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BensenDan Daniel Bensen from Sofia.Bulgaria Since: May, 2011
FringeBenefits Magical Girl Authority™ from in your basement (Veteran) Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Magical Girl Authority™
#1352: Sep 5th 2011 at 7:47:44 AM

[up]Sure thing! I'm bookmarking you now.

BensenDan Daniel Bensen from Sofia.Bulgaria Since: May, 2011
Daniel Bensen
#1353: Sep 5th 2011 at 11:11:18 AM

[up] Thanks for all the lovely comments :) I shall reciprocate! (scuttles off)

www.kingdomsofevil.com http://bensen-daniel.deviantart.com/ https://twitter.com/bensen_m
Prometheus136 What's eatin' you, chief? from Yoknapatawpha County Since: Sep, 2011 Relationship Status: It's so nice to be turned on again
What's eatin' you, chief?
#1354: Sep 5th 2011 at 12:12:40 PM

Hi all, I'm a newbie to the Tv Tropes community and I wish to get some formal opinions on some of my writing. I've noticed that there are quite a few intelligent people on these boards, and I've also noticed that quite a few of you are very creative. I also feel like I am creative, but I do admit that I have my hangups. I've written several short stories and I have ideas for two (or three, but that's doubtful) novels: a realistic fiction novel and a conceptual Sci-Fi novel. If any of you would be interested in critiquing my work, I would greatly appreciate it, thanks. (If any are interested I'll post my stuff below)

War is God.
BensenDan Daniel Bensen from Sofia.Bulgaria Since: May, 2011
Daniel Bensen
#1355: Sep 5th 2011 at 12:57:32 PM

[up] Welcome from another newbie. Want to talk a little more about your projects? I recommend this thread for that: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13136288150A69019700

www.kingdomsofevil.com http://bensen-daniel.deviantart.com/ https://twitter.com/bensen_m
Ronka87 Since: Jun, 2009
#1356: Sep 5th 2011 at 5:49:09 PM

^ Uncle Drunkie's thread should really be used for projects that have a solid amount of work done, not just ideas—it's a beta thread, after all. Critique for ideas is welcome here, or you can make your own thread to discuss your work.

ch00beh ??? from Who Knows Where Since: Jul, 2010
???
#1357: Sep 7th 2011 at 10:24:57 PM

hm I wonder who hangs out in this thread nowadays, slash, if there's another organized thread, what's this one mainly used for?

"Never let the truth get in the way of a good story." Twitter
ArgeusthePaladin from Byzantine. Since: May, 2010
#1358: Sep 7th 2011 at 11:09:04 PM

This one is mainly for quick critique of short works/excerpts/ideas, while the other one is essentially a brokerage that connects those with a large work to those willing to beta them. In Drunk's thread, I suppose, there should be a lot more commitment attached than here.

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ch00beh ??? from Who Knows Where Since: Jul, 2010
???
#1359: Sep 7th 2011 at 11:23:48 PM

well then I guess I will just go ahead and post in Drunk's thread and then pimp it right here.

Wooooo leeching.

"Never let the truth get in the way of a good story." Twitter
BensenDan Daniel Bensen from Sofia.Bulgaria Since: May, 2011
Daniel Bensen
#1360: Sep 7th 2011 at 11:50:48 PM

Here's an idea:

A Canadian ornithology graduate student is playing with Google maps when she notices an odd, persistent weather pattern over a particular valley in the New Guinea highlands. The valley is always significantly colder than it ought to be. She posts all over the internet, trying to drum up interest to get an expedition funded. Her posts are discovered by an interested party...

Meanwhile, a young man accepts the duties of his tribe and goes to war on the other side of the Hole(for made-up physics reasons, a literal hole in the ground, with a spherical wormhole at the bottom). He emerges on Router, a world which long-extinct godlike aliens once made the hub of their wormhole-transport system. Millions of years after the original inhabitant's extinction, the biota of many planets have leaked through the wormholes, and now compete with each other across Router's surface. Our main character is called upon to fight because of an invasion from a neighboring biotic zone, with different and incompatible biological systems (their support ecology sucks oxygen out of the air and replaces it with methane...anyway). In the past, such incursions have been easy to ward off, since the aliens are stuck with stone-age technology. But this time, the aliens come bearing guns. They must have got them from someone else. Everyone wants to find out who sold guns to the aliens (either a third alien species or a traitorous human community), and get some for themselves, but the main character has a better idea. Why not go back through the Hole to Earth and buy guns from the Europeans?

