Falco was quite different from Fox in Melee. Hell, Luigi was quite different from Mario in 64, compared to those two.
It isn't "they share animations". THEIR ATTACKS DO THE EXACT SAME THING, bar some punctual exceptions and details.
You can't compare them to the Melee clones, because the Melee clones just recycled animations. Lucina and Dark Pit are glorified skins.
And there is plenty of people complaining about Fire Emblem and Kid Icarus getting far too many characters DUE TO THOSE TWO.
I like them as characters in their games, I really do, but they were poorly handled in Smash. Alph was handled in a great way, despite people wanting him to get a slot as a tweaked Olimar.
I get people thinking Dark Pit is too close to Pit to be worth being a separate character. But there's only 3 Kid Icarus characters, I don't see how that's too many.
I can see the argument for Fire Emblem, but personally I don't think there's really 'too many x franchise characters' as long as it's not a 3rd of the roster or something. Though the Mario cast is getting pretty big...
I'm in favor of lesser known Nintendo franchises getting greater rep in this series.
You guys complain about Fire Emblem having 5 characters and Kid Icarus having 3 (though this is the same amount of characters that Star Fox has throughout the Smash series), yet I don't see any complaints about Mario having 14 characters and Pokemon having six characters.
AAAAUUUUGGGHHHH!!!!Because Kid Icarus has had three games, one of which was an incredibly obscure Gameboy game that was never even released in Japan.
It doesn't help that Kid Icarus is Sakurai's latest project, so it feels like creator favoritism when taken along with how many items, Smash Run enemies, songs, and special features (Like the Temple conversations) the series got this installment.
Fire Emblem has five now, but it at least has 13 games to its name.
You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!And Mario is fucking Mario. People can name plenty of secondary Mario characters, but have no idea of who the main characters of some franchises are.
Pokemon is also fucking huge.
Seriously, if any series has some justification for having many characters, it is Mario, Pokemon and Zelda.
Kid Icarus having more reps than Metroid can be labelled as insulting. 3 reps is a quite good number for series such as Kirby or Star Fox, however. Fire Emblem would have fit there as well if Lucina didn't go beyond being a Marth costume, with 3 characters (plus a DLC one down the line).
Still, Mario and its subseries being the most represented ones, then Zelda and Pokemon, then the rest, IS natural for a Nintendo crossover.
...
On a different tangent, dissapointed at the lack of new Events related to the DLC content. It'd be a really neat touch.
I'm oddly not insulted by Kid Icarus having more reps than Metroid. I guess I don't mind more minor franchises getting more representation in Smash. As far as Metroid reps go I only think Ridley should be the next Metroid rep. (Though Dark Samus could be given the Little Mac treatment. Or the Dark Pit treatment of being an alt first, lol.)
Though I was somewhat insulted (over it now) that Duck Hunt was chosen in favor of Dixie Kong or K. Rool.
I think it's really our own differing opinions here. I don't mind more minor Nintendo franchises getting more representation than a major one, yet you do. (note: I'm not really counting Duck Hunt as part of a franchise, so this does not really apply to him)
Second tangent: I don't really care about event matches in this one. So no real opinion on this one.
edited 20th Jun '15 10:12:17 PM by powerpuffbats
AAAAUUUUGGGHHHH!!!!Marth still kills earlier with his tippers (which in good play will come 80-95% of the time) and still has the safer attacks. Lucina's buffs do not fix these things.
Ken was a Ryu clone because the original Street Fighter wouldn't let you pick doubles. So if you wanted a Ryu vs. Ryu match, the closest thing you got was basically pitting Ryu and Ken against each other.
Fantastic Supreme Überkaiser Emperor Folt of The Infinity and Beyond" ... "The First"!
Maybe, but Ken added something to the original Street Fighter gameplay-wise: He allowed for pseudo-mirror matches of Ryu's moveset. Once Street Fighter 2 came out and they figured how to do mirror matches, Ken diverged from Ryu.
When it came time for lots of characters to show up, however, Ken changed starting from the first appearance he had where he didn't need to be identical. And while Ken is, among all the clones of that particular style, the most similar to Ryu, he's still different enough that while he can be played like Ryu he has his own nuances (he's basically the difference between Ness and Lucas - different normals, same specials with similar but distinct effects).
Lucina's odd in that even in a game where clones typically set themselves apart by having unique effects or characteristics despite their similarities, she's basically identical except for a slight difference in her damage output. Even Dark Pit (who, like Lucina, has all the same normals as the guy he clones) has his own Final Smash.
edited 20th Jun '15 10:46:55 PM by KnownUnknown
What amuses me is that, when it comes to the clone characters, most of them are separate people from their source characters, yet play almost exactly the same...except for Dr. Mario, who is literally Mario dressed as a doctor. Yet he has the most differences from his source character, when all he did was change clothes!
edited 20th Jun '15 11:49:35 PM by DrFurball
That doctor equipment weighs a ton.
I think it's pretty clear by now that if a character enters the roster as a separate character, they STAY a separate character. If what Doc and Roy coming back separate is any indication, you either come back to the roster separate from the base character or you don't, with no in-between beyond misc representation like trophies. Even when Doc was planned to be a costume for Mario, the team decided to keep him separated because of him already having been playable on his own.
Grandfather Clauses are a hell of a drug.
edited 21st Jun '15 4:50:39 AM by TechPowah
The New Age of Awesome is here! Not even the sky is the limit!Well, in a sense Dr. Mario makes the most sense as a clone because he is Mario.
Call me Willy Whistle 'cause I can't speak, baby. Something in TV Tropes really drove me crazy.It's actually pretty weird seeing Jigglypuff being described as a clone, even though she was one waaay back in SSB 64.
De Romanīs, lingua Latina gloriosa non fuī.

To be fair, I never understand why people hate clones in Smash. Hell, Ken was basically a Ryu clone to begin with in Street Fighter.
I think Lucina and Dark Pit will be Luigified like Falco was for Brawl.
AAAAUUUUGGGHHHH!!!!