Series/Deus Ex

Mankind Divided has a lot of good qualities. The Gameplay is still solid, Level design is open ended, The Tyrant Powers are a blast, I like how enemies use their augmentations in combat, The final Boss is better than any bosses in HR. I like the design approach they take to the hub world. The side quests are all pretty enjoyable. The side cast while not as good as DX 1 or HR still has some memorable characters. My problems lie with the game’s length, the fact that it ends just when its getting really good, Breach Mode was too much of a chore that I basically rage quit (not helped by the unreliable servers), and it has microtransactions.

On another note why hasn’t Walton Simons showed up in the prequels yet. I’ve always wanted to know what his deal is

Edited by Invincibleasshole on Dec 19th 2018 at 11:07:44 AM

Well depending on what rumors you hear, he was supposedly intended to be an earlier clone in Paul/JC/Alex's line at some point.

One irritating as fuck thing is the first DLC was ripped from the game proper.

Which removed an hour of content from the game itself.

It wasn't a great level but it was a full level.

So, I've now gotten captured, broke from my cell, gotten to Hong Kong, seen Maggie Chow, got the flippin' sword, got to tong, broke into Versa Life, and gotten the two triads to cease the conflict.

I'm now going to break into Versa Life again, after a frantic escape which was only possible through my cloak augmentation, which burned through my supply of bioelectric charges.

Oh, this will not be pleasurable...

this game, though, is incredibly pleasurable. I am enamored with this game.

Edited by fredhot16 on Dec 27th 2018 at 8:35:03 AM

There are enough Repair bots around that you should not be burning through cells unless you are in combat or leaving you augmentations running too long. As for the plot...just wait until you find out what you will be doing after the second trip to Versalife.

What I love about Hong Kong is how you can skip a few things and alter whole scenes.... if you just kill Maggie Chow when you first meet her... or snipe her from across the road from Jocks apartment.

It was the level that made me go "woah".

What I love about the original Deux Ex is that it offers you more meaningful choices than some games that sold themselves on making meaningful choices. And the beauty is that Deus Ex never tells you about them. It never tells you that you can kill Anna instead of Lebedev. It never tells you that you save Paul's life by leaving through the front door. It never tells you that you can save Jock's life by talking to that shady mechanic and then taking him out. There are countless things that you can do that affect the game in some fashion that it just never tells about and it's amazing.

Huh. Case in point: I didn't know that you could save Jock, I believe. Well, thank you for letting me know! That's something to experiment with the next time I play the game, should I remember! ^_^

Edited by ArsThaumaturgis on Dec 28th 2018 at 4:49:30 PM

this game must have been tested through the wazoo and back because it seems to able to anticipate every possible permutation of almost every thing that the player would.

I have one gripe with the game, though: at times, it can't differentiate from the unconscious to the deceased, which vexes me with me trying to be a ghost and a pacifist in this game.

O.K, you can say that's been buggered up with me turning Anna into a pile of charred meat and...me using a rocket launcher when a bunch of bozos tried to get Paul but those I would put as in-universe "not my sibling, you bastards" and as the player, I thought I had to slaughter as many as I could because I wanted to keep Paul non-deceased and I wasn't sure if Paul could handle those bozos.

So, I'm still going to keep being a ghost and a pacifist by not actually slaughtering a single person.

Edited by fredhot16 on Dec 28th 2018 at 10:32:53 AM

Yeah, not a person singular. Groups is fine ;)

With Paul, I find the easiest way is to put gas grenades in the hall. Really, all you need to do to save him is die inside the Ton hotel. But i try to see how far I can get.

Also, the MI Bs detonate if knocked out anyway, so there's gonna be.... collateral. Though it is possible to do it with liberal LAM and gas mine placement.

I prefer to show them what happens when you mess with a god.

That guide is still my favorite way to play through the game.

Honestly, the showdown at the 'Ton is not that difficult, even on Realistic (provided you go lethal). Gas Grenades are one method, but you can also use a LAW or just plaster the first couple of guys with a rocket, then toss a LAM for the second wave in the hall. By that point, you should be able to drop any regular enemy with a single headshot from the pistol or rifle; As long as you deal with the MI Bs with explosives or hamstring them with Gas Grenades, you can pretty much coast all the way back to Battery Park with a little patience.

Edited by ViperMagnum357 on Dec 28th 2018 at 6:05:30 AM

True, but it's not nearly as amusing as talking to Paul and having your screen go white and stay white for a few seconds as everything spontaneously explodes.

I finally beat Invisible war and I have mixed thoughts

The good

Really (if unmemorable) atmospheric music

Solid level design

Flashlights no longer take up energy

Cool locations like the Arcology and the arctic

The Omar

The opening areas and the final level have a pretty good amount of player freedom

The pilot system

The bit where you go through the Unatco ruins sent a chill down my spine

The faction system

The bad

Several of the characters especially Alex have this bug eyed look that makes it look like they want to kill everyone

Loading times

I don’t have a pc so I played it on the original Xbox. During my play through the game lagged at multiple points and even crashed on me a couple of times. I don’t know if this is just a problem with the Xbox version or with the pc version as well

Universal ammo

Weapons don’t have enough punch to them

The items menu

Multitools and lockpicks are rolled into one item (something that the prequel games have failed to correct)

No area specific damage

After the first visit to the arcology and excluding the final level the game becomes more on rails.

