TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Spider-Man General Discussion

Go To

This thread's for the Spider-Man comics and spin-offs, whether they're decades old or brand new.

  • Apart from the main Marvel Universe titles, Ultimate Spider-Man, Spider-Man "What If?" stories, crossovers, guest appearances in other books, Alternate Universe tales and things like Marvel's manga adaptations are all on-topic here.
  • Spider-Man 'family' books are on-topic (as are their own crossovers, guest appearances etc.) - e.g. Spider-Man 2099, Miles Morales, Spider-Woman, Silk, Spider-Gwen, Venom, Carnage, Black Cat, Red Goblin and Spider-Verse.
  • Characters and comics that originated in Spider-Man but are no longer directly connected to the spider-franchise (e.g. Punisher, Silver Sable) are not on-topic, unless you're discussing historical connections and crossovers. If in doubt, check before you write a long post. If this isn't the right place, there's a more general Marvel Comics thread which covers them.

Technically, Marvel's Infinity Comics (and their predecessors, Infinite Comics) are webcomics, not comic books, but it's fine to talk about their Spider-Man stories here.

Discussions that are only about Spider-Man adaptations in other media (films, video games etc.) are off-topic, but discussing the differences between the adaptations and the original comics is fine - as long as spoilers for the adaptations are tagged.

Please follow the spoiler policy rules - tag spoilers for the latest issues, for any previews or content leaks, and for off-topic comics. When including spoiler tags, try to write so that tropers can make an informed decision before viewing them (e.g. which series and issue will they spoil?).

     Original Thread OP 
Since everyone likes talking about him. I know little about him(Ironically,I got nearly all I know about him from a Batman thread),but he's apparently important so I made this thread. Enjoy.

Edited by MacronNotes on Jul 10th 2023 at 10:58:13 AM

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#31551: Nov 1st 2023 at 12:52:14 AM

Wait didn't we already have a Spider-Boy comic?

windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#31552: Nov 1st 2023 at 2:43:44 AM

Has any version of Aunt May ever died of old age? It seems the only things that kill her are supervillain plots.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#31553: Nov 1st 2023 at 2:46:24 AM

[up] Uhhhhh Into the Spider-Verse?

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
lalalei2001 Since: Oct, 2009
#31554: Nov 1st 2023 at 2:47:46 AM

[up][up] Amazing Spider-Man #400 was an example before it got retconned.

The Protomen enhanced my life.
Mrph1 he/him from Mercia (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: This is not my beautiful wife!
he/him
#31555: Nov 1st 2023 at 2:52:23 AM

The Life Story May gets old, gets dementia and dies offstage.

And apparently the MC2 continuity takes May's death in Spider-Man #400 as real.

Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 1st 2023 at 9:52:34 AM

Antiyonder (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#31556: Nov 1st 2023 at 4:54:19 AM

[up]Yep. Letter column in #47 confirmed such.

immortaleditor Since: Aug, 2023
#31557: Nov 1st 2023 at 7:12:47 AM

The obsession with keeping Aunt May around really is the prime symbol of the arrested development that Spider-Editorial is in. May has literally never been an especially popular or significant character, the few times she has still have her as totally superfluous to the plot after a point, and her sendoff in 400 was not only one of the best moments in the series’ history but also finally dumped an artifact of the series early days who no longer contributed anything.

Elseworlds and adaptations love killing her or putting her on a bus because unless you totally rework the character to be more interesting at the expense of being nigh-unrecognizable (e.g., Ultimate Aunt May and MCU Aunt May, who’re are both awesome), she’s basically just an annoying load who only exists to coddle Peter like he’s still a child and be a burden on him due to being perpetually at death’s door. The fact that Spider-Editorial desperately fights to keep such a character around and insist it’s “relatable” says a lot of creepy things.

Anyways, I’m with Charles Phipps on this. Aunt May died in 400 and never came back. The Aunt May from Gathering of the Five onwards is the genetic actress.

alekos23 Since: Mar, 2013
#31558: Nov 1st 2023 at 7:15:22 AM

I do find it a little amusing that Alfred and the Kents get relatively little pushback compared to May, maybe cause the writers aren't as stuck at home with them?

Blueace Surrounded by weirdoes from The End Of the World Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Surrounded by weirdoes
#31559: Nov 1st 2023 at 7:17:17 AM

At the very least, Clark is allowed to be an adult, really.

Wake me up at your own risk.
Joshbones Since: May, 2015
#31560: Nov 1st 2023 at 7:18:22 AM

Thing about May is she floats in and out of relevancy. The last time she was a major plot contributor was the BND Era. Affer Jameson's dad died, nobody really knew what to do with her.

Tom Taylor gave her cancer and then nobody ever mentioned it since, and she shows up like three to four times a run to remind us she's still around.

[up][up]The Kent's were also dead, brought back to life in the modern age, and writers who want to like Mark Waid aren't allowed to kill them, it's just that DC's way of doing continuity makes caring about details like that less important than Marvel's.