Extent of completion is what you see above, plus reams of EXTREMELY nerdy pictures and text here http://bensen-daniel.deviantart.com/journal/42282068/ here http://bensen-daniel.deviantart.com/art/Biotic-Zones-of-Router-255640875 here http://bensen-daniel.deviantart.com/#/d48lws4 and here http://bensen-daniel.deviantart.com/#/d48t2ok

www.kingdomsofevil.com http://bensen-daniel.deviantart.com/ https://twitter.com/bensen_m
Yej (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: They can't hide forever. We've got satellites.
#1361: Sep 8th 2011 at 8:50:47 AM

[up] I like the idea. Go write it. grin

Can anyone give me some feedback on this? (Which is a continuation of this, which I posted here a little while ago.) It's hard, but paradic sci-fi, so there is a lot of Shout Outs involved.

ArgeusthePaladin from Byzantine. Since: May, 2010
#1362: Sep 10th 2011 at 9:29:31 AM

So, I've finally reached that part in my novel where I have to describe giant robots. Owing to both personal and in-universe reasons, I am analogizing much of the machines' armor to medieval armors.

Hovering several dozen yards above that inhospitable sea level were three machines lining up in a loose wedge, each being easily as tall as a three-storey building and bearing uncanny humanoid shapes in their design. Behind their shoulders, a number of intense, yet sleekly shaped blue flame jets were jutting out from the respective exhaust ports, pointing in a diagonal angle towards the rocky sea level. Whether those intense flames were the only thing keeping the machines afloat, or if there were any other mechanism at work was beyond the understanding of the uninitiated.

Despite the superficial similarities in their flight and mid-air balancing mechanism, the three machines’ aesthetical designs were by no means similar. On the contrary, each was quite different to the others.

The machine at the front of the wedge had its head designed to resemble what seemed to be a stylized horse-hair helmet with an elongated decorative crest running as far down as its shoulders. Said shoulders were well encased in several layers of protective, reinforced plates, bulging outwards like a pair of unnecessarily large pauldrons. Covering its chest, stomach and groin were a system of interlinked shining plates, the smallest of which as big as a royal palace’s main gates, forming up into something akin to a giant humanoid’s equivalent of brigandine.

Its leg joints, mostly the ankles and the knees, were as well fortified as its shoulder, if not more so. This fortification spread right down to the machine’s feet, which, so heavily armored and reinforced, now looked more like a horse’s hoof than a humanoid pedal proper. Most notably, a number of exhaust ports not dissimilar to those on its shoulder lay on the back calves. If those ports were alit at all at the moment, their flames were but insignificant sparks compared to the shoulder exhausts.

The reason for such measures was probably the kind of weapon it cradled in its arms. At the first look, one might dismiss it as merely an extra-large arquebus with the only saving grace being its sheer size, almost as long as the machine was tall. A closer look at this weapon revealed an elaborate firing mechanism, with several kinds of levers and triggers jutting from the gun’s breech. The gun’s barrel itself was abnormal, its business end comprising of three separate, distinct muzzles aligned on a spinning circular disc connected to the rest of the oversize barrel. That gun was most probably not something anyone would like to stare down at early in the morning.

The entire machine was coated in varying shades of white. Its unarmored metallic core frame was painted steel white. Its plates, pauldrons and reinforced plates were given a silvery coat. The gun’s stock and breech were grayish in color, and the barrel were somehow given all three color schemes.

The two other machines were similar to each other in the very base design. The core of each unit was identical – a plain, simplistic yet sleek and mobile frame reflecting the basic anatomical ratio of an adult, with a largely segmented and modular structure. The head of these machines were interchangeable, being a vaguely humanoid face in an open helmet with what looked like colored stained glass panels for eyes, two decorative, elongated ears that extends diagonally backward, and a number of angular segments sculpted into the helms themselves.

However, the one on the left flank was dramatically bigger and better armed and armored. If the armor of the white machine at the front was analogous to a brigandine, this machine’s armor might as well be full plate. Thick, durable modular plates ran all over its body, from top to toe. Its body was covered in a single-piece suit of armor ceramics, extending right down to its knee level in the form of a formidable metal skirt. The legs were similarly armored, though somewhat lighter than the rest of the body, for two of its exhaust ports were also mounted on the back of its calf.

Its shoulders were even more thickly covered and reinforced than the white machine’s seemingly oversize pauldrons, if only because on each of them rested a large gun barrel whose inside was as wide as the machine’s head. In its hands, it carried some sort of giant-sized service rifle, albeit compared to the general size of its body and the sheer weight of its armors, the gun seemed almost puny in comparison.

On the contrary, the one on the right flank was barely armored. Aside for some reinforced joints, basic chest pieces and skirt, it had no other protective item worth mentioning. It did, however, have a large amount of weapons visible on its person. On its two forearms, it concealed something resembling the handles of two large knives. Its body, being relatively unarmored as it was, sported two rows of launch tubes along the vicinity of its abdomen. On its left hip, a small holster almost built into the torso itself housed a small gun. And finally, in its hand the machine brandished a service rifle of the same general design as that of its companion, albeit slightly larger and featuring a larger stock.

