Line #43 Headscratchers/Disgaea


1	[[WMG:In Disgaea 2, why does summoning the most powerful demon not summon Baal, but Etna?]]
2	* The nails used in the ritual were fake. Crisis averted, I suppose.
3	** But the cutsceen establishes that the failure amounted to setting Etna to level 1.
4	* I think summoning only works within a given world, or else they would have needed a LOT more power. Baal was off somewhere else at the time, so the strongest demon in ''Veldime'' was Etna.
5	* Beacuse Laharl and Etna beat Baal in Disgaea 1, Etna somehow had a higher power level at the moment.
6	* The ritual was, explicitly, to summon "The Strongest Demon in the World" (their caps) -- the world being Veldime and only Veldime.
7	** Later, when they summon "The Strongest Overlord," they summon Zetta (who, story-level-wise, is the strongest). Baal doesn't count as an Overlord, apparently.
8	*** It's possible that Baal is at a level beyond a mere Overlord.
9	*** That's a translation issue. Zetta's title in the Japanese is "Strongest Overlord" not "Badass Overlord"
10
11	[[WMG:Why is Friday MK II (the dark world guide) not named saturday]]
12	* Remember Thursday the robot in Disgaea 1? Thursday + 1 = Friday.
13	** No, her "real" world counter part is named Friday.
14
15	[[WMG: Character Species]]
16	Cut-pasted from a thread that was quickly getting derailed. What are the main characters species? As the tropers above, who discussed how Etna HAS to be a succubus in training...
17	* Etna, Raspberyl, Hanako, Post-La Pucelle Priere (possibly Pram), Seraphine: Succubi.
18	* Valvatorez, Rozalin, Salome: Vampires.
19	* Kyoko, Yukimaru: Ninja class, and since Rozalin's reincarnation's birth mother is from the same Snow Clan, Rozy herself could be one of these?
20	* Asuka: Samurai (hur dur)
21	* Barbara: Heavy Knight (also obvious)
22	* Fenrich: Werewolf, amusingly the only example of such in the series.
23	** Actually, Zeroken from D5 is one too.
24	** Also Usalia from D5 is a "Wererabbit".
25	* Emizel, Hugo: Both outright stated to be Reaper class demons. Emizel more directly resembles a Ghost though.
26	* Fuka: Almost a Prinny, but her self denial keeps her somewhat Human. Possibly the weirdest one to pin down, but the one who gets the most focus on her species in the series!
27	* Taro is a male holstaurus! FridgeLogic at its best here.
28	* Flonne will become a full-regalia Angel class, duh, but I think she would end up looking like Cornet's mom, Cherie. Artina, Sicily, and Lilliel are similarly Angels, with Vulcanus, Virunga, and Pure Flonne as Archangel representatives. Lamington is still the only known Seraph in the multiverse, though the entire cast of Guided Fate Paradox can count as Angels, Fallen Angels, or more powerful versions of either.
29	** [[spoiler: Christo]] is an angel too.
30	* Zetta: Majin. Stella and her father in the Vita release of Disgaea 3 are also stated to be Majin.
31	* Pram: Her true form has the feline trappings of a Nekomata. If the theory about King Drake III being her dad is true, then he is likely an example of a male Nekomata. A blatantly stated example is Disgaea 3's Rutile, who is half-Nekomata.
32	* Alexander: Known as a God of Destruction, this must just be some kind of title, his brother and underlings are of the Raijin class from Makai Kingdom, so he is likely a more attractive version of such.
33	* Babylon: A highly advanced Dragon demon, obviously enough.
34	* Champloo: Makai Chef.
35
36	* Baal: Eldritch Abomination. Final Boss? I guess you could throw Valvoga in there and Desco as an artificially made version in training. They both have some Lovecraftian elements to their designs as well. In that same vein from The Witch and the Hundred Knight, [[spoiler: Metallia is a humanoid magical being created from the remains of a dimension-hopping Eldritch Abomination like Baal, Dark God Niike. The titular Hundred Knight is also revealed to be a fragment of the same]] Dark God's consciousness. It's possible the World Eaters from Soul Nomad also fall under this kind of heading.
37	* Mao's father: Some kind of gigantic sized demon, speculated to look like Mao's Vasa Aergun attack. This seems to highly resemble a supersized version of the Baciel/Rifle Demon class. This likely puts Mao in this category as well.
38	* Vyers, Laharl, Adell, Axel, Mao: Incubi, then.
39	** Don't forget Real Form Tink.
40	** I wish I could.
41	** Most of those are doubtful if you ask me. Adell might be able to pass for an Incubus, but for the rest, just think about this: Adult Succubi are ridiculously curvy, so logically, an adult Incubus would probably have a muscular build, but even Axel looks pretty scrawny. My theory for Laharl and Vyers at least, is that they represent the classic idea of the Devil. Laharl's antennae do look kind of like horns in the right position.
