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VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#74926: Jul 14th 2023 at 11:59:34 AM

There's no real reason Sonic Team has to keep Knuckles/Silver/Blaze bound to their original lore when a simple setting update or change would fix these issues and allow them more flexible use of these characters, but it's been established now that Sega doesn't care as much about continuity as much as they pretend to. Individual writers =/= the people actually in charge of the franchise.

Grounder Main Character Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: All is for my lord
Main Character
#74927: Jul 14th 2023 at 1:34:57 PM

[up]Would work for Silver, would only cause Blaze more problems because of the Sol Emeralds.

KuroBaraHime ☆♥☆ Since: Jan, 2011
☆♥☆
#74928: Jul 14th 2023 at 2:14:22 PM

I think it would have been a good idea if Silver was just stuck in the past after his second appearance so he could easily show up again with little question, but Blaze is mostly fine how she is. Hopping in from another world frequently brings less weirdness with it than time travel and all the questions of how it and changing the past is supposed to work.

Tomodachi Now a lurker. See you at the forums. Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Now a lurker. See you at the forums.
#74929: Jul 14th 2023 at 3:01:30 PM

I'm on the ground Silver just makes Eggman lamer by association.

Megaman's archnemesis died, but got a legacy in a virus that infected the next generation's protagonist in Sigma.

Sonic's arch-nemesis? Forgotten and mocked, with a grumpy descendant that is as inept as the ancestor.

To win, you need to adapt, and to adapt, you need to be able to laugh away all the restraints. Everything holding you back.
Joshbones Since: May, 2015
#74930: Jul 14th 2023 at 3:05:53 PM

If Silver's future was a fixed point, that might mean something, but from what we've seen of him in every appearance, Eggman's actions in the past are usually responsible for the state of the future all those years down the line.

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#74931: Jul 14th 2023 at 3:07:33 PM

And yet when Eggman and Wily actually interact with each other, Eggman is much more effective and brutal. Wily kinda stumbled into success, and didn't have to use lots of Light and Cossack's work to do so? And you definitely can't credit him to Sigma's actual actions, just like you can't credit or fault Eggman for Nega's (when they're not working together).

Also, hasn't Eggman effectively won multiple times, and it's just that Sonic was able to undo it? At the very least, he has successfully split the world despite Sonic's interference in both Advance 3 and Unleashed, ruled the world when Sonic and co. were in the Twilight Cage in Chronicles (non-canon), conquered 5 planetoids in Colors, captured Sonic and conquered 99.9% of the world in Forces...

And that's not counting the logical conclusion of firing a super laser piss at the moon to break it in half.

Edited by wanderlustwarrior on Jul 14th 2023 at 5:15:34 AM

Joshbones Since: May, 2015
#74932: Jul 14th 2023 at 3:10:42 PM

Dr. Wily is a cartoon character onscreen, who only gets threatening offscreen in a timejump between franchises. Under those circumstances you could make any bad guy look menacing.

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#74933: Jul 14th 2023 at 3:14:04 PM

If we're counting timeskip accomplishments, Eggman wiped out all life on Earth with the Metal Virus, and the only reason it was undone was because Silver came back two times in a row.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#74934: Jul 14th 2023 at 3:17:12 PM

The combination of Light and Wily's bullcrap doomed the human race.

TBH, I never felt like the future made Wily more dangerous as much as made him look even more like a fool.


Unrelated, but posting this absolutely awesome deconstruction of my favorite Sonic song:

Any of you guys have a Sonic track you really love that nobody ever talks about?

Edited by KnownUnknown on Jul 14th 2023 at 3:19:24 AM

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#74935: Jul 14th 2023 at 3:22:05 PM

Chaos Angel Act 3 - Sonic Advance 3. Really, the Advance games don't get enough credit.

diddyknux Straw Hat Robin (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
Straw Hat Robin
#74936: Jul 14th 2023 at 3:26:35 PM

Tangentially to the Sonic Advance games...

The "Library" stage from Sonic Battle.

LoneCourier0 The Wandering Geek from A Diverse Land (Unitroper) Relationship Status: How YOU doin'?
The Wandering Geek
#74937: Jul 14th 2023 at 3:36:42 PM

Does Final Haunt count too?

"Cynicism is not realistic and tough. It's unrealistic and kind of cowardly because it means you don't have to try."
BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#74938: Jul 14th 2023 at 3:47:21 PM

Cyber Track from Advance 3.


@Very Melon: They more or less do with Knuckles; its only recently where they try to pretend like his guardian role still has any significance to his character and even then, that's probably mostly because of Flynn pushing for it.

I do agree if they were planning on keeping them around, they should have written around the circumstances that usually prevents them from being recurring characters but they just... didn't. Most likely just out of sheer negligence because they've just moved on treating Silver and Blaze as anything more than just another pair of characters in the long list of them.

Edited by BlackYakuzu94 on Jul 14th 2023 at 6:48:07 AM

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
MorningStar1337 The Encounter that ended the Dogma from 🤔 Since: Nov, 2012
The Encounter that ended the Dogma
#74939: Jul 14th 2023 at 4:21:53 PM

IIRC, Wishes in the Wind, Ephemeral, Genshi, Time Flyer, Arrow of Time. Basically most of Frontiers' Cyberspace stage BGM

From other games, there is End of the World (06), Sea Bottom Segue (Lost World), Fighting Onward, Moonlit Battlefield, Red Gate Bridge, Fading World and Mortal Canyon (all from Forces)

Red Gate Bridge is probally the msot relevant here sicne it only shows up as a prelude to the metal sonic fight and otherwise is only used for a short bonus level.

