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  • During the tournament, when Piccolo was facing against the Supreme Kai, why did he suddenly start panicking, then stepped down? I...never understood it.
    • Punching the King of the God Kings is bad juju. It's easy to forget since they aren't super powerful and we refer to them on a first name basis but Kami and later Dende is GOD. King Kai is SUPER GOD of the North Quadrant of the Universe. Not some quirky fat guy, King Kai is serious business and Supreme Kai is HIS BOSS. It's how most people would react if the President showed up at your MMA match.
      • Or if the Black Prince of Wales showed up at a jousting tournament
      • No, it'd be more like you stepping into a wrestling match ring, preparing to meet your opponent, only to learn it's a priest or some other religious figure. That's pretty much what happened to Piccolo. He was essentially meeting and being asked to punch out that universe's equivalent of a pope.
      • Considering what Piccolo did to Kami back in the Androids Saga, he didn't need any more bad juju going for him.

  • If the Supreme Kai (Kaioshin) has the ability to immobilize someone as strong as Gohan in his SSJ2 form, why didn't he try to do the same thing to Dabura, or Pipi, or Yakon for that matter?
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    • Grabbing the Idiot Ball with all their might is pretty much a running thing the characters do in this show. They may be physically stronger than anything in the known universe, but their logical thinking patterns leave much to be desired.
    • Alternatively, it could be that, seeing as it's a magical ability, Gohan wouldn't be able to stop it, while Babidi, being a magician and a sworn enemy of the Supreme Kai, would not only be able to stop such an attack but would have every reason to expect it in advance and stop it from working on himself or his minions.

  • Goku gets a lot of heat for not saving Gohan, Goten, Piccolo and Trunks. IIRC Goku grabbed Hercule and Dende and the Supreme Kai saved him and Vegeta via instantaneous movement (which works better than Goku's IT). Why didn't VEGETA grab anyone?
    • ...That's a damned good question. I just assumed neither of them had time. If they did, Vegeta would've grabbed one or two of them. Plus, Goku probably figured he could wish them all back with the Dragonballs.
    • As I recall, Goku grabbed Hercule and Dende with Instant Transmission. Vegeta didn't grab anyone because he didn't have the technique and couldn't reach them in time.
      • He actually swooped down and grabbed them while Vegeta seemingly stayed en route to the kids and Piccolo.
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    • He receives a lot of crap because, dumb luck and dragon balls aside, he grabbed the wrong people. Gohan was the most powerful person in the universe at the time and saving him should have been priority one. Vegeta who doesn't have instant transmission couldn't snatch anyone and thus doesn't get heat here.
      • Goku's IT/flight speed wouldn't have been fast enough for him to concentrate grab them AND leave the planet. He flew down to grab Hercule and Dende while Vegeta seemingly stayed en route to the others (though he was still behind Goku when he grabbed Hercule and Dende). Look at page 508-509. Or would you have been happier if they all died? Regardless, Vegeta "could" have grabbed everyone (or grabbed at least trunks) and then Supreme Kai would've met them halfway.

  • Does #18 still have her unlimited ki in this saga? She could've put up a fight against Buu but instead she apparently listens to her much weaker husband and starts running away with their daughter. Did they just forget her powers?
    • From what I can tell 17 and 18's unlimited energy means that they don't fatigue rather than being able to put colossal power into their techniques. If this wasn't the case then Piccolo wouldn't have been able to overpower 17. 18 was exactly as strong as she ever was; which considering as how completely she failed against Cell, fighting Buu would have been a complete joke.
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    • In my opinion, there are 3 possible reasons. 1} Yes, she has unlimited Ki but with the same power level she had against Cell, which is not going to help much against Buu. 2)She clearly doesn't like fighting, unless there's money involved or there's no other option (and she will join the fight in the latter situation). 3) There's a recurring dynamic in the Buu saga and the new movies, in which she stays with Marron and lets Krillin fight... which is strange considering how much weaker he is than her. But they are both really good parents and very protective of their child, so we can assume Krillin prefers for his strong wife to be the one protecting their child, just in case he gets killed AGAIN as has happened in many battles.
    • I always figured the 'unlimited energy' line was both a case of bad translation and poor wording. The androids have a power supply that produces energy without fuel: we certainly never see any indication they need to recharge, or refuel. Unlimited energy doesn't mean they can produce an infinite amount of energy instantly, or that they have an infinite reserve of power, it means that their power source won't run dry or decay, and will continue producing energy at a constant rate for a theoretically indefinite period of time. The amount of power it can output at any one time, however, is still limited, and likewise the amount of power they can actually store in their body at once would likewise be limited. 'Unlimited Energy' just means they're entirely self-sufficient and not reliant on external power or fuel.
      • While it's not impossible they made the same bad translation and poor wording over and over again, it even seems likely given 17 and 18 are cyborgs, not androids, this does not appear to be an error. The androids always have the exact same amount of energy. This comes into play in Piccolo vs 17. The two begin to banter and 17 mentions that Piccolo can't keep this up forever, he'll get tired. Piccolo counters that 17 will make a mistake before that happens. Which still means nothing to Buu who's so many steps beyond 18 that her having more endurance than him (if that's even true) would never come up. The reality is Krillin manned up to protect his family and 18 was the Designated Survivor along with their daughter. In the short term both choices sucked roughly equally and in the long term she's got much better chances of avoiding Buu.

  • This might be a little bit nitpicky, but when Super Buu used his Human Extinction Attack, he states that all humans have been killed. The problem with this is that there are many sentient species on the earth that aren't human and therefore wouldn't fall under the attacks criteria, what happened to them?
    • Boo just didn't care about them.
    • Alternatively, they got wiped out too. Does Buu strike you as the kind of...I was going to say person, but really, thing that would take the time to list off the different species of intelligent life he just annihilated? He doesn't care that much. They were down there, they were alive, thinking, doing what it is they do. Now they're dead. He lumps them into one group and calls them "humans".

  • When Vegeta tells Goku that he blew himself into oblivion in an attempt to kill Buu, Goku's shocked. Why? Goku knew Vegeta was dead already. Was it because it never occurred to him that Vegeta would sacrifice himself for others?
    • When did this scene happen? If it was anime-only, it's probably Adaptation Decay.
      • Goku knew that Vegeta was dead, or at least suspected it because to him, unable to sense one's ki means they are dead. The exceptions to that are the Artificial Humans and Gohan, who was simply taken off the planet and out of Goku's range of sense. Nobody ever told Goku the how and why, he just assumed that Buu killed them.
  • Why did Trunks never bother asking his dad why he has a weird "M" on his forehead?
    • There were other priorities at that time (avoid being killed by Buu, for example). Plus, Trunks and Vegeta didn't share that much time in the scene, and the whole Final First Hug thing probably distracted the kid.

  • Why did Goku seek a successor with Uub? He had two sons one of whom outpowered him and who had a serious girlfriend thus kids in the future. His rival had a son and both he, his rival and his close friend are all aliens who will outlive almost every human alive on Earth at that point. Shouldn't he have spent that time training Goten(the son he knew for about a year), no wonder he was so soft by GT his father left him to train with some random boy. By the end Goku literally spends more time with Uub then Goten, and when you consider he was dead for about 8 years of Gohan's life he's a real deadbeat dad.
    • Gohan, Goten and Trunks all grew up into lazy kids who slacked off severely on training unless a threat to the world was present. Gohan would rather study, Goten and Trunks just don't like to train that hard. If anything should happen to Goku, he probably won't be able to come back to life, and then the world will be screwed, so he really needs to find a worthy successor who is strong, cares about the world and loves training, and quick.
      • Also he may have been dead for 8 years of Gohan's and 7 years of Goten's life, but he spent 10 years with them after that, and he clearly states he'll come visit, what with his Instant Transmission skills and all. I wouldn't worry too much about that.
    • Goku wasn't really wanting a make a successor. As Vegeta points out (in the manga, at least), Goku just wanted to fight Uub once he was stronger.

  • The real question is why Goku didn't wish for Shenlong to make him younger again so he could be part of that "younger generation" he's trying so hard to bring up.
    • Well, he's an Idiot Hero for one thing. Also, perhaps he thought Chihi, Gohan, and Goten would be unnerved that he's now the same age as his sons?
    • He wanted Earth to be defended by an Earthling, not him. He didn't want Earth to always have to rely on him.
    • Furthermore, it's canon that Saiyan aging is a lot slower than humans. In Battle of Gods, Bulma complains about it, pointing out how nice it must be that they age so slowly. Battle of Gods is on Bulma's 38th birthday, and Vegeta and Goku still look the same age as when they met.
    • Bulma´s 38 birthday? Lol, that was a huge error. Let´s see. Bulma is 16 at the beginning of DB and 22 when it ends. 27 at the beginning of Z. And in her early 30s when the Androids arrive. So she would already be 38 or older when the Buu saga begins. And Battle of Gods is YEARS after that.

  • With all the worrying Chichi does about finances in the Buu saga, wouldn't it have been simpler for her to just send Gohan on a Dragon Ball hunt, then ask Shenlong to make her rich? Forgotten Phlebotinum?
    • Good question. I can't say she didn't believe in the Dragon balls, as she's no doubt witnessed their powers a time or two. It's likely that because she was so obsessed with Gohan studying that she felt him running off on a Dragon ball hunt would be an absolute waste of time. Alternate Character Interpretation: Perhaps she felt that using Shenlong to make her rich would make her look like a Rich Bitch, and possibly lower both Goku's and Gohan's opinion of her? I mean, she'd literally have the power to wish for anything up to and including the end of world hunger and all she wishes for is for her to be filthy rich? Even Goku wouldn't be silent about that.
      • No one has to know if she wishes for a moderate amount. Chichi was desperate enough for money that she was willing to whore out...err, marry off her precious darling Gohan to Videl. Nothing, not even Shenlong or Goku's wrath can compare to that for her.
      • True. It's just that I think even Idiot Hero Goku would say something if they suddenly became millionaires with their own money and it turned out she used the Dragon Balls to get it.
      • Possibly, but at the time she's shown worrying about money, Goku's been dead for almost a decade. He'll be coming back for a day, but only to take part in the tournament. Plus no one says she has to wish for millions, just enough to get by on so she wouldn't have to worry.
    • The Dragon Balls require a long recharge time between uses and can't bring someone back if they've been dead for too long. If something horrible happened within that year that could be solved by an immediate wish but not by a delayed wish or by throwing money at it, the guilt for that would be on Chichi's shoulders. Also, she's prideful; she can't ask the dragon for the same reason she can't ask any of the rich people she knows, including (if nothing changed since the first series) her father, the Ox King.
      • As far as her father goes, it's his money they've been spending all along. Neither Chichi nor Goku have ever earned a single Zeni in their lives. Well, technically Goku won the Budokai once, but he left before he could collect his prize.
    • I don't Chi-Chi is that desperate. I believe that she understands that the Dragon Balls should be available to be used for more important matters.
    • Apart from Bulma, I don't really see any of the Z Fighters gathering the Dragon Balls to ask for money. And the only reason Chichi wants it is really to feed her family. AND, she has a husband (when he's not dead or just not around), who never earns any money, so yes the most simple and reasonable thing would be to put him to work a little.
    • Chichi's worrying gets played up a lot in the fandom. Her dad's money was running low, but they weren't bankrupt. It was a problem that Chichi saw coming but wasn't critical enough to need resolution right then and there. And then Gohan mentions one day he could make a lot of money very fast and Chichi's private worry is resolved on the spot.

  • His choice to train Uub may be generally noble, but why doesn't Goku just go to the Hyperbolic Time Chamber with him? They can spar without damaging the Earth, and, by the end, Uub will be a man ready to support his family and village, and Goku will return to his own family and friends after a vacation of fewer than two weeks.
    • You mean the hyperbolic time chamber that got destroyed?
    • And which Goku has already used up his allotted two days/years per person per life?
      • Actually Goku had only used it for one day before, and if I recall he even exited early from that day. Plus he was on his 2nd life now since Old Kai gave Goku the rest of his life. Of course that doesn't help the fact the time chamber was destroyed.
      • Technically speaking it was only destroyed once. When the Earth was destroyed not long after it took the Lookout and the remains of the chamber with it - thus it was completely resurrected when the planet was wished back with the Dragon Balls. It would make no sense to believe that the door to the Hyperbolic Time Chamber would remain in pieces, so the OP's point still stands. Most logical answer? Story convolution. They wanted a convenient way for Goku to become a child and for Pan to grow up so that they could have a three-man band - note how little Uub actually does during GT. He starts by being Goku's equal *disappears* fuses with Buu *dies* has a token scene in the final saga *GT ends* The scriptwriters hated that character.
      • His point doesn't stand when you remember that it took Goku ten years to train Uub. Even with his renewed life, he'd only be able to get two of those ten years done in a couple of days. If they stayed any longer than two days, the door would disappear. Of course, with the existence of the Dragon Balls, Goku could've just had some friends wish him and Uub out of the room after ten days, assuming that's possible...
      • It's been proven that you can shout your way out, and chances are, instant transmission would work too.
      • The writers supported Pan/Trunks?
    • Doubt it, Toriyama wasn't involved in GT and there is no way he planned this in his long-awaited conclusion of the story.
      • In any case, the ROSAT was never Goku's first choice of training locations. He only used it because of time constraints during the Cell Saga. In this case he's in no hurry - plus Uub might need to enter the ROSAT one day for an emergency, much better to save it for then.
    • Seems like Goku always prefers to be somewhere else than at home... could it be because of his wife??

  • Also, Goku was very reckless in getting Uub to shout "yeah!" in the final episode of the anime. The excitement could have been enough to awaken Uub's full sonic potential, and Uub is the reincarnation of the loudest being in the history of the universe.
    • That's like saying it's dangerous to let Goten stick out his hand because of all the energy blasts fired from it. If he was angry enough? Hole in reality. But that needed serious rage.
      • Another point on this; Goku explained numerous times that he, Vegeta, and the rest of the fighters were getting up there in age. He felt that the world would still get attacked by threats. The impression I got is that part of it was to train somebody to protect the world for the day where he and his friends wouldn't be around to do it anymore.

