- If the Train of Thought delivers most of Riley's daydreams, ideas, etc. for each day, and the recall chutes are mostly for memories, then how do the emotions get mind mail to their rooms on a day when the train of thought is stuck up at HQ instead of pulling in from Dream Productions for the day?
- Nerve Mail?note
- If Joy didn't pick it up from a mail slot at her door, I'd have thought of a pneumatic system similar to the memory recall tubes.
- I'm having trouble imagining where the intercom would be placed. I've examined videos of Headquarters to see where it would go and the description of where it is placed in the fic, but I still can't picture where it is.
- The trouble with your visualization is that I think the author purposefully put it in a position where we could not see it from the normal front view we get of the emotions working. I think the idea is that it's placed just on the other side of where the Idea Bulbs are, by the ramp that loops up to the emotions spot. Like I said, one spot where we could never see it in the movie proper.
- Correction: There is 1 spot you might have seen it where it's described, and that's when Joy and Sadness were talking at the beginning of the movie. Unfortunately, that part of the wall was blank, so that probably threw off your visualizing as well. That the spot where it was written in was blank in canon.
- Chapter 16 states that the intercom was added with the new console.
- The trouble with your visualization is that I think the author purposefully put it in a position where we could not see it from the normal front view we get of the emotions working. I think the idea is that it's placed just on the other side of where the Idea Bulbs are, by the ramp that loops up to the emotions spot. Like I said, one spot where we could never see it in the movie proper.
- In chapter 11, one of Riley's classmates' emotions is quoted as saying "If [Riley] knows [about the true nature of emotions], she's bound to snap. Mind manuals say it's happened before." If we make the assumption that the mind manuals don't contain any false information—which makes sense, as there's no logical reason why they would—where would that information have come from? Has that student actually seen it happen to someone before? If not, does that imply some type of extrasensory perception (or ESP for short) is possible? After all, if a character's mind contains information about something outside the character's mind, and it came from a source other than that person's senses, it would stand to reason that other functions of the character's mind—such as their conscious thoughts—could get information through a similar means, at least through practice. Understanding this completely would probably require an explanation on where the manuals came from, which isn't explained in the movie, but the movie doesn't seem to imply they contain any kind of outside information.
- This of course is where WMG could come in. They could just be a manual that just covers all possible issues from the moment a child is born. Kind of like a true Big Book Of Everything that just exists. They could be connected to the collective unconscious if you're more Jungian in thinking about where all that information would come from. Or, if you want to go an alternate route, you could say that a God, when they created people, created the mind manuals as well. So that by divine power, the manuals have everything they need. It's all a matter of deciding what you think works.
- How exactly does the analogy in chapter 4 work of Riley's Mental World being like the Earth's mantle, and her physical brain being like the inner core? Wouldn't that mean her brain is inside of that dimension, which exists physically inside her head? Word of God for the movie already confirmed that isn't the case. (All I can think of is that the words "mantle" and "mental" sound similar and are anagrams, but that doesn't really mean anything.)
- Word of God from the author here for what I was going for: Say you have a city get blown up—that would cause that part of the Earth's mantle to be devastated, but the inner core that keeps the Earth stable wouldn't be damaged at all, just keep on turning like nothing was wrong. If, however, the inner core of the Earth had something drastic happen to it, the entire rest of the Earth would becomes affected too. Using this analogy, the Islands of Personality falling were catastrophic for Riley's mind at the time of the film, but her brain was fine. If she got brain damage from an accident or something, though, her entire Mind World could be affected. Similarly there's the brain freeze thing as depicted in the film—the physical brain itself doesn't really freeze, but the Mind World experiences it as freezing, like how weather is present above the Earth's mantle. Hope that helps.
- Oh, that makes sense. I thought you were using that analogy to explain how the two worlds were connected, or "where" it is, as Riley asked.
- To clarify a bit more on the "where it is" thing, going back to the "mantle and core" analogy, think of the Mind World being almost like an energy shield that's linked to the brain—came up with that way of looking at it seeing as Brain Freeze effects them in the Mind World, when "brain freeze" really more affects the front of the head, not the brain.
