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Spider-Man General Discussion

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This thread's for the Spider-Man comics and spin-offs, whether they're decades old or brand new.

  • Apart from the main Marvel Universe titles, Ultimate Spider-Man, Spider-Man "What If?" stories, crossovers, guest appearances in other books, Alternate Universe tales and things like Marvel's manga adaptations are all on-topic here.
  • Spider-Man 'family' books are on-topic (as are their own crossovers, guest appearances etc.) - e.g. Spider-Man 2099, Miles Morales, Spider-Woman, Silk, Spider-Gwen, Venom, Carnage, Black Cat, Red Goblin and Spider-Verse.
  • Characters and comics that originated in Spider-Man but are no longer directly connected to the spider-franchise (e.g. Punisher, Silver Sable) are not on-topic, unless you're discussing historical connections and crossovers. If in doubt, check before you write a long post. If this isn't the right place, there's a more general Marvel Comics thread which covers them.

Technically, Marvel's Infinity Comics (and their predecessors, Infinite Comics) are webcomics, not comic books, but it's fine to talk about their Spider-Man stories here.

Discussions that are only about Spider-Man adaptations in other media (films, video games etc.) are off-topic, but discussing the differences between the adaptations and the original comics is fine - as long as spoilers for the adaptations are tagged.

Please follow the spoiler policy rules - tag spoilers for the latest issues, for any previews or content leaks, and for off-topic comics. When including spoiler tags, try to write so that tropers can make an informed decision before viewing them (e.g. which series and issue will they spoil?).

     Original Thread OP 
Since everyone likes talking about him. I know little about him(Ironically,I got nearly all I know about him from a Batman thread),but he's apparently important so I made this thread. Enjoy.

Edited by MacronNotes on Jul 10th 2023 at 10:58:13 AM

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#24826: Aug 9th 2022 at 7:58:11 PM

Really this whole thing with Spider-Man is the principle of the thing

They don't want him married fine, but all this shit about saying he always needs to be young and fucking Mephisto is just insulting

As others said the Mephisto deal is an albatross hanging over the franchise's neck. It always there preventing you from fully enjoying things.

Edited by slimcoder on Aug 9th 2022 at 7:58:59 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#24827: Aug 9th 2022 at 8:07:58 PM

In a sense, it kinda makes pairing MJ with Peter after Gwen died pointless.

Since they'd be so obsessed with keeping Peter young, that letting them get married became a source of contention for them.

Edit: I do wish they'd just let the two of them be a couple again.

Like everyone has said, they have Miles to fill in the young Spider-Man niche.

Like, it's the reason all these shows about Peter being a teenager again are useless. Why do we need Teenage Peter when we have Miles.

Am I sad that we'll never get The Spectacular Spider-Man again at least partly because of that (though there are a hundred of other reasons)? Yes, but Miles is great, so it makes sense to use him, and let Peter and MJ be together.

Edited by HandsomeRob on Aug 9th 2022 at 8:10:13 AM

One Strip! One Strip!
RedM Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: You can be my wingman any time
#24828: Aug 9th 2022 at 8:08:04 PM

[up] [up]He needs to be doing WHAT to Mephisto?

Edited by RedM on Aug 9th 2022 at 8:08:17 AM

The very best, like no one ever was. Check out my Spider-Man fanfic here! [1]
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#24829: Aug 9th 2022 at 8:10:08 PM

[up] Pfffft I just now realized what I wrote

I mean Mephisto's overall inclusion here with the marriage deal

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#24830: Aug 9th 2022 at 8:10:57 PM

[up]

I see it too now.

We keep it for posterity. All must know. All must remember.

One Strip! One Strip!
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#24831: Aug 9th 2022 at 8:37:25 PM

I mean, he allowed his characters to grow old Peter Parker and the X-Men went from teenagers to adults), had numerous characters go through with marriages, etc, etc.

Stan was all about changing things from where I stand.

Stan was all about whatever was good for business.

It was, of course, purely his decision to make Peter grow up against all the naysayers, because Peter's college years are some of his most iconic.

It is also Stan's decision that Peter - or other heroes - should not meaningfully progress, leading to the illusion of change, which has allowed them to continue the stories for many decades.

RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#24832: Aug 9th 2022 at 10:07:56 PM

The decision to have Peter age in more-or-less real time for their first few years of publication) was likely made when they had no idea how long these comics were gonna go on for. I once saw someone post a letters column from back in the 70's, and even then you had editors (it may have been Stan) reflect that letting Peter graduate high school may have been a mistake.

Nofix from Over there Since: Jan, 2015
#24833: Aug 9th 2022 at 10:33:14 PM

Marvel has had plenty of chances to have their "young, hip, and datable" Spider-Man, from Ben Reilly to Miles, alongside the happily married Peter, and they've taken basically none of them. We just kind of have to accept the fact that the company is run by idiots and that nothing will ever improve.

This is why I've read manga for most of my life. At least there it's only most things that will never improve.

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#24834: Aug 9th 2022 at 11:36:12 PM

[up][up] Stan Lee has absolutely said that they didn't expect the comics to last so long (they thought it was another fad) and that's why they were allowed to age things in real time.

God, I'm so glad Peter was able to grow out of high school early enough that nobody has regressed him back to there.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#24835: Aug 9th 2022 at 11:39:36 PM

There's a reason why people joke that Kamala and Miles are never leaving high-school.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Zarius Since: Nov, 2012
#24836: Aug 9th 2022 at 11:51:37 PM

So here's my wild crazy, could-be-so-off base theory about the goings-on in ASM

I get the feeling the kids are going to stick around much longer than Paul will.

This could be what Cebulski meant by approaching Peter's relatability more 'delicately' at C 2 E 2, and why they pitched a series to De Matteis that explores what he and MJ cope with expecting a child

I think Marvel want MJ and Peter to be parents to Paul's kids, but they don't want to commit Peter and MJ to each other just yet. MJ will look after the kids with Peter and presumably Felicia's help, but will retain her independence of Peter for a while longer, ultimately falling in love with him again. Then, just when it looks like we'll get the two raising a family together, either Paul comes back or the true mother of Paul's kids resurfaces to take the kids back, and Peter and MJ are left on their own again but have gained considerable experience parenting kids, so they 'grow' and progress without Marvel having had them marry or have kids of their own again...and then it's left to the next writer if Peter and MJ stay together or not

Nofix from Over there Since: Jan, 2015
#24837: Aug 10th 2022 at 2:10:16 AM

I've never actually read The Other storyline, so I have a quick question: Does Peter's powers (and by extension, other Spider-people's) come from their connection to the Spider-Totem, or does their connection to the Spider-Totem come from their Spider-powers?

Because the first seems like a lame Chosen One retcon, while the latter is at least a serviceable retcon, in my eyes, to tie together so many different Spider-Men and Spider-Women.

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#24838: Aug 10th 2022 at 2:17:38 AM

@Slimcoder.

Yeah you cursing us with the mental image of Mephisto fucking Spider-Man is a thread milestone.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#24839: Aug 10th 2022 at 2:56:19 AM

[up][up] Pretty sure it's the second - the spider could have bit anyone.

Ezekiel speculates that the radiation may not have been what gave the spider the ability to pass those powers on, but that's while he's trying to introduce Peter to the totem idea and the ramifications of it.

Zarius Since: Nov, 2012
#24840: Aug 10th 2022 at 5:58:54 AM

I've seen some people theorize that the fantasy Paul has about beating Peter could actually be a flashback

windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#24841: Aug 10th 2022 at 6:48:56 AM

Court-ordered ankle monitors bring in hundreds of millions of dollars in the U.S. every year. Law enforcement uses the devices to monitor more than a hundred thousand people every day, a number that’s expanding rapidly. They play a key role in American criminal justice. For such a crucial technology, though, they began in an unlikely place: a lowly Spider-Man newspaper comic from the 1970s.

The Amazing Spider-Man comic by Stan Lee and John Romia ran in newspapers across the country throughout the late 1970s. One storyline that lasted from August of 1977 into September featured the evil Kingpin, who attaches a tracking device to Spider-Man. You can blame Spider-Man for planting the seed in a judge’s mind.

