TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

General Sonic The Hedgehog thread

Go To

Eriorguez Since: Jun, 2009
#76026: Oct 17th 2023 at 10:16:19 AM

Knuckles Chaotix is back in continuity tho.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#76027: Oct 17th 2023 at 10:20:12 AM

I don't think this is true. The only game they wrote out of continuity was Knuckles' Chaotix, so they could reintroduce the characters for Heroes. Amy flashes back to CD in Adventure, for one thing.

The mainline games (1,2,3,CD) were still in continuity. Literally everything else was put out of continuity.

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#76028: Oct 17th 2023 at 10:42:32 AM

Are we really doing this again? I swear it's like every 2 months. I'm gonna need to bookmark my post that walked through each time a game referenced a previous game.

Edited by wanderlustwarrior on Oct 17th 2023 at 12:43:05 PM

lalalei2001 Since: Oct, 2009
#76029: Oct 17th 2023 at 10:47:40 AM

Apparently there's a strange cameo involving what looks to be THE END's purple moon form in the final stage.

The Protomen enhanced my life.
randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#76030: Oct 17th 2023 at 10:48:54 AM

I think it involves the "Moon" you can see from outer space...

SEGA is really making Sonic a blase experience.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
magnum12 Since: Aug, 2009
#76031: Oct 17th 2023 at 10:59:11 AM

@Known Unknown: So what you’re saying is that the bosses are mostly under the “Xemnas Effect” (basically cool/creative but low difficulty)

I call it the Xemnas Effect because Xemnas was a fignt with rather low difficulty for a final boss, especially Kingdom Hearts, but the sheer showmanship of the fight made it really fun anyway.

Gamers call these “Spectacle Bosses”. For bosses that tend towards low difficulty but are still fondly remembered as fun due to top notch showmanship and/or high creatity (design/mechanics) Do we have a trope for this?

-Edit: I consider Metal Overlord an example of a Spectacle Boss. Too easy difficulty wise especially for a final boss, but oh boy was he a cool design with some interesting mechanics.

Edited by magnum12 on Oct 17th 2023 at 11:04:28 AM

Negaman Since: Aug, 2017
#76032: Oct 17th 2023 at 11:02:57 AM

TailsTube effectively confirmed Chaotix and SegaSonic as canon, as well as more or less every game gear game by this point. TL;DR the entire Classic Sonic is canon.

As for THE END'S cameo I think it's a non-verbal way to confirm what the True Final Boss is: an incarnation of THE END, just one without its consciousness to drive it due to it still being imprisoned by the time of Superstars. Although, it DOES actually make what Sage was saying in both the English and Japanese versions of Frontiers about its physical form make more sense.

"It's retreating to space to regain its true form./Another moon shall appear from the dark side of the moon."

The Ancients didn't seal THE END'S incarnation into Cyber Space, they sealed its CONSCIOUSNESS into Cyber Space, leaving its incarnations without a mind to direct them.

It also makes me wonder about Time Eater.

Edited by Negaman on Oct 17th 2023 at 11:04:18 AM

ShinyCottonCandy Everyone's friend Malamar from Lumiose City (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Everyone's friend Malamar
#76033: Oct 17th 2023 at 11:04:14 AM

[up][up]No, I don't think we do.

My musician page
neoamon Mr from Planet Mobius S.T.C. (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded)
Mr
#76034: Oct 17th 2023 at 11:09:14 AM

Nack is seen using a pop gun in his game appearances, I wonder if it is because bullets are too expensive for him or if it is because he is a cheapskate?

"May your heart be your guiding key"
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#76035: Oct 17th 2023 at 11:10:42 AM

Tails Tube effectively confirmed Chaotix and Sega Sonic as canon, as well as more or less every game gear game by this point. TL;DR the entire Classic Sonic is canon.

Yeah, that was never in question. It's explicitly established as canon now, but that happened literally this week.

It was explicitly not canon up until literally a couple years ago. For a long time, there was an explicit separation between the continuities of the Classic and Post-Adventure continuities: initially by way of removing those titles from continuity in the Adventure Era, then first re-establishing them as Sonic's explicit past in Generations, walking back on that by then establishing them as a separate continuity in the years after Generations, then walking back on that by re-establishing them as Sonic's explicit past a couple years ago.

Tbh, from the very first episode Tailstube largely exists as a vehicle to make it clear what's canon now. So we know that Chaotix and Sega Sonic are canon now because since making that decision a couple years ago they've been slowly trickling Classic-era content back into the current canon, mostly by using Tailstube.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Oct 17th 2023 at 11:10:50 AM

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#76036: Oct 17th 2023 at 11:11:28 AM

Here we go. Numbuh1234 and I pointed out the following games are directly connected. I'm updating that list below.

