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Codafett Knows-Many-Things Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Waiting for you *wink*
Knows-Many-Things
#14251: Oct 28th 2020 at 6:55:07 PM

Call me when we get to see Xivu in person. Because "Seasonal Antagonist" usually means hearing NP Cs talk about them for 8 weeks.

Just Having Fun
VoidsEmpathy Emissary of the Void from Realm of In-Between Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: A heart full of love
Emissary of the Void
#14252: Oct 29th 2020 at 7:23:23 AM

Launch Trailer dropped 20 minutes ago, rather surprising considering that this sort of thing happens on the day itself.

The trailer itself is good, but I think that if we keep getting more videos prior to release, it'll feel like desperation to keep the hype going.

[DATA LOST]
EndlessSea LEGENDARY GALE from oh no you don't Since: Jul, 2012 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
LEGENDARY GALE
#14253: Oct 29th 2020 at 8:19:02 AM

We're, like, ten days from release. Why would Bungie not amp ump the marketing?

but HOW?
KJMackley Since: Jan, 2001
#14254: Oct 29th 2020 at 9:37:33 AM

Depends on the pacing. A video a day may be too much but another two videos, one for season and the other for the Raid, wouldn't be overkill. Or they might do brief character trailers like the one for Variks. It's not like we've been bombarded with ads for the last four months.

VoidsEmpathy Emissary of the Void from Realm of In-Between Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: A heart full of love
Emissary of the Void
#14255: Oct 29th 2020 at 11:38:04 AM

This month alone we've had:

  • The gear teaser
  • Gear trailer
  • Story trailer
  • Variks character trailer
  • The -Bungie- Vi Doc
  • Launch trailer

Granted, the first two were a few weeks ago, but I do feel like I'm agreeing with people that between the Vi Doc and this trailer, there's too much shown.

Edited by VoidsEmpathy on Oct 29th 2020 at 2:40:44 PM

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VoidsEmpathy Emissary of the Void from Realm of In-Between Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: A heart full of love
EndlessSea LEGENDARY GALE from oh no you don't Since: Jul, 2012 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
LEGENDARY GALE
#14257: Oct 29th 2020 at 3:53:00 PM

Also, glamour system confirmed to operate off Collections. If you've been hoarding gear for fashion, feel free to delete it all.

but HOW?
KJMackley Since: Jan, 2001
#14258: Oct 29th 2020 at 9:12:49 PM

I don't think that kind of content is unusual for any major release, Bungie or otherwise. Each season got at least 2-3 videos on their own, let alone the big expansion. We are mostly surprised at a launch trailer released a week and a half early, as those usually come out a day or two before. The vidoc confirming Osiris and Uldren/Crow are involved is about the extent of that reveal, it may be a little disappointing not to get that surprise in the game, but I'd guess it's because they have more surprises planned.

VoidsEmpathy Emissary of the Void from Realm of In-Between Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: A heart full of love
Emissary of the Void
#14259: Oct 29th 2020 at 10:20:44 PM

Imagine back when Forsaken’s marketing was focused on Cayde’s death and we had to avenge him.

Would it have been preferable if we were surprised had that not been the case? For instance, imagine that it focuses more on the breakout and subsequent need to capture/kill the barons, and during said breakout Cayde dies.

Wouldn’t that hit harder for the players as a surprising twist? To be fair, if newer players who have never seen any of the promotional content, that’d be understandable. I think that given what was shown, it sort of reduces the surprise that we’re working with the Crow.

Edit: I just reread the end of your post. My mistake, though I do agree with that sentiment. I can see them pushing the season trailer between now and sometime next week. The raid trailer I’m guessing will be the week prior to it’s launch day.

