This is the thread for discussion of The Order of the Stick plot, characters, etc. We have a separate thread
for discussing game rules and mechanics. Excessive rules discussions here may be thumped as off-topic.
OP edited to make this header - Fighteer
edited 18th Sep '17 1:08:08 PM by Fighteer
I'm thrilled to finally have this actually brought up in the comic so people can stop speculating that Malack, because he's an evil creature of pure evil, considers his promise to Durkon completed by letting Belkar go and is now free to murder the Order as soon as he sees them.
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.I've only supported that idea because my impression was that Malack himself implied as much (he calls letting Belkar go "My final token to the Durkon that was"). It is very nice though that he actually followed the spirit and not just the words of his promise.
I will note though that weighing against raising the alarm in this strip were dual considerations of honoring his promise to Durkon and spiting Nale, and consideration two is pretty big.
edited 21st Jun '13 10:44:17 AM by Hodor
Edit, edit, edit, edit the wikiAlso, he has nothing to gain by instigating a fight with the Order, given that he believes the Gate not to be here.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"Even if Roy blows up the Gate and the Order ends up surviving, it's going to be difficult for them to get to the last one. They have no spellcasters left, they're stuck in the middle of a desert and two different groups of antagonists could show up at any time (Tarquin could probably see through this double-bluff).
Now would be the perfect time for V to show up. Even with banned Conjuration, if they have Limited Wish they could bypass that restriction and get out via Teleport. I don't see any other way for them to get out, really. Even Shojo can't help with such long-range, precise transportation, barring some high-level clerics.
Also, narrative demands that V admits/reveals their sin to Roy and the rest of the Order when they finally meet up again. I'm really looking forward to the next few strips, hehe.
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I have considered the possibility that Malack might suspect that the Gate was there, but I remember in one comic (where he was chatting with V and Durkon) Malack displayed the same kind of arrogance that seems to be endemic of magic users in the OOTS universe, so he probably wouldn't have considered that the Gate could be there, once magic showed him that it "wasn't".
Now Tarquin on the other hand.... Like some on the Giant forums, I kind of wonder if his real plan banked on the Order finding the Gate. Note that Nale has a history of failure, and Tarquin would have to know that Malack would do everything possible to sabotage him while nominally following his orders (and might actually try to frag him if the opportunity arose).
edited 21st Jun '13 11:06:58 AM by Hodor
Edit, edit, edit, edit the wikiHmm.
Tarquin was secretly following Nale's group. He is, of course, not truly allied with Nale. His plan was to allow Nale and the Order to fight it out and then swoop in and finish off the victor. Nale's retreat has thrown a wrench into that plan, but it still means he's in a perfect position to interrupt Roy's destruction of the gate and therefore set up a final battle type thing.
I think he won't destroy the gate. Tarquin or someone will show up.
Xycon & co. shows up, they start a fight, the Order begins losing, then Tarquin arrives and helps them destroy the gate and exit.
I can't shake a nagging feeling that the Order is going to be traveling to Kraagor's Gate in the company of Tarquin and Malack.
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.Keep in mind that not revealing the Order is there satisfies Malack's desires on multiple levels. He gets to keep his promise to Durkon, screw with Nale, and (potentially) hasten their return to the Empire of Blood. With that logic, there was never any doubt about what he would do.
Expergiscēre cras, medior quam hodie. (Awaken tomorrow, better than today.)
Don't forget he also has nothing to gain and risks Durkula being destroyed and taken to be Resurrected.
I don't think Tarquin's been twiddling his thumbs all this time. Seeing Xykon pop up at the Gate just as Roy goes to destroy it, then Tarquin bursting in and maybe even the Guild returning would make for a nice three/four-way battle scene. Bonus points if the Order ignore Xykon, thinking he's an illusion.
edited 21st Jun '13 12:43:29 PM by LogicDragon
I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that.Belkar volunteers to remain behind and destroy the gate after the others have gotten to a safe distance.
1: Barring reuniting with V and pulling some magical solution out of thin air, someone is going to die destroying this thing.
