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KuroBaraHime ☆♥☆ Since: Jan, 2011
☆♥☆
#65926: Jul 23rd 2022 at 3:51:47 PM

Why would Knuckles Chaotix not be canon? Just because Knuckles and the Chaotix really don't interact in the modern day as if they've got a history?
Someone else probably remembers better what I'm talking about, but I remember there was some interview in the past where it was said that Team Chaotix's appearance in Heroes was like their second introduction the franchise and something along the lines of, treat their character bios in Heroes as overwriting their bios in Knuckles' Chaotix, or ignore their previous appearance in Chaotix. I remember some people bringing it up on another site as proof of Knuckles' Chaotix not being canon.

I heard Chaotix isn't taken as canon because it wasn't exactly made by the same staff or something.
It was made by mostly the same team who made Sonic CD, so that shouldn't be an issue.

Chortleous she/her friend to the hooved (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: She does the things you do, but she is an IBM
she/her friend to the hooved
#65927: Jul 23rd 2022 at 3:58:15 PM

I was under the impression it was usually ignored because it was a kinda-not-great game that nobody played for a Genesis addon that nobody owned, or at least that was the unspoken reason they needed to "re-introduce" the Chaotix.

Edited by Chortleous on Jul 23rd 2022 at 6:08:34 AM

BorneAgain (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#65928: Jul 23rd 2022 at 5:16:12 PM

Chaotix is generally a title that seems interesting with its gimmick and color aesthetic... until you actually play it and ends up being more tedious than anything else.

Joshbones Since: May, 2015
#65929: Jul 23rd 2022 at 5:35:03 PM

Heroes, their reintroduction game, goes out of their way to have none of the Chaotix know who Eggman is, and I think that's very telling.

MisterZygarde64 Crazy Crossover Creator - A Man with Many Hypoth from New Mobotropolis, Mushroom Kingdom Since: Dec, 2015 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
Crazy Crossover Creator - A Man with Many Hypoth
#65930: Jul 24th 2022 at 12:55:53 AM

I feel like if Knuckles Chaotix ever became canon again, it'd probably occur in Classic Sonic's timeline.

Check out Rogues Gallery Transplant: The Game
RJ-19-CLOVIS-93 from New Zealand (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#65931: Jul 24th 2022 at 8:37:40 PM

That Classic timeline annoys me. If they want to make an Alternate Continuity that's fine, but it could be construed as them pulling a soft reboot by saying the classic games as we know them didn't happen in the modern era. They should at least give an explanation, like "when Sonic Generations happened it caused a Future Trunks situation". But that would still leave questions like "shouldn't there be Classic-exclusive characters like Mighty in modern games?"

Tomodachi Now a lurker. See you at the forums. Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Now a lurker. See you at the forums.
#65932: Jul 24th 2022 at 10:29:22 PM

Just because he should doesnt mean he doesnt. Mighty is just living his life somewhere we don't know.

To win, you need to adapt, and to adapt, you need to be able to laugh away all the restraints. Everything holding you back.
GeekCritique Since: Aug, 2018
#65933: Jul 26th 2022 at 10:46:32 AM

I agree that era designations are kind of silly (not to mention they probably lead to more tribalism) but darn if they're not also fun to think about. It's kind of ridiculous how long we've been doing this, too. I remember the GHZ fansite describing 1995 as "The Dark Age" in, like, 1999. :V

Here's how it shakes out for me:

1991-2001 is The SegaSonic Era. The key feature here is that Sonic is the mascot character of one of gaming's main players, and his influence and popularity makes that company a household name. He is a Triple A franchise, and rivals other gaming icons. You could further break this down into three sub-eras: The Genesis era (which sets that standard), the Saturn era (the first dark age), and the Dreamcast era (an uneven return to form, but an ambitious return all the same).

A constant through this period is the influence of Hirokazu Yasuhara, the lead director/game planner of Sonic 1, 2, 3, & Knuckles. While the rest of Sonic Team was working on Ni GHTS and Burning Rangers, Yasuhara was working with STI on the ill-fated Sonic X-Treme. When that game got canned, he moved to the UK for a while to work with Traveler's Tales on Sonic R. He said:

I was opposed to [Sega's] decision to create games that use 'Sonic-something' so that they can sell it easily. I wanted to make good games, not any games that used the Sonic character in a haphazard way.

1998-2009 is The Adventure Era. This crosses over into the previous era by a few years! I don't think era designations necessarily need a clean break. Sonic Adventure 1 is too much of a transition point between the two periods.

It also sees the loss of the original core trio of the Sonic Team... Yasuhara is gone before SA 1, Ohshima leaves before SA 2, and Naka quits before 06.

