Follow TV Tropes

Following

Headscratchers / Gate

Go To

  • Why is the Empire in the Special Region so Romanesque, when it was formed by 9th century Franks? Frankia in the 9th century was feudal in nature. 9th century Franks forming a not!Roman Republic, with Senate and all, would be like modern Japan going back to Heian-era goverment and social order.
  • How do they reconcile the presence of Gods and magic in the other side of the gate when the anime and light novel makes it clear that the Earth there is basically the same as our real life world? Does the light novel franchise imply that magic and God also exists in our world but that we simply focused on science? Or that the magic on the other side can be explained by scientific reasons and the Gods (Hardy, Enloy) are simply powerful creatures worshipped as deities by the population?
    • Also worth taking note is that Lelei was able to improve her magic using knowledge of science and chemistry learned from our world, implying that the Special Region's magic has a scientific component on it.
    • Advertisement:
    • And that in Episode 18 of the anime, Giselle, a demigoddess and an apostle of the God Hardy was easily defeated by the JSDF. When she tamed two baby dragons named Towato and Mowto, the JSDF was able to easily destroy the two dragons using self-propelled artillery and close air support and Giselle cowered in fear in sight of the the attack helicopters.
  • Why do no diseases spread? By some estimates, 95% of the Americans died from disease when the Europeans first arrived. There also seems to be no concern about diseases spreading. The people who survived the original attack should have been quarantined. The same goes for anyone crossing the portal in either direction.
    • Magic?
      • That still doesn't explain the lack of concern.
    • Everyone allowed to pass through the gate is checked out for anything even remotely contagious beforehand? It might not have been brought up because it's simply not a major concern for any of the protagonists beyond routine health checks that tend to be mandatory when operating long-term in foreign countries anyway.
      • It takes time for a disease to develop symptoms. You can't just check for it instantly. They also don't even know what disease exist in the Special Area. Also, they'd still need to quarantine everyone present during the initial invasion, as the invaders could have been contagious.
      • Plus, you'd really only have to check the humans. The other species are, well, other species. The viruses that effect them wouldn't effect humans.
      • Not necessarily. It's also not clear that they aren't just different races of human.
      • (at two posts above me) Ever heard of the Black Plague?
    • Advertisement:
    • Maybe it's one of those things done in the background that we never see. Like Easy Logistics, its boring to actually see them do it, so they just skip over those stuff. As for isolation, well they did build a refugee camp just for the refugees. I'm sure that's not really up to standard with proper medical isolation, but its still separate than say the troop housing area.
      • They made it sound like the Diet was only postponed by a day or so when they defended that castle. Not the weeks or so it would take to establish nobody picked up a disease.
    • The anime specifically points out that the refugee's medical needs are being met. While we are not shown it, the JSDF is clearly taking steps to keep diseases out of the cultural exchange.
      • You mean Lelei saying their needs were met? I wouldn't expect her to understand the necessity of quarantine. In any case, her saying that is certainly not evidence that the writers thought about it.
    • Advertisement:
    • At a guess, going by the very... Romanesque nature of some of the Empire's stuff, there's been enough contact with Eurasia in the past that those same diseases, or populations with a degree of immunity to those diseases have already crossed over. Either they've developed a degree of immunity or had the genes associated with increased resistance already spread throughout the population. Either way, when combined with the JSDF's access to modern medicine, it's enough to prevent the sort of pandemics that depopulated the Americas and Australia. Helped by the fact that diseases on the other side won't have developed antibiotic resistance.
    • Briefly addressed in volume 2, chapter 15. Japan is carefully sterilizing all vehicles going through the Gate in either direction. This obviously requires the drivers undergo through hygiene and medical checks as well. So, yes, steps are clearly being taken to prevent "The Plague" from being unleashed on either side. We, the audience, are just simply not having them described in exquisite, exhaustive detail.
    • But they seem to be able to move from world to world quickly, which wouldn't be possible if they had to wait in quarantine to make sure they're not sick. Medical checks can't find diseases in their earliest stages.
