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20th Anniversary of the Nicktoon

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TacoWiz title from location Since: Jul, 2009
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#126: Aug 11th 2011 at 11:28:57 PM

The Simpsons influenced South Park and Family Guy.

Ren & Stimpy influenced Spongebob Squarepants and Rocko's Modern Life.

Adult animation and childrens' animation are different fields, and both The Simpsons and Ren & Stimpy had a major influence on their individual field.

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Buscemi I Am The Walrus from a log cabin Since: Jul, 2010
I Am The Walrus
#127: Aug 11th 2011 at 11:56:13 PM

Ren and Stimpy didn't inspire Spongebob. Stephen Hillenburg's work as an marine biologist did.

More Buscemi at http://forum.reelsociety.com/
TacoWiz title from location Since: Jul, 2009
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#128: Aug 12th 2011 at 2:06:13 AM

"This cartoon I'm making is inspired by one source and one source only."

Spongebob certainly has a lot of appeal to marine biologists. According to Word of God, Patrick's personality was inspired by how Stephen Hillenburg perceives sea stars.

Ren & Stimpy inspired the stock music scoring and the gross up close up paintings.

Spongebob might exist without Ren and Stimpy, but it'd sure be different. There are several noticable elements from R&S that were in Spongebob.

What's next? [insert work of fiction name here] was inspired by one thing and one thing only?

edited 12th Aug '11 2:07:52 AM by TacoWiz

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Buscemi I Am The Walrus from a log cabin Since: Jul, 2010
I Am The Walrus
#129: Aug 12th 2011 at 10:22:46 AM

Stop with your claims that Ren and Stimpy inspired everything. Because it didn't. The Simpsons gave animators more leeway on their shows and the Nicktoons were part of that. Klasky-Csupo was even one of the animation studios for The Simpsons.

Spongebob was inspired by two things: Hillenburg's work in marine biology and Rocko's Modern Life (which was created BEFORE Ren and Stimpy premiered). If Ren and Stimpy inspired anything, it was for directors and creators to care more about its crew members and their sanity.

More Buscemi at http://forum.reelsociety.com/
PDown It's easy, mmkay? Since: Jan, 2012
It's easy, mmkay?
#130: Aug 12th 2011 at 10:43:27 AM

Buscemi, I can't help but notice that it appears that you have a grudge against Taco Wiz for whatever reason. Could you please take it somewhere else?

At first I didn't realize I needed all this stuff...
Torquey Dreamworks Since: Oct, 2010
Dreamworks
#131: Aug 12th 2011 at 11:19:48 AM

So you guys really want something to commemorate Nicktoon's 20th anniversary?

Fine.

Toph, Danny Fenton, and Powdered Toast Man playing baseball on Wrigley Field.

edited 12th Aug '11 11:24:15 AM by Torquey

Wackd Since: May, 2009
#132: Aug 12th 2011 at 12:04:23 PM

Spongebob was inspired by two things: Hillenburg's work in marine biology and Rocko's Modern Life (which was created BEFORE Ren and Stimpy premiered).

Ren & Stimpy: began August 11, 1991
Rocko's Modern Life: began September 18, 1993

Oh, wait! I know what you're talking about! Travis, right? From the 1980s! Okay then.

Originally, the character appeared in an unpublished comic book titled Travis. Murray tried selling the comic book in the late 1980s, between illustrating jobs, and did not find success in getting it into production.
Yeah, that unpublished work by someone with no reputation sure did inspire a lot of people!

And yeah, Hillenburg worked for Murray on Rocko, and maybe Murray and the other writers there did inspire him, but the fact of the matter is that 1) without the original three there'd be no market for it and 2) Hillenburg working for Murray is proof that he already had a great sense of humor before Sponge Bob was even a possibility.

So yeah.

