Follow TV Tropes


Headscratchers / Percy Jackson and the Olympians

Go To

    open/close all folders 

     Athena's birth 
  • This counts for actual Greek mythology as well but Athena's mother was supposed to have a child stronger then the father, but Athena is always said to be weaker than the big three. Why is that? Did Zeus "technically" give birth to Athena so it doesn't count?
    • Some versions say that Metis, Athena's mom, was supposed to give birth originally to two children, of which the second, the son, would be the one to surpass his father.
    • The myths about "a child stronger than the father" generally specified that the kid had to be a boy. So if Metis had a son, he would've been stronger than his father, but as a daughter, Athena wasn't seen as a threat to her father. (The same issue cropped up with Thetis, a Nereid who Zeus had his eye on until he heard about the prophecy. She was married to a mortal named Peleus instead, and became the mother of the hero Achilles).
      • Also, recall that Cronus swallowed all of his children, regardless of gender, even though he was explicitly told that it would be a son that would overthrow him (and to be fair, he only swallowed Hestia after learning she was a goddess, not a Titan; he was actually willing to be a good father up until that point). Zeus was told of a similar prophecy by Metis, but since he didn't know how many kids Metis was carrying, he swallowed her anyways before he could conceive any more kids with her. It's possible that said son would've been the first member of a new divine race.

     Godly DNA 
  • So gods not passing on DNA means that there aren't any cases of kissing cousins at camp. But doesn't this mean that it's the mortal parent they should worry about? Sharing a divine parent should mean the equivilant of not being related by blood because they really aren't.
    • The gods have to have something that substitutes as DNA for them - they still have organs, genitals, and golden blood, after all. The "having no mortal DNA" technicality is only used to cover the dating of half-bloods with different godly parents, since most of the gods are so different from each other it's nearly impossible to tell they're related, so two children of the same god dating is still seen as a taboo.
  • In the Demigod Diaries, Luke and Thalia are living rough, battling monsters and just trying to stay alive. They don't know about Camp Half-blood, but somehow, Luke knows that they're demigods. OK, so that can be explained when he mentions having met other demigods in his years on the run; presumably somebody explained to him what he is at some point. And OK, that could explain why he knows about Celestial Bronze. But how, HOW, does he know that he's a son of Hermes, specifically? And that Thalia is a daughter of Zeus? Considering that there are kids at the camp that have no idea who their godly parent is, how could two demigods on the run know? Even if they had been officially claimed, who would know what the symbols over their head even meant? Then, OK, so they know *about* Celestial bronze via word of mouth from other outlaw demigods, but how in the world did they GET any? Luke and Thalia have safe houses scattered about that are stocked with, among other things, caches of Celestial bronze weapons. This just doesn't work out. If there's some logical, in-universe explaination for why Luke and Thalia know who they are (or who they're from)AND where they got not just one or two CB weapons but entire caches' worth, it needs to be spelled out, because otherwise it just leaves the reader confused.
    • Lukes mother knew. she probably told him. as for Thalia I think her mother told her too. Especially considering what we find out about Thalia's mother in Heroes of Olympus.
      • Luke’s mother was talking to him about him being a demi-god. That’s what scared him and made him flee his home. Also, Hermes was visiting her a lot, even when Luke was a child. Luke remembers when his mom was trying to become the Oracle.
    • In The Lost Hero, Thalia actually talks about how her father came back to visit her (in his Roman form, but still), so we can assume that she'd known about him already.

     Antaeus's parentage 
  • Two words: LORD ANTAEUS. The giant in the Labyrinth in the fourth book. You know, the son of Poseidon and Gaea. Can ANYONE explain to me how that is not Squick to the tenth power? Gaea is Poseidon's grandmother!!! Also, she's incredibly evil and at almost no time has she ever wanted to do anything but destroy the gods. But mostly, brother and sister (incest) is typical, since Hera and Zeus are that. Child and parent? Eww. Child and grandmother?!!! SQUUUIIIIIIICKKKK!!
    • First, its Greek mythology. With everyone sleeping with their sister and want no this isn't that big a deal by this point. Two, its implied genetics and stuff is not the same for gods as it is for mortals. Third, IIRC in myth Anteus was more an accident. Poseidon was pursuing someone else and for lack of a better term missed.
    • The books are basically recycled Greek mythology, however well done, so you can't blame them for staying faithful to the source. Riodan actually handled it quite well, not editing the squick out but not drawing attention to it either (unless it's so Percy can snark about it).
    • Percy mentions in the fifth book that gods don't have DNA, hence why it isn't really that gross or disgusting for demigods to date each other even though, on the godly side, they're all technically related.
    • Also, if you think that's squick, you should read again how the minotaur and Dionysus were born, and they both appear in the first book (not to mention Athena and her children).

     Gods' lack of commitment 
  • Why are the gods so bad at staying with a single mortal woman? Out of the ones we know about, two of the seemingly less dependable ones stayed with their loved ones until tragedy happened, but Athena and Poseidon both moved on without any reason whatsoever, and their partners also treat it as the most normal thing, and are still on Just Friends terms with them. Why, exactly?
    • Well, the Tenth Doctor said it best: "You can spend the rest of your life with me...but I can't spend the rest of mine with you."
    • I figure if you live for eternity, your sense of personal loyalty to those who drop as quickly as flies gets SKEWED.
    • I dunno. Ask the Greeks.
      • Poseidon also knew that he wasn't supposed to have had Percy, so he probably figured that by staying away he would lessen the chances of the boy being discovered. Also, since we don't know the circumstances of Annabeth or any of the other's births, Athena could view her children almost as construction projects. She meets with someone with whom she has a close connection, they work together and come to develop a strong mutual appreciation of each other, and then finally the brain child (hardy har har) is completed and Athena leaves the project for new ones, only occasionally checking up on it like a building that needs work done while the male parent becomes more a permanent caretaker. I'll stop this analogy now and end by also saying that several times the gods say they aren't allowed to directly interfere with things, which does seem to extend somewhat to their children's entire lives, so as long as the parents intend to keep the kids around the gods can't be there as well.
    • I don't think that's the case with Athena's children. I remember Annabeth says that she was delivered by Isis (or whomever messengers of the gods was)since she said something about a rainbow or something.
    • Heh heh. ""Hardy".
    • I'm sorry, but are you categorizing Hades as less dependable? Hades, the single god who, in all of the Greek myths, was shown to be almost completely faithful to his wife? Hades, who's one "cheating" story is so little known I've only been able to find one account of it, and who, in the story in question, never made if past kissing, and only went that far to see of his wife loved him enough to stop him? That Hades?
      • Regarding Hades, he seems to have cared about Maria, Nico, and Bianca so much that he kept part of his essence with them for YEARS, as Nico and Bianca are at least five years old when she is killed.
      • The gods were never all that dependable. In the sequel series, which concentrates more on demigods who aren't children of the big three, there are a few excuses given: Aphrodite claims that the man wouldn't be happy knowing that the mythology is real, Hephaestus is just plain antisocial and stuff. Still, it's probably just that the gods don't feel like it.
    • Surely, dependability would consist of staying in your own realm and looking after your responsibilities, rather than hanging around sexy humans?
    • Also, while the Gods do have marriage and child-rearing, it's not really clear that they strongly resemble human ones. They might be going by the standards of Ancient Greek relationships or have expectations for a long-term relationship that humans are incapable of meeting.
    • When you have lived for millennia time would go by in the blink of an eye. To the gods their human partners and demigod children are only extremely fleeting relationships, passing by in a moment, and leaving the gods heartbroken. I can't blame them for not growing attached.
    • The Gods look human, and act human in some ways, but they aren't human. They're embodiments of cosmic forces, given shape by the hopes and dreams of mankind as a whole. This leads to a sort of "uncanny valley" effect in which the various ways in which they aren't like humans are thrown into sharp dissonance by the ways in which they are. Even in the original mythology, their various failings were often used in parables to try to teach humans to be wiser about things. Small wonder they continue to have far more of those failings than most humans.

     Celestial bronze and mortal weapons 
  • Celestial Bronze. Much is made of this wonderous material in the first book, along with the statement that demigods are especially vulnerable since both mortal weapons and Celestial Bronze hurts them. Luke's sword Backbiter is described to be horrid because it's possible of hurting both mortals and not. Yet in later books, things such as shotguns, mundane explosions, and blue plastic hairbrushes have been seen to kill or at least hurt even Titans. Whats the big deal? What's the point in having a dual-material weapon, if a regular iron one wll do just as well?
    • Well if you think about it, really think about it, a shotgun blast still packs more force than any mortal can put into a sword swing. And of course an explosion would hurt. An explosion isn't a weapon- it's a massive expulsion of heat, energy and pressure. An explosion which is quite a bit higher on the scale of lethality than a sword, magical or not. As for the hairbrush, it probably didn't really hurt him so mush as shock him and its worth noting he was in a human body at the time anyway. I'm guessing though that higher ranked monsters could probably shrug off human weaponry for the most part though which is the reason half-bloods carry it. Besides, it's the only weapon we see that can hurt the gods.
      • The other troper forgot that all the explosives were of magical Greek fire so naturally it would do the job. Though based on how it's described in Sea of Monsters, the way it functions sounds suspiciously like the way a hand grenade works.
    • I remember a mention in the third book of celestial bronze bullets. Annabeth's dad found some in her stash, right?
      • The Sequel Series actually has a specially made shotgun in the armory that fires celestial rounds
    • In d&d terms: dr 10/celestial bronze or regenerate/celestial bronze. In terms for normal people: they're resistant to damage from mundane sources, or you can blow holes in them but it'll grow back unless it's celestial bronze.
      • It also cuts the other way. Celestial metals are highly toxic to monsters, so any cut from a celestial bronze weapon will kill a weaker monster, whereas you presumably need a lethal shot to do the job with regular weapons.
    • Also, remember how in titan's curse Percy deflected bullets from the skeletons' sidearms with Riptide? Monsters can probably do the same. The guy Percy's mother shot was probably just caught by surprise. Kronos was only just into his mortal body-when Rachel threw the brush it unsteadied him. Furthermore, Celestial bronze is implied to make sharper and stronger swords than mortal steel - Percy frequently slashes through rock and metal with it without doing it the slightest bit of harm.
    • In the shotgun scene in question is not the shotgun that kills the monster, it just pushes the monster towards a demigod weapon, it is being pierced by that weapon which actually destroys it.
    • Yes, one of the short stories shows that you need to completely destroy a monster in order to kill it.

     Sibling lookalikes 
  • Annabeth's siblings. They're described in the first book as sharing her blonde hair and gray eyes, the latter of which is understandable, since it's a trait inherited from their mother. But Annabeth quite obviously inherited the former from her father - seeing as her mother has black hair. So how do her siblings all share the same hair color? Does Athena just have a thing for blonds?
    • They're made intellectually, so the rules of natural birth don't really need to apply. She could shape them to her image.
      • It makes more sense too, since Athena was always a virgin in Greek mythology and thus would never really procreate with any man, blond or no.
      • You missed the handwave. She never uh, joined in the gods' traditional pastime. She presumably gave birth to her daughters about the same way she was, born from her mind.
    • And gods can appear in practically any form they choose. Maybe Athena decided to go for black hair after a century of being blond.
      • Maybe she doesn't approve of the "Dumb Blonde" stereotype?
    • Also, in the Titan's Curse Percy describes her as: 'looking so much like Annabeth I almost called her that' so at that point she must have been still Blond, since otherwise he would have described her differently...
      • Not necessarily. Hair color and style are probably the last things that would highlight a resemblance between two people - I strongly take after my great-grandmother in terms of my eyes, lips, and facial shape, but I would have to wear a wig for my hair to come close to resembling hers. In this case, Athena's black hair may've been what made Percy realize his mistake in thinking she was Annabeth.

     Demeter in the Underworld 
  • So how come Demeter was seen as hiding out in the underworld with her brother (Hades) and Persephone? Did Hades decide that since she's Persephone's mother, that she could stay down there with her? Or is he afraid that Demeter could destroy the world if he pisses her off again. (Remember in Greek Mythology she almost starved the world because Zeus sold her daughter off).
    • Ten drachmas says Persephone nagged Hades to get her mother out of harm's way (what with Typhon coming and Kronos' attack) by taking her to the underworld with them.
    • As far as I know, nobody is outright banned from the Underworld. It's just that nobody usually wants to visit, as it's depressing.
    • a), Demeter and Persephone never took part in the first (Greek mythology) Titan wars anyway; b) where do you expect Demeter to be when Armageddon is knocking? Right.
      • Demeter might have been, besides the fact that she's a woman, and frankly, I haven't seen a lot interpretations/translations where women fought in the first Titan War. Social rights wasn't too much of a concept in ancient history.

     Percy and Nico's plan 
  • The Plan in The Last Olympian. It's understandable that, since the story is told from Percy's point of view, the audience isn't going to know things that he doesn't know. The Prophecy is an example of that. However, Nico's plan was plainly known by Percy while the audience was left in the dark. For chapter. After chapter. After chapter. Even when his mom asks about the plan, Percy tells her. In a sentence much like that. This troper enjoyed the books, but that little ordeal of Fake Suspense was extremely irritating.
    • This troper found it annoying too, but now that I think about it, it would've been even more boring if everything was stated from the beginning. Sometimes Fake Suspense is ever-so-slightly better that none at all, but of course YMMV.
    • I think it comes across more as Percy not really 'wanting' to talk about the plan - it's made pretty clear that he doesn't like it, and knows that people would think it's a seriously bad idea. So it would make sense that he doesn't give the audience any detail until he has to actually talk about going through it, because he doesn't want to admit what incredibly dangerous thing he's going to attempt.

     Ancient Greek 
  • It's been established that Olympus (along with the gods) moves to wherever the cornerstone of Western Civilization is (first Greece, then Rome, and currently the USA). Why then are demigods "hardwired" to only be able to read Ancient Greek fluently? Given the transient nature of the gods, shouldn't it actually be easier for them to understand all languages and texts rather than just one, specifically from a region the gods themselves have not been based out of for thousands of years?
    • Because even though they are moving with Western Civilization, they are still Greek. They want to keep at least something of their homeland. Add to that you can hand wave it that the reason the demi-gods are like that is because their parent is a god and anything goes.
    • It's better explained in the Sequel Series that while their taste match the country the flame is brightest in, they are still connected to their birth country and would fade if it was destroyed.
      • Why, exactly? According to the myths, the gods existed long before humanity. Why would they suddenly be tied to the civilization that worshiped them?
      • Maybe it's just that being prayed and sacrificed to just influences them more than simply living in a specific country.
      • This troper has always assumed that in-universe, the gods are just meant to be personifications of ideals rather than actual literal beings. Note that any myth which contradicts modern science is sort of glossed over- Apollo's chariot isn't the sun, it's made out of what people think of the sun (or something). So the gods could just be the concept of Western/Greek civilization (or the part of western civilization inspired by Greece) personified. By the same token, monsters seem to represent chaos (antithetical to civilization) or nature (satyrs getting reincarnated as flowers.
    • I think it's because first and foremost, they were Greek gods. Yes, they lived in Rome for a while, yes, they spent time in England, France, Spain, America, etc-but they spent centuries, if not millennia, in Greece, they're more strongly associated with Greece than anywhere else, and most importantly, they started out in Greece. A throwaway line in the sequel series mentions that Roman demigods are hardwired to read Latin. Same reason.
    • In the sequel series, it is mentioned that some gods and their offspring have the inherent ability to speak and understand other languages, namely French. Children of Aphrodite can speak fluent French because it's the "language of love", whereas Boreas has always lived to the north of the other gods, which in this case means he lodges in Quebec and can thusly speak French as well. I wouldn't be surprised if Notus, the South Wind, were able to speak Spanish or something, especially seeing as the Boreads mistake Leo for one of his children when they meet.

     Godly DNA 2 
  • In The Last Olympian, we learn that Gods don't have genes, so while a relationship between any two demigods with the same Olympian parent is taboo, a relationship between two demigods with completely different sets of parents is a-okay. But if Gods don't have genes, what is the difference between the two? What makes two of Apollo's kids gettin' it on so much worse than Annabeth and Percy's relationship?
    • Hmm... Maybe because they would have lived with each other for some time? Or their godly parents would be disgusted by it? Wait, nevermind, these are the Greek gods... Sorry, can't help.
    • Maybe it's a psychological thing? Like, it's techicially not incest, but they know they have the same mom or dad, so it's still squicky, but don't feel as squicked out with someone from another cabin?
      • It never says the gods forbid it, just that it doesn't happen - too squicky for the mortal raised halfbloods.
      • That's exactly right. Also, readers want to see Percy and Annabeth together, but feel squicky if they're reading incest. This explains it away so nicely!
    • Maybe he means that the gods, being of a different ontonlogical nature to humans, don't have the same kind of genetic resemblance to each other - the gods aren't treated as being related to each other in this regard, but their half-human children still share the same parent.
      • It's also perhaps to do with the convoluted Greek family tree. Athena is Poseidon's brother's daughter, so since Percy is Poseidon's son and Annabeth is Athena's daughter, Percy is technically like her uncle once removed, which would be enough distance in a normal mortal relationship anyway. Whereas if Percy and Annabeth had the same parent they would be half siblings, which, genes or no, is probably just a little too close.
      • Actually, Percy and Annabeth would be first cousins once-removed. Percy is the son of Poseidon. Athena is the daughter of Zeus. That makes Percy and Athena first cousins. Annabeth is Athena's daughter, therefore she and Percy are first cousins once-removed. This troper is personally far more squicked out by the implications of something between Luke and Thalia, considering that, since Hermes is the son of Zeus, and therefore Thalia's brother, and Luke is the son of Hermes, Thalia is Luke's aunt. And you can't even use the "different gods" excuse to get around that one.
    • The Greek gods are beings spun of power and magic, not genes and cells. They don't have genes because they're completely different than human beings, they exist because people believe in them. It's more about magic than genetics, and a lot of myths reflect that.
      • Siblings are usually not attracted to each other by default, both through psychological and physical\hormonal reasons. Cousins are less of a big deal, and if they're only related through their godly parent, then they have everything listed above as an excuse. Siblings would still have to think "out daddy is the same person", which would be squicky for them regardless of genetics. I've always assumed, though, that even if gods are beings of energy, demigods would still have their traits (maybe except for the supernatural ones) translated into their genetic code.
    • The thing about incest is that the problems associated with it stem from the likelihood that both carry the recessive alleles for the same genetic disorders. Granted, people who are unrelated but carry the same recessive alleles unknowingly have kids together, but it is much more likely in two closely related individuals. I interpreted the whole situation when Percy mentioned it as something that was not technically incest, but rather the gods being gods having none of the genetic problems that warranted the incest taboo through their side of the family.