42	*** [[AllThereInTheManual According to the in-game description,]] no one know what a Succubus looks like because [[YourMindMakesItReal their physical forms are tied to what is deemed as most attractive.]] That being said, let's score our incubi candidates:
43	*** Vyers: [[spoiler:managed to score with a human witch, fathered a son with said witch]], and looks handsome to boot. '''[[MemeticMutation Myth confirmed, dood.]]'''
44	*** Laharl: [[spoiler: son of above]], which would have automatically qualified him if not for having [[spoiler:numbed his heart to love due to the grief of losing his mother]].
45	*** Adell: It probably doesn't matter if he ''had'' incubus blood, he turned the switch off a long time ago and it's not going to come back on because it has probably atrophied from lack of use. [[{{Jossed}} Busted.]]
46	*** Wouldn't be so sure of that. Remember how he's able to charm Yukimaru into joining his cause (and talk her out of suicide in the process) with pretty much no effort. He may claim to not like girls, but girls seem to like him just fine.
47	*** Axel: Evidence is circumstantial, but considering his charm and that [[spoiler: his IdiotBall behaviour might be intentional]], this is pretty plausible. Not to mention to lightning bolt brows ''can't'' be natural in anyway. Axel being an incubus may also explain his director's passion for his work.
48	*** Mao: He has hardly any idea how love works, much less ''what it is''. [[spoiler: As a matter of fact, his passion [[ForScience for the scientific method]] and his ability to ''extrude malice into a physical form'']] means that [[InvertedTrope this myth is waaaaay busted.]]
49	*** Champloo: If anything, food ''is'' a good way to generate emotions...
50	*** Look at [[http://disgaea.wikia.com/wiki/Winged tier five.]] I highly doubt there is any accuracy in the above as none of those characters resemble this monster class.
51	*** Anything to do with tiers are titles and simply have nothing to do with species. The species is called Winged.
52	* Then Myao would grow up to be a Nekomata! Gao is already a clear werewolf and Crowdia a pretty good looking tengu.
53	** Marjoly: Old, blonde, in-denial Prism Mage?
54	* Gordon, Jennifer, early-game Kurtis, post-game Almaz, Sapphire, Marona, all Prism Rangers (what? At least Red is playable): puny humans. Ahem.
55	* Killia: Dragonewt.
56	* Red Magnus: Ogre.
57
58	* With the characters of Disgaea 4 specifically pointing out that they're vampires and werewolves, as opposed to JUST demons, it seems to me that before this, most demons were simply "demons" without a specific species attached.
59	** Demons without a specific species are probably the Netherworld equivalent to humans. That's how you get all the human-like fighters and archers and the like. They're "demons", they have pointed ears and live for several thousand years, but they don't have anything particularly special about them after that.
60	*** This probably ties into the long-running background plot point that humans, demons, and angels might be not so different.
61	* I always assumed that the humanoid demons were the result of succubi trips to the human world and are really half demons.
62
63	[[WMG: Power Levels]]
64	Are there even any canonically acceptable Power Levels, or it all depends on who is holding the Hero Ball and who is not? (That's why Laharl obseses over the 'main character' role, I guess.)
65	* Sooo, lets try and clean up our thoughts and conclusions... the Overlord Rank List!
66	** The One: (You know who. The one who makes the Netherworlds be what they are, mentioning his 'name' sends chills down any Overlord's spine.)
67	** Tyrant Baal: (A monster solely designed to be nigh unbeatable, he starts with the highest level of the non-Item World enemies... but he is always defeated. As he can just jump to a new body, that takes him to the top of the list.)
68	** Original Zenon: (Was a few kills short of becoming the same kind of monstrosity as Baal, but managed to avoid such fate by Transmigrating.)
69	*** Zenon didn't actually escape that fate, despite Transmigrating; that's why they still exist as a separate person from [[spoiler: Rozalin]], who should have been their reincarnation. Powerwise, they beat Laharl with little shown effort, and killed 99 Overlords and 1000 Demon Lords in a single night.
70	** Dark God Niike from The Witch and the Hundred Knight: Basically described as a dimension hopping Baal like being in his home game, relevant to the Disgaea verse due to [[spoiler: Metallia's DLC appearance. She is a magical being borne directly from Niike's remains so she can likely be listed here as having powers comparable to his while she is on her swampy power source. Similarly, the Hundred Knight is revealed to be a fragment of Niike's consciousness and may merit a slot here with the other Eldritch Abominations.]]
71	** Gig: Feared as a god of destruction. Even gave Valvatorez trouble.
72	** True form Zetta: (He's the Most Badass Overlord of them all, Badass > Regular, and starts at lvl 2000 where all others start at level 1.)
73	*** Except the Most Strongest Overlord title is self proclaimed.
74	*** In D2, when the party summons the strongest overlord, Zetta shows up.
75	*** Zetta's self proclaimed title in japanese is "Strongest Overlord" not Badass Overlord, so thats why he showed up.
76	*** If the ritual worked by summoning people based on personal claims instead of fitting the terms, fake Zenon would have shown up at the beginning of the game instead of Rozalin.
