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ShinyCottonCandy Everyone's friend Malamar from Lumiose City (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Everyone's friend Malamar
#70676: Jan 9th 2023 at 6:26:14 AM

Speaking of minigames, I gotta ask. Really? Pinball? Shouldn't The Ancients be more advanced than that?

Being highly advanced is not mutually exclusive to enjoying a good game of pinball. Granted, that individual game has some design issues, including the ball being polyhedral.

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KuroBaraHime ☆♥☆ Since: Jan, 2011
☆♥☆
#70677: Jan 9th 2023 at 1:49:12 PM

So I had decided to try playing almost every Sonic game before Frontiers. And it took longer than I wanted but I finally finished doing that. And I've put all the games in a neat tier list.

    tier list as an image 
https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/sonic_ranking2_2.png
    tier list as plain text 
S: Adventure 2, Adventure
A: Sonic 3 & Knuckles, Mania, CD, Colors (DS), Pocket Adventure
B: Advance, Shadow, Heroes, Rush, Rush Adventure, Black Knight, Riders, Riders: Zero Gravity, Sonic 2, Tails Adventure, Battle, Team Sonic Racing
C: Generations, Sonic 06, Forces, Triple Trouble, Advance 3, Chaos, Fighters
D: Advance 2, Secret Rings, Blast, Lost World, Sonic 4 Ep2, Colors, Chronicles, Shattered Crystal, Rivals 2, Rivals, Shuffle, Sonic 1
E: Unleashed, Generations (3DS), Sonic 1 (8-bit), Drift, Drift 2, R, SegaSonic, Sonic 2 (8-bit), Labyrinth, Lost World (3DS), Fire & Ice
F: Free Riders, Sonic 4 Ep1, Chaotix, 3D Blast, Tails' Skypatrol, Spinball, Rise of Lyric
The games are ranked within the tiers, but that doesn't matter as much as the general tier and are sometimes thrown in a bit of an arbitrary order.

I'm probably going to take long break from Sonic games before I actually get to playing Frontiers.

Feel free to talk about what your favorite Sonic games are and how wrong my list is.

NoName999 Since: May, 2011
#70678: Jan 9th 2023 at 1:53:38 PM

Where's the GOAT that is Waku Waku Sonic Patrol Car??????

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#70679: Jan 9th 2023 at 2:10:19 PM

So where is Frontiers on that list?

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
KuroBaraHime ☆♥☆ Since: Jan, 2011
☆♥☆
#70680: Jan 9th 2023 at 2:13:04 PM

I still haven't played it yet. Ask again in a couple months, I'm all Sonic-ed out for now.

Teamkirin5 Soft Boi from You don't need to know. Since: Jun, 2019 Relationship Status: Abstaining
Soft Boi
#70681: Jan 9th 2023 at 2:21:23 PM

I'm surprised Unleashed is that low. What version did you play?

We all have to answer to the call of fate when it beckons us, even if it is not at a moment of our choosing.
KuroBaraHime ☆♥☆ Since: Jan, 2011
☆♥☆
#70682: Jan 9th 2023 at 2:29:44 PM

The PS3 version. It's the most Boost-y Boost-style Sonic game, which if you like Boost games means it's possibly your favorite game, but I hate it so as far as I'm concerned it's the worst 3D Sonic games (not counting Boom). The Werehog sections were the good part of the game.

A bit of extra background info: I fully played through every Sonic platformer to the end, except for Rise of Lyric and 3DS Lost World which I played for a couple hours each before deciding I'd seen enough. I didn't play the Wii version of Unleashed, it would have been too repetitive after having just played the HD version.

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#70683: Jan 9th 2023 at 2:30:52 PM

Forces is too high.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#70684: Jan 9th 2023 at 2:34:15 PM

Hey, someone else who remembers to separate Sonic 4-1 and Sonic 4-2 as different games, and recognizes that 4-2 is a marked improvement.

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#70685: Jan 9th 2023 at 2:38:31 PM

It went from a bad game to an ok one, but an improvement is an improvement.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#70686: Jan 9th 2023 at 2:38:34 PM

Too bad that improvement wasn't enough to save Sonic 4.

One Strip! One Strip!
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#70687: Jan 9th 2023 at 2:43:24 PM

It really is a shame. 4-2 is an enjoyable game that just has very clear, obvious flaws, in contrast to 4-1 which was just terrible. It would've been a great first try. But it wasn't.

Like, if 4-2 was 4-1, I think more people would've really wanted more games to see where the side series went. In the end, though, 4-2 wasn't 4-1. It ended up just being the game that gave its best, but failed, shot to save a series that was already killed by its first game.