- Word of God from the author here for what I was going for: Say you have a city get blown up—that would cause that part of the Earth's mantle to be devastated, but the inner core that keeps the Earth stable wouldn't be damaged at all, just keep on turning like nothing was wrong. If, however, the inner core of the Earth had something drastic happen to it, the entire rest of the Earth would becomes affected too. Using this analogy, the Islands of Personality falling were catastrophic for Riley's mind at the time of the film, but her brain was fine. If she got brain damage from an accident or something, though, her entire Mind World could be affected. Similarly there's the brain freeze thing as depicted in the film—the physical brain itself doesn't really freeze, but the Mind World experiences it as freezing, like how weather is present above the Earth's mantle. Hope that helps.
- From Chapter 5, Fear, Disgust and Sadness choose to take the train of thought down to Dream Productions in order to meet Riley when she lucid dreams herself into the mind world for the first time. Ok, fair enough. And Joy and Anger stayed up in HQ in order that when riley woke up, she wouldn't be emotionless. However, what this doesn't explain is something subtle you might not have caught with the funny moment about Riley changing into pajamas that night. When she asks Joy and Anger not to look at her, and when anger snarks about them never giving Riley privacy before, Riley seems to show signs of embarrassment and bashfulness. The only trouble with this is that embarrassment and bashfulness usually have an element of Fear to it. But when Joy and Sadness got lost last year, Riley seemed to shut down and become incapable of being either happy or sad. So.....how was riley able to feel the fear of embarrassment if Fear wasn't at the console at the time?
- You have a point there... I guess I was going for more of a frustrated "Ugh, you had to remind me of that" response, which would be leant more to Anger than Fear.
- So, if the emotions have had an intercom in Headquarters, why didn't Anger, Fear and Disgust try using it to get Riley to stop running away when they couldn't give her an emotional reaction?
- Because it hadn't been installed yet. As stated in Chapter 16.
- Why is it called "consciousness tampering"? Tampering means "interfering with (something) in order to cause damage or make unauthorized alterations." This term has been used to refer to non-damaging alterations, but they certainly wouldn't be unauthorized. If anyone's authorized to make changes to the way Riley's mind works, it's Riley.
- Word of God here: I called it "conscious tampering" because a host interacting with the Mind World isn't a normal everyday procedure like on a normal day.
- Doesn't mean it's unauthorized though, or that there's anything wrong with it.
- True, though what I meant by it was more along the lines of it being not something that is a normal function of the Mind World, but something that is done only under specific circumstances with the host that puts some alterations in the average way the Mind World works.
- Word of God here: I called it "conscious tampering" because a host interacting with the Mind World isn't a normal everyday procedure like on a normal day.
- Why does Riley accept it as a given that she can't directly read the manuals simply because Fear doesn't want her to? It's not up to Fear; it's her own mind.
- Riley's still only 12. And for most of her life (aside from brief flare ups from anger or when she's on the rink) she's been a rather mild, non-aggressive child. Heck, even when she was depressed, she never took it out on her parents directly. Never yelled, "I hate you for taking us out here!" She might enjoy things and want things, but she's not naturally inclined to demand someone to "step aside". (aside from demanding joy remove an idea from her head) It's...not in her personality. Also, Riley's still getting use to the idea of having living mind beings who live for her. She doesn't consider herself their Boss or their Goddess or anything like that, because such a thought seems unthinkable to her at the moment. And besides, the emotions are her friends now. Part of me wonders if she doesn't want to go against them because she's worried they're the only friends she'll have left. Hence her going behind their back because she doesn't want to fight with them over this. Or as an alternate view, what Riley's thinking of doing is so radical, she's certain the emotions will veto her, and she'd never get a chance to see those manuals anyways. It's like the CEO demanding her best managers to let her do their job. Sure, she might technically have the authority to do so, but there's an unspoken rule that doing so is stepping over their authority as her emotional guiding forces.
- How could they veto her? She has more control there than they do.
- Again, it's more a moral/emotional veto rather than a veto by force per se. Riley, as a child, probably also doesn't think she has that right to do something so big for mind world. Idea bulbs getting replaced is one thing, but if it's bigger than that, well, all 5 would do everything in her power to make her understand why the action is a bad idea.