Judge Jack Love from Bernalillo County, New Mexico saw the series and would later credit Spider-Man with inspiring him to approach an engineer about producing a tracking device for low-level criminals. He became one of the first judges to use the authority of the bench to mandate offenders wear location-monitoring devices. The Colorado engineer he partnered with, Michael Goss, liked to call the ankle monitor “electronic handcuffs.” He would later refer to his device—official name Goss-Link—as a “goldmine,” though his own company would go belly-up.

https://gizmodo.com/spider-man-s-prisoner-ankle-monitor-1977-crime-stan-lee-1849346834

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#24842: Aug 10th 2022 at 6:49:04 AM

So I just started reading AMS from the start of JMS' run, and there is a moment that claims that Peter is sort of a "chosen one" - the spider didn't bite him by coincidence, but because he had the best quality to be a 'hunter': rage.

So yeah, there's that, I suppose.

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#24843: Aug 10th 2022 at 7:10:30 AM

Yeah the Spider-Totem along with Mephisto is one of the worst additions to Spidey lore.

There is a reason why the Spider-Verse movie went with the better message of anyone can be Spider-Man as well as taking out the Morluns and Spider-Totem aspects of the story with the Kingpin.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#24844: Aug 10th 2022 at 7:30:04 AM

Mm, I disagree. I actually really like the Spider totem stuff, it let them tell some fresh stories with Peter and added a new spin on things.

Peter doesn't end up agreeing with all the destiny stuff, anyhow - he literally beats Morlun the first time by jacking himself up with radiation, while defying the idea that he's a "pure" totem that Ezekiel and Morlun think he is.

It's not without its flaws, but I think being able to add something new to his mythos after 40 years of serialization is pretty good for him.

And it's helped introduce others characters and plot elements from there.

Sure, ITSV doesn't go with totem stuff, but that's probably more a combo of being focused on Miles (who hasn't had much to do with that stuff) and that the story doesn't work as well as a first instalment.

The mephisto stuff does suck tho

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#24845: Aug 10th 2022 at 7:46:37 AM

Fair, we'll just have to agree to disagree on the Spider-Totem.

And agree Mephisto is a shit addition. [lol]

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
Zarius Since: Nov, 2012
#24846: Aug 10th 2022 at 8:28:17 AM

Further examination of ASM#7

More diffusion of the current status quo...MJ is appreciative of Peter's apology and is about to tell him the truth of how she feels when there's a convenient interruption from Paul. Mary Jane also gives Peter a warm smile as she glances back at him when she and Paul depart, almost like she's relieved

Edited by Zarius on Aug 10th 2022 at 8:28:24 AM

Nofix from Over there Since: Jan, 2015
#24847: Aug 10th 2022 at 8:30:35 AM

[up][up] When Steve Ditko shits on your idea decades in advance, maybe just don't do it.

Edited by Nofix on Aug 10th 2022 at 8:30:59 AM

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
Nofix from Over there Since: Jan, 2015
#24849: Aug 11th 2022 at 4:02:57 AM

[up]"Stan’s synopsis for the Green Goblin had a movie crew, on location, finding an Egyptian-like sarcophagus. Inside was an ancient, mythological demon, the Green Goblin. He naturally came to life. On my own, I changed Stan’s mythological demon into a human villain…I rejected Stan’s idea…A mythological demon made the whole Peter Parker/Spider-Man world a place where nothing is metaphysically impossible."

Spider-Man is usually better off when they stick to the "science run amok" theming, or just regular people misusing science for their own ends. Even the Clone Saga knew that much. Bringing in demons to ham-fistedly enforce such a major change was always going to feel out of place, even if OMD was well-written and hailed as a modern classic.

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#24850: Aug 11th 2022 at 5:03:56 AM

Ah right, the original green goblin idea... I think Ditko's idea was a little too narrow to truly hold up - Spider-man doesn't exist in his own world, he exists in one where magic, demons and gods are real and interacting with them is pretty much inevitable as a superhero.

Like, of all the issues with OMD and Peter making a deal with the fucking devil, the supernatural element is probably the least concern.

Edited by Saiga on Aug 11th 2022 at 5:05:17 AM


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