  • Apollo, while arrogant and frankly kind of a dork, is portrayed in PJatO as essentially good. On the other hand, rapists are generally considered, you know, bad. So any theories on what really went down regarding that whole "Cassandra" incident?
    • For those of you out of the loop, in the original mythology, Apollo thought Cassandra was cute and gave her the ability to see the future, then got pissed when she turned him down anyway, and cursed her with the whole 'no one will believe you' thing.
    • Pre-series character development, maybe? None of the Gods are as big of jerks as they were in the original mythology anyway.
    • Or, going with something like the above troper's suggestion, perhaps some aspects of the gods' values changes with the times. For example, in traditional Greek Mythology, female demigods are usually princesses and/or abnormally beautiful, but not heroes. But now in the PJatO universe, female heroes are perfectly acceptable and encouraged. So, what with rape being much more frowned upon nowadays, the gods don't do that anymore? Though that doesn't explain why they still have loads of affairs. Alternatively, since there's many different versions of the same myths and Riordan even changed some things from Greek Mythology, maybe the PJatO Greek gods didn't go around raping people?
      • Going with the idea that they've changed, one would assume the mortal affairs are consensual.
      • Which makes sense if the Gods are the embodiments of Western Civilization - when they lived in a time when rape was okay, they raped. Now that it's a big no no, they don't do it anymore.
    • The original post only made mention of Apollo, but come on - just about every Greek god and goddess did absolutely horrific things according to the commonly known and studied myths, and the gods do nothing to deny them. Why is anyone willing to give them any respect or look on them with anything but horror, even if they have stopped raping or killing out of petty revenge and so on? It's not fear in the series, and just because you have a parent doesn't mean you love them, so love isn't necessarily the reason...
      • The gods were not beings of pure evil like many modern people think. Most of them were live and let live unless you did something big to piss them off. Zeus, the god of morals, was ironically the worst of them all. Its made clear he and several others like Hera and Ares are feared more than loved. You respect them because of what they will do you to if you do not. Their kids want acceptance by their parents. Others have their personality quirks, but are not evil abominations.
      • It may also have something to do with the viewpoint of their current seat of power. In Ancient Greece, for example, the term hero didn't mean person who goes above and beyond to aid those in need and defend the helpless but rather person who is powerful or smart enough to do whatever they damn well please. The gods were revered as greater than heroes. Essentially, in Ancient Greece, people believed the gods had the right to rape because nobody could stop them anyway. Later countries, such as America, have a different attitude, namely we don't care who the hell you are, you don't get to rape someone. As well, it may also have to do with different attitudes—the Greeks merely told stories, they never judged the subjects of those stories. If you go purely by direct mythology, the Titans were never said to be better or worse than the gods, merely that they were overthrown by them. Contrast America, where we harshly judge and criticize people, especially those in positions of power. Look at this page. Heck, look at some of our tropes. We were viciously trodding all over Zeus well before Riordan started writing his books, magic rapist that he is.
      • One must also consider that it's seriously implied in the books that Ancient Greek mythology is not exactly what happened. (For instance, when Theseus is briefly raised from the dead by Nico Percy comments that he looks like a teenager similar to himself, and Hephaestus mentions that Hera was the one who threw him off Olympus as opposed to Zeus as most records say.) It's possible Cassandra really did do something to piss Apollo off or some incident happened, but she told her version of the story to put herself in a better light.
      • Greek mythology was largely an oral tradition. There were as many different variations of the stories as there were storytellers. The mythology we have now, and on which Riordan bases his stories, represents the tiniest fraction of stories of the gods that were told—the ones that were lucky enough to be written down by someone. In altering the myths to suit his own stories, Riordan is just following tradition.
      • Also, there's a lot fewer cases that are definitely rape-as-we'd-define-it in Greek mythology than a causal reading would suggest, because the word rape is mostly used in the classical sense - taking the woman away from the people she belonged to. Any sex in this situation is likely to be rape, (because kidnapping does not demonstrate a great regard for consent and because the power imbalance makes consent difficult,) but not necessarily.
  • Something I think people forget is that at one point the greek gods were actually The Greek Gods, meaning people actually saw them as something admirable and worthy of worship. You can take that two ways: either the ancient greeks were a bunch of sick bastards or that in the millennia since the original Values Dissonance has been Flanderized beyond all belief (literally). I'm going with the second myself.
    • Gods are created to explain the unexplainable. In the Greek mythology, gods were just as flawed as humans, perhaps even more so, because gods had far less consequences for their actions without the threat of eternal punishment after a death that would not come. The Greeks believed in the gods, and worshiped them because they truly believed they controlled everything. If you don't leave a good enough sacrifice on Demeter's altar, you're crops will wither and die and you will starve. You laugh about Zeus's cheating ways, and he'll strike you dead in an instant. Yes, they saw them worthy of worship, because they believed that if they didn't worship them, they would die. The gods have never been "something admirable".
      • This isn't completely true. The Greeks admired the benevolent side of the gods. Zeus and his upholding of public order. Poseidon protecting you at sea. Aphrodite and her protection of lovers. Etc. However, they viewed the gods has being like humans and having a dark side too. The gods were superior to mortals and could do things mortals were not allowed to. Humans were not the center of the universe. The gods were. Humans were more like really intelligent animals. The difference is nowadays fictional portrayals emphasis the dark sides without the good sides as well. Riordan is actually giving a fairly balanced portrayal.
      • The gods were supposed to be morally flawless according to some early myths. I'm not sure how they got flandarized into their common portrayal, but it's probably just because flawless characters wouldn't make a good story.
      • Blue and Orange Morality
      • One must remember that this is not Christianity, where the deity is consider an omnipotent benevolent creator. The Greek Gods were considered personified forces of nature, this is why the gods tend to have seemingly bipolar personalities and be kind in one instant and become inhumanly cruel the next - they are not human beings. The Greeks did not worship them as role models or respect, but outright fear that they would blast them with lighting. Zeus is chaotic, temperamental and have hundreds of kids, because storms and lighting are randomly destructive, yet provide rain which fertilizes fields and growth. Poseidon is extremely temperamental, because the ocean can be calm in one second and destructive the next. Apollo, the sun god is said in mythology to shoot invisible arrows that randomly cause people to die, just in the same way that being in the sun too long can cause heatstroke. They are sentient aspects of nature seen through human veils.

     Discovering Percy's father 
  • Why did it take so long for anyone to determine who Percy's father was? Heck, Annabeth, supposed to be wise and all being daughter of Athena saw what he did during the bathroom incident and didn't even get a hint? How many Greek deities associated with water are there to have any confusion, after all?
    • Lots actually. More or less every river, lake or individual sea had its own associated deity. Poseidon is just the most significant of them.
      • Yes, but in this case we're talking about toilet water.
      • True, but the book doesn't mention any sort of lodging for children of lesser gods. Or children of lesser gods, at all. Of the 12, he surely is the only one, and if you know just a little bit of Greek Mythology, trusting a god to keep a promise isn't all that reliable, especially considering Zeus himself broke it, too.
      • Actually it does - when Luke is explaining things to Percy, he mentions that Percy could also be the kid of a minor god who has no cabin. Cabin Eleven is so full because they take everyone not claimed and those who aren't children of Olympians. Additionally, there's Ethan Nakamura, son of Nemesis, and his being on the side of Kronos because he was promised proper respect for the minor gods and their offspring.
    • Consider that everyone was hoping for him not being Poseidon's son. Chiron because of the prophecy, Annabeth because of her mother's rivalry. There is a little of denial about Percy's parent.
    • This could also be seen as a respect issue. If a god has not yet claimed his child it would be disrespectful to presume its ok for you to say its his kid, no matter how obvious it is. You don't want to get on a god's bad side, after all.
      • It seems like that would be disrespectful to do that to anyone, not just a god, to be fair. "Hey, super-famous and important guy! I've been told by people who haven't gotten to know you much that I vaguely resemble you, and since I share minor versions of attributes that you're well-known for, I'm just going to assume that I'm your son! You're cool with that, right?" (All humor aside, though, I could just as easily see the toilets and showers as something one of the Hephaestus or Hermes kids rigged up, so barring that, the only other evidence that connected Percy to Poseidon at first was that he was good with a canoe.)

  • Okay, so Percy's Mom's husband (can't remember their names ever) is kind of a dick, true. However, why the hell does being a Jerkass make it okay to MURDER HIM? By turning him to stone, no less.
    • Years of physical and emotional abuse, bullying a twelve year old, forcing said 12-year-old to pay for his beers.
    • He was abusing her, the former love of a god. Percy imagines that Gabe's fate in the Underworld is to play poker in boiling oil for eternity.
    • It was strongly implied he abused Percy.
      • That was never outright stated or shown. Beside which, that is still not a reason to KILL someone. Contact the police, damn it.
      • Are we forgetting when he said that he would "Punched his lights out" when he told anyone about the gambling?
      • If someone was abusing my mother I'd want them dead. Secondly, killing out of self-defense is generally considered acceptable. Killing someone in retribution for years of abuse is a-okay in my book. Then again, I've been called Axe-Crazy.
      • Just imagine what Poseidon could've done to him if he found. Being turned to stone sounds pretty good now, doesn't it?
      • I think there's a fanfiction based on that idea.
      • Plus, with the contact-the-police idea, there are far too many domestic abuse cases where the victims would call the police and they wouldn't help for numerous reasons.
    • Isn't it implied that those turned to stone by Medusa don't actually die unless their statue is broken? I'm pretty sure Percy said something about Gabe not deserving eternal punishment, even though he was such a horrible guy.
    • Are we even sure his stoning was her fault? Maybe he was rooting through her stuff and did it to himself.
      • That's what happened in the Movie. Makes it seem more like Gabe though.
      • The stoning was specifically done by Sally Jackson in the books: she sells Gabe as a sculpture titled "the Poker Player" to some art gallery and makes a killing off it.
      • What movie? There was no movie. There was never any piece of crap movie just barely based on the first book of the series.
      • Hey, I don't hate the movie any less than you, but this one scene was just unremarkable, while the one in the book made me go WTF. I know it mirrors the mythology, but still, that's no reason to kill (?) Gabe's poker buddies along with him.
      • She didn't kill Gabe's friends on the book. She sold him off as "the poker player" (SINGULAR). So it is strongly implied that she killed just Gabe when his friends had left. And considering this is a man who abused his and his adopted son, probably raped Sally daily, and provided no financial support for the latter to speak of and threatened to turn him into the police, I'd say Gabe deserved what was coming to him.
      • Whatever happened or not in the movie, it is entirely possible that Gabe was never killed directly by Sally (as much as we see Sally imply it with "meat loaf surprise", we're already aware Sally has a sense of humor plus she had previously shown misgivings about doing this to Gabe). It's possible a situation identical to or at least similar to the one seen at the end of the movie took place and Gabe sealed his own fate, and Sally just took "credit" for it in her letter to Percy.
      • Also remember that Percy, despite being an American, is also very Greek (his brain being hardwired for the language and all, plus his stout defense of Greek culture and the Greek side of the gods in Son of Neptune over the Roman side of things). Just like he and the rest of Camp Half-Blood are naturally predisposed to the Greek language, they're probably also predisposed to the Greek way of doing things, vigilante justice and all that.
      • There's no real need for it to be an innate disposition. Percy and Sally could both have picked up on the attitudes of the supernatural people they hang out with. That (and My Country, Right or Wrong) are enough to explain Percy. It's not clear whether Sally has enough contact with Gods and Monsters to have the same effect, but it seems more likely than homicidal tendencies accompanying clear-sightedness, an ability that might or might not be associated with Ancient Greece.
    • Thematically, killing Gabe makes sense, because it reinforces the damage he did to Percy and Sally. It puts him on the same level as the Monsters.
    • And of course, let's not forget the reason why Sally really stayed with Gabe was because Percy is the son of Poseidon. Smelly Gabe just happened to be strong enough to mask Percy's scent and protect him from monsters.
    • While I can understand how people can take both sides in this argument, and I am all for the belief that, however which way you look at it, Gabe was 100% in the wrong for abusing Sally...To those who think that the actions of domestic abusers are equal to murder or, if he remains conscious even after being petrified, a fate worse than death...that's just not right. Even if stoning Gabe was seen as appropriately equal to what he'd done to Sally and Percy all those those who say he was equal to a monster for what he did, what does that make Percy's mom for doing something equal to it?
      • Not a freaking monster, that's for sure. She killed the man that verbally and physically abused her and her son for years, and who, more importantly, made it impossible for her 12 YEAR OLD SON to live with her ever again unless she git rid of him. And considering how tightly he controlled things like their finances, and was willing to enforce his will through physical violence, she may not have been able to get rid of him any other way (since filing for divorce requires paperwork and legal proceedings, which would have been impossible to hide from Gabe). And, in any case, the man was willing to lie about a twelve year old boy (in a way that started s nation wide man hunt) just to get back at him, and try to throw him out when he came home to see his mom. This wasn't some petty "he's just a loud, slobbish prick" situation. He was a full on, wife and child beating, lying, cheating, manipulating (in a clumsy and unsubtle way) repulsive pustule of a person. And he deserved the death he got (seriously, where did this "they're still alive" stuff come from?)
      • There's something seriously wrong with you, as a human being, if you find it acceptable to murder someone based on your own judgement of them. Sally's situation with Gabe is not unique in this day and age. It wasn't like in the 50s, where divorce was basically impossible - she could've just left him if she wanted to. In no way was murder the only option.
    • Basically, we can interpret this as either Gabe accidentally found the medusa head, or Sally turned him to stone on purpose. If you disagree with this, you can see it as a character flaw; Sally clearly has a vengeful streak. Or you can feel it's utterly justified; Gabe is utterly despicable, and he presumably abused her and her son. You don't necessarily have to see it as a good thing.
    • A common element of Greek myths were strong and courageous women who endured abusive relationships for the sake of their children. Two that spring to mind are Penelope (wife of Odysseus) and the original Perseus' mother, Danae. Penelope didn't hold off the suitors for Odysseus' sake, she did it so that Telemachus wouldn't be killed to eliminate his claim to Odysseus' throne. Danae married an evil king (can't remember his name) to satiate him long enough for Perseus to grow into strength and manhood. Also a common thread, the women are usually avenged in the end for the abuse they endured. Sally's case is just Riordan sticking to the myth formula.
    • What I'd like to know is, why is Sally permitted to do things like petrifying people because it's what would've happened in mythology, when she realistically could've just kicked Gabe out or something, yet there's always an outcry whenever one of the gods (typically Zeus) does the same thing? Protagonist-Centered Morality, much? I dislike Gabe as much as the next person, but that doesn't make what Sally did "okay".
      • I would say a large degree of Protagonist-Centered Morality along with Gabe being an Asshole Victim along with him alone suffering the consequences. With the gods, it is not uncommon for them to do worse for far less even in modern times, but the people who suffer is not limited to the transgressor, but anyone unlucky enough to be near them. Zeus cheats on Hera so Jason is given to her and Thalia thinks he is dead. Halcyon Green angers Apollo so he lures other demigods to their deaths. Hades is angry at Zeus so he takes it out on the Oracle. Poseidon is angry at Minos so he takes it out on his wife. Hera is angry at Zeus so she torments Hercules. Triptolemus is angry at an old grudge and temporarily turns Nico into a flower. Aeolus is mad at the gods so he orders the Wind Gods to kill any demigods they come across. Etc. Etc. Etc. Sally did it to a single person who actually wronged her. Does it make it right? No, but it not close to how bad the gods often do for more trivial actions.
      • Great. The difference is that the gods are basically anthropomorphic forces of nature, which is why they do things in a generally apathetic manner. Zeus represents the sky, which is why he can be level-headed and fair one day, and the next, he strikes someone down with lightning on a whim. Same with Poseidon, Hades, Demeter, Aphrodite, or Ares. By holding them accountable for their actions, you'd basically be punishing the sky, the sea, the ground, death, love, and war for not adhering to a moral code. (Which also explains why Hestia is one of the only gods who isn't cruel or apathetic - home can never really be a bad thing.) Sally doesn't have that excuse. Whether she killed one man or one-thousand of them, she can't really use being a turbulent force of nature as an excuse.
    • For what faults it had, at least the film rectified this by having neither Sally nor Percy outright murder him. There, Sally leaves Gabe alone in the apartment to move out his things, and Percy leaves the head sitting inside a padlocked fridge, with a note explicitly warning Gabe not to open it.
    • Considering that there are canonically deities that can resurrect the dead, it's not a stretch to imagine that there's a way for petrification by looking at Medusa's face to be reversed, so it's not as bad as murder - And I Must Scream? Sure. But not as bad as murder.
    • I think that might be worse than murder. Even if petrification could be reversed, Sally didn't have any intention of capitalizing on that possibility when she petrified Gabe, and she sold his statue without telling anyone, so there's no chance that he'll ever be revived. That's a little like locking someone in a secret underground room and saying, "Well, they're stuck down there, and no one knows where they are, but if someone did know, it'd be possible for them to escape, so it's not as bad as murder."

     Luke killing Annabeth 
  • Near the end of the second book, Luke gives the impression that he is perfectly willing for Annabeth to be eaten by his bear-man minion. This seems a bit out of character for me, since throughout all the rest of the books he generally seems to not want her to die. For example, in the third book, he hesitates about killing her when they don't need her any more, then in the fourth book, he orders his minions to kill Rachel and Percy, but not her. I know he's a complete Jerkass, but the rest of the time he goes out of his way to not hurt her when he gets the chance, so why doesn't he in the second book?
    • Well, Kronos on the ship and he probably didn't want to look weak in front of him.
    • It might be more that Luke is perfectly willing to pretend to be about to kill Annabeth, if that's what he needs for leverage against Percy. There was never any chance that Percy would stand there and watch any of his friends eaten, and Luke could have prepared for it in advance with a quick 'hey, if I tell you to kill Jackson's friends, don't start with the blonde girl.'
    • It also seemed that as the fight between Kronos and the Gods got more heated through the series, Luke seemed to get a bit more hesitant about violence, a bit slower on the draw, as he began to see how much he would have to betray his friends.

     What's left in Greece? 
  • I thought of this when Annabeth said she wanted to visit Greece: If all the Greek gods, monsters, and even "geographic locations" are now in America, what the heck is left in Greece?
    • Only the magical locations are there. The ruins - like the Parthenon, say - remain in Greece; also, it's probably worth something to see the original locations, at least for sentimental value.
    • Also as revealed later in The Heroes of Olympus, the ancient ruins are still deeply connected to the gods.

     Hunters' immortality 
  • In the third book, it says that all of Artemis's hunters are immortal, unless they're killed in battle. Why? I know they said it's unlikely, but why does that matter? Nothing is stopping Artemis from just making them all 100% immortal, so why not? If she had done that, it would havekept Zoe from dying. Are they afraid the hunters might rebel against them or something?
    • I think full-fledged immortality is only granted in extenuating circumstances. Actually, looking at Greek Mythology, their are plenty of times when the gods wanted to protect/immortalize someone and instead of just making them immortal did something weird like transforming them into plants and animals. Apparently only the gods get to have full immortality.
    • Artemis gives the Hunters eternal youth, not eternal life. Nowadays we don't tend to draw much of a distinction between the two, but Greek mythology did.
    • True immortality is only granted to gods or their immortal consorts.
    • The Last Olympian mentions that Zeus needs the approval of the whole council to grant true immortality. Presumably that's too much trouble for Artemis to go through. Also, even gods can die (Pan) or be killed (Kronos).
      • Actually, Pan faded (which is separate from death), and Kronos was said to have been blown to bits and scattered — still technically alive, but [hopefully] spread so thin that he'll never be able to reform again.
    • I always interpreted it as essentially making it so that if her hunters did die, it would be because of their own actions - it fits with Greek myths overall; most of the deaths that occur are the result of someone's actions; you don't hear a lot of myths concerning people dying of old age.

     Betrayal and forgiveness 
  • This troper hates it how everyone forgave Silena. She basically betrayed camp and endangered them all. Because she was seduced by Luke.
    • Well, she did sacrifice herself to save the camp.
    • This troper has to agree with the first troper. Silena took it really bad after Beckendorf died, but still continued to provide information to Luke? I mean, I suppose she could've been hypnotized or something, but it didn't seem that way. And it was only after Annabeth took the knife that she finally lost it and decided to switch. Since when did she and Annabeth get on so well?
      • I think it's stated that she felt awful about it from the beginning, but as soon as she provided any information at all, Luke threatened to expose her as The Mole to everyone and she didn't want people to find out. So at first it was a poor decision, and then she was blackmailed into staying as the informant. Given that the more experienced campers were also taken in by Luke and mostly have pretty low expectations of the children of Aphrodite's decision making ability, it's easier for them to see her as Luke's dupe than a traitor in her own right.
      • Furthermore, she claims that she was promised she'd be saving lives. She probably assumed that they had no chance of winning but that her friends would refuse to give in (which wasn't too unrealistic) and that the only way to save them was to help defeat them as cleanly as possible. Doesn't make her betrayal right, but she did it at least in part in a twisted attempt to protect the camp.
    • The Last Olympian has a strong Redemption Equals Death theme going. Silena saved all their butts and sacrificed herself by getting Ares camp to come, so they consider her redeemed.
    • Cognitive dissonance is a powerful psychological tool, and in fact is frequently used in real-life brainwashing techniques. Get someone to do something totally against their own moral code, and they'll convince themselves after the fact that what they did is so unlike them that they must have had a good reason for it, or they wouldn't have done it. Because obviously they did do it. In that light, you could say that having contributed to Beckendorf's death actually reinforced her commitment to Kronos's cause. Her aid to the enemy camp had led to the death of her it must have been a worthy cause if she was willing to sacrifice her boyfriend for it.