The main defining feature of this era is the end of Sega's console business, their establishment as a third-party developer, and Sonic Team's coinciding decision to take the series in a bold, different direction, with a much more dramatic, anime-inspired focus. To quote an interview with Shiro Maekawa (the lead writer of SA 2, who also did work on Heroes, 06, and the storybook games) from Sonic Team.com...

"What is Sonic to you, Mr. Maekawa?"

Honestly, I didn't like Sonic in the "Mega Drive Era". To be frank, it didn't suit my tastes. So when I was placed into doing Sonic Adventure I was excited! "I'm going to make a Sonic that I like!"

This was highly divisive at the time, but thanks to the sales of SA 2: Battle on the Game Cube, it was also highly influential. Maekawa's unique tastes brought a whole new flavor to Sonic, one that resonated with some people and alienated others. To some, it was their introduction to the series. To others, it was the abandonment of everything that defined their love of it. But it's the nature of a long-running series, it's always going to be re-interpreted like this over time, and this wasn't the first or last time it'd happen to Sonic.

The era fully comes into focus with the release of SA 2 in 2001, a game that, like most of the mainline titles of this period, would be made in the US by a sub-group within Sonic Team called "Sega Studios USA."

2007-2017 is The Boost Era. Sega Studios USA is no more. Sonic Team is fully integrated back in Japan. No trace of the original Sonic Team is left, and a younger group, many of whom grew up playing the games, starts to take the reigns.

This really gets its start with Sonic Rush in 2005, comes into clearer focus with a Sonic Team game via Secret Rings in 2007, and hits its stride with 2008's Sonic Unleashed, which combines and refines the most popular elements of both of them. And yet like Sonic Adventure, Unleashed itself is a transitional game. It started development as "Sonic Adventure 3," but had its name changed when the team felt they had evolved too far beyond that concept.

Just like SA 1 set a new foundation and SA 2 built on it, Colors calcifies what Unleashed started, and Generations further refines the formula. The early part of this era is, in terms of reception, the exact inverse of the previous one: Instead of the games getting progressively WORSE reception, they're getting progressively better, and by 2012 Sonic is cameoing in Disney movies, appearing in insurance commercials... the ship has been righted, people start calling it the "Renaissance Era," and there's a surprising air of optimism about the future of the series.

Then Lost World is a bust, the "Sonic Boom" project is one of the most expensive, ambitious things Sega's ever attempted with the series, but proves that the bigger they are the harder they fall, and Forces gets middling reception and fails to re-re-right the ship. The renaissance was short-lived.

But to someone who's been there since the Genesis, all of that pales in comparison to the brilliance of Sonic Mania, which I see as the vindication of our fandom. Sega's complete inability to follow-up on it in the five years since says something, I think.

Everything past that, we're too close to see clearly how it fits in. 2017 to 2022 has been a WHOLE lot like 1994 to 1999, a bit of a dark age. We've gotten spin-offs, compilations, movies, and comic books, and in a lot of ways the Sonic brand seems healthier now than it has been 'since' the mid-90s. I just hope Frontiers can knock it out of the park. In any case, Sonic continues to spin toward the future...

Edited by GeekCritique on Jul 26th 2022 at 10:57:07 AM

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#65934: Jul 26th 2022 at 11:00:09 AM

but darn if they're not also fun to think about.

If you're a masochist maybe. I love watching chaos too, but I can take but so much.

Edited by BlackYakuzu94 on Jul 26th 2022 at 2:01:22 PM

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
Rabbitearsblog Movie and TV Goddess from United States Since: Jan, 2014 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
Movie and TV Goddess
#65935: Jul 26th 2022 at 1:54:06 PM

I honestly never understood the need to create different eras for the Sonic the Hedgehog franchise. I mean sure, maybe it's done to help people distinguish between the types of games being released throughout the years. But, the way I see it, I just see the games as being their own thing and I judge the games based on their content, not based on the era they came out of. To me, breaking up the franchise into several different eras just causes even more frictions within the fanbase and we all know how divisive this fanbase can get.

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AceOfScarabs I am now a shiny stone~ from Singapore Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Drift compatible
I am now a shiny stone~
#65936: Jul 27th 2022 at 6:46:26 AM

I always figured that Vector really did know Sonic back in their band days, and that challenge stage in Generations is a jam session 'Just like old times'.

Edited by AceOfScarabs on Jul 27th 2022 at 9:46:37 PM

The three finest things in life are to splat your enemies, drive them from their turf, and hear their lamentations as their rank falls!
FOFD Since: Apr, 2013
#65937: Jul 27th 2022 at 7:24:25 AM

I honestly never understood the need to create different eras for the Sonic the Hedgehog franchise.

I mean sure, maybe it's done to help people distinguish between the types of games being released throughout the years
.