    • There is also the light novel mention when Itami and the special region "guests" were going back through the gate from the Ginza side. Everybody had to undergo a very thorough screening, and Itami had to provide lots, and lots of paperwork detailing everything the group did, what they ate, who they met, and all sorts of (unstated) minutia concerning their physical health, exhaustively taking hours to complete. Only after that was done, and with nobody showing symptoms of illness, were they allowed to pass. We can presume full and proper quarantine will be used if an actual outbreak occurs, or someone shows symptoms.
    • Finally answered in exquisite detail in Volume 3, chapter 8. While the JSDF are all completely healthy, carefully screened, and closely monitored at base, there are many health problems among the Special Region's population. Most are citizens of "Arnus Town" that have had accidents with unfamiliar equipment, like modern tools. To combat the possibilities of accidental exposure to unusual diseases, including sexually transmitted ones, the JSDF, as part of their intelligence operations, set up a clinic in the Azuko district, ie, the slums of the imperial capital, where they offer medical, contraceptive, and counseling services, in exchange for token payment (because the residents would be insulted if it was free) so they could research, study, and fully investigate the native diseases of the Special Region specifically to prevent a massive outbreak of something truly exotic, and the author specifically mentions the American natives' encounter with Columbus as a reference point.
  • Why didn't the soldiers guarding the gate do more to scare away the invaders? They could have sent back some of the prisoners with pictures and possibly video of the attack. They could have set up a projector and showed showed the invaders what happened to earlier groups. They could have launched tear gas at them. That would be illegal to do during war, but since Japan invading anyone is illegal anyway, they were claiming that the Special Region counted as Japan, and they were just fighting terrorists, in which case tear gas is legal.
    • Because the author's portrayal of the JSDF is that they are honorable and would not do such things. This is proven by the fact that the prisoners on the JSDF side is treated humanely.
      • I don't see what's honorable about killing thousands of people.
      • "When you have to kill a man it costs nothing to be polite." And besides, the objective of Japan going to the special region isn't to kill people, but rather find someone who could be brought to negotiation table.
      • But you don't have to kill them. If killing them is the cost of being polite, then don't be polite. I agree that the objective isn't to kill people, which is exactly why they should be taking more precautions to make it so they don't have to kill people.
      • At that point of time, there is no information about the enemy besides what is initially shown. Since the enemy are riding wyverns, there is no guarantee there is nothing more dangerous in the mix. There is no information about magic either. The JSDF fought defensively and only engaged after the enemy proved to be aggressive and have entered into threatened territory. All countries will put their people, and by extension soldiers, first before other countries. Especially if said country just raided your cities.
  • Why did Japan ask the Special Area for so many concessions? They were asking for land twice the size of Japan, along with the amount of money the Japanese government gets in a year. This would make it take longer to achieve peace, and thus take longer for large-scale trade.
    • Sugawara stated that the demands are based on post-war precedents, so it may not be entirely thought out for the Empire's state of economics. Its also said that he just thought of the concessions right there as the actual conditions was "Reparations are undetermined".
    • In war reparation negotiation, there is a need to keep ones dignity. Asking for less sometimes result in being looked down upon. The JSDF most likely wants to avoid it.
    • The light novel addresses this, in detail. The Japanese government wants The Empire to bow their heads, admit wrongdoing, and apologize. If the concessions and reparations were light, Emperor Molto and the government would simply see it as paying ransom for their nobles taken prisoner by Japan, and go right back to what they were doing, admitting no wrongdoing. If the price for messing with Japan is punitive to the point of being devastatingly crippling, The Empire would be far more likely admit wrong doing, beg forgiveness and be much more reluctant to ever attack again. At least, that's the theory behind such massive demands. Sugawara also states some very realistic motives to the Senators, such as paying for the loss of income to the families of the victims, damage to the surrounding buildings, costs of deploying troops for Japan to defend itself, etc.
    • When you are negotiating, you always ask for more than you want (or offer less than you are willing to give). Otherwise you have no room to move and no way to suss out what the other side is thinking.
  • Why was Shino able to fight off several of Zorzal's guards in close-quarters combat before she starts using her gun? Until this point, every fight had been a curb-stomp-battle in the JSDF's favor because they had modern weapons and tactics and experience with them. However, this fight was what the Special Area excels at, and Zorzal's guards should have been some of the best.