     Half-blood gods 
  • Wouldn't Dionysus, Apollo, and Artemis all technically be half-bloods?
    • My Greek mythology is rusty but Dionysus was conceived by a mortal woman but upon seeing Zeus's divine form, she was incinerated and died. Zeus took the apparently took the embryo and sowed it into his thigh. So Dionysus can be handwaved. I don't remember about Apollo and Artemis though.
    • Apollo and Artemis's mom was a Titan. So was Hermes's, actually. I suppose that makes them demigod-demititans, but they're not mortal-parent demigods.
      • Also keep in mind that the original seven Olympians were also the children of Titans. There's no biological (metabiological?) difference between the two factions; it's a matter of title, not species. So Apollo, Artemis, and Hermes aren't half-bloods (nor are Hephaestus and Athena, who are grandchildren of Titans, though their status isn't in dispute anyway). Dionysus still requires the above handwave, though.
    • In The Last Olympian, the gods offer to make Percy a god. This implies that half-bloods can become gods if they do enough. Maybe the half-blood gods managed to rise in power over time.
      • Hercules was said to have become a full god after his death, his cremation burning away the mortal part of him and leaving only the divine.
      • I think it was outright stated that Dionysus was mortal at one point and was made a god.
      • In Percy Jackson and the Greek Gods, it's... speculated that Dionysus was elevated to true godly status by having an enormous number of worshippers. It also makes specific mention that Gods Need Prayer Badly, so it's certainly one possibility.
    • In The Mark Of Athena from the second series, Percy has a conversation with Dionysus, who mentions specifically that he was once a demigod. Though, it's worth taking into consideration that Percy technically wasn't having this conversation with Dionysus, but rather his Roman personality, Bacchus.
    • In a book that I read, Dionysus would've been born a half-blood, but because he ended up being born out of Zeus's thigh (since Zeus carried him there after he was forced to incinerate his mother), he ended up an immortal god instead

     Dionysus rant 
  • What pissed me off is Dionysus' rant about heroes in the third book, pointing out how Thesus abandoned Ariadne. Cue Percy more or less just agreeing with it when the proper response would be, "demigods being dicks and assholes to mortals who help and/or love them, gee I wonder where they learned that from?" What with a fair number of greek heroes being the product of outright rape on the part of their divine parents, then being saddled with the blame for their parents' indiscretions and made to clean up after the gods' messes. Is it any surprise that most demigods are slightly less than well adjusted?
    • True, but actually coming out and saying this to a god's face is only going to make them angry, and you wouldn't like them when they're angry. Not even Hestia.
      • The way I heard the myth was that Dionysus came up to Theseus and told him to leave Ariadne behind because Dionysus wanted her for his wife. It doesn't sound like Theseus actually decided to just leave because he was a jerk. When I read that rant on demigods I was like "What?"
      • Yeah, cause the gods aren't known for being hypocrites or anything.
      • There are multiple versions of Greek myths on record and some do say that Theseus indeed dumped Ariadne on an island on his own accord, so it's possible for Riordan to have just taken that version.
    • In story, I think Percy was just shocked that a guy who'd always seemed to be a jerk for the sake of it actually had a genuine grievance. However, I suspect that the meta-textual reason that it is not challenged is that, while the reader very often sees demigods blamed for the actions of parents they barely know, it is very easy for the reader to judge the Gods the same way, discounting them all as worthwhile people for the way we see them act. It's a subtle way of calling out the people who have Moral Myopia and making us notice the shades of grey.
    • If you don't recall, Percy does say something along the lines of "I wonder where we learned that from" - Dionysus just goes on to say that his point still stands and that heroes never change. I think this may have been his way of explaining that, although they still do some pretty mean and unjistifiable things, the gods have come to change in the last 3,000-some years - they don't flood modern-day people out because they're inhospitable like they did in the myths, and I think that, if you compare our society today to the society of Ancient Greece, a lot of demigods wouldn't be born as a result of 'rape', so called.
    • Except this case Dionysus is lying and being deliberately blind. The Lost Hero mentions Zeus sending Boreas to cause a blizzard over some city for pissing him off. The Olympians are notorious about their double standards.
    • I'm sorry, but at what point does the book mention that? In any case, I believe a more in-dept explanation may go something like this: if you've been alive for many thousands of years, living alongside and arguing with the same people today as you did back in 10,000 BC, you're more likely to notice even the smallest changes that come to each of them and disrupt this normalcy, whereas demigods and heroes come and go quickly to an immortal god, and with all of them having the potential to be so different from one another, it's expected, or at least understandable, that you'd start to pick up on the few things they seem to all have in common during the few thousand years you've been alive and watching them. Couple this with Dionysus, who doesn't seem to have much of a soft spot for children and is grumpy about being stuck babysitting them at camp, and it makes sense for him to be badmouthing demigods by listing off all of the bad things he's managed to take note of.

  • The whole Nico/Rachel ship. I'm going to ask you other fans: Nico is 13/14. Rachel is 16/17. Rachel is now a maiden. Like, until death. Why are people shipping them?
    • Pair the Spares? Rachel fans want their beloved to be happy so they attach her to the next most significant character. Nico fans may be looking for a romantic option for their favorite dead kid. Personally, I'm investigating alternative pairings for Nico mostly involving another child of a death god...
    • Being a shipper of them myself I can definately say that it's Pair The Spares. People need to pair Nico with SOMEONE and Annabeth or Clarisse or Thalia just doesn'
      • Maybe he'll find someone in the Roman camp?
    • This troper agrees with the first troper. Why do Nico and Rachel need to be romantically involved at all, with anyone?
    • To this troper, Nico/Thalia is a bigger headscratcher. Larger age gap: Nico is still 13/14 but Thalia is mentally 17/18. Like Rachel, Thalia's an eternal maiden. But you can bet Artemis would be less forgiving of her fricking Lieutenant breaking her vows, than Apollo of his Oracle. (In the myths, Artemis killed such 'traitors'). Plus Thalia enjoys being a Huntress AND she's immortal AND permanently travelling. At least Rachel and Nico are both around camp: There's potential for interaction. (Romantic or not). With Thalia and Nico, there's none at all. Why do people ship them?
      • "They both wear black" is the main reasoning.
      • Don't question shipper logic, lest your head goes boom.
      • Wouldn't recent developments in House of Hades, affect that?
      • Since when has something as simple as a character's sexuality stopped people from their shipping?

     Mortal weapons 
  • Celestial Bronze only harms mythical beings, correct? Seems to me that Percy and Co would be fairly screwed if Kronos just sent guys with guns after them. Hell, big strong guys with sticks would suffice because there's not much Percy's little "only kills monsters" blade could do to stop them. Granted that wouldn't be much of a story if Kronos just sicced a gang of mercenaries on Percy but if their weapons wouldn't work, what's to stop them from getting killed dead by mortals with shotguns?
    • He wanted Percy on his side. In Greek mythology you cant fight fate and so when a prophecy says when this douchebag turns sixteen hes either going to kill you or help you takeover the world you better goddamn make him want to work with you.
    • Plus, remember Percy's block-bullets thing? And that demigods are implied far stronger and, well, just better than mortals? or maybe the gods just think, "hey, it's embarrassing if mortals go around shooting our kids. I'll turn his gun into a dead fish."
    • Actually, Celestial Bronze works against Percy and other Demigods as well; they're weak against both steel and celestial bronze (in fact, using both is far more effective against a demigod than using just 1). Having demigods carry around celestial bronze is far more effective anyways, since while mercs might be great against demigods, all it would take to stop them would be for them to run into a mythological creature, who would be able to shrug off any bullets fired their way.

     Demigod power 
  • Demigod's level of power; how strong are we talking here? They're head and shoulders above laymen mortals but divine blood isn't the only way people come across enhanced strength and improved reflexes. Say if a demigod went up against a well trained mortal martial artist who would win? Could the Half-Bloods outfight a U.S. Marine or an SAS officer using comparable technology?
    • Children of Ares, maybe, due to Ares being the god of warfare. The others...not so much.
    • Well, if it was a kid of the Big Three, they could... (a) Vaporise them with lightning (b) Turn them into a fish (c) Send them straight to the Underworld.
    • Also, within the setting of the book the best trained US Marines or SAS officers would probably turn out to be demigods anyway. The idea is that most significant 'mortals' secretly are.
      • That, or Roman demigods, or magicians, or a magical something or another. I don't know to what extent all myths are true in this verse, but it seems like most important people are connected to some mythology.
    • It's also dependent on how you define "power." In general terms, a half-blood only inherent powers are having ADHD, ergo, enhanced battle reflexes. But that doesn't automatically make them masters in combat, unless perhaps they were a child of Athena or Ares, or Poseidon and soaking wet, maybe. The rest of their skill is only achieved through training and practice, which is the same thing real-world masters have to go through.
    • Also, "power" does NOT just flat-out beat skill. Sure, Percy would probably beat a mortal Master Swordsman in a sword fight. If Percy was on his game. If the other person wasn't a Combat Pragmatist and didn't ambush him. If the mortal doesn't just get flat-out lucky. Fights are never as easy as Hollywood depicts them.

     Dionysus rant 2 
  • Dionysus' rant about heroes in the third book. It's already been mentioned above, but... Well, isn't Dionysus a halfblood? Even with the handwave, his mother was still a mortal. It's true that most heroes in greek mythology - demigods or not - were idiots, but Dionysus is one too. It really just bugs me.
    • Depends on the myth. There are countless variations of Dionysus' birth from being born from a mortal woman to being born from Zeus' thigh. All myths seem to agree that he was mortal for a time, that he led an army of crazy women on a cross continent orgy of sex and violence before ascending to Olympus.
    • It's also very possible that Dionysus hates halfbloods so much because he was originally supposed to be one. Less idiocy and more hate for an inferior position he is embarrassed to have once been in.
    • Most versions of the myth have it as Dionysus being born from Zeus's thigh as a full-fledged god, due to Zeus storing him there after incinerating his mother with his godly form. And Dionysus being a half-blood had nothing to do with his rant. He was telling Percy that most heroes throughout history were grade-A jerks, and with the way Percy's going, he runs the risk of following in their footsteps. He wasn't saying that being a half-blood inherently makes you a jerk, just that it's a pattern he noticed a lot of them tended to follow.

     Fatal flaw 
  • Percy's Fatal Flaw is loyalty? I'm sorry, but that's the kind of "flaw" you put down for a job interview. Annabeth overly proud, Thalia is easily tempted with power, the Di Angelo's are prone to malicious grudges and Percy is...too good a friend?
    • To be fair, loyalty can be a flaw if the person lets their devotion to someone make them do bad things (like siding with somebody who's gone evil).
    • No, Percy's flaw is being insanely reckless when it comes to his friends. Yes, it can be a flaw, and if he didn't learn to control it, he'd probably be dead by the end of the book.
    • His flaw is putting the safety of his friends and family over the safety of the world. That's bad.
      • Wrath—all-consuming though justified anger—is a flaw when it's uncontrolled. Loyalty is a flaw when it's blind. Any virtue becomes a flaw is taken too far—love turns to obsession, justice turns to enforcement, kindness turns to subservience, etc. Overcoming one's fatal flaw is more about keeping it from getting to the point that it becomes a weakness. Percy himself seems to have realized it in the last book, as he prays that Kronos won't notice his mother and stepfather, knowing what would happen if he did.
      • From the few hints dropped in Son of Neptune, it seems as if this element may be explored in the third book.
    • Tapping into the potential of this kind of flaw is one of the things the film got right, in my opinion. These fatal flaws demigods had were said to be extensions of qualities their godly parents possessed, despite Poseidon’s loyalty to his loved ones never getting enough focus to come off as a problem. The film, though, changes Percy’s background so that when he was younger, Poseidon was so loving and devoted to him that he was neglecting his godly duties and literally becoming mortal so that he could spend time with him, which is why Zeus had to forbid contact between the gods and their offspring.
    • This also gets touched on in the Mark of Athena—Percy has to learn to let go and let others take on their tasks, even though he wants to do it for them.

     Percy's treatment of Hera 
  • Percy blowing off Hera at the end of Battle of the Labyrinth. Granted, Hera isn't the cuddliest Olympian but she saved his life and personally helped him on his quest. Percy and Annabeth came off as seriously ungrateful which angered Hera...and why would anyone want to purposefully provoke Hera, Goddess of Disproportionate Retribution?
    • Let's put it this way. If Charles Manson did you a favor back before everyone knew he was a murderer, would you help him out now?
      • If he was a supremely powerful being who everyone I knew thought had the right to do such thing and whom I could do nothing to help or harm at the time, when helping was defined as nodding and truthfully agreeing the favour was helpful and disagreeing would do nothing to change his horrific ways except mark me down as victim? ... Yeah, I probably would. ... Besides, by that logic, they wouldn't have any dealings with Athena or Poseidon, either.
      • He wasn't angry at what Hera did, he was angry at what she didn't do—he didn't like her dismissing Nico. As noted above, Percy's fatal flaw is personal loyalty.
    • No one said that Percy telling off Hera was a smart thing to do - he was doing it because it was the right thing to do, calling her out for the way she treated people she didn't consider perfect enough for her family, like Hephaestus or Nico.

     Godly DNA 3 
  • If gods don't have DNA, how do their children "inherit" their physical characteristics? It's mentioned Annabeth has her mother's hair, etc.
    • Annabeth's hair is actually a different color than her mother's (Athena's is black and Annabeth's is blonde). But anyway, Athena doesn't give birth conventionally, her children spring out of her head (much like how she was born), so she can probably create them in whatever image they want. As for the others...*shrug*.
    • Well, making a foetus requires some kind of DNA or DNA-substitute in order to create cells.

  • So, that Rachel Elizabeth Dare's name spells out "RED" isn't actually important?
    • The color symbolizes sacrifice. DUH.
      • Also, warning (danger), passion (love interest), fire (Apollo), beauty (love interest), anger (unhappy with her life).
    • I took it as a meaningless nod to her hair color.
    • This troper read it as R.E. Dare- "Are we there". Appropriate, since she was their guide through the Labyrinth.
    • In the next series, the villains hire an elite team of mercenaries known as "BLU" to hunt her down.

     Weak Demeter 
  • Why are Demeter and her halfblood kids portrayed as weaker/ lamer than the others? sure, you'd be hard pressed to find more than a handful of myths about her, and she's not as well loved, but still, she's not some little pansy. Doesn't anyone remember that she was willing to kill every mortal thing- animals, plants, men, women, children, all of it- because her daughter was missing? That is way more badass than turning someone into a spider. And then there's the guy who cut down her favorite tree. What does she do to him? she sics Hunger on him so that he EATS HIMSELF. How on earth is that not badass? She's insanely powerful, not a pushover that can't fight. She could just sic hunger on the enemy demigods until they died, and the titans would have had no army.
    • She WAS beloved in her day. She's the goddess of the harvest, that's one of the less glamorous but most important positions in the pantheon. I don't know about why she was portrayed that way, but as for the half bloods it's because farming powers aren't combat oriented. That said, any strategist can tell you about the importance of logistics and supplies.
      • Sorry- I meant if you ask a kid( or anyone really) " Who's your favorite Greek God or Goddess" you won't get many saying " Demeter". And the books don't really help- It's been a while since I read them, but the only named child of Demeter that I recall is mentioned at the end of Lost Hero, having gotten her nose stolen by one of the other campers. They never play any sort of role in the prophecies or even give aid to the heroes that get to go one quests. And their powers could be combat oriented- more so than Aphrodite's, and her kids get cool stuff and names! It's not like Demeter's not one of the major goddesses- but I can't recall a single scene where Demeter does anything plot related at all. she's just a vote on the council, that's all, and well, it bugs me.
    • (raises hand) HERE! I'm a complete Demeter fan :-) You haven't read your Pratchett, right? Godly power is proportional to the number of followers. And Demeter never participated in all the macho shit Zeus et al were dealing. She's the Bona Dea, the one goddess who is benign to mankind. Oh, Riordan could have ended the series very quick by Kronos attempting to do, eh, bad things to Persephone...and instantly Demeter would have wiped the floor of Tartaros with him. But that's a Parallel Universe book :-) Lest not forget the Crowning Moment of Funny with the Demeter/Persephone/Hades "We're one Dysfunctional Family" scene in the last book which had me in stitches. No, good sir, given that Demeter usually doesn't get ANY credits in Greek-myth based books, I didn't found her undermentioned.
    • I don't know where you get the idea that Demeter or her children are portrayed as weaker than the other gods. Just because they aren't mentioned in combat? Most half-bloods aren't inherently skilled in combat apart from their reflexes, and Demeter herself just never had a good reason to meet personally with Percy, unlike the other gods.
  • Completely averted in "The Trials of Apollo."

     Harry Potter 
  • You had to give him black hair and green eyes, didn't you, Rick Riordan? You had to give him black hair and green eyes and a more-or-less ordinary mother and a superpowered father and an inseparable female brainiac friend. There are readers smart enough not to go "OMG U RIPPED OFF HARRYPOTTER O NOES!" There are readers who... are not.
    • Er...Harry Potter's mother was a very powerful witch. And where does it say what colour his hair and eyes are?
    • Yes, let's blame the author for the stupidity of the readers when he's not encouraging it.
    • Actually, I see your point. Black hair and green eyes isn't a particularly common combination in real life. I don't think Riordan stole from Harry Potter know, he finished writing the manuscript in 1994 and HP 1 came out in '97. But it might've been a smart marketing move to change the freaking hair/eyes combo for this very reason.
      • Hold on I know plenty of people who have this combo of eye and hair color. PLUS SEA green eyes and green eyes are actually a big difference I always though of Hp's eyes as being mantis green while Percy would have something more like teal or Persian green. Also two people can have the same hair and eye color and still look nothing alike.
    • Whether intentional or not there are a lot of similarities between first books of HP and Percy Jackson. However, the following books stand alone. So wait, he has a brainy female friend (Annabeth->Hermione), a friend who is knowledgeable about the new 'magical' world (Grover->Ron). He suspects a particular character of wrongdoing, but they are actually not responsible (Hades->Snape), while a character that is helping the character (Ares->Quirrell) who is actually a puppet of the real big bad who people are nervous about naming and who they think is long dead/out of action forever (Voldemort->Cronos). While there is a secret magical place that teaches you to use your 'magic' (Camp Half-Blood->Hogwarts) where you see your school antagonist (Clarisse->Malfoy) who lives with some apparent 'bad apples' (Ares House->Slytherin). And all the while you are special because of something that was essentially out of your control (Percy[being the son of Poseidon]->Harry[taking out Voldemort when he was a baby]). The teacher in charge has taken a particular interest in the main character and appears to be respected by the people who he trains (Chiron->Dumbledore). All the while normal people have no idea what is going on and don't think that their particular world ever really existed despite legends of their that say there was. That being said, there are still enough differences to make it its own story, the similarities are there when comparing the first books of the series and it is distracting.
      • Not to mention a pair of trouble making brothers (Stoll Brothers->Weasley Twins).
      • Also a language that the protagonist understands inexplicably (Ancient Greek->Parseltongue)
    • Percy Jackson is certainly not a rip off of Harry Potter. It's certainly easy to point out the similarities between the two franchise, as evidenced above, yet they are different enough that you can't accuse PJ of being a ripoff of HP. Would you really compare Clarisse and the Ares cabin to Draco Malfoy and the Slytherin House? (While they both cause problems for the protagonist, Clarisse/Ares are still reliable, while Draco/Slytherin are straight up evil). Where does Luke Castellan fit into this analogy? Are the greek gods supposed to be the exact same thing as the Ministry of Magic? (Both annoying and full of themselves, yet they serve very different functions). As stated on the home page of, these are not clichés; they are tropes. You are likely to see these sort of things show up in any franchise; (the mentor character, powerful parents, brainy friend, etc.). There may be a 'golden trio' in both franchises, but their personalities, chemistries, and backstories are distinctly different. Both recipes use similar ingredients, but they use different amounts, and each have their own special sauce.
    • Percy is based off of Rick Riordan's son, so his appearance is most likely based on him.
    • From what I've seen, the two don't seem to resemble each other.
    • Watch this video, comparing The Lord of the Rings and Harry Potter. You'd be surprised how similar those two stories are, yet you probably wouldn't argue that Harry Potter is a rip-off of Lord of the Rings. These are tropes and archetypes, not clichés. What makes the story interesting is how the author uses these characters in different ways. For example, comparing Hermione and Annabeth, Hermione stubbornly asserts her opinions and struggles against prejudices in the wizarding world, while Annabeth is more comfortable in the godly world, and learns to overcome her own pride. Compare Clarisse and Draco; Clarisse is generally on the side of good, though she is a bully, and must overcome her own pride in order to be of help to the heroes. Draco, on the other hand, struggles with the will of his parents and his peers, as well as the philosophies he had held since he was a child. The Harry Potter books have a strong message of friendship and equality, while the Percy Jackson books focus more on family.
      • A lot of that video is comparing very basic character types, though - "short guy who lives with his uncle" or "wise old mentor" or "blonde-haired guy who thinks he's better than everyone else." Of course a lot of stories seem similar if your archetypes are as basic as those. Harry Potter and Percy Jackson are way too comparable on a much deeper level. Harry and Percy are both inexperienced, green-eyed boys with black hair, the subjects of important prophecies, with a flaw of caring too much about those around them and being willing to sacrifice anything for their friends. You also have the smarter and more competent lady-friend despite her coming from a similar background as the main character (Annabeth/Hermione), the bumbling guy friend who's still more experienced with this new world the main character is now a part of (Ron/Grover), the bully character who struggles under the wishes and expectations of his/her parents (Clarisse/Draco), having a secret place where "special" children can train to survive in the outside world that's disguised as an everyday facility that children would normally go to, an overarching governmental entity that rules over the world and is frequently portrayed as corrupt, incompetent, apathetic, etc...Even the basic premises of the two of them are way too similar - a secret, fantastical world that exists just beside our own normal, modern-day world. (This is mainly the one that gets me.)
    • Tropes Are Not Bad, people.
      • Doesn't mean they're necessarily good, either.

     Gold weaponry 
  • Jason's sword/spear is made of Imperial gold. You know, the same metal that's only used for jewellery and ornamentation because it bends under stress? How can it be any use in combat?
    • Its not the same metal. The imperial gold used in the books is a magical metal. Bronze is one of the weakest metals, but the magical kind in the books can cut through steel.
    • Also, it is one of the few weapons we've seen breaking in this universe, so it's not like it was shown to be indestructible.

