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TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#73101: Apr 17th 2023 at 8:51:19 PM

You joke, but if Cream had been there, she DEFINITELY would have been the murderer.

If I was the train, I would not pass that up. "Your job is to cutely waddle over to Sonic, and then when he doesn't expect it, jab him with this tranquilizer and go, "Psst, I killed you!" And she'd be right there, smiling her sweetest smile because she's a very good girl who is doing a fantastic job winning this game.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Apr 17th 2023 at 8:51:45 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#73102: Apr 17th 2023 at 8:55:01 PM

Oh, I definitely agree that Cream would have been the murderer had she been in the game. It's the hilarious twist that everyone wants.

Even if she wasn't, I would have accused her immediately regardless of the clues.

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#73103: Apr 17th 2023 at 8:57:58 PM

I feel proud I managed to guess who the culprit was just before the final car.

Based on the fact that Espio is the only one who couldn't back up his alibi AND is a Ninja.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#73104: Apr 18th 2023 at 2:54:01 AM

...you know what, it is kind of weird how Cream and Charmy get coded as "too young" but Tails is completely fine.

I know Grandfather Clause and all, but yea that is a huge ass disparity.

No wonder they just nixed ages altogether

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#73105: Apr 18th 2023 at 3:09:08 AM

6 is a LOT younger than 8...

Scientifically, Tails is perfectly suited for a murder mystery.

Plus, he's Sonic's best friend.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#73106: Apr 18th 2023 at 3:14:46 AM

Ahh, the Toriyama defense.

Like how Krillin is the strongest human despite settling down to a more mundane job simply because he is Goku's best friend.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
KaoticKanine from Vania of Pencils Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
#73107: Apr 18th 2023 at 5:54:20 AM

[up][up][up] Yeah, and that's the thing that baffles me the most. They freaking removed the ages just last year! Sonic is no longer specifically 15, Amy is not specifically 12 anymore, and so on. Yet they still decide against Cream and Charmy because they're both 6. Like, do the ages not matter anymore or do they still??

[up][up] ...Two years, dude. That's not a big gap at all. Dare I say, it's quite short. And looking up parenting articles, eight-year-olds aren't that much different in behavior from six-year-olds. If Tails was nine, then I'd concede. But he's just a freakishly mature eight-year-old.

But, of course, the ages shouldn't be mattering. They never mattered to the characters to begin with, and they're supposed to be outright nixed now. Ultimately, age restrictions should not exist in Sonic at all. It's mind boggling to have a child and a borderline teenager owning their own houses, driving their own vehicles, while two other children marginally younger than the former are deemed "too young" for anything. It's nothing more than a stupid double-standard against Cream and Charmy (especially Cream) that arbitrarily limits their appearances and contributions to the cast.

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#73108: Apr 18th 2023 at 6:11:33 AM

Real world human standards don't exactly apply 1:1 with fictional animal-people. What matters is how they're coded and what's appropriate for them. And it's not like Cream's being infantilized. They made it a point to explain what sets her apart from other kids in the Metal Virus Arc.

It's not hard to believe someone would do different things with different friends. Cream just got multiple shout outs in Frontiers, it's not like Amy doesn't care about her.

lalalei2001 Since: Oct, 2009
#73109: Apr 18th 2023 at 6:45:31 AM

If Cream went along Cheese would too, and I have a feeling Cheese would be the murderer while Cream was innocent.

The Protomen enhanced my life.
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#73110: Apr 18th 2023 at 7:09:15 AM

Is Tails still 8? Since Generations, they've been implying that these characters have aged to some extent over the course of their history. "Modern" versions seem at least a few years older than their Classic counterparts.

And then Frontiers had Sonic's voice drop. Despite not changing actors, he has a deeper voice now.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Apr 18th 2023 at 7:10:52 AM

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BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#73111: Apr 18th 2023 at 7:22:49 AM

Wouldn't that make Cream and Charmy older then?

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
Pokesamus Since: Aug, 2016
#73112: Apr 18th 2023 at 7:51:57 AM

I’d say Tails gets away with it because frankly unless you were told he was still a young child most people would probably just assume he’s somewhere in the adolescence phase since that’s how the story typically treats him.