  • Just noticed something in the Buu Saga. When Goku and Vegeta fuse into Vegetto, they toy with Buu in order to get him to absorb them so they can rescue their kids and Piccolo. But at that point they were already planning to use the Dragon Balls to revive their dead friends. So why not just kill Buu on the spot instead of dilly-dallying and then just revive everyone all at once?
    • Because at that point, trying to bring back the people Buu had absorbed (not eaten) would have either brought back Buu or done nothing; they were a part of Buu's being, and we've already established that the Dragons can't affect someone stronger than he is against their will.
      • They would have all been killed along with Buu, meaning they could be resurrected separately, and there's always the "restore them as they were at so-and-so time" wish. There was no need to take so many risks with Buu when they could have ended the whole thing quickly.
      • This is the same bunch for whom it never occurred to destroy the Vegeta and Nappa's space pods, stranding them in the vacuum of space, once Sheng Long told them he couldn't directly zap them. Or wish Goku/Gohan/whomever was fighting the Big Bad suddenly had a power boost that would allow them to take down the Big Bad.
      • Ohh, good point. No way Shenlong could have given a power boost to a being more powerful than him (his usual excuse) beyond refilling their energy, but destroying the space pods is a brilliant idea! ...which is why they didn't think of it.
      • Because Saiyans, like Batman, can breathe in space
      • No they can't. This is the point of the "5 minutes till Namek explodes" part of the Freeza fight: the fact that Freeza can survive in space and Goku can't.
      • Yeah, actually they can. They are shown breathing in space several times in the series, both before and after the Freeza Arc. When Nappa and Vegeta are traveling through space and blow up the bug planet, they are shown just standing outside of their capsules several hundred miles from the planet. And in the movie with Goku's dad, he breathes perfectly fine in space as he charges Freeza.
      • Those same scenes had said Saiyans talking in space. So I wouldn't take too seriously what that means about Saiyan capabilities. They're clearly filler and it's made explicit in canon that Goku can't breathe in space.
      • Actually there's a few non-filler parts that seem to indicate they can all breathe in space, and it might've been more a matter of Goku never tried. For one, while Bardok was a retcon, it's still considered canon. All the men alongside Bardok also seemed capable of breathing in space (perhaps the scouter has something to do with it? or the armor?). Vegeta is also shown training on an asteroid. In the movies (non-canon) they're shown breathing in space or at least the outer atmosphere a few times (World's Strongest, for example). The only time we've seen Goku for lack of oxygen is when he's underwater. I think this is more the case with the show taking artistic license with the depiction of space than anything.
      • They might have considered it, but here's a couple of maybe reasons... Goku and gang had strict codes of honor, and they might have felt that zapping the Saiyans is bad form, as they would be defenseless and can't fight back (space pods are only for travel, as the series shows several times). Then again, maybe Bulma could have built something in that year's time to blast them... but then it is also consistently shown that Earth technology of that time is a bit behind Saiyan and Namekkian technology. She blew up a Saiyan ship by fiddling with its remote control-type thing, and later in the show it was Mr.Popo who showed her how to use a Namekkian space pod. So they were pretty much sitting ducks, really...
      • Even though the whole "them being a part of Buu at the time" thing is a good reason, it kind of fails when you take into account that they were able to bring back #17, who was a part of Cell at the time, perhaps even more so than the ones Buu absorbed.
      • Even more so? Buu's insides are a dimension of their own with warped physics that caused Vegetto, which was SUPPOSED to be a permanent fusion, to defuse. I'm going with the "absorbed people are too firmly integrated into Buu to be removed by any means save going in and doing it from the inside," and it seems plausible enough that even death wouldn't be enough to extricate them from Buu. Cell didn't really get shown having a very firm grasp on the androids he absorbed-hell, punching him hard enough was enough to get #18 free.
      • I thought that part of the fusion process involved a pretty cocky personality to go along with it. Look at how Gotenks toyed with Buu during that fusion. Although the other fusions don't seem to have this, such as Kibito Kai.
      • Goten and Trunks were cocky enough to begin with, the fusion didn't change a thing.
      • Maybe it's just a Saiyan thing?
      • Vegetto wasn't cocky, he was obviously playing the whole time so Buu would try to absorb him, the fact he almost flat out tells Buu to use it on him makes it obvious.
      • Hell, Vegetto's reaction when Buu starts trying to absorb him was to think something along the lines of, "Took him long enough to realize that I'm open for that." It's arguable that we never actually saw Vegetto's real personality during his entire fight.
      • Because that was their kids in there. You think Goku and Vegeta would have the heart (or lack thereof) to knowingly blow up their children under any circumstances, even if they could be revived later?

  • Why were Goku and Gohan so cavalier about snuffing Babidi's minions? They just sat there smirking as Vegeta smoked his opponent and Goku didn't even give a token effort into getting his opponent to surrender. Did the decade or so between Freezer and Babidi make them both that cynical?
    • As for Gohan, he had to deal with Cell in between Freezer and Babidi, if you'll recall, and, as noted above, he isn't exactly what you'd call "saner" for it. Sorta the opposite. After Cell, it's understandable if he finds himself taking a "no mercy" attitude to any and all superpowered evil. As for Goku, well... the baddies DID have the M on their forehead, so he knew they were brainwashed beyond being able to surrender.
    • More than that—Babidi only picked people with supreme evil in their hearts, and the only one who WASN'T all that evil was able to resist Babidi's commands almost completely. It's a safe bet they figured that Babidi's servants were scum anyway.
      • Also Goku used to be pretty cavalier about killing baddies early in the manga. Perhaps he tapped back into his childish roots?
      • Having spent a decade or so dead and loving it, it's possible that Goku doesn't see killing as all that bad anymore (or at least its viable way to keep evil monsters from terrorizing other people). At this point in the series, death is little more than a glorified time-out.
    • Because God was on his side. (Kaio Shin is God, right? Unless Dai Kaio is God, in which case God is dead. Either way, Goku is stronger than God.)

  • Fat Buu expelling the evil inside of him caused Evil Buu to form, and subsequently makes him weaker (this version is commonly referred to as Mr. Buu). Evil Buu absorbing Mr. Buu forms the even more powerful Super Buu. After Mr. Buu gets yanked from Super Buu, he becomes Kid Buu. Wait, what? What the heck happened to Evil Buu?
    • Making it even worse, Kid Buu was the original monster, forged by Bibidi himself; he was transformed into Buff Buu when he absorbed the Southern Supreme Kai, and then Fat Buu when he absorbed the Grand Supreme Kai. Then Fat Buu splits and rejoins, causing Super Buu. Super Buu is basically Buff Buu, so apparently something got lost in the shuffle. Then Mr. Buu leaves Super Buu, causing him to become Kid Buu. Then Kid Buu dies and reincarnates as Uub, while Mr. Buu is still around. If you were following that, then congratulations: you are insane.
      • I followed all that. If I wasn't insane before I read it, I am now.
      • Just mark it up to Tangled Family Tree. Oh, and in the manga, Majin Buu and Uub merge to form "Majuub"
      • Err, no they don't. Unless you're talking DBGT manga, which definitely does not count.
      • Fat Buu was Kid Buu (concentrated evil), plus a bunch of Supreme Good that made him bigger, fatter, and acted as a power limiter. Fat Buu was Chaotic borderline Neutral/Evil, then Mr. Satan got him nicer to the point where he was Chaotic or True Neutral. Evil Buu jumps out of him, but he's weaker as only part of Buu, and absorbs Fat Buu to become Super Buu: All the power of Fat Buu, but suppressing the good of Mr. Buu.When they cut out everyone who's powering him up, they also completely remove the Grand Supreme Kai's influence, which was limiting his power. So Fat Buu was likely far stronger than Kid Buu, but GSK was holding him back. (Buu power is positive, good is negative, combining them makes a smaller absolute value, sort of thing.)
    • Think of it this way: Majin Buu had all the power-boosting-but-behavior-altering good guys absorbed inside him, isolated. He split, a la Kami. Evil Buu absorbed Mr. Buu. Evil Buu got Mr. Buu's power without the behavior-alterations, thus the changed coloration but unchanged personality. Buu being made of Phlebotinum, he took a shape much more suitable for fighting than Fat Buu had. Theories for why Evil Buu became Kid Buu follow:
    A. Evil Buu had absorbed enough of Mr. Buu's memories or nature or something like that that he transformed into what was basically the evil early version of Fat Buu instead of going back to Evil Buu. To avoid horrible snarls it only works on whatever-the-HFIL Buu's species is called.
    B. Akira Toriyama was way past caring at this point and just wanted to mess with your heads.
    C. The animators made a coloring error, making Kid Buu pink instead of grey, and Kid Buu is basically the same as Evil Buu but taking a shape more suitable for fighting someone who isn't Fat Buu. Plus he's seen The Incredibles and figured out that capes are a bad idea.
    • Continuing from above: To figure out why Kid Buu was reincarnated as Uub, you need to think on this: Goku can tell the entire hierarchy of Otherworld to shove it and they'd have no choice but to comply. Kid Buu gave Goku a run for his money, plus he can teleport across dimensions, so there's no real way to make sure he actually stays in Otherworld, or keep him from leveling the place. Goku had his quota one brilliant idea per twenty years and suggested that reincarnating Kid Buu as a helpless infant would either get him turned good or make him an HFIL of a lot easier to kill, and the guys in charge agreed. Keep in mind that Mr. Buu had been pulled out of Kid Buu by then, and was still living separately, the same way Kami and Piccolo had. Just like Piccolo Jr. not having the same personality as Piccolo Daimao (personal opinion not really backed up by canon, but killing Goku once in revenge, then having a Heel–Face Turn could well be any child's reaction to having his admittedly evil father killed) Uub developed his own personality and turned out okay.
      • Anime Filler and GT aside, DB actually explains their views on the afterlife quite clearly. Enmadaiou has a book, where everyone is listed according to their Karma. If their Karma lists them as "good", they go to heaven. As a subset of that, abnormally heroic figures get to keep their bodies. Those deemed "bad", get reincarnated — during a process where they lose their bodies, their souls are systematically cleansed and their identity is destroyed (this happens in Hell) and they are reincarnated. This is what Piccolo (who was GOD, and knows such things) explains will happen to Vegeta when he dies. Goku, having been to the afterlife and friends with several deities, knows this is how it works, and asks as a special favor that Buu be reincarnated on Earth. Uub has his own personality because he *is* is own personality. Personality doesn't remain during reincarnation.
      • Interesting. Thanks for the explanation.
    • According to the manga, the Fat Buu got "special treatment" when he was absorbed, unlike the others, which probably meant that somewhere in the transformation, Evil Buu used the Fat Buu's DNA or whatever to restore himself to the condition of the original (Kid) Buu. But having fused with Fat Buu in the process, what resulted was the form of Super Buu, which is basically what you'd get had the Kai's influence not been present. Then when the Fat Buu was removed, we get to see just what sort of restoration the "special treatment" did.
    • I'll try to give my take on it because it's fun to nerd out :3. Majin Buu can be inferred to be an early God of Destruction; due to existing since time immemorial and going into cycles of destruction and hibernation, becoming more deranged due to being exposed to the evils of the universe. Bibidi knew how to wake him up and direct him somewhat. Kid Buu, or 'Pure Buu', the original identity, absorbed South Supreme Kai, becoming Buff Buu due to the raw power, and Grand Supreme Kai, thus becoming 'Innocent Buu' due to The Grand Supreme Kai's influence. Innocent Buu didn't have the capacity for good just because of the Grand Supreme Kai, but because before becoming corrupted, Pure Buu was more or less just doing a job. Grand Supreme Kai's presence was able to draw out that goodness, which came out in the form of childlike innocence. Fast forward to Mr. Satan being shot, Innocent Buu is torn and takes the only measure he can think of to keep himself from breaking his promise; by purging himself of his murderous intent. That is where Evil Buu, a manifestation of the personality is born. However, due to Innocent Buu's rushed fission, he wound up giving Evil Buu proportionally more power, which Evil Buu then used to defeat and consume Innocent Buu. With proportionally the same power, but the conscious intent to use it, Super Buu was perceived as stronger because he is able to draw out more of his power. The "Special Treatment" comes to play here, as it is implied [though not outright confirmed], that if a being stays absorbed inside Buu long enough, they are permanently integrated into him; the only cases of that being for Good Buu with the two Supreme Kais, and there hasn't been an attempt to defuse them shown. Super Buu is known to be able to micromanage his internal dimension, so in order to maintain his identity, he returned some portions to Good Buu, likely the pieces that would result in Evil Buu, while taking pieces that made him more 'Buu'. When Good Buu is ripped out, not only are the two Supreme Kais ripped out, but a sizeable chunk of the total power they had and aspects of Buu that Super Buu did not want in him. The result was a proportionally weaker Pure Buu, yet with him being completely out of control, Pure Buu was willing to throw around all of his destructive power just because it was funny; hence his perceived strength increase. Evil Buu was out of the equation as a result of the initial merge between Evil and Good Buu; which allowed Pure Buu to ultimately regain his original identity.
  • In the fight against Kid Buu, Goku refused to throw the Genki Dama because Vegeta was in the way despite him shouting to go ahead with the attack anyway, so he was basically choosing to doom the entire universe for the sake of one person who would've ended up being killed anyway because of his refusal? What the hell? Yes, launching the attack would've pretty much ensured Vegeta a third demise, but it's not as though they couldn't have just wished him back to life again. The lapse in all things logical makes my head want to implode!
    • Goku is an Idiot Hero. He may gain 20 IQ points when fighting, but that's because he fights using natural instincts and intuition- works well in hand-to-hand, but problematic with such higher-reasoning decisions, especially given that he lacks the intelligence to compensate.
    • As I recall, Vegeta was still dead at the time that he was holding off Kid Buu. At which point, if he were to die, he would cease to exist. They couldn't wish him back because his soul would have been destroyed; Vegeta wouldn't just be dead, he would end. Forever. Goku didn't want to destroy Vegeta's soul in the process of killing Majin Buu.
      • No, they'd already wished him back as the second wish before gathering the chi for the Genki Dama.
      • Yeah, Goku was just being an idjit. Last moment of suspense before the grand finale.
      • Well, They couldn't bring Vegeta back with the earth dragon balls anymore and they were about to used up all their wishes for the Namekian dragon ball. So they wouldn't be able to bring him right away, and even then there is nothing stupid about not wanting to kill a friend even if you could bring them back.
      • IIRC, the rule is that if a person had been dead for more than a year, they can't be brought back. So if Goku killed Vegeta in the process of killing Buu, he would basically be consigning Bulma and Trunks to a life without Vegeta. See, they were about to use their last wish for the Namekian dragon and would have to wait a whole Namek year to reuse them again. By then, it would have been too late to resurrect Vegeta. And as said before, Vegeta is Goku's friend, and Goku probably doesn't want to kill him under any circumstances.
      • Two problems, first we don't know if the either new set of Dragon Balls (Dende's balls have different powers than Kami's did there is reason why the current elder Namek's balls have to function the same way Guru's did) but as far as we know the Namek Balls still reset after six months. So if everything remained the same that would be as simple as using the Namek Balls which last we checked can bring you back as many times as Porunga wants to well within the one year limit.
  • How is it that when a villain like Frieza or Broly is out there terrorizing the universe, the so-called "Supreme Kais" never do anything about it? If I recall correctly, didn't Supreme Kai mention in one episode about him being able to fell Frieza with one punch?
    • Because as bad as they were, they weren't threatening the stability of the universe, and didn't even blow up all that many planets, comparatively. Buu was, what with destroying something like three quarters of the known universe as well as 4/5 of the top deities, as compared to Broly's one-family vendetta or Frieza's black market trading.
    • Did you see how terrified Supreme Kai was over Vegeta going one on one with Pui Pui? Personally think the Supreme Kai was lying, exaggerating, mistaken or referencing his power millions of years ago when he claimed he could one shot Frieza. Nothing he demonstrates supports his claim.
      • Going to have to disagree with that. Piccolo absolutely freaked out when he sensed the Supreme Kai's power. And this is a guy who stalemated an android who punched out a Super Saiyan with a single punch. The very same Super Saiyan who killed Frieza and his father with very little effort. And keep in mind Piccolo trained in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber for 2 years after stalemating #17 while also likely increasing his strength over the years following Cell's defeat.
      • Also, consider the Supreme Kai's ability to immobilize a Super Saiyan 2 Gohan with his powers. He even stopped a charging Majin Buu. The guy is clearly far ahead of Frieza in terms of power.
      • Piccolo freaked out because he recognized the Supreme Kai, not because he was weaker than him. As is mentioned above it was the equivalent of going to the local boxing tournament and the President of the United States stepping into the ring. Of course you took a forfeit. It's easy to forget in Dragonball that Piccolo is ex-GOD, King Kai is Super God and the Supreme Kai is Super Duper God. He was out of his pay grade but not his weight class based on his panic over Pui Pui who based on his thinking 50x gravity was a big deal was probably roughly on par with Captain Ginyu! As for immobilizing Gohan it's possible that magic just works differently. Vegeta and Goku are both (separately) relocated by Bibbity and while it clearly didn't stop him Vegetto is even turned to candy. There is supporting evidence that the Kais used to be much more powerful however. King Kai tells East Kai that he should recognize Buu because he was part of the last fight with Buu. Anybody who wasn't at least on par with say Perfect Cell wouldn't have been fighting Buu so much as fleeing that galaxy. King Kai was by his own admission weaker than Goku by the end of the Saiyan Saga. A few million years is apparently quite enough time to get really fat and lazy.
      • The pure amount of wrong in this post is staggering. West Kai fighting Kid Buu is an inaccurate dub-only line. Kaioshin was never scared of Pui Pui, he just advised Vegeta not to screw around. Piccolo didn't back down because Kaioshin was a god, but because he was way stronger; that is exactly what he said when asked. Kaioshin didn't paralyze Gohan with magic, he did it with telekinesis, which as shown in the Saiyan Saga won't work unless you're at least like a quarter of whoever you're trying to use it on. Finally, West Kai and Kaioshin aren't even of the same order of being, so even if West Kai was stronger a while ago (he wasn't), why compare them? Kaioshin was stated by Piccolo to be far superior to him and he had the psychic powers to paralyze a Super Saiyan 2. He's clearly way more powerful than any pre-Cell Games character at the very least, and a good portion of the fighters at the Cell Games.
      • On to why he didn't stop Freeza: the Kaioshin we meet is the overseer of the East Galaxy. Freeza's operation was based in the North Galaxy. There was a North Kaioshin who should have been taking care of this, but Buu killed him. East Kaioshin can't watch the entire universe by himself; he didn't even finish his training before Buu killed the rest, so it's more of a wonder that he even keeps the East Galaxy relatively peaceful. Broly can't even be fitted into the continuity, so he doesn't factor in.
    • Universal Balance. There has to be SOME evil in the universe. Plus, where Frieza is concerned, as of Battle of Gods, Beers told Frieza to destroy Vegeta, meaning he was kind of a "stand in" for destruction. Plus, everyone is scared shitless of Beers.
      • Nothing in Battle of Gods suggests that Beerus was the one to make Frieza destroy planet Vegeta. Beerus states that he would have gotten around to it himself the next time he woke up, but Frieza ended up doing it instead.
      • Not true. "I'm curious, Whis. While I enjoyed my all too brief slumber, did that upstart Frieza manage to eradicate Planet Vegeta for me?"
      • The exact wording is ambiguous. The most literal meaning is that Beerus asked Freeza to destroy Planet Vegeta, true. But he could also mean that Freeza just ended up doing something he was going to do anyway, unwittingly doing it on his behalf. Unless someone posts a more definitive translation, there's no way to tell.
    • Super seems to imply that the Kais work on something of a non-interference clause when it comes to mortal affairs, only acting indirectly. The conflict with Buu was different, either because Bibidi & Buu attacked first, or because Buu isn't considered a mortal problem, while Frieza & Broly would be.