Edited by Joshbones on Nov 1st 2023 at 7:19:41 AM

immortaleditor Since: Aug, 2023
#31561: Nov 1st 2023 at 7:28:34 AM

Alfred and the Kents dodge basically all the problems that Aunt May has as others have noted. Mostly because they’re actually fun to read and contribute something more than waver between cutesy grandmotherly cooing, being deathly sick, and being The Load. Alfred contributed an incredibly good role to the Batfamily, the Kents help give Superman his moral core with their raising of him (like an Uncle Ben who wasn’t dead), and neither of them gets in the way of their child’s development and growth; Clark has wife and kid and everything while Bruce has an entire family. And Alfred has been allowed to die rather than linger obnoxiously forever, and they seem to really be committing to it instead of pretending Bruce still needs his childhood parental figure to babysit him when he’s a grown healthy man with a family of his own.

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#31562: Nov 1st 2023 at 7:40:26 AM

Plus there's the fact that Aunt May living is the price of Spider-Man losing his wife and daughter.

So her being around is a living reminder of that.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
immortaleditor Since: Aug, 2023
#31563: Nov 1st 2023 at 7:49:33 AM

Yep. She’s become a walking reminder of everything bad about the current comics and of everything we’ve lost since OMD. Predictably, that leads to people hating her guts and either reworking her in adaptations and other continuities to be less annoying or just killing her to be rid of her.

Eriorguez Since: Jun, 2009
#31564: Nov 1st 2023 at 8:07:44 AM

That's why I really like the Insomniac take: Spider-Man has been heroing for 8 years, and is now in his 20's, trying to find his footing. Ben was the older brother of Peter's dad, and died at age 58 when Peter was 15. And May is 65 when Peter is 23.

They are at an age where they are elder relatives in a realistic way, and where death still strikes at being a bit too soon.

Ancient-looking aunt May and Peter selling his future to keep her alive is... just bad writing.

Mrph1 he/him from Mercia (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: This is not my beautiful wife!
he/him
#31565: Nov 1st 2023 at 8:14:15 AM

I'm hoping there's an alternate universe where he solved the OMD problem by stealing the ruby of Cyttorak or pleading with Galactus.

And there's now an ever-youthful, immensely powerful May - as the Juggernaut or a cosmically charged ex-herald - and Peter's stressing over who she's dating and wondering how her career as an Avenger/Defender/Ultimate overshadowed his.

(And everyone now treats him as a teenage sidekick because, although they may not know his secret identity, his aunt is clearly one of Earth's mightiest heroes)

Bonus points if May ends up dating Thor, Hercules or Loki.

I may be overthinking this. And a little too cruel to Peter.

Joshbones Since: May, 2015
#31566: Nov 1st 2023 at 8:21:20 AM

I think comics May and Ben were actually younger than what their decrepit appearances made you believe.

It's mostly just down to a different art team in the modern ages not doing that as much. Vulture also doesn't look as old as he used to.

immortaleditor Since: Aug, 2023
#31567: Nov 1st 2023 at 9:01:27 AM

May and Ben are always supposed to be older than Richard and Mary were, but beyond that, they’ve never really been solid on how old the two should be in relation to Peter. They want to have May as this Cryptkeeper-looking motherfucker who looks like she’s in her eighties at youngest and is super frail and fragile, looking and acting like she’s Peter’s Grandma not his aunt. But Uncle Ben usually looks like he was only just barely on the other side of middle age when he died, mid-sixties at most. There could be an age gap in Ben and May’s relationship that would make this work, with May being ten to twenty years older than him, but the story usually indicates otherwise and claims they were around the same age.

It’s yet another case where adaptations and elseworlds improve upon it significantly. OG Ultimate Spider-Man made May and Ben look plausibly like Peter’s uncle and aunt not his grandparents who’re only just getting past middle age when the story begins and Peter nears adulthood, as did stuff like Spider-Verse or the MCU, and Life Story in particular did it well with May starting out looking healthy and not especially old, only to get her classic Cryptkeeper look as the timeline progresses and she actually gets to the age where she’d realistically start to look like that and suffer those kinds of health problems.

Joshbones Since: May, 2015
#31568: Nov 1st 2023 at 9:08:05 AM

[up]May was explicitly called sixty in the early issues of the comic, so her looking incredibly old was supposed to be an artistic choice.

They never tell us Ben's age, but other material has given me the impression that they're around the same age.

So Raimi casting 70 year old Rosemary Harris and Cliff Robertson to play May and Ben was definitely highballing it, but the vibes were right.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#31569: Nov 1st 2023 at 9:50:38 AM

Comparing May and Alfred I also. Like May to Peter, Alfred is also a character Bruce is highly dependent on, but while May has a reputation for being a tool for writers to keep Peter from growing as a person, Alfred tends to be a character built around forcing Bruce to grow and remember his humanity. Batman does have a similar issue with Aesop Amnesia and Character Resets, but it’s not centered around Alfred specifically.

