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TPPR10 Craving for fish from up north Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
Craving for fish
#26976: Nov 10th 2013 at 11:04:45 AM

Because fuck interesting and new ideas.

Okay, I swear, I don't plan these page toppers.

edited 10th Nov '13 11:05:20 AM by TPPR10

Only sometimes posts
Irene (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#26977: Nov 10th 2013 at 11:05:39 AM

It's a great rule. Every Link using his signature moves for his B moves is perfect. Especially if they're not based upon a very specific concept like a Masked Link is.

@Kostya: Well, Masked Link is Young Link, who is unrelated to Toon Link. We see ST Link in a stage. There already are three Links that appear in the game. I doubt he'll do it, but it's not 100% impossible. IMO, I think he could do some other characters first, and it seems like a giant roster isn't on the possibility list, so... I don't think we have a fair chance of seeing him, sadly. I think he's a cool concept, though. And since his concept isn't "showing off both notable versions of Link", the rule wouldn't need to apply to him like it should for a regular version of Link.

Shadow?
Moth13 Since: Sep, 2010
#26978: Nov 10th 2013 at 11:07:37 AM

Why is it a great rule? It seems like the opposite of a great rule to me.

TPPR10 Craving for fish from up north Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
Craving for fish
#26979: Nov 10th 2013 at 11:08:36 AM

Heck, I doubt they will even bother giving different Links different weapons for other attacks. Skull Hammer for like a Smash Attack? Not gonna happen.

Only sometimes posts
NesClassic Meh-meh!? from Flyover Country Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: In another castle
Meh-meh!?
#26980: Nov 10th 2013 at 11:14:38 AM

I feel like us people who like Toon Link are in the minority. The one thing I'd change is make his Final Smash the Hurricane Spin Attack, and that's it.

🏳️‍⚧️she/her | Vio Rhyse Alberia
Irene (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#26981: Nov 10th 2013 at 11:24:20 AM

[up] He kind of has that in Brawl. He can charge up his Spin Attack for more damage. Although I think his Wind Waker could be interesting.

The rest fit him perfectly, though, since those are all extremely notable Link-based moves. One-off items, not as much. Specials really should be about their signature moves(if possible. Ganondorf is an exception in Smash currently, but that's due to how he got in. Still needs to be changed), not poor excuses to declone others. Specials aren't there to show off differences among anyone. That's what A moves are for. They're there to show that that character is well known for doing. And we all know Link is quite well known for his Spin Attack, Bow, Bombs, and Boomerang. Barely anyone knows him for his Bombchu, or Deku Leaf, etc. Hammer as well, but it's not nearly as important, so I think it being an A move is fair enough. Also, the Hookshot is semi-notable, but again, is dedicated to being a non-special, his grab and all.

[up][up] Well, it could. It's not unbelievable either. It'd make a good Down Smash. Also, the last Hammer Adult Link had was the Megaton Hammer, so since he used TP Link, he didn't want to give one guy a move the other couldn't replicate in any way. I think it makes a lot of sense, being that they're both based upon the same overall and consistently used protagonist, just named Link.

edited 10th Nov '13 11:26:12 AM by Irene

Shadow?
Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#26982: Nov 10th 2013 at 11:55:07 AM

As an outsider looking in, sometimes I feel like posting here, but then I see these arguments and just have no idea. I get the feeling if I say one slight thing, something will explode.

Anyways, I think I thought up of a few more Mega Evos:

  • Bowser: Giga Bowser
  • Yoshi: Winged Yoshi
  • Wario: Wario Man
  • Zelda: Shiek
  • R.O.B.: Ancient Minister

and so on...

Demonfly birdie fairy Since: Jul, 2012
birdie fairy
#26983: Nov 10th 2013 at 11:57:16 AM

It's funny because you just ended up mentioning one of those slight things in that exact same post. tongue

Anyway, since we're back on this topic, it'd actually be pretty nice if the theoretical Mega Ring actually managed to cut back on all of transformation Final Smashes that are always suggested/brought up.

edited 10th Nov '13 11:59:55 AM by Demonfly

"Tell them to shut up and have some faith in me." - dead flashback guy
Irene (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#26984: Nov 10th 2013 at 12:15:19 PM

[up][up] Sheik is a normally playable character by default. I don't think she fits in all too well, nor is she specifically meant to be a truly more powerful person than Zelda is. It's just the gameplay makes it look that way.

The rest are perfect, though.

Shadow?
NesClassic Meh-meh!? from Flyover Country Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: In another castle
Meh-meh!?
#26985: Nov 10th 2013 at 12:28:15 PM

For Mega Zelda/Sheik... well, this idea would be original to Smash (kinda), so warning.

It would be Goddess Zelda/Sheik.

🏳️‍⚧️she/her | Vio Rhyse Alberia
ScorpioRat from Houston, Texas Since: Jan, 2013 Relationship Status: Forming Voltron
#26986: Nov 10th 2013 at 12:30:56 PM

Turning into Hylia would actually be pretty cool.