The reason I believe this was done is because the games are not just their own thing. From Sonic Adventure onward the core gameplay and tone of the franchise changed immensely. Sonic went from being a 2D platformer to including a wider variety of gameplay types. Not only that but the cast and setting changed significantly.

Granted, as always, Mario did the same thing without causing as much confusion or divisiveness, but that's how SEGA chose to go about this.

It also let them market stuff like this which was pretty unheard of back when it came out. You wouldn't find Donkey Kong or Samus or Master Chief or Doom Guy teaming up with their past selves.

not based on the era they came out of. To me, breaking up the franchise into several different eras just causes even more frictions within the fanbase and we all know how divisive this fanbase can get.

That's more the fanbase's problem than the developers I think.

Or at least it was until they opted not to create a sub-series of Classic games while continuing to make Modern titles. They could've easily remedied the divisiveness, had their cake and eaten it too because people like Sonic Mania and people want Sonic Adventure 3. People want improved remakes of Sonic 06. People like Sonic Colors and Lost World and even Forces to a degree.

Distinguishing the obvious difference between Sonic 1 to 3 (& Knuckles) and Sonic Adventure to Sonic 2006 isn't a problem. The sheer lack of pragmatism definitely was. A modern/classic split would be less of a problem if A) they didn't announce/people didn't adhere to there being "two separate worlds that never interact", and B) if they just made Sonic 4 like Sonic Mania and if Sonic Forces didn't suck.

Edited by FOFD on Jul 27th 2022 at 10:28:57 AM

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#65938: Jul 27th 2022 at 4:29:07 PM

Since nobody posted this yet.

Sonic Frontiers will be playable at EGX, a London gaming convention, in September

And yes, the render is official. 100%.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#65939: Jul 27th 2022 at 4:47:48 PM

Alright then.

Time for Sega to put up or shut up.

Go big or go home.

Win or die.

Etc, etc.

One Strip! One Strip!
mstorzil Crimson Helios Since: Nov, 2019
Crimson Helios
#65940: Jul 27th 2022 at 5:55:50 PM

At the very least it's something completely new for the series so even if it's a disaster at least it'll be an interesting disaster.

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HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#65941: Jul 27th 2022 at 5:57:58 PM

We've had interesting disasters from these guys.

Or rather, we've had disasters.

I think we'd all prefer something else.

I do hope Sega has truly been serious about making sure this is a good one.

Time will tell, time will tell.

One Strip! One Strip!
FOFD Since: Apr, 2013
#65942: Jul 27th 2022 at 5:58:38 PM

Giant floating railways without any buildings or implied rail stations.

Interesting.

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#65943: Jul 27th 2022 at 6:15:57 PM

That's basically what the game is, yea.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
erazor0707 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#65945: Jul 27th 2022 at 8:43:47 PM

So good that literally nobody believed it came from Sega.

Kind of says a lot really.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
Tomodachi Now a lurker. See you at the forums. Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Now a lurker. See you at the forums.
#65946: Jul 27th 2022 at 9:29:20 PM

Sega hired that man, after all.

To win, you need to adapt, and to adapt, you need to be able to laugh away all the restraints. Everything holding you back.
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#65947: Jul 27th 2022 at 10:18:59 PM

It's still so weird to me that the open-world area that looks like a Windows backdrop and has random architecture floating in mid-air seemingly for the sole purpose of gameplay is the real world and the sub-levels that look like every other Sonic game is a fake digital world.

Almost weird enough to believe that's the big twist of the game, that it's actually the other way around, or at least that the open-world area is one layer of the digital world and the sub-levels are a different layer meant to imitate the real world.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Jul 27th 2022 at 10:19:42 AM

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#65948: Jul 27th 2022 at 10:44:08 PM

Platforms and rails are floating in mid-air...

The actual architecture is all grounded.

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diddyknux Straw Hat Robin (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
Straw Hat Robin
#65949: Jul 27th 2022 at 11:37:32 PM

Now that I think about it, rails usually are just floating in the air without anything actually holding them up.

Edited by diddyknux on Jul 27th 2022 at 1:37:47 PM

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#65950: Jul 28th 2022 at 12:00:14 AM

Yes, that has been consistently pointed out many times...

The thing people don't seem to understand is that for as many times there are rails that naturally and diegetically fit into the environment...there are twice as many levels where that doesn't happen and rails just extend off of unrelated terrain.

And in the Boost games rail sequences tend to stretch on so long that it doesn't matter if they're connected to anything.


The other thing people don't seem to understand is that...regardless of the amount of levels where rails just stretch out to infinity over open space, outside of Final Rush & Rail Canyon you can't actually see those rails just floating over nothing before or after the dedicated sequences.

So when people say it looks ugly to just see random rails floating in the sky, it's because of where you see them along with the fact that you see them at all.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.

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