     Neglectful gods 
  • How are the gods any better than the Titans? Yeah, I know, the Titans want to blow up the world and force humanity back into "darkness" (whatever that is,) want to end civilization as we know it, et cetera, et cetera. But all the gods do is sit back, be jerkasses, make unbreakable prophecies that make humans miserable and in general patronize and overcontrol everybody. There is no free choice in Percy's world because the gods control everything. Is that really a good message to send to kids and teens - that there's no point taking responsibility for your own life because you've got one fate that's going to come to be anyway, just because some jerky gods want to control your life? What. I wouldn't want either existence, personally - the Titans in control or the gods in control, I would have fled to a safe corner of the multiverse where I can take charge of my own life, thank you. You know what would have been an epic ending? Percy defying both the gods ''and'' the Titans.
    • So, I have only read one book in the series so... the Titans want to force humanity back into "darkness"? Where does Prometheus stand about this?
      • The Titans are worse because the implication is most of them want to return mankind back to the stone age (or at least an age of severe ignorance). The Titans are basically always Chaotic Evil beings who view mortals as sport. The gods are portrayed as a bit better because they allow mankind to advance and while being major jerks and a-holes a lot of the time they also tend to have their kinder sides as well. They or their demigod children are responsible for many of the world's problems, but both parties are also responsible for a lot of the good as well.
      • And you are wrong with some of your arguments. The gods do not control everything its the Fates whom ultimately do. Zeus's attempt to avert the prophecy worked to bring it true. Hermes stated he knew Luke's fate, but telling him would have somehow made things worse. Its implied that on some level it is possible to defy fate or at least certain key moments are not set in stone. Luke chose to sacrifice himself to stop Kronos. As for the gods, the implication is they do not control mortals nearly as much as you imply. Apollo stated one of Zeus's rules limits how much the gods can interfere in mortal affairs. The gods seem more or less to follow the trends of human civilization and control the big picture, but do not micromanage leaving many things up to mortals. Its their children who typically use their powers to change the mortal world and not the gods.
      • I don't know which book you have read, but in "The Last Olympian" Prometheus sides with the Titans. Its implied that much of his foreknowledge comes from being able to calculate the most probable outcome of events. He sides with the Titans because he believed the Olympian side did not have the strength to win just has he calculated the Titans did not have the strength to win in the first war. He cites how the Olympians are just as petty as the Titans due to Hermes knowing of Luke's future, but doing nothing to prevent it. He claims to have a revelation that would advance mankind as far as fire as brought humanity this far, but Zeus would never allow humans to grow that powerful. His ultimate side seems to be his own and to a degree humanity. It is implied that one of his reasons for siding with the Titans is his hatred for Zeus due to his punishment involving the eagle and this could be clouding his judgment.
      • Greek gods are indeed total jackasses. That's the point of a Greek god. I have to agree with the OP and say that the best ending would be for Percy to Take a Third Option. I mean, the gods really don't seem to have done much good, in all honesty.
      • The problem with that is that it's implied that the Greek Gods are the pillars on which civilization stands. In the end, having a bunch of jackasses in charge is infinitely better than having nobody in charge because everyone's dead. Ultimately, the Gods leave humanity alone for the most part. Kronos, on the other hand, wants to eat the United Nations.
      • Its also revealed in "The Last Olympians" that the Gods are so tied to the Western Civilization that if they died than civilization will die with it(e.g Demeter dies, than the whole breadbasket Mid-West becomes a barren wasteland, If Hermes Dies, Commerce, Free Trade, communications and the internet will cease to exist, If Zeus dies, electricity will vanished etc). So Percy Jackson really has no choice to side with the gods because every good thing in life is because of them.
      • Hey, what about Pan? He died, and nothing happened!
      • Maybe it's more of a gradual thing. If Demeter died the Midwest wouldn't have turned into a Dust Bowl at the snap of a finger. The area would likely have petered out over several decades or a century. As for Pan, he is the god of wilderness and forests... which are gradually fading anyway. Perhaps that is what killed him in the first place. His death may simply speed up the process.

     Making Maria immortal 
  • In The Titan's Curse, Dionysus talks about making a mortal woman his immortal wife after her death. Why then, when Maria Di Angelo was killed, did Hades have to "respect the rules of death" and lose her forever? Was it because he already had a wife, like first come, first serve?
    • I think its a combination of his divine role and the reason you stated. As the god of the underworld Hades is in charge of maintaining fairness and the overall afterlife. He can't just change the rules whenever he feels like it. Otherwise, it's a betrayal of his divine duty which is something Hades has shown to take more seriously than Zeus. The other is if he resurrected her Persephone would no doubt take it as some sort of insult and Hades would be pushing things too far.
      • Yeah but what could she do, isn't she just like, the goddess of flowers or something?
      • "Persephone" means "Bringer of Destruction". In a quite a lot of mythos, Persephone, once she has changed from Kore, becomes as much the queen of the underworld as Hades is the king. She's just as powerful as he is, in their realm.
    • Did the book clarify that Ariadne was dying at the time Dionysus made her immortal?. But even if he did, if he saw it coming, then he would've had time to make the change, or possibly, ask Zeus to make the change. Hades didn't have time to do this because Maria was killed suddenly, by a thunderbolt, that no one saw coming until it had already struck. That's why he couldn't do anything - once she's dead, she's moving on to the afterlife. Ariadne may have been close to death, but she was still alive when Dionysus changed her. Her spirit hadn't left her body yet.
  • Not just that, but Book 5 shows that you need a unanimous vote of the Council to make someone a god. No way they'd agree to that for Maria.

     Luke's sacrifice 
  • Why does everyone treat Luke's death like a huge Heroic Sacrifice when he was going to die anyway? Doesn't going to Elysium beat being burned away as Kronos rises?

  • Okay, so Poseidon wasn't allowed to have children with mortal women. Did he ever, ugh, hear of this little thing called a condom? Or does he have magical sperm with a 100% chance of getting a child?
    • Condoms can break. And Poseidon could've easily been in an arrogant mood and just not cared for unreliable man-made protection.
    • Not to mention we don't exactly know what is being exchanged when a mortal and god have intercourse (see the discussion about the gene-god issue above), so a condom might not be able to block whatever is happening.
    • In the original myths, it is explicitly stated (by Poseidon, to his mortal one-night stand of ...questionable consent...) that "The embrance of a god is never barren." I don't think any form of contraceptive would work.
    • He and his brothers also could’ve limited themselves to women who are already infertile, but I think it’s pertinent that the thing that made them agree to the abstinence pact and the thing that made them want to go against it are two different parts of their anatomy.

     Half-blood relationships 
  • Am I missing something, or is Percy Annabeth's uncle? Cause that's only slightly disturbing.
    • Uncle once removed, which is probably more than enough gap for most mortal relationships, except for the fact that most uncles once removed would be significantly older than their niece. Also, see above for debate about gods not having genes.
      • No. In order to be Annabeth's Uncle, he would have to be a sibling of her parent. Since Athena is Zeus's offspring, not Poseidon's, this makes Percy and Annabeth second cousins.

     Curse of Achilles 
  • The Curse of Achilles. How specific is it about choosing places on your body to make weak? Do you have to have it on the outside of your body? For example could I choose to make my stomach my only weak point? Or my heart? Surely that would make you basically invincible except to poison or heart failure. Or why not your spleen or something very small and totally random. Sure maybe Percy just wouldn't be the type to think about those sorts of things but would it be theoretically possible. Also, even if it has to be something on the outside of your body, why not an eyeball, so if anything is about to hit you you can just close your invincible eyelid and no harm will come to you.
    • If it was his eye he would die the second an invincible eyelash got stuck in his eye. Achilles died of essentially a tiny scratch from what I recall.
    • What if he gets a vat of acid to his face? or an arrow through the eye? jeez, i think something at a high speed would penetrate his eyelid. I forgot what the concept is called, if you try and keep it a secret, the person you're keeping it from will find out (memory sucks sorry). And Organs fail, Percy would be no exception.
      • No, it wouldn't pierce his eyelid if it wasn't the vincible part. "Invincible, anyone?"
    • It's the place from which Percy imagined a cord coming, connecting him back to the people he loved, so it would probably take a pretty good imagination to make it come from a minor internal organ, especially whilst standing in the Styxx.
    • Since a hero's death in Greek myth is usually decreed by the Fates, you can't rules-lawyer it. Achilles was given the choice of long life and an obscure death or to die young and have glory forever. He chose the glory. Once he did that it was only a matter of time until the fatal blow found his weak spot. It wouldn't matter if Percy had chosen "under the toenail of my left pinky toe," something would have found its way there eventually if he'd been fated to die.

     Percy's parent 
  • In The Lightning Thief,before Percy's godly parent is known,Grover states that he could be a son of Nemesis. Nemesis is a female god,and Percy already has a mom. What?
    • If Gods can take pretty much ANY form (which they do, e.g. Zeus as a horse, bull, swan, golden light, a storm, etc.), do you think that gods can't change gender? In fact, there was even an intersexed god/dess named Hermaphroditus, the child of both Hermes and Aphrodite. So... Yeah.
    • In the original myths, Zeus seduced Callisto by taking the form of Artemis and impregnated her. It's up to version and interpretation whether he changed back to his own form for the impregnating part, but... y'know, we can safely assume gods can do whatever they want. Also in the original, Hera had children on her own, and in the series, Athena has children with mortal men while remaining a virgin.
    • Grover's diction is that Percy could be the son of a minor god, like Nemesis. It was used for comparison (albeit phrased rather badly).
    • In Magnus Chase and the Gods of Asgard, one of the characters was actually mothered by Loki transforming himself into a female.
    • "The Trials of Apollo" also has Apollo mention that one of his sons has two dads.
    • Although I think the likeliest explanation is that Riordan didn't know at that time that Nemesis was female, and he just threw the name in without bothering to check. I feel like the suggestion would've been commented on in-universe if it was really what Grover had meant, and it fits with the author not knowing Khione existed until he was five books in. The Lightning Thief was still his first, so it makes sense that he wouldn't know every facet of the mythology yet.

     Zeus's rule 
  • Why is Zeus such an idiot? Seriously, I know he is supposed to have deep character flaws, but for the ruler of the world he comes across as a complete moron. Every time he is mentioned or shows up it only makes a situation worse, screwed up, or acted like a complete jerk (putting it very nicely). If he cannot bully his way out of a problem or use a thunderbolt to solve it he comes across as useless. Under his rule in recent times we have had two near civil wars in the first book of each series (the first being his fault), two crisis he has ignored when they are obvious allowing them to grow in strength (both threats), and such dislike of his rule that he basically gave both Kronos an army with the demigods and minor gods. All in all he comes across as something worse than a massive jerk being paranoid gullible, incredible arrogant even for gods, and all around unlikable. Add on his general disregard for others (including wanting to put off saving his own wive) he inspires little to no loyalty in anyone except his wife and perhaps Athena. About the only purpose he serves is to keep the gods somewhat under control with a WMD and one wonders what that says about the Olympians as a whole. Is this really the only way to portray him? Wouldn't it be easier to destroy Olympus by turning them against each other? It comes across as fairly easy thing to do.
    • I believe it is established that in some of these cases, Zeus was under evil mind control. Also, Zeus was never depicted as being particularly wise. Honestly, who needs wisdom when you can vaporize whoever comes your way with a lightning bolt?
      • Zeus wasn't under mind control. Khione can influence behavior by playing on a person's own feelings. In this case she merely suggested what Zeus was already thinking. And there is a difference between being wise and being outright incompetent.
    • "Wouldn't it be easier to destroy Olympus by turning them against each other?" This is EXACTLY what happens in the first book. It doesn't take because Percy, Annabeth, and Grover succeed in their quest and stop it.
    • Also, Kronos being able to amass a large force of unloved demigods wasn't directly Zeus's fault. He never did anything that kept the other gods from claiming their children...If anything, he was actually one of the ones who went above and beyond, turning his daughter into a tree and using it to power a barrier around camp, thereby protecting other demigods in the process. And his closing the gates of Olympus in the sequel series was because Khione suggested he should do it - as she puts it, she's only confirming people's greatest fears with what she does, but he may not have resorted to it if she hadn't done so.
    • Worth noting is, Zeus did have his more generous moments in the original myths, such as the tale of Baucis and Philemon. He was the patron of justice and hospitality, as well as his other trademarks. His jarring portrayal here in these books is probably due to several factors: A.) Changing values; showing kindness and hospitality toward strangers isn't promoted as much in the modern day as it was back then, so he may have lost that side to him over the centuries, B.) Most of his actions being viewed through the eyes of Percy, for whom he's already made his lack of fondness quite clear, and C.) because Riordan chose to write him that way. And even then, he's never been shown to be completely devoid of reasoning or empathy - examples of both include letting Percy live despite being sired against Poseidon's sworn oath (keep in mind what Percy could've grown up to accomplish, due to the prophecy), showing at least two or three signs of loyalty to his own daughter, and at least offering Hades the chance to send Bianca and Nico to camp (which he had good reason to), and only going back on it once Hades made it clear that he wasn't going to oblige.
      • {{Percy Jackson's Greek Gods}} kind of addressed this by stating while Zeus has his moments of kindness and has responsibilities he has always been irresponsible which is why Greek kings tended to get away with abusing their power though I do admit Riordan's portrayal is one of the most stupid and jerkish portrayals I have ever seen. But I don't see your empathic moments working. He let Percy live because it would have looked bad killing a mortal who did him a service, shown favoritism for his own daughter which Zeus claims he is supposed to avoid, and to maintain peace with Poseidon which he explicitly stated why he let Percy live. And while he did offer to let Nico and Bianac go to Camp Half-blood it was the general mistreatment of Hades that caused the latter to distrust Zeus. Hephaestus stated Zeus excels as being a jerk, Hera confirmed he has a long history of letting his pride make wrong decisions and refuse to change unless he had to, and Achelous confirmed major Olympians are rarely punished for their crimes. Truth is, this version of Zeus is just a poor king whose positive traits are overshadowed by his negative ones especially when compared to other Riordan god-kines like Ra, Horus, and Odin. Hence, why Khione only needed to push him slightly into closing Olympus.
      • I never said any of these were major redeeming factors. Just things to keep in mind. His "favoring" Thalia is still noteworthy considering how many other half-bloods have gone unclaimed and unattended by their godly parents. And regardless of the reason he let Percy live (and I get the impression it did have something to do with losing Thalia, since he didn't show such reservations with Bianca and Nico), he still let him live. That counts for something.
    • As with all the Greek gods, being larger than life means that Zeus's flaws are also larger than life. He was created out of storytelling, and it's worth noting that unflawed heroes make for terrible stories. (See also Mary Sue.) Also, power corrupts, and when you get right down to it Zeus was not exactly given the best upbringing as a child. Who exactly is going to be able to smack Zeus down and teach him a lesson when he does something stupid?

     Prometheus siding with the Titans 
  • How does Prometheus, who can see the future, pick the wrong side? He said he looked into the future, and Olympus lost. Either he's really bad at his job, or he's a complete moron.
    • Its implied that much of his foreknowledge comes from being able to calculate the most probable outcome of events. He sides with the Titans because he believed the Olympian side did not have the strength to win just has he calculated the Titans did not have the strength to win in the first war. Remember, at the time Hades was sulking in the underworld with no sign he would change and Poseidon was busy with Oceanus. Even if Kronos had not attacked Olympus it did not look like the gods would stop Typhon in time. The bitterness between Zeus and his brother and their own selfishness and pride is so great it was highly unlikely they would put aside their differences. Zeus almost had a fit when he had to thank them. It is implied that one of his reasons for siding with the Titans is his hatred for Zeus due to his punishment involving the eagle and this could be clouding his judgment. Finally, Prometheus saw one future. Its strongly implied that the future is not entirely set in stone. Percy saw one future where he grows old and dies, but could have changed that by becoming immortal. Prometheus once saw a future where a son of Metis would overthrow Zeus so Zeus took steps to prevent it.
    • Also, even if you look past Poseidon and Hades not helping until their children convinced them to, the fate of Olympus really came down to Percy giving Annabeth's knife over to Luke, disarming himself in the process, instead of the more sensible and likely option of trying to take down Kronos on his own. If Prometheus was only looking at the most likely outcome, it's no surprise that he bet on the Titans' victory.

     Hera having kids 
  • Ok, I know that this doesn't really make sense, but- Why couldn't Hera have kids? She's the goddess of marriage, right? So here's a scenario- just hear me out. So there's this mortal couple, right? And they really want kids, but the Wife can't- she doesn't have any eggs.( it happens) and the marriage gets strained, because they both want this so much, but can't afford to adopt. so Hera shows up, offers her Goddess/divine Egg, and they do a type of surrogate mother thing- Hera's egg in the mortal lady's womb. Presto, one half-blood of Hera, no cheating AND a saved marriage, which is Hera's domain anyway, so it's not like Zeus could get really mad at her, she was faithful and she was using her powers to do her job.
    • I seriously doubt Hera would lower herself in that way. It would be simpler for Hera just to magically fix whatever is preventing the woman from having children. It is questionable if gods even reproduce the same way as humans. They are portrayed more as beings of pure magic then flesh and blood. In Hera's mind that may very well be considered cheating especially if she did it without Zeus's permission. And Zeus would throw a fit since Hera could have fixed it the way I mentioned. He also is not known for being the understanding or reasonable type. Sorry, but it doesn't work.
      • In the original myths, Hera was always mad at Zeus for cheating on her all the time, so if she cheated she'd become a hypocrite.
      • Helping individuals doesn't seem to be the gods' style anyway, unless said individuals are actually important. If Hera is the goddess of childbirth, then I assume it's meant in the general sense, so MOST women get to have children or something.
      • Hera's way of thinking is just a tiny little bit old fashioned, so she'd probably consider the children bastards if the parents aren't married, sex or no sex.
      • Also, she seems to mostly want children so she can bring them up. Having someone else raise them would defeat the point.
    • In some versions of the myths, Hera did try to have a child outside of her marriage with Zeus. For those of you who don't know, she ended up pitching the result of that little attempt right off the mountain when she saw his ugly mug.
    • Also, she's the Goddess of Marriage. For her to break her wedding vows would be like Mr. D taking a vow of sobriety, or Ares becoming a pacifist. It literally could never happen-it's against her very nature.
    • In addition to her not wanting to go against her marriage vows, if the goddess of childbirth wanted to give an infertile couple the chance to have a child, she could probably just heal their infertility with her magic.

     Gods of the West 
  • The Olympians claim that they are more or less embodiments of Western Civilization and without them it would collapse into chaos. Do you think this is true? The Egyptian gods from the Kane Chronicles are supposedly the first gods of the west. They were imprisoned after Egypt was conquered by the Romans with no known ill effects. Pan, the god of the wild, died and entrusted mortals with protecting the wild instead of him. So would Western Civilization fall without the Olympians? Or is it they are just the upholders of the current order? Without them another set of gods like the Titans may replace them and reorder the world.
    • Uh, how would Egypt be the West? They're in the Middle East.
    • The thing is, Western Civilization is the current order. Yes, humanity and society could endure past the fall of the Olympians. But whoever replaces the Olympians may not be so disposed to liking humans; for instance, the Titans pretty much treat mortals as trash. I doubt they'd let civilization survive once they took power.
      • This other troper doesn't quite understand how the order could be tied to the gods, though. Prometheus, a titan, was the one who created humanity and gave us fire or enlightenment or whatever in the original myths, which seriously pissed off Zeus.
      • Big gaps between the earliest controlled fire and the earliest civilization. Somewhere between 60, 000 years and 260, 000 years, to be specific. Also, it wasn't the giving people fire that pissed off Zeus, it was the fact that he stole it from the gods.
    • One has to guess that even if civilization survived without the Olympians, they probably wouldn't be going around telling people that. Think of them like politicians. "If I'm not re-elected president, the world will end." Just because someone says something doesn't mean its true, especially if they are egotistical maniacs or people who worship them.
    • One must realize that there are many type of Western Civilizations, Egypt was the First Western Civilization, but it collapse because Isis banish Ra in The Kane Chronicles. After that The Greek Gods took over and created a new one with Greek and Rome.if the Greek Gods die than odds are U.S and every nation that has ever been influence by Greek or Roman culture(e.g U.K, France, and every country that has democratic government or has been part of the Roman Empire), will collapse into chaos, allowing any new diety to take their place and create a new "western civilization" albeit in their own image. This is probably what the Titans were planning to do.

     Thalia's age 
  • If Thalia was 12 when Annabeth was 7, how come she's only 15 in The Titan's Curse, when Percy and Annabeth are 14? Did being turned into a tree slow the aging process on her?
    • Yes.
      • It was explicitly stated by Apollo, who managed to calculate her exact age. She didn't know how old she was until he told her.

     Nymph Hunters 
  • In The Titan's Curse, Zoe says that nymphs can become Hunters of Artemis. The problem is that a nymph can't go too far away from her tree/river/whatever, and the Hunters are always traveling. When a nymph becomes a Hunter of Artemis, what happens to her tree/river? Is it not tied to her life force anymore?
    • We just don't know. True to the original myths, the gods have all kinds of mysterious and not at all defined powers, so maybe Artemis can "untie" them. The author probably didn't think of it when he mentioned nymphs offhand, though.
    • In the original mythology, Artemis was always attended by a group of nymphs who were originally, I believe, either ocean or river spirits. When they joined her, in a way she became their tether/life force. So yes, the ability for a nymph to leave their original tree/river/etc once they swear themselves to Artemis is just part of the Hunter blessing. Eternal youth, magical bow, increased strength and stamina, and for nymphs being untethered from their focus.
    • Actually, the nymphs who accompanied Artemis in the myths were typically dryads or oreads (mountain nymphs) since those were the hunting grounds she frequented most often.

