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Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#276: Mar 23rd 2012 at 11:16:04 PM

[up]Except Vegeta is already the strongest guy in his group*

. He doesn't need to prove anything in that situation nor has he anything to gain with that.

edited 23rd Mar '12 11:17:30 PM by Heatth

daveshan Since: Dec, 2010
#277: Mar 24th 2012 at 12:09:41 AM

[up]

But I'm saiyan that it stands to reason that all Saiyans would act like that. Nappa pretty much went on a long ego-run when he fought the Z-fighters. He could've taken them all out long before Goku arrived if he wanted, but toyed with them and egged them on because he was stronger. You know, at the very least, all hopped up on power, Kakarot will barge into the Amazon's room and try to force her to come with him.

Heck, every bad guy in the DBZ universe toys with their opponents, strokes their own ego, and gives the opponent chances to pull out all their tricks until they find themselves backed against a wall. Some of the good guys do that too.

Point is: Awakening Pan's potential wouldn't help her, so Gohan's planning on pitting the members of U13 against each other in the hopes that they either kill each other or get them disqualified.

P.S. I'm betting that Kakarot's a perv because Master Roshi was the last person he killed and found all of his 'reading material' after they fought.

edited 24th Mar '12 12:12:47 AM by daveshan

Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#278: Mar 24th 2012 at 7:03:28 AM

[up]Vegeta would probably be in a ego trip if he awakened his power. But that doesn't mean he would pointlessly fight his own allies who he already knows are weaker than him and that are already obeying him. It is not the same situation as Freeza at all. Remember Cell saga. When Vegeta "surpassed the Super Sayajin" (and become stronger than Cell form 2), he did went in a ego trip, but he wasn't randomly fighting Trunks or Kulilin, he was fighting Cell.

So, if Vegeta upgraded his power, his attitude would certainly changes in the matches, but not outside it. Yes, if any other Sayajin got the Mystic power, it is likely they would challenge Vegeta, but if Vegeta himself does so, the status quo would simply remain the same.

Also, why do you think awaking Pan power wouldn't help her? I would bet it would make her stronger than Kakarotto. And even if not, it would still make her a credible opponent to him, at very last (thus, making the fight more enjoyable to her).

daveshan Since: Dec, 2010
#279: Mar 24th 2012 at 10:42:49 AM

[up]

Oh, sorry. I guess I wasn't clear with what I was saying. I was thinking that the power up would go to Kakarot first. Thus resulting in a cock-fight between him and Vegeta without Vegeta getting the boost.

I said that about Pan because it doesn't appear that she trains that much in U18. U16, sure. But between Kakarot's strength, experience, ruthlessness, and Pan's lack-there-of, the power boost would have to be ridiculous for her to do well.

Kayeka (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#280: Mar 24th 2012 at 10:52:04 AM

Yeah, while DBZ seems to forget about it a tad too often, flat power isn't the only thing that determines the outcome of a fight. Experience and ruthlessness are up there as well.

Kakarot won't have much trouble with Pan, even if she did get the upgrade. So I guess that 'no killing, no sadism' is indeed the best deal she can hope for.

Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#281: Mar 24th 2012 at 11:19:01 AM

[up][up]And I am saying it is perfectly possible for Vegeta to get his power-up first. Hence why I said before you were missing a few possibilities. Actually, I find it is more probable Vegeta would have the power-up first, in fact. He is the leader, remember? It is only natural he would want to become stronger first, specially since he knows the others might defy him if they were stronger. I actually have my doubts he would allow the others to have the same power up. He was the guy who shot down the idea of breeding super half-sayajins because he didn't want other people to be stronger than him, even if they were his kin.

But between Kakarot's strength, experience, ruthlessness, and Pan's lack-there-of, the power boost would have to be ridiculous for her to do well.

That is the point. The Old Kai's power up is ridiculous. Lets ignore the canon Gohan power up, since Gohan is an special case. Lets go with Videl hypothetical Mystic form. In that fight, Videl was overheating herself with Kaioh-ken against Form 3 Cold, but was still losing, never mind against True Form Col. Regardless, Old Kai still believed she would win if he powered her up.

So, for Videl, the 'Mystic' form would boost her from below Form 3 Cold to above Full Strength Cold (way above, according to the Kai). This is very powerful. And Videl is not even a Sayajin. So, yeah, Mystic Pan would most certainly be strong enough to win SSJ Kakarotto. Probably with easy.

Also, I don't understand why you think Pan doesn't train much. Just because she is not a SSJ and use Goku's old style? She is the girl who was training with her grandpa and flying around the Earth at the age of 4. This shows more strength and dedication than any other (canon) character at such young age. Furthermore, Salagir once said he picture Goku coming back to grab Pan to train with him and Uub, so I believe this is what happened in DBM canon (meaning Pan have been training for as much as Uub). If 18!Pan is not as strong as 16!Pan is likely due to their different teachers (in the main series, Goku is said to not be the ideal trainer, since he is too soft).