Numbuh1234 Since: Apr, 2014
#73113: Apr 18th 2023 at 7:59:20 AM

I've worked on this exact thing myself for my own timelines, so in case you're curious:

  • CD > Mania Mode > Encore Mode > Sonic 4 = +3 years (classic Sonic was confirmed to be Sonic when he was younger in Tails Tube so this should apply)
  • 06 +2 years at minimum (one of Shadow's missions (in English) mentions Shadow took a test in GUN "years" ago)
  • Unleashed +1 year (Sonic Pict tells us two things, 1 is that 06 takes place at the end of Summer, and 2 that Sonic has a birthday during Unleashed (which takes place in June, early Summer)
  • Colours +2 years at minimum (Eggman's Incredible Interstellar Amusement Park took "years" to make according to the English manual, and Eggman made this under the guise of reforming from his past misdeeds necessitating that he doesn't commit other takeover attempts during that time period)
  • Generations +1 year? (birthday, it really depends on how strictly you apply the "years" thing for Colours before
  • Runners +1 year? (birthday event, though Chip shows up for one scene...)
  • Forces +9 months (technically not a year, but that's pretty close, starting from the prequel DLC's flashback level and ending when the game's main plot takes place)

Going from Heroes/Advance 2, that'd put the ages of Cream and Charmy anywhere from +5 to +8 years at minimum, which puts them at at least 11 each. They'd be old enough to play in a murder mystery party.

Tomodachi Now a lurker. See you at the forums. Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Now a lurker. See you at the forums.
#73114: Apr 18th 2023 at 8:16:32 AM

Ok, then it's time for your good ol' friend, the jerk of Tomo, to guess why Amy and Tails were allowed.

Because they are rich but Cream and Charmy aren't.

Don't dare to pretend Amy is a common girl, she is secretly rich. How can a young girl own at least two apartments, multiple furniture in her image and be capable of traveling through the world? She owns the big bucks. How did she get the money? I have no clue, maybe she inherited it from her unseen parents. wild mass guess Maybe Chris Thorndyke was secretly Amy in an earlier draft, explaining why he took her role.wild mass guess

Cream, however, very clearly lives a simple life because Vanilla is nothing but a humble housewive without being a wive.

And let's not even talk about Tails who owns houses and workshops around the world. If he didn't inherited the money, he got it from selling his inventions. In fact, I'm sure he is the creator of Omochao who is the announcer of the World Grand Prix, meaning that Tails get royalties.

And Charmy is a Chaotix, who can't even pay rent consistently.

Edited by Tomodachi on Apr 18th 2023 at 8:26:54 AM

To win, you need to adapt, and to adapt, you need to be able to laugh away all the restraints. Everything holding you back.
LoneCourier0 The Wandering Geek from A Diverse Land (Unitroper) Relationship Status: How YOU doin'?
The Wandering Geek
#73115: Apr 18th 2023 at 8:17:55 AM

That sounds like the start of a copypasta. tongue

"Cynicism is not realistic and tough. It's unrealistic and kind of cowardly because it means you don't have to try."
NoName999 Since: May, 2011
#73116: Apr 18th 2023 at 8:26:12 AM

Doesn't explain why Knuckles, who doesn't even have a home, was able to afford a ticket. lol

Tomodachi Now a lurker. See you at the forums. Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Now a lurker. See you at the forums.
#73117: Apr 18th 2023 at 8:28:46 AM

He's a treasure hunter, he sold some old relic for a buck and then bought the ticket.

Either that or Amy paid for his ticket.

To win, you need to adapt, and to adapt, you need to be able to laugh away all the restraints. Everything holding you back.
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#73118: Apr 18th 2023 at 8:41:19 AM

Is Tails still 8? Since Generations, they've been implying that these characters have aged to some extent over the course of their history. "Modern" versions seem at least a few years older than their Classic counterparts.

I think the Sonic franchise's general idea on the concept of the characters aging is to always go backwards from the official ages.

That is, in whatever game you're playing, the modern day Sonic is always fifteen and Tails is always eight. So in Generations or other media that depicts them as younger, those Classic versions are to be retroactively seen as younger than fifteen or eight, rather than the younger versions beings the official ages and the modern versions going forward.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Apr 18th 2023 at 8:42:06 AM

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#73119: Apr 18th 2023 at 10:39:43 AM

Is that still the case? It was noted earlier that the official Sonic cast ages were removed last year, which I can't help but notice coincides pretty closely to Frontiers dropping Sonic's voice.

