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RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#70826: Jan 19th 2023 at 3:48:32 PM

I remember in the Archie Comics Flynn also had Sonic use the Master Emerald to go super to fight a brainwashed Knuckles.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#70827: Jan 19th 2023 at 3:57:26 PM

Wait, was the whole Knuckles becomes Enejak thing done after Flynn took over? I thought that was still Penders. Though that story line went a lot better than the one where Knuckles turned green and, then, uh, I wouldn't say he did nothing, because he went back in time to change history, but then he realized that plan had lots of issues, so he stopped doing that, and then after that he didn't really use his new powers for anything.

Edited by WillKeaton on Jan 19th 2023 at 5:57:55 AM

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#70829: Jan 19th 2023 at 4:27:04 PM

That's just true...

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#70830: Jan 19th 2023 at 4:54:34 PM

Oh, you know why I thought that? Because in Penders' stupid lawsuit over Sonic Chronicles he was upset that one of the evil echidnas was an albino, just like the character Dr. Finitevus, who first appeared in that Knuckles is Enerjak storyline.

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#70831: Jan 19th 2023 at 5:03:13 PM

Yeah the story came from Sonic 183, under Ian Flynn.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
lalalei2001 Since: Oct, 2009
#70832: Jan 19th 2023 at 5:03:58 PM

There was also Dr. Zachary from Sonic the Comic, though the first original echidna created for Archie was Athair, by Mike Gallagher. He also appeared in Sonic Underground!

The first original Sonic echidna ever was Princess Alucion from Sonic Adventures.

(Finitevus was retconned to be a random echdina in ish 94 who was transformed/changed by the Chaos Siphon.)

Edited by lalalei2001 on Jan 19th 2023 at 8:04:52 AM

The Protomen enhanced my life.
Zeromaeus Since: May, 2010
#70833: Jan 19th 2023 at 8:32:36 PM

Finitevus was, humorously enough, introduced by another writer while Penders was off the book during the Return to Angel Island arc. Its the one where the art style shifted drastically for a little while to a more chibi/anime-esque aesthetic. One of the best pre-Flynn arcs, honestly.

Penders' claim came from that retcon that only exists because Flynn likes to tie things back as much as possible.

Edited by Zeromaeus on Jan 19th 2023 at 11:33:37 AM

WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#70834: Jan 20th 2023 at 9:39:17 AM

Oh, that retcon. Okay, for those who aren't ardent followers of Archie comics lore: Dr. Fintivus first appearance was during the "Knuckles is Enerjak" arc. But, back during the Knuckles turns green arc, a little bit before and after issue 100, Knuckles also got a lot of chaos power. The leader of Albion decided to use a Chaos Syphon to suck away the chaos energy. I think that was the plan anyway. At any rate, the thing backfired, there was an explosion, and afterwards Knuckles had so much chaos energy he was green. What does this have to do with Fintivus? Well according to a retcon, Fintivus was the guy operating the Chaos Syphon and the explosion left him with white fur. If you go back and look at the actual scene, the guy who is supposed to be Fintivus appears in like two panels and has no lines. So, I guess Penders wound up with the rights to Fintivus, even though the concept of Fintivus didn't come around until after he left, because of this retcon to try and tie Fintivus' origins to an earlier event.

Edited by WillKeaton on Jan 20th 2023 at 10:40:48 AM

jouXIII The One Who Knows Many Things from Between the Multiverses (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
The One Who Knows Many Things
#70835: Jan 20th 2023 at 10:14:37 AM

Actually, Finitevus' first appearance in the comics was during "Return to Angel Island"(#138-141) written by Karl Bollers.

Next time Finitevus was used from there was during Ian Flynn's first two issues(in #161, to be more precise), where he rescued Scourge and Rouge from Shadow.

Edited by jouXIII on Jan 20th 2023 at 8:33:33 PM

I assure you, I'm perfectly trustable person
WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#70836: Jan 20th 2023 at 10:46:00 AM

Ah, okay. Was the "Return to Angel Island" arc before or after Penders left?

Edited by WillKeaton on Jan 20th 2023 at 12:50:19 PM

jouXIII The One Who Knows Many Things from Between the Multiverses (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Zeromaeus Since: May, 2010
#70838: Jan 20th 2023 at 1:26:23 PM

Before, but while he was off the main comic. Without checking, I think he was on Mobius 25 Years Later at the time.

ultimatepheer Since: Mar, 2011
#70839: Jan 20th 2023 at 2:48:54 PM

So he sued and managed to steal characters from Sega, because the character in a game was visually similar to a character created by an entirely different person when he had no claim to that character at all?

lalalei2001 Since: Oct, 2009
#70840: Jan 20th 2023 at 3:28:18 PM

I think for Chronicles it was more that the Nocturnus Clan had storyline and visual similarities with the Dark Legion, both being a high-tech race of echidnas banished to an alternate dimension and having a Sixth Ranger Traitor love interest with Knuckles.