Edited by MorningStar1337 on Jul 14th 2023 at 4:22:30 AM

SoaringStarman Since: Jul, 2023
#74940: Jul 14th 2023 at 6:32:46 PM

[up][up][up][up][up][up]Richard Jacques’ music from Sonic 3D Blast. Sonic music isn’t usually known for being calm and majestic, but Jacques did a great take on it.

WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#74941: Jul 14th 2023 at 7:13:23 PM

The Genesis version or the Saturn one?

BorneAgain (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#74942: Jul 14th 2023 at 7:22:29 PM

Space Queens from Sonic X-Treme always has always had this out-worldy, almost moody quality to it; like a David Wise Donkey Kong Country track by way of Sonic.

Edited by BorneAgain on Jul 14th 2023 at 10:23:05 AM

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#74943: Jul 14th 2023 at 7:44:56 PM

That one damn Lost Chao New Koco on Kronos island is so hard to clear the final obstacle for. But I FINALLY got it! Here's some tips:

  • If you're about to fall, fast travel back to the Cyberspace Portal at the start of the puzzle. Doing so saves your progress.
  • You can actually skip MOST of the puzzle. The only important part is the set of rings spawned by the last sensor.
  • When you are skydiving off the starting grind rail, caarefully position yourself so that you land on the high set of platforms, next to, but not on, the spikes. There is an invisible wall preventing you from landing at the very top ring, though.
  • There are just enough spike-free platforms that you can carefully jump to the other side of that high structure. From there, you can use Stomp to go inside the structure and trigger the sensor.
    • You may be able to jump to the metal crate next to the sensor, punch it as you fall, fast travel back to the Portal, land at the top again, then actually trigger the censor, but I'm not sure.
  • You still have to collect all the rings at the top as usual, and it may be a bit more challenging with the spikes still there, but the detection area for the rings is actually much larger than the rings themselves, so you don't have to get too close. As usual, you can fast travel to get the rings in multiple attempts.
  • To reach the top ring, you only need to launch yourself off the first platform it sends you to, using MOMENTUM. If you start with a boost from the very beginning of the ramp, it launches you just high enough that you can aim to pass by the high tower's single standable platform by the climb wall. As you do, hold a midair parry. That kills all your momentum and indefinitely suspends you in midair (I actually hate this feature). Then just jump on top of that platform, climb the wall, and you're done.

There's also a relatively easy way to skip a large portion of the New Koco with the climb wall platforms and spikes:

  • Right in the middle of the gorge, near where SQUID does a loop around a bridge, there's a grind rail leading to one of the rainbow boost hoops. Just launch from that hoop (you can even jump down to it from above).
  • It brings you right THROUGH some of the vertical platforms. As you approach them, just midair parry (again, ugh), to kill your momentum, then jump onto a platform.
  • These particular platforms are actually safe enough to walk on top of, on their thin side. Their other thin sides are also climbable. So, you can carefully climb and walk atop the thin sides of the platforms to skip the spike balls completely (once again, be careful with your hurtbox).
  • Then, as you near the end, just drop onto the boost pad, and finish the challenge automatically.

Edited by wanderlustwarrior on Jul 14th 2023 at 11:59:12 AM

mstorzil Crimson Helios Since: Nov, 2019
Crimson Helios
#74944: Jul 14th 2023 at 8:34:14 PM

Pretty much any theme from Rise of Lyric. Special mentions to Sky Citadel Chase, Metal Sonic, Abandoned Research Facility Part 1, and Lyric. Hd Unleashed may be my favorite game, but I can't see anything topping Ro L's ost anytime soon.

No rain could douse the flames that burn within me!
diddyknux Straw Hat Robin (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
Straw Hat Robin
#74945: Jul 14th 2023 at 8:44:28 PM

Speaking of Unleashed; Holoska's and Chun-Nan's Night Themes.

And also, Jungle Joyride Night.

...Honestly, a lot of the Night themes in Unleashed are really good. A different flavor then the Day themes, in a really cool way.

One of my favorite Sonic tunes is from a game I haven't even played (technically), the Saturn version of 3-D Blast. Rusty Ruin, Act 2. LOVE it.

Edited by diddyknux on Jul 14th 2023 at 10:46:15 AM

Kiobi20 Since: Sep, 2016
#74946: Jul 14th 2023 at 8:46:05 PM

which character do you think that should get a super form next? of course I mean one that doesn't have one yet, I was thinking of Espio or Rouge.

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#74947: Jul 14th 2023 at 9:54:14 PM

I would say Rouge, but I think there's too many super forms as is in the Modern era. Hell, I don't even see why Silver has one. Just having it be Sonic, Shadow, and Blaze is fine.

In the Classic games, I'm fine if everyone gets a non-canon super form.

Kiobi20 Since: Sep, 2016
#74948: Jul 14th 2023 at 9:56:11 PM

[up] how're the classic super forms not canon?

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#74949: Jul 14th 2023 at 10:08:35 PM

Well, they may be, but unless referenced in the story of another game, one doesn't have to treat them that way. Kind of like how beating Sonic 1 with Knuckles isn't canon.

I love how much game and replayability is in Frontiers, but there are WAY too many Memory Tokens on the map. 100% completion is gonna take a while.

Edited by wanderlustwarrior on Jul 14th 2023 at 12:09:31 PM

Kiobi20 Since: Sep, 2016
#74950: Jul 14th 2023 at 10:11:16 PM

[up] I can understand that with Knuckles not being in sonic 1 originally but in this case the super forms were on this games from the beggining so I think they're most likely canon, especially since this classic games barely have any story to speak off at all, where are they going to have space to put the super forms on?


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