Wouldn't that make Cream and Charmy older then?

Not necessarily? I mean, Charmy was introduced in Chaotix so who knows where that falls on the timeline but Cream is from Sonic Advance 2, which clearly depicts Amy in her updated Modern look. The stark difference in Amy's two character designs acts as something of a barometer here.

If the Modern characters are supposed to be older than they were in the Classic games, then Cream entered the franchise after said time progression.

I don't know. Sonic ages are weird and confusing.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Apr 18th 2023 at 10:40:25 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
ShirowShirow Dinosaur Hunter from Land of Maple Syrup (Old as dirt)
Dinosaur Hunter
#73120: Apr 18th 2023 at 11:05:19 AM

I remember people saying that Sonic Heroes was the Chaotix "Real" debut and their previous appearances shouldn't really be counted. Makes sense too considering Espio basically did a complete 180 on his All There in the Manual personality.

Taking this into account you can sort of divide the timeline into the classic and Post-Adventure time periods, where Amy got her slightly older design, Espio got a attitude adjustment and Sonic stretched out his proportions a bit.

Since Cream debuted in the latter era and Tails debuted in the former it's easy to say Tails is a bit older than 8 now while she's still 6.

You are not alone.
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#73121: Apr 18th 2023 at 11:35:02 AM

Is that still the case? It was noted earlier that the official Sonic cast ages were removed last year, which I can't help but notice coincides pretty closely to Frontiers dropping Sonic's voice.

I think that was more to the purposes of not being tied to any particular number, but by all appearances the series still runs on Comic-Book Time: Tails is still explicitly a child in Murder, Sonic is still a teenager, etc.

ShirowShirow Dinosaur Hunter from Land of Maple Syrup (Old as dirt)
Dinosaur Hunter
#73122: Apr 18th 2023 at 11:56:53 AM

I do like that TMOSTH kind of flies in the face of a lot of the things Sega had previous mandates on. "Keep it simple, Sonic and Co can't wear different outfits, Sonic can't be defeated" etc. They probably got extra leeway by calling it an April Fools Day joke, but at the end of the day it's really a completely sincere story made from love of these characters and it clearly resonated.

You are not alone.
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#73123: Apr 18th 2023 at 12:03:42 PM

I think that was more to the purposes of not being tied to any particular number, but by all appearances the series still runs on Comic-Book Time: Tails is still explicitly a child in Murder, Sonic is still a teenager, etc.

That makes sense. So it probably is just the vibe, as someone noted earlier. You can easily forget that Tails is supposed to be a child given his prominent role in the series as the Smart Guy, whereas Cream is very childlike in her... everything.

As the Kid Sidekick, Tails is a lot more Sidekick than Kid. While Cream is just all Kid, 100%.

I don't know about Charmy. I'm not very familiar with the Chaotix. I kinda just thought they were all around the same age as Knux.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Apr 18th 2023 at 12:05:35 PM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#73124: Apr 18th 2023 at 12:37:17 PM

Heh. About that.
Basically, Charmy used to be a childish "teenager" close in age to the rest of them, since it was never explicit in game canon. Then at some point during the Archie run, SEGA mandated/clarified that he actually be/was a kid. So in that comic canon, he basically got hit with some mental age regression. In IDW and presumably the games, he has always been on the younger side, matching his actions. Vector and Charmy are basically his dads/guardians.

If Vector and Vanilla ever get together, Charmy and Cream could sort of be considered step-siblings. In the wholesome, Brady Bunch way. Not the unwholesome internet way. ...Or the unwholesome Brady Bunch way.

Oh hey, the above video link was to a Game Apologist video about Charmy. Turns out he just published a video about Murder today.

Edited by wanderlustwarrior on Apr 18th 2023 at 2:40:51 PM

neoamon Mr from Planet Mobius S.T.C. (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded)
Mr
#73125: Apr 18th 2023 at 1:08:15 PM

He was treated as a kid by Chaotix and Sonic in Fleetway but he is the same size as most adult bee bar his mother the Queen Bee who is taller than the rest of the bees and brought a company.

"May your heart be your guiding key"

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