    • Maybe she took bayonet training REALLY seriously? At Italica, her first instinct was to charge headfirst into the mass of raiders and Rory, bayonet fixed and all.
    • If you compare how fighting has evolved in the real world, a black belt jiujitsu practitioner should be able to win against knights of the dark ages. This is because of our more in depth understanding of the human body.
      • I believe it was mentioned before that she specialized in hand-to-hand / close-quarter combat. If anyone can take on Special Area's best fighters, it would be her.
      • What do you think Zorzal's guards specialized in? Archery?
    • I always assumed that those with him weren't his guards but his personal entourage. Noble sots with next to no combat experience who hung out with him for prestige and influence (Note that one of them didn't even have clothes on, which would be inexcusable for an actual bodyguard).
    • Answered in Volume 3, chapter 8 and 9 of the light novel. The true Praetorian guard was already lost, either captured or killed in the Ginza incident, lost in action upon the attack upon Arnus Hill, or killed as part of the bandit army besieging Italica. Zorzal's entourage was, at that point, composed of entirely of raw recruits, poorly trained, and seriously lacking discipline. In addition, they were all horribly shaken, both figuratively and literally by the earthquake, which is something the imperial capital has never faced before. Even Pina, which was very well trained, and had live combat experience, was completely overwhelmed experiencing the event, and that's with Itami and the JSDF guarding her. In addition, even if Zorzal's escorts were well trained, the author notes that Shino's bayonet training was specifically designed to counter melee combatants, and that the only advantage Zorzal's entourage had, force of numbers, was completely negated by Tomita watching her back and preventing them from flanking her.

  • How did the Special Area forces that invaded Ginza learn of the Gate's existence and mobilize to attack through it before anyone in Ginza noticed it? The Gate is located on top of a completely featureless hill in the middle of nowhere in the Special Area, and opens into Tokyo on this side.
    • I thought they were the ones to open the gate.
    • Hardy opened a portal in Alnus and the Emperor mostly thought "hey look! let's conquer the unknown other side!! We've already captured some of their people with ease, they must be spineless cowards!!"
    • The Gate's existence is explained in the Anime episode 19 and expands on the above spoiler Whenever Hardy gets bored with the stasis of the world, she opens the portal once in a while to bring in new souls to the pool from other worlds. Every race that came to the Special Area point back to Alnus as their land of origin. Humans are the most recent addition to the world, when a thousand or so Franco-Romans crossed over some time in 9th century AD. The Empire that they form in the new world consider Alnus sacred land, so they know about the portal.
    • Another one for expansion. Part of the reason why Hardy gets bored all the time? The world Medieval Stasis is brought about by the other deities partly because they are opposed to sudden shifts in technology based on outside help. During the zombie arc, Rory forbids Itami from taking samples of a zombie for testing purposes. In the later novels, she is ordered by Emroy to destroy an oil well and refinery that the JSDF have set up in the kingdom of Elbe. Lelei, after having dodged multiple assassination attempts and survives being stabbed by Shandy, is told by Hardy herself in no uncertain terms that should she demonstrate her science-boosted magical powers again, Hardy will send apostles after her with orders to kill on sight.
  • How do USA, Chinese, and Russian leaders think they will actually be able to achieve their plans with the world on the other side of the Gate? Either of them would require a military invasion of another planet, and to that would also require an illegal invasion and occupation of Japan. I hear that the author is a Right-winged Japanese political so making other countries seem insane wouldn't be unexpected.
    • The United States of America President wants what you would expect. He wants to invade the planet and strip it of resources. A more lighthearted objective is to find fantasy creatures which makes him seem Affably Evil.
    • The Chinese Prime Minister is even worse. He wants to do the same, but also move half the population of China to the other wold and conquer it as a New China.
    • The Russian Prime Minister seems far more reasonable. He just wants to close the Gate. His reasons are selfish as they are based around keeping the possible new market of resources cut off so they don't damage the Russian economy. Its actually a decent idea when you think about something like the God Hardy coming through and wrecking Earth. However its unknown how closing the Gate could be achieved and it doesn't change the problem that another gate could be opened and leaving the other side undefended. That was why the JSDF send forces in through it in the first place.
