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Ookamikun This is going to be so much fun. (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
This is going to be so much fun.
#127026: Feb 29th 2020 at 9:37:51 PM

[up]That was was about favoritism. Just talking about how "Nintendo is the devil" was a thing back before Joker was shown but then he got revealed. Actually now that I think about it people were doubting it too because "Sakurai liked the character!" Apparently Sakurai liking a character or a game implies it isn't a Nintendo pick. Or something. You know, right after the fanbase whined about Piranha Plant.

Actually wait that could be the same source. It's like they forgot Nintendo was behind "fan favorite" picks but then Byleth comes around. And honestly? As long as the fanbase keeps showing itself from stupidity like how we got the Grinch hoax to be a thing to the point where we reached the height of obnoxiousness, or the whole lead up to the Byleth reveal complete with "Mii costume is better than the actual character reveal" (yes, I will not let go of it as a Terry fan and I will at every given opportunity laugh at it), I am glad a "Byleth reveal" exists to pull back the delusions of the fanbase to reality.

Edited by Ookamikun on Mar 1st 2020 at 1:38:22 AM

agent-trunks IHE from Every-where, but there Since: Apr, 2015
IHE
#127027: Feb 29th 2020 at 10:35:55 PM

And yet Paper Mario is unironically one of the most request 1st party characters


Yea, it's kind of a hassle.


Thank you


I wouldn't put Byleth in that category.

And the whole reason why this Byleth debacle annoys me is that apparently, a plant mook is more acceptable because it's from the Mario franchise.


Doesn't change that Bandanna Dee still one of the most requested characters out there. Especially in terms of 1st party.

Edited by agent-trunks on Feb 29th 2020 at 11:47:07 AM

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#127028: Feb 29th 2020 at 10:36:44 PM

[up][up]As much as I'm annoyed that you're practically asking for another couple of pages of arguments regarding Byleth...
Thank you for phrasing it as "Grinch hoax". Some of these "leaks" aren't leaks, they're just rumors and hoaxes that impatient parts of the fanbase latch on to just because they want their expectations filled or they can't wait a couple days/weeks for relatively trivial information on a video game they'll get anyway.

[up]Bandana Dee's just on my wishlist because he's an easily implemented echo that can get his supporters who actually have a tiny bit of a point to finally shut the fuck up about it. Though Adelaide, Daroach, or the Three Magus Sisters would be more interesting to me as playable characters.
Never Waluigi, though. Because 1) there's no point, especially when Peach (and Daisy in particular) can represent the sports games far better, 2) he's mostly just a meme, and the meme stays funnier without him being playable, and 3) spite.
Paper Mario I could see a legitimate case for. Yeah he's a third Mario, but significantly different in gameplay. Also in my opinion Doctor Mario shouldn't be innote , but he is in, so I'm not going to get all HOES MAD about it, and will just play as someone else.

[up]Your second link is busted. It redirects to an "Add post" page.

Edited by wanderlustwarrior on Feb 29th 2020 at 12:54:03 PM

The sad, REAL American dichotomy
randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#127029: Feb 29th 2020 at 10:40:15 PM

I'm pretty sure the whole Nintendo picks thing is just letting Sakurai and co. know who they're willing to pay for.

Or Smash just has an unusually high budget just on the basis of getting the rights to use 3rd party characters.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#127030: Feb 29th 2020 at 10:42:50 PM

Who would Bandana Dee be an Echo of?

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#127032: Feb 29th 2020 at 10:45:24 PM

Kirby.

And his inhale would work different. He just absorbs a character through osmosis via a counter.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#127033: Feb 29th 2020 at 10:45:41 PM

"Just change all 4 specials"

Yeah, no. That's not an Echo Fighter.

Edited by Anomalocaris20 on Feb 29th 2020 at 1:45:54 PM

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#127034: Feb 29th 2020 at 10:49:08 PM

Ask Ryu and Ken.

But fine, only change some of them. I really don't care.