Modern Continuity:

  • S1 > S2 > CD/S3&K > Adventure 1 > Adventure 2/Advance 2 > Heroes/Battle > Shadow/Advance 3 > Chronicles picks up from here but is non-canon
  • Then there's a split from here based on platform, with various options regarding some combination of Silver, Blaze, and Eggman Nega, all coming back at the same point:
    • 06
    • Rivals > Rivals 2
    • Rush > Rush Adventure
  • They re-convene at Riders series > Colors Console/DS > Generations > Lost World > Forces > TSR > Frontiers.

Classic Continuity:

  • The following occur between S1 and S3&K, but I don't yet know the timeline for them:
    • Segasonic
    • Fighters
    • Superstars
  • Mania > Mania Plus

That leaves out the following games as not connected yet. They may still be connected, but I'm just going off of my memory, and can't vouch for them. EDIT: Also, I don't remember off the top of my head what Tails Tube confirmed.

  • Game Gear S1 and S2
  • Chaos
  • Tails Adventure/Sky Patrol
  • Drift 1/2
  • Triple Trouble
  • Chaotix
  • 3D Blast
  • S4

Edited by wanderlustwarrior on Oct 17th 2023 at 1:14:28 PM

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#76037: Oct 17th 2023 at 11:13:27 AM

Presumably everything is canon now unless directly stated to not be, so there's not really much need for lists.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Oct 17th 2023 at 11:13:37 AM

neoamon Mr from Planet Mobius S.T.C. (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded)
Mr
#76038: Oct 17th 2023 at 11:22:28 AM

Maybe they could give an explanation of what Sonic and Friends did about the Death Egg II or is it still encasing the Miracle Planet/Little Planet?

"May your heart be your guiding key"
lalalei2001 Since: Oct, 2009
#76039: Oct 17th 2023 at 11:24:48 AM

@76032 That's a really interesting thought and makes that boss make more sense!

The Protomen enhanced my life.
mstorzil Crimson Helios Since: Nov, 2019
Crimson Helios
#76040: Oct 17th 2023 at 11:53:05 AM

No playable Fang. Just Sonic, Tails, Knuckles, Amy, and Trip.

No rain could douse the flames that burn within me!
Vertigo_High Since: May, 2010
#76041: Oct 17th 2023 at 12:01:21 PM

Thoughts on Sonic Superstars

  • the level design is actually well done, they did a great job making each feel distinct mechanically and some are very inventive with their gimmicks. I only found two acts which I felt were annoying, press factory A2 which is like a more punishing version of sandopolis/oil ocean mania 2 which made it stressful and golden city act 1 which is just kinda ugly and confusing, also has some of the worst music in the game. The last stage took me by surprise with its theme which I thought was cool at least conceptually, but also frustrating due to the absolutely horrid crush kill hitboxes which are the worst I've seen since sonic advance 3. I should not be getting crushed by a block falling upwards before it even hits a surface! wtf? That was annoying and almost ruins what was otherwise IMO one of the coolest ideas for a last level in a sonic game. A few levels are obvious throwbacks to some earlier Sonic stuff...and one to a retro SEGA game that I feel will go over some people's heads. But I appreciated it.

  • Visually on the HD versions...the foreground looks great more often than not, really crisp and vibrant but in an absolutely baffling decision unlike the Switch version they made the background super blurry and I daresay it results in making the game actually look worse than the Switch version? This was my biggest issue with the game visually, the horrendously blurred backgrounds and when I found out the Switch version didn't suffer from this I was kinda mad. I just don't understand the logic of making your background look like a late 90s jpeg. Some of the levels are quite nice looking, others have questionable color palettes or tile sets(like on one hand Sky temple looks great, but then golden city is just a visual mess with a clashing color scheme and incoherent theming with its tiles.} Mania this is not in artistic presentation.

  • I think the characters control great in this, I haven't experimented with the emerald powers too much but I actually like that they don't feel intrusive at all. First playthrough I hardly used them but now looking back I think using them more would've helped out a lot in certain points especially a few bosses. Ah bosses...

  • So I've seen some complain about the bosses and I'm going to be honest, I think these are overblown a bit. The bosses definitely take longer than the classic sonic games but if you played Sonic Rush they're closer to that style of boss more than anything. In fact a lot of them kind of reminded me of that in their design, and I beat the vast majority first try. Only ones that stuck out as being particularly troublesome were the golden city act 1 boss, notice I keep complaining about this level lol, the cyberspace boss whose mechanics took a bit to figure out, the frozen base act 1 boss as the last hit is pretty tough to land and the egg fortress boss who being the final boss is supposed to be hard but it's legit one of the hardest non-super final bosses in the series IMO especially with Sonic who lacks air mobility as I used tails and it took me a good amount of time to beat. overall I'll even say I enjoyed the bosses and found them fun to learn. Also to note I didn't use any powers against them so I may have made some harder than I needed to.

I'm going to play some more right now, enjoying how Trip plays.