77	*** Considering Zetta is in his book form when he was summoned, it makes him impossible to be the strongest overlord in that current form. And also this is a comedy-verse that constantly breaks the 4th wall, where your stats can be cut down to half by fighting enemies with big assets, has a bill that overrides you as a main character etc, etc.. so almost anything is possible.
78	*** Ah, then there's no problem with Book Zetta as the strongest overlord.
79	*** I mean his arrogance affecting the summoning by thinking himself as the strongest overlord, and Book Zetta is a wish book. I don't think he's the strongest Overlord, I'm not even sure if theres even a strongest overlord. Considering almost anyone can beat the top tiers of the verse given the situation(1 of them being the main character) and the 4th wall affecting some of it. and NISverse isn't being clear on who's really the strongest. see Laharl>Baal.
80	*** Three things: First, Zetta is accepted to be the strongest power in the cosmos by the ''other'' strongest powers in the cosmos: Pram (who by all rights should be third on this list behind Baal and Zetta), Bablyon (who was the undisputed king of the heap before The One cursed him), Valgoga, etc. Second, if one looks at non-playable appearances, Zetta has the highest level of all the characters. Zenon was 1900, Zetta was 2000, everyone else was lower. Third, in Disgaea 4, embodied Zetta has apparently gone to level ''4000'' as the strongest non-secret boss of the game.
81	*** That doesn't really prove anything, level arguments wont really help much in this case, since Baal who is the strongest boss on the whole franchise with a whooping level of 9999 was beaten in canon by laharl. Zetta is a secret boss, he's not part of the main story line.
82	*** Zetta is just as part of the storyline as Baal. You're not required to beat either of them for the main stoyline. Also, levels are a good way of judging how strong these gods are. I mean, it's not like you're going to fight Baal or Zetta at level 100 are you?
83	** Valvatorez: Considered a WorthyOpponent to Zetta in his de-powered state. May potentially be as powerful as Zenon (or even Baal) in his Tyrant form.
84	** Laharl: (Stated to be equal to Mao in ''Disgaea 3'', he has beaten 2 cameo battles but lost the rest... then again, he shows up at a impossibly high level during ''Disgaea 2''... but he has a couple of pathetic weaknesses which don't seem to bother Mao, so yeah.)
85	*** Laharl's the only character that has actually beaten Baal. so this should be justified.
86	** Mao: (Stated to be about the same as the true Zetta, and has beaten every other character in a cameo battle. So he is a bit above Laharl.)
87	** Etna: (Rumored to be able to take over Laharl's throne if she really wanted to... 'if you're not worth, an '''accident''' may happen', she says. To say that to Laharl's face, she has to be very confident. Less we forget, shows up at an impossibly high level during ''Disgaea 2''.)
88	*** It's canon that Etna's powerful enough to be an Overlord, but is too lazy to make it worth it. Not to mention the power upgrade she gets in Disgaea D2, which most likely puts her on the same level, if not above, Laharl and Mao. She even gets an evility titled The Lone Majin aka The Lone Demon God.
89	** Plenair: (DLC, thus overpowered. Hax speed, which means she dodges everything. Yes... even spoken language. You can't kill what you can't hit... and most probably, her fans will not let you. Of course, ADELL is one of them.)
90	** Majin Hanako: (With just 18 Veldime years, she became so strong that Adell and company were barely able to stand to her. Who knows what will she become if she ever gets Beauty Queen rank like her idol, Etna.)
91	** Pram: (DLC, thus overpowered. Became Overlord when she was a couple years old, in a ''Makai Kingdom'' end, rules over all the cosmos for a million years, undefeated. Then again she was bested by both Adell and Mao, but was weakened on those ocassions.)
92	** Marjoly: (Just above Priere because, while possesing the same raw power, she is 500 levels ahead of her in cameos and is a magic user. Magic > Fists, what with range advantage... Of course, Demon Priere's MegatonPunch and GroinAttack are not to be taken lightly.)
93	** Priere: (Stated to have been restraining herself when she battled Adell, but nothing of the sort agaisnt Mao and Laharl. She lost every cameo battle, but starts at lvl 2000... that means she has a lot of raw power, but can't control it.)
94	** Book Zetta: (Same power as when he was human-shaped, but now has atrocious mobility... how the mighty has fallen. Okay, he can still Invite a building to crash on your head.)
95	** Beryl: (Just above Flonne, because... even if she's a monster-class caster -two terms that don't exactly mix well together- and had to be rescued once, she had her own story mode and is stated to be Mao's rival. Also, as Flonne, too kind to fight at full power.)
96	** Flonne: (How is she not higher? She is stated to be weaker than full Angels, you know... a GENERIC class. She would be about the same as Demon-in-training Almaz. Furthermore, she's too kind to ever fight at full power.)
97	*** She's probably quite a bit stronger now that she's Archangel, and outranks all those full angels.
98	** Adell: (Has beaten the same cameo battles as Laharl, and has a score of two loses and a win agaisnt him. His ability makes him stronger agaisnt people more powerful than him, so that fact has to count for something. Lost to Valvatorez but did however put up a pretty good fight, possibly due to Val's fire weakness. Heavily implied to have TookALevelInBadass majorly by Disgaea 4 as he pretty caused every demon in Veldime excepting Yukimaru, Rozalin, and Fubuki to leave out of fear.)