Unfortunate, but I'd still be intrigued if a game brought back Sylvania Castle or White Park one of these days. And it still has one of the best 2D final bosses in the whole franchise imo.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Jan 9th 2023 at 2:43:55 AM

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#70688: Jan 9th 2023 at 2:48:24 PM

The first real mistake was calling it Sonic 4 when it was never designed as such to begin with. They should have known how high the expectations were with a name like that.

Had it been just another 2D title, people would have written it off and moved on. They set themselves up by trying to cash in on people's nostalgia without putting work in understanding the games they were trying to emulate.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
BorneAgain (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#70689: Jan 9th 2023 at 2:53:01 PM

4 pretty much was the Forces of its time; a title presented as a follow-up that fails to genuinely embody the kind of games it was supposedly emulating.

MetalMichelangelo Since: Nov, 2012
#70690: Jan 9th 2023 at 2:54:36 PM

I reached the final island and I know the True Final Boss requires Hard mode, but can I merely switch to Hard mode?

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#70691: Jan 9th 2023 at 3:12:36 PM

Yes, you can.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
MetalMichelangelo Since: Nov, 2012
#70692: Jan 9th 2023 at 3:19:52 PM

Any other tips?

I had quite some trouble on Easy mode. I'm horrendous at parrying.

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#70693: Jan 9th 2023 at 3:22:52 PM

Parrying requires no timing at all...

You can hold it for 20+ seconds.

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MetalMichelangelo Since: Nov, 2012
#70694: Jan 9th 2023 at 3:31:15 PM

I tried that against Wyvern and Knight and they slammed Super Sonic into a wall.

mstorzil Crimson Helios Since: Nov, 2019
Crimson Helios
#70695: Jan 9th 2023 at 4:23:58 PM

That's probably because you didn't release the parry buttons and press again after the 1st parry. After you parry an attack Sonic exits the parry stance. I remember for Wyvern you have to parry 2 missiles in a row. By the way, I feel that I should say I'm kind of doing a challenge run. I'm going through the game not upgrading any stats except for speed (Only because I don't think speed upgrades really make things any easier aside from the race challenges, which are pitifully easy anyways). So far I haven't died on any of the Titans and I'm on the final island.

No rain could douse the flames that burn within me!
Hylarn (Don’t ask)
#70696: Jan 9th 2023 at 6:14:17 PM

Got to the pinball, and, uh, not having a great time. The third island's story missions have generally been unreasonably hard, but pinball's just not that fun. Well, box smashing also sucked, but at least a single round was fairly short

PhysicalStamina i'm tired, my friend (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Coming soon to theaters
i'm tired, my friend
#70697: Jan 9th 2023 at 6:32:38 PM

Most of the minigames are kinda bad tbh

i'm tired, my friend
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#70698: Jan 10th 2023 at 2:34:01 PM

@tier list

Huh, I feel validation seeing Colors DS so high on that list, since I really enjoyed playing it, but I'm surprised that it's so much higher than Generations 3DS and Lost World 3DS.

KuroBaraHime ☆♥☆ Since: Jan, 2011
☆♥☆
#70699: Jan 10th 2023 at 2:59:19 PM

Colors being so much better than the 3DS games isn't surprising when you know the circumstances. Colors DS could have had a tight schedule for all I know, but since it was on the DS Dimps was able to reuse the engine and assets from the Rush games, so gameplay-wise it ends up being Sonic Rush 3 and it's quite polished and streamlined.

But with Generations 3DS, Sega only gave Dimps around 7 months to make the game, and it was on a new system they had to make everything from scratch on. You could argue the game is decent considering how rushed it was, but it's pretty rough and plays significantly worse than the Classic stages in console/PC Generations. I originally threw it somewhere in the middle of D tier at first, but it's so rough around the edges and pointless to play over the console version or other 2D Sonic games I kept moving down until it ended up in high E tier.

I haven't heard any details on Lost World 3DS's development, but supposedly it was rushed as well. From what I played (up until the 2nd boss) it was basically just Wii U Lost World but with worse controls and more annoying level gimmicks. Even the story is exactly the same but with the cutscenes being more blurry and compressed. It also has one of the worst special stages in the series. I've seen a few people think it's better than the Wii U version, but I've seen more think it's worse, and it didn't seem very worth playing to me.

ShinyCottonCandy Everyone's friend Malamar from Lumiose City (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Everyone's friend Malamar
#70700: Jan 10th 2023 at 3:58:07 PM

I know it's an unpopular opinion, but I preferred 3DS Lost World to HD Lost World. The somersault felt so much better to me than the kick, and for that matter Sonic's homing attack itself felt janky in the HD version. Plus I really hated the minecart in the HD game.

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