Edited by Vertigo_High on Oct 17th 2023 at 12:05:30 PM

Tomodachi Now a lurker. See you at the forums. Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Now a lurker. See you at the forums.
#76042: Oct 17th 2023 at 12:02:05 PM

I'm not going to talk about "canon", as if, continuity, but I will mention that during the 2000's (let's call it the "Sonic X era"), only elements of the Adventure games and onward were promoted by Sonic Team and Sega, with Classic Sonic effectively dead and buried, only living through game compilations that used the modern incarnation design on covers.

Ever since Generations, though, it appears the Classic Brand was reborn, hence why we have the two brands existing.

My hypothesis was an attempt to keep pushing Sonic's popularity in Japan, where the Adventure games did sell well.

Edited by Tomodachi on Oct 17th 2023 at 12:06:48 PM

To win, you need to adapt, and to adapt, you need to be able to laugh away all the restraints. Everything holding you back.
magnum12 Since: Aug, 2009
#76043: Oct 17th 2023 at 12:15:50 PM

@wanderlustwarrior: Shadow the Hedgehog is before Battle and Advance 3.

The Shadow route makes much more sense if his game came before Battle since he has his memories back at the time.

Plus he likely received intel from GUN about Emeril.

Joshbones Since: May, 2015
#76044: Oct 17th 2023 at 12:36:16 PM

The spinoff games get referenced less because they don't have as much going for them. How do you drop a Sonic R reference into anything?

Even so, Amy's signature weapon literally debuted in Sonic the Fighters, they didn't have to bring that back for Adventure.

Rabbitearsblog Movie and TV Goddess from United States Since: Jan, 2014 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
Movie and TV Goddess
#76045: Oct 17th 2023 at 1:33:16 PM

So, for anyone who has played Sonic Superstars so far, is it better or worse than the previous games that the dev team had made like Balan Wonderworld?

Edited by Rabbitearsblog on Oct 17th 2023 at 1:33:45 AM

I love animation, TV, movies, YOU NAME IT!
Negaman Since: Aug, 2017
#76046: Oct 17th 2023 at 1:41:02 PM

[up]

Can't say, I never played anything by this studio before. Pretty good overall though, I just beat the normal final boss, Avatar really helped on the final phase.

Now to get that last emerald. Does anyone have ANY tips for that one?

Tomodachi Now a lurker. See you at the forums. Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Now a lurker. See you at the forums.
#76047: Oct 17th 2023 at 3:37:34 PM

Unfortunately I have to Fan Wank something involving Superstars.

Spoilers ahoy.

Superstars is a simulation. The events happened, but we are playing a memory that The End is watching from afar. This is to explain the unexpected cameo the purple moon had on one of the levels.

To win, you need to adapt, and to adapt, you need to be able to laugh away all the restraints. Everything holding you back.
Negaman Since: Aug, 2017
#76048: Oct 17th 2023 at 3:55:00 PM

[up]

At least it's better than the usual tripe with that kind of theory.

Also, just got the last Chaos Emerald in Trip's Story's Sky Temple and Trip's super form is referred to as Dragon Form.

Edited by Negaman on Oct 17th 2023 at 4:04:27 AM

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#76049: Oct 17th 2023 at 4:13:26 PM

Played a few more stages.

The level and boss design definitely improves. Though to clarify, I never thought either was bad before, just that I feel the level design can get too busy and uncoordinated sometimes with tons of random stuff the player could interact with but probably won't interact with popping out all over the place (they could at least get rid of the random portals that teleport you across the map), and that the bosses - though interesting and experimental - tended to be pushovers.

Both gets better. Though the business never really goes away the levels do get more focused, which is all it really needed, at least so far. And the bosses, while clearly still meant to be more on the easy side, do start to use the creativity more than just looking neat.

Sky Palace is my favorite stage so far. It's a great idea, the stage mechanics are all fun, and it's had the best / most fun imo boss so far.

Edit: The music is a mixed bag. Sometimes you get cringey sounds like the map music theme, other times you get absolute bangers like this:

Edited by KnownUnknown on Oct 17th 2023 at 4:29:57 AM

Vertigo_High Since: May, 2010
#76050: Oct 17th 2023 at 4:34:01 PM

[up]sky temple is a favorite of mine as well. Looks good, nice music, fun mechanics, fairly challenging boss for that point in the game.

First playthrough I was just sorta whatever on the jungle level but replaying it more I think it's pretty solid actually. Bridge zone is rather forgettable though. I don't feel we need a green hill expy every game but the devs are fixated on having such. But even as far as green hills go it's kinda lacking anything to set it apart really? The waterfalls look nice but there's better levels in the game for sure.

Lagoon City act 2 is one of the best stage music in the game. The sand stage is another great one and my personal favorite.

Actually I think I may have been too harsh on Golden capital. Replayed it today and liked it more now that I understand the stage better. Act 1's music is still kinda eh but act 2's theme sounds better. But like, hey need to stop trying to emulate the genesis game's sound with the drums and synths.

Edited by Vertigo_High on Oct 17th 2023 at 4:37:40 AM


Total posts: 84,033
Top