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This is the thread for discussion of The Order of the Stick plot, characters, etc. We have a separate thread for discussing game rules and mechanics. Excessive rules discussions here may be thumped as off-topic.

OP edited to make this header - Fighteer

edited 18th Sep '17 1:08:08 PM by Fighteer

Kayeka (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#53001: Apr 7th 2020 at 2:33:50 AM

It's not as if they wouldn't be digging up the monsters along with the Gate.

crazysamaritan NaNo 4328 / 50,000 from Lupin III Since: Apr, 2010
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#53004: Apr 7th 2020 at 11:36:00 AM

You’re right, it doesn’t make sense for a simple sacrifice to be what’s required to access the gate, requiring a willing sacrifice however might lock out most evil groups, especially if there’s no bringing back such a person.

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HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#53005: Apr 7th 2020 at 12:13:45 PM

Maybe a willing sacrifice of the strongest member of your party, or the one you can least afford to lose.

So in the case of Team Evil, either Redcloak (who would want to avoid it since then he can't finish the plan) or Xykon (since he has no desire to die any time soon).

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fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#53006: Apr 7th 2020 at 12:23:16 PM

It's not like it would be that much of an inconvenience for Xykon to die. He's already undead and has a way to come back.

Edit: Plus, losing the strongest member of your team isn't really a problem when you can bring them back to life in ten or twenty minutes. "Hey, I need you to do a solid but don't worry, you'll be back in 5."

Edited by fredhot16 on Apr 7th 2020 at 3:39:13 AM

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FuzzyBoots from Outlying borough of Pittsburgh (there's a lot of Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
#53007: Apr 7th 2020 at 1:01:59 PM

If it's a matter of a sacrifice, I could see it simply being a significant willing sacrifice, not one of people. So the evil people won't think to give up a non-selfish sacrifice, but the good guys could make a substantial donation of a magic item, or a photograph of their departed mother, and it counts. In an emergency, they're perfectly willing to give up a valuable possession, but they you're not in a state of attrition where you have to keep killing off your top allies to get in.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#53008: Apr 7th 2020 at 1:03:57 PM

I can't imagine the Gate requiring a sacrifice to access, willing or not. It goes back to that point made earlier that either Serini would want to be able to access it herself or she wouldn't want it to be accessible at all, period.

If she put a lock on the door, that means she intends the door to be opened. It means that she wants the door's contents to be found, either by her or by someone else. With that in mind, I see little value in putting a blood sacrifice on the lock. Certainly Serini herself, if she were of a mind to want to be able to access the Gate, wouldn't want to have to kill someone every time she opens the door.

What kind of hideously evil person would create a door that only opens by murder? And no, "willing sacrifice" doesn't fix it. It changes it from "Door only opens by murder" to "Door only opens by murdering good people, specifically".

The Order of the Scribble, I remind y'all, were good guys. They may not have all gotten along with one another very well, but they were heroes in their own right.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Apr 7th 2020 at 2:10:06 AM

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DeMarquis (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#53009: Apr 7th 2020 at 4:29:31 PM

The only one who can access the gate... is one who does not wish to access the gate.

Seriously, though, it's in the diary.

I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#53010: Apr 7th 2020 at 5:04:58 PM

It can't be in the diary. Short of the ritual that the Dark One taught Redcloak, the Gates can't be moved. Serini's diary is entirely portable.

If you could just pick up a Gate and carry it to wherever you wanted, Xykon wouldn't even have been brought into the Dark One's plan in the first place.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Apr 7th 2020 at 6:05:37 AM

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thok That's Dr. Title, thank you! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Non-Canon
That's Dr. Title, thank you!
#53011: Apr 7th 2020 at 9:43:36 PM

My guess for the trick is that Haley's Exact Words are correct. As she said "I'd bet ten gold that they already search every inch of that chasm before they started picking doors at random, and came up empty".

Of course, there's no reason for the gate to be in the chasm. I still think the best use of dramatic irony would be that the gate was near the mountain lookout that O-Chul and Lien were using to spy on the chasm, but my track record suggests that's wrong.

blkwhtrbbt The Dragon of the Eastern Sea from Doesn't take orders from Vladimir Putin Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
The Dragon of the Eastern Sea
#53012: Apr 7th 2020 at 11:16:24 PM

I think that great big chasm might just BE the gate? was it always there?

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M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#53014: Apr 8th 2020 at 1:08:31 AM

My wild mass guess is that the diary itself is also needed to access the Gate.

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tricksterson Never Trust from Behind you with an icepick Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Never Trust
#53015: Apr 8th 2020 at 5:14:17 AM

[up][up]Joking or not you might have a point. What if all the doors are an exercise in misdirection?

Edited by tricksterson on Apr 8th 2020 at 8:15:17 AM

Trump delenda est
Wryte Since: Jul, 2010
#53016: Apr 8th 2020 at 6:16:27 AM

That

That's what's been being discussed for pages.

DeMarquis (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#53017: Apr 8th 2020 at 6:57:44 AM

Tsk. I meant the clue is in the diary. As opposed to being the inscription on the statue.

I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.
Elfive (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#53018: Apr 8th 2020 at 7:05:50 AM

Maybe each dungeon has a switch hidden somewhere. You need to go in and activate a particular sequence of them to unlock the gate.

DeMarquis (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#53019: Apr 8th 2020 at 7:08:30 AM

Maybe cleared dungeons need to form a smiley on the cliff wall.

I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.
Noaqiyeum we must dissent (it/they) from across the gulf of space (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
we must dissent (it/they)
#53020: Apr 8th 2020 at 7:39:45 AM

I stand by my guess that the gate is in a chamber that none of the dungeons connect to and you have to map them all in order to figure out where to dig.

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TheLovecraftian Since: Jul, 2017
#53021: Apr 8th 2020 at 8:01:24 AM

I will maintain that "Sacrifice Forgotten" has some secondary meaning. Especially seen as it's exactly the kind of thing that both Xykon and Redcloak would completely fail to consider.

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#53022: Apr 8th 2020 at 8:05:14 AM

At the very least, I think we can assume the defenses aren't super magical in nature, since neither Kraagor nor Serini were magically inclined. At least any magical defenses wouldn't be customized like Dorukan's Cloister and Girard's illusions.

Kayeka (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#53023: Apr 8th 2020 at 10:25:35 AM

Well, the self-replenishing monster gauntlets are pretty magical in nature.

Gilphon (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#53024: Apr 8th 2020 at 10:29:50 AM

I don't think the monsters are magically self-replenishing. I think they're just self-replenishing in the way that mundane animals are.

Like, that's why Oona is helping them. To ensure that they don't just kill all the monsters and therefore prevent the caves from replenishing.

Edited by Gilphon on Apr 8th 2020 at 2:01:33 PM

thok That's Dr. Title, thank you! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Non-Canon
That's Dr. Title, thank you!
#53025: Apr 8th 2020 at 11:39:09 AM

Maybe the door is where the statue is looking at.

I get that this is a joke, but if I understand the geography of the area, the statue isn't looking at the doors, but in the direction of the mountain lookout where O-chul and Lien were watching from.


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