Edited by VoidsEmpathy on Oct 29th 2020 at 1:23:51 PM

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KJMackley Since: Jan, 2001
#14260: Oct 29th 2020 at 11:51:40 PM

I know some people are really sensitive to spoilers, but I think in the case of stories like Forsaken you really need that big trailer surprise in order to sell the content. You remove Cayde's death and it would just be an adventure in the Tangled Shore and Dreaming City, and any atmosphere you attempt to wring out of it may fall apart (as cool as some of the stuff in Beyond Light is, a lot of it feels interchangeable with other action footage). Instead we knew we were getting an intensely emotional story underlying the entire DLC.

I did realize something buried in the TWAB, all current gear in your inventory will be upgraded to a 1050 default, much like how Shadowkeep automatically upgraded everything to 750 (at least for PC, don't know how it was for X Box or Playstation). Assuming this becomes standard for each fall expansion, that means sunset gear won't fall behind quite as much as anticipated, and would be a little more viable for the first few weeks of the expansion.

Edited by KJMackley on Oct 29th 2020 at 11:53:13 AM

VoidsEmpathy Emissary of the Void from Realm of In-Between Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: A heart full of love
Emissary of the Void
#14261: Oct 30th 2020 at 1:05:22 AM

Yeah, that's the plan. The problem comes from the realization that by being forced to drop old gear, there's the need to keep grinding for newer things each time we hit newer seasonal content or at the start of a new expansion. I get that it's sort of the point with this kind of thing, but it's more "what's so good about the new gear that I can't use what I already have?".

This is where criticism of the execution comes in. Who knows, maybe sun setting will work as intended. But until we see more of or the entire patch notes for the expansion, we'll have to wait and see.

Re: story- I do see your point, though I think it just comes to a perspective issue on how we see spoilers affecting players.

Edited by VoidsEmpathy on Oct 30th 2020 at 4:10:06 AM

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KJMackley Since: Jan, 2001
#14262: Oct 31st 2020 at 11:05:23 PM

The whole issue surrounding sunsetting was Bungie being forced into a corner:

  • Make new gear exactly the same as current gear and players will ignore newer gear because they already got their god rolls with the current stat pool.
  • Make new gear with alternate perks than current gear and players will ignore newer gear because players primarily care about DPS improvements (damage or reload speed) and they are just more familiar with the previous stats.
  • Make new gear even better than current gear (Kill Clip 2.0, Rampage 2.0) and players will only advance further into Power Creep, forcing Bungie to artificially inflate difficulty levels to give players a good challenge (ie Grandmaster Nightfalls).
  • Make massive nerfs to existing gear so they won't be the universal go-to for every encounter. I think the biggest problem is less about players with their Spare Rations and more about the prevalence of Mountaintop and Recluse because their unique-to-them perks made them almost Exotic-tier legendary weapons.
  • Sunset older gear so they can never be top tier again, rendering it largely irrelevant in the level grind and forcing players to search for newer alternatives to bring with them to max level. The primary issue is almost ethical, as you are almost taking away content players had previously acquired through playtime and simply buying the game (in conjunction with the vaulting content issue).

I personally felt the better approach for sunsetting would be to cap them at 20-50 points lower than the current seasonal softcap, rather than the one-year softcap retirement they had previously announced. That gives more power of choice to the player, the perks of the weapon still exist but you are fighting with a handicap.

Imca (Veteran)
#14263: Nov 1st 2020 at 12:31:58 PM

They should have honestly just limited each gun to a single damage/reload boosting perk and rerolled the spares.

It wouldnt be the first time they took that course of action, they did it when shotpackage was too broken in d1.

The end result is it allows more perk verity and encourages diversity any way since you have to think beyond just lol more damage.

There were a couple things D1 did better, and gun diversity was one with its severely limited in both amount and scale of damage boosting perks, and the fact that red bars could be one shot headshot by even scout rifles, it encouraged way more weapon diversity.

Edited by Imca on Nov 1st 2020 at 12:34:48 PM

Codafett Knows-Many-Things Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Waiting for you *wink*
Knows-Many-Things
#14264: Nov 1st 2020 at 2:02:43 PM

My issue with sunsetting is that, by design, we're going to have to deal with a very limited wardrobe of new gear for months. The game is going to lose so much variety for the sake of meta. Crucible will probably suffer the most.