- Riley's still only 12. And for most of her life (aside from brief flare ups from anger or when she's on the rink) she's been a rather mild, non-aggressive child. Heck, even when she was depressed, she never took it out on her parents directly. Never yelled, "I hate you for taking us out here!" She might enjoy things and want things, but she's not naturally inclined to demand someone to "step aside". (aside from demanding joy remove an idea from her head) It's...not in her personality. Also, Riley's still getting use to the idea of having living mind beings who live for her. She doesn't consider herself their Boss or their Goddess or anything like that, because such a thought seems unthinkable to her at the moment. And besides, the emotions are her friends now. Part of me wonders if she doesn't want to go against them because she's worried they're the only friends she'll have left. Hence her going behind their back because she doesn't want to fight with them over this. Or as an alternate view, what Riley's thinking of doing is so radical, she's certain the emotions will veto her, and she'd never get a chance to see those manuals anyways. It's like the CEO demanding her best managers to let her do their job. Sure, she might technically have the authority to do so, but there's an unspoken rule that doing so is stepping over their authority as her emotional guiding forces.
- In Chapter 16, it is explained that time passes in the Mind World on a Year Outside, Hour Inside principle. Sadness says this immediately after saying that "everything in Headquarters is needed for immediate responses", which I assume is referring to how people can feel emotional responses to events faster than you would expect it to take for someone to walk to a control panel and press a button. But if this is the case, wouldn't it be Year Inside, Hour Outside instead?
- I thought it was the reverse of that since only a short amount of time seems to pass for Joy and Sadness, but much more time passes Outside.
- Actually, come to think of it, how is that even supposed to work with the intercom? They're able to talk to Riley at a normal speed.
- The way I see it, everything in Headquarters is directly in time with the Outside world, while time seems to pass differently in other areas. That would be why only a few minutes seem to pass from when Joy and Sadness tried to cross Goofball Island to the island collapsing, when Outside that event that triggered the collapse didn't happen until hours later.
- Does that mean the view from the window in Headquarters appears in slow motion? That's the only way it would make sense, but I didn't notice anything like that in the movie when the islands were seen collapsing from HQ.
- Didn't think about that... maybe then the other parts of the Mind World just kind of operate on a Timey-Wimey Ball and it depends.
- So far the only reason we've seen why emotions don't normally talk to their hosts is because it could scare people, or cause psychological problems, because it's not something people are used to. But that had to start somewhere. If humans had been able to communicate with their emotions (not to mention access their Mind Worlds) as a normal thing for all of history, it wouldn't be something to worry about. It would make a lot more sense that way, not to mention being better in many ways (see the WMG page, Ctrl+F "new era for mankind"). So, given that the normal concerns didn't apply then, why did the very first emotions decide to keep their existence a secret from their hosts?note
- (deep breath) Whoo. Big question. In a way, this is poking holes at the metaphysics of this universe. I suppose there are a number of reasons that could be called plausible, so here goes.
- Because of Fear. Fear was all about keeping their humans safe, and as we've seen with even Riley for a few days, there are plenty of scenarios where the emotions could hinder by their talking just as much as they could help. If a sabertooth is attacking you, wouldn't it help if you could just react quickly without flinching at hearing a voice scream "LOOK OUT!" And if you were always self aware of your own emotions, then you might not recognize how much you still have your own life too. Hence Fear's whole "go crazy" business, only more in the sense that you don't know how to deal with a potential free will crisis.
- Because of convenience. If emotions can't be heard, a human wouldn't have to feel self-conscious hunting, fighting, mating with 5 other people right alongside them. Even if they won't get credit for some things they do, they'd still let their host have it easier by thinking about their own interest rather than "group" interest.
- Because they wanted to respect their host's privacy. That Disgust and Fear both thought it would be too icky if people had to bear with the fact that they always have 5 little beings watching at all times, so to give the illusion of privacy, they didn't regularly communicate. (Ok, so that's dishonest, but then emotions don't exactly have "normal" morality)
- Because there was a time issue. Remember, Riley didn't get an intercom in her head until she was 12. So even if the first emotions wanted to talk with their people, they'd have to wait years before they could do so. And then this would teeter again into that issue of humans having to abruptly transition from being master of their own life into "Well, you choose to actualize what we're plugging into you." And that would easily cause some psyche damage.
- Because there's a mind world rule in the manuals stating emotions can't do that. We don't know if the manuals cover this normally, but perhaps they were just following the rules that said, "Under no circumstance should you let your human hear you talking directly, because (insert plausible reason here).
- Then the question just shifts to why that rule exists.