The WTO/Order conflict ends up feeling pointless

The fact that they decided to make all three endings canon instead of just choosing one and sticking with it retroactively invalidates the choice at the end of the first game

The treatment of the characters from the first game. JC’s partial heel turn I can kind of understand given he’s being influenced by Helios but Tong and Chad feel like completely different characters.

Overall on its own Invisible War is a decent game but an unworthy follow up to the original

I think we're meant to completely agree with JC Denton's Instrumentality Plan.

Which is problematic.

The WTO/Order conflict ends up feeling pointless because it is pointless. It exists solely to Palpatine the shit out of the secular materialists and religious.

People can change a lot over the years, so characters acting different is expected. Also keep in mind that "you're" different too. They aren't going to act around you the way they would JC. For some of them, he was their messiah. Alex is, to some, just spare parts or at best a useful cog.

I remember back in the day, reading the quotes from the hidden dance party level and feeling like they painted a picture of an unhappy production. In retrospect, I'm amazed the game was as good as it was; it's less a "bad game" than it is a collection of poor decision and compromises following a super-excellent game.

Personally I'd say Deus Ex in general has a bit of an issue with "Palpatine-ing"-political debates are often rendered irrelevant because The Illuminati is controlling both sides to some degree anyways. Essentially, the issue with this is that particularly invasive conspiracy theories like this tend to heavily imply that politics don't exist per se.

Strangely I'd actually argue it's an inversion of Debate and Switch or a Debate and Switch against its will-Deus Ex wants to talk about politics, but the elephant in the room makes it too hard to ignore.

Deus Ex was meant to be a X-Files Conspiracy Thriller parodying the zeitgeist of the 90s. Its of no obligation to be accurate to reality and I'd argue doesn't even pretend to be.

Mind you, Human Revolution did a good job of suggesting The Illuminati isn't actually the Illuminati but adopted the name because when you were *that* rich, you could get away with it.

I wish it had stuck with that and they're essentially conspiracy cosplayers.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Jan 28th 2019 at 5:26:59 AM

It has, essentially - we see that they're essentially playing around and TRYING to be in charge, but Mankind Divided shows they're floundering. It's a key reason why Page was able to do what he did with MJ 12 - the Illuminati are too porous and poorly coordinated to really fundamentally work.

Yes, Everett runs the paper and Du Clare does... her thing with a bank. They buy politicians but it's all with very grand ideas and poor execution.

I really REALLY hope they give us a third one. Maybe we need a new protag, though I'd like to see Jensen get an end to his arc at least. Hell, maybe we just need them to do a full reboot. DX was fantastic for its time but I doubt we'll get the nuance and depth in a remake / reboot.

So has anyone else noticed that there are a lot of You Tube commenters who use JC as an avatar?

DX was fantastic for its time but I doubt we'll get the nuance and depth in a remake / reboot.

A remake in the same vein of the Metroid and Resident evil remakes is an interesting idea. Maybe they could even restore some of the cut content like the MJ 12 path (and the option to play the game with the original voices).

Edited by Invincibleasshole on Jan 29th 2019 at 8:53:09 AM

So Bloodlines was amazing and I want more RP Gs's like it. Roleplaying, factions , multiple endings... But I'm not in the right mood for games like Pillars or Tyranny.

The Deus Ex games though I've been hearing about forever. Could they be up my alley?

I think so. If you enjoyed Bloodlines, Deus Ex is similar in a lot of ways.

I'd say so. The factions and roleplaying may be more a bit more limited than Bloodlines (or at least that's my impression), but the variety of options for traversing levels in Deus Ex is a gold standard.

Yes, plenty of exploration and fine tuning a specific character-modding weapons, mutually exclusive augmentations, and limited skill points ensure a tailor made experience once you know what you are doing. The game is fairly linear, but most can be thought of as a series of open areas bottlenecked by specific plot progression flags. There is a lot to do in each area, but you can blow through it in a hurry if you want to and know what to do and when.

The factions/multiple endings are not as pronounced as some games, with you basically following the same plot and making specific choices near the end to determine the ending; not the drastic branching of something like, say, Mechwarrior 4: Mercenaries. The real draw is that there are 3+ ways to complete most objectives; brute force and stealth are usually options alongside at least one more, ranging from diplomacy, hacking, trading, sabotage, deception, to straight up bribery. IE, in the first mission of Deus Ex, you need to enter a particular fortified building and reach the top: there are seven different ways to gain access, none of which involve commerce, threats or bribery (all of which come into play at various points in the game).

Okay thanks everybody.

What about Deus Ex 2? I've heard criticisms of it for years. I do have one ending spoiled. Apparently if you back the wrong faction you die. Oops.

In any event, nobody talks about it much anymore in my experience. So should I just play DE 1 and then go to Human Revolution? Can I actually do that or do I miss out on important stuff?

Edited by Nikkolas on Apr 28th 2019 at 2:37:54 AM