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lavendermintrose (Long Runner) Relationship Status: One True Dodecahedron
#3551: Oct 2nd 2023 at 10:33:26 AM

So I was searching for posts online about Cesare Borgia and I just randomly found a person who's trying to locate swords that he owned, and that person posted something from Nightmare of Nunnally where an inscription from one of Cesare's swords shows up.

Which is interesting considering that there's a character in that manga whose name is Caterina Sforza.

I read it in high school, and I honestly don't remember anything about it, other than that there was a character with the exact same name as a character in Trinity Blood. I knew absolutely nothing about the historical figure at that point.

But now that I'm, um, kind of obsessed with the Renaissance, and especially Cesare (side note — if there's a manga you should definitely read, it's this one), I feel like I need to rewatch/reread both of those.

Update: The Geass musical, was... well. The kind of thing people are thinking of when they say "XYZ should never be made into a musical". Which is sad, because it has so much potential. In a world where the Cesare musical exists, this should have been so much better.

But Akazawa Ryotaro just really loves Suzaku, and he was just so excited to be playing his favorite character, and he's so cute, and like... that makes up for a lot. (He was one of the main characters in Cesare, I don't think I'd have seen Geamyu if not for him.)

Also, the ensemble played basically all the characters who weren't listed/given full costumes. The same person played Viletta, Chiba, Nina, Sayoko, and like three more people.

Oh also, I saw Geamyu and Anastasia on the same day. That was interesting.

Oh and I'm actually writing a fanfic about Lelouch and Cesare, it's here if you're interested.

Edited by lavendermintrose on Oct 3rd 2023 at 2:34:40 AM

darksidevoid Anti-Gnosis Weapon from The Frontiers (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Anti-Gnosis Weapon
#3552: Dec 3rd 2023 at 6:15:31 PM

Important update: We'll finally be getting more info about Z of the Recapture on the 18th!

GM: AGOG S4 & F/WC RP; Co-GM: TABA, SOTR, UUA RP; Sub-GM: TTS RP. I have brought peace, freedom, justice, and security to my new Empire.
dRoy Professional Writer & Amateur Scholar from Most likely from my study Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: I'm just high on the world
Professional Writer & Amateur Scholar
#3553: Dec 5th 2023 at 7:41:09 PM

Huh, what do you know.

My country's equivalent of Crunchyroll - which sadly isn't available here and I refuse to watch anime on Netflix unless it's made by them - actually started to release Code Geass episodes.

Sadly, though, they are only releasing two episodes every week and so far 14 episodes are out. Given my anime consumption habit, I know I will probably burn through all of them within 3, 4 days at most so I'm still patiently waiting for at least halfway through the season 2 to be released. [lol]

Continuously reading, studying, and (hopefully) growing.
Nachtwandler Since: Dec, 2014
#3555: Dec 19th 2023 at 1:45:32 AM

[up] To avoid any confusion, it will be 4 movies (not clear yet, though, if they will be a short ones like Akito or longer).

theLibrarian Since: Jul, 2009
#3556: Dec 19th 2023 at 9:00:02 AM

So is that Lost Stories game available in the West?

theLibrarian Since: Jul, 2009
#3558: Dec 19th 2023 at 12:13:00 PM

Cool. Is it like a gacha game? I'd imagine so, but not sure.

Also cool that it's sort of a strategy game instead of an FGO-style "RPG" thing.

darksidevoid Anti-Gnosis Weapon from The Frontiers (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Anti-Gnosis Weapon
#3559: Dec 19th 2023 at 12:44:26 PM

Correct. It's a gacha, and if you're at all familiar with Arknights, it's like that. Sort of tower defense.

GM: AGOG S4 & F/WC RP; Co-GM: TABA, SOTR, UUA RP; Sub-GM: TTS RP. I have brought peace, freedom, justice, and security to my new Empire.
theLibrarian Since: Jul, 2009
#3560: Dec 19th 2023 at 1:29:34 PM

Ah, I was expecting more an SRW-style "put unit here against other unit, they fight" thing. That's what it looked like in the App Store video at least.

Since Arknights if I recall correctly is Tower Defense instead.

darksidevoid Anti-Gnosis Weapon from The Frontiers (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Anti-Gnosis Weapon
#3561: Dec 19th 2023 at 1:45:14 PM

Yep, Lost Stories is basically tower defense, but if a boss unit encounters one of your ground units, they engage in a zoomed-in duel where you can use skills and such.