- Because humans didn't have true minds until it was too late. This one's a bit more out there, but it's a theory that by the time humans had TRUE minds, with control panels, imagination lands, etc, they were already heavily populated. By which point the first true emotions threw up their hands and said, "this is way too much to take in. If we start talking now, he'll be executed for insanity, or mislead them if they think he's talking to gods. We gotta keep secret."
- Because the power of using the mind world was abused. As stated in the manuals, things like consciousness tampering and psychotic breaks are very real fears in the modern era. Perhaps when humans who did have emotion conversations began abusing their powers, thus hurting themselves, the emotions in other people decided to have a collective memory purge so that humans wouldn't destroy themselves on their behalf. I mean, think about it. If you had a chance to live in a world where you could do so much on your own, why live in the cruel world of farming, disease, and helplessness?
- As long as you're not hurting anybody else, you aren't abusing it. Also, how would the emotions communicate with other people's emotions in order to do the collective memory purge?
- When you hurt yourself, anyone who knows you is hurt through ripples of sympathy, pain and care. It's possible that collective memory lost was just each individual set of emotions exposed to a brain dead human eventually threw up their arms and said, "To ensure our person doesn't get like that, we'll try to have our person help raise their kids never to hear emotions."
- Because emotions didn't even think to do something like that before. This ties in a bit to the 12 before you got an intercom idea, but perhaps since the emotions were just used to doing their work one way, they got lazy and thought that they didn't need to help their people by directly communicating except for conscious voices. That what they were doing on a day to day basis was enough.
- Because of Divine Mandate. This one is definitely going to raise a few eyebrows, but I suppose it does function as the ultimate Because I Said So Hand Wave on why emotions and humans never interacted before this.
- ''Like with the example of the rule in the manuals, then the question just changes to why that "divine mandate" was made. People's lives would very likely be better if it hadn't been.
- (deep breath) Whoo. Big question. In a way, this is poking holes at the metaphysics of this universe. I suppose there are a number of reasons that could be called plausible, so here goes.
- To explain why Riley got her intercom installed at the age of 12, could the age for the installment of the intercom be selected based on a person's upbringing? For example, Riley has led a happy and safe life, did the mind workers think because she has had such a smooth ride, getting the intercom when she was 12 sounded reasonable? It's all a matter of life's choices and the decision of the mind workers?
- Technically speaking, we don't know how upgrades work. Heck, we never saw the transition from 1 button to mini console. All we do know is that as a person matures emotionally, they get bigger consoles for wider emotional ranges. In regards to getting the intercom at age 12, I suppose it could go in 2 directions. That intercoms get installed when emotions (or mind workers, depending on who you think is responsible for initiating upgrades) think their child is too astray or really developing their worldview. Remember, Intercoms were originally meant for "occasional back of head" conscious speaking. So that would imply that the emotions need it to help people stay moral to the degree they believe themselves to be. So it's possible they get installed as people begin to realize the notions of Good and Evil as a way to help build character.
- If Honesty Island were to fall completely, how big of a problem would that really be? Riley could still be honest if she wants to. And in cases when she feels like lying is the right choice (like when her parents were questioning her about hearing voices) it would probably actually be a lot easier because without Honesty Island, she probably won't feel (as) guilty about it. Not to mention she wouldn't need to worry about it falling anymore. Looking at what's best for Riley, Honesty Island might actually do more harm than good.
- Strictly speaking, people's personality can be changed. And whether that change is good or bad depends on context of that change and why it was done. Riley losing Hockey Island might be a tragedy, but on the other hand, there might be a good reason for it...like if she got into Bobsledding or Basketball instead. Even if it's a shame she doesn't like something anymore, at least she has a corresponding interest that she'd be able to be drawn to as well. But Honesty Island? I know that just because Riley doesn't have it doesn't mean she's incapable of telling the truth. However, what it does say is something that any parent would be ashamed to find out about. That Riley no longer values telling the truth anymore. And lying being a better choice? That's reserved for something where lying would save either your life or the life of someone else. There's a difference between lying about taking bribes and lying to a burglar that you have a vicious attack dog. Riley lying about having little emotions in her head is....unclear I admit, but the TRUTH (pun!) of the matter is that Honesty Island is one of the few bits of Riley's personality that is about her being willing to do things that she won't feel good about just because it's right. It's kinda like her morality island in some ways. And besides, feelings change from point to point. Look at how her anger lead to the bad idea to run away. She can't rely on them fully to know what's right. (ok, so Anger's the closest cause "he cares very deeply about things being fair", but even he can make mistakes) She needs something like honesty to ensure she has some sense of how to act beyond "it feels right". And she needs to be able to build her life on being open rather than hiding parts of herself that would only backfire later on. And there's a difference between Brutal Honesty and being Honest as a policy, so it wouldn't mean Riley is blunt because of Honesty Island. Just that she won't be...afraid to speak truth in hard situations. THAT is why Honesty island is not only helpful to Riley, but ESSENTIAL for giving her a better life in the future.