Edited by wanderlustwarrior on Feb 29th 2020 at 12:49:37 PM

The sad, REAL American dichotomy
randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#127035: Feb 29th 2020 at 10:49:43 PM

Their specials...are the same.

Edited by randomness4 on Feb 29th 2020 at 10:50:01 AM

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#127036: Feb 29th 2020 at 10:54:18 PM

Ta da.

But again, I don't care about Bandana Dee enough to go beyond that. I'd rather theorize a playable moveset for Adelaide or Travis Touchdown (and will, soon).

The sad, REAL American dichotomy
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#127037: Feb 29th 2020 at 11:00:17 PM

Ken and Ryu have the same specials, just with some altered numbers. Bandana Waddle Dee cannot use any of Kirby's specials, especially not the Neutral-B.

I'm assuming you mean Adeleine, and I actually devised a full moveset for her here if you want to compare.

Edited by Anomalocaris20 on Feb 29th 2020 at 2:00:49 PM

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Irene (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#127038: Feb 29th 2020 at 11:05:23 PM

Kirby and Bandanna Waddle Dee do have similar bodyshapes, but that's about it. They however have too many huge differences in abilities that an Echo wouldn't work very well. It's not something like Isabelle who had the wrong bodyshape from the start either. Some just don't flow right. At least Dark Samus makes sense using a lot of Samus' abilities, despite being inaccurate in general.

Plus, Bandanna Waddle Dee generally uses a spear, including a normal part of its model, so Kirby really would be at best help to create the character, but wouldn't add much beyond a few animations. Like retooling the Up B could somewhat work if you wanted to do that, but there's better options like a Helicopter Spin.

Shadow?
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#127039: Feb 29th 2020 at 11:07:04 PM

Bandanna Dee would not be an Echo, he would have a completely original moveset based on the Spear ability in his home games. If you want a Kirby series Echo Fighter, Prince Fluff would work for Kirby, Galacta Knight or Dark Meta Knight could work for Meta Knight, and Bonkers could be an Echo of Dedede.

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#127040: Feb 29th 2020 at 11:12:29 PM

Yeah, Bonkers is known for inhaling people. tongue

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#127041: Feb 29th 2020 at 11:20:30 PM

Eh, they could change that to a hammer spin, or something like that. They could also change the Gordos to Bonker's exploding nuts. Outside of those two special moves, I feel like Bonkers would play mostly the same as Dedede.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Feb 29th 2020 at 12:23:24 PM

Crossover-Enthusiast from an abaondoned mall (Lucky 7) Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#127042: Mar 1st 2020 at 12:43:16 AM

[up] Would Hammer Throw be his dash attack or his side-B?


And yet Paper Mario is unironically one of the most request 1st party characters

At least Paper Mario has the potential for a unique moveset, unlike Fire Emblem, which is forever tainted by the idea that everyone must and always will be Marth

...Ones of these days I need to sit down and finally write out my ideas for a Paper Mario moveset...

Jawbreakers on sale for 99¢
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#127043: Mar 1st 2020 at 1:00:50 AM

I like the idea of swapping out the Gordos as Dedede's Side B for Bonker's exploding nuts, which would fly in the same arc but wouldn't bounce, instead landing on the ground and exploding on contact or after a couple seconds. I guess Inhale can be swapped out with Hammer Throw to give Bonkers a secondary projectile, or maybe Bonkers' Neutral B can be Hammer Spin into Hammer Throw, as a primary attack with a powerful secondary projectile.

agent-trunks IHE from Every-where, but there Since: Apr, 2015
IHE
#127044: Mar 1st 2020 at 2:56:49 AM

[up]Your second link is busted. It redirects to an "Add post" page.

Fixed, thanks for that.


This is unironically how people will always view every FE protag.

Roy still one of most inaccurate to the source material.

Because someone will always have to be in Marth's shadow in damn near in every crossover he gets involve in.