Just Having Fun
EndlessSea LEGENDARY GALE from oh no you don't Since: Jul, 2012 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
LEGENDARY GALE
#14265: Nov 1st 2020 at 4:56:45 PM

I think sunsetting is a bizarre idea because people who were actively chasing the power grind would've been grinding for new loot anyways, because those new activities are generally what gets you higher level gear in the first place. But then again, power level these days is basically an arbitrary "you must be this tall to ride" system anyways. What's one more level of needless busywork on top of all the rest?

brb crying in duke mk 44

but HOW?
KJMackley Since: Jan, 2001
#14266: Nov 1st 2020 at 5:16:11 PM

It's mostly an issue with hindsight. Forsaken introducing random rolls and mod slots gave players a lot more options, and it seems players were just way too overpowered for the content they wanted to make. As fun as it is, I'm still amazed Well of Radiance made it through playtesting (overshield, damage buff AND autoreload?). Shadowkeep was then rolling back a number of those changes into something more balanced and strategic (no autoreload, can't stack all buffs).

VoidsEmpathy Emissary of the Void from Realm of In-Between Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: A heart full of love
Emissary of the Void
#14267: Nov 5th 2020 at 10:21:10 AM

Today's ARG day! Myself and players with the Collector's Edition are sending information to Raid Secrets to unravel a puzzle to be solved that has to do with the missing pages from Colis Bray's journal.

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EndlessSea LEGENDARY GALE from oh no you don't Since: Jul, 2012 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
LEGENDARY GALE
#14268: Nov 5th 2020 at 4:19:42 PM

Ooh, I thought this was going to be a Reach deal where a handful of books would have the missing pages still in there. ARG? I'm checking that shit out.

but HOW?
VoidsEmpathy Emissary of the Void from Realm of In-Between Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: A heart full of love
Emissary of the Void
#14269: Nov 5th 2020 at 7:39:26 PM

It's been pretty interesting so far, but it has not been solved yet, to my knowledge.

[DATA LOST]
KJMackley Since: Jan, 2001
#14270: Nov 5th 2020 at 7:53:17 PM

I usually find ARG's to be cheap and a largely pointless advertising strategy, but the Destiny ARG's tend to be really interesting, making real mindbenders carefully tied in with the lore and requiring some genuine effort on the part of the community. I realize too that given all the time and money put into the game itself, this is probably 5-10 people hammering out a complex puzzle over a couple weeks.

VoidsEmpathy Emissary of the Void from Realm of In-Between Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: A heart full of love
Emissary of the Void
#14271: Nov 5th 2020 at 9:04:54 PM

Given that this is intended to be solved before the expansion drops, it's a lot more hectic than it looks imho. Right now I'm looking at about 30 people in the Raid Secrets discord server voice chat trying to figuring this out.

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VoidsEmpathy Emissary of the Void from Realm of In-Between Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: A heart full of love
Emissary of the Void
#14272: Nov 6th 2020 at 10:16:44 AM

A video clip has been found in the ARG. Bungie has released this on Twitter: https://twitter.com/DestinyTheGame/status/1324773632279797763

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KJMackley Since: Jan, 2001
#14273: Nov 6th 2020 at 1:51:37 PM

That's seems to confirm the rumors that Clovis Bray in the Deep Stone Crypt will be the raid boss.

EndlessSea LEGENDARY GALE from oh no you don't Since: Jul, 2012 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
LEGENDARY GALE
#14274: Nov 7th 2020 at 12:19:10 AM

I still find that theory dubious. I think the leak that first suggested it has already been debunked, for that matter.

but HOW?
KJMackley Since: Jan, 2001
#14275: Nov 7th 2020 at 4:10:53 PM

I don't follow that stuff too closely, but it made sense both in the way the lore has been built up and the way these big expansions will offer a campaign villain and the Raid will be a loosely connected side villain.


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