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Spider-Man General Discussion

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This thread's for the Spider-Man comics and spin-offs, whether they're decades old or brand new.

  • Apart from the main Marvel Universe titles, Ultimate Spider-Man, Spider-Man "What If?" stories, crossovers, guest appearances in other books, Alternate Universe tales and things like Marvel's manga adaptations are all on-topic here.
  • Spider-Man 'family' books are on-topic (as are their own crossovers, guest appearances etc.) - e.g. Spider-Man 2099, Miles Morales, Spider-Woman, Silk, Spider-Gwen, Venom, Carnage, Black Cat, Red Goblin and Spider-Verse.
  • Characters and comics that originated in Spider-Man but are no longer directly connected to the spider-franchise (e.g. Punisher, Silver Sable) are not on-topic, unless you're discussing historical connections and crossovers. If in doubt, check before you write a long post. If this isn't the right place, there's a more general Marvel Comics thread which covers them.

Technically, Marvel's Infinity Comics (and their predecessors, Infinite Comics) are webcomics, not comic books, but it's fine to talk about their Spider-Man stories here.

Discussions that are only about Spider-Man adaptations in other media (films, video games etc.) are off-topic, but discussing the differences between the adaptations and the original comics is fine - as long as spoilers for the adaptations are tagged.

Please follow the spoiler policy rules - tag spoilers for the latest issues, for any previews or content leaks, and for off-topic comics. When including spoiler tags, try to write so that tropers can make an informed decision before viewing them (e.g. which series and issue will they spoil?).

     Original Thread OP 
Since everyone likes talking about him. I know little about him(Ironically,I got nearly all I know about him from a Batman thread),but he's apparently important so I made this thread. Enjoy.

Edited by MacronNotes on Jul 10th 2023 at 10:58:13 AM

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#29176: Jul 26th 2023 at 8:38:31 PM

Peter’s fellow youth were jerks but they did invite him to hang out in good faith a number of times and he was very specifically the kind of guy who was like “while you were busy with frivolous time wasting, I studied the atom” and “one day I’ll show them all”

He didn’t deserve to be bullied and nobody deserves to be bullied. But Peter has a habit of antagonizing.

Edited by Bocaj on Jul 26th 2023 at 11:39:33 AM

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Joshbones Since: May, 2015
#29177: Jul 26th 2023 at 8:39:45 PM

I don't think Peter and Flash had that sort of dynamic at all in the comics.

It's not even really a thing in any of the cartoons pre-spectacular. It comes from the Raimi movies, which are aping older movies, not the comics.

The only time Peter and Flash come into blows in those early issues is in the Living Brain issue, where the teachers force them into a school-sanctioned boxing match, for some reason.

Deadpoolrocks Since: Sep, 2010
#29178: Jul 26th 2023 at 8:39:45 PM

Yeah that was partially why flash said he qas so tough on 9eter he felt like Peter was looking down on them all.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#29179: Jul 26th 2023 at 8:41:27 PM

I think Untold Tales added some classic bullying from Flash

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
FKJ10 Since: Mar, 2012
#29180: Jul 26th 2023 at 8:53:30 PM

@lbssb Even then point still stands Ross isn't a big character that would cause alot of stir to recast unlike say T'Challa who they retired out of respect for Chadwick Boseman.

[up] Yeah and still it doesn't work as they fundamentally miss the point of Flash's character he's legit dumb poor and insecure about it. Falling on his physical strength and success in sports.

While Harry was insecure about his father's expectations and turned to drugs and partying. Similar to the MCU!Flash's party boy persona and need for attention because his parents...don't really like him.

Like if this character was just named Harry I'd fully expect the fourth movie to be about him and Peter meeting up in college and slowly becoming friends.

Plus yeah when Ditko originally wrote Peter he did have a spiteful streak to him. Which makes sense considering the objectivist no compromise kind of guy Ditko was.

Peter was a jerk and it's why Gwen antagonized him at first. Sure she was a stuck up rich girl but he was very callous at first.

Edited by FKJ10 on Jul 26th 2023 at 8:58:26 AM

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#29181: Jul 26th 2023 at 9:01:49 PM

I actually assume that he was Flash in the MCU movies and not Harry because Harry had huge focus in the previous five Spider movies

Until No Way Home, Holland Spider-Movies tried to focus on different stuff that hadn’t already been done

Before the third movie became “hey let’s do everything that’s already been done!!”

Edited by Bocaj on Jul 26th 2023 at 12:02:43 PM

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#29182: Jul 26th 2023 at 9:23:57 PM

Well at least we got working class Spider-Man if nothing else.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
lycropath Since: Mar, 2010 Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
#29183: Jul 26th 2023 at 9:50:39 PM

Harry also brings with him the expectations of Norman and Goblins.

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#29184: Jul 27th 2023 at 12:02:57 AM

Isn't there going to be a cartoon where it's Norman who hires Peter, not Tony?