  • To my understanding, Goku left to train Uub because the Z Fighters were getting old, and he wanted someone to succeed them. However, by this point he's got all of Old Kai's lifespan, which is enough to guarantee he'll outlive everyone except maybe Popo and Buu, possibly Dende and Piccolo. So why didn't he spend as much time as he could with his family, considering he'll still be alive when their dead and thus have plenty of time to train a successor.
    • Dude can teleport and fly at super-speed. His sons can at least do the latter, and his wife is probably strong and fast enough to run there in a few minutes (going by how she trained Goten to his early Buu saga levels). GT aside, he can spend as much time with them as he wants and vice-versa, and he's really looking forward to having a duel with Buu where the latter isn't completely psychotic.
    • Goku's reasons for training Uub were as much having a successor, as having his rematch with the reincarnation of Buu. Also something to do with keeping an eye in with the reincarnation of the most powerful being in the universe, and making sure he turns good so it's all worth it in the end.
    • Goku doesn't have the lifespan of the old god. He's just alive for the rest of his Saiyan lifespan, which admittedly means he'll still outlive pretty much everyone but the aliens and Roshi.

  • In the beginning of the Buu saga Vegeta believes Gohan was killed by Buu. Due to his claim the others believe this as well. A short time later Bulma makes a wish on the Dragon Balls to bring back everyone killed. Gohan had not been killed/revived before by the dragon. Even if he had died he would have been brought back. Why did they still believe he was dead!?
    • This one bugs me too. If at least they had a Hand Wave of "Hey, we can't feel his ki, that means he must be dead!" (But he's actually at the Kaiohshin's planet), it would make some sense. But instead, they just assumed he got Killed Off for Real when it was impossible for him to be so.
      • The only way it could make sense if they thought that Gohan had been fatally wounded, but still hung on long enough until after the wish was made, and only then died.

  • Okay, so Piccolo destroyed the entrance to the room of space and time to trap Buu inside. Then Buu ripped a hole into space and went back to our side. After 1 or 2 minutes Piccolo and Gotenks manage to come back to our side too, just to see that Buu destroyed Kami's palace and left. So far so good. Only problem would be that 1 day outside equals 1 year inside, making those 1-2 minutes inside the room equal to less than half a second for Buu to destroy the palace and leave.
    • That's all the time Buu would need. That's why he's so destructive.
      • This, basically. Buu has ridonkulous levels of Super Speed. An out of shape Roshi and a barely trained Kuririn were able to attack, counterattack, strategize, play Janken, then attack again so fast that they looked like they just blinked to opposite ends of the battle ring in a split-second back at the beginning of the series. Buu is a little faster than that.
    • Toriyama forgot about that, just like he forgot about the whole "being unable to know about the outside world" and "only two people can be in at any time" rules. At least he didn't forget making the place white.
    • It could be Handwaved saying that breaking any of the rules nullified the chamber's time effect at least temporarily.
      • Or that Buu doesn't count as a 'person' seeing as he's magically created.
    • It's mentioned that Gotenks and Piccolo took hours trying to break the room.
    • When Piccolo sees that Dende is alive, Gohan reminds him that Buu didn't have enough time to look for everyone in the Lookout because little time had passed between Boo getting out of the Hyperbolic Chamber and then Piccolo and Gotenks getting out. Piccolo then says he had forgotten to consider this!
    • Only two people being allowed in at a time was never a rule. It was stated in the Cell Saga that only two people could go in at a time because it was only set up for two people at a time, i.e. stocked with enough food and provisions for two people for one year.

  • Babidi having Boo kill off Dabura. Okay, so Babidi is childish and stupid. That doesn't stop this from not making any frigging sense:
  1. If Boo goes rebel (Like he ends doing), only Dabura can hold him long enough for Babidi to seal him in the ball again.
  2. If Boo ends in the ball again for whatever reason, Dabura can defend Babidi.
  3. If an enemy is strong enough to put Boo in a pinch, Dabura can help. (Hey, still better than nothing, and he has that stoning spit...)
  4. Boo has a childish nature and doesn't accept orders, while Dabura is completely loyal to his master until his last breath.
  5. While Babidi could make new servants, it's almost impossible they would be stronger than Dabura.
  6. He comes from the freaking Demon Realm and looks like Satan! (Not Mr. Satan, thankfully)
  • ...So, all in all, Babidi nabbed himself a Genki Dama-sized Idiot Ball right there.
    • Pretty much yeah. Babidi is arrogant, possibly more childish than Buu, and more notably, incredibly short-sighted. Remember what he did to Spopovitch and Yamu. They were hit with a massive case of outliving their usefulness, but after he saw how much energy they collected, he wondered if he had acted rashly. It was the same thing with Dabura. He treats everything like a toy, and once something better comes along, he chucks the old one away. He's nowhere near as smart as his old man (who was able to control fat Buu much better from what we can see). He just doesn't consider the consequences of his actions.
    • Wrong: Babidi didn't order Buu to kill Dabura at all. Dabura pissed off Buu by mocking him, then when he regained consciousness after Buu casually trounced him he thought it was a bright idea to try and backstab Buu (out of loyalty to Babidi), who proceeded to turn eat him without any input from Babidi.
      • True, however, he also didn't do anything to stop Buu, and in fact was cheering Buu on, so the questioning troper's point still stands.

  • The fusion dance requires both participants to be the same height, right? But Vegeta's way shorter than Goku. How are they able to use the fusion dance?
    • They don't have to be the exact same height, they just have to be close enough.
    • What counts as close enough though? Despite Toriyama's inconsistencies with height, Goku has about 4 to 5 inches on Vegeta.
      • Four to five inches isn't that big of a difference. Probably height is important in a general sense, but power level is the real deciding factor.
      • The movies are non-canon, so it is possible that the height requirement does apply. Of course, Toriyama didn't really give a shit about the series at this point and was pretty much pulling everything out of his ass.
    • They are never shown using the fusion dance (Vegeta bluntly refuses in DBZ), so maybe it wouldn't even have worked due to said height difference.
    • Maybe the height thing is a recommendation and not a hard rule. After all, if one person's significantly taller or shorter than the other, it makes the whole finger placement thing (which Trunks and Goten learned the hard way is not very forgiving) very difficult.

  • Enma judges EVERY SOUL of EVERY PLANET, so why when Buu starts destroying Earth does he act like this is making his job harder? I seriously doubt an extra 6 billion people is THAT MUCH when you're judging souls of God knows how many planets each day.
    • More work is still more work. In the grand scheme of things, it may not be that much, but it's still irritating to get a bunch of work piled on you all of a sudden.
    • Well, for Enma to judge that many freaking souls, we can assume that time moves much much slower in Enma's realm. So normally he gets souls slowly, a few at a time, even though they are dying much faster in reality. But with Buu, they all died at the same time, so they all arrived at the same time. Just a theory.
    • Does Enma judge EVERY planet or just the North side of the galaxy? It would seem extremely likely/prudent that each of the Kaios would have their own check-in ogre. If not, then at the very least Enma's jurisdiction would be limited to the Supreme Kai. Even so, how many of the planets in each galaxy actually sustain life - or as many lives as Earth? So it's probably a safe bet to say, either way, that Enma's probably never seen 6 billion souls in line, let alone all arriving at the same time.
    • Buu wiped out the majority of Earth's population in less than 2 days. Enma (in the anime, anyway) stated there were times when he and his group weren't doing much when he chewed them out during the judging of Earth's many souls, so clearly they can manage things well enough most of the time. And keep in mind Goku was giving out statistics in the millions and Yemma had a terrible reaction to it. But the majority of Earth's population would actually be in the billions instead. So an extra 6 billion probably would be terrible for him.

  • Before Kid Buu destroys the Earth Goku says "That's way too much power, it can't be meant for us! He's going to destroy the Earth"... But, by this point, wouldn't it take MUCH more power to destroy Goku than it would to destroy the Earth?
    • It's Goku.
    • Another theory: He's saying that he's using more power then he'd need to use against Goku and Vegeta and he's making sure they can't do anything to stop him. That's what I always thought.
    • That's a dub line. In the original, he just says "That's extremely powerful! We can't block that!".

  • In the Buu saga the number of wishes Shenlong can grant goes from 2 to 3, I guess we're just supposed to assume Dende upgraded them which is fine and all. But Goku seems to know straight away that it's 3 wishes now?
    • So?
      • Goku has been proven to have mind-reading powers. Fact.
    • I'm thinking more and more it just depends on Shenlong's mood that day.

  • The Super Spirit Bomb they used on Kid Buu should have worked without the need for the people of earth to raise their hands. The spirit bomb works by taking energy from those beings that offer it, who do so by raising their hands. Now, right after everyone on earth gave energy and Buu is still pushing Goku's Spirit Bomb back, Vegeta tries to bully Mr. Satan into having the people of earth raise their hands once more, giving even more of their energy and potentially killing them. If this is so, what exactly stops the Z-fighters that are on earth from giving huge chunks of their energy? Kid Buu is shown to be about on par with SSJ3 Goku, so Gohan (who's a whole lot stronger than that at the moment) donating almost all of his energy should have been more than enough to take care of Kid Buu. Heck, Android 18 and 17 have INFINITE energy, they could have kept their hands up all day.
    • 1) Who said they weren't giving all they could? 2) 17 and 18's energy wasn't exactly ki (it's why the Z-Senshi sense where they were). The chances were good they couldn't actually use 18's energy if she wanted them to.
      • I was going to mention the scene where 17 was shown giving Ki (well, whatever his energy source is)to Goku, but I guess that could be attributed as filler. The thing is that if the the Z-Senshi (or really just the demi-Saiyans) were giving all they could their donated Ki should have been more than enough to take care of Kid Buu. This might have been averted if it was said that there's a limit to the amount of Ki a person can give, but a person can apparently continue donating until they die. There is no reason for Gohan, Trunks and Goten to not give all they can.
      • The scene where #17 raise his hand is not filler (it is in the manga), but you could Hand Wave by pointing it was never shown the ki actually coming from him. Anyway, the scene where Vegeta tries to make Satan to convince people to raise their hands again is filler, so we can conclude it is just not possible. After raising their hands you can't give the energy again as you have already gave all of it.
      • According to Toriyama in the SEG the way to win battles "includes several forms: genki, yuuki & shouki" and presumably ones battle power is a combination of all 3 so while Gohan may have been stronger than Boo the amount of genki he could offer was nothing. It also explains why 17 and 18 could offer energy as genki isn't whatever source was being artificially produced. So everyone on Earth could be as strong as Vegito but the Genki Dama wouldn't be as strong as a billion Vegitos would be. Also explains how the genki dama on Freeza was so powerful when there was hardly anyone significantly powerful offering energy to it.
      • Uh...wasn't #17 long, long dead by then?
      • Every time the Z-Fighters beat a major villain, they generally make a wish to revive all of said villain's victims.
      • Generally, yes, but 17 specifically wasn't revived at the end of the Cell Saga. 18 was, but only because she'd been coughed up by Cell earlier in the fight.
      • 17 was revived along with all the other victims of Cell. He is shown to be alive during the Kid Buu saga, having lived a life in obscurity after his revival. If 17 had been left dead, why would Krillin wish for both of them to be turned into humans again?
      • I distinctly remember in the anime (or at least, the version I saw) that 17 was left out of the revival, and I don't recall him ever being shown in the Buu saga at all.
      • I believe it was a mistake, then. Here's the short clip of 17 during the Kid Buu saga: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nadz-fsWYsU Also, every Dragon Ball wiki I have read specifically mentions that he was revived and lived a life as a vagrant in the woods.
      • Ah, that settles that. The description in the Youtube link says it was cut from the episode, so that's why I didn't see it.
      • I think you misremember. I saw the English dub of the episode where Cell's victims were wished back to life, and there was no mention of 17 being left out. The Z Fighters did talk about not liking him as much as 18 in that scene, which might be what you're thinking of.
      • 18 and 17 cannot use the power from their mechanical body parts (the place where they get their infinite energy) to donate to the spirit bomb, because it's not ki. However, they can donate whatever human life force they have, just like everybody else.