99	** Rozalin: (She has less experience than her male companion, but ends up about equal to him in the end. Sometimes taps into her 'father's' power reserve, at which times she is just below Mao and his crew. Not knowing her potential makes her lose points and be below Adell.)
100	** Axel: (Had his own story mode, but proven to be a bit weaker than Adell, what with his lame and goofy attitude and the fact that everyone wanted him to stay dead even if he was not. If only he could forget his rock star stunts and fight seriously...)
101
102	* Now for the Puny Humans Rank List! Demon > Human, anywhere, any day. So let's keep on.
103	** Human Priere: Those are Paprika's (and later, the Netherworld's) strongest, sexiest legs... said to be able to bend metal with them, and has a knack of recruiting demons for her game's party a la Nanoha: that is, 'befriending them'.)
104	** Eclair: (DLC, thus powerful. Even if she's inhumanly strong as a Dark Knight she was still beaten by HUMAN Priere. Nonetheless, stronger then everyone else.)
105	** Almaz: (He's build like a male BarrierMaiden, that means he can both give beatings and TAKE them, something that his wife Sapphire cannot match. Becomes a Superhero in some ''Disgaea 3'' ending. He had demon powers infused to him.)
106	** Ash: (Stated to be strong when he was alive, he could defeat an EldritchAbomination even if he was a Phantom. Not having to care about dying puts him this high.)
107	** Sapphire: (AxCrazy princess, she has everything Almaz has minus the Defense stat, albeit a higher aptitude towards magic. Still, below him. No, I am not being sexist. See who is holding the first place?)
108	** Marona: (Even if she is nice and non-violent, she is a powerful necromancer. She was able to beat the Disgaea 1 cast in her game, but later Mao trounced her. That's why she is not higher.)
109	** Kurtis: (Has cyborg implants, thus he is stronger than regular humans, and brains to match Jennifer's. But was beaten twice before dying and became a Prinny...)
110	** Jennifer: (She is the brains of the EDF, but secretly the brawn too. Forgeting her relation with Gordon, she could easily take him down. Again like Flonne and Raspberyl, she's too kind to ever use that power again, that's why she is not higher.)
111	** Gordon: (Skilled with guns, and has attack based specials, but hasn't enough power to use them consistently. He is as much a hero -in his own way- as Almaz, but every skill of his is surpassed by someone else, be it physically or intelectually.)
112
113	* Below even puny humans:
114	** [[ButtMonkey Prinnies]]
115
116	* Everyone else is weaker than the main character of their games, but still stronger than the previous games' cast. If only because they don't change much between their playable appearances...
117	* Any more thoughts? I hope this list does not end like [[Manga/NegimaMagisterNegiMagi Jack Rakan's]] in its level of well... ridiculousness.
118	** Tyrant Baal should be top of the board, considering how it always takes a joint effort of multiple main characters utilising the power of [[strike: friendship]] the ''cosmos'' in order to beat him (see: Disgaea 3, and that wasn't even Baal at full strength!) Agreed though, Full-Power Zetta and True-Awakened Zenon can give him a run for his money. Super Hero Aurum should also go near Mao's level - [[spoiler: remember, that Bad End had Mao using his {{SuperpoweredEvilSide}}!]]
119	*** Laharl did manage to utterly decimate Baal in the [[ExpandedUniverse novels]] though, which should speak volumes about his power level 10 years after Disgaea 1.(He also grew 2 centimeters!)
120	*** [[CanonDisContinuity Novels are not game canon.]] If you accept [[VillainDecay Baal being sued]], you've also got to accept the idea that [[{{Squick}} Flonne can switch genders pretty much at whim.]] Do not want.
121	*** Except Laharl actually did beat Baal in-game and is the only charater in canon to do so. In Disgaea 3 Bonus Battle, Baal said he was recovering from his last battle against Laharl. (Mao's party fighting baal is not canon though)
122	** Laharl and Mao have been said in D3 to be equals, and Pram has compared to Mao being near Zetta's level in his prime. Prier should be a bit higher, or at least higher than Adell as she was holding back during the fight, and wasn't Marjoly still under the effects of a seal when they went to fight her? A post-game Zetta would probably also be a lot weaker since he stopped getting extra mana and probably gave up a whole lot of it for his last stunt.
123	** It's silly to count levels and stats to determine power levels as a whole, especially since they fluctuate between cameos. I mean, Laharl wasn't the best unit in D1, got better in D2, was outclassed in D3, and in LP:r, stat wise, he was just copied from Prier. It doesn't mean much. Not to mention, cameo battles favor the main character.
124	*** Exactly! I mean, in theory, a single Death Kitty could be the one doing all the work while the main characters are sitting there at level 1 or something, cutscenes and species be damned. The only clear thing we can say about power levels, I think, is that The Main Character > Cameos.