TheSpaceJawa Since: Jun, 2013
#26987: Nov 10th 2013 at 12:45:34 PM

Nope, equal fuss. Your fallacy is that you're pretending that one false generalizing statement is more acceptable than another. It's not. They're both entirely unacceptable to make since it's just lying through your teeth.

And your fallacy is thinking its worth making a huge fuss over it like it ought to be rule or something. You are blowing the issue way out of proportion. If it were making the statement about something that is highly popular, it would be a case of lying about it or major ignorance. If the statement is about something that has almost no fans, its as likely to be a matter of simplifying the statement with the unspoken assumption that anything has fans if you look hard enough.

Hyperbole exists for a reason. This is one of them.

@The rest of this post

By that argument, there would also be a justification for including two or three other versions of Link as well since they are all equally important to the series and they are all represent different games. But we don't need three or four versions of Link hanging around, we only need one. If they really wanted Mini Link to stick around, they should have just made him "the" Link and simply call him "Link". Any Links included with the game beyond the first one is simple, unnecessary redundancy.

The fact that they both have the same move set only makes things worse - if they actually had different move sets, there might actually be justification for keeping him around. But right now he's just a miniaturized carbon copy with a few behind the scenes numbers tweaked around.

And the fact that you are trying to argue that he needs to have the exact same move set as Link classic only builds more of an argument for why he should have gotten the ax as far as I'm concerned. If he needs to be identical, then what is the frikken point of having more than one of him?!

I'll agree that Ganondorf really ought to be uncloned, though. Of all the clones, he's the one that they could least afford to remove from the game and actually deserves a new move set the most.

Even if all of Brawl's roster returned, hypothetically?

Any time spend putting Mini Link into the game is time they didn't spend putting in another character who deserves a spot far more than a miniaturized carbon copy of a character that is already in the game.

If Ridley doesn't make the cut, then yes, I will blame Mini Link for eating up time that could have been spent making him work. If Mewtwo doesn't return in spite of his rumored status as such, then yes, I will be blaming Mini Link for taking up energy that could have instead been used to bring Mewtwo back. If Ganondorf is once again Captain Falcon slower clone, I will blame the inclusion of Mini Link for eating up time and energy that could have instead been spent giving Ganondorf a more unique moveset that's more 'Ganondorf'.

Mini Link is nothing more than a waste of time and space who never should have made the cut in the first place.

think part of it is that Toon Link is basically Link-but-much-better, so people just wonder- Why not just make Link better?

Yeah, the thing is that if they were trying to keep Mini Link fans happy because they like the way Mini Link played better, they should have instead axed the unnecessary mini version and instead made Link Classic play more like his miniature counterpart.

Irene (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#26988: Nov 10th 2013 at 1:05:51 PM

I gave zero hyperbole. Don't make false statements unless you want them corrected. That's all there is to it.

The Zelda games star two types of protagonists, Child and Adult Link. Both are severely important characters and both deserve to be playable entirely. Likewise, they both have the same signature moves that are important to them and most recognizable. I agree the A moves should be changed up a bit, but the specials(outside of the Final Smash) changing is just insulting the characters by making them lame for the sake of "de-cloning", which is not a good reason at all. Smash will always have clones, it's a major part of the series. Since day one. To think this won't happen again or any will ever be truly de-cloned is laughable. Stop trying to ruin the series by removing key aspects of it.

Shadow?
Thnikkafan ? from Faroe Islands (not really) Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
?
#26989: Nov 10th 2013 at 1:09:33 PM

[up][up] Stop bitching, please and thank you.

I don't care if your argument is "right" or "wrong" or whatever, it's just annoying.

So anyway, Mega Evolutions for the characters. Next up, my ideas for the Kirby trio.

  • Meta Knight: Galactica Knight
  • Dedede: Masked Dedede
  • Kirby: This one is harder, since Kirby's never really been one for multiple forms, going instead for power-stealing. So, instead... he splits into loads of mini-Kirbys. Let's say 12. They, however, each do about 1/3 of the damage that Kirby normally does, thus leading into a general attack boost. Kirby's B-attack doesn't work due to size differences, so instead of consumption, Kirby just pulls them past him, which could easily be off the stage. Each one that dies is damage done when the Mega Ring wears off.

edited 10th Nov '13 1:09:39 PM by Thnikkafan

Anyone who assigns themselves loads of character tropes is someone to be worried about.
Moth13 Since: Sep, 2010
#26990: Nov 10th 2013 at 1:12:49 PM

Stop bitching, please and thank you.

That's not productive.

[down][down]That's even less productive.

edited 10th Nov '13 1:23:33 PM by Moth13

NesClassic Meh-meh!? from Flyover Country Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: In another castle
Meh-meh!?
#26991: Nov 10th 2013 at 1:14:08 PM

So, earlier I mentioned my ideas for DK and Yoshi alts. (respectively Mystery Land Donkey Kong and Pirate Land Yoshi from Mario Party 2)

But I was wondering what costumes you guys would use from that game, if any, and for which characters. Well, which ones would you use? (The characters are Mario, Luigi, Peach, DK, Yoshi, and Wario. You can see the costumes here if you scroll down.)