Edited by darksidevoid on Dec 19th 2023 at 4:45:34 AM

GM: AGOG S4 & F/WC RP; Co-GM: TABA, SOTR, UUA RP; Sub-GM: TTS RP. I have brought peace, freedom, justice, and security to my new Empire.
HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#3563: Jan 7th 2024 at 8:00:26 PM

I've started watching this. On the whole it's really good, though some bits I find hard to follow because of all the dark secrets and double- and triple-crosses. It's kinda like Pirates of the Caribbean in that respect.

As an example, I just made it to the stadium massacre, and while harrowing I can't for the life of me figure out what happened. Lelouch opposes Euphy creating the Autonomous Zone, even though he knows she isn't lying and it seems like the best solution for everyone? And then his Geass goes haywire at the exact moment he says a bizarrely specific thing that causes her to start the massacre?

Also there's a creepy kid with a creepy grin living in an underground temple. "HELLO, I AM THE ACTUAL BAD GUY."

KuroBaraHime ☆♥☆ Since: Jan, 2011
☆♥☆
#3564: Jan 7th 2024 at 8:45:54 PM

Lelouch wasn't opposed to Euphy's plan for any noble reason. He was opposed because her plan would effectively neuter the Black Knights and put a halt to his plans. As Lelouch outright explains to C.C. to one of the earlier episodes, he's made sure to make the Black Knights look publicly like the most upstanding and reasonable force vying for control by doing things like fighting criminal organizations and other terrorist groups that were killing civilians, and generally presenting a message of being protectors of the weak.

By their own messaging of being heroes who just hate Britannia because they're bullies and not for nationalistic reasons, they should be all for Euphy's Autonomous Zone plan - something that seems like a viable solution to peacefully give rights and control back to the native Japanese population, under the supervision of the most beloved and trusted Britannian royal by said population. But in actuality, Lelouch plans to eventually use the Black Knights stage a coup against the Britannian government and take control of Japan, and he just wants as much of the population to be on board with that as possible.

So that puts the Black Knights in a very precarious position. If Zero and the Black Knights publicly give their support to Euphemia and assist in the Autonomous Zone, they're completely defanged because they'll be effectively working for the Britannian government now. But if Zero and the Black Knights stay silent or worse publicly oppose the Autonomous Zone, then they lose their moral high ground and with it the good will and political capital Lelouch was hoping to use to get people to support an eventual coup. Even many of the Black Knights' own members were already voicing support and questioning if the organization had a future.

So without even realizing it, Euphemia had put Lelouch in check. He had no good option to continue his plans. And prince Schneizel was completely aware of this, which is why he was giving Euphy his support and resources to get the project off the ground against opposition from other more supremacist members of the Britannian royalty and government.

That's why he came up with the plan of getting alone with Euphy, geassing her into (non-fatally) shooting him, and then running out and claiming the whole thing was just a trap to kill Zero and the Black Knights. It would get allow him to reveal the whole thing as a sham (even though it really isn't) and turn public opinion against the plan and Euphemia, not only getting Lelouch out of the situation but even making public opinion of Britannia even worse and helping his plans of getting people to support overthrowing them.

He ended up not going through with the plan due to getting distracted by his Geass acting up and Euphy's own persuasion, and so admitted defeat and agreed to support her even if it ruined his current plans for revenge against Britannia. But then his Geass went haywire just as he said a hypothetical example that was basically a more extreme version of his plan, and everything went to shit.

HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#3565: Jan 7th 2024 at 8:58:10 PM

[up] Thank you. So his objection to her plan was just another expression of his Revenge Before Reason tendencies. Thought that’s what it was but wasn’t sure.

Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Pet Owner
#3566: Jan 7th 2024 at 9:58:23 PM

Euphy's reputation was never the same poor girl...

Just Makima.
RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#3567: Jan 7th 2024 at 11:45:21 PM

Best Lelouch could do was cause so much bloodshed during their time as Emperor that Euphemia's relatively small massacre becomes a historical footnote.

HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#3568: Jan 8th 2024 at 9:14:39 PM

Huh, I just learned there's a Code Geass video game where you can get a non-standard GOOD ending by simply agreeing with Euphy's plan immediately.