125	*** But this list isn't focusing on which character wins a battle. It's focused on actions and what they say. Even though every main character(or at least Larharl) has beaten Baal, he's at top of the list.
126	[[WMG: Ages]]
127	In Disgaea 1, Etna is stated to be in her 1400s, and Laharl 1300 or so. Judging by appearances, the only thing that would make sense is if their growth rate is identical to ours, only 100 times slower. However, in her secret diary, Etna mentions that she was already working at the castle when Laharl was born, and was clearly old enough to have her own opinions and such by then. Does this mean that she was a particularly erudite 1-year-old-equivalent working in the kitchens or something?
128	* If a couple of the "Etna Mode" flashbacks have anything to say, then yes.
129	** In Axel Mode of DHD, Axel is given advice by his infant sibling, so it's not implausible.
130	* It seems that demons age like humans up until a certain point. Laharl listened to and loved his mother very much, and he was aware of her sacrifice for him. Humans have short lifespans, so for Laharl to be aware of what his mother did, he was probably aging like a human child.
131	* And then there's [[spoiler:Adell, who didn't even know that he was a demon.]] The point where each demon stops ageing is probably a mental thing.
132	** See my WMG: perhaps Disgaea demons are as old physically as they are mentally.
133	*** Apparently, ''VisualNovel/DisgaeaInfinite'' mixes this up some; one of the entries states that Netherworld Time runs at about 1/100 the speed of Human World Time, hence why Laharl and Etna look the way they do (and guessing that Celestia runs on the same time frame, Flonne and Lamington being examples as well). Another possible piece of evidence comes from Disgaea 2; Veldime was a human world prior to the curse transforming everyone and everything, hence why Adell and Rozalin look as they do. However, here comes the mix-up: With the Dark Hero Days DLC, we get Majin Hanako, who basically looks like Etna, except that when Hanako went with Etna, it was back to Laharl's Netherworld, which means she should've still looked like her 9 year-old self if we were to follow said entry. Although this probably raises even more questions....
134	*** Majin Hanako is 10 years older as young Hanako sees it, but maybe she's actually translating Netherworld years into Veldime years.
135	* Are we even sure ages are given in Earth years? If the Netherworld was a planet in a tight orbit around a red dwarf star, its years could be pretty short... That said, perhaps we're wrong to think of it in human terms. Humans have a rather short childhood/youth, during which they are dependent and vulnerable, and a much longer and more autonomous adult life, but even in [[RealLife real life]], this is not true for all creatures: mayflies have a very long larval life, spent underwater, and a very short adult life (it's only purpose is reproduction). And dragonflies larvae are pretty fierce predators, even if they are 'juveniles' of their species. So it could very well be that angels and demons keep their young-looking form for much of their life, only turning into their final 'adult' form very late in life. And that long before reaching that final stage, some are already powerful enough to become overlords - the sheer length of time being more than enough to become skilled warriors. So basically, they would be 'juveniles' of their species, but not in the human sense of the term.
136	** In ''VideoGame/Disgaea3AbsenceOfJustice'', the Raspberyl ending states she has a lifespan of 10,108 years, and the same game places biologically adult characters such as Big Star, Salvatore, and Mr Champloo at 2670 or so. My guess is that ImmortalityBeginsAtTwenty. That theory also explains Lamington looking middle-aged at 9000-ish.
137	** So if a demon or angel live in the Netherworld or Celestia [[ImmortalityBeginsAtTwenty Immortality Begins At Twenty Thousand]], and if they live in a human world [[ImmortalityBeginsAtTwenty Immortality Really Begins At Twenty]]?
138	*** The Makai Kingdom Overlords live insanely long; Zetta and King Drake The Third are at least 30,000, and endings imply that millions or billions of years are not implausible. One theory I like: at a certain power level, a demon can simply kick Death's ass and force it to ignore them (unless they're beaten in combat, and thus too weak to keep Death away). Considering Laharl gave (a) Death a thrashing in the original Disgaea...
139
140	[[WMG: Prinny Death]]
141	If a prinny is a human soul sent to the netherworld, what happens when a prinny dies?
142	* They reincarnate again - probably as a Prinny, just like all creatures in the netherworld. Like SouthParks said: "Where was I gonna go, Detroit?"
143	** This has been confirmed in the ''VideoGame/PrinnyCanIReallyBeTheHero'' game.
144	* If you look closely, you'll notice that the Prinnies aren't so much penguins as souls wrapped in penguin suits --literally (take a look at the stitches on their stomachs). "Killing" a prinny just means destroying the suit and leaving the soul to just float around (which, seeing as they're just glowing balls of light when we see them, makes them useless in battle), which is probably why it's always so easy to "revive" them.
145	* This can also be seen at the end of the Red Moon chapter in Disgaea. When the prinnies reincarnate their souls float up and the prinny suit just collapses onto the ground.
146
147	[[WMG: Stronger Enemy Bills]]
148	When you pass this bill, pretty much everything in the universe that you don't control gets leveled up. Why are the senators so against leveling up, and why do they support leveling down?
149	* Because THEIR level is fixed: it doesn't change no matter how many bills you pass.
