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NesClassic Meh-meh!? from Flyover Country Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: In another castle
Meh-meh!?
#51726: Jul 25th 2014 at 8:43:28 PM

He may do it if we get another Meta Knight situation, but I think he's trying to keep everything close together as far as balance goes (even if balance isn't his priority.)

🏳️‍⚧️she/her | Vio Rhyse Alberia
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#51727: Jul 25th 2014 at 8:45:39 PM

I wouldn't worry too much about balance. Sakurai isn't the only one doing the balance this time, not to mention they've taken input from the players at E3. Obviously it's not going to be perfectly balanced, no game can be, but I'll bet it'll be more balanced than Melee or Brawl. If there's any severe issue like a glitch or Meta-Knight it'll get patched, most likely. They just won't be doing little tweaks like "Ganondorf is bottom tier, make him better".

edited 25th Jul '14 8:46:37 PM by Anomalocaris20

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Pulse The Fool from Yadayadaville Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Fool
#51728: Jul 25th 2014 at 8:47:36 PM

I'm thinking if we wind up with a character that's so far out ahead or so far behind the rest that the game loses fun elements, we might see some degree of balance patching going on. Not general balance tweaks, though, you got that part right.

I sure said that!
Ogodei Fuck you, Fascist sympathizers from The front lines Since: Jan, 2011
Fuck you, Fascist sympathizers
#51729: Jul 25th 2014 at 9:15:55 PM

Overpowered heavyweights suit me fine, given that Ike and Dedede were old mains (they're not getting the benefit of the doubt this time, though. That's reserved only for Kirby and Game and Watch)

Keybreak (Long Runner)
#51730: Jul 25th 2014 at 9:20:40 PM

The heavyweights always seemed easy to beat to me. They'd spend so much time on the ground, all you'd have to do is hit them with enough weak attacks and then get close enough for another big hit.

You gotta believe me when I scare you away, all that I wish for is that you would stay
wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#51731: Jul 25th 2014 at 9:51:41 PM

Obligatory Ridley comment.

So is ZSS' entire moveset invented for this game?

Pulse The Fool from Yadayadaville Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Fool
#51732: Jul 25th 2014 at 9:53:06 PM

The Paralyzer's stun gun function isn't. That's about it.

I sure said that!
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#51733: Jul 25th 2014 at 9:54:12 PM

Her neutral-B move is the only non-invented one.

I guess you could argue that her down-smash is a logical extension of it though.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
zeromaeus Since: May, 2010
#51734: Jul 25th 2014 at 9:54:56 PM

Let's see. In Zero Mission, ZSS could:
jump
climb
crawl
shoot paralyzer bolts

Enlong Court Dragon from The Underground Facility Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
Court Dragon
#51735: Jul 25th 2014 at 10:07:34 PM

To be fair, most of Samus's moves are invented for Smash, outside of her grapple beam (which didn't work like that until Prime 3: Corruption gave her the Grapple Lasso), charge beam, bombs, and Screw Attack. But, considering how strong and fit Samus is known to be, her moves make sense, now that she's in a battle where the enemies are weak enough to actually be hurt by something less powerful than her awesome beam cannon.

I have a message from another time...
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#51736: Jul 25th 2014 at 10:18:25 PM

Sheik, Captain Falcon, Fox, Falco, Wolf, and ROB all had their movesets pretty much created from scratch, and Zelda's, Ness's, and Lucas's are all based on someone else's moves (As is Ganondorf's, but in a different context).

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Pulse The Fool from Yadayadaville Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Fool
#51737: Jul 25th 2014 at 10:24:28 PM

Though there's usually some degree of justification to most of 'em- Sheik's Up Special is derived from her tendency to disappear in OoT by throwing a Deku Nut and vanishing in the flash, with the rest being general ninja tropes, Fox's Reflector is probably based on the barrel roll's reflection effect, and his Fox Illusion is arguably based on the booster on the Arwing, with the Falcon Kick and Raptor boost also being delectably derived from the boosters on F-Zero machines to some very vague extent, and R.O.B.'s eyes detected video signals in real life, so using his eyes to shoot lasers isn't the worst interpretation of that, and the Gyro was indeed basically charged the same way on the actual robot.