  • Okay, check this out. Right at the start of Volume 24, Goku's about to teach Trunks and Goten how to fuse when Babidi threatens to destroy Capsule City. They have to go for the dragon radar before it's destroyed for good. So Goku tells Trunks to zip home and get it while he stalls Babidi and Boo. But waitaminnit. Goku can teleport there and back in a flash. So why doesn't he a) go by himself or b) take Trunks there, instead of going to fight Boo?
    • Trunks had to search for the Dragon Radar once he got there. If Goku had gone himself, Buu would have destroyed the city while he was looking.
      • We already established that Goku has Instant Teleportation, AND that he can take Trunks with him. At the speed Buu was traveling and with Goku's abilities, Goku and Trunks would have found the radar and been out of there before Buu made it.
      • Let's be honest. What Goku really wanted to do was fight Buu. He probably wanted to test his full strength against Buu once, then see how the boys would compare against him since the stakes were too high with Buu. There's also the fact that Trunks is more familiar with Capsule Corp than Goku since, he's obviously family. Besides in the end, it was in Bulma's flying craft in a capsule.
      • He could teleport there with Trunks, but there was no guarantee that they could find the Dragon Radar before Buu gets there and nukes the place. This way, he can at least hold Buu's attention for as long as it might take Trunks to find it. OTOH, he probably should have teleported Trunks there and then teleported to Buu, but the Buu saga basically had Goku oscillating from having everything under control to saying/doing completely random things.

  • Right before Vegeta sacrifices himself against Buu, he asks Piccolo if he'll be sent to the exact same place as Kakarot. Piccolo tells him no, he's going straight to hell for being such a bad guy. But the thing is, Vegeta has already died once before against Freeza. He should already know where he's going and why, so why ask?
    • Because that time, he was revived within a matter of hours, a day at most. Have you seen the line for processing? He probably didn't even make it to Yama the first time around.
      • Okay, that makes sense.
    • Alternatively, it had been years since the Namek Arc, while Vegeta is still not exactly nice, he has definitely changed. Vegeta may have thought that he may have been good enough in those intermission times that he may go to a different place.

  • Near the end of the Buu saga, Dende, old Kaio and Kaio-shin go to New Namek to get the Dragon Balls so they can wish the Earth back. But when they get there, the Namekians already know all about what's going on and have gotten the seven balls together. How is that possible?!
    • Namekians have magic.
      • Not possible. They didn't know about Freeza's genocidal ambitions that were happening on the very same planet as them, and even Guru had to put his hand on Krillin's head to get the details. And now suddenly the whole race knows everything that happened a million light years away?
      • Didn't they mention something along the lines of "we sensed a great dangerous Ki in Earth's direction so we feared for the worse and gathered the Dragon Balls just in case"? If so, talk about Crazy-Prepared!
      • They didn't mention any such thing, but it's not impossible.
      • Nah, just savvy. Given that they were around for Frieza and Cell, and had been on Earth long enough to have heard about Pilaf, Piccolo, the Red Ribbon Army, and the Saiyan Invasion, it really doesn't take very much imagination to connect "powerful malicious ki on Earth" to "they're probably going to want large scale reviving again soon, we better gather our balls in case they lose theirs again".

  • So, in order to defeat Super Buu Goku and Vegeta fuse together and for all they know it's a permanent fusion. So I guess what I'm wondering is, what would Vegetto have done about Bulma and Chichi? Would he have juggled two wives? Got them to wear the earrings? Picked one?
    • In the grand scheme of things, given that the protection of the Earth is more important than the feelings of two women, the most reasonable answer to give would be tough luck. In regards to giving the Potara to Chi-Chi and Bulma that is... one of the most horrifically negligent things that could possibly happen. They have two very young children to think of. Goten has spent his entire life without a father and would have to come to terms with not only losing him again, not only losing his mother, but the knowledge that his parents have apparently decided their happiness is more important and that he should just accept his mother has been replaced by what is essentially a completely different woman with his mother's memories. Not to mention what Ox-King, Bulma's parents and Gohan would think about such an arrangement. Incidentally, if Vegetto picked a wife it would transform him immediately from Hero of the Earth to Complete dick.
      • "Hero of the Earth" and "Complete Dick" are not mutually exclusive titles.
      • Well the Goten situation is easy to solve: have him and Trunks use Potara fusion. And the Chi-Chi/Bulma fusion (Chi-ma? Bulchi?) wouldn't be a completely different person.
      • This solution is so wrong on so many levels... My best bet is that they'd end up living with Bulma and Chichi would go off and do her own thing. She's far more uptight than Bulma, who would probably accept the situation before too long. She's open-minded (and more than a little perverted).
      • "And the Chi-Chi/Bulma fusion wouldn't be a completely different person." Whilst you are indeed correct in saying that a fusion between Bulma and Chi-Chi would technically be the same person - in the same way the Eleventh Doctor is technically Susan Foreman's grandfather. But in terms of personality, sense of humour, outlook on life, physical appearance and even intelligence you could in no way say that the Eleventh Doctor is the same man as the the First. A fusion between these two women would be the exact same situation. For example lets look at Chi-Chi; a loving, caring housewife who enjoys the simple things in life like marriage and raising children... and is nonetheless an authoritative, stern woman with a real-world level of martial arts skill. Bulma on the other hand is a vain, snobbish tomboy with a genius level intellect but absolutely no prowess in fighting whatsoever. If you were to merge these two women you would in no way create a woman that acts like Chi-Chi. To Goten, who is lets remember is a seven year old child, she would have would have been replaced with a woman who only superficially resembles his mother in looks and personality. Secondly the suggestion that Goten and Trunks should give up their individuality and their short lives just to make Vegetto and Bulchi happy is both disgusting and absurd - Chi-Chi and Goku aren't the Borg Queen and Locutus.
      • Look to put it simply, there's no way Chichi would ever agree to either fuse with Bulma or accept Vegetto as a husband. Bulma wouldn't want to fuse with Chichi either (Bulma = vain = fact), but she may find it in her heart (and, ahem, other places) to accept them as a unit. With Goku's Instant Transmission, he can go back to visit his kids any time he wants while living at Capsule Corp. Problem solved.
      • Erm, did we suddenly forget that Chi-Chi is madly in love with Goku? True, she would get very pissed off at him throughout DBZ, but she still very clearly cared about him and in DB, she was obsessed with him. I doubt she'd suddenly not accept Vegito simply because he's not exactly what Goku once was. Hell, I doubt she'd even think that deeply about the fact that Goku technically doesn't exist anymore.
      • Is Chichi really that in love with Goku? It's always seemed more like she was in love with the idea of being in love and getting married, rather than in love with Goku himself.
    • Let's see...at the end of the Cell saga, she's crying on the floor when her son informs her that Goku died in the battle. Yeah, that sounds like a woman who doesn't love her husband.
    • Plus, at the time of Vegetto's fusion, Goku was a widower (as well as Vegeta.) And Vegetto probably figured that Shenron could split him apart.
    • Alternatively, they could have just taught Chi-Chi and Bulma the temporary Fusion Dance and have them do that whenever they want to have a... foursome?
    • Because sharing them would be bad? That seemed to be DB Multiverse's solution anyway.
    • What would have happened if they had defeated Buu, saved the world, brought everyone back to life, but couldn't find a way to un-fuse? Bigamy would ensue.
    • Or, just take it to a further extreme. Use the earrings to fuse Chi-Chi and Bulma, Trunks and Goten, Ox King and Dr. Briefs and then get Future Trunks to return and fuse him and Gohan. Problem solved.

  • Umm... Old Kai is a fusion of a male Supreme Kai and a female old witch... If the fusion is "balanced" enough to alter their face to resemble the witch's face much more so than the Kai's, along with making them old like the witch, then what does that mean for their physical gender?

  • How can "Mr Buu" (As some call him) and Kid Buu exist at the same time? Isn't Mr Buu just Kid Buu with the Grand Supreme Kai absorbed? Meaning if you removed the Grand Supreme Kai from Mr Buu you'd have 2 Kid Buu's...
    • I think that while he looks the same, the Mr. Buu that was split off basically is Grand Supreme Kai, reborn as what can be thought of as a split personality of Buu. Note that when Goku and Vegeta went in, they didn't see Grand Supreme Kai with the other absorbees- most likely, due to the time he spent absorbed, you couldn't remove him any more than you could Kid Buu's native personality.
      • I always thought of it similar to the whole Kami King Piccolo deal. Same person, different identity, one good one evil.
    • I assume Mr. Buu is mostly just the remaining power of the Grand and Southern Supreme Kai but taking just enough of Kid Buu's energy so as to be a pink blob like him. Which would mean that the Kid Buu Goku fights isn't quite as complete as he was millions of years ago, but still pretty close (Or it's a fair trade. Kid Buu is 99% original Kid Buu and 1% Kais, Mr. Buu is 99% Kais and 1% Kid Buu, and that 1% Kid Buu radically changes Mr. Buu but the 1% Kais has no change to Kid Buu for whatever reason).

  • If Enma really had the power to re-incarnate villains into good guys, why didn't he do so with every villain the Z fighters killed?
    • Wasn't worth the trouble is probably the official reason. Buu was ridiculously strong and there is no reason to believe he wouldn't have destroyed the world from the other side had Enma not trapped him the body of a young boy. Unfortunately it's filler but the Ginyu Force, Frieza, King Cold and Cell are all shown as keeping their bodies in hell. Frieza and Cell even get to fight Goku in GT (I know, I know) in the anime Zarbon is the strongest warrior to actually be cleansed. Everybody above that says screw that noise and keep their bodies. But none of them was strong enough or crazy enough to try to destroy reality itself. Honestly given what we learn about Other World during the Buu Saga there's not much reason to think that killing Buu would have done more than slow him down for a tick.
      • There's no indication that they haven't. Frieza and Cell may be some sort of freakishly powerful children on a distant planet and possibly even good guys.
      • It was just a favor to Goku for saving the universe. If for some reason he asked for Frieza to be reincarnated (I expect Vegeta would have something to say about that) he probably would have done it instead.
      • I expect what Vegeta would have to say about that would be something along the lines of "Yes. Bring him back as something I can hit. Repeatedly."
    • Remember, Buu was the only villain who ever posed a threat to the afterlife- a threat which he would continue to pose even in Hell. The other villains might riot from time to time, but Grand Kai's warriors can put them down without much trouble. Buu, however, has killed several Kais and was about to blow up Grand Kai's planet when he sensed Goku. Turning him into a human was the safest course of action.
    • Buu posed no threat to the Afterlife after his death. Not only because they could send Gohan to smack him down, but because villains keeping their bodies at all is a filler-induced plot hole. They're explicitly just helpless disembodied souls in the manga, so they're not going to threaten anyone.
      • Incorrect. They are not helpless disembodied souls until AFTER King Emna condemns them. This is confirmed multiple times. Goku goes to the Check Out station and Kami requests he be allowed to train with King Kai, Picollo (who most likely would not have gotten into Heaven) is given the same opportunity. During the Cell Saga when Goku and King Kai die the reason they know Cell has survived is because they look around expecting to spot him on Snake Way and he's not there. In the Buu Saga Vegeta had explicitly checked into the HFIL and had been allowed to keep his body and finally Dabura kept his body. It's not just the questionable cannon of filler and GT that establish you keep a body for a certain period of time before being turned into a cloud.
      • Taking this into account, it seems that Goku's request that Buu be reincarnated was one of genuine pity. When all's said and done, for all the evil things he did, Buu was a child who didn't know any better. Perhaps Goku just wanted Buu to have a real chance at life.

  • I think all Dragon Ball Z fans know by now that Hercule Satan is the greatest case of Overshadowed by Awesome in the entire franchise. He is an incredibly gifted martial artist when not going up against Z-Fighter level fighters and legitimately won the World Martial Arts Tournament at least once. What bugs me is that, because we only ever see him getting his ass kicked by vastly stronger enemies, there is no conclusive reading of his power level - just how strong is he? Now most people would be inclined to give him a very insulting power level, however as we have seen from the 21st Tournament, there are an incredibly diverse level of opponents that enter from monsters and beasts to legendary fighters and cheaters. There is no reason to believe that the tournament he legitimately won wouldn't have also featured a vast array of strong enemies for him to defeat. Also, we have seen him fall from insane distances, survive explosions, get kicked into a mountain and pull of speed and strength similar to 21st Tournament Goku (when he defeated the two thugs who shot Buu's Puppy) which would immediately put him ahead of his two closest rivals King Chappa (who was killed by a single kick from Tambourine) and Nam. This would logically give Hercule a power level at least equal to Roshi and Goku in the 21st, a pretty impressive feat for someone that cannot use his ki.
    • That's probably too much. The commenter says to Goku and friends that the tournaments have become really boring without them because the level was so low. Mr. Satan probably doesn't even have a patch on Nam, who could at least jump up an absurd height. He probably got lucky and entered the 24th tournament when no weird people were around anymore (let's not forget DB used to run on humor, so the fighters were as strong as they needed to be in order to appear funny to the readers). If someone had to guess, it could be said that character-wise, he seems very similar to Pamput, the boxer from the 22nd tournament.
    • Quite possibly, yes. It's just that by the point he was introduced Toriyama had moved beyond using power levels for the series (too much trouble, he said), and they never made a reappearance so Hercules never got rated.
    • It's not easy, but we could try to quantify Satan's power somehow: for his strength, we know that he had trouble destroying fifteen tiles with one hand, while Goku in his first appearance easily destroyed three slabs of concrete with a finger. The latter sounds way more impressive, I believe. For speed, we definitely know Goku at the 21st tournament was pulling out stuff like triple persistent images, which from what we know, seems way above Satan's league. Same for Roshi, who at the time was essentially the strongest person in the world, who could use several ki techniques and make persistent images like it was nothing. Overall, I severely doubt Satan would be anywhere near their level. Maybe he could deal with Goku in his first appearance, but even then, it's a very strong "maybe". He can definitely deal with the other contestants in the tournament though. Maybe he's close to King Chapa's level. Still, King Chapa was said to have won a tournament without getting hit once, so maybe he's stronger. Anyway, maybe Satan won because there were no other competitors (I guess being defeated twice by Goku, the second time with no effort whatsoever, would have a bad effect on King Chapa's ego, and Nam has no reason to be fighting again after getting his water).
      • You just made me think of something else: What happened to all of the funny animals? There were many characters like those in prior series, but, after DBZ, they became scarce and stopped appearing altogether after a certain point. Some of them even fought in the tournaments as well.
      • Addressed in another question, but they're still around. The President is still the dog from the Piccolo Daimaou saga, for one thing. Toriyama probably just didn't feel the need to draw them all the time just to show that "Yes they're still around."
    • Mr. Satan almost died after being shot with a gun. Goku, in the very first chapter/episode, was shot in the head, and while he said it hurt, it didn't even seem to break the skin. While martial arts skill might be a different story, I'd say that puts start-of-series Goku on a whole different level, brute force wise, from Mr. Satan.