     Godly DNA 4 
  • The children in a few of the cabins were mentioned to look alike, so why doesn't anyone seem to pay attention to appearance when trying to find out who the kid's parent is? On a related note, why do some gods have children who all look like them, and others resemble their human parents instead? How does that work, exactly - if Sally was Chinese, would Percy have looked half-Chinese or something?
    • On the first note (why do they not pay attention to appearance?)... because genetics are weird? Even if we disregard the "God's don't have genes" thing (see further up the page), there's still the fact that just because you look lime somebody does not mean you are related. For instance, most of Athena's children have grey eyes. Does that mean every demi-god with grey eyes is a child of Athena? No. Of course not. A demi-god could, for example, be the child of Hermes and a woman with grey eyes, inheriting the mortal mother's eye color. Or it could be an eye color shared with another God (Zeus also has grey eyes). Add in the fact that the gods can change shape to look like pretty much whatever they want and appearance would, in fact, be an incredibly poor way to try and label a demi-god's godly parent.
    • On the second question (why do some gods have children who look like them and some don't?)... the same reason some humans have children who look like them and some don't. Genetics are tricky. You inherit half of your genetic make up from mom and half from dad. But that doesn't mean you will look like a perfect combo of mom and dad, because some genes are dominant and some are recessive. For example, in real life, if your mother is dark skinned with dark hair and dark brown eyes, and your father is light skinned with green eyes and red hair, you will most likely end up looking very similar to your mother and not too similar to your dad. Likewise, in P Jat O, sometimes the kids look more like their godly parent, sometimes they look more like the mortal one. As to the "if Sally was half Chinese" question... like any other couple, if Sally was Asian and had Percy with Poseidon, Percy would most likely take some traits from her and some from his father, but it would depend on which genes were dominant. So he could end up looking pretty much 100% Asian, or he could end up looking 100% Caucasian. Most likely he would be somewhere in the middle. But it would depend on the genes. And of course, none of this is taking into account the "godly shape shifting", "lack of real genes" and "possible weird ways of reproducing" that have all been discussed further up this page.

     Lightning Thief prophecy 
  • The prophecy from the first book isn't complete. You shall go west and face the god who has turned - Ares.
You shall find what was stolen and see it safely returned. - Done that.You shall be betrayed by one who calls you a friend. - Luke.And you shall fail to save what matters most, in the end. - This line of the prophecy isn't fulfilled. He saved his mother, so it can't be her - so if not his mother, and not the bolt, then what?
  • It WAS his mother, and was referring to how she had to 'save' herself from Gabe. Or, it could have been how she was stuck in Hades. when Percy goes there, he wasn't able to save her. (how do I add spoiler tags?) Either way, it was talking about how Percy wasn't the one that saved her.

     Weight of the sky 
  • Who/What held up the sky before the Olympians decided to punish Atlas with it?
    • The story I've heard is that there was a pillar holding up the sky, and that the first war between the Titans and gods cracked it.
    • In the one I saw, there wasn't any sky before that.
    • Riordan addresses this; as he lays it out, it was the presence of the four titans of the cardinal points - north, south, east, west - that maintained the pillars of the sky, and after the first Titan War things were rejiggled so the sky was held up in the middle, by Atlas, rather than at the corners.
    • According to some outside source or another, the earth and the sky weren't in contact at all times to necessitate someone holding it up. Rather, they only made contact when they were...canoodling, as it were. The reason bearing its weight becomes such a constant struggle, then, is because it hasn't touched the earth in so long — I believe Atlas even mentions something to this effect.

     Godly reproduction 
  • Unlike the original Greek Mythology in the PJO series there is a large number of demigods who are the children of goddesses rather then gods. Alright fair enough times change and the gods change values with it. Except, how is that possible? Gods can sire several children at a time but goddesses can only carry one at a time which would mean the demigods of gods would outnumber that of godessess signifigantly. For that matter wouldn't the other gods note when a godesses is pregnent since she can't hide like the mortal consort of a god can. You would expect that to be a kind of big deal what with Aphrodite being married to Hephaestaus and all (and Hephaestus is not the understanding type). I can forgive Athena because of the whole "brain child" thing but that still dosen't explain Demeter or Aphrodite.
    • Well, if we follow human biology (which is entirely optional), they could still have about one child a year, which is a whole lot of children. Aphrodite could be explained - the cheating part is a given since she's been doing it forever (I doubt Hephaestos has been trying to get her into a trap with every lover), and Percy pretty much described her as all of his celebrity crushed pulled together, so who knows if she even appears as herself. Also, Demeter had lovers in the myths, but I don't recall her ever getting married. Sure Hera would still call her children bastards, but she's not cheating on anyone.
    • You're asumming they follow human biology. Goddesses can appear in multiple places at once in one form or another. I doubt pregnancy works the same way for them.
    • It's established in The Lost Hero that Gods can be in as many places as they want at a time. So, say, Aphrodite could theoretically simultaneously be in Seattle, Houston and Boston having three different kids with three different mortals all at once.

     Percy flying 
  • In the first book, Zeus says he will let Percy live so long as he doesn't presume to fly again. But in the second and third books, he flies on horseback, and in the fourth, he flies using one of Daedalus's machines. So why is he still alive?
    • It's flat out said that Pegasi are fair game. Percy's dad made horses, but Zeus is lord of the sky. It's neutral. As for Daedalus, I honestly don't remember that happening at all.
    • Also, Zeus tends to be full of hot air. Sure, he will bluster around to ease he wounded pride, but deep down he knows that if he kill Percy Poseidon will hold Zeus accountable. Given Zeus himself has time and again broken the oath making him a hypocrite and knows Percy does not deserve to die it would only make him look bad if he killed Percy. Afterall, he let his own children live.
      • This. When Percy brought back the lightning in book one Zeus says he should have shot the plane Percy was on midflight, Poseidon immediately calls his bluff saying that Zeus knew very well the bolt was on the plane and he would have never risked destroying that, and after hearing Percy out Zeus specifically states the reason why he lets Percy live despite his existence being a breach of the agreement is to "preserve peace in the family"- i.e., to not get Poseidon mad.
    • Percy is also concerned about this when he uses Daedalus' wings. The trick there was that they didn't go all that high, thus not attracting notice. Plus it was very short. Same with pegasi-they almost certainly fly much lower than horses.
      • The books explain that pegasi are fair game for Percy to fly on since Poseidon fathered them. It doesn't matter how high they go - they're neutral territory, so Zeus doesn't touch them.

     New gods 
  • Okay, I suppose the answer is obvious in terms of narrative, but I kinda want an in-universe explanation for the fact that in all the years since the ancient Greek myths were told, the gods didn't get any more children with each other.
    • With Zeus and Hera it may be they haven't touched each other or considering how Hephaestus and Ares turned out they did not want anymore. The rest could just be birth control. Why would Poseidon want a hundred immortal kids running around. The ones he has already create enough of a headache and would either be rivals for Triton, potential to overthrow him, or just more than he needs or wants to have to look after. It may also be that if each god fulfills a universal role no more are needed because all of the roles are currently occupied.
    • It's simple. Somewhere on down the line, the Greeks got conquered (was it by the Romans? My history is fuzzy), so nobody made any new Greek myths, so there were no more stories about these gods having babies with each other. The gods are tied to society and culture. Since there were no stories about gods having babies with each other, the gods no longer had babies with each other. Since all (most?) mortals no longer believe in/worship the Greek gods, they are essentially sterile.
      • Alternatively, maybe they have been having children this whole time, but since no one believed in them anymore they never became known to mortals and so they faded.
      • That's not how fading works. People nowadays don't believe in the gods like they did in Ancient Greece, and even back then, there were still some of them who didn't receive ample worship, like Khione. The books make it clear that a god's own will and desire to live, as well as the extent of their sphere of influence, also factor into whether or not they fade.
    • It's also possible the gods are just bored with each other by this point. Zeus and Poseidon both broke the pact of abstinence that was held between them, which certainly seemed to put a strain on their relationships with their wives, and even Hades, loyal, humble, true-to-his-word Hades, found a loophole in the rules of death and arranged for his demigod children to be placed inside the Lotus Casino, prolonging their lifespans, and later allowed Nico to live with him in the Underworld, which likewise puts him on bad terms with Persephone, who never actually liked him anyway, since he kidnapped her in order to marry her. Ares and Aphrodite wouldn't be able to get together as often since Hephaestus has so many traps laid for them across America. Athena, Hestia, and Artemis are all virgin goddesses, Demeter seems a bit too picky to just go about sleeping with people, Dionysus is one of the few gods who actually is happily married, and Apollo may be too busy with his job to sire any more children...and even if he wasn't, he doesn't have many options - besides the three who are virgins, and Aphrodite constantly being fought over by Ares and Hephaestus, that leaves only Hera, who's too loyal to her husband to betray their marriage, and Demeter, who seems like she would be too naggy and picky for Apollo's taste.
      • Who says there aren't any new ones? There may well be new ones who just don't affect the plot.
      • Even if they didn't have an effect on the plot (and it's not like it would've been impossible to give them one), it would seem that they would be worth mentioning, even in casual conversation. There are, what, four or five different series' focused on the existence of ancient gods in the modern world, you'd think that if new gods had been born, they would've been brought up at some point.

     Not for kids 
  • Anyone here just find the whole series NOT FOR KIDS? Anyone who knows Greek mythology knows that there are a hundred things that aren't kid friendly. There's incest, rapes, and the fact that most demigods are born out of one night stands from a god to a mortal. Is it just me or does anyone else think that Riordan is sugarcoating Greek mythology to make it look like it's perfectly kid friendly?
    • I was in sixth grade when we learned about Greek Mythology in school and that is the bottom age range these books would be aimed at. I fail to see the problem.
    • Riodan is glossing over or outright omitting the worst aspects. To have any respect for many of the gods, especially Zeus, you have to do that.
    • Besides, it's certainly not like he's the first to try introducing Greek mythology to a young audience.

  • This troper got the weird feeling that the books are very ethnocentric upon rereading them recently. So, the Greek gods are responsible for Western civilization. That's great. However, the gods and the books themselves seem to utterly disregard other civilizations that were as good or possibly even better than the Western. The Middle East, China, Japan, the Americas—all of these places had empires and civilizations that did great things, yet the books seem to just forget about them. It's like the Greeks are taking credit for all the things that everybody has done and then saying they are Western inventions.
    • Don't be offended; it's just part of being loyal to the genre. The gods are arrogant; yes, they are taking credit for everything significant that's ever happened. It's not meant to be subtle.
      • Not to mention the fact that every mythology has a their own "Domain" which they have power over. Greek Gods have control over most of U.S.A, however its reveal in "The Son of Neptune" that in Alaska and Canadian Regions are "Beyond" their power. So its possible that China, Middle East, and Japan, as well as other countries have their own Gods/Dieties, but they can only have influence over their own civilization, and are powerless outside of it.
      • Also worth noting, the Kane Chronicles and the upcoming Norse series imply that All Myths Are True, and all of those civilizations had their own gods which are probably still around today.
    • Nobody's forgetting about anything, it's just that the books focus on Greek Mythology because it's set IN THE WORLD OF (or at least the future of) Greek Mythology. Also, everything that has been mentioned in the books as being the result of Greek Mythology is either American or British. How is that taking credit for Chinese, Japanese, or Middle Eastern inventions? Answer: it isn't. It'd be way more ethnocentric to shoehorn in mentions of every culture that ever existed while still utilizing America as the exclusive home of the gods.

     Famous demigods 
  • Is anybody else bothered by the idea that all (or almost all) highly significant humans were demigods?
    • This troper got the sense that it was just Riordan's way of incorporating the world of Percy Jackson into the real world. Yes, it does seem to imply that only demigods can accomplish great things, but I don't think that was the vibe Riordan was going for.
      • Olympians also tend to be so arrogant that they claim everything important happened to them. So not all of these may be true.
    • Maybe demigods just have a tendency to do great things and get famous. After all, they are half divine.
    • And the logistics of all this? It would be one thing if the Revolutionary War was engineered by the gods Troy-style, but if Washington was really a son of Athena why wasn't he going on quests or getting attacked by monsters his whole life?
      • But, you see, he was. It's just that the Mist twisted them into things that seem ordinary, commonplace, or even apocryphal. For example, perhaps Washington's battle in his youth against a powerful cherry tree dryad only survives as a made-up story about how he couldn't tell a lie.
    • In George Washington's time, Great Britain was still seen as the world's most powerful and influential nation, so it stands to the reason that the gods (and, likewise, the majority of monsters) were overseas and hadn't yet moved over to America at that point.
      • Their center might have been already starting to shift at the time, as it is all but stated that the Revolutionary War had demigods out the wazoo. In either case, the gods are explicity said to be able to be anywhere they want and in several places at once too, so logically, a country being the one carrying the flame of western civilization as Chiron put it does not mean they are confined to that country when acting on Earth.

     Stoll brothers 
  • Here's one that slips into Fridge Horror territory. In Sea of Monsters, Percy mentions that there are two Stoll brothers, both sons of Hermes, right? Then, he says that they're not twins. Does this mean that Hermes left so much celestial spunk in their mother that she had another child, or did Hermes come back for seconds?
    • More than likely Hermes just visited the mother twice. Nothing I recall has been stated that says this never happened. Thalia and Jason are the first case of a mortal attracting both the Roman and Greek aspects. Nothing has been said about the Greek aspect coming back twice.
    • Remember Bianca and Nico had the same mother, but were a few years apart. Obviously, a god sleeping with the same mortal twice isn't a big deal.
    • And then there's the fact that Thalia and Jason Grace are siblings, coming from two separate visits by two different aspects of the same god.
    • The first time the Stolls are introduced it's mentioned that they aren't full brothers. Just look and act enough alike that they are called twins.
      • Yes, they're brothers. They have the same surname. In Sea of Monsters, Percy only says they aren't twins, as the OP stated.

     Fate of the Titanesses 
  • Where in the name of Zeus are the Titanesses in all of this? They aren't mentioned even once. Did they just lose their immortality and fade out of existence like Briares's brothers?
    • Odds are they they still exist but aren't incorporated in the story as the books are focus mostly on Percy Jackson and the demigods, not the gods and titans themselves. Greek Mythology has hundreds of minor deities and incorporating that into a book would fill more pages than the Library of Congress.
    • It's been a while since I read it, but I believe The Lightning Thief makes some mention of Rhea being involved in the conflict between Zeus and Poseidon in some way. I can't recall how, but that would seem to indicate that Zeus and the other gods are willing to let them stick around.
      • It's not her being involved in the conflict, it's an example Chiron brings to the petty spats Poseidon and Zeus have all the time, as in, "You were always Mom Rhea's favourite".

  • Why is Minos one of the judges of the dead? In life he was a cruel and vindictive king and that has followed him in death. I know he is a son of Zeus, taught law by Zeus, and later made a judge by Zeus, but isn't this extreme nepotism? In Percy Jackson, Zeus has a long history of making poor decisions even when the right one is obvious. In the books he tries to manipulate Nico and wrongfully condemn Daedalus. The ancient Greeks had to try and rationalize it by saying there were two Minoses, the morally just one and another who was responsible for the Minotaur and Daedalus' suffering. So why is Minos a king? Should all the souls he judge be retried to make sure he did not let his vindictive nature get in the way and his judgements were just?
    • Cause he is in Greek Mythology, and in Greek Mythology the strongest theme is "life's not fair" and in many cases "the afterlife is not fair". After all, the stories are filled with heroes who are really jerks, who beat up innocent people and steal things from their rightful owner while receiving absolutely no comeuppance for doing these things. Or in the case of someone getting punished, it's always disproportionate; if you spotted Artemis bathing, not in her home, simply in a forest, you'd get turned into a stag and she'd hunt you like an animal. All in all, in Greek myths nothing's fair.
      • I would say that is a tad simplistic. It is true many heroes were jerks, but often they were at some point punished for their crimes like Jason and Theseus. And they often did good things like killing monsters. In the Artemis case it is not so much that they accidentally glanced but that they decided to continue to stare that they were punished, at least according to some versions.
      • Life is fair in Greek mythology. It's just that their concept of fairness was very weird for our standards.
    • You just answered your own question. Nepotism and poor decision-making skills on the part of the Gods.

     Hunters & company 
  • The Hunters of Artemis....they are said to swear off love and all that, which is very much implied in myth to stay virgins. The question I have to ask is, what happens if hunters are attracted to their fellow hunters?
    • Presumably depends on how Artemis defines "virgin". That they're only asked to avoid "the company of men" is promising, but the "company" bit being a euphemism might imply the extent of the statement is expected to be understood.
    • A "virgin" is described as someone who abstains from any kind of... "company", not just with a certain sex.
    • The Dark Prophecy (the second Apollo book) clarifies that all romance is off-limits, regardless of orientation (although apparently in some situations, Artemis will allow Hunters to leave behind their immortality without killing them).

     Luke & Annabeth 
  • The most obvious headscratcher of all is...Luke and Annabeth!!! Ok, so Annabeth obviously had a crush on Luke for long time; it's fairly common for kids to have things for older cool teens. And for most of the series, Luke seemed to love her in a little sister kind of way (he says so himself in the first book). But what is NOT ok is Luke actually being romantically interested in her too. That's verging too close to statutory rape for comfort; Luke is 23 and Annbeth isn't even 16 yet, people. Plus it's weird! Luke practically raised her, for crying out loud! Wife Husbandry anyone? Besides, why would a 23 year old like a high schooler? Come on, they aren't even on the same playing field emotionally or mentally. Sure, seven years isn't a big deal when it's between two adults...but at this point in their lives, that makes Luke a pedophile. I for one firmly believe that Luke asking if Annabeth loved him was a desperate attempt to just see if anyone even cared remotely about him. But the romance route between a kid and an adult (especially when its portrayed as totally NORMAL and not creepy) is too much. It would NEVER happen! But, disturbingly enough, Riordan implies through Percy otherwise...
    • Well, Percy sees Luke as a rival for Annabeth's affections. And Percy seems to have always felt he has all the family he needs in his mother, so he'd be a lot more likely to see a hunger for connection as romantic.
    • You've also got a few things mixed around...Annabeth is the one who looks at Luke like an older sibling - she says as much when he asks her in the fifth book, that he was like a brother to her, but that she didn't love him that way. Annabeth constantly fretting over Luke's status as the villain was due to the sense of family that had existed between them in the past.

     Hades in future adaptions 
  • For the movie: assuming they continue adapting the books, how are they going to handle Nico and Bianca di Angelo? Y'know, since they made Hades into a Satan analogue?
    • This is only compounded in Sea of Monsters. Several Half-bloods switch sides earlier than in the books and Kronos repays them by trying to eat them.
    • Just because they started off the series by giving Hades a bad relationship with his nephew, which isn't too far off from what happened in the book, doesn't mean he can't be a somewhat dedicated father to children of his own, or that those children can't be decent people even if it does. Hades may have let Percy and his friends go in the film if he hadn't thought they'd lied about having the bolt.

     Dionysus's banishment 
  • Dionysus - What did he do to get banished from Olympus? I know the official reason is he chased on off limits nymph, but a hundred year banishment to Camp Halfblood seems kind of harsh considering other Olympians have performed worse actions and gotten off with lighter punishments. Do you think it was merely the latest in a long line of offenses that finally pushed Zeus too far?
    • Could be that yes, he pushed Zeus too far; doesn’t sound unlikely, since Dionysus seems to be one of the most reckless gods in terms of behavior. But reason for punishment aside, what is a century for a god who’s been around for hundreds of years? It probably sucks for one of the most hedonist gods to spend time with a bunch of kids (including his own children) in a camp, but it sounds quite like a light punishment in a god’s eyes.
      • Not to mention, though the excuse for sending him there (off limits nymph) seems highly hypocritical of Zeus of all people, Dionysus says he was also told to be a better influence on the young demigods. Whether Zeus intended that as bullshit or not, it has merit, as Dionysus is pretty much the closest person Zeus can think of among the gods who was originally a demigod (touchy subject notwithstanding) and might be able to understand them better than many of the others. Also depending on when exactly Mr. D has arrived in camp (i.e., just weeks before Percy or a few years earlier), Zeus might have even been aware of another child of his, Thalia, being on her way to the camp.

