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The 2012 US presdential election

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TheyCallMeTomu Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#401: Apr 2nd 2011 at 7:23:03 PM

I wouldn't mind a Kuccinich/Weiner ticket myself, but I wouldn't want to threaten losing the election to Palin in order to have it on the ballot :P

SavageHeathen Pro-Freedom Fanatic from Somewhere Since: Feb, 2011
Pro-Freedom Fanatic
#402: Apr 2nd 2011 at 7:25:28 PM

Jimmy Mc Dermott would make a cool Dem candidate, if he wasn't so friggin' old.

edited 2nd Apr '11 7:26:30 PM by SavageHeathen

You exist because we allow it and you will end because we demand it.
FFShinra Since: Jan, 2001
#403: Apr 2nd 2011 at 7:27:03 PM

The election should be run, Obama should throw Biden out, and then replace him with a Republican. I wanna see the madness that would entail.

TheyCallMeTomu Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#404: Apr 2nd 2011 at 7:30:09 PM

It wouldn't surprise me, as much as Fox News hates him, the reality is that he's half republican already. <Tch>

Ultrayellow Unchanging Avatar. Since: Dec, 2010
Unchanging Avatar.
#405: Apr 2nd 2011 at 8:02:49 PM

Centrist. The word is centrist. Not half Republican, as in half traitor. Centrist.

Except for 4/1/2011. That day lingers in my memory like...metaphor here...I should go.
TheyCallMeTomu Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#406: Apr 2nd 2011 at 8:05:38 PM

Centrist in relation to US politics, yes.

Centrist in relation to world politics or a reasonable position? Maybe, but less so.

Deboss I see the Awesomeness. from Awesomeville Texas Since: Aug, 2009
I see the Awesomeness.
#407: Apr 2nd 2011 at 8:45:59 PM

I think it would be hilarious.

Fight smart, not fair.
Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#408: Apr 2nd 2011 at 11:49:24 PM

I always laugh at the term "Tyranny of the majority"

Isn't that the point of democracy?

tnu1138 Dracula Since: Apr, 2009
Dracula
#409: Apr 2nd 2011 at 11:51:06 PM

Yeah and you act like thats a good thing?

We must survive, all of us. The blood of a human for me, a cooked bird for you. Where is the difference?
Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#410: Apr 2nd 2011 at 11:53:07 PM

You take the good and the bad.

You can't have your cake and eat it too.

You can't go around saying "DEMOCRACY IS FAIR BECAUSE EVERYONE GETS A VOTE" and then when a majority of people vote for something you dont like, you can't go claiming "TYRANNY OF THE MAJORITY!"

edited 2nd Apr '11 11:53:37 PM by Thorn14

tnu1138 Dracula Since: Apr, 2009
Dracula
#411: Apr 2nd 2011 at 11:54:14 PM

When did I ever say Democracy was fair?

We must survive, all of us. The blood of a human for me, a cooked bird for you. Where is the difference?
Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#412: Apr 2nd 2011 at 11:55:15 PM

You didn't, but I know alot of people hold democracy as the perfect political situation and is superior to any other form, and its worth spilling blood over.

tnu1138 Dracula Since: Apr, 2009
Dracula
#413: Apr 2nd 2011 at 11:56:43 PM

if I advocate any government at all it is a Federal Republic. Not a Democracy.

We must survive, all of us. The blood of a human for me, a cooked bird for you. Where is the difference?
EricDVH Since: Jan, 2001
#414: Apr 3rd 2011 at 12:03:07 AM

FF Shinra: *sigh* The only way the federal elections will change is if they start at the state level. At least thats how I figure...
This Just This, every important reform in this country started at the state level, which is even easier now since there are many states with referenda elections (also a good idea for the feds.) Once governors start facing instant runoff elections, the days of the two party monopoly will be numbered.

Major Tom: Had proportional representation been implemented at the start, it very quickly would have turned into a tyranny of the majority.
Nate the Great: I'm still confused as to why we need an Electoral College. It seems fairly obvious that just using a big imaginary ballot bin for each political party would be a lot simpler and a more direct reflection of who the people want to elect
Now that we're a we're a federation In Name Only and the people of the states are all one big happy family, all that it does is act as gerrymandering on a national scale. The electoral college is largely irrelevant (though I agree abolishing it would do no harm and simplify things,) the real problem is that the senate is split into states, the congress (and presidential election) is split into districts, and the state legislatures are also split into even smaller districts, all of which are heavily gerrymandered.

The only real solution is to make the members of all representative bodies into at-large officials.

