This thread's for the Spider-Man comics and spin-offs, whether they're decades old or brand new.
- Apart from the main Marvel Universe titles, Ultimate Spider-Man, Spider-Man "What If?" stories, crossovers, guest appearances in other books, Alternate Universe tales and things like Marvel's manga adaptations are all on-topic here.
- Spider-Man 'family' books are on-topic (as are their own crossovers, guest appearances etc.) - e.g. Spider-Man 2099, Miles Morales, Spider-Woman, Silk, Spider-Gwen, Venom, Carnage, Black Cat, Red Goblin and Spider-Verse.
- Characters and comics that originated in Spider-Man but are no longer directly connected to the spider-franchise (e.g. Punisher, Silver Sable) are not on-topic, unless you're discussing historical connections and crossovers. If in doubt, check before you write a long post. If this isn't the right place, there's a more general Marvel Comics thread
which covers them.
Technically, Marvel's Infinity Comics (and their predecessors, Infinite Comics) are webcomics, not comic books, but it's fine to talk about their Spider-Man stories here.
Discussions that are only about Spider-Man adaptations in other media (films, video games etc.) are off-topic, but discussing the differences between the adaptations and the original comics is fine - as long as spoilers for the adaptations are tagged.
Please follow the spoiler policy rules
- tag spoilers for the latest issues, for any previews or content leaks, and for off-topic comics. When including spoiler tags, try to write so that tropers can make an informed decision before viewing them (e.g. which series and issue will they spoil?).
Edited by MacronNotes on Jul 10th 2023 at 10:58:13 AM
Hmmm
Huh. Thats mostly what Gwen's relationship with Peter was (a massive source of drama due to her hatred of Spiderman for killing her dad, and Peter being unable to bring himself to tell her), only if Stan had stayed on, they'd have eventually gotten married.
Conway thinking MJ was the better partner was only one reason she died. Them not wanting Peter to settle down was the other. Well, there were a lot of reasons, as we've mentioned before.
Ultimately, the writers put themselves in a poor position because they let the Peter/MJ relationship happen, but perhaps didn't realize until it was far too late that they didn't want it to go as far as they did. Combine that with MJ being so popular with the fans that she's essentially bullet proof and unkillable, and all attempt to pair Peter with someone else (outside of Felicia, who's the closest thing to a viable second option) and we have the situation we have now.
They don't want Peter to get married to MJ, but already let it happen, and now won't bring it back, but also keep teasing maybe this time it'll happen because they know it's popular, even though they hate it themselves.
Like, you have to wonder how long they can keep this up.
One Strip! One Strip!The more people that get tired of being jerked around and quit reading, the more likely they’ll cut it out
But spider man tends to be one of Marvel’s best selling books so the majority of the audience doesn’t care one way or another or possibly there’s a bunch of people hate reading it
Forever liveblogging the AvengersI mean I don't want to quit reading Spider-Man, which I have read since I was six.
I just want it to stop sucking.
And I quit from One More Day to Spencer.
So it wasn't going to get better.
Edited by CharlesPhipps on Jul 15th 2023 at 5:26:18 AM
Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Sent you the PM containing a lengthier response, but since I think it's worth mentioning, yeah there are still good comics.
Just that Marvel and DC would need to see that readers will give attention to the stuff not made to draw controversy (Like the recent ASM #26) and that they aren't the only comic game in town.
Thumbnail in particular has images of the 90s cartoon MJ, Raimi MJ, and MCU MJ.
I saw the video too, and it's not even MCU MJ - it's Zendaya, in the movie The Challengers.
I have no idea what the plot of the movie is, but I do know that it features her having a threesome sex scene with two men, which has got a lot of people talking on twitter. Either memeing, or genuinely thinking this is a problem with her relationship with Holland, or a problem for the Spider-man films.
The fact that the video creator used specifically that image of Zendaya for a video about MJ being toxic just shows the kind of misogyny underlining it.
Reading a big bundle of 1987 newspaper comics now, the year of the marriage, and it's interesting to note the engagement and wedding was 'rushed' there too. In fact, the story that occurs before it sees MJ skip town again because she's still processing Peter outing himself to her as Spider-Man, and Peter tries to forget HER by going on another date with a blonde called Robin, who he helps with her car.
When MJ returns, she walks in at the wrong time as a grateful Robin is giving Peter a thankyou kiss that means nothing, she's so incensed she goes back home and rips up her photos of Peter declaring how much she hates him. She's tempted to skip town again, but decides against it. Peter breaks into her apartment and surprises her with a web-shaped loveheart, MJ calls him a nutcase, then calls herself a nutcase, kisses him, and the next day's strip we find she said 'yes' off-panel
True love folks.
The story features Betty Brant too, I think she vanished from the strip not long after this.
The remaining two arcs after the wedding for the year involve Peter recapping his origin so MJ better understands why he can't just give up the crime fighting, and another story where he goes back to being a professional wrestler while MJ seeks opportunities in LA as an actesss, which is an excuse for Ms. Fanservice moments of her wearing only a bikini. She also attracts a sleazy Weinstein-like public figure who is infatuated with her.
And in yet another parallel between the two, Felicia is a viable love interest for the same reason MJ is: Marvel let her and Peter last for too long and got way too many people invested in it. It doesn't help that a lot of fans grew up on the 90s Spider-Man show were Felicia's less pleasant qualities that could get in the way of her and Peter being endgame were largely removed.
There's a hilarious irony in how the Spider-Man office has created iconic romances by accident while the ones that they actually did want fans to get attached to were often met with more severe pushback.
Edited by windleopard on Jul 16th 2023 at 9:01:06 AM
So pretty much Gwen Stacy, Carli Cooper and Cindy Moon.