  • Where did the term "Z Fighter" to refer to the main and supporting characters come from? I figured it was just an out-of-universe thing, but I remember them being explicitly referred to as such in the original English dub, if not in Kai. So was there ever an explanation for it?
    • Some clever dub writer thought of it, that's all. Remember the "Z" doesn't even exist in the original Japanese edition.
      • Thank you for bringing this up (I was going to if it wasn't already here). I actually hate the term "Z Fighter" because it makes no sense. As the above troper said the Z didn't exist in the Japanese version and it certainly never existed in the series itself. At no point in story did a significant, team building event involving the letter Z happen. They need to be called something else.
      • Why hate the term so much? The "Z" comes from Toriyama himself, even though it wasn't used in the Japanese version.
      • Citation needed. This is the first I've ever heard of that.
      • It comes from the interviews that can be found in the back of certain Tankobon releases. And it was actually used for the Japanese anime as well as the dub. Toriyama chose the Z because he thought he was getting near the end of the series, and Z is the last letter of the alphabet. Post in the Dragon Ball forum thread if you want an exact quote.

  • In a similar vein to just above, what is with the tournament commentator saying, during the Buu Saga, specifically during the fight between Android #18 and "Mighty Mask", that he had not seen anything like these fights? Hm... did he forget every tournament in Dragon Ball? The news eleven years ago -by this point- of the Saiyans attacking the world, or Piccolo before that, or young Goku going ape when fighting "Jackie Chun"? Or was Hercule THAT convincing?
    • Hercule probably told everyone the same thing he told Videl: All of those spectacular fights in the previous tournaments were fought with cheap tricks. As for the announcer, he's just pretending he doesn't know what he's talking about; The dude clearly states that he remembers the old fights, says that the new tournament fights are boring, and asks Goku if he and his group were really the ones who beat Cell. He and King Furry are the only characters not closely related to Goku that seem to have realized that Cell is far stronger than Mr. Satan.
    • It's worth noting that as far as we can tell nobody remotely close to as powerful as any of the Z Fighters emerged the entire time between. If I had (I'm admittedly not overly familiar with Dragon Ball vs Dragon Ball Z) a few years of fantastic over the top action that was both preceded and followed by years and years of fairly mundane fights I'd buy into it being somehow staged as well. Kinda like when you first learn that professional wrestling is fake and it suddenly makes sense why MMA matches go pretty quickly and lots of boxing matches are over before they start but these people get dumped off ladders through tables. I'm really curious why nobody better than Hercule emerged in the interim. I know he's good but honestly I would expect at least people with power levels similar to the minor tournament members to be running around like it was the thing to do.
    • This troper was under the impression that the fantastic over the top action was the norm for the world tournaments up til the end of Dragonball but by the final tournament in that series it was primarily just Goku and the other Z fighters who were using ki abilities and since they seemed to stop competing in world tournaments after the end of Dragonball that was when the more mundane fights became the norm. Considering that nobody ever sought out Goku or his friends for training the way that Goku and Krillin sought out master Roshi and most of the adventures/battles Goku and his friends experience during Dragonball Z occur in remote out of the way places or other planets its possible that knowledge of ki and other fantastic fighting abilities fell out of practice and faded from public consciousness after Dragonball.
  • During the Buu saga, Goku was forced into a desperate choice - to use Potara to fuse with either Dende or Hercule. He quickly decides upon Hercule, reasoning that because of his martial arts training the resultant fusion should, at the very least, become slightly stronger. It bugs me of just how dismissive Goku was at the contributions Dende would have made to creating a fused warrior. Dende maybe weak, but he is also a Namek - and Namek's have some incredible natural abilities. A fusion between a Saiyan and a Namek would have the ability to regenerate, (something that Piccolo, Cell and Buu have proved time and again how useful that is), would have the ability to stretch his limbs a good dozen metres, would have access to incredibly acute hearing and, of course, have access to all the Saiyan advantages that Goku would bring. Also, unlike Hercule, Dende can actually use ki - weak ki perhaps, but his healing ability is arguably one of the most useful techniques in the series. The excuse that he needs Dende alive to keep the Dragon Balls active is in itself ridiculous because a fusion between Goku and Dende would have the ability to make new Dragon Balls. There is nothing saying that you have to be pure Namek, and seeing as the fusion would give the resulting warrior all of Dende's abilities... Goku was firmly hit with an Idiot Ball.
    • (op) Something else I thought of just after I wrote the paragraph above. Why did Goku have to fuse with Dende or Hercule in the first place? Goku's Instant Transmission allows him to go anywhere in this Universe or the Otherworld. What was stopping him from snapping his fingers and fusing (forcibly if necessary) with Pikon? Or Olibu? Or King Kai? Or any of the dead Z Warriors which includes Krillin, Tien, Yamcha..., or the Grand Kai? Or Supreme Kai/Kabito? All of these fighters are stronger than Dende and Hercule. We also know that it's entirely possible for a living and dead warrior to fuse because that is exactly what he does a few minutes later with Vegeta. Seriously, Goku or Toriyama really didn't think this whole crisis through.
    • He didn't fuse with Dende because he needed the Dragon Balls (This is before the whole plan to go and use the Namekian Dragon Balls).
      • Like I said above though; why? there is no evidence whatsoever a Saiyan/Namek hybrid wouldn't have the ability to create Dragon Balls. A fused being has every capability its hosts possessed - just enhanced. Dende's original balls would die, but seeing as this new creature isn't Dende, all he would need to do is create a new Dragon. In fact, if you consider GT to be canon a very similar event has already happened. The Nameless Namek invented the Black Star Dragon Balls that turned to stone when he split into Piccolo and Kami - only to reactivate when they re-joined in the Cell saga.
      • GT isn't canon, and Pikkon and Olibu aren't canon either. I don't have an answer for the other characters you mentioned.
      • There was no way to know for sure ahead of time whether fusing with Dende would affect his ball-making abilities or not (GT is not canon). Since the process was irreversible, the risk was not worth taking. Your point about him fusing with King Kai is a valid one, though. Who are Pikon and Olibu? If they're filler they don't count. And Goku could not fuse with any characters currently actively dead, only those who had been brought back to Earth like Vegeta was.
      • Also, when Kami fused with Piccolo, the Dragonballs became inactive. Whether or not the same thing would happen isn't certain, but it wasn't a risk Goku could take. If they did become inactive, then "Denku" wouldn't really have time to reactivate it.
    • Another thing to consider is biology. Fusing through the dance only works with two people with similar bodies and ki. Although Potara fusion would've forced Goku and Dende to fuse, you have to remember that humans are much more similar to Saiyans than Namekians. So similar, in fact, that they're able to reproduce with each other. Who knows what problems may have arisen from fusing a monkey-like humanoid species with a plant-like humanoid species. There was Cell, but Cell's a special creature not born of fusion techniques.
      • I don't think it was stated that the Potara fusions require a similar person. The fusion dance does but was the Potara ever confirmed to?
      • Yep, when Kibito and Supreme Kai fused to form Kibitokai, Kai was roughly half the size of Kibito, and they didn't need to match up their power levels to fuse either.

  • Another little bit of confusion occurs in the Buu Saga. What the HELL happened to Tien and Chiaotzu! Tien did pop up briefly to try and help, but after Dende healed him he vanished. It's possible that Tien left the battlefield to get Chiaotzu, and they and Dende could regroup. But of course that wouldn't explain Dende's recklessness in trying to follow Buu around everywhere with Hercule!
    • As far as the manga goes, Tien was not shown being healed by Dende. It's entirely possible that Buu's kick killed him (that would also give an explanation as to why Goku avoided using the Potaras with Tien; he could have fused with an unconscious body, but not with a dead one).

  • The final Spirit Bomb. When Goku used it the previous times (Vegeta and Freeza) he only needed to ask his surroundings (including inanimate things) for energy, yet to defeat Kid Buu he needs the humans to raise their hands and consciously give him energy. Why couldn't he take it freely anymore?
    • He could. However he needed all the humans to donate their energy because just doing it the normal way would make it far too weak to destroy Kid Buu, who is hundreds of times stronger than Freeza.

  • When Babidi is about to destroy West City, Bulma explains why they need to recover the Dragon Radar: since it's made of particular components, it cannot be rebuilt. Then how come, in the original series, she was able to rebuild it at least once (using scrap material!)?
    • Maybe she ran out of whatever special material she had?

  • Goku at Super Saiyan 3 claimed he could have destroyed Kid Buu at full power, but was holding back to give Vegeta a chance? I've heard of Idiot Hero, but this is ridiculous. Goku knows that Vegeta can't beat Buu at all with Super Saiyan 2 so why even throw away his best chances?
    • Goku only claims to have been capable of defeating Fat Buu at Super Saiyan 3, but wanted one of the still-living Z fighters to save the day. Vegeta made the assumption that Goku was holding back against Kid Buu to give Vegeta a shot, and is surprised when Goku reveals that he was trying to beat him, but couldn't get up to full power quickly enough during the fight to do so.
    • You sure? I remember Goku saying he could have destroyed Kid Buu if he weren't holding back for Vegeta to have a shot. Unless that was anime or dub only.
      • Quite the opposite - in the Viz translation of the manga, at least, Vegeta thinks this is the case, but Goku outright tells him that he was going all-out (barring his inability to get to full power since it's more difficult to use Super Saiyan 3 while he's alive).

  • At the part where Goku has to decide to fuse with Dende or Hercule, he decides to go with Hercule because he knows martial arts even though he admits that it would lower his power level by a lot. My question is why would he bother to fuse then. Goku by himself may not have a chance to stop Buu, but he would definately have a better shot by himself than from some weaker fusion form.
    • He says he has no idea if he would get strong enough from the fusion, and speculates he may actually become weaker. He doesn't know at all if it's even possible for him to become weaker through potara fusion. He was desperately hoping fusing with Mr. Satan would make him stronger than Boo.
    • The fusion seems to be fully cumulative (And then some. Gotenks and Gogeta/Vegito seem to be stronger than the sum of their parts). So Mr. Satan would have given a sliiiight power boost, as well as some useful martial arts knowledge.
      • More importantly, it would turn him into a half-saiyan, which would be quite useful. Remember that at age 4, Gohan was twice as strong as Goku was at 23. Gohan became a super saiyan at age 9, and Trunks and Goten were even younger when they transformed. Based on that, we can conclude that half-saiyans tend to be stronger than full-blooded saiyans, other things being equal.

  • Ok, let me get this straight; Kid Buu is weaker than Super Buu but stronger than a level 2 super saiyan, which was all Vegeta and Goku could manage against him, so he tore them apart, forcing them to go with the Spirit Bomb plan. Gohan at this point was significantly stronger than Super Buu. While Gohan giving his Ki to the Spirit Bomb gave it the single largest boost of anyone, shouldn't his contribution have been more than enough to obliterate Kid Buu?
    • We don't know how powerful Super Buu actually was, only that he was losing to Gohan. The thing that makes Kid Buu so dangerous is he's fighting at 100% and doesn't care about collateral damage. Super Buu and all the others thanks to the Kai he absorbed are holding back and we don't know how much. Like Gohan when he fights to his full potential had Frieza on the ropes, was beating Cell so bad he started playing with him and owned Buu so hard he decided to let Gottenks have another crack at it for no reason other than it couldn't hurt anything. It's entirely possible that Super Buu could have destroyed Gohan with little effort fighting at 100%.
    • Nah, Super Buu was inferior to Gohan by a big margin. We know that Super Saiyan 3 could match Kid Buu with enough power to obliterate him at it's peak power and Gohan is quite a bit superior to Super Saiyan 3 so it's likely that they were pretty close.
      • We still have no idea how much Super Buu was holding back. We know back on Namek for example that Gohan 100% was doing no worse than Goku against final form Frieza and that vs Cell he was holding back and it's heavily implied that Mystic Gohan isn't a power up, it's just unlocking his full potential. Buu may very well have similar hang ups.
    • The OP is correct to say that Super Buu is far stronger than Super Saiyan 3 Goku, which is equal to Kid Buu, and Ultimate Gohan is faaaaaaar stronger than even Super Buu. Super Buu wasn't holding back at all; he said that himself. That was the whole point of the absorption plot. He couldn't overcome Gohan alone, he needed to absorb Gotenks to win. So why wasn't Gohan's contribution to the Spirit Bomb enough to destroy Kid Buu alone, considering how much stronger he is? Simple. The answer is in the name. Specifically, the technique's Japanese name: Genki-Dama. Genki. We know from Toriyama himself that ki, the energy that makes up the characters' power, is made up of various components: one of those components is genki, or vitality (others include shuuki and yuuki, which are courage and correct state of mind). So Gohan didn't actually donate his full strength to the Genki-Dama; no one did. Just a fraction of it, their genki. Hence why Gohan's energy alone wasn't quite enough (Goku said it was close, though), and why they needed to draw from the Earthlings to complete the attack. Goku even brings this up in the series, when he says he's just going to draw "some" or "a bit" of power from all contributing beings in the vicinity whenever he uses the Genki-Dama/Spirit Bomb. Including here.
      • tl;dr: Gohan >>> Super Buu >>>> SS-3 Goku = Kid Buu, but the power Gohan gave to the Spirit Bomb wasn't all the power he had, according to Toriyama and Goku.
  • Buu can regenerate even from molecular matter, as we saw after his fight with Gotenks in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber. Why didn't he just vaporize himself, or at least just cast off microscopic bits of himself, and then absorb everybody almost instantly?
    • Considering that he doesn't just gain power like Cell from absorbing people he gets some of their personality this wouldn't be a good plan. If be absorbed someone who was a pacifist he might become one too just like how Kid Buu became Fat Buu after absorbing someone who was very kind and playful.
    • Microscopic bits would probably be too small to engulf people with. The globs he uses on Piccolo, Gotenks, and Gohan are fairly large.