KuroBaraHime ☆♥☆ Since: Jan, 2011
☆♥☆
#3569: Jan 8th 2024 at 9:50:02 PM

Yeah, that's the DS RPG. It gives you a lot of dialogue options for Lelouch where one is always the canon option he says in the anime, and the others either slightly off or gives you a Non-Standard Game Over. Including bluntly stupid options like having Lelouch randomly admit he's Zero to another student or command someone he's Geassed them into shooting him for no reason. The most darkly hilarious one being when Lelouch finds C.C. hanging out with Nunnally, you can have him introduce her as Nunnally's new mom and that causes Nunnally to freak out and immediately zoom her wheelchair to a nearby window and fling herself to her death.

After Euphy makes her declaration you can choose in a conversation with C.C. to have Lelouch agree to work with her, and you'll get a game over/ending where Lelouch narrates that as he expected the Black Knights were neutered and had no more reason to exist working with the Autonomous Zone so have been disbanded, but Lelouch hasn't given up on getting revenge and already has new schemes to infiltrate Britannia and find out who killed his mother.

In the same vein, the visual novel Lost Colors which stars an original character named Rai has multiple full endings on several of the story routes where Rai catches Euphy just as she's about to commit the massacre uses his own Geass to cancel out the one Lelouch put on her, leading to happy endings where the Autonomous Zone goes well and Rai lives happily with whatever character you had the most points with. In fact, those are the only happy endings in the game, the others are bittersweet or downers.

HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#3570: Jan 8th 2024 at 9:59:39 PM

[up] That sounds like a delightfully complex game!

OmegaRadiance Since: Jun, 2011
#3571: Jan 8th 2024 at 10:49:06 PM

Still tickles me that the Granblue Fantasy Code Geass event ended with Lelouch, C.C., Nunally, Suzaku, Kallen, and Jeremiah permanently Isekai’d to the Sky Realm.

Now with their own personal pizza store they run!

Even funnier the OC villain of the event is basically just Female Rolo who succeeded at Murder the Hypotenuse. Everything from being a Tykebomb from the same cult and attached to the older sibling. And considering V.V. tried to murder Lelouch mom out of jealously the Cult really is just a hotbed of emotionally needy Tykebombs and vile Mad Scientist.

Edited by OmegaRadiance on Jan 8th 2024 at 10:50:34 AM

Every accusation by the GOP is ALWAYS a confession.
lavendermintrose (Long Runner) Relationship Status: One True Dodecahedron
#3572: Jan 9th 2024 at 6:30:39 AM

[up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up]"So without even realizing it, Euphemia had put Lelouch in check."

She did realize it, though. She said as much. And she knew that Zero was motivated by hatred of the imperial family. That was how she figured out that Lelouch was Zero.

But wow, reading it all written out like that makes me realize how extremely Cesare-like that is. (Again, if you like Code Geass, I highly recommend Cesare - Il Creatore che ha distrutto.) I'm actually writing this fanfic where Cesare took C.C.'s code back in 1507, so Cesare ends up being the immortal who gives Lelouch his geass.

One thing I noticed again, or connected, when I saw the musical, is how when Lulu sees both Suzaku and Euphie again, as Zero, (in episode 4 (when Lulu tells Suzaku "Don't be an idiot!" and then the focus shifts to Suzaku and he says "An old friend used to tell me that," on some level, right there, he knows.) and episode 8, for Euphie), in both cases for what he worries will be the last time, he says too much and both of them figure out right away that it's him. On some level, some part of him, the part that knows his Machiavelli by heart, knows better... but he can't help himself because he loves them, and he's just a 17-year-old kid. It's so sad.

I think the musical had a lot more SuzaEuphie scenes than the anime or any of the side stories than I remember, at least, since it was from Suzaku's point of view (it basically just felt like, "Hey, this popular actor really likes Suzaku, if we have him play Suzaku people will buy tickets" but honestly, just watching him overflow with love for these characters was worth it.)

Anyway, Suzaku and Euphie, like... there's this audio drama that takes place shortly after the invasion, where Euphie says she got a letter from Lelouch that mentioned Suzaku, so she knows when she meets Suzaku that Suzaku was friends with Lelouch. And Suzaku knows that Euphie is Lulu's sister, and they were so close, Lulu must have mentioned her. So when they start talking to each other and becoming friends, they both really want to ask each other about Lelouch. But at the same time, they both know (even though Suzaku's denial is stronger than Euphie's), that Lelouch is Zero. But they know just from the feeling in that one short conversation, with this masked man who's committed murder, who could have murdered either of them there, so of course they were afraid.

