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beorc Ridley and Ridley from hither and yon Since: Sep, 2009 Relationship Status: I know
Ridley and Ridley
#43451: May 6th 2014 at 8:22:24 AM

I'm guessing there won't be any enemies from Wii Fit either. Unless we fight the Wii Balance Board.

Welcome to th:|
CountofBleck Starting to believe in himself from New Wirral (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Starting to believe in himself
#43452: May 6th 2014 at 8:24:48 AM

I wonder if Smash Run will have Boss sections aswell, similar to the Air Ride events with Dyna.

Imagine the sirens going off and the background changing as Tabuu flies into the background, wings fully charged.

edited 6th May '14 8:24:55 AM by CountofBleck

KSonik Since: Jan, 2015
#43453: May 6th 2014 at 8:35:07 AM

Would anyone like to see other third-party boss characters besides the Yellow Devil?

edvedd Darling. from At the boutique, dear. Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: We finish each other's sandwiches
Darling.
#43454: May 6th 2014 at 8:35:21 AM

Enemies like Roturret and Poppants are definitely in, so there's bound to be more. They're focusing on actual Nintendo enemies it would seem.

Visit my Tumblr! I may say things. The Bureau Project
paperbritt Since: Apr, 2013
#43455: May 6th 2014 at 8:36:03 AM

[up][up] EGGMAN

edited 6th May '14 8:36:13 AM by paperbritt

Pulse The Fool from Yadayadaville Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Fool
#43456: May 6th 2014 at 8:38:13 AM

Egg Viper or Egg Dragoon, please!

I sure said that!
Sterok Since: Apr, 2012
#43457: May 6th 2014 at 8:43:06 AM

Have we seen any Star Fox enemies?

I've been thinking about Greninja, and I suspect its inclusion and popularity are coincidences. Here's my train of logic, based on likely assumptions.

  • The decision to cut transforming characters was made early in development. This means Pokemon Trainer has to go.
  • Of his three Pokemon, Charizard is going to stay. Because it's Charizard.
  • The roster was most likely finalized around or shortly after E3.
  • Gamefreak/Sakurai wants a proper XY representative. Even with Megas, Charizard, Lucario, and Mewtwo don't count, because none of them debuted in XY.
  • Sakurai looks for diversity and moveset potential.
  • Gamefreak/Sakurai only put in notable Pokemon. Notable XY Pokemon include Chesnaught, Delphox, Greninja, Sylveon, Xerneas, and Yveltal. Maybe throw in Hawlucha and Aegislash if you're feeling generous, but they really aren't that important.
  • Xerneas and Yveltal are out for obvious reasons. Delphox is out due to similarities to Charizard.
  • Sylveon is a legitimate option, but it's very possible Sakurai didn't see moveset potential from it, since Ivysaur had vines, and Sylveon's ears probably wouldn't work.
  • Then it comes down to Chesnaught and Greninja, and between the two Sakurai likes Greninja more. Thus, we get Greninja.

That's my guess at least. The earliest I can see Greninja's popularity being determined is November, and while it's certainly possible her programmed Greninja between then and April, it seems unlikely.

Vgm3 This is the Monado's power! from Miami, Florida Since: Apr, 2013 Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
This is the Monado's power!
#43458: May 6th 2014 at 8:58:49 AM

[up] I think we'd see the Aparoids as the enemies from Star Fox.

I think Zazz is a likely boss for Windy Hill, have him riding in on the moon, shooting stars at you.

Now's it's Shulk Time!
BadWolf21 Since: May, 2010
#43459: May 6th 2014 at 9:54:43 AM

[up][up] Short answer: Ash has a Froakie. Sakurai has already confirmed that what the anime chooses to give focus to plays a role in what Pokemon get to be playable.

I'm not saying that's the only reason, but it probably helps that he only has one of the Kalos starters (whereas he had all three in Unova), and its type doesn't conflict with Charizard. I can easily see it coming down to Chesnaught or Greninja and Sakurai siding with the one that is more likely to get face time in the anime.

FullMoon feeling blue from Surface Since: Jul, 2012 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
feeling blue
#43460: May 6th 2014 at 10:38:22 AM

That's assuming Ash's Froakie is even going to evolve, considering it's the anime we're talking about.

WaxingName from Everywhere Since: Oct, 2010
#43461: May 6th 2014 at 10:39:42 AM

If the Anime essentially decides the playable Pokemon, what's the explanation behind the Trainer and his three starters?

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Enlong Court Dragon from The Underground Facility Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
Court Dragon
#43462: May 6th 2014 at 10:42:37 AM

That's a question we've been over many a time.

The two answers are that the team was based off of either Ash's team of Kanto starters, or that of Red. Midway through training and evolving them all, in either case.

That's as far as you want to probe into this, trust me.

I have a message from another time...
Sterok Since: Apr, 2012
#43463: May 6th 2014 at 10:46:26 AM

PT seems to be entirely made up to justify giving Charizard a slot. Okay, maybe that's an exaggeration, but by Brawl I'm sure they had noticed that Charizard had become the most popular thing ever. At the time, Sakurai was big on uniqueness, so he came up with trainer as an excuse to get in the three popular starters. Squirtle is more popular than Bulbasaur, which means we get Ivysaur for the mid-evo. That's my theory anyway.

KSonik Since: Jan, 2015
#43464: May 6th 2014 at 10:52:37 AM

Speaking of PT, it's actually kinda weird that, despite Red being still relevant due to Pokemon Origins, he has been cut due to the disconfirmation of transformations.

edited 6th May '14 10:52:50 AM by KSonik

Hashil Since: Aug, 2010
#43465: May 6th 2014 at 11:21:15 AM

With 600+ Pokemon at the time, I think they just wanted a way to wedge in as many playable ones as possible without the roster visibly getting over saturated with them.