  • How does Super Buu constantly crack his neck despite lacking bones and joints?
    • Popping bubbles inside him.
    • He may not technically have bones and joints, but he does at least need to simulate them in human form.
    • On a similar note, why does Buu have a heart and veins/arteries, as seen inside him? Does globby matter like him really need a cardiovascular system and blood, especially considering how regularly his heart gets destroyed along with everything else?
      • A possability is, it seems that Buus' "race" generally are just blobs for the most part, but when taking on a humanoid form they copy everything, because they don't understand how a humanoid body works properly so they don't miss anything out incase they miss something that will hamper the function of te body, for all we know if Buu missed out on copying a spine he might flop about kind of uselessly.

  • So where was Android 17 during Super Buu's reign? If Tien and Chiaotzu were able to survive the Human Extinction Attack I'd imagine he could too. Given how Tien at least shows up to Buu rather quickly after extinction, I'd wonder if 17 bothered to investigate everyone dropping dead or not.
    • Well, remember that 17 and 18 can't sense Ki. Depending on where he was, he might not have had even the slightest idea of where Super Buu touched down on Earth after the attack.
      • Android 18 can't sense Ki, yet in the newer movies, she says a couple of times that she can sense a strong Ki. How did she learn??
      • The easiest answer is that the movies are non cannon. That aside everybody that she associates with can sense ki, the idea that Krillin taught it to her at some point isn't difficult to believe. Either that or she just figured it out. Vegeta teaches himself to sense energy levels on the way to Namek. It's like once he figured out it was possible he could do it almost instantly. We also don't have any accurate way of gauging how difficult it is to learn. Goten and Videl go from being unable to fly to flying just fine over a couple of days if learning to sense Ki is similarly easy 18 may have just picked it up along the way.
    • What precisely would he have accomplished aside from getting himself killed? I think the better question is why he didn't fly into space and hang out on the moon. (How many times has that thing been brought back?)

  • Why is Chichi so different in how she treated Gohan in comparison to Goten? With Gohan, she was virtually psychotic about his studying and keeping him from fighting at all. With Goten, she even trains him. Could be that she's justed mellowed out but I'm not sure that explains the drastic differences in upbringing.
    • Goku's death during the Cell Games snaps Chi Chi out of her insane overprotectiveness and obsession with her son's education, at least when it comes to Goten. She's still as obsessive as ever about it with Gohan.
      • But why with only one kid? How come she hasn't lightened up in regards to Gohans education? IS that she favors Goten for looking like his dad (not likely, I think), or has dismiss Goten as lost cause in this case (once, again, I don't think this is the case) or what? Why be obsessed about one kid getting a good education and not the other?
      • I think that Gohan is studying of his own accord by that point. Chi Chi being so obsessed with Gohan's education is something that anyone that's seen Dragonball would agree is something that just came out of nowhere anyway.
  • Why is it, for all of Goku's efforts to rehabilitate his enemies, turn them into friends, and keep his growing network of people alive, does Goku never seem to show any interest in reconnecting with his brother, Raditz, or the biological father he never knew while he's dead? Granted, Raditz was trying to kill his son and didn't give Goku a lot of time to really think about what was going on, other than to save him, but every other major villain he ever met after that also tried to kill Gohan and didn't receive the existential cold shoulder. He's also never been too curious about his mother either, and doesn't seem too interested to see Grandpa Gohan when he has the change to either. I just can't figure that out.
    • For Raditz, the guy did kidnap Gohan and didn't give Goku time to think, as you have said. As for the other guys that tried to kill Gohan? Simply put, do ''not'' mess with Gohan when Goku is around, or he will end you without hesitation. As for his own parents? Good question. He probably assumed they were like the other Saiyans (ie, evil), understood that they paid for their crimes with their lives and didn't think twice about it. Plus, he had no real emotional attachment to them, as he was sent to Earth when he was a newborn. As for Grandpa Gohan? He met him once again the Afterlife, near the end of the original Dragonball series, so he knows that Grandpa Gohan is happy and well in the Afterlife.
    • Not to mention that the Earth Dragon Balls can't revive anyone who's been dead for more than a year, and the Namek Dragon Balls were unavailable (either being used to revive the other heroes at the end of the Freeza Saga, or on a planet they didn't know the location of until the end of the Buu Saga). He could have revived the Saiyans or Grandpa Gohan with the Namek balls sometime after the end of the series, but a lot of things could have happened after the end of the series.
    • Isn't there a limited time where you go from a body to a spirit and thus can't be brought back? Even if Goku used the Namekian Dragonballs, Grandpa Gohan would would probably be a spirit by now. Plus, the guy was old, so if he were brought back, he'd have only a decade at most before he'd die...again. Easier to just let the man rest in eternity. As for the Sayians, considering what they were, I'm not sure Goku (or even Vegeta) wants to risk bringing back a murderous race of space warriors. Goku's and Vegeta's parents included (imagine the family reunion!) Would make for an interesting fanfic, though.
      • The Dragon Balls (the original Earth ones at least, we didn't know all the limitations of first gen Namekian Balls and know nothing about the current gen Namekian balls and not much about Dende's Dragon Balls is actually set.) can't bring you back after a year and Raditz fell behind Goku's friends. We know in the Dragon Ball Universe that reincarnation is real so it's entirely plausible that normal people are reborn rather quickly and that bringing back Bardock would "kill" some thirty something guy on Frieza planet #6856. It might be as simple as Goku halfway understands that death is natural and only seeks to change it in events where he feels he personally screwed up.

  • In the Buu saga, all of humanity is killed, and then only the "good" people are revived. The memory of everything relating to Buu and his deeds is then erased to make life easier for Fat Buu. But... doesn't this mean that, as far as everybody can remember, one day all the assholes just randomly keeled over? Did nobody question this?
    • They probably erased their memory of the assholes as well.
    • "Jerkass/asshole" is different from "Evil". Even then, "Evil" is subjective and may only include people willing to murder, rape and torture. If one day a large group of evil people like the Red Ribbon Army disappeared, people will merely shrug and continue with their merry little lives.
    • So, did they pretty much usher in a utopia on accident by killing literally everyone willing to murder, rape, torture or commit evil in general?
      • And then everyone started worshipping Kira.
    • Doubtful. Perhaps in the short run things would run smoothly, but that doesn't mean that all good people will stay good. Even if all of the people willing to murder, rape or torture vanished, these impulses are qualities that can return in the right conditions, and there's no guarantee that their children or grandchildren will avoid having them.
  • How come Bulma, Krillin, Videl, Yamcha, and the rest of the group didn't just fly away from Kami's Lookout in order to avoid being turned into chocolate by Super Buu?
    • Because it wouldn't have made a difference. Super Buu would have just turned them into chocolate ten seconds later.
    • The better question is why 18 wasn't the one to confront Buu. Sure, she wouldn't stand a chance against him, but being that she's on par with a Super Saiyan, she could at least have bought some time and created a distraction that would let Videl carry Marron away.
      • Two reasons. The first was mentioned by the Troper above you. It wouldn't have made any difference whatsoever. She not on par with Super Saiyan, she's slightly above the bare minimum for a Super Saiyan. Vegeta and Trunks were wiping the floor with Imperfect Cell and Goku was keeping up with Perfect Cell. By comparison the only thing 18 could do against Imperfect Cell was run for her life. The second was there was always the off chance that Buu found Krillin amusing but the reality is they were all in way over their heads.
      • Even more pragmatic reason for 18 being the one to carry their daughter: Krillin left the stronger fighter to protect their daughter while he acted as a distraction, which makes perfect sense. His entire focus on that point was protecting his daughter.

  • When they wished to bring back everyone but the most evil people(not simply the evil people, but the most evil), why was Dabura not revived. The guy wasn't that bad a guy(there's also a possibility some of his nastiness is a result of being majined), and was in the midst of having a Heel–Face Turn while trying to stop Buu.
    • Dabura was the Devil. That makes him pretty damn evil, and he wasn't making a Heel–Face Turn at all.
      • The problem here is that there isn't much evidence supporting that Dabura was particularly evil. We know he's the most powerful being from his dimension which seems to be implied to be Hell but it's only implied. What we do know is that HFIL is the Hell of the DB Zverse and Dabura is definitely NOT from there or at the very least he's never mentioned earlier. We also know that the Devil of the DB Zverse is Piccolo. He's the evil half of GOD/Kami. While the Majin process apparently requires you to have evil in your heart or something along those lines Majin Buu doesn't seem to be evil so much as immature.
      • Majin Buu doesn't seem to be evil so much as immature Yeah, except Buu was fully created by Bibidi and never was submitted to the Majin process; his capacity to rebel against Babidi is proof enough. And for evidence that Dabura is evil: the only person to ever resist Babidi's control is the one that wasn't fully evil at that point; so when Vegeta is the "not-so-evil" guy, it's not a stretch to imagine that the other "Majins" are completely, unambiguously evil.
      • Actually, Bibidi didn't create Buu; Buu has existed since time immemorial. Bibidi simply has knowledge of Buu and the magic to seal him up and transport him for his own ends.
      • It's heavily implied nearly to the point of being outright stated that not only did Vegeta willingly submit to the Majin process but also that he remained in control not because he was good but because he's simply that determined and that stubborn. We're talking about a guy who scared Kid Buu because he refused to stop getting up. That doesn't confirm him being good. We don't see the Majin process enough to know how much evil in your heart is needed only that Goku, Gohan and Supreme Kai are apparently immune but those are amongst the purest hearted beings in existence.
      • The dragon can't affect people more powerful than it who don't want to be. Maybe Dabura just decided he was happier in heaven and chose not to be revived.
  • Morality in Dragonball. How exactly does that crap work? I ask it here because it's relevant to the Buu Saga and the wish that all the good people be revived. A previous troper mentioned Dabura but Vegeta is just as vexing, if his suicide attack on Buu didn't qualify him as a "good" person then the only way he should be on the approved list after is if they called in a favor from King Yemma but it while the Saiyan Saga claims that Yemma directly chooses who goes where by the Buu Saga it seems that the "universe" decides on it's own hence the surprise at Vegeta's revival. While I guess saving the universe, or trying, has it's benefits but he already tried that with Cell and again with Buu. Is there some sort of meter and he just lucked into ticking over the top at a very convienent moment? Is Piccolo good? He seemed to have been arguably worse than Vegeta he simply lacked the raw power to do the kind of damage that filler arc Vegeta did and everything else can be chalked up you don't say no to Emperor Frieza if breathing is an addiction you have. He certainly had fewer choices than Piccolo even if you want to argue that he didn't seem too put off by being a murderer.
    • Presumably, they used Vegeta's actions after the death- and not only his actions in life- when deciding if he sufficiently atoned himself to qualify as "good".
    • You answered your own question, OP. The reason they probably allowed Vegeta to keep his body was because they had chalked all the atrocities he had committed in his young life to be him acting under Frieza's orders, 'cause if he didn't, he'd be killed. Of course, then one has to wonder...How good are the ones doing the deciding if they apparently take Just Following Orders as a reasonable excuse?
      • If acting under Frieza's orders was an excuse he wouldn't have been punished as he was when killed himself earlier in the Saga. If they were using his actions after death that doesn't work out either because he already died fighting Frieza and while he did some prickish things after that like bragging about destroying a village of Namekians he really doesn't do anything evil after that. Whatever Vegeta did that qualified him as a good person happened during the battle with Buu
      • And we are forgetting Vegeta made a deal with the devil and destroyed rows of unsuspecting citizens just to satisfy his own pride? That he not only let Cell become perfect but attacked his own son for trying to stop it, leading to how many needless deaths in the royal army? The worst Piccolo Jr does is kidnap a child for perspective in his whole life while Vegeta does all these things after being liberated from Freeza.
      • Fair enough. Then we're back at the beginning though. If destroying rows of citizens and making a deal with the devil make you evil then fighting Buu (which he was already doing when he died) shouldn't be enough to magically make him good.
    • There's two different things at work here, that you're assuming are the same thing. First, when you die in DBZ you go before Yema who judges your soul based on your life. Most people get processed into the reincarnation cycle and reborn, the really good ones get to keep their bodies and go to heaven. Prior to Vegeta's sacrifice, Piccolo isn't making a definitive statement that Vegeta doesn't qualify as a "good person," just that he won't get to retain his existence like Goku does because Goku was the rare breed good enough to pass on into heaven. However, when Vegeta does die Yema takes a look at the situation and decides he'd rather not get rid of the super powerful warrior that just fell into his hands when a monster like Majin Buu is on the loose and let Vegeta keep his body for the moment to help out. His judgement there has little to do with morality and everything to do with pragmatism. Vegeta later gets revived by Porunga on the basis that he's a good person, who's probably using a lower standard than the one required to get into heaven. So two different people using two different standards reached two different answers.

  • When Gohan was getting angry when Spopovitch tried to murder Videl, why couldn't he just use energy-based attacks that would hurt Spopovitch, but would still keep him from entering the ring instead of standing and doing nothing?
    • Good question. I guess entering the ring when its not your turn is against the rules, and shooting Spopovitch with a ki blast, even if he were standing well outside the ring, counts.
    • Attacking another opponent would be against the rules, and I doubt Gohan would want to be disqualified, considering how much Chi-Chi wanted the prize money.
    • Most likely adrenaline. The boy was seeing red, and when your adrenaline starts pumping like that, it's not uncommon to forget the most obvious thing you could be doing. It's the same reason panicking people tend to become useless.

