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Nap1100 Since: Mar, 2012
#58726: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:04:55 PM

It's considered by many to be the best in the series in competitive terms. Let's not get into this debate though.

ScottPilgrim2013 Why aren't you laughing? from Arkham Asylum Since: Jun, 2013 Relationship Status: Waiting for Prince Charming
Why aren't you laughing?
#58727: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:06:38 PM

Not too sure exactly,I love melee but I don't I don't know why it is on such a high pedestal(esp. in the tournament community)partially I feel its because of nostalgia but I don't know why it's so highly praised in by the competitive players.

My Tumblr "If theirs one thing I'm good at, it's blowing" Jesse Cox 2013
Pulse The Fool from Yadayadaville Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Fool
#58728: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:09:50 PM

Brawl had a lot of issues in regards to competitive balance. I personally feel it's more rawly fun to play, but let's be honest, Meta Knight and Ganondorf in vanilla Brawl are on opposite ends of a pretty wide gap.

Smash 4 looks to be fixing most of that, at least- It's a little faster and dropped the big anti-competitive elements, like random tripping.

I sure said that!
BloatedCreeper The One and Many from Area N Since: Jan, 2013 Relationship Status: RelationshipOutOfBoundsException: 1
The One and Many
#58729: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:10:11 PM

Through glitches, it becomes the most intense of the original three. Four is still up for debate.

I'm the guy who knows how to make games but doesn't. 3DS FC: 2878-9776-7579
Tarsen Since: Dec, 2009
#58730: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:10:45 PM

you know, i never actually noticed tripping in brawl.

Pulse The Fool from Yadayadaville Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Fool
#58731: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:11:39 PM

[up][up]They weren't quite so much glitches as holes in the design concept, but yeah, there was that going on, too.

I sure said that!
Nap1100 Since: Mar, 2012
#58732: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:23:14 PM

Melee is also by far the fastest game in the series, and doesn't have the extra problems Brawl/4 do like actual blockstun, more risk/reward, not-as-significant Stale Move Negotiation, among other things. It wasn't perfect by any means of the word, but there's a good reason tournament players usually latch on to it besides all the glitches it's known for.

Mukora Uniocular from a place Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
Uniocular
#58733: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:26:23 PM

Did they remove tripping? I've noticed Villager do something that looms a lot like it. But then, it's only happened with her...

"It's so hard to be humble, knowing how great I am."
Keybreak (Long Runner)
#58734: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:27:25 PM

Banana peels will still trip. But playing through the demo it looks like random tripping is gone.

Shaaaaaame...

You gotta believe me when I scare you away, all that I wish for is that you would stay
LordofLore Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Consider his love an honor
#58735: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:33:24 PM

Some items cause tripping in For.

Dragon_Ranger Since: Jan, 2010
#58736: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:34:27 PM

I've always wondered why the Smash community ended up with such a vocal group of tournament players. Smash is about as far as you can get from a traditional fighting game, and they're hell-bent on treating it like a traditional fighter. I don't mean to start a debate, but I'm just genuinely curious.

Demonfly birdie fairy Since: Jul, 2012
birdie fairy
#58737: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:34:30 PM

[up][up][up][up]I think you're referring to their dash attack.

edited 23rd Sep '14 1:38:15 PM by Demonfly

"Tell them to shut up and have some faith in me." - dead flashback guy
Nap1100 Since: Mar, 2012
#58738: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:40:25 PM

[up][up]It's not so much "treat it as a traditional fighter" as it is "treat it as a competitively viable game". The Smash community and the traditional fighting game community have some overlap, but for the most part the people winning the majors in each genre have been historically different players. Timed stock matches on not-chaotic stages without items have just proven time and time again to be the most fair way to play, which just so happens to be similar to traditional fighters.

Customer Since: Sep, 2009
#58739: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:40:39 PM

[up][up][up]Anything that pits people against each other (and sometimes even things that don't do this), no matter how silly it seems, can sow competitiveness.

[up]This as well. There's a reason that competitive Smashers are sometimes at odds with the rest of the FGC.

edited 23rd Sep '14 1:47:32 PM by Customer

Fawriel Since: Jan, 2001
#58740: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:41:37 PM

Why would it have to be a traditional fighting game in order to be competitive?