2: Belkar is so weak from Con-drain he can barely run, and if the party runs into either the Guild or Xykon on the way out, he's dead meat anyway.
3: His comment about hurting people after snapping Roy out of his Heroic BSoD (and to a lesser extent, his personal illusion) indicates he's ready to be a team player for real. Bonus points if he says anything about doing this out of respect for Durkon.
4: A Heroic Sacrifice led to by circumstances outside of his control and dictated by logic is a pretty good cap on his character arc.
The main thing holding me back from being sure at this point is that it's still pretty soon after Durkon's death, and two permanent main character deaths in one storyline might be too much. Granted, Durkon could be brought back in the future, but the team doesn't have the resources for it or any leads on where to get them, and the narrative seems to insist that Durkula at least reach the dwarven homelands. Then again, have we considered the possibility of Durkon rejoining the Order after Malack turns him free-willed?
[edit] Oh, and considering that it appears to have taken upwards of 3 hours for the Guild to catch up to the Order from the top of the pyramid, I'm not really expecting the Guild to come back before they've made a decision about the gate.
My bet is that Xykon will show up just as Tarquin finishes explain to Nale what an idiot he is, and the two groups will fight. Nale will probably run away either to try and take the gate for his own while the bigger bads are duking it out, or just run away, knowing how powerful Xykon is, but will be killed either by the Order if he goes for the gate, or by Durkula if he tries to escape; Malack will have ordered Durkula to take Nale out (adding a bit of poetry that he would have his revenge for Nale killing his children by having him killed by Durkula) before escaping back to the Empire of Blood with instructions on how to turn himself free-willed. The Order will slip out past them, and Belkar will destroy the gate shortly after, ending Xykon and Tarquin's fight prematurely. This could end in either Tarquin's death, or Tarquin joining forces with Xykon. If Malack is killed in the battle, Durkula rejoins the Order after becoming free-willed.
edited 21st Jun '13 12:54:47 PM by Wryte
I can see this. While it is soon after Durkon's death, we've also had it hammered in repeatedly recently that Belkar's clock has just about run out.
I just can't believe Elan managed to restrain himself from saying "Dun dun DUUUNH!" after that final panel. Now that's Character Development.
That just makes me want to see Belkar and Miko tormenting each other in the afterlife, even though it's impossible given that she's not evil enough and he's not good enough.
For the record, isn't destroying the gate pretty stupid? Xykon can just immediately teleport to the next gate at any moment. Letting Xykon have this one and retreating while he prepares it gives them the same opportunity to call in reinforcements, except without the danger of blowing up the world by accident. And if Xykon teleports to the next gate, they lose even more of the initiative since they'd need to find the next gate all over again.
Keep in mind that they only reason they're ahead of Xykon in the first place is because Redcloak decided to stop and play Civilization, something which Xykon is explicitly sick of.
edited 21st Jun '13 3:34:44 PM by Clarste
Xykon has the halfling's diary (can't remember her name...). Which is how he know where any of the gates are. And apparently it's more accurate than what Soon knew.
The last gate was also the one whose defenses were built by said halfling, so it probably contains details on that too. I believe it's supposed to be guarded by high level magic beasts. And the halfling's likely still alive too.
edited 21st Jun '13 3:45:23 PM by Clarste
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You forgot one important thing- O'Chul did exactly the same thing with Soon's gate and Hinjo admitted that it was a better option than to let Xykon seize it
considering the fact that Xykon only need control of one gate in order to be able to control the Snarl, and thus the world.
edited 21st Jun '13 3:48:09 PM by KSonik
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Hinjo is omniscient now? Good to know. Plus, the situation is different? There's an army of hobgoblins and the huge fortress that is Azure City that naturally makes it harder to reclaim the gate? As opposed to an empty pyramid with all the traps already triggered. Also, keep in mind that the series started with Xykon in control of a gate and not much happened.
edited 21st Jun '13 3:57:32 PM by Clarste

Like I said, I think "he sees them" is the most likely end result. It's just that things like Girl Genius get me into thinking about twisty little
passagesplots (if not all alike).edited 21st Jun '13 10:25:09 AM by Nohbody
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