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Arha Since: Jan, 2010
#151: Mar 24th 2011 at 4:40:58 PM

Are you really telling me of all people I need to read FSN? ...Suffice to say, that's not necessary. I don't like her much myself, but she's easily the most moe character in FSN. Whether or not you like her or approve of how it was done is different. In fact, it's because of the fact that I think the writers kind of went overboard with her is why I would not vote for her.

This tournament is not just about the most moe character. It's a popularity contest.

Arilou Taller than Zim from Quasispace Since: Jan, 2001
Taller than Zim
#152: Mar 24th 2011 at 4:42:58 PM

[up][up] Irrelevant. Moe is a broad concept. Yamato Nadeshiko is a subtype. There are a bunch of them (and combinations thereof) It's not limited to any specific kind of character but rather to the subjective reaction of the viewer.

"No, the Singularity will not happen. Computation is hard." -Happy Ent
Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#153: Mar 24th 2011 at 4:52:22 PM

[up][up]Why not? What do you have against it? Or it is because you have read it already? Anyway, YMMV. I don't think she is all that Moe, myself. You think. Lets end here.

It is a popularity contest and a moe contest. It is both. Even if you clam it leans more to the 'popularity', I believe the results would be quite different if it hadn't a 'moe' in the name.

[up]No, it is not. One character doesn't need to be Moe to be a Yamato Nadeshiko. They are just different things.

edited 24th Mar '11 4:53:30 PM by Heatth

Arilou Taller than Zim from Quasispace Since: Jan, 2001
Taller than Zim
#154: Mar 24th 2011 at 4:56:24 PM

[up] Not really. Part of being a Yamato Nadeshiko is being well... Attractive, beautiful, adorable, IE: Moe.

"No, the Singularity will not happen. Computation is hard." -Happy Ent
Arha Since: Jan, 2010
#155: Mar 24th 2011 at 4:59:10 PM

Of course I've read it. If you were actually in the FSN thread you would have seen the huge debates I've had about the thing. I'm quite sure I know the story better than you do.

And Yamato Nadeshiko is one of the ways a character can be made moe. As is Shrinking Violet, or Emotionless Girl, or Kuudere or Fragile Flower.

edited 24th Mar '11 4:59:42 PM by Arha

Thenamelesssamurai from Atlanta, Georgia Since: Nov, 2010
#156: Mar 24th 2011 at 4:59:40 PM

I never really considered a Yamato Nadeshiko to be adorable, but rather beautiful in mature sense, where as moe seems to be built around looking younger. Then again moe's an ill-defined concept and I could very easily be wrong about Yamato Nadeshikos.

edited 24th Mar '11 5:00:29 PM by Thenamelesssamurai

Imagine Rakan applying Calling Your Attacks to doing paperwork.~Anarchy Rakan for the hell of it COMMISSION THIS BRIDGE!~EHK
Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#157: Mar 24th 2011 at 5:05:11 PM

[up][up][up]Actually, the adorable is not part of the concept. So, she is attractive and beautiful, but not necessarily adorable. Not necessarily Moe either.

[up][up]Ah, sorry. Haven't visiting the Visual Novel forum recently as I couldn't play any lately. A previous post of yours(specifically, the 142) gave me the impression you only have watched the anime.

And, surelly a character can be Moe in virtue of being a Yamato Nadeshiko. But that doesn't mean every Yamato Nadeshiko is Moe. All character types you mentioned are the same. Specially since it was just pointed last page Moe is not an objective adjective.

[up]This. I agree fully. While I think there may be some Moe Yamato Nadeshiko, I think it is not the Yamato Nadeshiko characteristics that make them moe, but something else.

edited 24th Mar '11 5:07:01 PM by Heatth

Arha Since: Jan, 2010
#158: Mar 24th 2011 at 5:12:32 PM

If you think Sakura's domestic nature was being played as mature, then we may have found our problem.

Anyway, to finish this up, I just have one more thing to say.

Death to Nagisa. After story would have been better without retconning you back to life even if I did like you! It ruined Tomoya's development!

Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#159: Mar 24th 2011 at 5:14:01 PM

Why so much hate. tongue I agree with you, but it is not the poor girl's fault.

(I failed English hard on this post)

edited 24th Mar '11 5:20:40 PM by Heatth

Arha Since: Jan, 2010
#160: Mar 24th 2011 at 5:20:46 PM

Oh, no, I already hated her. The After Story thing is just where she weakens the story.

Arilou Taller than Zim from Quasispace Since: Jan, 2001
Taller than Zim
#161: Mar 24th 2011 at 5:21:24 PM

I'd say that while Rin is my favourite character, I thik Sakura is my favourite route. (Oddly enough Rin gets to do the msot awesome stuff in Sakura's route...)