I need some opinion as to whether this sounds okay. Anyone willing to lend this humble troper a helping hand?

edited 10th Sep '11 9:30:47 AM by ArgeusthePaladin

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FallenLegend Trickster. from Navel Of The Moon. Since: Oct, 2010
Trickster.
#1363: Sep 10th 2011 at 5:43:49 PM

Hey guys I have wriiten an entry for the tv tropes conttongueestand I would love someone to check it ou. Unfortunately I can't post a link to to judge imparitality and stuff.

Woud anyone be willing to critique it? (I would pm the link). It's only one thousand words long tongue (so far)

Make your hearth shine through the darkest night; let it transform hate into kindness, evil into justice, and loneliness into love.
Prometheus136 What's eatin' you, chief? from Yoknapatawpha County Since: Sep, 2011 Relationship Status: It's so nice to be turned on again
What's eatin' you, chief?
#1364: Sep 10th 2011 at 6:29:10 PM

I mostly have written short stories and the like (and they are fairly short, usually around 10 pages or so), and I like to dabble in different styles and such every once in a while. I have a story in which I attempted to use a stream-of-consciousness style from the perspective of an... not-so-sane man. I find that it is good, and people have told me that it is disturbing (which I want it to be). I doubt anyone would really care or even read this, but if anyone in particular would be interested in reviewing it (I'll post a link), PM me or state that you're interested in the following post(s). Thanks!

War is God.
ch00beh ??? from Who Knows Where Since: Jul, 2010
???
#1365: Sep 10th 2011 at 6:29:52 PM

streams of consciousness from insane people are like my favorite.

"Never let the truth get in the way of a good story." Twitter
Prometheus136 What's eatin' you, chief? from Yoknapatawpha County Since: Sep, 2011 Relationship Status: It's so nice to be turned on again
What's eatin' you, chief?
#1366: Sep 10th 2011 at 6:33:00 PM

[up]So would you be interested in giving your own thoughts on it? (It's not that long, really, only about 4 pages in MS Word). I haven't finished it completely, but I have an idea of where it would go; of course, I want to know if it's any good to begin with.

War is God.
ch00beh ??? from Who Knows Where Since: Jul, 2010
???
#1367: Sep 10th 2011 at 6:51:31 PM

yeah I'd probably be interested in reading it

"Never let the truth get in the way of a good story." Twitter
Noaqiyeum we must dissent (it/they) from across the gulf of space (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
Ronka87 Since: Jun, 2009
#1369: Sep 10th 2011 at 7:13:17 PM

@Argeus: Here's my critique, and it's a long one.

First issue: Infodump. Ten paragraphs and almost a thousand words of information conveyed by straight-up telling. You must find a better way to share this info (I have a suggestion at the end of the post).

Second issue: Irrelevant info. I don't want to dictate what is or isn't important in your work, since you know that better than I do, but it seems like most of the descriptions up there are unimportant. There's a lot of detail, but what's the point? That amount of info doesn't help me envision the mech— it bogs me down in minutia. *

Third issue: Some areas, while detailed, have vague details. Take "[It had] two decorative, elongated ears that extends diagonally backward, and a number of angular segments sculpted into the helms themselves." I'm sure you can picture it in your head, but I had a hard time—at first, I imagined long Vulcan ears, and then I figured you meant Gundam antennae. The "angular segments" are still lost on me. At first, I pictured this, and that can't be right. I get the sense you're trying to do two things at once—1) describe the head in detail, and 2) do so using terminology the POV character understands *

. Mixing the two concepts has led to vague descriptions, but perhaps you could try using different terminology the POV is familiar with.

Fourth issue: Is anyone there? I know this is an isolated passage, but reading through, I don't get the impression there's anyone involved in this scene. Who's seeing the robots for the first time? Where are they? What's their reaction to seeing these monolithic mecha? What setting are we in? A hangar? A battle ground? I get no sense that these robots are connected to anything—it's like the Featureless Plane of Disembodied Dialogue, but with description. Consider your POV and what his reaction is to seeing these monsters for the first time.

Fifth issue (last one): Wordiness and sentence structure. It's a style thing, maybe a bit personal, but much of this text can be cut or phrased better. Look for repetitious ideas ("The three machines’ aesthetical designs were by no means similar. On the contrary, each was quite different to the others.), long ways for saying simple things ("The three machines’ aesthetical designs were by no means similar different.") and weak words (probably, seemed); these are simple ways to cut wordiness. The sentences are grammatically sound, but you use the "It/They/The object was/were [blah]" structure a lot. It's like the mecha is a grocery list. Spice it up!