Irene (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#43466: May 6th 2014 at 11:27:21 AM

[up][up] Red isn't in Brawl, that's why. Pokemon Trainer is. Never mind that that version of Red only has Charizard. Funny which one stayed. tongue

Shadow?
Sterok Since: Apr, 2012
#43467: May 6th 2014 at 11:29:20 AM

[up]It's Red in all but name. And those were his Pokemon, just not all evolved.

I'm going to laugh if we're shocked yet again and Trainer does get in, directly commanding Squirtle and Ivysaur in battle while adding his own moves.

Enlong Court Dragon from The Underground Facility Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
Court Dragon
#43468: May 6th 2014 at 11:39:36 AM

So what do you think will be the extent of the custom specials? It'd be cool if Samus's Charge Beam could have different beams applied to it, such as Ice or Wave.

I have a message from another time...
Irene (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#43469: May 6th 2014 at 11:46:07 AM

The only thing related to Red is his appearance.

You can't see all his Pokemon outside of Yellow or Gold/Silver/Crystal. Since they're not fully evolved, that blatantly leaves G/S/C out. That means he has to be based upon Yellow, the only time he can get all 3 on his own. Trading is irrelevant and can't count, especially since Brawl is pretty clear in him catching them. The Trophy completely omits "trading" from what he does, and he catches them in the SSE. Yellow is not a regular game and is explicitly based upon the Anime, where we both know Sakurai often looks at. His lineup is either based upon Yellow or Ash's at best. Obviously his appearance was the most updated version of the game character, the main playable version in the first Gen. That's literally the only thing that the FR/LG part refers to. And the only part that makes sense on the Trophy. Why he didn't list Yellow is up to anyone. Despite being far more similar to his Yellow counterpart...

And to call him Red(as anything more than a nickname anyway) is clearly ignoring who he is in Brawl, a generic Pokemon Trainer. He's always been known as PT whether you like it or not. That's a fact. He has no name beyond that and never will in Smash. Origins, as I said, has zero effect on Smash. It does not star a relevant version of Red at all. He doesn't have all 3 Pokemon(like every version of Red except Yellow/Gold/Silver/Crystal/HG/SS) and is meaningless in that regard. Outside of using that to determine what Pokemon to keep in 4, but Charizard already was the most popular, so that wouldn't much matter anyway. Only the regular Anime has had any real effect on Smash so far.

And no, Pokemon Trainer is beyond unlikely to return at all. Especially not with two Pokemon. Transformations are gone. Squirtle and Ivysaur either get their own slot, or not at all. And we got Greninja for Water. With Jigglypuff obviously coming back, there's probably one or two spots left. That's likely Mewtwo and maybe a Grass Starter, if anything. Which one is a different story, and we've gone through variant ideas.


[up] I'm guessing maybe 2 or 3 more choices, and that they'll probably be small variants of each one. Like Fire to Ice, etc. I have a feeling they won't be major changes, sadly.

edited 6th May '14 11:49:14 AM by Irene

Shadow?
Enlong Court Dragon from The Underground Facility Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
Court Dragon
#43470: May 6th 2014 at 11:51:42 AM

maybe Zelda could have a variant of Din's Fire that travels extremely far and fast, at The expense of power, and one that's quite strong, but domes around her instead of flying out at all.

Perhaps Fox's Blaster could be swapped with other weapons, like the Sniper Rifle from Assault.

Edit: even in terms of what we've seen, we saw Kirby breathing ice instead of inhaling. I think most anything that can use a similar animation is possible.

edited 6th May '14 11:52:46 AM by Enlong

I have a message from another time...
Sterok Since: Apr, 2012
#43471: May 6th 2014 at 11:54:03 AM

Trainer represents all the main trainers, but he's clearly 100% based off of Red. It's the same thing as Link and Zelda representing all (non-Toon) Links and Zeldas there have been, but at the same time they're clearly Twilight Princess Link and Zelda.

Ice Beam Samus would be amazing. Or even Ice Missiles. No wait, Diffusion Missiles.

NesClassic Meh-meh!? from Flyover Country Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: In another castle
Meh-meh!?
#43472: May 6th 2014 at 11:54:50 AM

Marth's dashing Shield Breaker (henceforth known as the Shield Breakneck) has potential to be a great horizontal recovery, but I have no idea how it works in the air.

They'll be fun little changes, albeit some of them could potentially change the metagame (assuming they're allowed, which I almost guarantee they won't be).

🏳️‍⚧️she/her | Vio Rhyse Alberia
Enlong Court Dragon from The Underground Facility Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
Court Dragon
#43473: May 6th 2014 at 11:58:16 AM

Why wouldn't they be?

I have a message from another time...
NesClassic Meh-meh!? from Flyover Country Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: In another castle
Meh-meh!?
#43474: May 6th 2014 at 12:00:04 PM

Usually custom movesets are outlawed when available. Granted, here they're all probably too insignificant to do anything. I was probably leaping to conclusions, ehehe...

...but yeah, when custom movesets are available there's almost always some way to make a Game-Breaker out of them.

🏳️‍⚧️she/her | Vio Rhyse Alberia
Sterok Since: Apr, 2012
#43475: May 6th 2014 at 12:00:52 PM

Hm, maybe Toon Link can finally get some Wind Waker stuff beyond Taunts.


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