The reason he won the case, though, was mainly because Archie didn't keep track of the paperwork from what I understand.

Edited by lalalei2001 on Jan 20th 2023 at 6:29:57 AM

The Protomen enhanced my life.
KuroBaraHime ☆♥☆ Since: Jan, 2011
☆♥☆
#70841: Jan 20th 2023 at 3:38:34 PM

It should probably be remembered that Penders didn't technically "win" the actual case, Archie just settled with him out of court. We don't actually have have any public info about what exactly Penders got out of the settlement, and there was even some court documents dug up a year ago that suggest he's been lying about getting more character rights than he actually did (I don't have time to dig up the details on that at the moment).

Chortleous she/her friend to the hooved (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: She does the things you do, but she is an IBM
she/her friend to the hooved
#70842: Jan 20th 2023 at 4:09:31 PM

[...]and there was even some court documents dug up a year ago that suggest he's been lying about getting more character rights than he actually did

That sounds incredibly illegal.

Edited by Chortleous on Jan 20th 2023 at 6:10:03 AM

RJ-19-CLOVIS-93 from New Zealand (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#70843: Jan 20th 2023 at 4:15:01 PM

@ Will Keaton: Makes sense. The Master Emerald is meant to be more powerful than the Chaos Emeralds and acts like a master control of sorts so it alone allowing a super transformation is fine. After all, Mecha Sonic got a super form using it

WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#70844: Jan 20th 2023 at 5:08:33 PM

On the topic of the Master Emerald, Frontiers seems to suggest it's native to Earth, but the Ancients had all the chaos emeralds when they still lived in space, before they arrived on Earth. So, do they have anything to do with each other? They must, but now it looks like they're not from the same place? This new lore hurts my brain.

KuroBaraHime ☆♥☆ Since: Jan, 2011
☆♥☆
#70845: Jan 20th 2023 at 6:59:07 PM

I found the thing I was thinking of in regards to the Penders case. I was misremembering as it doesn't directly contradict the idea that Penders owns those characters, but the records show that Penders basically had no case and it was pretty much a slam dunk in Archie's favor, meaning the narrative Penders has given over the years that he won the rights because Archie lost the papers he signed when hired is a complete lie. The court established that Archie had copies of such papers and those copies were proof enough that he signed them and any away rights to any characters he made while working for Archie.

If he did get anything out of the case, it's seems like it's purely because Sega twisted Archie's arm to end the case immediately instead of continuing the trial. Anything more is speculation, but considering things, it's possible that Penders possibly doesn't own full rights to those characters but just that Sega had no interest in ever using them again and possibly starting more trouble with him.

Deadpoolrocks Since: Sep, 2010
#70846: Jan 20th 2023 at 8:46:04 PM

[up][up]the master emerald is what drew the chaos emeralds and the ancients to earth, so they are connected in some way

Tony-Sharx Megalodons are the best kind of furry. from ACME Nation Since: Mar, 2020
Megalodons are the best kind of furry.
#70847: Jan 20th 2023 at 9:57:48 PM

[up][up]All SEGA had to do was show up in court and explain that they were the sole proprietor to the Sonic franchise; this would've secured Archie's win and kicked Penders to the curb. Probably could've taken 30 minutes out of their day sending some low level intern and a written summary.

But because Sega of Japan decided to be completely hands off, no judgement was made.

Certified, self-appointed Sonic Visionary
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#70848: Jan 21st 2023 at 12:07:56 AM

Watching Comic Drake's video on Penders, I think the darkly funniest thing about him is that he only got into Sonic because his son happened to be a fan of the games at the time

This comment sums up how bizarre that is

I never knew that Ken’s son being into Sonic helped start this whole thing. I’m trying to imagine what would be going through my daughters’ heads if 30 years from now I was spending all my time and money fighting for a bunch of weirdly sexualized Paw Patrol OCs, and it’s a very bleak image.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#70849: Jan 21st 2023 at 12:09:20 AM

You never know where life takes you. [lol]

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
GAP Formerly G.G. from Who Knows? Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: In love with love
Formerly G.G.
#70850: Jan 21st 2023 at 1:23:08 AM

The odd thing is that Penders can write some decent stories if an editor can reign him that is. It is just that Penders is not as good as he thinks is.

Edited by GAP on Jan 21st 2023 at 4:25:25 AM

"Mai waifu."

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