"No, the Singularity will not happen. Computation is hard." -Happy Ent
Arha Since: Jan, 2010
#162: Mar 24th 2011 at 5:22:53 PM

Heavens Feel probably is the best route, yes. The idiot plot hurts it though.

But I still like UBW more. Even if it doesn't have Rider and Ilya doing anything.

Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#163: Mar 24th 2011 at 5:29:01 PM

[up][up][up]Oh, fine them. I can understand that. I think it was her who made After Story better, though (by dieingtongue).

[up][up]I find hard to decide between the two. I think I would take Rider myself. Haven's Feels is decidedly the best route, anyway.

Arilou Taller than Zim from Quasispace Since: Jan, 2001
Taller than Zim
#164: Mar 24th 2011 at 5:30:53 PM

I found UBW to be pretty weak actually, better than Fate, obviously, but it felt like a bit too much of a re-thread (albeit with new info and different characters doing different things) HF was a totally different story in comparison

"No, the Singularity will not happen. Computation is hard." -Happy Ent
Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#165: Mar 24th 2011 at 5:33:42 PM

[up]I agree. But is still found UBW awesome when I first read it. Even if started too similar, it changed quite a lot from the moment of Archer betrayal. And I think Shiro is in some way more awesome there then in HF.

Arha Since: Jan, 2010
#166: Mar 24th 2011 at 5:33:57 PM

I liked the resolution UBW had and frankly, the romance didn't annoy me. HF felt like the characters normally wouldn't act this way, but they had to in order to get the story to move the right way. UBW definitely had flaws, but the characters felt more natural to me. That's why despite thinking it's not as good, I still like it more. Pretty close though.

And to be honest I also just thought it had more cool stuff in it.

Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#167: Mar 24th 2011 at 5:42:32 PM

Thinking now, my biggest problem with UBW is that its resolution don't feel as good as the other two routes. I mean, both Saber and Sakura have so much shitty fates that I feel bad by not helping them. Between that, Rin don't really need to end with Shiro (and she seemed more fulfilled in HF, anyway) and Archer's problem wasn't solved, so the route kinda feel like a waste.

Hylarn (Don’t ask)
#168: Mar 24th 2011 at 6:19:05 PM

I think Tohsaka and Nadeko are the only characters in this one I actually like

...Probably a good sign that my tastes don't align with the sort of people that care about moe

Arha Since: Jan, 2010
#169: Mar 24th 2011 at 6:22:17 PM

Oh? How many of the shows have you seen Hylarn? I know I personally never watched K-On, Higurashi, Angel Beats and a few others, but there were still a decent number of characters that I liked such as Elsie.

Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#170: Mar 24th 2011 at 6:34:12 PM

[up][up]Don't be so intolerant. There are some quite good stories hidden in the Moe. Of the current group, Clannad and The World God Only Knows, for example.

[up]I recommend Higurashi. You have to avoid the anime, as it sucked, but the Visual Novel is awesome and the manga is said to be great. Despite what the merchandise and beginning of story might imply, it is not a Moe show.

edited 24th Mar '11 6:35:35 PM by Heatth

Arha Since: Jan, 2010
#171: Mar 24th 2011 at 6:39:44 PM

So I hear. I even downloaded them and installed them, but I couldn't get into it.

Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#172: Mar 24th 2011 at 6:50:56 PM

"Couldn't get into it" as you read a bit and then stopped? If you couldn't reach the half of the first chapter, ttry a bit more, It Gets Better (or worse, depends of the point of view). If it is really that unbearable, just skip the school scenes or even the whole first half until the festival. You won't miss much. Just make sure to read the scrapyard scenes (there are other good scenes, identifiable by the change of music, but not as necessary).

If you read past the festival then I suppose there is no much to do. If you didn't liked yet there is little meaning in keep trying.

Arha Since: Jan, 2010
#173: Mar 24th 2011 at 6:51:41 PM

I barely started. The art irked me so I put it on hold and never got back to it.

Hylarn (Don’t ask)
#174: Mar 24th 2011 at 6:54:44 PM

I have no problem with moe and have at least tried most of the shows on the list. It's the fans I dislike. And the characters they're voting for

Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#175: Mar 24th 2011 at 6:59:17 PM

[up][up]Oh, the art. ^^; Yeah, it sucks. I actually downloaded a patch to use the PS 2 art instead (I recommend the sprite only patch, as the original background are quite good). The same wiki has patches for tweaking all the problems with the Manga Gamer release, like the change in the music and ugly interface. Made by annons, so not very stable. It works mostly well, though.

[up]I see what you mean. Not sure what you are doing here, though.tongue

edited 24th Mar '11 7:08:08 PM by Heatth


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