And to say, "Yeah, Zero's scary, but guess what, I think that under that mask, he's actually my childhood friend who's also 17 and supposedly dead... oh, and by the way, this dead kid that I'm accusing of the most severe terrorism is actually an imperial prince..."

But even though they know they can't just say that, they both just know.

And neither of them can mention Lelouch to the other without having to confront that knowledge.

And neither of them wants to put Lelouch in danger by exposing him, even if he is Zero. Because they both love him, too, even if he is Zero.

Just... I just felt all of that hanging in the air over Suzaku and Euphie in the musical, and it was so sad.

[up][up][up] Okay, it's nice that the game says Lulu has other plans after that, but I'd like to see those plans... I mean, I guess that much is up to fanfic writers...

—- Oh! One more thought about the scene between Suzaku and Lelouch in episode 4. So, I haven't really done a real analysis of this, and I've never actually read Death Note, (started 2003) but I did watch the musical, just because I like musicals, and like. I'm assuming that the opening song "Where is the justice?" reflects a scene in the manga.

When I saw the Geass musical, with Akazawa Ryotaro, who had played Angelo in Cesare, as Suzaku, this idea just flashed in my mind...

So, in Death Note, we have these students in a modern classroom who feel powerless against the forces of society, talking about "justice", and debating what it means, and setting up a theme that will be played out over the series once Light gets the Death Note. Also worth noting that L has not entered the picture yet, L is not in Light's class, no one in the class is a match for Light, and Light is essentially debating with himself (the musical essentially has the class as his backup chorus, don't know how the manga is, whether they back him up or they don't care, or what).

Then there's Cesare (manga started 2005), and the debate scene between Cesare and Angelo in the Dante lecture (this scene might have been '06 or '07). It's 1491, Cesare Borgia is 16 years old and still a student, but he's already a powerful political agent. He transferred to that school essentially on a mission to get the two cardinals around there to vote for his dad to become pope. And he's not the only politically powerful student in the class. One of those cardinals is in the class, too, Giovanni de'Medici (yes, those Medici, and Giovanni later becomes pope himself). Angelo is a commoner, and as a commoner from Florence, he's supposed to be quiet and suck up to Giovanni, but he's too nerdy for that. He can't help but get into a debate with Cesare when they disagree on a point — without getting into any more medieval Italian politics, Angelo thinks that the people should have — could have — risen up to stop some unjust action that Dante wrote about, and Cesare thinks it wasn't wrong, but prudent and wise, of the people to have saved their energy and preserved order. I feel like quoting it can't be avoided.

Angelo: So do you think the people should just roll over and entrust their fate to someone else?
Cesare: It all depends on whether or not they can get a good leader.
Angelo: And do you think you have what it takes to be that leader?
Cesare: That's not for me to decide, that's for God to decide.

... which is Renaissance for, "I'm trying".

It sounds tyrannical, yet Angelo has already seen enough of Cesare to know that he cares, and that he does want to make a better world. It's complicated.

(In case anyone doesn't know, Cesare is The Prince that Machiavelli was writing about. He's also the bad guy in Assassin's Creed, but that's... not a very accurate portrayal of him.)

And then we have the scene between Suzaku and Lelouch in episode 4 (2006), after Lelouch rescues Suzaku, where Suzaku decided to turn himself in anyway. They're still teenagers, but they're not in a classroom. They're having this debate for the sake of the practical actions they're taking, putting their lives on the line, right now.

I just like the idea of putting these scenes up against each other... if anyone knows Death Note well, please correct me. Thank you.

Edited by lavendermintrose on Jan 9th 2024 at 11:57:14 PM

HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#3573: Jan 12th 2024 at 12:47:49 PM

S2, episode 7. Lelouch gets lolnope'd by the Special Zone plan again, this time by the one person he can't say no to! Take the hint, kid; you keep getting Out-Gambitted by excessive niceness! [lol]

The-Azure-Star-Of-Orion Long time lurker from a deep dark hole Since: Mar, 2022 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Long time lurker
#3574: Jan 13th 2024 at 8:46:01 AM

[up]fortunately he has a lolnope plan for it as well and it's pretty funny.

After 10 year plus years I have the confidence to be here. My one and only Fate servent.
HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#3575: Jan 13th 2024 at 8:04:50 PM

For someone so smart, Lulu's fucking dense sometimes. Shirley dies as a direct result of his violent recklessness, and as a result he... becomes even more reckless and violent, which he actually seems to think will honor her!


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