150	** I might just be forgetting how stuff worked in the earlier games, but in Disgaea 3 the senators ''do'' level up with the bill.
151	*** Because passing the bill means YOU level up faster, allowing you to pass more bills by force.
152
153	[[WMG: Gordon and Jennifer]]
154	* If Jennifer has a degree in "all subjects", why does she have to be the assistant of that moron Gordon? IT would make more sense the other way around.
155	** She ran into the glass ceiling? More realistically, the position of Defender of Earth most likely requires quite a lot of military experience, beyond just a bunch of degrees.
156	** Plus, [[MediumAwareness her class says Sidekick]].
157	** Because it's [[StupidBoss funnier that way]]. Gordon has [[HotBlooded a different kind]] of [[IdiotHero qualification]] anyway.
158	** Series/RemingtonSteele situation, probably: he provides the spectacular levels of [[LargeHam ham]], {{Hot Blooded}}-ness, and [[LanternJawOfJustice manly, square jaw]] while she brings the actual competence.
159	*** She's the brains, he's the brawn.
160	*** But her weapon default is [[GoodOldFisticuffs fists…]]
161	*** Okay, then... he's got the stereotypical hero looks, Jennifer's got everything else (including the beauty, brains, and brawn). ''VisualNovel/DisgaeaInfinite'' even has a wonderful IKnewIt in the form of stating outright in the character bios that "Jennifer is stronger than Gordon".
162	*** I have always been under the impression that while Jennifer is stronger, she still let's Gordon provide the brawn and she provides support. Gordon was clearly shocked going up against the neural-overrided Jennifer meaning that if she did use her Kung Fu skills, she didn't use it often enough for Gordon to notice. And while Gordon's default weapon is a gun, remember that his specials are ATK based and most of them involve him pummeling his targets.
163	*** It's stated in ''VideoGame/{{Disgaea 4\| A Promise Unforgotten}}'', humans by definition are only at about 30% or so power when in a Netherworld. The exception is one that has conviction to the point of being delusional. ''That's'' why the Defender of Earth is effective; and by placing herself "under" Gordon; Jennifer gets that bonus too. (Gordon's pretty good against normal Demons. He unfortunately ran into the Overlord.)
164
165	[[WMG: Rune Knights and Archers in Celestia?]]
166	* Why are they there? I thought that demons weren't allowed in Celestia...
167	** Aren't Rune Knights and Archers two of the character types you need to level in order to unlock Angels? Maybe its just that Angels and their unevolved types are free to hang out in hell if they want. After all, the whole point of the first game (haven't played the others) is that none of the races are all that different.
168	** Most likely, those particular Knights/Archers happen to be Angels, not Demons.
169	*** Celestial Host is likely a military rank, and those guys are lesser ranked angels. It's unlikely that they are demons, as at that point, officially, demons had not entered into Celestia for thousands of years.
170	* In the character bio type thing in Disgaea DS it said that Rune Knights were incredibly honorable and were like Adell when it came to promises. It also said that they could perform 'sword oaths' that were like super heavy duty vows that killed them if they broke it. Not because of the oath, which I'm assuming would be like a major betrayal or something like that if you broke it, but because their nature wouldn't let them break that without dying. No damn clue about the archers though cause I haven't bothered unlocking them to get their bio.
171	** They are flat and good at killing things from afar. This confuses me as well.
172	* Same troper who answered by talking about the bios. I think it might just be a behavior thing instead of a race thing with those two classes. They don't look like most demons. Really they look alot more like angels. Hell I would've guessed they were human except for the pointed ears. Still If the MK's are very good and honorable and look more like angels than demons then can see why they'd allow them to join. Same for the archers. Hope this makes sense...
173	* In Disgaea Infinite, Flonne was able to regain her angel trainee appearance after receiving an angel permit from passing the angel exam. I guess even if you are a demon, as long as you pass the exam, you're considered an angel.
174	* It could also be a question of Title, which as D3 reveals, can change you both physically and mentally. When Mao gets a hero title (even a fake one) he starts acting more heroic. When Almaz gets a demon title, he actually starts growing fangs. These changes are minor though; neither gets any alterations to their stats, and when Flonne became a demon she was basically the same person. So perhaps a well behaved demon could acquire an angelic title, and thus would be for all intents and purposes an angel, despite being the same in every other respect. Maybe a new title is what passing the test gets you.
175	* It's just GameplayAndStorySegregation. There is no mechanical difference between demons and angels, and the rune knights and archer sprites look as angelic as demonic. Since the final chapter takes place in Celestia, the developers probably figured it'd get dull if the players only had one sprite to look at.
176
177	[[WMG: Okay, so Overlord Zenon is known as the "God of all Overlords."]]
178	* However, story-wise, Zetta (the Badass Freakin' Overlord) is stronger than the God. Apparently Badass > God.
179	** It should be noted that Zetta's title is a Badass Freakin' {{Woolseyism}}. In Japanese, he is simply "The Strongest Overlord/Demon King"; which makes (a tiny bit) more sense since even a God among Overlords would have to bow before the strongest guy ever.