Zeiqthe Pyro OK, now might as well be the best time to ask. Why do so many people obsess over Ron Paul anyway? The guys getting on in years.
Because the shallow, egotistical, psychopathic, shortsighted, totally impractical rhetoric of the American Libertarian Party sounds “refreshingly” different from the realm of sanity all other political options hail from. Also, if Ron himself doesn't run, his son Rand has vowed to.

They Call Me Tomu: Centrist in relation to world politics or a reasonable position? Maybe, but less so.
Oh give me a break, put Obama up next to someone like Tony Blair and tell me there's gaping chasm between them. Face it, fiscally rightist socially indifferent is the new “centrism.”

Eric,

Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#415: Apr 3rd 2011 at 12:06:48 AM

Yeah, my friend from Europe says America's left is like Europe's right, and America's right is Genghis Khan.

BestOf FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC! from Finland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
#417: Apr 3rd 2011 at 6:07:48 AM

We actually say it very often, at least in Finland. Even the most conservative right-wing parties here wouldn't dream of ending free universal education (including university-level) and healthcare.

edited 3rd Apr '11 6:08:35 AM by BestOf

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
FFShinra Since: Jan, 2001
#418: Apr 3rd 2011 at 6:17:23 AM

Is there any centrist party in the US which is centre-slightly left on fiscal and centre slightly right (as opposed to fundo territory extreme right) on social policy? I'd go for that. But then, I'm somewhat communitarian, so I seem to be flailing.

As for the suggestion of at-large status, that would work great for the Senate, and make state elections even more important, but I don't see how it'd work for the House...

storyyeller More like giant cherries from Appleloosa Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: RelationshipOutOfBoundsException: 1
More like giant cherries
#419: Apr 3rd 2011 at 6:18:29 AM

The real problem with districts is gerrymandering. Instead of abolishing them, we need to have an independent commission draw up the borders like in Iowa.

Blind Final Fantasy 6 Let's Play
EricDVH Since: Jan, 2001
#420: Apr 3rd 2011 at 6:47:38 AM

There is absolutely no way you can draw up districts without gerrymandering, no matter how you cut it, somebody's getting screwed over.

^^ What in the what what? Maybe I'm misreading you, but I think you typed that backward. It's dead simple for the house, since then nobody would be representing a state, instead they'd all be stateless representatives at large, or alternately (in a party list system, which I favor) representing parties.

The only way I can imagine at large representation working in the senate is if it was retained as a miniaturized mirror image of the house, locked to 100 members so that we still have individual legislators big enough to fend for themselves amongst the president and governors, instead of just hundreds of pipsqueak house members.

Eric,

edited 3rd Apr '11 6:55:30 AM by EricDVH

storyyeller More like giant cherries from Appleloosa Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: RelationshipOutOfBoundsException: 1
More like giant cherries
#421: Apr 3rd 2011 at 7:00:07 AM

But at large members makes it more expensive to campaign, increasing the influence of special interests.

Blind Final Fantasy 6 Let's Play
MajorTom Since: Dec, 2009
#422: Apr 3rd 2011 at 7:03:35 AM

^^ If they were stateless representatives at large, 90% of Congress wouldn't know how to deal with 95% of the country's issues that specific Congressmen from specific states would.

Face it, a Parliamentarian style Congress is never going to happen. Proportional representation was doomed to failure from the start and if you really want the entirety of Flyover Country from the Sierra Nevada to the Appalachians to up and secede and starve the leftist coasts of everything be my guest. We'll be happy to plummet New York and San Francisco into impoverished 3rd world status. They depend on our resources and people to survive and promote their silly ideologies, not the other way around.

SavageHeathen Pro-Freedom Fanatic from Somewhere Since: Feb, 2011
Pro-Freedom Fanatic
#423: Apr 3rd 2011 at 7:10:42 AM

It's centrist as in "traitor".

We picked Obama because we thought he was The Liberal Guy.

He has failed. We will find another way.

You exist because we allow it and you will end because we demand it.
Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#424: Apr 3rd 2011 at 7:16:43 AM

[up] The funny thing is, most people on the right think he's so liberal he's a communist.

And he's extremely centrist!

I can't imagine if we actually got a ACTUAL LIBERAL in office.

They'd probably spontaneously explode!

FFShinra Since: Jan, 2001
#425: Apr 3rd 2011 at 7:25:38 AM

^^^^^

No, I meant what I said. We can't have stateless representatives for reasons already stated. But we can at least change the way we get our senators within the current system into office. Even if we're a federation in name only, what little remains of states rights will be loathed to be given up by said states.


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