A side note: Rocko's one of my favorite shows, and if it wasn't for how badly Murray got burned on the DVD deal I'd have Season 1 on my shelf right now.

edited 12th Aug '11 12:06:58 PM by Wackd

Maybe you'd be less disappointed if you stopped expecting things to be Carmen Sandiego movies.
harkko Since: Apr, 2010
#133: Aug 12th 2011 at 1:18:58 PM

BTW, The New Adventures of Beany and Cecil (1988) by John K already had some elements later present in Ren and Stimpy, such Gross-Up Close-Up s.

Buscemi I Am The Walrus from a log cabin Since: Jul, 2010
I Am The Walrus
#134: Aug 12th 2011 at 2:34:15 PM

[up][up] Well, I mentioned the prototype stage of Rocko to show that Joe Murray did not ripoff Ren and Stimpy like Taco Wiz claimed. It's just like the Repo Men vs. Repo The Genetic Opera debate that fans of the latter love to have (though when you see the two movies, they are nothing alike).

As for Taco Wiz, I don't have a grudge with him/her. It's just the person's blatant hero worship of John K. getting in the way of the actual truth. Ren and Stimpy was not a major influence on every show in existence. In fact, many of the people in animation were working before Ren and Stimpy and were bound to get noticed with or without that show. As I've said before, it was The Simpsons that launched animation as we know it. That show made prime-time animation, animation for teens and adults and the concept of networks built around cartoons possible.

More Buscemi at http://forum.reelsociety.com/
Smasher from The 1830's, but without the racists (Don’t ask) Relationship Status: The best thing that ever happened to a bum like me
#135: Aug 12th 2011 at 7:46:44 PM

So, in a related to the original 3 question:

Disney's Doug, All Grown Up, or Adult Party Cartoon?

I'm going with Disney's Doug. APC...ew. AGU was So Okay, It's Average.

Buscemi I Am The Walrus from a log cabin Since: Jul, 2010
I Am The Walrus
#136: Aug 12th 2011 at 8:17:31 PM

Disney's Doug. It had its moments. And the movie wasn't too bad.

More Buscemi at http://forum.reelsociety.com/
Wackd Since: May, 2009
#137: Aug 12th 2011 at 8:24:42 PM

Disney's Doug. Disney might not have hired the best writing staff, but at least they didn't go out of their way to rearrange the show.

All Grown Up was a nice concept that unfortunately suffered from just being another generic teencom. It pretty much stripped Rugrats of everything that was fun about it, and while I get preteens having adventures in their imagination would be a bit odd I'd like it if someone besides Tommy and Dil retained a bit of imagination.

Adult Party Cartoon...the less said about it the better.

Maybe you'd be less disappointed if you stopped expecting things to be Carmen Sandiego movies.
Shota Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Dancing with myself
#138: Aug 12th 2011 at 8:29:33 PM

Okay why is the general opinion that Adult Party Cartoon was bad?! I was laughing my ass of the entire time!

edited 12th Aug '11 8:29:49 PM by Shota

Smasher from The 1830's, but without the racists (Don’t ask) Relationship Status: The best thing that ever happened to a bum like me
#139: Aug 12th 2011 at 8:33:44 PM

[up][up]They didn't rearrange the show? What about all of those changes like Roger getting rich, the Honker Burger closing down, the Beets breaking up, the new school (although that one is justified since Doug and co. had just finished Elementary), Mayor White become the principal, Mrs. Dink becoming the mayor of Bluffington, the birth of Cleopatra Dirtbike Funny, the addition of Guy Graham, and correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't Mr. Bluff a lot more evil in this show? (Though he was really evil in the movie.)

edited 12th Aug '11 8:34:00 PM by Smasher

Wackd Since: May, 2009
#140: Aug 12th 2011 at 8:39:15 PM

[up]But the basic premise and humor sensibility, by and large, stayed in tact. Rugrats got blander and R&S got raunchier but Doug largely stayed the same.

Then again, I haven't felt compelled to watch Disney's Doug since it was cancelled, which is what—eleven years ago?—and even then I only caught it occasionally. So I could be wrong.

Maybe you'd be less disappointed if you stopped expecting things to be Carmen Sandiego movies.
TacoWiz title from location Since: Jul, 2009
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#141: Aug 12th 2011 at 8:44:20 PM

[up][up][up]

Same here, dude. It's not EXACTLY the same as the original series, but it's pretty damn funny in its own right.