180	** We should also remember that this is a more eastern perception of the "god" idea, and almost certainly doesn't have the connotations of omnipotence, total sovereignty, etc. that the western, Abrahamic conception of "God" has. In this case it would simply mean that he's really really strong. And we all know that badass > regular strength any day.
181
182	[[WMG: Why have we only seen one Celestia?]]
183	* We have seen multiple netherworlds and at least 3 human worlds in the nipponichiverse so why have we only seen one single Celestia, it doesn't make sense seeing as how Celestia is supposed to balance out the netherworlds.
184	** As of the release of the Guided Fate Paradox, it's shown that there are in fact multiple Celestia dimensions.
185	** Given that both Laharl's Netherworld and Evil Academy both have a gate leading there, my theory is that Celestia is the largest realm around, with TONS of branching pathways out to other worlds.
186	* Maybe there are technically, multiple Celestias, but since Angels are more inclined to get along they're all permanently linked.
187	* Could there have originally been just one Netherworld, but other human worlds were corrupted just like Veldime? Angels are pretty well behaved, so I can't see them invading other worlds and conquering them. Demons, however, fight like mad over who gets to be Overlord, so I can easily imagine the occasional powerful demon coming in second and saying "Fine, I'll just StartMyOwn Netherworld...[[{{WesternAnimation/Futurama}} with blackjack, and hookers]]"!
188
189	[[WMG: Why doesn't Aurum just switch dimensions?]]
190	* At this point, pretty much everyone knows that they live in a multiverse, especially considering the amount of transfer students going from one Netherworld to another. So why is Aurum obsessed with finding the strongest Overlord at the Evil Academy? Even ignoring other N1 demon protagonists, there's probably a lot more Overlords waiting to get their asses kicked somewhere else.
191	** Note: Aurum had already killed Mao's dad, stated to be the strongest at the Academy, but Mao's dad was holding back, trying not to injure his own son through the Century Killer attack. When Mao ended up flying into a rage at Aurum breaking his word to just teach his father a lesson and attacked him, that was when Aurum got the idea, "If I can't find the strongest Overlord, why not create my own to kill?", hence setting the whole plot into motion.
192
193	[[WMG: There is a major time paradox involved]]
194	In Disgaea Infinity, it reveals how Laharl got put into the bottlemail for Phantom Brave. Thus Disgaea Infinity must take place before Phantom brave.
195	In Phantom Brave Marona doesn't learn how to fight well until the beginning of the game, and appears in Disgaea 3 knowing how. Thus Phantom Brave must take place before Disgaea 3.
196	In Disgaea 3, Flonne is still a fallen angel yet in Disgaea Infinity, Flonne is once again an angel trainee. Thus Disgaea 3 must take place before Phantom Brave.
197	So Disgaea Infinity > Phantom Brave > Disgaea 3 > Disgaea Infnity > Phantom Brave > etc.
198	Is there something I'm missing or did Nippon Ichi really mess up that bad?
199	* IIRC, Flonne is only allowed to wear her angel outfit for the purposes of a test to regain her trainee status; she can't wear it any other time. So she's still a fallen angel in ''VisualNovel/DisgaeaInfinite''.
200	** But she's still ACTING like a fallen angel which is the opposite of her behavior in Infinity.
201	* Also, Flonne seems to have the ability to change freely from fallen angel to archangel (Which at this point is still her angel trainee outfit) in ''VideoGame/{{Disgaea 3\|AbsenceOfJustice}}'''s Raspberyl Mode. Speaking of time paradox, the bottlemail ending is only one ending. One of the other endings is Laharl eating Etna's pudding, which makes her quit, become a Demon Lord, and travel to another Netherworld, [[VideoGame/Disgaea2CursedMemories Veldime]]. And then there's an entry that mentions 1000 Prinnies being sent off in search of the Ultra Dessert, but in ''VideoGame/PrinnyCanIReallyBeTheHero'', Laharl died and became a Prinny and Etna is a Demon Lord. Then again, at the end of the AttractMode trailer, Laharl does say this:
202	-->'''Laharl:''' [[MST3KMantra We shouldn't worry about it too much. This is Disgaea, after all.]]
203	** So there's no concept of time then, everything just kinda goes where it wants to.
204	* If I remember right, it's possible to avoid any lengthy meetings with Mao and Raspberyl completely by just getting the Phantom Brave or Disgaea 2 ends... which, when you think about it, would be considered the canon endings, given that those are the ones that actually happen. After that, Mao and Beryl go home and people move on with their lives - a day in demon time is probably like a few seconds anyway, in the grand scheme of things. Alternatively, Infinite was just a fun way to show how it happened all at once without actually making you run around over years and years worth of time and cameos.
205	** You may be able to avoid them, but it doesn't mean it doesn't happen.
206	* Disgaea Infinite probably takes place before Disgaea 3. At some point in D3 (maybe in Raspberyl Mode), there's a flashback to Raspberyl convincing Mao do some community service; that's the cause of their appearances in Infinite. So the continuity is close to real-life chronological order: 1, Infinite, 2, 3.