(Unrelated, but now I think on it, Mystic Uub would be very powerful. It should boost him to Kid Buu's level, after all.)

daveshan Since: Dec, 2010
#282: Mar 24th 2012 at 12:06:18 PM

[up]

Videl is extremely passionate about fighting, though. Also, one way or another, she could hold her own against Cold's 3rd form, which, based on this, he's already above Frieza final form. To say that she would get strong enough to beat him from there isn't that much of an increase.

edited 24th Mar '12 12:06:36 PM by daveshan

Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#283: Mar 24th 2012 at 3:17:57 PM

[up]She was clearly losing. She even spelled it out here. She was very worn out, while Cold was barely harmed. And he hadn't transformed yet (each transformation is a huge power up, if we go by Freeza). Yes, the Mystic power up is very strong.

As for Videl being passionate about fighting... so what? Does this mean she has a hidden potential all of sudden? It is likely the opposite, actually, the more passionate you are, the closer you are to living your potential.

Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#285: Mar 25th 2012 at 12:03:27 PM

Th... they are actually furthering the Universe 6 subplot? Really? Is it some kind of illusion? Are we really about to know more about these weird girls?

Torquey Dreamworks Since: Oct, 2010
Dreamworks
#286: Mar 25th 2012 at 2:12:44 PM

[up] Remember, we've had several specials about other universes that never even explained the differences between them and the regular Dragonball universe. This should have been placed in the Bojack special.

Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#287: Mar 25th 2012 at 4:06:25 PM

"This" what? The subplot of the girls trying to destroy Bojack during the tournament? Then, no, it shouldn't be in the special. It is part of the main plot and it will likely effect how things will develop from now on. In the last 10 pages, we have seem different groups and their future plans for the tournament, probably foretelling how they will clash on each other at some point. The Universe 6 girls are a small part of the story, but are not a side material either.

Of course, if by 'this' you mean backstory for the girls and Bojack, as well as explanation for who they are. Then, yeah, you are right. In fact, I have the feeling there will be yet another Bojack special in the future, one with more relevant content. In the end, I guess Salagir didn't want to expose they quite yet. They wanted to keep the mystery more, so they couldn't 'spoil' to much in the Bojack Special. This is fine, I guess, thought I believe that, in this case, the Bojack special shouldn't have happened at all.

Torquey Dreamworks Since: Oct, 2010
Dreamworks
#288: Mar 25th 2012 at 5:21:54 PM

[up] I meant the latter.

Anyway, now we can speculate on who these mysterious ladies are (aside from obvious fanservice), and why they want to kill Bojack so badly.

wild mass guessThe women of Universe 6 are all survivors of planets destroyed by Bojack. All four have certain magical powers; Kat can use pheremones to control men, Syd can swap genders with her opponent to split their power equally, Jet can read minds, and Mai can use opponents's spirit animals against them.wild mass guess

Also, wild mass guessBuijin will eventually get sick of Bojack and join up with another universe. Zangya will stay in hell, continuing to make out with Salza ('cause they're both blue).wild mass guess

edited 25th Mar '12 5:47:56 PM by Torquey

daveshan Since: Dec, 2010
#289: Mar 27th 2012 at 9:47:28 PM

Round 2 predictions.

1. Nappa(13) vs. Frieza(8): If Frieza's going to win, he'll have to reach the 5th form. Raditz put something of a fight against Bardock as a Super Saiyan and if Nappa's better and goes into the ape form, it'll be a good one. Plus, Nappa won't likely give Frieza (who'll horribly underestimate Nappa) the chance to reach 100%.

2. Son Goku (18) vs. #17 (14): Goku won't even need to transform. Another curb stomp battle for Goku.

3. South Kaio Shin (1) vs. Majin Buu (11): Majin Buu, but only because of the regenerative powers. Remember, South Kai put up a really good fight against Kid Buu and would have won if not for the regeneration abilities.

4. Uub (18) vs. Nail (10): Uub

5. Trunks (12) vs. Vegeta (18): Vegeta after a good fight with a lot of smart alec-y retorts at one another.

6. Pan (18) vs. Kakarotto (13): Kakarot and he'll adhere to Gohan's request.

7. Cell (17) vs. Bojack (6): Not only Cell, but Cell killing him with a masenko beam as a small gift to Gohan.

8. Tapion (3) vs. Krillin (9): Close, but I'm saying Krillen.

9. Vegito (16) vs. XXI (5): If XXI is supposed to be the ultimate villain of this story, my money's on him. I'm also guessing that he's the legendary super saiyan that came before Broly.

10. #18 (14) vs. Arale (2): Arale. After all, she was able to defeat a Mary Sue character with ease. She's clearly the most powerful in the tournament. :p

11. Gotenks (18) vs. Nekomajin (2): Gotenks. We're almost through with Toriyama-verse and, with no significant addition to the story, they'll most likely all be removed soon.

12. Buu (4) vs. Tenshinhan (9): Buu, hands down.

13. Son Bra (16) vs. Eleim (19): Eleim all the way. Now that they know what they're up against, U19 won't waste time or screw around.

14. King Cold (8) vs. Bardock (3): If the fight happens at all, Bardock is the winner. If Bardock weren't going to win, he'd just forfeit ahead of time.