Suggestions:

  • Build a scene out of it. Info dumps are hard to swallow because it's like the story goes on hold while the narrator fills us in on what's happening. Try to integrate the information with the character and setting. Have the character ask questions, interact with the mecha, react to the things he's seeing. This is also a great way to use character personality, side characters, setting, foreshadowing, whatever. As a bonus, you'll also automatically switch up the writing style by changing from description, to dialogue, to action, to reactions. Remember: Stories are told in scenes.
  • Dump some of the info. Decide what the most important info is, kill the rest.
  • Describe the robots in relation to other tangible things, not just as a series of details. Even if the narrator is from medieval times, he can find ways to describe the objects that are concrete. "Its head looked like a cross between a samurai and a praying mantis," or "Its ears stood up like a sheep dog's." It'll give a vivid description in fewer words and it'll be more fun to read (and write).
  • Not all info needs to be given at once. A character may only notice a handful of things at first ("Great Scott, it's a giant man! Made of ivory!") and learn other important things later on ("The ejector seat doesn't work? You had to wait 'til I was 2000 feet in the air to tell me that?!").

Hope this helps. Keep at it!

edited 10th Sep '11 7:15:38 PM by Ronka87

ArgeusthePaladin from Byzantine. Since: May, 2010
#1370: Sep 10th 2011 at 7:51:20 PM

Thanks Ronka. I know something was wrong, but I can't really correct it myself.

Actually, that part was taken from a scene as followed:

The whole scene took place on an ocean. The three said machines had just taken off from their carrier to engage a group of enemy frigates. However, *something* happened, a large explosion went off, caused something of a huge surge of tidal wave and took out their carrier and the enemy frigates. The machines managed to survive only by activating their experimental independent-flight engine.

Actually, when I wrote this description, I am vaguely aware that this was too detailed for the urgency of the scene (pacing, people). So I am just kinda sorta writing them as (i) placeholders to let the rest of the plot go on, and (ii) as mandatory prose description for the machines.

Speaking of which, my current idea is to cut off this entire part, put it on the clipboard, and just give a vague description of "The three machines appeared several feet over the sea level in a wedge formation" then cut to the cockpit. The entirety of the description will be copy-pasted some time in the later part where the POV character can take a closer look at it, ergo, in a more peaceful setting.

Would that make more sense?

Also, as for the seemingly blandness in some place and the need to "spice it up", let me just chalk that up to creative bankrupcy and/or writer's block these days. sad

edited 10th Sep '11 7:58:33 PM by ArgeusthePaladin

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Ronka87 Since: Jun, 2009
#1371: Sep 10th 2011 at 8:12:56 PM

I agree, it would not make sense to have that description in a battle scene, so your idea about just having a one-line description during the fight and going into further detail later is a good one (it also fits with my last suggestion of not dumping all the info at the same time). However, I don't recommended copy/pasting it as-is into a calmer setting— more description would be fitting in a calm setting, but this is far too much info even for that. And as I said in my first point, it's an Infodump— too much information too fast in a dull way. If you cut some of the description and built it into a scene, it would be information and character building and dynamic.

The style stuff will work itself out eventually, so long as you work on it. You build up creativity and beat writer's block by practicing—so practice! You can always edit later. smile

edited 10th Sep '11 8:14:13 PM by Ronka87

ArgeusthePaladin from Byzantine. Since: May, 2010
#1372: Sep 10th 2011 at 8:21:42 PM

Or an alternative is to glean out parts I can use to add more flavor to the current passage, then save the rest to be used later. So that would effectively divide the infodump into two parts proportionate to the amount of detail required in each scene. Would that be a better option?

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FallenLegend Trickster. from Navel Of The Moon. Since: Oct, 2010
Trickster.
#1373: Sep 10th 2011 at 8:23:02 PM

Ronka could I ask you advice for something I am writting?. It's for the tv tropes contest thanks. I would like to know if I am heading towards the right and an honest opinion would be nice . It isn't too long trust me

edited 10th Sep '11 8:24:48 PM by FallenLegend

Make your hearth shine through the darkest night; let it transform hate into kindness, evil into justice, and loneliness into love.
Prometheus136 What's eatin' you, chief? from Yoknapatawpha County Since: Sep, 2011 Relationship Status: It's so nice to be turned on again
What's eatin' you, chief?
#1374: Sep 10th 2011 at 8:59:29 PM

Welp, that's actually fairly encouraging! Here she be: [1]

Word to the wise: I intended this story to be disturbing, so let me know if it did its job.

War is God.
ch00beh ??? from Who Knows Where Since: Jul, 2010
???
#1375: Sep 10th 2011 at 9:00:05 PM

not public

"Never let the truth get in the way of a good story." Twitter

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