207
208	[[WMG: Exclusive Human Class Spells]]
209	It ''seriously'' bothers me that some spells are only learnable/retainable by certain classes. It makes sense for the Monster-type attacks, sure, but if I have a Magic Knight master the Elemental Charge/Anti-Element spells, then reincarnate her as a Witch, she shouldn't just ''forget'' all her progress with those! Same deal with a Beast Master and her monster buffing. It was ''such'' a huge letdown to discover that limitation...
210	** Honestly, all I can think of is that it discourages from making a single "Uber-unit" capable of doing anything, and more tends towards having multiple units for different situations (healing/buffs, attacking, etc...)
211
212	[[WMG: How is it possible to equip multiple pairs of glasses?]]
213	That would be awkward.
214	* Agreed. Though, this question would also extend to how someone can have on multiple pairs of shoes, full armor sets, TooManyBelts, the list goes on.
215
216	[[WMG: Why is Celestia so dependent on D4's Earth?]]
217	So from what we know, most if not all Netherworlds are attached to a Human World, and there is only one known Celestia that connects many Human Worlds and Netherworld. So why is Celestia in so much trouble because ONE human world is being difficult? That Val's Netherworld and Hades is in trouble due to the lack of Fear Energy makes sense, but Celestia would be getting Awe Energy from a lot of places. Only by the human worlds we've seen, we have Marl/Antiphona/La Pucelle world, D1 Earth, Ivoire, Salome/Seedle's human world, Veldime, Haephnes and Drazil, Sapphire/Almaz's world... that's a lot of human worlds! Yet, they keep talking about it's all D4's world's fault. What gives?
218	* Presumably, D4's Human World is one part of a bigger problem. Celestia presumably needs all the awe energy they can get, and as humans advance, their fear and awe goes away from the demons/angels and towards themselves, thus they don't give as much as they used to. Considering how presumably little they get from the increasing number of advanced human worlds, even just one giving nothing would likely be enough to lead to a shortage.
219	* This actually has real-world parallels in oil. Take, for instance, Iran, which has less than 5% of the known global oil supply. We might even be able to get by without Iranian oil. But the stuff is limited enough globally that any news relating to Iran that might impact its ability to deliver on that oil when it counts makes gas prices jump up, and freeing of economic sanctions would make gas prices drop noticeably. The differences, of course, are that oil isn't renewable on a reasonable timescale but is stockpiled underground, whereas awe energy is renewable on a reasonable timescale but only has what is renewed at any given time, and is thus more vulnerable to fluctuations in that renewal (as with real rewnewable energy sources).
220
221	[[WMG: Rozalin's wings?]]
222	* Are Rozalin's wings real, or just part of her dress? And if it's the former, does that mean she could fly if she wanted to?
223	** In the manga, at least, she could indeed use them to fly (they used it to turn a TakeMyHand moment into a FridgeLogic AntiClimax).
224	** According to official art, Rozalin's wings are indeed real.
225
226	[[WMG: Why was everyone so ridiculously afraid of Tyrant Valvatorez?]]
227	* Isn't is kind of strange that he was utterly infamous for being the "[[RedBaron blood-soaked king of carnage and absolute evil]]" despite not being malicious in the slightest? Did no one other than Fenrich (and even then, he was TheMole to begin with) bother actually getting to know the guy?
228	** Once you get "known" for being evil and nefarious and all that, most people don't bother to get to know you and instead start interpreting anything and everything to do as evil and nefarious. Many misconceptions later, and everyone "knows" how evil he is.
229
230	[[WMG: So do we start calling her Artina or Vulcanus?]]
231	* Which name will our angel of Avarice prefer to be called by?
232	** Considering that the name of "Vulcanus" was but a cover, and later games have had her use her actual name, pretty safe bet to say she's gonna prefer to be called Artina.
233
234	[[WMG:"Attack zone height problem."]]
235	* So attack skills that relocate the enemy like Triple Strike and Hurricane Blow can't be used if the destination panel is obstructed by something (another unit, an impassible structure, the lack of a panel); fair. You also can't use them if the destination panel is too high above the target's initial position; also fair. But why can't you use these sorts of skills if the destination panel is too ''low''?
236	** Trying to attack downwards past a certain point, particularly with melee weapons, causes you to lose a LOT of force, especially if you don't want to lose your weapon.
237
238	[[WMG: Why are Mentors called Mentors and Pupils called Pupils?]]
239	* The mentors learn from the pupils. Shouldn't it be the other way around?
240	** Disgaea D2 fixed that up -- now the pupil learns from the Mentor, and Mentors can be assigned many different pupils.
241
242	[[WMG: How do humanoids always win when thrown into your base panel regardless of level or stats?]]
243	* In Disgaea 1, a battle ensues when you throw a monster into your base panel, but if you throw a humanoid in, they'll just kill everyone and destroy it regardless of everyone's level or stats or even how many units you still have on reserve. How does simply being humanoid make you immune to capture?

Context Headscratchers / Disgaea