  • Thinking about it, why DID they bring Vegeta along with them to the fight on Babidi's ship? Supreme Kai knew that the Majin Powerup worked by bringing out the inner evil in person, and Vegeta doesn't exactly hide that he's a jerk. Hell, the whole Cell Games Saga is his damn fault because he wanted a good fight, which the Z Fighters should have remembered. The plan should have been to just bring in Goku and Gohan. The two of them would have been able to Curbstomp everyone inside the ship without expending too much energy and then they pimp slap Babidi. Buu never gets released, day is saved, Goku can fight it out with Vegeta now. Everyone lives, everybody's happy, Supreme Kai buries Buu's egg on a moon or something. Instead, they bring the jerk along and are surprised when he sells out for a power up and screws everyone over.
    • My guess is because Vegeta wouldn't be so happy with missing out on an opportunity to get into a fight and even if the other fighters told him not to go, he would have gone anyway since Vegeta is too damn stubborn to listen to other people's warnings (like how he punched Future Trunks in the stomach so he could fight the androids because he didn't want to wait for Goku to help and he wanted to prove he was strong).
    • Plus, wasn't Vegeta supposed to stay at the tournament originally? Goku was all, "We'll take care of it, so just stick around and stuff." but Vegeta would've have it, so he went anyway. You really can't convince him to listen to you, so they more or less just gave up and hope he doesn't screw anything up in the process of coming with them.
      • Vegeta hates losing, and Gohan had already forbidden everyone from turning Super Saiyan because of The Masquerade. Telling him to stay at the tournament amounted to not only telling him to stay out of an epic fight where he can go all-out, but actually telling him to lose to 18, because even as strong as Vegeta is, he can't beat 18 in his base form.
      • I don't think they took Vegeta so much as he came. Remember though that Grand Kai is some combination of a liar or an idiot. He wanted all hands on deck because they were going up against the mightiest warriors in the universe. Remember his reaction to the three of them playing Rock, Paper, Scissors to see who would take on Pui Pui? Pui Pui! Grand Kai just didn't know what monsters the last Saiyans were and probably based every decision he made on the idea that they were at best no stronger than Frieza. Certainly he couldn't fathom the idea that Dabura was at best a threat in one on one combat but not much of a threat to Goku, Vegeta, Gohan, and Piccolo as a group. It's just one more of the cavalcade of fuck ups everybody made in the Buu Saga. That entire saga should just be called "everybody made the worst decision possible every single time".
  • When they were trying to convince everybody to donate their energy to the Spirit Bomb, why didn't Gohan don his Great Saiyaman outfit? The populace isn't going to listen to Son Gohan, because only a handful of people even know who he is. The Great Saiyaman, on the other hand, has instant credibility.
    • Gohan didn't have time to zip back home and don another pair. He probably didn't even have another pair, as we only see him wearing one set, and that got ruined a while back.
  • How did none of the spectators recognize Piccolo when he participated in the tournament? Aside from his father's reign of terror, in the last arc of the original Dragon Ball series he participated in the same tournament wearing the exact same outfit and using a very similar pseudonym, not to mention openly declared himself to be the reincarnation/son of Piccolo Daimao, destroyed the arena, and nearly killed Goku, and his appearance is not exactly forgettable. Yet it never occurred to anybody but the ref that the seven-foot-tall green guy in a turban seemed kind of familiar.
    • The tournament announcer recognized Piccolo and Goku. He was seemingly the only one not riding the Hercule Satan bandwagon. The announcer flat out said he believed all tournaments since the last one in Dragonball to be boring. He remembers the fights with Goku, Tien and the rest of the gang. Everyone else is too busy being enamored with Hercule to remember the old tournaments too much.
  • Babidi says, in his global announcement I think, that his original goal was to rule the universe with Buu at his command, but since Vegeta destroyed his spaceship, he will settle with terrorizing earth. Why doesn't he warp himself and Buu away from earth using the ol' paparapah?
    • Maybe he can't. Maybe he can only warp other people and not himself.
      • He probably can't. He might not even really be warping people to different planets but rather to very good imitations. When he did it to Vegeta he basically just turned up the gravity and put them someplace where they couldn't hurt the ship. It might be no different than the Room of Space and Time. A better question is why not build a new ship, even if he's not smart enough to do it Earth has space tech, and even if it didn't there has got to be some of the Planet Trade Organization floating around that would respond to "either you get a space ship out here right Kami-Now or I send Buu to eliminate the rock your standing on. Hell, the star your orbiting. Everybody in the Buu Saga was lobotomized before it started. That's the only answer that explains every single fuck up. Well except Goku, he was always a moron.
    • For that matter, why doesn't he just look for a spaceship? Yeah, Earth isn't exactly advanced, but it's had experience with alien life, so there's a chance they may have made some sort of interstellar device. Even if they haven't, Babidi would likely know how one works and get humanity to make a spaceship. Killing everyone would only end in Babidi being trapped on Earth until he dies, which will either be when Buu gets sick of him or Earth becoming a wasteland a billion years from now.
      • There is no reason to believe that Babidi has any idea how to build a spaceship. Searching for a ship would have been a decent idea, clearly he knew there were Saiyans on the planet but building a space ship takes knowledge that Babidi was probably lacking. Most average people today couldn't build you a car without at least instructions. Babidi being a wizard is probably worse in that regard than most people. Wizards and scientists are usually treated as opposites and I can certainly understand not learning to make planes if I can fly or how to make guns if I can shoot fireballs. Still he had options such as force the Earthlings to build a ship and failing that send Buu into space or if he thought he could trust Buu have Buu absorb him and travel inside Buu.
    • Babidi is shown to be shortsighted, childish, and prone to doing things that bite him in the ass later. Wouldn't surprise me one bit if he killed every human on earth only to realize after the fact they could have built a ship for him.
  • It's a fairly minor headscratcher, but when things were looking so grim for the entire universe that King Yemma brought back Vegeta, why not throw in Cell for good measure? Granted, he wouldn't be much of a challenge to Buu, but consider this: what they needed most desperately was time to cook up something like fusion or a genki dama. So what better than to use a guy who is very tough to finish off and who got a warehouse full of techniques to keep Buu occupied. I know it's a bit of a stretch, but if the universe is at stake...
    • Vegeta they can plausibly get to cooperate and not cause apocalyptic trouble once the dust clears. Cell... notsomuch.
    • I'm fairly sure we don't want Cell anywhere near this fight. First, Cell is fairly powerful and may have gotten more powerful in the afterlife. (Hey Goku does it twice, clearly being dead doesn't stop you from training.) And we know he gets that silly Zenkai boost. He's nearly as hard to kill as Buu and much smarter. Buu most likely either never kill Cell or best case scenario, eventually get bored of fighting him and find a way to absorb him. If Super Buu's Gottenks, Gohan and Piccolo forms taught us nothing it's that the new personalities have a fair bit of influence on him. The last thing the world needs is Buu with Cell's personality as a major influence or Cell managing to over power Buu and learn his techniques or absorb him. Either way sending Cell to fight Buu had a lot of ways to turn a bad situation worse. Though you could make an very solid argument that Buu was far enough past the Godzillathreshold that you simply throw everything because it's not like there is really anything worse than destroying all reality and maybe Cell would just rule over it forever?
      • A better question would be: Why would Yemma not revive every fighter who took part in the Otherworld tournament and just have them all attack at once? Perhaps the best answer was hinted at by Vegito. It's quality, not quantity. Tossing a bunch of fodder at Buu isn't going to accomplish much, especially if Buu feels like absorbing everything. Even #18 was fodder compared to Buu, and was dispatched effortlessly. But Vegeta just fought Buu in a better match than most could hope to top, and Vegeta likely got the old "Saiyan power boost" he constantly got on Namek due to Buu beating the ever-loving snot out of him before the sacrificial attack.
      • This has been said elsewhere as well but the villains keeping their bodies in hell is anime-only filler. In the manga it's made clear that only the righteous get to keep their bodies and all the villains stay as spirits (looking like puff clouds) for the exact reason of preventing them from training and starting a riot in hell.
      • It's made fairly clear in the anime as well. All the way up until it's proven to be a lie. Based on what we know about power levels and the after life I don't see how the villains wouldn't keep their bodies. In theory at least Kami<King Yemma<King Kai<Early Vegeta. We also know until you get judged your apparently free to do as you will and Grand Kai (if he could. I personally think all the Kais are full of it) nobody in Afterlife could so much as lift a finger to Frieza much less Cell. In Vegeta's case it seems to be hinted that he was willing to let them take his body but they would have had one hell of a time forcing him to do anything.
      • All it takes for the villain to lose their body is Yemma saying they lose it. Refusing to wait in line or causing any other such mischief seems like a one way ticket to reincarnation through hell, rather than heaven. Presumably the kais, being gods, are outside of the process of reincarnation and thus cannot be sent to hell so easily but then again, they are not immortal so maybe not. What seems to make Majin Buu especially dangerous is his ability to exist in the other world without dying in addition to being stronger than the gods, but being created to destroy the universe and all, it is to be expected.
  • Kind of minor but when Fat Buu builds his house, how exactly does he have indoor plumbing? There doesn't seem to be a water source anywhere in the area and Buu doesn't strike me as being....savvy enough to figure out how to build a network of pipes under his house.
  • Haven't seen anyone mention this yet and I'm not sure if it's filler, but after Kid Buu finally dies there is an episode where Fat Buu wanders around town getting into hijinx and being his derpy self. I get that they used the dragon balls to make people forget about Buu's attacks when he was evil to make life easier for him, but wouldn't they still freak out about seeing a giant pink bubble gum monster in a diaper who sounds like Beaker from the Muppets just walking down town? Are the citizens in Dragon Ball just so desensitized to seeing weirdness by now that this sort of thing doesn't phase them?
    • This is a world where dinosaurs that would frighten Tyrannosaurus Rex are alive and well, and where various beasts compete in the widely popular martial arts tournament. Buu stands out, sure, but he isn't an oddity compared to other "normal" thing in the world.
  • It is assumed that Chi Chi and Bulma and Muten Roshi must pay their electrical bills for their house. Why? After all, everyone around them is capable of expunging massive levels of energy, so you'd think that this would be enough to provide them power for time immemorial. Of course, this is never mentioned but assumed, so it might be a moot point. Still, this would mean that they could solve the world energy crisis just by zapping some energy into the wires. You'd think they'd do something useful with all that galaxy-busting energy.
    • We're never really given a reason to think the world of dragon ball is suffering any kind of energy crisis, and the Z fighters kind of prefer to not have a lot of attention on them anyway. Also, Toriyama probably never thought of it, but we've never seen anybody use ki energy like electricity to power a generator or shock somebody or anything like that, so maybe it just can't be used that way.
    • Ki =/= Electricity. They may be two kinds of energy, but not all forms of energy are readily interchangeable; you can't pipe nuclear radiation, for example, through the wires of your house because it works differently. Even if Ki was a type of physical energy, research would have to be done into how to convert it into a usable form. And it's not; we know Ki has properties that disregard the laws of physics, since individuals can sense Ki instantaneously from impossibly-far locations, give it to others from across the universe, and use it to move instantaneously. Converting it would be a tremendous breakthrough (it would mean that anyone could power their homes or recharge their devices with only the power of their living bodies), but it's likely a challenge that would be far too expensive to research and develop for Bulma to save on electrical bills, and no one else in the world would be aware of its existence or know how it works well enough to come up with said technology.
  • This might have just been in the dub but after Kid Buu finally dies Goku and Vegeta go over with Mr. Satan to find the injured Good Buu. Vegeta decides he's going to obliterate him right there, saying he could still be dangerous if he ever gets angry again and produces another Evil Buu. Except, Vegeta was watching when Good Buu fought Kid Buu earlier and Good Buu was getting angry and blowing steam and he didn't produce another evil Buu or anything. So what exactly is Vegeta worried about? I wouldn't mind except it seems like a cheap way to add some arbitrary tension.
    • Fat Buu simply didn't get mad enough. It's not like Goku argues against that so much as he implies that the best answer is training up so they can beat him next time.
    • I chalked it up to Vegeta having a brief period of a panic attack considering all the things he had been through from Buu's initial unleashing to Buu's final defeat. He sees Fat Buu and momentarily assume that he is still like the original Buu in that he's got some bad evil mojo inside of him that's just waiting to be unleashed the next time Fat Buu gets angry enough. He clearly wasn't thinking straight, and who could blame him? He probably didn't want to risk having to go through all that again.
      • Except in the epilogue when Buu goes and gets an Ice Cream he's apparently been told explicitly not to get angry. There doesn't appear to be any reason why he couldn't produce another Evil Buu.
      • It's a bad idea for Buu to get angry even without his evil side, considering the amount of power he has. Even if Buu doesn't have a side that will destroy the entire universe, he can still easily cause enough destruction out of Hot-Blooded rage to turn people against him.
  • This may go under Fridge Logic, but, well, SSJ3. Okay, so when he uses it against Fat Buu, his power gets felt all the way up at Supreme Kai's planet. All well and good except....well, Goku obviously came up with this new form IN the Afterlife right? So it would have been even easier for Supreme Kai to feel the bonkers amount of Ki from SSJ3 there, right? Why wouldn't he go check that out?
    • Maybe he just came up with the theoretical transformation, like how King Kai came up with the Kaio-Ken but never used it, and his fight with Majin Buu is the first time he actually put it to use. Hell, his first transformation took about four minutes and every time after that took only a few seconds.
    • Why would it be easier to sense while he was in the other world? The Kais have a planet they live on that seems to be on the far side of the universe and the Other World is a separate dimension all together. Also Supreme Kai is deeply stupid.
    • Supreme Kai has not been spending his time chilling on that planet but been around fighting Bibidi. So Goku may have caused a stir in otherworld but he was probably too focused elsewhere to notice.

  • Why didn't the kais just ask their co-worker, the God of Destruction, to help deal with Buu?
    • Beers had been napping the whole time, and knowing him he probably would have just killed whoever woke him up out of spite and just gone back to sleep and only deal with Buu when he felt like it, which might not have been for a few more decades or so. Remember this is a guy who decided to kill everyone on Earth because he was shorted on desert cakes. It's not like it would take him more than 5 minutes to take down Buu so there'd be no sense of urgency for him.
    • Actually this is now a huge headscratcher given that Super has revealed that if the kais die, Beerus dies with them. The kais and the God of Destruction have a Kami/Piccolo relationship. It also states that while Beerus is asleep, he more or less relies on Whis to protect the kais and him in turn. It could be that Beerus & Whis simply didn't care because the Old Kai was still trapped in the sword at the time and thus even if Buu killed all the others, Beerus would survive, but I get the impression that he likes to keep at least a couple alive just in case.

  • So did Android 18 go to heaven with her daughter Marron after they were both turned into chocolate by Super Buu, because I didn't see them there. Also, how come the other characters weren't shown in heaven (except for Bulma, Videl, and Chi-Chi).
    • Those three were all looking for Gohan, who they all assumed was dead and likely be hanging around waiting for them. Android 18 and Marron would be in heaven, but would be looking to reunite with Krillin (who is at the Grand Kai's place training). By the same token the rest of the characters would be looking to hook up with their loved ones and wouldn't be free to look for Gohan. As for Bulma as far as she knows Trunks is still alive and Vegeta wouldn't be in Heaven, so she's tagging along for the ride.