  • The Diet hearing doesn't make sense for multiple reasons, from an apparently complete lack of information about the witnesses beforehand for the Diet members, leading to multiple misunderstandings, to the Diet member who just can't stay on topic (her assertion that unnecessary civilian casualties were incurred during the dragon attack). This is despite a multiple day delay due to the intervention at Italica and knowledge of who the witnesses would be well in advance.
    • The Diet hearing wasn't organized as a comprehensive multipartisan (or, in the Japanese case, multifactional) effort to comprehend the Special Area situation and/or to brief the MPs on it. It was basically a private effort of Senator Kouhara to bash the JSDF — both to stroke her personal anti-military bias, and to advance her faction in the political games of the Diet. Given that she's not entirely rational on the first point, it's no surprise that it failed spectacularly.
    • Even irrational politicians like to prepare, though.
  • I don't know how this was handled in the manga and light novels, but why do the foreign SF operators in the anime lack standard things such as night vision when the JSDF SF has proper kit? I understand this story is a JSDF wank but, for the Americans especially, who have all the assets necessary located in Japan already, undertaking a politically risky operation without the right gear and aerial/orbital observation to identify hostiles like the JSDF does with their observation helicopter feels ham-fisted.
    • In the manga, none of the special forces have night vision. The only advantage they probably have is they are on their home turf and have assistance from the command center with drones and stuff. Though, why the Americans or the other nation did not have the same assets at the time is another matter. One of the American agents lampshades this by saying the operation was lacking information and was too reckless.
    • None of the agents went in well-prepared for the operation. Just to drive it home: the Russians used the UAZ-452 4WD van.note  While the good, ol’ "Breadloaf" does have some popularity with the Japanese outdoorsmen (that is, about a hundred is sold in a year), the export model is explicitly a right-hand drive, while the one that is used by the agents is LHD, which makes it stand out as a sore thumb.
    • Two words: Plausible Deniability. In the anime, one of the Japanese operatives mentions that all the gear the enemy operatives use, except the guns, could easily be bought by tourists in Akihabara, as Cosplay. Even the US president's call to the Prime Minster with the blackmail material could not be used as conclusive proof without damaging a great many sensitive diplomatic contacts and channels, as well as making the blackmail material heavily public. While this might seem good, in the short term, it is in no way a sound maneuver for Japan's long term interests. As it stands, Russia, China, and the U.S. can reasonably claim that they had no knowledge of the operative's actions, or even their existence, as Japan had no proof of their origins. That would be much harder to claim if the operatives had official gear, like night goggles and drones, which, by military regulations, are all marked with the name of the country of origin and branch of service. Had Japan had conclusive proof of the other countries' misdeeds, they would never have gotten away with just merely cancelling their operations and withdrawing.
      • Not sure about Japan, but in most of the world night vision equipment isn't a controlled technology and is freely sold through the normal commercial channels, mostly as hunting supplies. The fancier thermal vision gear would cost you an arm and a leg, of course, but it is available, as are the more pedestrian image intensifiers. In fact, sometimes a better tech can be bought in a hunting store than the country's military is using.note  And as for the drones, you can buy a reasonably priced quadrocopter, perfectly suitable for a forward recon, in a toy shop. Of course, it hasn't been that easy to get all that gear ten years ago when the novels were originally written, but it was possible to field a much better equipped team that is still deniable, so it's still probably more of the oversight/haste than the conscious planning.
      • What about their weaponry choice? I see Americans with the Knight Armament PDW and in the manga, they also have a Magpul PDR somewhere, plus the Chinese has the KRISS Vector SMG. Aren't these weapons like the Knight Armament PDW be a really good indication on which country the agent's from?
      • The respective countries could all claim the guns were stolen, which happens all the time in Real Life.
    • Better yet, why did they still execute a risky operation at all infuriates me. They carry on with little intel, few gears, small arms, no body armor at all, no reinforcement, and no clear retreat path, or in hindsight no clear next step and, if and only if, they do successful they would get the ire of Earthen nations in general and Japan in particular because of interrupting diplomatic process. I can only think author put Battle at Hakone to make JSDF looks strong not only to people on the other side of gate but also to Earthen forces.