I sure said that!
doctrainAUM White Hindu from New Jersey Since: Aug, 2010
White Hindu
#51738: Jul 25th 2014 at 10:31:39 PM

It's commonly theorized that Captain Falcon's moves come from the abandoned Dragon King concept. Fox might be the same, but his moves' general sci-fi elenment make them stand out less.

"What's out there? What's waiting for me?"
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#51739: Jul 25th 2014 at 10:39:59 PM

Yeah, Captain Falcon is basically recycling the original moveset from before SSB was retooled into the Mascot Fighter we know and love.

Heck, if they didn't already have a spare moveset to give to someone, I suspect we wouldn't have gotten Captain Falcon to begin with.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Sterok Since: Apr, 2012
#51740: Jul 25th 2014 at 11:11:42 PM

And where would Smash be without its mascot?

An accurate summary of the tournament.

Edit: Also, the evolution of the Smash meta in two pictures.

edited 25th Jul '14 11:14:51 PM by Sterok

CassidyTheDevil Since: Jan, 2013
#51741: Jul 25th 2014 at 11:34:39 PM

Honestly, there's nothing wrong Bowser being at the top. I just hope they don't nerf him based on this feedback, I think it's great that Bowser is powerful. It's how he should be.

doctrainAUM White Hindu from New Jersey Since: Aug, 2010
White Hindu
#51742: Jul 25th 2014 at 11:56:42 PM

There is no character who "should be" more powerful than the others. As long as people keep that in mind (looking at you, Dungeons and Dragons, with your Linear Warriors, Quadratic Wizards), then game balance is much easier.

"What's out there? What's waiting for me?"
Pulse The Fool from Yadayadaville Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Fool
#51743: Jul 26th 2014 at 12:10:04 AM

I mean, Bowser should be more powerful than most of the cast in the sense that he should hit like a truck, at least.

From what I understand, weight is much more important to how effective launches are, so Bowser has a significantly better defensive game now simply because of his increased passive defense.

edited 26th Jul '14 12:10:26 AM by Pulse

I sure said that!
Vgm3 This is the Monado's power! from Miami, Florida Since: Apr, 2013 Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
This is the Monado's power!
#51744: Jul 26th 2014 at 12:33:53 AM

I'm still really happy with how Bowser's turning out to be. After years of using the guy in Melee and Brawl's he's finally gonna stamd a good chance.

Now's it's Shulk Time!
SpookyMask Since: Jan, 2011
#51745: Jul 26th 2014 at 12:36:21 AM

They will probably nerf ZSS and Bowser too much tongue Since wasn't that what apparently happened to Marth?

Pulse The Fool from Yadayadaville Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Fool
#51746: Jul 26th 2014 at 12:38:21 AM

They made Marth different. He's apparently closer to a Jack of All Stats instead of a Fragile Speedster now.

I sure said that!
Mukora Uniocular from a place Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
Uniocular
#51747: Jul 26th 2014 at 12:39:48 AM

Makes sense. I imagine Lucina will fill that niche now? Ike will probably be a Mighty Glacier.

"It's so hard to be humble, knowing how great I am."
doctrainAUM White Hindu from New Jersey Since: Aug, 2010
White Hindu
#51748: Jul 26th 2014 at 12:43:22 AM

I was gonna say "makes sense", until I remembered that Ike, in his home games, was not super-slow. But it does make sense with Lucina's presence, I suppose.

[up]I swear, that was a complete coincidence.

edited 26th Jul '14 12:43:55 AM by doctrainAUM

"What's out there? What's waiting for me?"
Mukora Uniocular from a place Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
Uniocular
#51749: Jul 26th 2014 at 12:44:23 AM

How. Dare you.

"It's so hard to be humble, knowing how great I am."
Pulse The Fool from Yadayadaville Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Fool
#51750: Jul 26th 2014 at 12:46:34 AM

Ike was a Lightning Bruiser in both Tellius games, but Radiant Down dropped his speed down a few pegs closer towards Mighty Glacier territory. Even ignoring that, given his build, him being powerful makes sits better with me than making him fast.

Heck, he really wasn't all that slow in Brawl- He had several attacks that opened quickly and occupied the running speed level directly below the tie between Mario, Bowser, DK and R.O.B., the middle-grounders in that sense.

I sure said that!

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