15. Raichi (3) vs. Vegeta (13): Vegeta

16. Gast Carcolh (2) vs. King Piccolo (3): Gast Carcolh will condemn King Piccolo for his actions and beat the snot out of him.

edited 27th Mar '12 9:49:07 PM by daveshan

Torquey Dreamworks Since: Oct, 2010
Dreamworks
#290: Mar 28th 2012 at 12:40:31 PM

BLAH

BLAH BLAH

BLIH

[up] Interesting prediction. My own predictions (I'm only adding the ones different from yours):

Nappa vs. Freeza: Honestly, I just want to see less Saiyans on the final roster. I'd like Freeza to win an honest battle.

Pan vs. Kakarrot: For some reason, I'm imagining Kakarrot telling Pan the story of how he killed Mr. Satan on Earth in an attempt to get her Super Saiyan and increase Gohan's reward, but that's just me.

#18 vs. Arale: I'd like to see #18 get her shit slapped, then yell "Stop" before Arale can knock her unconscious. Arale thanks her for a great match and forfeits, so #18 gets her mind together and joins Universe 9 (against her brother's wishes, of course, so we can get more conflict).

Buu vs. Tien: I'd really like Tien to use his four arms to fight Buu (he did use it in Dragon Ball), only for Buu to play with him. Tien eventually kills Buu, but a small piece of him lands on Tien and eventually fuses with him to make an evil Buushinhan.

Raichi vs. Vegeta: I'm guessing Raichi will use Hichiack (?) to kill Vegeta, using Vegeta's merciless execution of Syd as justification.

Gast vs. Picollo: Gast fuses with Picollo to become Super Saiyan 3 level. A little more evil, though. But he regains his senses later.

edited 28th Mar '12 12:53:27 PM by Torquey

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#291: Mar 28th 2012 at 8:35:05 PM

[up]

Was the Blih part in that new page a nod to HFIL in the original dub?

Or just something random.

One Strip! One Strip!
Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#292: Mar 28th 2012 at 9:20:18 PM

[up]Something random, I would guess. They are French, after all, I doubt they are familiar with the English dub.

daveshan Since: Dec, 2010
#293: Mar 28th 2012 at 10:31:50 PM

[up][up][up]

I'm at a toss up about who I want to win Frieza v. Nappa. On the one hand, we do need less Saiyans. On the other, I'm a sucker for the underdog characters and would like to see Nappa get some real credit. Also Frieza and honest fight are like oil and a house on fire. Try to mix them and it'll only get worse.

I was actually joking about 18 v. Arlae. I expect 18 to win.

Gast will curb stomp King Piccalo. I think the pressure will be on him to face XXI once Vegetto loses.

Alucard Lazy? from Vancouver, BC Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Torquey Dreamworks Since: Oct, 2010
Dreamworks
#295: Mar 30th 2012 at 12:33:37 PM

[up] My prediction: The Ginyu Force, back in Freeza's universe, failed to stop Broly (I guess) from destroying the capital of Freeza's empire. Freeza is about to execute Ginyu when something happens, distracting Freeza and allowing Ginyu to switch bodies with Guldo (apparently, the comic's writers forgot about him). He switched from Guldo to Vegito off-panel, which is the reason he beat Cooler up.

Still, surprised they aren't taking an entire chapter to show the glories of the Frost Demon empire in another special. They must be learning.

Also, is it me or is Burter wearing a helmet?

Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#296: Mar 30th 2012 at 4:08:05 PM

[up]We have yet to see a special chapter to tell anything which actually have consequence in the main story. So far, all special are only consequence-less backstory. So, I don't think it is a matter of 'learning' and more that this have been planned that way since the beginning. In fact, I beleive the specials itself are a consequence of this manga popularity (which allow them, among other things, to find the guest artists) and not something planned from the get go.

So, yeah, I think we will get a special about the glories of the Frost Demons empire at some point. Which is not necessarily a bad thing. The divergence here is more than 'villain win and kill the heroes', it seems, so it won't likely to be as bad as Cell's and Bojack's special.

As for Butter, I it is just the shape of his head. See this image for a comparison.

edited 30th Mar '12 4:09:45 PM by Heatth

Torquey Dreamworks Since: Oct, 2010
Dreamworks
#297: Mar 30th 2012 at 6:44:27 PM

[up] Huh. Always though he just had that yellow thing as his hair.

Anyway, who is he carrying?

Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#298: Mar 30th 2012 at 7:20:40 PM

That yellow thing may still be his "hair". What does his head shape have to do with it?

As for who he is carrying, Jeece perhaps? It has the right size, I think. And he is the only Ginyu Force member missing on that image (apart from Guldo, who haven't appeared in the main story).

edited 30th Mar '12 7:21:03 PM by Heatth

daveshan Since: Dec, 2010
#299: Mar 30th 2012 at 7:53:41 PM

You know, he might be talking about Gohan. After all, it stands to reason that a small change could've resulted in Porunga not transporting everyone off Namek, thus Goku doesn't go all-out, thus Frieza wins. After Frieza wins, he captures Gohan to try to find out why such a young boy could have so much power.


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