     Sally and Gabe 
  • Paraphrasing CinemaSins video about the movie, regarding to Sally's marriage with Gabe: "(...) Couldn't have been, like, almost any other tactic to disguise de smell of his (Percy's) blood other than marrying a smelly, abusive asshole? Aren't there some nice guys out there who just happen to smell bad, too?"
    • Probably, but keep in mind that Percy was being regularly attacked by monsters that could easily have killed him. She probably felt that she couldn't afford to wait until she found another suitable man.
    • In the first book, Percy mentions that Gabe appeared to be a genuinely nice guy when they first met him, and that he only became a big jerk later on, presumably once he'd married Sally.
    • It's implied if not outright stated that the "stench" Gabe gives off is due to his moral nature, not an actual B.O. problem. (Think about the number of analogies in the world between bad behavior and bad smells.) Likewise, it's implied that the "smell" that demigods give off is metaphysical in nature, not an actual scent. That's why it can be amplified by things like cell phones and internet connections.
      • Sally can see through the Mist, yes, but that's it. Most probably she couldn't smell Gabe, only noticed the weird things she saw all around and weird monsters avoided him like the plague.
    • And finally, spending too much time looking for a nice guy who smells bad might make Sally come off looking like a little bit of a weirdo. Say she does find a nice guy whose smelliness is due to some medical condition or something - what's she going to do without sounding crazy if he one day comes up with a treatment for it that would end up putting Percy in danger?

     Sally's financial status 
  • Percy states that his family is so poor that renting a movie and getting Burger King is a treat that they can rarely afford. There is nothing to really support this though in their lifestyle. Percy has gone to private school since at least sixth grade, and is implied to have gone since first grade. That isn't cheap. Percy has enough pocket change at twelve years old to take a taxi home from the Port Authority, not the cheaper bus or subway. Keep in mind that no business would hire him at that age for a regular job, most of the work he would have gotten at this point would have been small jobs for neighbors, which he wouldn't have been able to get in five/six months because of the boarding school he had been at. Though there was no evidence that Camp Half-Blood was picking him up for the summer, there was no hint that Sally was figuring out creative, low cost ways of getting Percy to camp. Sally, despite living in Manhattan, could afford and had a car that worked well enough to drive Percy to Maine, and could take time off from work to do so. The drive from Manhattan to even southern Maine is about five hours even in the best of traffic conditions. There is also no suggestion that at any time in the Jackson household that there was anything less than plenty for everyone to eat. If they're so poor, how can they afford all this?
    • Possible financial backing from Poseidon that was kept secret from Percy? And Percy being Percy might have not noticed some other things that should not be affordable in his family?
    • Gabe owned and ran his own appliance business and Sally worked full time. It's strongly implied that there was plenty of money around, Gabe was just very stingy about allowing Sally or Percy any luxuries. He even took Sally's pay for his poker money. The private schools were something Gabe was obligated to do due to Percy's record of expulsion. The car was probably useful for Sally to run errands, therefore useful to Gabe. What little money Percy had came from whatever part of her pay Sally managed to hold back from Gabe.
    • Most of the money is probably going towards private school tuition, hence why they can't afford to do things like go out to eat. As for Sally's car, that happens in The Titan's Curse, after she's gotten a better job and sold the "statue" of Gabe for a lot of money.
      • ^ This. The car they took to Montauk in book one was expressly described as Gabe's, he even made the point of threatening Percy with terrible punishment if there is as much as a scratch on the paint (which Percy snarks at in his mind, given that he is TWELVE and obviously not the one who is going to drive the car.) If it was Sally's, he wouldn't have bothered.

     Percy beating Ares 
  • For the love of all that is holy, can someone explain to me how a 13 years-old boy, who started learning how to fight with sword only two weeks ago, can injure Ares, THE God of battle ?
    • Ares is a moron who fought said boy in the domain of Percy's father. Frankly he's lucky he just got a scratch and that Poseidon didn't smack his ass down.
    • Pretty much the above. They stated several times that for all his power, skill and knowledge Ares doesn't think instead relying on brute power to solve the problem. He had no trouble with Percy on land and was toying with him since to him war is a game. He was so overconfident that he did not think Percy would use the sea against him despite it being obvious.
    • Ares was literally toying with him, but it was Poseidon who manage to distract him, thanks to Ares deciding to fight the son of the sea god the beach less than 10 ft from the ocean. Heck, Ares was gonna fry him until Kronos force him to back off. The next time Percy fights an immortal, Atlas literally backslaps him down. He only manage to hold a stalemate against Hyperion due to Curse of Achilles boosting his power up, even then it was Grover who turn the Titan into a tree, and Dionysus revealed that all the titans weren't even at full power yet.
    • Also, Ares was always looked upon as the patron of the more violent, untamed, bloodthirsty side to a war, and was known for the humility he often suffered in mythology - just look at how many times Hephaestus pulled off pranks on him - whereas Athena was the one who represented actual tactics and battle strategy. He's strong, but not particularly smart, and especially not so when he's angry.
      • In fact, even in the series, Ares, though he was either too dumb to see through being used and take the bolt for himself or he was subtly mindcontrolled by Kronos to ignore that tiny possibility (remember, he mentions dreams...), when "watching from the sidelines" he shows a little insight when telling Percy that his mom is alive because she is more valuable as a hostage than dead. Compare that with the fight he has with Percy where he and his ego are directly involved and he becomes brash and too proud as a result, allowing Percy to outthink him.

     12 cabins 
  • Who are the 12 cabins assigned to if Hades doesn't have one and there are only 12 major gods. For that matter there's said to be 12 thrones on Olympus and again Hades doesn't have one.
    • The 12 are Zeus, Poseidon, Ares, Dionysus, Apollo, Hermes, Hephaestus, Hera, Aphrodite, Athena, Artemis, and Demeter. Hera and Artemis do not have any children. Hera's "cabin" is more of a temple in her honor. Artemis' cabin is for when her hunters visit. Hestia stepped down to prevent a fight over Dionysus having a throne. Hades only goes to Olympus once a year (normally) and while he is a major god he is not one of the ruling council. His area of responsibility is the underworld which takes his full attention since he is one of the few responsible Olympians.

     Blaming the Fates 
  • Why isn't Percy angrier at The Fates as they take Luke's body away in The Last Olympian? I understand that he'd keep his opinions to himself around Jerkass Gods, but in the narration he barely acknowledges their role in this sorry mess and doesn't seem the least bit angry or despairing that they Fated the events of the series to happen "Just Cuz" and got away with it for the eleventy-billionth time.
    • If what Zeus said at the end of "The Blood of Olympus" is true then events did not have to end this way. Zeus says there are three fates so prophecies can unfold different ways. That is one reason they tend to be vague. I don't think Percy was mad at them because he realizes that they are not Karma Houdinis. And there are several stories in Greek Mythology back this up. A fated event can be prevented if the appropriate action is taken. A son of Metis was destined to overthrow Zeus and Zeus prevented it. Troy could have avoided its fate of being destroyed if several things were done differently, but they were not. At best, the Fates are keepers of balance. They prevent the gods from utterly enslaving mortals and that different sides have a fair shot at succeeding. The Fates do not control absolutely everything. To blame them is to devoid both the gods and mortals of any responsibility. Luke's fate could have been avoided if Hermes had been a better father, if Hades had not chosen to cure the oracle, if Luke' mother had not ignored Hermes's warnings, if this and that. Luke brought his fate upon himself. Percy knows this. So he does not blame them.

     Grover in the Underworld 
  • At the end of the first film, after Grover returns to Camp Half-Blood from the Underworld, he mentions doing various things together with Persephone, among them 'dining'. But in the myths, it was mentioned that you can't eat the food of the Underworld or else you'll be fated to return there again - that's the whole reason Persephone's there in the first place! So...did they just overlook this detail, or was it meant as a sort of "Now Grover will have to return to the Underworld and spend even more time with Persephone' joke? And if it's the latter case...I can't imagine Hades being too happy about that.
    • It's the film. Nuff said.
      • Not everything in the myths is adapted anyways - it could be that had more films been made, they would've retconned this as being only food served by Hades himself that would trap you in the Underworld (since the only reason Persephone gets trapped there is because she swallows a few pomegranate seeds that were from a fruit he offered her).

     Children of the Big Three 
  • Why does Poseidon seem to be the one who gets most hated on by the other gods for siring a demigod when he's actually the only one of the Big Three who only sired one? Yes, I understand that Jason is Roman, Bianca and Nico were born before the pact was made, and Thalia seemed to get as raw a deal as Percy did...but still, with the way people treat him, you'd think he was the only Big Three child there ever was.
    • He doesn't get the most hate. Zeus brings it up because Zeus is a Jerkass. Athena later criticizes both of them for it indirectly. The problem is in this series Zeus has a hair-trigger temper and a big Bolt of Divine Retribution he would use on anyone who criticizes him. If you notice throughout both series anyone who has met Zeus has little true respect for him. They say nice things about him out of fear.
    • Maybe he isn't hated on directly, but I guess I meant it more like this...Zeus hates Poseidon's son Percy and Hades's children Bianca and Nico. Hades, likewise, holds a grudge against Percy and Zeus's daughter Thalia. But we never really hear of any attempts Poseidon has made on the lives of either of his brothers' half-blood children or any feelings of ill will he may have toward them, even from the children themselves. Whether this is because the story is told from the viewpoint of his own son or Poseidon is just the most levelheaded out of the Big Three (and why?), I'm not sure, but I think this issue could've been helped by maybe giving the sea god a few more flaws besides just being kind of a dead-beat dad. As stubborn as Zeus is, for example, it's easy for me to say something positive about him - he loves his daughter. Sure, he's kind of dismissive of her when she needs him, but he's also probably a little busy some of the time, being king of the gods and all.
      • It's probably has to due with unlike Hades and Zeus, Poseidon actually has a better politician. Unlike them, Poseidon is not the "true" lord of his domain. There are literally thousands of minor sea deities and at least several other "Lords of the Sea" that still have strong influence over the Ocean(e.g Oceanus, Nereus, Pontus, Aigaios, and that's not including Sea gods from other Pantheons that could possibly exist). Unlike Hades or Zeus who are pretty much absolute rulers of their domain and can do anything they want. Posiedon has to be careful not to get any of the other sea deities piss off at him or they might gang up on him(He even had his own war along the Second Titan War). So in the thousands of years Poseidon learned how to keep his temper in check in order to live peacefully with his neighbors. Which is probably why he is not taking his anger out on his brother's demigod children since he knows that would be death for his own.
      • Adding to this debate is the fact that Poseidon's wife, Amphitrite, is the only wife of one of the Big Three who doesn't seem to have it out for her stepson. (Persephone once turned Nico into a dandelion while they were in the middle of a "family spat", and Hera...Well, she took Thalia's brother away, along with probably a lot of other things, considering her spiteful nature.) She acts pretty coldly toward Percy when they meet, but there's not much else. I understand that Percy is the main character in this series, but why is his divine family the most level-headed and reasonable out of all the Big Three?
      • I think you hit it when you said he was the main character. Percy's life is already so messed up it giving him an unsympathetic parent might make things too dark for a light-hearted series. Besides, that might be considered too similar to Zeus and Hera. Mythologically, Poseidon and Zeus were not that different. Riordan wants to keep the Olympians somewhat likable so you cannot have all of them be Jerkasses.
    • Also, Hades mostly seems to hate Percy because he's impertinent-seldom if ever does he say anything bad about Percy relating to being Poseidon's son.

     Belief in the gods 
  • If the gods in this series can only remain alive for as long as people still pray to/believe in them, which is what I've picked up on as being the case, then how is it that Khione is even still alive, let alone posing as a threat? She claims that no one honored her in Ancient Greece (which, as sad as it is, is kind of understandable considering it rarely snowed there), she presumably doesn't have demigod children given how much she hates mortals, I never read about her being mentioned at Camp Half-Blood, she didn't get a cabin there...I even read somewhere that Riordan didn't even know she existed when he wrote the first series.
    • This is not the case. They do not need people to pray to them or acknowledge they exist to live. Khione and a slew of other minor gods and the Titans are proof of this. Riodan's series is not one of Gods Need Prayer Badly. It appears to be a matter of will to live. Immortality can be hard to bear. Being remembered and worshipped can give you a connection to the world and a reason to live. Lack of that can cause you to lose your purpose to live so you fade. Khione and other still have strength of will to live so it does not bother them. It is also indicated that worship or at least veneration of a god's sphere of influence has an effect on their health and the weakening of Pan's sphere caused him to fade, but since they were born independent of their sphere Pan could have lived if he had wanted to.
    • So...does that mean the myths Ancient Greeks believed about creation actually happened in this universe, if the existence of the gods and everything related to them is independent of peoples' belief in them? And setting things up for the next question, I'd like to ask, do The Kane Chronicles and the Percy Jackson/Heroes of Olympus books both take place in the same realm of continuity? I haven't read the former of the two, but I heard there was some sort of reference made in one to the other.
    • The goddess Bast stated in the Kane Chronicles that conflicting stories can often be true. A key point of magic and mythology in other fantasy universes is they are not facts you check off in a ledger. They are not rational the way modern man thinks. I think that is the case here where in some weird way the multiple myths and creation stories are all true. So they take place in the same universe and realm of continuity.

     Percy's motivation 
  • During the fourth book, Percy is asked by Calypso what really drives him to support the Olympians like he does. Percy thinks on this and realizes that although the Olympians are not necessarily good, he feels that he has a duty to support them because he's the son of Poseidon. But shouldn't the main reason be, since he's still half-human, and has grown up among humans, that the gods treat mortals better than the Titans did, and that he wouldn't want to see their world reduced to what it was when Kronos ruled over it? I'm not saying Calypso doesn't bring up a good point in questioning him on this - I merely think Percy's answer is a bit befuddling. Regardless of who his godly parent is, shouldn't his real loyalty be toward the mortal world where he grew up?
    • Growing up, Percy's stepfather was a Jerkass who likely abused him and I don't recall him having many if any friends besides Grover. This isn't the childhood that would endear him to the human race. Then he learns that he is "special" because he is the son of a major god and said major god is pretty cool and looks out for him as best he can. Percy strikes me more as an emotional being who things primarily in those terms. Loyalty to the whole human race is a vague, abstract notion that does not work with him. So his reasoning is going to be more motivated by his emotional connections. Then you have that his best friends are all nonhumans or half-humans. He spends most of his time in a secret world disconnected from the rest of humanity. So I don't see him having strong loyalty to the mortal world because it pretty much treated him like crap and he has no true emotional connection to it outside of his mother. At the same time, I don't think he has any true loyalty to the Olympians either aside from Poseidon. They have treated him like crap as well. His only real loyalties and motivations are to his friends. This was supposed to be his fatal flaw. He fights the Titans and Giants partly because yes...they are supposedly worse than the Olympians and would make the world worse for everyone. He does have a sense or right and wrong in that regard, but since he is motivated more by emotions and personal relationships that is where his true reasoning is.
    • What about his mom, though? His second stepdad, Paul Blofis, who is actually a pretty decent guy? Are we to assume Percy's made no completely mortal friends throughout his life? And I know Poseidon's come to learn a thing or two by the events of the fourth book, but at the end of The Lightning Thief, even Percy acknowledges that his father probably didn't even want for him to have been born that early on. So while I can understand it being a product of Percy's fatal flaw of personal loyalty, I don't believe that a somewhat rotten upbringing would have made him less-inclined to the mortal world or that loyalty to his father would've been highest on his list.
    • Look, Percy is a primarily emotional being. General loyalty to the human race is a vague abstract notion and he does not think in those terms. Why does he fight? What motivates him? What is first in his mind? Loyalty to family and friends with the human race as a whole being second. So the reason he supports the Olympians is out of loyalty and love to his family and friends and not to mankind in general. He knows regular humans can be as crappy to each other as the Olympians are to him. He has been on the receiving end of it. Yeah, it would suck if the mortal world went down the toilet, but again the real motivation he fights is not a vaugue abstract notion. It is his love and loyalty to his friends and family.
      • Even then, at the point where he meets Calypso, it’s stupid to suggest that his relation to Poseidon is the primary reason he sides with the Olympians. Saying it’s because of his friends at Camp Half-Blood is perfectly reasonable, but his relationship with and allegiance to Poseidon at that point in the series is about as vague, abstract, and indirect as you’re saying his duty to the mortal world is.

     Cleveland joke 
  • In the film version of The Sea of Monsters, Luke says that in order to find Kronos's remains, he had to crawl through the depths of Tartarus...and then Cleveland. What does that mean? Is there something particularly unpleasant about Cleveland I just don't know about? And why would Kronos's remains be found there?
    • Forget the films. The first one was heavily criticized for changing so many things from the book. The second one made some attempts to be more accurate, but changed many things since a sequel was unlikely. In the books, Kronos did not rise till the fourth book and by taking over Luke's body. This joke in particular was meant to be "funny" regardless of how much sense it made.

     Demigod children 
  • What happens if two demigods get together have a child? Would that child end up having lesser powers from both of them, or would whatever divine blood that remained at that point be too diminished to leave any influence or effect?
    • This was answered in the Heroes of Olympus book series. If the child has any powers he/she is a legacy that may have powers of both gods, but probable some sort of curse on top of it for being too powerful or they would only get a watered down version of their parents abilities.

     Selina & Beckendorf 
  • Am I the only one who saw a small hint of strangeness in Selina and Beckendorf dating? I know it's not the same as having the same godly parent, and that the gods don't have DNA anyway, but Beckendorf's father is Hephaestus, who is married to Aphrodite, who is Selena's mother...I'm not an expert on family dynamics, but wouldn't that technically make them some sort of half-/step-siblings or something?
    • Well, Aphrodite and Hephaestus were never the most loving of the couples; indeed it was a pretty bad Arranged Marriage. I don't think Greek gods practice actual divorce, but it's safe to say that nowadays they're more or less separated, so at most Selena and Beckendorf would be like a couple whose mom and dad are "legally" married and refer to each other as wife/husband but do not have an actual loving married life and obviously cheat on each other all the time, and probably don't even live together per se. If anything at all they're step-siblings who don't even share a house or have a sibling-like relationship. Don't see anything wrong with that, though it is kind of funny that they got together given their parent's history.

     Ares' weapon of choice 
  • Why does Ares fight with a sword in this series when his signature weapon in mythology was a spear?
    • The guys the God of War. While the spear is his Symbol, he is just as fine with any weapon. Plus the only time we see him fight is against Percy. In which case he used a sword because Percy is a sword-user and Ares wants to toy with him for the kicks.
      • Exactly- he starts the fight by asking what kind of weapon style Percy wants them to settle this in, modern or classical, to which Percy just sorta waves his sword in a "duh, only have one of them" way, which is when Ares' bat and bulletproof vest turn to a humongous sword and his shield respectively, but when the police arrive, Percy specifically mentions that he can see Ares as holding a sword and many other weapons, ranging from baseball bat to machine gun, and he doesn't even want to know what Riptide cloaked itself as with the Mist but is sure it is not something that is to his credit in the eyes of the police.

     Wars and conflicts 
  • If the conflicts between the gods and their offspring are meant to coincide with those of mortals that have occured throughout our human history - the American Civil War was accompanied by a confrontation between the Greek and Roman half-bloods and World War II was spearheaded by the sons of Zeus and Poseidon on one side against the sons of Hades on the other - then what event in the mortal world corresponds to the second clash between the Titans and the Olympian gods?
    • It's not EVERY single war mirrors the what gods and demigods do, but just in general.
    • Also, recall that officially, there hasn't been a war involving the United States (where Mount Olympus is located) since World War II - conflicts involving the US? Yes. But WWII was the last time Congress declared war, so it's possible that some of the conflicts that broke out after WWII (i.e., the Vietnam War, the Gulf invasion) didn't have demigods on both sides.

     Themis and Dike 
  • I just wonder where Themis (law) and Dike (justice) were when all that unfair crap was dealt out to Percy...
    • Law and Justice are relative terms. Heck, by Divine Law, Percy should be dead since he is the result of a broken oath.
    • I guess they left Olympus some time ago. According to one story, Dike originally inhabited Earth, but fled to Olympus when she became fed up with mankind's injustices and corruption to report mankind's misdeeds to Zeus for him to punish them. Several gods have commented on how unfair and unjust Olympus has been over the centuries which is why Kronos even had an army. Considering how unjust the Olympians have become especially Zeus I would guess the two of them have left Olympus. Zeus no longer listens to them. He barely listens to anyone.
    • To be fair, justice isn't always about taking one side or another. Zeus has a very specific and at least somewhat understandable reason for disliking Percy...I mean, even beyond his dislike of other people. He says so in The Lightning Thief, that he doesn't like what Percy's existence means for the future of Olympus. People act like Percy's birth shouldn't be such a big deal, but the pact between the Big Three was made after a war of casualties immeasurable that was caused by them and the reveal of a prophecy that one of their children could grow up to destroy the very foundation of their existence. And yes, it's mentioned in The Titan's Curse that condemning someone because of something they might do is wrong and unjust, so it could be that Zeus letting Percy live in spite of what his destiny might bring about is justice enough.
    • Like a lot of things with this version of Zeus while he may says something that makes sense Zeus' own hypocrisy is a problem. Every thing you said about Percy applies to Thalia whom Zeus spared. You also have the facts that Zeus cares about his image and Zeus owed Percy for returning the Bolt to him along with Poseidon liking Percy a lot. If Zeus killed Percy it would be outright hypocritical, overt favoritism (for Thalia) ungrateful, and would create problems with Poseidon in the future. I don't see Zeus sparing Percy so much because it was the right thing to do because of justice. Instead it was the best thing to do for Zeus. Percy embarrassed Zeus. His birth being a possible threat to Olympus is a convenient secondary reason to dislike him and a reason he can talk about disliking him that sounds less petty.
    • I agree that Zeus really only let him live for the sake of "keeping peace" in the family, which probably translates into protecting his behind from Poseidon's wrath. In any case, it's possible justice and law fell victim to...What was it called? Downsizing or something? That thing Apollo mentions with regard to Helios and Selene in The Titan's Curse. Something like, say, the sun is a huge, visible, tangible object, in any culture of the world, whereas justice and law are very abstract concepts. Something similar to the Protogenoi, Themis and Dike may have been downsized, if that is the proper term, reduced to just a simple, intangible representation of justice and law, still acting in and upon the world, but not in the way someone like Zeus or Apollo might.
    • Helios and Selene faded because the Romans wanted fewer gods and started worshipping Apollo and Artemis/Diana as the sun and moon gods instead of those two. Riodan has gone back and forth on whether gods need mortal worship to survive or how much of their power depends on it. At the very least, if an immortal grows tired of living they "fade." Mortal worship gave Helios and Selene a reason to live and without it they faded. With the goddesses of justice, it is possible they faded for one reason or another. As king, Zeus has the ultimate authority on justice. On the other hand, they may just be in the background somewhere. There are many minor gods like Khione people have barely heard about, but are still alive.

