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Worlder What? Since: Jan, 2001
What?
#1: Apr 3rd 2011 at 10:18:48 PM

First of yes it is fantasy. Yes there is some Magitek and but that is rare compared to plain old eletric-powered or liquid fuel-powered hardware.

The current setting of my story already gotten past that point in history when many unskilled workers and their unions struggled with the idea of their jobs being taken by machines. Only about two decades in the past did someone managed to make a machine that can manipulate the same energies used by all magic users.

The magic users start about when such arts were developed frankly saw themselves as only worthy of self-employment. This attitude combined with a single major catastrophe involving Dark Magic and the development of popular rule resulted in many magic users unable to a land a job either due to safety concerns or union pressure.

Still the wizards and holymen saw themselves as being professionals whose skills are indispensable for whenever they are needed such as able to bring rain to a drought-ridden plain or stop a major plague in its tracks. Of there is always war.

But the day that a machine that can manipulate magic became something that is dreaded by every person who can manipulate natural and supernatural forces.

  • First off it means that their skills have become depreciated; these machines can be churned out in the hundreds in a single factory in a single day.

  • Second. Major figures of the fashioned old magic users come in a values conflict with a vastly more numerous new generation of magic users that didn't have to go through training since childhood. That's not even including the religious-types.

  • Third. These machines aren't capable of megalomania, hate, or greed. The companies using them would not suffer the same stigma that comes with hiring a living magic user.

  • Fourth. Even if the first machine doesn't perform as well as living breathing magic user, they know that many companies will start developing a new generation of these machines to top the first generation and also to top each other.

I basically want to a write a sidestory about how would an old-fashioned "trained from childhood" magic user feel about this invention.

Anything you might want to add to help make this an enjoyable short drama?

CyganAngel Away on the wind~ from Arcadia Since: Oct, 2010
Away on the wind~
#2: Apr 4th 2011 at 2:38:07 AM

The humans should still have a major advantage; they're much more flexible than machines.

There are too many toasters in my chimney!
del_diablo Den harde nordmann from Somewher in mid Norway Since: Sep, 2009
Den harde nordmann
#3: Apr 4th 2011 at 5:47:04 AM

On the top of my head:

  • There would still be requirered mages to design machines, or improve them
  • There would still be requirered mages if something really accidental happens
  • The wizards do not really have a good reason to care. If you have magic, you have magic. The ability to bend reality is freaking powerful, and since we are not too far into Skytopia and its Magi Tech settingwise, mages are immesely more powerful
    Take a look at Zeal from Chrono Trigger, or some of the other magitech kingdom. The only thing that happens is that you get practical machines on the sideline.
    The other issue is: There will still be large openings for resarch. To get a new machine, you still need a mage who can do the research.
    Basically you are overthinking the problem.

    Take a look at Edo(?) japan or Europa after the Feudal started collapsing, basically you had an entire class of society that was no longer needed. The difference is that the mages are not some random replaceable social role, they are like engineers.

A guy called dvorak is tired. Tired of humanity not wanting to change to improve itself. Quite the sad tale.
RalphCrown Short Hair from Next Door to Nowhere Since: Oct, 2010
Short Hair
#4: Apr 4th 2011 at 7:17:34 AM

If your world has a finite (but rechargeable) supply of mana, the machines could use it up in a hurry. Perhaps nobody realizes there is a limit until the brownouts start. The machines wouldn't care, of course, but people would sometimes fire blanks, so to speak.

And there's always the Frankenstein trope. When the machines develop some awareness, they may decide to take over.

Under World. It rocks!
GiantSpaceChinchilla Since: Oct, 2009
#5: Apr 4th 2011 at 3:56:58 PM

Hello

  1. what do the machines do?
    1. are they more Matter Replicators or mass enchanters?
  2. you mentioned that wizards had lost jobs, which jobs?
    1. If they are similar to modern day machinery then it would be the "middlemen" most cut out, of course depending on your society it's possible no-one would notice a peasant class / aristocratic class set up.
    2. If they are more like how machines were supposed to be then they'd force everybody up into a new middle class and aristocratic positions, which might start some infighting.
  3. Can they build more of themselves?
    1. if not then the "mastermolds" might become more valuable
    2. if so then they could go all Grey Goo
      1. even if it's not possible drumming up fear that they could become uncontrolled could be a major tactic or strategy against them.
  4. are they mobile? and/or large?

edited for clarity

edited 6th Apr '11 8:14:34 PM by GiantSpaceChinchilla

Worlder What? Since: Jan, 2001
What?
#6: Apr 4th 2011 at 5:10:09 PM

The machines are like computers, and the spells are the programs.

A radio dish or camera can act as a substitute for the hands and eyes, the bodyparts most used to focus and manipulate one's lifeforce.

Most non-"religious affiliated" magic users tend to be self employed.

Companies and governments don't hire them often or only in emergencies, because magic users tend to charge exorbitantly for their services, and for safety and PR concerns.

These machines allow companies and government to have more access to the capabilities of a magic user without the risks and costs.

Now that you mentioned how it will still take magic users to make and maintain such machines, I think it would rather split the existing community of existing magic users than a new vs old conflict. Some would welcome a steady paycheck, others refuse to submit to being employed by anyone but themselves.

GiantSpaceChinchilla Since: Oct, 2009
#7: Apr 6th 2011 at 8:40:41 PM

    quote 
The machines are like computers, and the spells are the programs.

A radio dish or camera can act as a substitute for the hands and eyes, the bodyparts most used to focus and manipulate one's lifeforce.

I'm not sure I understand you correctly, but.

  • they are relatively intelligent and difficult to make but not quite robots.
  • depending on the individual design they have many or few "spell programs" that can do whatever the spell/mage can do, so they could for instance create matter out of nothing if that is what their programing is or they could make something magical or control the weather.
  • somehow or another they work with "life energy" or can use something equivelent.

so, could they be set up in an assembly line type situation? the magic users might react differently if they are simply a one-to-one replacement vrs making massive amounts of stuff, or if they are deliberately designed to make boring vrs interesting things.

They don't seem mobile across the board or very small perhaps the size of a Compaq Portable or similar portable computer at the smallest. For the magic users that would mean that they'd have to stay mobile and/or break up into smaller organisations, but as you set it up it doesn't seem like they'd mind.

did I get the essence of it down pat?

edited 6th Apr '11 8:45:21 PM by GiantSpaceChinchilla

Worlder What? Since: Jan, 2001
What?
#8: Apr 7th 2011 at 7:38:42 PM

Well the machine aren't exactly mobile they have to be attached to large mana batteries.

The conflict comes from having their prestige lowered to that of an engineer. Some companies are willing to hire magic users for their expertise in managing the machines, on the condition that the magic users accept that they will be restricted on their amount of personal spellcasting. Some are just too filled with pride to accept any contract by a second party where they have to become an "employee".

Of course, now that I think of it, that should be a stereotype reinforced by attention-whoring loud mouths that sort of help to make various schools of magic a dying art.

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