- There are many situations where it's okay to lie and it isn't a life-or-death situation. What if you have some illegal drugs for personal use and a cop asks you about it? Or what if you're lying simply because the truth would offend someone and not do any good?
- Honestly (Pun again!), this headscratcher is never going to come to a definitive answer. And that's because its value ultimately comes down to how much you believe you should always tell the truth. Would you lie to law enforcement about having something morally questionable but illegal? Well, would Fear win out on that call? Would Anger? Would Sadness? You can't really know how to come down on that without endless debates about being truthful, illegality vs immorality and so forth. So sure, you could say that it's ok to lie there, but there would just as easily be others who say, "No! You must testify to the reality of a situation, no matter how much it might hurt you to say so." Is lying about an uncomfortable truth ok? Maybe, but again, what is the value of "uncomfortable"? If you were a military commander, and you had to tell your superior that you were refusing to massacre a village, even though you know others might be sent in to do so, and you'd be court martialed for refusing, but is is Right to be honest and refuse to do so anyways? If you had to speak truth to others on a topic such as...evangelizing on what you believe and you had someone who didn't believe you, would that force you to be silent even if they said they would never believe anything you said? Ultimately, we can go back and forth on the value of honesty, but we'll never reach a final conclusion that all people (or all emotions) agree on. And in the end, it's up to Potter Phantom Kitten to give her own interpretation to it too. There's bound to be disagreements down the line regardless of what's chosen, but it is one of those things that we're never going to fully get down to a definitive answer. No matter how we try.
- Strictly speaking, people's personality can be changed. And whether that change is good or bad depends on context of that change and why it was done. Riley losing Hockey Island might be a tragedy, but on the other hand, there might be a good reason for it...like if she got into Bobsledding or Basketball instead. Even if it's a shame she doesn't like something anymore, at least she has a corresponding interest that she'd be able to be drawn to as well. But Honesty Island? I know that just because Riley doesn't have it doesn't mean she's incapable of telling the truth. However, what it does say is something that any parent would be ashamed to find out about. That Riley no longer values telling the truth anymore. And lying being a better choice? That's reserved for something where lying would save either your life or the life of someone else. There's a difference between lying about taking bribes and lying to a burglar that you have a vicious attack dog. Riley lying about having little emotions in her head is....unclear I admit, but the TRUTH (pun!) of the matter is that Honesty Island is one of the few bits of Riley's personality that is about her being willing to do things that she won't feel good about just because it's right. It's kinda like her morality island in some ways. And besides, feelings change from point to point. Look at how her anger lead to the bad idea to run away. She can't rely on them fully to know what's right. (ok, so Anger's the closest cause "he cares very deeply about things being fair", but even he can make mistakes) She needs something like honesty to ensure she has some sense of how to act beyond "it feels right". And she needs to be able to build her life on being open rather than hiding parts of herself that would only backfire later on. And there's a difference between Brutal Honesty and being Honest as a policy, so it wouldn't mean Riley is blunt because of Honesty Island. Just that she won't be...afraid to speak truth in hard situations. THAT is why Honesty island is not only helpful to Riley, but ESSENTIAL for giving her a better life in the future.
- Riley's plans involved using information from the manuals, right? She did look at some of the titles of the manuals, one of which was actually used by the emotions when they were trying to figure out what's going on. But nowhere did it say she actually saw the contents of any of the manuals. And besides, that was back in chapter 7, before she was even considering making any secret plans. This is especially confusing because one of the "scarier" parts of the manuals that Fear mentioned dealt with "hijacking the console". This can easily describe Riley's plan A; it's probably what Fear meant by it. And yet she didn't use the manuals. Why all the buildup about Riley needing information from the manuals if she didn't actually use it for plan A, and what she did was something that was specifically mentioned as a particularly interesting part of the manuals?