     Poseidon's appearance 
  • Why does Poseidon cease being an old man in The Last Olympian when he chose to let his kingdom be destroyed in order to fight Typhon alongside his family? His visage was based on the state of his home during the attacks, and he confirms later that Oceanus didn't hesitate to level it to the ground when the chance came to him...Hence, shouldn't he still have looked like an old man?
    • Best guess? Up to that point he was expending all of his power trying to protect his palace form Oceanus and his armies. He spread himself too thin. Oceanus is tied to all waters deeper than Poseidon so I doubt Oceanus was screwing too much with the ocean itself. Once he stopped expanding so much power and focused it all on one target backed by his own armies he was no longer so "exhausted." Yeah, he lost his personal palace, but like Percy stated his true "home" or at least the one his power was tied directly to was his throne on Olympus.
    • I understand that the main idea was supposed to be that Olympus was his true home, but still, Percy sees him as an old man after destroying the Princess Andromeda, and the Battle of Manhattan hadn't begun yet at that point, so even then, his "true home" wasn't in a state that would make him look like that.
    • Poseidon mentioned he was expending power to keep storms from wrecking the surface world. Storms I presume Oceanus was trying to cause to weaken Poseidon. Poseidon "spread himself" too thin to try and counter everything. He had also separated himself from his fellow gods to stand alone. At the end, he focused his entire power on one target and was working with his fellow gods instead of separate. The Egyptian gods, Olympians and Titans have all been portrayed as some sort of inter-dependent collective where to some extent their power relies on each other. Poseidon working with his fellow gods and on a single target focused his power instead of being separate and focused on many targets. Oceanus did not wreck the surface because all of his power was focused on Poseidon and destroying his under seas palace. At least, that is how I understand it.

  • This does apply to all versions of Greek mythology, but I'm addressing it here because this is the only adaption I know to showcase personal relationships and encounters with the individual gods...If the Olympians have the ability to change their appearance in whatever way they want to, why doesn't Hephaestus use this to make himself look less...deformed? I've seen his artwork, and I personally think he could look worse, but if everyone seems to ostracize him for being "ugly", it raises the question why he never considered it.
    • I would guess to it being a shapeshifting limitation caused by the injury and looks being too much. In Norse myth, Odin is always missing an eye no matter what shape he takes because Odin's "true self" gave up an eye. Whatever Hephaestus' divine form looks like it is no doubt damaged in some way and that damage is reflected in whatever shape he takes. He could try to cover it up with illusions, but his fellow gods would know it is a lie and he dislikes the relationship with handsome Ares and his physically perfect wife. Given his general dislike of people in general he would see no point and may even dislike the dishonesty of it.
  • True, and it's mentioned in Book 4 that Hephaestus "cleans himself up" for the Council, but most of the time just doesn't care.

     Poseidon's favorite 
  • In The Battle of the Labyrinth, when Poseidon calls Percy his "favorite son"...Did anyone else find that weird, or wonder whether any of the real Greek gods would ever say something like that? Adding to that, isn't it also a little bit unfair and insulting, as well? Poseidon has probably sired hundreds of children throughout history, including some who became great leaders and important celebrities and such, and he says in what is meant to be taken as a truthful and heartfelt manner that Percy is his favorite. No disrespect to Percy Jackson, but I would've expected, say, Winston Churchill to be higher on Poseidon's list than him... (If Churchill really was Poseidon's son, that is, but there are still others.)
    • Percy saved the world at age twelve (and again at fifteen, and yet again at sixteen). He's not exactly a nobody. Plus, "favorite son" doesn't necessarily mean "the greatest child I have ever spawned", it could mean "favorite living son" or "child I get along with best". It's also worth noting that none of the other children of Poseidon we meet are particularly likable people—it's possible most of Poseidon's kids over the years have been jerks, and Percy's an exception to that rule.
    • I think it is Riodan's way of increasing the reputation of Percy compared to children of Zeus who are often the heroes. For instance, Hercules is usually considered the greatest Greek hero and stand up guy, but Riodan's is a darker, more villainous version. In-universe, I can see how it would be insulting to Triton, Poseidon's lawful son and supposedly his heir (if Poseidon ever planned to retire).

     Zeus's bolt 
  • In the film, Zeus's master bolt is renowned for being the most powerful weapon ever created, but in the climax, Percy is able to deflect lightning strikes from it just by swinging Riptide - a completely simple, normal (at least to demigods) Celestial bronze sword - against them. How could that even be possible?
    • Because the movie was a poor adaptation which is what a lot of people complained about. And a god may have been the only one able to bring out the weapon's true potential. In the film, Zeus' control over all lighting in the world if not the weather itself was tied to the bolt.

  • Is there anything about fading that sets it apart from mortal death, save being for gods? Like, the gods are immortal and normally can't be killed, so when they fade, where do they go? The underworld? Tartarus? Or do they just cease to exist? And is fading permanent? If a god chooses to fade after losing their will to live, would it be possible for them later on to regain that will and return to life, being immortal, or are they gone for good once the deed is done?
    • Not much is said about it. Gods cannot "die" at least in the mortal idea of death so the impression I was left with is they cease to be. Nothing goes on to the underworld. Mortal worship can force a god to hang on and prevent them from fading, but that too has its limits. It was implied fading was permanent, but in the second book series Gaea somehow revived Medusa's sisters who had faded. There is no clue on how it was done, whether this would work on gods or if anyone could do it. Gaea was incredibly powerful even for a god and monsters are far weaker than gods so that might have played into it. Since a faded god might still be considered "alive" I suppose if they gained enough of a will to live again they could start to exist in some state, but there is zero evidence of this.

     Warping back to Olympus 
  • After the Olympians work together to defeat Typhon in The Last Olympian, why don't they warp/teleport back to Olympus directly instead of flying there in their chariots? Kronos could be in the palace smashing each of their thrones to bits by that point, for all they know, and it takes them a few minutes more they finally get there.
    • I think they did. Hermes claimed Olympian teleportation was really a form of air travel which is why the wind gods could prevent anyone from teleporting to Olympus when Percy brought this up.
    • Percy mentions that they arrived, storming into the throne room in full battle armor, just moments after Luke died. If they had teleported, they would've done so directly into the throne room.

     Mist limitations 
  • Why does the Mist conceal things like a cyclops' eye, or at least, make it harder to look at, but can't do anything to hide Grover's goat legs? Yes, it certainly would've been a lot weirder if Grover had spent all of his time without pants or shoes on and Percy just failed to notice the hooves until he learned he was a demigod, but still, it makes one wonder...
    • As for the legs, you also have to remember the differences between human and goat legs result in a hugely different movement which would constantly draw attention to the legs. Even if the Mist could have "created" a camouflage of pants or shoes, it would have been probably harder to maintain when attention was constantly drawn to it. Also legs are a much huger part of the body than eyes.

     Godly DNA 5 
  • In the fifth book, when Percy is explaining how relationships between demigods are looked upon as okay, how does he know surely and specifically that gods don't have DNA? Even if there were some scenario where he could've learned this fact, DNA just seems like too much of a modern science for anyone to think of applying it to the ancient gods.
    • Always assumed Annabeth told him when he asked it. Being the genius she is, she definitely asked that herself at some point, probably to Chiron or even her mother.

  • Is the doorman for the Empire State Building just a mortal that was brought up to speed on the existence of the Greek gods, or he is an actual figure with a base in Greek lore and legends? I ask because, to my recollection, I don't recall any of the books ellaborating upon who he is, nor do I remember Olympus having any sort of gatekeeper in the myths.
    • Strangely enough there were entities who guarded the Olympus, but they were goddesses: the Horae/Hours. Perhaps like Selene and other gods, they got tired of immortality and left their duties, which were taken on by the doorman. He might be a demigod or even some minor god, who knows.
      • He may also be one of Hercules' and Hebes' sons, who are mentioned as being the doorkeepers in one myth.

     Camp pegasi 
  • Is there a reason pegasi aren't used more often on quests? In Heroes of Olympus they get people from the Grand Canyon to Camp (on Long Island, mind) between chapters. You'd think that would shave a whole bunch of time off of all those quests that take campers all the way to the West Coast in Books 1 and 3.
    • I think it's all about how you handle the horses. Percy and Butch are both said to be really good with them, the former for obvious reasons, being the son of Poseidon. Chances are horseback riding isn't a required lesson to learn at camp, so using one ona quest would be out of the question for all but the most experienced campers. In book 3, the heroes had Thalia with them, and while the other quest members didn't know it, she was afraid of heights, making a cross-country trip on a winged horse impractical for her. And as for the first book, Percy was even higher on Zeus's hit-list than he normally was due to the theft of his bolt, meaning even a pegasus, which are usually neutral territory, might not have been safe for him to ride. (Not to mention, he didn't find out about his affinity for horses until the middle of his quest to retrieve the bolt, when he used the connection to talk to a zebra in the back of a truck.)
    • Also, I thought the trip to camp from the Grand Canyon went so fast because of Butch being a son of Iris, which meant he could travel at the speed of light. That's just how I figured it worked.

     Pan's death 
  • What I don't get about Pan's death is the timeline of it. Thanks to the satyrs he's been on life support for two thousand years!! What I want to know is why did the god of the wilds give up the ghost all those years ago when there was plenty of wild and man didn't looting it until after his supposed death?
    • I haven't read the book in a while, but if I'm remembering correctly, Pan was supposed to be something of a pessimist - he knew that the state of the wild was starting to go into decline as man developed and his influence spread, even if it hadn't yet hit rock-bottom, so maybe he just didn't want to stick around to see it happen? (Which is sort of a depreciative idea to suggest in a children's series.) Also, the Greek gods are meant to be the roots of Western civilization, and Pan is the patron of the exact opposite of civilization, which probably led to some self-conflict, as well.

     Mist and different mythologies 
  • OK, so if some mortals can see through the Mist, and all myths are true, does that mean these mortals see EVERYTHING divine, no matter the mythology? Or do certain ones only see certain mythological creatures?
    • I think I recall the Magnus Chase books mentioning something called "glamour", which I believe came from the gap surrounding the World Tree and served to disguise from view all things Norse-ish, similarly what the Mist does for the Greeks and Romans. So it would likely vary depending on the mythology.

     Camp safety 
  • This isn't really something that bothers me personally, but the way Camp Half-Blood gets off so easily, considering the ways in which it endangers its campers so many times...No one ever seems to cut Hogwarts any slack, but in that case, even if they did take a lot of injuries pretty lightly, they at least had magic to both easily prevent and easily heal them. At camp, you have ambrosia and nectar, but it's said that even half-bloods can only consume so much of them before they burn up just like any other mortal would. And to go along with this, we have kids as young as 11 or 12 playing Capture the flag armed with real-life swords, spears, and armor, in the woods where acid-spitting ants make their nest, and one kid who even ended up in a full-body cast due to a sour encounter with Festus. And no one (in-universe or outside it) seems to have any complaints?
    • There are a few points I'd like to make. The first is that celestial bronze wouldn't work on the demigods because of their mortal blood, so they're basically fighting with blanks. Second, their entire existence is a life or death struggle where they constantly fight monsters and die young. The camp isn't just to provide a safe heaven, but to make the demigods combat ready. And the more dangerous challenges and tasks seem to be reserved for the most powerful ones. The harsh truth is that if they're not put through all of this, they'll be easy pickings once they go back home.
    • The bronze does affect them because they're half-god, just like normal weapons affect their mortal half. This was explained by Chiron as Percy was leaving to go on his first quest, and demonstrated during many different battles across the series.

     Persephone's pearls 
  • Another one from the film alone...So Percy and the gang realize that they only have three pearls to get four people out of the Underworld. Unlike in the books, the pearls here are said to be hidden in different places by Persephone. Who is standing right there with them. And is the one who notices that they're short one to begin with. Is there any reason why she couldn't just make another pearl for them?
    • The Greek gods cannot always conjure items out of thin air which is why they needed Hephaestus to forge things. Few gods had the power to create something out of thin air. That is likely the reason why.

     Thalia's eyes 
  • What colour are Thalia's eyes? Her first appearance in a dream of Percy from The Lightning Thief has her with "stormy green eyes" (yeah no idea what that means either) but when she is brought back in Sea of Monsters, she is described with blue/gray eyes Early Installment Weirdness perhaps?.
    • It was either, that or just due to being in a dream sequence - Percy couldn't have known what she looked like, so maybe he just pictured her as looking a bit like him. I believe there's artwork out there depicting her eyes as blue, like Jason's are.
      • Ok but how did Percy get everything else, including clothes and hair colour, right about her then? I mean you are right about him not being able to know what she looked like.
      • The same way he had the dream about the golden eagle and white horse fighting with each other, before knowing anything about the impending war between Zeus and Poseidon - demigods are very prone to having dreams of future events.
    • If you want a Hand Wave, call it different lighting—I have blue-gray eyes, but in fluorescent lights, they sometimes look vaguely greenish.

     Boat control 
  • Why is Percy able to control all manner of boats, but apparently thinks a submarine is beyond his capabilities? I understand that submarines are a lot more technical than an 18th-century pirate ship, but the way they answer his beck and call doesn't seem to have anything to do with that.
    • Where does it say he can't control submarines?
    • Sea of Monsters: as he and Annabeth are in search of a way off of Circe's island, he takes one look at a submarine and dismisses it as a viable option. I might be wrong, but I recall him thinking he wouldn't know how to pilot it. But immediately afterwards, he gets on board Blackbeard's pirate ship and commandeers it instantly through magic.
      • Since Demigods are discouraged from using most tech (how many situations can you think of that could've been avoided by using a cell phone), it could be that he might not have as much control over something more modern - maybe perhaps if it was one of the submarines from World War I, it might be a different story.

     Zeus vs. Kronos 
  • In The Titan's Curse, a lightning bolt knocks the team off the road as they're heading to Mt. Othrys. Thalia suspects it was Zeus, due to her prophecy saying a quest member would "perish by a parent's hand", but Percy tries to convince her that it was just Kronos trying to mess with her. Thalia was heading right toward the choice that could destroy Olympus, so maybe Zeus wanted to kill her over that, but I might've expected him to have a bit more faith in her. And when they attend the council of the gods on Olympus, he says that he's proud of her and vouches against her being killed. So was it Zeus trying to prevent the Great Prophecy from being fulfilled, or Kronos or one of his allies of subjects?
    • Most likely Kronos given the circumstances. Kronos tried to drive a wedge between the characters and the gods.
      • Yeah it is probable but how did he pull it off when it's Zeus who has the lightning powers and Kronos is little more than mash pulp at this point?
      • All of the gods are shown to possess some level of weather manipulation considering they make thunder sound whenever they're insulted in the books; barring that, it could've just been a generic blast of energy that was feigned to appear like a strike of lightning.
      • The latter is pretty likely and could be done by Kronos too, as for the thunder when insulted or when trying to make a point of "watching you..." or like a clearing of a throat, my memory must be rusty cos I always remember that as being Zeus. (eg., Dionysus: "Only Zeus knows how many of the lesser gods went over to Kronos' side." *THUNDER* Dionysus: "SCRATCH THAT, not even ZEUS knows.")
      • The Battle of the Labyrinth: after praying to Apollo and Artemis for help defeating that three-bodied monster, Percy throws some food into the fire as an offering to them, followed by the sound of thunder overhead. We later find out that it was (supposedly) Hera who did this, not the twin archers, but Zeus had nothing to do with it.

     Sally marrying Paul 
  • If Sally only married Gabe so that his putrid odor would keep monsters away from Percy, then why is she okay with marrying Paul Blofis later? I thought a half-blood's scent was said to grow stronger as they got older, and when they find out/begin to suspect they're a half-blood, and Percy is the son of one of the Big Three, so there's a number of gods and other supernatural entities out there who wouldn't mind seeing him dead...Not to mention, it probably brings Paul into a lot of the danger of Percy's lifestyle.
    • Percy is old enough to defend himself from monsters and is not living at home nearly as much so there is no reason to cover up Percy's scent.
    • It's also stated that as a rule, most monsters find mortals below their level, so they don't bother, if they can munch/kill a demigod instead. Not counting some of the lesser and more feral monsters, who usually avoid civilization anyway, unlike their more civilized kin.
      • Considering that the number of people who knew Percy's dad was Poseidon can be counted on one hand, odds are that the monsters figured that while it's possible that Poseidon might've broken the pact made by the Big 3, the odds of Percy being the kid resulting from said pact were slim. By the end of the first book, odds are that Percy's divine parentage was rather common knowledge, meaning that Gabe's smell was no longer needed, and as a result, Sally was free to marry Paul.

     Hephaestus's deformity 
  • Why is it that Hephaestus's children aren't described as being deformed at all? Even if the gods don't have the mortal idea of DNA, they must have something that acts in place of it, so that Percy can look so much like Poseidon, Annabeth can look so much like Athena, and all of Hermes's children can share the same elfish, cunning look that he has. It's already been established that the damage to Hephaestus's leg doesn't go away no matter what form he takes, so why hasn't it been passed on?
    • A large part of Hephaestus' deformity is from being dropped off a mountain when he was a child. He was considered ugly by Hera which means less than 100% perfect so he might not have originally been that ugly. So he might not have started off that ugly, but due to injuries and being treated as ugly for eons that is the form he takes. He doesn't care about his appearence so at least in part he takes o less than perfect forms. We also know gods excersie some degree of control over what their children inherit such as pyrokinses. Hepahestus may take steps to make sure his children do not look too bad so they avoid going through what he has gone through.

     Cabins for minor gods 
  • Why didn't the children of Hades and the minor gods have cabins built for them before Percy suggested it at the end of The Last Olympian? Having a small cabin for your kids to stay in at camp isn't the same as, say, a throne on Olympus for every minor god, and characters like Nico are shown to have built their parents' cabins largely on their own. Were they all waiting for some permission that had to be given by the gods, or did they truthfully just not think of it?
    • They were waiting for permission. The major Olympians especially Zeus are incredibly prideful and did not deem the minor gods important enough to have cabins of their own. It would distract from their own cabins and imply the minor gods are kind of equal to the big 12.
    • Important, according to who? No one except the half-bloods worships the Greek gods anymore, and a cabin doesn't seem to be on the same level as a throne on Olympus because it's not just there for honorary purposes. (We know that Hera's is, but then again, it's Hera we're talking about - Artemis at least uses hers for when her Hunters visit camp as a hunting cabin.) The cabins are there to house their children, and I don't recall any point in the books where it was mentioned that this was the reason.
      • Important according to the 12 incredibly arrogant, petty jerks who rule Olympus and usually do not care what mortals think. The same 12 whose mistreatment of the minor gods and demigods drove many to side with Kronos. It was never outright stated, but like many Headscratchers or facts can be inferred. The 12 are very self-centered dismissing others are not important enough to bother about hence their mistreatment others. It is not a stretch to assume that whenever the issue was brought up Zeus or the council to dismiss it because they did not consider the children of minor gods to be important enough to do anything about.
      • I'm sorry, but it still seems like a stretch to suggest that the gods would care at all. A cabin for Hades, I could see Zeus having a problem with, but otherwise, I can't see even him stooping to such a low. (Especially since he's responsible for the barrier around camp to begin with, powered by none other than the sacrifice of his own daughter.)
      • The same Zeus who destroyed an entire city for the king alone insulting him, another for a queen's foolish boast, treated Percy's birth as a major issue while ignoring Thalia, willing to watch his kingdom crumble rather than ask for help, and whose general drove many demigods and minor gods including former allies into joining the army of the Titans. Yes, Zeus at least at some of the others of the 12 are that low. Given minor gods a cabin and not Hades would be an insult Hades would not ignore. Easier to give only the 12 cabins on the grounds they are the rulers and ignore everyone else. Like most things with Zeus, the barrier has to be put in context. It saves Thalia from Hades, honors her death, and more importantly makes Zeus look good while claiming to do something for all the children while not doing that much. That improves Zeus' self-image which is what is most important to him. Cabins like thrones become another status symbol that proves the 12 are "better" than other gods. And yes, from all we have seen of some gods like Zeus, Hera, and Apollo among likely others I would say they are that petty.
      • Okay, even if that's the case, it'd be nice if there were something in the books to back it up. It's harder to swallow when there's no evidence of it, since the "Olympians are jerks" argument is used on almost everything else."
      • Headscratchers are often Headscratcher because there is no clear, plainly stated answer to something. The best one can do is infer from the given information. The "Olympians are jerks" is used to answer any question on why the Olympians did something that is jerkish because the books portray them, especially Zeus, as that big of jerks.
      • Yes that does explain why the Olympians didn't order the building of smaller cabins before but what's to stop the kids from starting it? What are the gods or Chiron going to do, forbid honouring a (fellow) god? They would have a mini civil war on their hands led by Hades even without Kronos turning the minor gods to his side.
    • I think it's supposed to mirror the Olympian Council-as above, so below, so to speak. Percy shook them up something.