Not that May hasn’t been used that way, but those portrayals never seem to stick. Which actually leads to another really important thing, I think:

Alfred’s part of the team. He’s not just a parental figure who knows about the hero’s secret, he’s an active participant and vital part of the hero’s fight and team, with a clear cut role in the superheroing. Whereas even in stories where May knows, she’s often kept out of that part of Peter’s emphasizing how she can feel like a prop.

That said, ironically it feels like the works that do nail how to write May as an active part of Peter’s life or superhero side, and/or are already doing a good job writing him as an adult such that heMs not using May as a crutch anyway, that are the most prone to killing her off or writing her out of the story. Either that or they again just don’t last.

That is to say, she keeps dying in continuities that probably would’ve been better served keeping her alive.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Nov 1st 2023 at 10:02:05 AM

Mrph1 he/him from Mercia (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: This is not my beautiful wife!
he/him
#31570: Nov 1st 2023 at 10:08:50 AM

As soon as May's part of Peter's life as Spider-Man, she becomes a valid target for Mentor Occupational Hazard.

Sorry. Them's the rules.

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#31571: Nov 1st 2023 at 10:10:39 AM

Aunt May being a character in stagnation is pretty fitting considering Editorial only keeps her alive to ensure OMD had some benefit to Peter.

Even though it would be pretty on brand for Mephisto to have her killed off just to torture Peter more.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
TrashJack Confirmed Doomer from beyond the Despair Event Horizon (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Confirmed Doomer
#31572: Nov 1st 2023 at 10:19:50 AM

[up][up] Damn that Parker Luck!

"Cynic, n. — A blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are, not as they ought to be." - The Devil's Dictionary
immortaleditor Since: Aug, 2023
#31573: Nov 1st 2023 at 10:24:18 AM

[up][up][up][up]That’s a really good way of putting it.

Alfred has always been a big part of pushing Bruce to grow beyond his trauma and start actually living his life, whether as Batman or as Bruce Wayne. He’s not afraid to call Bruce out when he’s being an ass and often plays peacekeeper when there’s family drama afoot. He encourages Bruce to form connections with other people and pushes him to be a better father, friend, and partner to his children, teammates, and love interests. Alfred, to put it simply, actually acts like a proper parental figure to Bruce, trying to help him grow up and have a good life.

Aunt May in 616 has never really had that to her, and in later years has turned into an anchor used to actively drag Peter backwards in terms of maturity and character development. She rarely ever seems to advise Peter on how to be a better person or deal with his emotions or handle his responsibilities as both Parker and Spider, and when she does it often is Played for Laughs (e.g., MJ’s earliest appearances being “the daughter of Aunt May’s friend that she clumsily tried to hook Peter up with” with the punchline being that MJ was actually hot and likable instead of someone Peter would hate). She’s never the one to call Peter out when he’s being an asshole. She never gets on his ass to improve or genuinely helps him to do so. And she contributes nothing to the wider Spider-Family other than being a burden they all have to fret over.

She’s supposed to be Peter’s maternal figure, but they’ve never really felt close as they should, not like how Peter and Uncle Ben always really feel connected even after Ben dies. The few times she does really seem like what she’s supposed to be — Peter’s motherly aunt who did her best to teach him how to be a good person who can fend for himself in a harsh world — come off as exceptions to the rule.

Again, adaptations and A Us often do May way better by making her and Peter feel genuinely close and making her really feel like an indispensable part of Peter’s life who played as much role in helping become Spider-Man as Ben did. Compare the heartwrenching “you take this money” scene in Spider-Man 2 or any of Ultimate Peter and May’s interactions or MCU May taking Peter out for dinner or Spectacular and Webb May stressing out over Peter’s constant lateness and clearly worrying that they’re failing as mothers or the second Insomniac game’s flashback where May teaches Peter better ways to channel his anger or anything like that with 616 where most of Peter and May’s interactions with depressingly few exceptions consists of May bitching and moaning while Peter busts his ass to babysit her.

Edited by immortaleditor on Nov 1st 2023 at 10:24:56 AM

knightstorm Since: Feb, 2022
#31574: Nov 1st 2023 at 10:33:07 AM

The only one to actually make 616 May useful as a character was JMS. And like literally everything else...OMD ruined that. She lost her memory that Peter was Spider-Man...and went right back to being a dull burden that she classically was. I'd actually argue rather than being the one "good" thing to come out of OMD for Peter...that May's continued presence is the monkey's paw. Not only is he cursed to be a pathetic loser for all time...he's flushed away everything good in his life for an undead burden for all eternity. Somewhere Mephisto is cackling with evil glee...

Edited by knightstorm on Nov 1st 2023 at 10:38:39 AM

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#31575: Nov 1st 2023 at 10:40:05 AM

Okay sorry for the change in topic, but are their symbiotes that completely control their hosts?

I'm not super familiar with all the latest symbiote lore, I know Planet Of the Symbiotes established that the Symbiotes do take over their hosts as standard procedure and Venom was a deviant.

But I think that got removed with all the lore about Klyntar.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"

Total posts: 38,961
Top