As much as I still find it amusing how horny Slott was with the Spider pheromone induced boning. Yeah Silk should have just been used as Peter's green partner/sidekick like in Spider-Man Fake Red.
Her miniseries are nice and really hope Cindy gets more popular because honestly she literally has all the qualities that should make her the definitive Spider-Woman.
Past connection with Peter Parker (retconned to be his classmate with Jessica Jones)
Same spider bite
Actually from 616 unlike Spider-Gwen
Like imagine instead of making Jessica Drew's convoluted backstory back in the 70s for trademark purposes they just made Cindy Moon.
In fairness I don't think complaints about modern entertainment (Specifically 2016-2023) equates to bigotry. But it doesn't look when the way people phrase it is to suggest that say crappy entertainment was barely a thing in the Pre-2016 years or that say oversensitivy and the like is just a modern problem.
Again, 90s Spider-Man animated series had to keep punches by Spidey to a minimum and deemed the word Sinister to be unsettling for kids even with surrounding shows having a lot more of those things.
Or just the no fisticuffs being a heavy aspect of 70s and 80s animation as best shown by Superfriends. And as demonstrated before, just look at Spider-Man and His Amazing Friends and the other Spider-Man cartoon from the early 80s to see how one being Saturday Morning meant making it lighter in tone.
Or things like a handful of Looney Tunes shorts being banned before the 2000s.
Heck I would think anyone more familiar with comics especially Fred Wertham's Seduction of the Innocent wouldn't fall into the trap of thinking that the 1900s was this utopia free of censorship.
And yeah, Marvel and DC again are good examples of how rage inducing crap were made before using Woke as a criticism was a thing.
Heck going with the film first infamous for such, Ghostbusters 2016, I don't care for. But hard to act like that's the worst thing when the Bayformers films were not that long ago at the time. A film series that minus the R or X rated stuff is basically a Porno Parody that was deemed appropriate as official Transformers films.
Ghostbusters 2016 for all it's faults was at least discontinued with Afterlife being made. Yet Bay got to make 5 Transformers films. So where was the quality concern there? Heck I think it is the perfect opposite to GB 2016 especially since it shows that lack of concern about sensitivity doesn't mean quality is coming.
And even if things ever calm down on the political front, that doesn't mean entertainment utopia is on the horizon.
Edited by Antiyonder on Jul 16th 2023 at 1:26:23 AM
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Hell they prolly should have just used Cindy in Spider-Verse 2 instead of Jess.
Its not like Jess doesn't do much or even get any focus in the film. And Cindy fits better because she is actually connected to the spider-lore unlike Jess.
Man Super Friends really was a garbage show.
Edited by slimcoder on Jul 16th 2023 at 1:32:00 AM
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."It was fun I'll grant you, but yeah it is especially more suspicious when people will use 70s and 80s animation as a whole to demonstrate how good those days were.
And well whether it's the last few years due to politics or just the 2000s for example. Yes, people back then thought that the decade giving us House of Mouse, Avatar the Last Airbender, Justice League, Justice League Unlimited, Static Shock, Kim Possible, The Spectacular Spider-Man or Batman The Brave and the Bold flat out sucked. Still miles better than the 70s.
Critiquing what sucks or what you think sucks, cool. But the problem is just that sometimes it seems like people who do this deliberately try to block out the current stuff that's good in contrast to blocking out past crap to focus on the classics.
Boy I remember the weird name change from "Sinister" to "Insidious" in the 90s series, it actually got worse than that, because in the final season they were referred to by Kingpin as the "Six Forgotten Warriors" (for at least one episode, then the name was applied to the golden age Marvel heroes)
Edited by Zarius on Jul 16th 2023 at 2:02:10 AM
Speaking of the "Insidius Six": I really love this scene from the 90's Cartoon, and the version from the original comics, mostly because of the whole idea behind it.
Is there a trope wherein the hero is sick, tries to fight the enemy or enemies, fails, gets unmasked, and everyone is like "lol, look at this dumbass trying to pretend to be the real hero"? Because that's what this is, and I like it.
Is it kind of hokey? Yes, but I still find it hilarious. Especially since everyone "knows" the hero's identity, but they don't actually believe it. Dramatic Irony at its finest.
Edited by Nofix on Jul 16th 2023 at 2:53:45 AM
That actually was adapted from the Lee-Ditko era where Doc Ock kidnapped Betty Brant to force Spider-Man to fight him, while Peter was sick from the flu.
So naturally, Doc Ock wins and unmasks Spider-Man in front of Jameson and the others but they all assume since Spider-Man lost so easily, it was just Peter trying to be brave.
It was the 12th issue IIRC.
Edited by RedHunter543 on Jul 16th 2023 at 5:50:57 PM
"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"There is a discussion to be had on what exactly separates Peter Parker and Spider-Man.
Like depending on who is writing, Parker isn't really all that different from Spider-Man personality wise, especially in the Romita-era.
"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"Yes, the big difference is confidence.
There's also the Make Your Own Villain element that the reason Spider-Man's villains are so incredibly hell bent on destroying him (Spider-Man has like 15 versions of his own Doctor Doom level hate) is because they're all mentally fragile man children who can't deal with being mocked.
Edited by CharlesPhipps on Jul 16th 2023 at 9:38:41 AM
Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.

The issue for Spider Editorial,is that they want Peter to be a young single loser period. It doesn't matter who the woman is specifically,Peter is never allowed to be happy in their eyes. He must always end up alone,broke,and a total failure in every aspect of his life. The resentment towards MJ is because her presence defies that.
Edited by knightstorm on Jul 15th 2023 at 4:55:36 AM