      • Or my point is, the mystery of nobody of those so-called Special Force Group(s) have any thought "Itami and his guests at Hakone" info might be a trap and they still executed risky operation with difficulty that I mentioned above, when people at military are drilled to know when to fight and when to call it quits.
  • Goblins don't reside near Alnus. In Manga, after Incident of Ginza you don't see may orcs, trolls, or goblins. The reason is those races don't reside near Alnus or southern Imperial area. While many both agile Cute Monster Girl workers are Clan Formal's maids or even mercenaries and agile male Petting Zoo People are mercenaries that guard the trade caravan. Meanwhile, slower goblins and trolls are more suited to Empire's Army doctrine that battle like Roman Legion. Further evidence in noble POW's memory of Incident of Ginza, the goblins and trolls also marched back to Gate and captured.
  • Yanagida mentions that Noriko's family was handing out posters about Noriko's disappearance, but he mentioned they were caught "on that day" during the Ginza incident. If that's the case, does this indicate that Noriko was missing/taken across the gate before the gate incident even happened? If so, how on earth was she kidnapped to the special region if the gate hasn't opened yet.
  • So why doesn't Tyuule just kill Zolzal instead of going through a complicated revenge scheme to take down the entire Empire? I get that she would probably get executed on the spot, but it doesn't seem like she values her own life that much. Why not take the straightforward route and spare innocent lives?
    • Revenge Before Reason. She hates The Empire for what it did to her, and she hates the Warrior Bunnies for thinking she sold them out so basically she wants them all to burn at the hands of the JSDF.
    • Along with the above, keep in mind that she's lost more than just her life at Zolzal's hands. Her people were slaughtered, her kingdom destroyed, any survivors came to see her as a traitor, and then she's spent however long afterword being little more than a sex toy. Yes, Zolzal is the one directly responsible for this, but the Empire is the method through which he had the power to do any of this at all. Sure, there's no way for her to no that all citizens of the Empire are like Zolzal, some are probably innocent, but her people were innocent as well. From her perspective, just killing Zolzal probably wouldn't have been anywhere near fitting enough of a punishment for what she's had to endure.
    • Volume 8 expands on the above. When Furuta considers assassinating Zorzal, Tyuule calmly tells him that even if he should succeed, not only would doing so completely de-stabilize the situation among those loyal to Zorzal (Helm, Kurastra, etc.) and the pro-war senators, but that it's highly likely that whoever rises up to take Zorzal's place would be worse. Thus, the only way to guarantee change in the corrupt system Zorzal set up is to crush it so completely that it never rises again.
  • During episode 7, the rest of Recon Group 3 perform a covert rescue operation for Itami, who was previously captured by the then unaware Rose Knights. Was it really necessary for them to do so? Itami was taken to Italica, the town they just saved previously, so it would make more sense for them to just drive back to the Formal Mansion and ask Princess Pina to release Itami. Even if the rest of the Rose Knights decided to attack them, all they would be doing is incurring the wrath of their Princess. Also, they have Rory with them. If anything, her presence with the Recon Team would all but assure them that they can just walk back to the mansion without anybody daring to lay a finger on them.
    • They don't fully understand the situation, which in itself warrants sending covert scouts. Further, the JSDF don't want to catch innocent civilians in the crossfire, so sending a covert-ops team to spirit him away in the middle of the night is their best option.
  • This series has been often derided as a "right-wing propaganda", "Japanesewank" and "Painting JSDF in better light they really are", to sum up common complaints. Hell, even the description of the work compares it to Outbreak Company claiming that Outbreak Company is more "civilized". However, as far as the series actually goes, nothing it does is not something that say, Stargate SG-1 didn't do or any other "Nation X comes in contact with Y". So why is it that this specific work gets so much hate? Is it because, for once, it doesn't have Americans as the pure and superior protagonist?
    • Because we are talking IN and about the English-speaking segment of the Internet, which is heavily dominated by the Americans and their culture? And they are known to be the fiercely patriotic fans of Cultural Posturing (see the whole Manifest Destiny thing), who have a long and complex history with the Japanese. So, for a large number of American population, a mere though of Japanese revanchism (even as mild as GATE is) is, understandably, a very controversial thing.