It's a series that's popular simply by virtue of what it is, which is the only reason why anyone ever even attempted to have Brawl tournaments even though it tries its hardest to really be the "party game" that the series is often decried as. Since Melee actually works, and works very well even, there's no reason for a tournament scene not to spawn. In fact it seems to me like the whole format offers a lot more potential for depth than traditional fighting games ever did thanks to the much greater mobility it offers and the complex win mechanics compared to just throwing punches on a straight plane until one of the dudes falls down. (I am aware of the oversimplification but I think my point stands.)

Keybreak (Long Runner)
#58741: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:50:56 PM

If it was just something like Super Race Brothers then the competitive community wouldn't be so argumentative about it.

Because fighting about fighting just brings more fighting. tongue Verbal violence for virtual violence.

edited 23rd Sep '14 1:51:23 PM by Keybreak

You gotta believe me when I scare you away, all that I wish for is that you would stay
Nap1100 Since: Mar, 2012
#58742: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:55:02 PM

[up]Have you experienced the amount of vitriol that comes from racing your friends in Mario Kart? I'd say Smash is rather tame.

From my experience the fighting game community (offline, not online) is actually one of the most welcoming competitive gaming communities out there. Weirdly enough.

Blueblur21 Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
#58743: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:57:23 PM

It's probably just me, but Smash will never be on the same 'level' that other fighting games are. It's not like Dead or Alive, which has a very special rock paper scissors aspect, or Soul Calibur, which has the whole parry/counter thing. Smash has always been more about having fun and beating Pikachu over the head with a wooden bat. Games like Dad or Alive focus on actual fighting, while Smash Bros says screw it and gives us the chance to be completely ridiculous.

Marth with a Bunny Hood? Why not?

Smash is very different from other fighting games, and that's okay. It just seems weird for it to be a tournament fighter is all.

edited 23rd Sep '14 1:59:17 PM by Blueblur21

Demonfly birdie fairy Since: Jul, 2012
birdie fairy
#58744: Sep 23rd 2014 at 1:59:54 PM

[up][up]What we can gather from this is that randomness is the sworn enemy of all game-related sportsmanship.

See also: Mario Party

"Tell them to shut up and have some faith in me." - dead flashback guy
LordofLore Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Consider his love an honor
#58745: Sep 23rd 2014 at 2:00:37 PM

Isn't Yoshi's Cookie a eSports game now?

Enderspy (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: In bed with a green-skinned space babe
#58746: Sep 23rd 2014 at 2:02:51 PM

Now I want Smash Bros versions of Mario Kart, Party, and Sports.

Pulse The Fool from Yadayadaville Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Fool
#58747: Sep 23rd 2014 at 2:11:03 PM

We're already edging into that with Link and Villager being in Mario Kart 8, along with a F-Zero course.

edited 23rd Sep '14 2:11:14 PM by Pulse

I sure said that!
WaxingName from Everywhere Since: Oct, 2010
#58748: Sep 23rd 2014 at 3:22:46 PM

@Blueblur 21:

The reason why I've been working towards getting Melee SD Remix ready for my Wii is because they apparently fixed the balancing flaws of Melee.

I actually prefer to play both SD Remix and Balanced Brawl over Project M, since if I want a balanced Melee, I play SD Remix. If I want a balanced Brawl, I play Balanced Brawl.

Playing Brawl with Melee physics doesn't appeal to me.

Please help out our The History Of Video Games page.
Keybreak (Long Runner)
#58749: Sep 23rd 2014 at 6:10:28 PM

So I'm getting eager to play with humans soon. I've gotten used to the tricks of the level 9 CPU's. Just KO'd a level 9 Villager three times without taking any damage.

You gotta believe me when I scare you away, all that I wish for is that you would stay
BaffleBlend Hey there! Having fun? from Somewhere Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: LET'S HAVE A ZILLION BABIES
Hey there! Having fun?
#58750: Sep 23rd 2014 at 6:21:11 PM

@58736: Because, it's more fun when there's not a million things happening on screen at once, and you can focus on outwitting your opponent rather than just hiding from the RNG. At least it is to me.

edited 23rd Sep '14 6:22:44 PM by BaffleBlend

"It's liberating, realizing you never need to be competent." — Ultimatepheer

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