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Rule Magic vs, Magic A is Magic A.

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chubbyboy Since: Jan, 2001
#1: Feb 4th 2011 at 7:42:36 AM

Could someone please clarify the difference between these two tropes? As far as I can tell, they mean the same thing: "Magic operates by following a consistent set of rules."

FastEddie Since: Apr, 2004
#2: Feb 4th 2011 at 7:43:49 AM

"Magic A" Is "Magic A" is one of the rules being followed. Rule Magic is a thing that has the rule.

edited 4th Feb '11 7:44:53 AM by FastEddie

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chubbyboy Since: Jan, 2001
#3: Feb 4th 2011 at 8:38:47 AM

That seems like an unneeded distinction to me.

NativeJovian Jupiterian Local from Orlando, FL Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Jupiterian Local
#4: Feb 4th 2011 at 10:01:16 AM

Better question: why does Rule Magic redirect to Functional Magic, while the section called "Rule Magic" in the Functional Magic article is potholed to Ritual Magic?

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FastEddie Since: Apr, 2004
#5: Feb 4th 2011 at 10:09:46 AM

^ I fixed that.

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KJMackley Since: Jan, 2001
#6: Feb 4th 2011 at 12:15:11 PM

It's a vague distinction but Rule Magic is specifically about magic itself, where magic is governed by specific rules of casting such as a Mana Meter, speaking an incantation, making a potion with ingredients or you have to use a magic wand. "Magic A" Is "Magic A" isn't so much about magic as it is about fictional elements being consistent. Time Travel, Psychic Powers and Sufficiently Advanced Alien can fit the trope.

Atz Since: Jan, 2001
#7: Feb 4th 2011 at 8:13:08 PM

"Magic A" Is "Magic A" is about consistency, while Rule Magic is about having underlying rules and metaphysical laws.

If you have to say "Abracadabra" to make something vanish, and everyone says it every time they want to vanish something, that's "Magic A" Is "Magic A". It doesn't matter if it's completely arbitrary, or why it works like that - so long as it works the same way every time it's still Magic A.

If it's explained that Abracadabra makes things vanish because it means "vanish" in the True Speech, which the Creator used to craft the universe, and that whenever someone wants to do magic they need to say the appropriate word in the True Speech, that would be Rule Magic.

Likewise, if you can't cast Baleful Polymorph at targets more than a a kilometre away, just because that's apparently how that spell works, that's "Magic A" Is "Magic A". If Baleful Polymorph doesn't work on things that are too far away because the world's metaphysics require that you be able to see someone's face clearly when placing a curse on them, it's Rule Magic.

chubbyboy Since: Jan, 2001
#8: Feb 5th 2011 at 8:32:41 AM

I think I understand now. "Magic A" Is "Magic A" is the author setting rules for himself. Rule Magic is the existence of an in-story explanation or justification for those rules. That's an extremely subtle distinction...

SilentReverence adopting kitteh from 3 tiles right 1 tile up Since: Jan, 2010
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#9: Feb 6th 2011 at 7:54:52 AM

"Magic A" Is "Magic A" is the author making rules more than for himself — he is essentially establishing Continuity, and in a certain way it is a trope about the work. Rule Magic is the rules existing for a reason in-universe — it is essentially a trope about the world. They are not so indistinct once you remember you can have the first one in a world where the second one is never explored (in-universe).

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shimaspawn from Here and Now Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: In your bunk
#10: Feb 6th 2011 at 8:51:22 AM

You can also have Rule Magic where while all the characters talk about magic having rules, the author himself is completely inconsistent for whatever reason and wind up averting "Magic A" Is "Magic A". This is more common in a Shared Universe though.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
SomeSortOfTroper Since: Jan, 2001
#11: Feb 6th 2011 at 6:46:46 PM

"Magic A" Is "Magic A" is more focused on consistency than any stated rules. In fact you can use apparent consistency, to deal with the fact that you never talk about the rules.

BigT grimAuxiliatrix Since: Jan, 2001
grimAuxiliatrix
#12: Feb 15th 2011 at 7:40:21 AM

"Magic A" Is "Magic A" doesn't even have to be what we would normally consider magic. Stuff like Time Travel mentioned above could be entirely Science Fiction, but the consistency matters.

In fact, "Magic A" Is "Magic A" is pretty much an Ominpresent Trope, as people only seem to notice when it is missing.

A laconic version might be: Unreality in fiction must be consistent, or it will break the audience's expectation of disbelief.

Read it carefully: Magic doesn't even show up in the first two paragraphs.

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Deboss I see the Awesomeness. from Awesomeville Texas Since: Aug, 2009
I see the Awesomeness.
#13: Feb 15th 2011 at 5:56:34 PM

"Magic A" Is "Magic A" is most definitely not an Omnipresent Trope. Real Life uses it which is why it seems that way, but if it was omnipresent we wouldn't have a trope like Like Reality, Unless Noted.

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nrjxll Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Not war
#15: Feb 16th 2011 at 4:23:51 PM

[up]Not according to a recent Trope Repair Shop thread that argues they're the same.

KJMackley Since: Jan, 2001
#16: Feb 16th 2011 at 4:43:17 PM

Minovsky Particle is really more of a subtrope, any fictional science tends to be a type of magic no matter how well defined it is. "Magic A" Is "Magic A" would say that you can make science do anything so long as it fits within the established boundaries of the canon. Such as the no mass-shifting rule in the Transformers film, it is not magic but advanced technology with vague but consistent groundrules. A Minovsky Particle science isn't vague.

shimaspawn from Here and Now Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: In your bunk
#17: Feb 16th 2011 at 4:43:51 PM

[up][up] Only the OP did. The rest of the posters disagreed.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
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