If what they say is true about Jigglypuff's character model than Bandanna Dee shouldn't be all to hard in comparison but that's seriously downplaying the man-hours that developing takes.

Edited by agent-trunks on Mar 1st 2020 at 2:58:35 AM

Irene (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#127045: Mar 1st 2020 at 3:16:38 AM

It is true. Jigglypuff uses Kirby as a base. So it takes less time than some characters. But some are also even easier to make(Dr. Mario, any Echo. Though Ken is also pretty unique too for an Echo, so it's hard to say if he's closer to Dr. Mario, who is the only regular clone that you could say is the least unique).

Jigglypuff is often done near the end of development because it takes less time than someone more unique, I.E. Yoshi or Ganondorf. We know little about the development schedule of Ultimate, since all of the base game characters(Plant may or may not have been intended for base game) were meant to be there from the start. So any clones and echoes could've still been worked on last among the characters, or first this time. We don't have very clear data of what's going on, nor a good way to tell. At least with Brawl we had delays to add Sonic, along with some characters with no SSE stuff beyond "unlock video" at best, due to them being nearly on the cutting block(Toon Link, Wolf, Jigglypuff) and their data placement implies they were done later. As well as the actual cut 7 characters(of which only some of them had stuff worked on beyond a file name, anyway).

Shadow?
powerpuffbats The crabby fussbudget Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
The crabby fussbudget
#127046: Mar 1st 2020 at 8:56:46 AM

Honestly, I think when it comes to wanting characters, people get very hyped up, only to be disappointed because they “aren’t Crash/Sora/Dante/Master Chief/Doomslayer.”

I’m in part curious if really out there character picks like Neptune or Ni GH Ts would get any significant amount of hate if they made it in.

(I just realized the other day that Neptune would actually be aware of her reception if she did somehow get in and would definitely be the type that would say “hoes mad”.)

AAAAUUUUGGGHHHH!!!!
STRX Since: Jul, 2013
#127047: Mar 1st 2020 at 9:09:46 AM

Would Shadow be an echo or could you make a moveset around him that basically makes him an ex semi clone.

I'll take Viewtiful Joe.

Irene (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#127048: Mar 1st 2020 at 9:22:58 AM

[up] The answer is both.

Both are plausible. He has the same bodyshape as Sonic and can easily do all the same moves. You could even change barely any as is(like Down B could be akin to Witch Time, but using his Chaos Control animation from the AT. Just obviously touched up) and it'd still work. The most would be changing his animations to things like karate chops that fit his character more. With barely any stat difference. That'd take a bit of extra animation work, but that's closer to what Dark Samus is at this point.

Otherwise, you could easily make him a semi-clone with many unique specials, but some moves can be retooled otherwise. Including the karate chops as is.

If Dark Samus was a semi-clone, she'd still be using Samus as a base for a lot of stuff. Overall, the only key factor at this point is to be an Echo is if they have the same bodyshape with barely any differences(pixels worth. That's about all Lucina and Daisy even have) first. If they have different bodyshapes(for instance, Isabelle's is different from Villager's enough that an Echo doesn't work), a semi-clone or regular clone still works. Pichu is a regular clone, and has a very similar bodyshape to Pikachu, its base.

[up][up] Yeah, some just expect characters instead of simply hoping. It's just a thing that happens. If you set yourself up on a pedestal, it can easily come crashing down, basically. Happens a lot, really.

Edited by Irene on Mar 1st 2020 at 11:26:51 AM

Shadow?
Ookamikun This is going to be so much fun. (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
This is going to be so much fun.
#127049: Mar 1st 2020 at 10:36:53 AM

[up]Pichu used to be anyway. Ultimate Pichu animates so differently now. Or rather, Pikachu animates so differently now.

Edited by Ookamikun on Mar 2nd 2020 at 2:37:08 AM

RodimusMinor Professional Complainer Since: Oct, 2018
Professional Complainer
#127050: Mar 1st 2020 at 10:39:20 AM

Getting Nights in Smash would be fucking legit.


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