🏳️‍⚧️she/her | Vio Rhyse Alberia
Irene (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#26992: Nov 10th 2013 at 1:18:33 PM

[up][up][up] Agreed.

I like Mario's explorer outfit the most.

I also am sick of clone complaining. Every character that was ever playable damn well deserves the spot. That's why they were chosen, because they deserved to be in there. Toon Link is super deserving, no matter what his moveset is. His character is beyond important to the Zelda series, as is Adult Link. The only reason Young Link didn't need to be in is because he wasn't getting a different moveset.

edited 10th Nov '13 3:01:07 PM by Irene

Shadow?
Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#26993: Nov 10th 2013 at 1:21:03 PM

See, it happened again. Dammit...

Anyways, yeah, multi-kirby can work.

KSoniK Since: Jan, 2015
#26994: Nov 10th 2013 at 1:24:37 PM

[up][up][up][up] Pretty much. That was out of line.

About Toon Link: Whilst I didn't mind his inclusion in of itself, I was annoyed by how hypocritical it seemed considering that Sakurai dismissed fighting game characters for supposedly not having the ability to offer anything new to the table, despite the obvious fact that there is virtually no chance of any one of them, martial artists or otherwise, of not offering something new gameplaywise. Whilst I don't want any characters from traditional fighting games to be in Smash, that reasoning still is pretty poor, especially when he went on about wanting characters that offered something unique.

edited 10th Nov '13 1:27:32 PM by KSoniK

GaryCXJk Wants Captain N for SSBU Since: Aug, 2009 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Wants Captain N for SSBU
#26995: Nov 10th 2013 at 1:30:19 PM

You know what would be fun to see? Multipe Final Smashes per person. Like, you pick the Final Smash when you pick your character or something, or a different Final Smash triggers when activating while blocking, separating the offensive and defensive Final Smashes. Defensive Final Smashes would for example protect you from getting knocked down, while offensive Final Smashes act like most of the existing ones.

Like, Samus would roll around in her morph ball, or Zero Suit Samus would hide in the background when standing perfectly still. Mario would turn into a tanooki, and his down B would be replaced by his statue thing, allowing you to fall down as a statue without taking damage, but also without inflicting damage.

Signatures are for lamers.
Irene (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#26996: Nov 10th 2013 at 1:30:27 PM

[up][up] That was in the context of third party characters or ones not in Smash yet.

It's not hypocritical to return a veteran here. He never was talking about already previous Smash characters.

I thought the clone thing seemed annoying at first, until I realized that he wasn't talking about any current clone. He just wanted any new character to be unique, but never showed he had problems with any previous ones. I know it almost sounds like it. I even see where it comes from. But it actually isn't here when you remember the context of his statement.

[up] That's a good way to have both Mega Mewtwos and both Mega Charizards. I like.

edited 10th Nov '13 1:30:56 PM by Irene

Shadow?
NesClassic Meh-meh!? from Flyover Country Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: In another castle
Meh-meh!?
#26997: Nov 10th 2013 at 2:23:40 PM

Everyone gets a Landmaster.tongueAnd they're all Fire/Fighting type.

🏳️‍⚧️she/her | Vio Rhyse Alberia
Irene (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
Enlong Court Dragon from The Underground Facility Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
Court Dragon
#26999: Nov 10th 2013 at 2:31:03 PM

I'm starting to despise the word "entirely". Seems to be the herald of bad times in this thread.

Were I designing Toon Link, I'd probably have used the Deku Leaf for his recovery move, and maybe used the Grappling Hook as his tether recovery, rather than the Hookshot (which could probably remain as his grapple). That's just a visual difference, of course.

I have a message from another time...
TheSpaceJawa Since: Jun, 2013
#27000: Nov 10th 2013 at 3:13:07 PM

I gave zero hyperbole. Don't make false statements unless you want them corrected. That's all there is to it.

I didn't say you were giving hyperbole. The hyperbole is on the part of the people who are saying the "nobody likes X" about things that almost nobody likes. The point is that they should be able to get away with such hyperbolous statements such as "nobody likes X" when talking about something that has an insignificant fanbase without someone raising a massive fuss about "YOU'RE NOT BEING 100% ACCURATE! HOW DARE YOU LIE ABOUT HOW MANY PEOPLE LIKE X!"

You know what would be fun to see? Multipe Final Smashes per person. Like, you pick the Final Smash when you pick your character or something, or a different Final Smash triggers when activating while blocking, separating the offensive and defensive Final Smashes. Defensive Final Smashes would for example protect you from getting knocked down, while offensive Final Smashes act like most of the existing ones.

Eh, seems unnecessary. The Final Smashes are all about big flashy 'finisher' moves, making it so people can use them defensively would seem counterproductive. Besides, sounds like they'd be kind of boring, really. And they wouldn't serve much purpose during a 1v1 either. Either the player with the lead would maintain control of the game, or the player behind wouldn't get any use out of it.

edited 10th Nov '13 3:13:22 PM by TheSpaceJawa


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