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
FKJ10 Since: Mar, 2012
#29185: Jul 27th 2023 at 2:53:11 AM

Which is hitting my NOPE button hard.

Yeah I'll take Iron-Man Jr a million times a day over one Goblin Jr.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#29186: Jul 27th 2023 at 3:17:25 AM

I mean it's not Peter willingly working with his archenemy there.

It's high-school kid Peter looking for a job and deciding to work for a guy who isn't a total bleeding psycho yet.

That's assuming Norman will be involved in managing his life as Spider-Man which I don't think will be the case.

Edited by slimcoder on Jul 27th 2023 at 3:18:09 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#29187: Jul 27th 2023 at 6:37:39 AM

Norman is way-way overexposed. Ever since the Clone Saga, too many editors have tried to make Norman into Peter's Lex Luthor.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Joshbones Since: May, 2015
#29188: Jul 27th 2023 at 7:03:28 AM

I feel like the only time they tried to push Norman as a Luthor type was during the Dark Avengers days.

Otherwise, his hate for Spidey superceded even his normal goals. You don't see him talking about wanting to control all the gangs in New York anymore.

windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#29189: Jul 27th 2023 at 7:06:49 AM

This talk about MCU Flash having more in common with Harry reminds me that Harry has been Venom in two (possibly three) different incarnations of the Spider-Man story.

Which makes me realize that Spider-Man adaptations, perhaps more than any superhero media, are particularly guilty of treating supporting characters as interchangeable by swapping their traits. 90s series Felicia starts out as something of a Gwen Stacy clone, Spectacular Gwen wears glasses like Deb Whitman, Spectacular Silver Sable is Silvermane's daughter, Eddie has been reimagined as either a friend of Peter's who turns evil like Harry or a rival of his who is revealed as a villain like Ned and Lance.

TargetmasterJoe from Velocitron Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
#29190: Jul 27th 2023 at 10:06:05 AM

[up][up][up]

I mean, if Norman shouldn't be a Lex Luthor to Peter, then who should it be? (Or Peter shouldn't need a Lex Luthor?)

RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#29191: Jul 27th 2023 at 10:16:30 AM

[up][up] And the Raimi films put Mary Jane in the Liz Allen role.

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#29192: Jul 27th 2023 at 10:51:00 AM

I mean, if Norman shouldn't be a Lex Luthor to Peter, then who should it be? (Or Peter shouldn't need a Lex Luthor?)

I much prefer Doctor Octopus as Peter's archnemesis or the rest of the classics. Either Norman and Gwen should be dead or Norman dead and Gwen alive or Norman is alive while Gwen is.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#29193: Jul 27th 2023 at 10:53:46 AM

Growing up, it was usually Norman who takes center stage as THE Spider-Man villain, and he's already a perfect foil and evil counterpart to Spider-Man.

Granted, he's nowhere near as overexposed as Doc Ock and Joker are.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#29194: Jul 27th 2023 at 10:58:01 AM

> Granted, he's nowhere near as overexposed as Doc Ock and Joker are.

if you want overexposed try Venom

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Joshbones Since: May, 2015
#29195: Jul 27th 2023 at 10:58:47 AM

Norman took the arch-enemy spot by default because the other two contenders in Venom and Ock fell out of the running by turning good.

But post ends of the earth but pre-Superior, Ock has as much of a claim to it as Norman, they both get big stories.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#29196: Jul 27th 2023 at 10:59:32 AM

Has anybody replaced Venom as the third big Spider-Man enemy?

And why is it not Morlun, please.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#29197: Jul 27th 2023 at 10:59:49 AM

[up][up]I mean, according to the Spencer run, Peter considers Norman to be his arch enemy, and Doc Ock second fiddle.

And Norman IS a good guy RN, while Doc Ock is a bad guy.

[up] Clearly, it's Paul.

Edited by RedHunter543 on Jul 28th 2023 at 2:00:06 AM

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#29198: Jul 27th 2023 at 11:01:43 AM

Ock and Norman were basically neck and neck for being THE Arch-Enemy of Peter.

Ock handed him his first defeat and killed George Stacy, which was one of the biggest obstacles to Peter getting together with Gwen (since she hated Spiderman even before that), and then Norman learned Peter's identity, was the dad of his best friend.....and presented a much bigger obstacle to Peter and Gwen's relationship than Ock did.

Honestly, they probably share the role at this point.

Ock also has being the one who first started the Supervillain team-up in the form of the Sinister Six.

One Strip! One Strip!
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#29199: Jul 27th 2023 at 11:01:59 AM

Dammit, Paul.

That guy is the worst!

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#29200: Jul 27th 2023 at 11:04:03 AM

I thought that [up] came out of nowhere, but I didn't notice there was a post above mine.

Paul is gonna be in the same category as Carlie isn't he?

Only ever brought up by people who talk about how much they hate him and want him to die, even if he never shows up again.

One Strip! One Strip!

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