You get a gold star.

edited 12th Aug '11 8:44:50 PM by TacoWiz

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Shota Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Dancing with myself
#142: Aug 12th 2011 at 8:51:29 PM

[up] THANK you! A troper knows. Also, me, and my friend who showed Adult Party Cartoon to me!

Wackd Since: May, 2009
#143: Aug 12th 2011 at 8:54:58 PM

YMMV, of course, but I found Adult Party Cartoon to be nothing but high-octane nausea fuel with a few politically-incorrect jokes thrown in to remind you that this is, in fact, supposed to be a comedy. It tries more for shock value and less for comedy. I maintain to this day that Krasinski is at his best when someone's got a leash on him.

(Granted, it's entirely possible that he wasn't lying about the network forcing him to go edgier, but given what else I've seen of his independent work I highly doubt it.)

edited 12th Aug '11 8:55:44 PM by Wackd

Maybe you'd be less disappointed if you stopped expecting things to be Carmen Sandiego movies.
TacoWiz title from location Since: Jul, 2009
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#144: Aug 12th 2011 at 9:08:28 PM

[up]

The original Ren and Stimpy series had a lot of gross out humor too. I understand why somewhat wouldn't like R&S, as a lot of it is indeed lowbrow, but someone liking the original but not APC? That just confuses me.

And don't get me started on people who like the Games episodes.

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nomuru2d Gamer-turning-maker from Port Saint Lucie, FL Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Longing for Dulcinea
Gamer-turning-maker
#145: Aug 12th 2011 at 9:10:51 PM

Games?

Long live Cinematech. FC:0259-0435-4987
TacoWiz title from location Since: Jul, 2009
title
#146: Aug 12th 2011 at 9:18:56 PM

Seasons 3-5. No John Kricfalusi, no Vincent Waller, and no Jim Smith.

The only funny episodes were those from Chris Reccardi and Bob Camp, and even they couldn't save the show from ugly, rushed drawings and lack of focus.

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Buscemi I Am The Walrus from a log cabin Since: Jul, 2010
I Am The Walrus
#147: Aug 12th 2011 at 10:17:11 PM

Is animation really everything in a cartoon? Home on the Range had nice animation but an awful script. The few Cartoon Network Studios episodes of The Powerpuff Girls with Craig McCracken were not well-animated but had scripts caliber with the Hanna-Barbera run.

And of course, there's He-Man. Lots of limited animation but great scripts (a few were even written by J. Michael Straczynski).

edited 12th Aug '11 10:17:29 PM by Buscemi

More Buscemi at http://forum.reelsociety.com/
Wackd Since: May, 2009
#148: Aug 12th 2011 at 10:28:35 PM

[up]Yes, yes it is, because John K says so.

In all honesty, great writing can't always save a show if it looks like crap; and great art definitely can't save a show if the writing's no good. Writing should take priority, if only because animation is a storytelling medium.

Three words: Rocky. And. Bullwinkle. Worst animation ever. Seriously. This is the reason no self-respecting cartoon company exports to fucking Mexico anymore. Continuity errors out the wazoo and I'm pretty sure there are frames missing in some episodes. And yet it's still remembered today.

edited 12th Aug '11 10:31:47 PM by Wackd

Maybe you'd be less disappointed if you stopped expecting things to be Carmen Sandiego movies.
TacoWiz title from location Since: Jul, 2009
title
#149: Aug 13th 2011 at 12:41:11 AM

[up][up]

No. There are lots of cartoons that are amazing solely based on writing, like South Park, which is brilliant. But Ren and Stimpy isn't one of those shows. One of the hallmarks of the series was its beautiful art, and taking it away takes away a big part of the show.

Not EVERY cartoon needs to have good art.

Stop assuming I'm a mindless John K. fanboy. I have my own opinions. John K. thinks writing-based cartoons like SP are all garbage, while I can appreciate them for what they are.

Haven't you seen me on the Phineas And Ferb threads?

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