    • If this show was about America doing the same thing it would be just as hated. Michael Bay's Transformers movies have been derided for over-glorifying the US military. GATE is no different in that respect.
    • Because Gate is an imperialist fantasy where everything is made from the outset to make Japan look good. The series starts by Japan unilaterally annexing the unknown lands and proceeds to kill, intimidate and blackmail to control the lands and take their natural resources. JSDF is an absurdly competent infallible Mary Sue that doesn't ever lose any of their hilariously one-sided battles. There is zero suspense in any action scene, the only question is if any of their opponents will survive. Their conveniently technologically inferior opponent is denied most assets that a fantasy world might provide them and make the conflict interesting. Lelei and Rory immediately join them to stack the odds further. As if this wasn't enough, everyone going against JSDF is just generally inept to secure futility of their struggle. Natives are either fawning simpletons or suicidally aggressive savages and no tears are shed for the latter as they are unceremoniously slaughtered. And nobody is allowed to mount reasonable criticism against them, even when it's shown that they will aid natives only when convenient and will make zero sacrifice for them. Opposing them is never presented as a justifiable action and the carnage they cause is hardly shown. As a result, JSDF come out looking just a bit better than their more traditional opponents. Oh, and they have all-but-explicit endorsement of Emroy, god of war and death.
    • One of the things which irks many non-Far Right Japanese who watch this series is they go quickly from "We are defending our nation from hostile forces who came through the Gate." to "Let's conquer the land at other end of Gate and find resources!"
    • The stated goal to "Find the ones responsible to attack to Ginza and make them pay" does continue to progress as the "go there and claim resources" line of plot grows in prominence.
    • Even attempting to compare the nationalism in this series with American nationalism falls short. America does save the day a lot, but American media will tend to also portray other elite military organizations as competent and fierce, if for nothing else so that American special forces will look better for beating them. Hell, the Spetsnaz are often portrayed as something just under John Wick levels. Gate, meanwhile, has everyone else's special forces looking like bumbling buffoons, most of whom get taken out by faceless nobody characters because the JSDF is too good to even blink in the face of anything at all. As well, if this were an American series, the American military almost certainly would venture into the other side of the Gate, probably in the stated name of seeing what was there and if there was likely to be any more dangers/invasions and establish a defense so that they could be stopped, and it would leave it to the internet snarkers to make comments or jokes about America probably wanting to conquer the fantasy world for oil. This series just straight-up acts like the goal for the JSDF is global conquest of the other world, which is in modern fiction typically a motivation reserved for the villains; especially since, if Japan in this series thinks it's okay to use military might to conquer another world, what are they going to do back on our world when they get access to an entire planet's worth of resources and people they clearly don't care much about that could be used as cannon fodder? Someone could easily take most of the plot of Gate and use it, unaltered, as the story of how Japan decided to instigate World War 3.
  • Assuming that the new Alnus-Ginza gate that Lelei opens at the end of the first round of the novels has the same dimensions as the previous gate, how are they managing to get an Oyashio-class submarine through the damn thing? And assuming it does fit, how are they going to transport it from....for example, Yokosuka, all the way into the heart of Tokyo, through the Gate, and then from there to the closest body of blue water?
    • There are heavy crawler-transporters that can haul ~3000 ton loads (Oyashio-class displaces 3000 tons submerged, and weighs accordingly) without much problem, and it's not that you HAVE to load it as Yokosuka: Ginza is actually quite close to the waterfront. The bigger problem would be navigating the huge transporter through the dontown Tokyo, which would require closing it off from all traffic, and actually pushing it through the Gate, which might require the removal of a sail from the submarine, unless the Gate is 20+ meters tall.
    • For that matter, how did they get transport planes that look like C-130's through the gate, let alone helicopters and F-4 Phantoms? Where did they set up an airstrip capable of handling those planes?
      • Modern planes can be relatively easily disassembled for transport. Detaching the wings and empennage and reattaching them back is a maintenance task that any reasonably equipped airbase could do in a couple of days, and without its wings a C-130 can pass through the Gate without any problem.
  • How did Zorzal regain all of his teeths back after losing most of them during his educational beatdown by Shino?
Top

Example of:

/
/

Feedback