- Author here... I totally understand your confusion, and looking back I probably should have put that out a bit better... Admittedly I was going to put a point where she did read the manuals at one point right before she left (and looking back I probably should have done that)... but don't you worry, it's all gonna come into play. Besides, who says that what we've seen so far is all of her Plan A?
- The author clarified the scene where Jill reacts to seeing Riley's drawings by making it clear that she doesn't know why she feels uneasy about them. This was after a reviewer pointed out that there's really no reason for her to think the drawings are significant in any way—she doesn't know enough about the drawings herself to realize they are, but her emotions do, and that's where her sense of unease comes from. However, it's not clear why she decides to have Bill look at them as well. I can see her taking a closer look at the drawings, curious about the strange feeling they give her. But after that, I can really only see her dismissing the drawings as irrelevant and looking elsewhere. I guess she could just be showing Bill in case he's interested in seeing Riley's artwork, but the way she asks seems as if she's presenting it as a cause for concern.
- Regardless of whether she knows why the drawings are important or not, it's the only really irregular thing in Riley's room. Even when you're not sure why something makes you feel mixed, it's the only clue they have for why their daughter has started being so snippy and quiet and hearing voices. Like a game of Pictionary, those drawings might be the only hint they have for what's going on in Riley's head. (Which in this case is literally true) So of course she'd call over Bill to look.
- This isn't specifically an Intercom question, but it still counts given what happens over the course of the nights. So normally, Riley's memories are in the spheres that she produces from emotional reactions in her life. It seems like she needs the emotions help to remember things on a normal basis. (soul memories aside) However, there seems to be some indication that Riley is capable of remembering her dreams before she started Lucid dreaming. For example, she mentioned a time where a dream about her parents in her room helped her for the day beforehand. But if the emotions are just watching the show for the most part, how is Riley able to remember her dreams exactly?
- It's possible that there are some things Riley can remember on her own. In fact, as seen in Inside Out, there are several things she remembers that no recall is visibly involved in remembering it. I guess that as long as she experiences something for a bit, she can remember it...somewhat for a least a little. At least, until the mind chooses to let it go.
- I thought something like that might be the case. After all, during the first day of school scene, Riley describes her friend Meg playing forward and her dad being a coach right before Joy calls the memory up. Seeing as all those memories are stored in Long Term and Riley didn't need memory orbs to be called to remember Meg and her Dad, it could be that memory recall is used to have her primarily think of specific moments or facts. Knowledge like that that's collected over a collection of memories is thus something she knows through her own long term and reasoning, rather than having a bunch of different memory orbs called up.
- It's possible that there are some things Riley can remember on her own. In fact, as seen in Inside Out, there are several things she remembers that no recall is visibly involved in remembering it. I guess that as long as she experiences something for a bit, she can remember it...somewhat for a least a little. At least, until the mind chooses to let it go.
- Why isn't it a common practice for emotions to help their hosts with tests? Emotions already help with traditional memories. Is it really normal for one's own emotions to see them stressing out over a test, and decide not to help them in the best way they can? They wouldn't have to reveal their existence (though putting their own desire for secrecy over their host's worries would be questionable anyway); they could speak on the intercom (it's there for a reason) without identifying themselves.
- Before you say "because it would be cheating", note the following:
- It's controversial whether or not that actually is cheating. I, for instance, strongly believe it's not, as I explained in depth in my review for chapter 10
. - Some people, and by extension their emotions as well, don't think cheating on a test is dishonest, or do but don't care. The only thing potentially stopping these people from cheating is the risk of getting caught, a risk that doesn't exist here.
- If this happened often, it would probably just be considered a normal function of the mind rather than cheating.
- It's controversial whether or not that actually is cheating. I, for instance, strongly believe it's not, as I explained in depth in my review for chapter 10
- The interesting thing about this is that it’s an intersection of epistemology (study of knowledge and belief), ethics (right action), and metaphysics (how we understand the world). Now what you seem to be drilling at with your question is that given the metaphysics of the Inside Out universe, why is the epistemology of the human mind set up the way it is? And more to the point, what kind of ethics would prevent the emotions from acting in a certain way?
- For the simple answer, how do you know they haven’t been doing this before? Haven’t you had a few tests where an answer just “came to you” when you needed it?
- But to try and tangle with an assumption that the emotions don’t use the intercom for general interactions, that takes a bit more thought. And truthfully, this is what happens when a film universe starts getting probed for the underlying assumptions about their work. Suddenly holes in logic start popping up because they weren’t included in the filmmaking process. Especially for something as mysterious as a human mind (even whether it exists in some circles). But, I will try to think through this in the best way I can.
- To begin with, remember that the primary reason Riley thought that she was cheating on her test was because she believed that she should be doing it on her own rather than having the emotions feed it to her all the time. That before the intercom broke, she just thought she was working through things on her own. Simple personal responsibility. But as you pointed out, Emotions try to feed Riley memories all the time through recalling things through the mind’s eye. But what I think is the key difference between giving information through Fear’s notes and giving information through memory orbs comes down to a question of what “is” riley’s and what’s her emotions.
- As established in the film, the emotions aren’t exactly riley. Riley doesn’t exactly like/play the accordian, but Joy does. Doesn’t really like wrestling but Anger does. Could probably find certain bad dreams more terrifying while Fear is just bored by them. As Riley insisted, she’s not her emotions. Which then brings me to the distinction that I see as the main difference between using orbs and using paper. You see, the difference is that the paper is used by fear to take notes about the day. And while it was generated by part of Riley’s mind, that paper isn’t really meant to be used by Riley. It’s like the difference between what’s shared with the public, and what’s used by an intelligence committee.
- But the Memory orbs? Those are always Riley’s. The emotions set the color for what they are, but only Riley (subconsciously) decides where 1 memory starts and another stops. Or whether that memory is now part of her personality. So even though Fear’s notepad could be used as a memory recall method through using an intercom, it’s considered cheating because that paper isn’t really Riley’s. The memory orbs are what’s hers. Getting memory outside of that? That’s cheating.
- Besides, that’s not even getting into other more simple answers to why this sort of thing hasn’t happened. Like Emotions not remembering the test stuff, or not finding the test valuable enough to even think about recording or personally remembering. Or that they kept trying to recall information from the orbs, and say fear’s panic, anger’s frustration or sadness’s despair didn’t have them thinking of working outside the box in that way.
- And that’s not even getting into the main reason why Riley was unique in even exploring this option: most emotions don’t bother to talk with their person. This could be for a variety of reasons (as I theorized above), but to keep it short, perhaps the emotions just aren’t interested in risking their person thinking themselves crazy just to get ahead on 1 test. Or as Anger mentioned in chapter 2, “That intercom’s meant for small conscious-voice-talking only!” That emotions on a normal basis aren’t interested in distracting their person with their chatter about this or that, even if they could be helpful. Or for the fact that by directly feeding her information, they’re taking away Riley’s free will. And the emotions are guardians, not controllers. (at least, they try not to be) If they were to just keep feeding Riley information without using the memory orbs, then they wouldn’t be respecting the fact that not all memory sticks. It’s completely natural to sometimes forget an answer or not. As I mentioned before, memory orbs are definitely Riley’s in the sense that her underlying (subconscious is what I want to say, maybe cognitive?) thought process controls when and how they’re created and whether they stick around. The emotions and the mind workers just work around that. And even though the emotions want the best for Riley, not using memory orbs disrespects what riley subconsciously values, even if she consciously would want one thing or another.
- It's kinda tricky to muddle through, but perhaps this is something YOU should write a story about. How they have been cheating this whole time and we just didn't know it.
- PPK here. First, flarn2006 and Eric: you guys are awesome. Secondly, you guys bring up good points, and Eric's mention about the memories subconsciously being Riley's are how I consider it: the emotions don't necessarily cause a memory to be created (whether regular or core), it's Riley's cognitive process/unconscious mind/what-have-you that dictates when a memory is created and how strong it is, which may also relate to the emotions being compelled to change memories when Riley's perspective on events change. On a deeper level, the emotions aren't really in control—Riley herself is, even though it's not on a level she realizes (except for instances like the Console Lockout in Chapter 19 and 20 so far). The reason that there's a distinction between ordinary recall and the emotions giving her the answers is because they wrote them down and are directly telling her in correlation with the test questions, rather than just relying on recall of memory orbs like normal.
- Before you say "because it would be cheating", note the following:
- Why would Sadness's eyes widen slightly describing the first stage of gloom in describing the move's black control panel crisis? She was there! She knew what it was way before Disgust described it! Unless she realized that she needed to explain this to Riley, it makes no sense for her to have that kind of reaction.
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