  • What is the deal with Fat Buu anyway? The implication seems to be that Fat Buu absorbed the former Supreme Kai so long ago that separating them is impossible. When he pushes out his evil however it doesn't turn into Kid Buu like it should have even if it was a vastly weaker Kid Buu, it pushed out Grey Buu. Who then becomes the dominant half when he reabsorbs his "good" Fat Buu. Who is later rescured creating Kid Buu. What is going on here?
    • Basically, Kid Buu absorbed the Southern Supreme Kai, the strongest one, and became Buff Buu, a much stronger form. However, he then absorbed the Grand Supreme Kai, whose gentle heart and purity were incompatible with Buu's own inner evil. So he turned into Fat Buu, essentially a failed fusion/hodge-podge of Buu and the two Kais, which was smarter than Kid Buu, but weaker than both him and Buff Buu under normal conditions. However, Kid Buu and the Kais didn't simply go away; their influence and being are still in Fat Buu's body. As Fat Buu gets angrier, the gentle influence of the Grand Supreme Kai become more repressed, and the savage influence of his original Buu self gets drawn out more, as well as his strength. Once Buu gets really pissed, he powers up so much his body can't handle it. This is where things start to get complicated, and where we can really only guess or speculate. I'll try to put together a plausible explanation with the available information:
      • Evil Buu is expelled from Fat Buu's body, turning him into Good Buu. Evil Buu is stated to represent all of the evil inside Buu, so logically he should have Kid Buu's essence/soul. However, going by his clothing and his sickly, miserable appearance, he's still being negatively influenced by the Grand Supreme Kai. He essentially has all of the Kid Buu essence/power and a good chunk of the Grand Supreme Kai influence/essence/power. But since the latter is incompatible with the former, he's weaker than Kid Buu. Good Buu, on the other hand, possesses only most of the South Supreme Kai and Grand Supreme Kai power. So Evil Buu is able to defeat and absorb him.
      • Next we get Super Buu, who occurs as a result of Evil Buu and Good Buu fusing. He's made of the same parts as Fat Buu, but is also waaaaaay stronger than both him and Kid Buu. He basically is Fat Buu, except with two big differences: one, the evil influence of Kid Buu overpowers the good influence of the Grabd Supreme Kai, explaining his devious and sadistic personality, and two, he's morphed into a form that can actually use all of the great power stored within him. His intelligence and power come from the two Kais he has absorbed; now that he can tap into their strengths. Both of the Kais, however, have ceased to exist themselves, due to being 'fused' into the one being known as Mister Buu (the fat one who looks like Good Buu, who looks like Fat Buu).
      • Mister Buu is where everything gets really complicated. Note how Super Buu looks just like Kid Buu, and nothing like Evil Buu. The reason for this is the same reason he reverted to Kid Buu instead of Evil Buu: Evil Buu contained most of Kid Buu's essence, while Good Buu contained most of the Kais' essence. Evil Buu was an example of fusing the influences the wrong way; Super Buu is an example of fusing it the right way, just using the Kais as batteries. Buu's body, after Kid Buu's personality became the dominant one in Super Buu, basically auto-corrected this by shoving all of the Kai influence into Good Buu (who I'll call "Mr. Buu" to distinguish him) and purifying Evil Buu of said essence, turning him into Kid Buu again. Kid Buu was the base of Super Buu, while Mister Buu now contained all of the Kai power and influence. When Mister Buu was ripped out, Super Buu lost that power and intelligence, just like when Gohan and the others were removed, and reverted back to Kid Buu, his 'base'.
    • tl;dr: Mister Buu is the one that was ripped out of Super Buu, and Good Buu is the one that was formed when Fat Buu expelled his evil. All of the Buus are varying combinations of Kid Buu (the 100% original Buu), the South Supreme Kai (whose power made Buu much stronger), and the Grand Supreme Kai (whose gentle heart initially made Buu weaker but more intelligent, and had the former weakness ironed out when the evil became dominant).
      • Fat Buu splits into two parts. Evil Buu = Pure Buu + 20% Kais, Good Buu = 80% Kais.
      • The two parts fuse into one being, who can actually tap into the power of all three of his components, both their pure strength and their intelligence. Super Buu = 100% Kais + 100% Kid Buu.
      • Vegeta rips out Mister Buu's pod, and since he is basically the two Supreme Kais merged into Buu form, removing him removes all outside influence on Buu, turning him back into his original, basic form, Kid Buu. Kid Buu = 100% Kid Buu (duh), Mister Buu = 100% Kais.
      • That's all just in order of distribution of influence and essence. In terms of power: Super Buu >>> Kid Buu > Evil Buu > Mister Buu > Good Buu. Fat Buu is theoretically just as strong as Super Buu, but his restraints from the Grand Supreme Kai's gentle heart keeps him from using it.

  • Why can't Mystic/Ultimate Gohan go super saiyan? Surely if the ritual was just a release of all his hidden power, he should then be able to go super saiyan on top of that. I heard that in the original, Old Kai told him not to because the power would be uncontrollable and destroy everything, but I can't seem to find sources to back it up.
    • He can still go Super Saiyan, he does in Battle of Gods. It's probably just weaker than his Mystic/Ultimate form.
      • Or alternatively, he can, but it won't make a difference. He'll just use up valuable ki.
    • Old Kai tells him to try to become a Super Saiyan, which Gohan does and becomes Mystic instead. My understanding has been that the powerup process let Gohan use all his ridiculous amounts of potential without the emotional requirements of being Super Saiyan, since that had never meshed well with his personality.

  • Why is there a whole episode showing Super Buu screaming when Goku and Vegeta are inside him? Literally, the whole episode showed him screaming. I had to just skip the whole episode, and not even consider whether I was missing anything. What the hell?
    • Did you have a Candle Cove experience or something? I don't recall any episodes solely focused on Buu screaming.

  • How is the Pilaf gang still alive? I highly doubt Porunga judged them to be good guys.
    • Porunga might have decided that "good" was defined as anybody other than Bibbiti's men. It's mentioned above that apparently Vegeta fighting Buu after he died magically qualified him as a good guy. Android 17 is also brought back from the dead and while it's hard to gauge his death count he was indiscriminately blowing up cars. I'm sure he had a couple on his tab and had to date done nothing to clean the slate. The only downside to that is it's possible, however unlikely, that Android 17 was simply on the far side of the planet and just plain survived the explosion of Earth. We don't know if he can or can't survive in space and while as a cyborg (he's not a robot with flesh over it like Android 16. He's a person with cybernetic enhancements. Like 18 who's human enough to have a daughter) he shouldn't be able to survive in space it wouldn't shock me if he could.
      • Well, Pilaf and co. may be considered evil, but they are morea threat to themselves than to the world. Cyborg 17 wasn't necessarily evil. Sure, he was a dick, but he wasn't evil like Bibidi, Babidi, etc.
  • How come it took Trunks as long as it did to reveal his Super Saiyan form to Vegeta? Goten revealed it the first time he trained with Gohan, and he had also been told to not use it in front of his mother, but Trunks had no reason to hide it. If he's able to be as relaxed in his Super Saiyan form as he is, he's likely been able to do it for quite some time, so it seems odd that it would never come up in his training with Vegeta until they were getting ready for the Budokai.
    • A number of reasons are plausible. The easiest answer is he's been able to do it so long and with such ease that it never occurred to him that it was something that might interest his father. That combined with Vegeta probably holding back enough that he never forced Trunks to transform and it just never happened. Another possibility is after Gotten first transformed, which mind you was in front of Chichi she likely gave the delinquent speech. Which she went back to Trunks and told him about so he avoided doing it in front of his parents because he thought it was something bad. Finally we don't really know how much time Vegeta and Trunks even spend together, though he's obviously had more formal training than Gotten as evidenced by his ability to fly before him and his ability to actually control his ki blasts given how long it takes Videl to learn to fly that might have been a single weekend of 'okay no boy of mine is going to be pathetic' and not anything indicating regular attention.
  • This one is about Mr Satan. All the way back in Dragonball, in his first appearance, Goku was stated to have a power level of 10, and this was enough to make him bullet proof. Mr Satan has been listed as having a power level of 140 (slightly higher than Roshi's power level)... and yet when Van Zant shot him, he almost died. So, what gives?
    • He might not know how. By standards that don't include the Z Warriors and other freaks and aliens he's super fast and super strong but in DBZ durability is in part based on concentration. Remember the aura around Goku's finger when he and Trunks sword fight, that was a highly concentrated form but they are doing that constantly.
    • Also, unlike Goku, Mr. Satan is a full-blooded human with no knowledge of Ki ability. Being super strong by human standards doesn't make him bullet-proof. It also helps that Zant ambushed him from behind. Oh, and Rule of Drama.
  • Why is it that Fat Buu, who is supposed to be at least 4 times stronger than Super Perfect Cell, has had his body either caved into or pierced by much weaker opponents. He was pierced by Dabura's SPEAR, had his body blown through by Supreme Kai's Energy's Last, had his entire face, along with his body, caved in by Majin Vegeta's admittedly brutal assault on him, forced back by a surprise kick by SSJ Kid Trunks, and his body was blown through by a Super Kamehameha by SSJ3 Goku. Can someone explain?
    • It's simple, he didn't care. In DBZ it's not that your body is hard as rock there are several examples of people getting hurt by letting their guard down. Krillin blasts Vegeta on Namek nearly to death because Vegeta lowered his defense, Vegeta one shots both Trunks and Goku when they don't expect him to attack. So Buu, all of them really, take a lot of damage because as regenerators they just don't care. Also if ki is limited and it appears to be it might make more sense if you can regen to basically put all your ki into offense and ignore defense for the most part. Note we see Buu fly through buildings, tank a point blank kamehameha and go toe to toe with Vegeta for extended periods of time with no visual damage. Presumably because they found it plausible he might vaporize them entirely if they were wasting too much time regenerating.

  • How is it that Vegeta can walk around in public without being recognised? He and Nappa were shown on the news years ago. They blew up an entire town, destroyed helicopters, and wasted battle ships. There's no way you can hand wave that with "smoke and mirrors" and "publicity stunts". How would they explain the dead bodies and the disappearance of love ones (assuming their bodies were completely vaporized)? It doesn't help that he wear outfits similiar to his original saiyan uniform (minus the big shoulder pads).
    • Assuming they also wished everyone back to life, they might have done the same thing they did for Majjin Buu: wish that everyone had forgotten about him.
    • First Vegeta doesn't strike me as the guy who's spending a whole lot of time in public. Bulma is more than rich enough to have things delivered to the house instead of going out to shop and Vegeta can fly. By the time he returns from Namek he can fly faster than any non Z-Warrior can even see. Second they blew up a town even Raditz could catch bullets. So attacking Vegeta is at best a waste of time and at worst suicidal. Finally people in the DBZ universe don't seem to have long memories. In the years between Dragon Ball and the battle with Cell the public at large has completely forgotten about Goku vs Piccolo, believes all the flying around and shooting fireballs is just a special effect. So between those factors it's entirely possible that the people who didn't forget either never come into contact with Vegeta or are simply smart enough to avoid the guy who can rip apart tanks with his bare hands.
    • Also, IIRC, the last time Vegeta was seen on the news was back when he landed on Earth with Nappa. For all they knew, he and Nappa were both defeated/killed by the Z fighters. Those who know better, as the troper above me put it, are wise enough to not tangle with Vegeta.
  • Forget the whole 'Why wasn't Gohan's energy enough for the Spirit Bomb to finish the job on Kid Buu?'-stuff. Why even bother with a spirit bomb? Just teleport Gohan in already and let him do the job by himself. Would've saved a whole lot of trouble.
    • Because everyone caught a literal Spirit Bomb-sized Idiot Ball in that saga. Another thing to consider is that by this point, Akira Toriyama was beyond sick and tired of the series and was just making things up as he went along to get the whole damned thing finished and over with.
    • In-Universe the above is true. Every single character makes the worst possible decision at each and every turn with the possible exception of Buu and that's just because he honestly didn't care. Out of Universe, Akira Toriyama was tired but also his editors and the fans just didn't like Gohan nearly as much as they did Goku and Vegeta. Basically Goku's Plot Armor is far better than Gohan's.
    • Well, there is the possibility that Gohan would just make the same mistake he did with Super Buu and Cell and try torturing Kid Buu, who through a massive Healing Factor and sheer endurance could weaken Gohan enough to absorb him, making him too strong to be killed by a Spirit Bomb. And yeah, Akira was making crap up on the spot but to be fair, he did that through the whole series. It's even on his tropes page.

  • Why are the two Supreme Kais that Buu killed, rather than absorbing them, not still around somewhere? It's already established that for a Kai, being dead barely even qualifies as a nuisance. It just means that you now have a halo. They already live in the Afterlife, so what difference does it make if they're dead? Yet East Supreme Kai acts like West and North are gone forever. It makes no sense.
    • Perhaps Buu had the power to make a Kai Deader Than Dead if he set his mind to it. We only see the two Supreme Kai dying in flashbacks separately, so perhaps Buu managed to destroy their spirit after they physically died to prevent them from just that problem.
    • Or Bibbidi specifically had the power to seal their spirit. Still, it's incredibly odd the kais are killed off for real whereas most protagonists can die several times over and at least still hang around in spirit world. Alternative: After killing them, they immediately gained their halos and were 'finished off' soon after. They do establish Vegeta is at risk of permanently dying, and ceasing existing if Buu kills his spirit.
    • There is little evidence that the Kais are not subject to the same reincarnation cycle as everybody else. It's simply that King Kai outranks Yemma who decides what happens so they make the choice. It's worth noting that no dead Kai ever leaves the heavenly realm and it's possible that they can't, and simply chose to be reincarnated rather than stick around the afterlife. We aren't shown much of it but it looks boring. Boring to the point that I'm amazed Goku didn't give up his body to get back to Earth rather than train endlessly for a fight that really should never have come.

  • How come Babidi doesn't try to mind control Majin Buu? Even Babidi should know that mind control is a more effective method of controlling Buu... plus since the Majin Seal increases the user's power, it'd make conquering the universe even easier. Even if Buu turns out to be immune, he should at least try.
    • He may have simply known he was immune and it never gets mentioned.
      • The last person he tried doing that to rebelled, which made Babidi lose confidence in his ability to mind control others.

  • How can a ruthless demon like Dabura turn into a peaceful loving guy? Shouldn't Heaven drive him insane? Sure he is free from Babadi's spell, but I doubt he has good in him if he's the king of demons.
    • We know so little about Dabura that it's possible he was essentially a good guy. This is a problem with DBZ, people often forget the mythology. Picollo isn't some random Namek, he's literally the devil (or the reincarnation/son of the devil if you prefer. Kami is/was God. The point being Dabura may have just been the King of those work out Oni or something equally benign. We don't know how much evil one must have in their hearts to be Majined either, only that Vegeta's insane pride allowed him to retain mental control.
      • The anime's filler answers that; Dabura *did* go insane, which was channeled by his exagerrated Heel–Face Turn, where he's all about sunshine, lollipops, and rainbows.

  • Before the World Tournament, Gohan insists that He, Vegeta, Goten and Trunks shouldn't go Super Saiyan for risk of people recognizing them from the Cell Games. Fair enough, the ability to transform into a super-powered blonde form is very unique and recognizable. The problem here is that VEGETA went to the Cell Games untransformed and still looks exactly the same. That and he would have been on the news report when he and Nappa invaded the Earth. So if anyone were to recognize him, they should be able to do it regardless of whether he transforms or not. The same goes for Piccolo in both cases as well. So transforming will give away who they are, but not hanging out with two of the most visually identifiable people to be at the Cell Games?
    • As discussed earlier, Vegeta doesn't exactly go out of his way to make himself known to the people at large. To most people he's just this muscular angry man with spiky hair — hardly someone you'd want to fuck with even putting aside the fact that he's a Saiyan. Those that would have recognized him as the Saiyan who attacked Earth would probably have the smarts to not want to tangle with him. As far as Piccolo, the world had mostly forgotten about him so he's just this giant green man with pink things on his arm.

  • When Goku arrived to stop Bulma and the others from asking Shenlong for wishes, how did he know that this one had already granted exactly one wish?
    • Because the dragon tells him. Goku arrives just in time to hear Shenlong say "Tell me your second wish." IIRC, the dub anime even has the first words out of Goku's mouth as "Did he say second wish!? I'm too late!"

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