     Labyrinth destruction 
  • When the labyrinth was destroyed at the end of the fourth book, what happened to Hephaestus's workshop? Did it get destroyed as well, or is it technically not part of the labyrinth?
    • It was not part of the labyrinth or it was one of several labyrinths though I go with the former.

     Gods' morality 
  • Ok so, Percy calls out the gods on some less than savoury actions in front of Dionysus, to which he tartly says that mortals, demigods included, have bad apples too so they are in no position to judge. Percy just concedes the point. Fair enough, nobody said mortals are perfect but aren't gods supposed to be... you know... ideal in the sense "behaving in a way that is worth following as an example?" Which they do not do.
    • No, not really, because even in a meta-sense, the Ancient Greeks intentionally modeled their gods in the image of most of humanity by making them flawed and imperfect. In the myths, the gods weren't responsible for creating humanity or agreeing to become paradigms of enlightenment and morality or anything - they only gained "ownership" of the world by fighting to take it from their much more ruthless progenitors, and humans only came into the mix because one Titan created them in the image of the gods and then gave them gifts of advancement when he couldn't bear watching them suffer. So, in their view, while the gods still could try to act as models for the humans, most of them don't really see themselves as obligated to because they didn't volunteer for that kind of role and because humans have been given so much already, without their involvement in giving it to them.
      • Well yes Prometheus was the one who created the first humans back during Kronos' rule, not the gods, that is true. Yet 1, Zeus (one of the worst ever offender in a pantheon of Jerkass Gods) actually did volunteer for the king of the universe title by agreeing to plot to kill his father and as mentioned, humans were already part of that deal at the time, and 2, after Zeus with some help created a huge flood it was Zeus who allowed the two survivors, Deucalion and Pyrrha, to repopulate the Earth by throwing rocks behind their backs which turned into humans (in some versions it was him that sent them to Delphi for the prophecy on how to do that).
      • To be fair, Zeus in these books isn't synonymous with Zeus as he was in most of the myths. If he really does have any sort of a good side to him, Riordan hasn't really done a good job of showing the readers that. Zeus in the myths did questionable things because all of the gods did questionable things back then - it's how the Greeks imagined them to be - but even he wasn't without his good epithets back then.
      • Protagonist-Centered Morality may account for some of this.
    • This is one of the problems with writing a book series about Greek gods that’s also aimed at middle schoolers. Riordan didn’t make anything up about how the gods behave — their portrayals, while exaggerated in some cases, are written in the spirit of how they were in the original mythology. There are multiple reasons given for their behavior in the myths, so you should read some of those if you’d like to learn about them. But asking an author to trim away all the morally gray parts of the mythos and/or make the gods overly good and nice would lead to an adaptation more in line with Disney’s take on the subject, which was poorly received in Greece due to how watered-down its portrayal was.

     Entering the camp 
  • If Luke wanted to destroy camp from the beginning, couldn't he have just gone inside the barrier himself and then granted permission to all the monsters so that they could enter, too? Or did the camp have some way of keeping him off of the list?
    • First off, its implied that you need to address the monster by name, and you can only individually allow them in one at a time. Considering that an army big enough to beat all the campers must be at least several hundred strong, that would take hours. Which leads to problem two, the campers. They trust Luke, but they aren't stupid. If they see Luke inviting monsters in they would immediately dogpile him and drag him off to be questioned. Third, Dionysus is there. For all his laziness he isn't going to stand by and just watch. Therefore, any army, no matter how big, isn't large enough to threaten the camp at this point in the story, so its pointless. It would even be counterproductive, Kronos needs more time to build up strength, so he mustn't draw suspicion, a monster army marching into one of the great bastions of demigods if literally ringing alarm bells, he would be crushed in his weakened state instantly by the gods.

     Hera's responsibility 
  • In Percy Jackson's Greek Gods, Percy makes the excellent point that since Hercules had a well documented track record of unchecked temper flowing into violence, starting with beating a teached to death when he was twelve, him killing Megara and their children might not have, in fact, been because of Hera driving him completely insane, and was more Hera calculatedly annoying him with the oracle about Hercules having to serve his royal cousin for an extended period of time until he was ready to snap at anyone in a fit of rage. Fair enough. Then in the sequel series we learn Thalia's mother met her death in a carcrash. Most to that say "uh-huh. Yeah. Car crash. Obviously Hera arranged it."- but did she really have to, when Beryl was already a known alcoholic? Did Hera even need to introduce Beryl to alcohol when we learn how obsessed with Zeus and full of herself Beryl was when she found out she managed to snatch the Lord of the skies himself? Speaking of, how did she even find out? ZEUS of all people has a bad experience with his paramours learning who he is (just look at the pile of ashes that was Semele.)
    • I've never heard it suggested anywhere that Hera was responsible for the death of Thalia's mother. If anyone actually believes that, they must be part of a very small minority.
      • Really? Thought more would have made the obvious jump to conclusion that the goddess whose day job it practically is to torture and kill her husband's paramours and lovechildren would have had something to do with the death of a woman who Zeus had a child with not once, but twice. Then again, by the point Beryl died, Hera did already take Jason, and it is specifically stated that Jason's life was sold to her to pacify her wrath, it's just never added whether it did manage to pacify her at the time or if the years gone by since then have done that.
    • I remember it being established in The Demigod Diaries that Thalia's mother was a bit of a wreck, and that she sort of let being the secret lover of the king of the gods get to her head a little bit...It sort of undermines her responsibility to pin it on Hera when it was never suggested that that was the case.
      • Good points, however sadly even in the Demigod Diaries we only have a perspective describing Beryl after she got to know Zeus, we have unfortunately nothing to go on to judge what she was like before him and in what ways she changed that were completely out of line with her former self other than the fact that she became a mania... and Hera is the one famous for taking her wrath out on Zeus' paramours in various vindictive and creative ways.

     Demigod ages 
  • In the books, much is made of how dangerous being a demigod is and how it's really a miracle if one of the more powerful ones live to see the ripe age of 25-30, let alone more. And with all that happens to the kids in every book, that's no exaggeration. Yet they also establish that all cabins and cohorts have centuries of demigods to look back to, many of whom became famous... and died old, read over 70 or even 80. Keep in mind by this I don't mean the small percentage offhandedly mentioned I think in book one whose scent and aura was so weak they themselves never realized what they were- I'm talking people like Jefferson, confirmed Cabin 1 kid from Monticello (read, living with a target on hom all his life if we know anything about Hera), Washington, the pride of Mount Vermont and Cabin 6, or Archimedes, legend of Cabin 9. Why do people forget that while yes, this gives a lot to live up to but it also gives hope, as in, "they started at the same place we are, so if they could do it, so can we"?
    • I assume they view this the same way we view founding a top 500 company, yes its possible, but its so incredibly rare that only a lucky few get to achieve it.
    • You make it sound as though all half-bloods are cynical and don't expect their lives to last long or lead to anything noteworthy. They know the dangers their very existence can lead to, but they spend most of their lives training to survive. It's not like they need someone to stand up and give them all a motivational speech for them to see the worth in living.

     Let's get metaphysical 
  • In the first book, Percy asks something to the effect of whether the singular God himself is real. Chiron basically shrugs this off, says something about being metaphysical and that it's not worth dwelling on. However, later installments showcase the existence of multiple different pantheons - Greek, Roman, Egyptian, Norse, Chinese (I think) - and in The Sword of Summer, one character offhandedly mentions one of his interactions with Jesus. So why didn't Chiron just tell Percy that All Myths Are True?
    • I mean, the answer Chiron gave is closer to the kind of information Percy was actually looking for. Percy wants to know if there's an absolute God and the simple answer is "I don't know" because, from Chiron's perspective, the gods are basically just really powerful embodiments of the world's various aspects. He couldn't mention the other pantheons because the Greeks aren't supposed to know about the Romans (can't speak for certain about the others as I've only read the first series and Heroes of Olympus) and telling them that there's more than one set of gods out there would set a precedent for the existence of separate demigod groups that the gods do not want Camp Half-Blood to have.
    • Also, presumably both Chiron and Riordan don't want to have to deal with "Is there a capital-G God."

     Dealing with the scent 
  • It's stated that all demigods have some degree of luring scent to monsters- the stronger the parent, the stronger the scent and the more monsters find the kid to be like a five star dinner of 10 courses. (Eg: A child of Aphrodite or even a minor god? You should probably be able to get by even if you don't happen to be an outstanding fighter.. A child of Zeus, Poseidon or Hades? STAY AT CAMP FOR THE SAKE OF ALL THAT IS HOLY. Especially if you live in Cabin One.) Other factors are whether or not they are in the company of other demigods (too many demigods equals a "come eat me" flare) and the usage of electronics such as cell phones and laptops (IIRC, there is a mention of a poor unfortunate soul whose last mistake was googling a type of monster shortly after being attacked by them and escaping.) Yet... many of those electronics are a staple of modern life and expected for use in school and later work- which might be why it is spelt outright in several books that demigods living to adulthood can be a big thing, and that demigods living to adulthood without actually knowing they are demigods are rare as anything (though it still happens). How come Cabin Hephaestus and/or Athene hasn't thought of something to deal with the conundrum?
    • Asking "why haven't Hephaestus and Athene kids figured out an answer?" is sort of like asking "how come the real-life genius doctors of the world haven't solved a cure to Alzheimer's?" Some of them probably are working on it, but it might just be that it's that difficult a conundrum. You also have to remember that widespread information technology has not been widespread for all that long, meaning people haven't had much time to work on a fix, and that most of those who would have the motivation to work on it are, while very smart, still ultimately kids who don't live long enough to reach their full intellectual potential. That being said, it's implied that with time, certain parties 'have figured out selective workarounds: Daedalus' laptop, for example, doesn't appear to attract monsters while in use.
      • Daedalus's laptop was actually one of the main reasons of asking the question in the first place: it proves that the problem can be solved. Not only did Daedalus have no problems while using it but Annabeth (and any demigods around her) doesn't either. Which could give them an opportunity to reverse-engineer from it whatever measures Daedalus took to make it safe.
      • I think the effects of technology on half-bloods have more to do with whether there's a signal being emitted, like through Wi Fi or cellular data, and that signal is what the monsters are able to detect. Daedalus's laptop's main use is to store his own designs and inventions, so Annabeth might not use it to browse the internet very often. Nevermind how she's safe with it whenever she uses it while at camp - even if monsters detect the signal, there's no way they could get in. She might just not use it while she's staying with her dad during the year. The same would apply to the kids in Cabin 9 - if they do any tinkering with technology while away from camp, they'd probably be safe as long as the tech doesn't emit any sort of signal.

  • Two questions. 1: Why did Zeus pick Tantalus of all his sons when he started doubting Chiron? This is the guy who served up his own kid for a stew we are talking about, who Zeus and the others unanimously , justly and personally punished brutally for it. If he just wanted one of his own kids to replace Chiron, heck, he had loads more to chose from who would have been better. 2: How come he and Dionysus are all chummy? Yes the Tantalus episode is before Mr. D was even thought of, yes Mr. D. is currently forcibly off the bottle and cannot touch anything wine or grape related which might make him understand Tantalus' crankiness a bit, but as the god who chews out demigods for being jerks towards others, you would think he would detest one prime example where it really was the demigod at fault and everyone sides with the gods about the horrible punishment.
    • 1.) You could make a very long list of things Zeus does in these books that the Zeus of the myths wouldn't have done, because Riordan likes making Zeus look like a corrupt incompetent idiot, and the readers like buying into it. 2.) It's not like Dionysus's entire character revolves around him disliking demigods because they do bad things - he gets annoyed with them primarily because he's miffed about being stuck babysitting them and not being able to drink anything while he's there. Both of these things would probably make him delighted to be paired up with another person who doesn't like half-bloods and is forbidden from eating or drinking.

     Dead parents 
  • It's mentioned in the first book that there's a decree or law among the gods that half-bloods are obligated to be raised by the mortal parent. But what would happen if a mortal father dies before the baby is born, and without any family members? Does the baby get sent to an orphanage with no explanation of who they really are?
    • Short answer, yes. Same for those whose mortal mother dies in/around childbirth or before remarrying if they were single when meeting the god that fathered the child, if there are no other relatives. Also keep in mind that it is established in the first sentences of the first book that even knowing of their demigod origins makes their scent stronger, so "no explanation of who they really are" kind of applies to every young demigod.
      • When I mentioned the explanation part, I meant an explanation to the orphanage/place where the baby was left, as to who they were. If they were the child of a particularly powerful god, it would seem like a bad idea to just throw them into some random orphanage and leave them to be assailed by monsters and other strange happenings as they grow older. Young half-bloods may not know anything about their divine parentage, but at least their mortal parents do.
      • To the orphanage... probably no explanation would be given, because seriously, how would they make sure that 1, the one(s) getting it would actually believe it, 2, it doesn't get into the wrong hands? Remember, loads of teachers are monsters themselves.

     Age limit 
  • Is there an age limit to going to camp? I mean both in the sense of "you have to get to camp by the time you are x years old" and in the sense of "You cannot return to camp if you are older than x years old". I know Annabeth says that usually the kids' smell doesn't attract monsters till they are about 10 years old (making her getting to camp at age 7 slightly preemptive but she does say she had huge monster problems even before running away probably thanks to being Athena's child since stronger parent = stronger smell), and Dionysus remarks that Sally's reaction of trying to protect Percy herself without sending him to camp is usual of mothers and is generally a surefire way to get the kid killed, but they don't mention an upper age limit either way...
    • I don't recall anything in the books stating that there were any age limits, or that half-bloods were required to come to camp in the first place. It's probably up to the child and their mortal parent if and when they go. In the same vein, an adult half-blood probably would be disallowed by default, since their survival up to that point would indicate either a minor god as their parent or them being sufficiently skilled to protect against monsters on their own. Maybe they could find work there as a camp counselor or some sort of trainer, but I doubt Chiron and Mr. D would allow them in just as a regular camper.

     Atlas going divine 
  • How come Atlas didn't go into his true divine form at any point during The Titan's Curse? In the fifth book, Mr. D reveals that just being near a full-on Titan is enough to incinerate you, even if you don't look at them, and Atlas was never sealed in Tartarus like Kronos and the others, so he shouldn't have needed to take time to recuperate like they did.
    • Bond Villain Stupidity, most likely.
    • It's implied in the Last Olympian that the titans are heavily weakened until Kronos regains his form.
      • Considering that he had been holding the sky up until pretty recently (in the book), it could be that he was too tired to engage the transformation at the time he was fought.

     New gods 
  • So Heroes of Olympus reveals that the gods still hold a connection to the ruins left behind in Greece, since their roots are still there regardless of how much they move to a new country. But what would happen if a new god was born after they moved. Would they be rooted to Greece like the others, or whatever country they were born in?
    • For new gods who are born to two gods (eg., Ares and Aphrodite), I think they would be rooted in Greece. For new gods who were actually mortal demigods but ascended (eg., Herc and Mr. D) if such a thing is still possible, they would be rooted in their birth country I think.

     Aphrodite's looks 
  • If Aphrodite's appearance changes according to the viewer's standards of beauty, what would she see if she looked at herself in the mirror? For that matter, what does Hephaestus see whenever he lays eyes on her? And is this something she can toggle on and off as she pleases, or is it how her appearance always works?
    • She'd see herself a) however she wanted herself to look or b) with whatever features she would find most attractive in another person, presumably as moderated by her personal gender identity/desired presentation. Hephaestus would see whatever he found most attractive in a partner, whether he wanted to or not. We're never told she can turn it off, but I don't see why she wouldn't be able to.

     Location of Mt Olympus 
If Mount Olympus's location follows Western Civilization, shouldn't it be located somewhere in Washington DC (i.e., the top of the Washington Monument) instead of at the top of the Empire State Building? I get why it didn't go to the West Coast (seeing as how that's where the Roman camp is, and even though the Roman and Greek gods are basically the same people but with different personalities, the Roman and Greek demigods are still bitter rivals during the time of the first 5 books), but wouldn't it make more sense for it to be in the capital of the nation than New York City?
  • Maybe the construction of the Empire State Building - the tallest building in the world at the time - was what cemented America's status as the new hearthstone of western civilization, so when the gods moved to America, Olympus rooted itself to the thing that had brought them there.
  • Mount Olympus isn't close to Athens, Greece's capital either. The location seems to have something to do with the tallest point in the country, which was likely the Empire State back when the US consisted of only New England. And for what it's worth, during that time New York was the capital.
    • Bear in mind that the Empire State Building wasn't built until the 1930s, and we know for a fact that there were demigods born in America as early as the Founding Fathers (Percy says in Book 1 that GW was a son of Athena). My guess is that, as above, it moved to America before Washington DC was built in the early 1800s.
    • Just because half-bloods were being born in America doesn't necessarily mean that the gods had already moved over. (Especially since, at that time, America was still a colony of Great Britain, meaning it hadn't done anything to cement its status as the new hearthstone.) And there's also no reason to assume that Olympus rooted itself to the Empire State Building, and that it wasn't the other way around. Maybe the architects who built it were half-bloods themselves, who did so in honor of the gods.

     Big Three pact 
  • If the Big Three were so adamant about not having any more children after World War II (at the time, anyway), why didn’t they swear their oaths on the River Styx so that they’d be completely unbreakable? In every myth where it’s brought up, a Stygian oath is described as being impossible to go against even by Zeus himself, and no matter how much he might want to.
    • They did, actually—it's mentioned briefly by Grover. That's part of why the Furies, etc went after Thalia, and she had to make her stand. And as The Trials of Apollo shows, Stygian oaths are breakable, there are just very severe (but not entirely fully-defined at time of writing) punishments. It seems to be kinda like swearing on the Bible in court—you can break an oath sworn on the Styx, or on the Bible, but it's just assumed that no one would.

     Thalia fulfilling the prophecy 
  • The ending of The Titan’s Curse plays out as though the Great Prophecy is still in effect (and it does turn out to be) — Thalia joins the Hunters so that she won’t ever fulfill it by turning 16, and Percy accepts the burden of fulfilling it so that Nico won’t have to. However, Thalia already fulfilled the terms of the prophecy, didn’t she? She had the choice to summon that creature (whose name escapes me) that held the power to destroy Olympus, and chose not to - “Olympus to preserve or raze.”
    • But not all of it—there's also the bit about "see the world in endless sleep/a hero's soul, cursed blade shall reap."

     Social Services 
  • Shouldn't Luke have been taken away from his mother at some point before he was old enough to run away? It's been years since I read The Last Olympian, but she was clearly some level of crazy, and that's part of the reason why Luke became evil in the first place. Was Hermes somehow pulling something to make sure no one looked into Luke's home situation?
    • Hard to see that happening, given how broken up he was afterwards. Possibly the insanity got worse over time, and when Luke was a kid, it was only occasional flashbacks and episodes, and it got worse over time, especially when she had no one else around.

     Half-blood lineage 
  • How did it take Percy at least three books for the fact to occur to him that Kronos was his grandfather? And even then, it comes up almost as an afterthought during his introduction to Hera, as I recall. He knows Poseidon is his father, and he knows that Kronos is Poseidon's father...I'm admittedly a bit of a mythology nerd, but I feel like if I were a half-blood, those kinds of relationships are ones that would've come to my attention right away, not two or three years later.
    • My guess is that it's because godly relationships beyond immediate family are seldom touched on. He's also Annabeth's first cousin once removed and both Apollo and Meg's first cousin—if you spend really any time thinking about godly family relationships, you're gonna need Brain Bleach. My guess is that with the exception of other children of Poseidon, Percy just doesn't think about his dad's side of the family any more than necessary.

     Holding up the sky 
  • If the weight of the sky is as heavy as it would seem to be, it seems unlikely that Percy, Luke, or Annabeth would be able to hold it up for very long. I don't recall the books stating that enhanced strength is something half-bloods are naturally gifted with, and a full-on goddess told Percy he would be crushed if he tried to bear it himself. Yet he manages to do so despite the immense strain it puts on him. Does he actually have superhuman strength, or did he pull through thanks to the magic of willpower alone?


How well does it match the trope?

Example of:


Media sources: