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** Frank Doyle, the NobleTopEnforcer from the season 4 finale gets a lot of development before being unceremoniously beaten up and tossed on the side of the road as just another KickTheDog moment for his KarmaHoudini boss, when it could have been much more rewarding (and certainly felt like it was being set up) for him to betray his boss to either the team or the cops. Frank being Albert's former partner form his Vegas days and only pretending to beat up and run off the various cheaters over the years could have been a great twist.

to:

** Frank Doyle, the NobleTopEnforcer from the season 4 finale gets a lot of development before being unceremoniously beaten up and tossed on the side of the road as just another KickTheDog moment for his KarmaHoudini boss, when it could have been much more rewarding (and certainly felt like it was being set up) for him to betray his boss to either the team or the cops. Frank being Albert's former partner form from his Vegas days and only pretending to beat up and run off the various cheaters over the years could have been a great twist.
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** HeroAntagonist Lucy Britford with her FoeYay with Mickey and decent amount of professionalism. While the reasons she couldn't come back in the season 6 finale (Creator/IndiraVarma getting pregnant) is a valid case of RealLifeWritesThePlot, that wouldn't have kept her from showing up again in seasons 7 or 8, but she never did.

to:

** HeroAntagonist Lucy Britford with her FoeYay tension with Mickey and decent amount of professionalism. While the reasons she couldn't come back in the season 6 finale (Creator/IndiraVarma getting pregnant) is a valid case of RealLifeWritesThePlot, that wouldn't have kept her from showing up again in seasons 7 or 8, but she never did.
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Propose candidates for Magnificent Bastard on this thread. Also ZCE (and not accurate. Protagonists, evil or not, can qualify for MB if they do enough morally grey actions)


* MagnificentBastard: The main characters don't qualify, because they're the protagonists. However, [[spoiler: Joseph Whittaker-Wright III]] certainly does.
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I've been around the fandom for a while, and I've not once heard this concensus.


* BaseBreakingCharacter: Billy, Emma and Sean all qualify for various sections of the fandom. Billy was often regarded as a whiny brat prone to indulging in {{Wangst}} whom the writers tried to use as a foil to Danny in his new position as leader, but who wasn't nearly as funny or charming as Danny had been when he'd served as Mickey's foil. Emma and Sean were instantly regarded as the [[ReplacementScrappy Replacement Scrappies]] for Danny and Stacey, with people claiming they weren't given enough depth to make them unique or interesting (especially Sean), and especially that Emma and Mickey's relationship was a severe case of StrangledByTheRedString (and again an attempt to mirror the {{UST}} between Mickey and Stacey in the earlier seasons).
* BrokenBase: The first three seasons are generally regarded as the best (both in terms of the quality of the writing and the overall team dynamic), but fans are divided on whether the Season 4 lineup (Danny, Stacey, Ash, Albert, Billy) is better than the Season 5-8 lineup (Mickey, Ash, Albert, Emma, Sean) or vice versa. Arguments for the former cite Billy being a fairly unique character in his own right and the original crew dynamic remaining largely intact (minus Mickey) while allowing a closer look into how Danny fits as a leader after it having been teased a few times in the first 3 seasons. Arguments for the latter cite an overall return to the original dynamic of the first three seasons - with Emma and Sean filling the roles left by Stacey and Danny but with enough uniqueness to make them their own - that Danny's nature as a character meant he couldn't work as a leader of the team and Adrian Lester's return.

to:

* BaseBreakingCharacter: Billy, Emma and Sean all qualify for various sections of the fandom. Billy was often regarded as a whiny brat prone to indulging in {{Wangst}} whom the writers tried to use as a foil to Danny in his new position as leader, but who wasn't nearly as funny or charming as Danny had been when he'd served as Mickey's foil. Emma and Sean were instantly regarded as the [[ReplacementScrappy Replacement Scrappies]] for Danny and Stacey, with people claiming they weren't given enough depth to make them unique or interesting (especially Sean), and especially that Emma and Mickey's relationship was a severe case of StrangledByTheRedString (and again an attempt to mirror the {{UST}} between Mickey and Stacey in the earlier seasons).
seasons). The {{UST}} didn't survive past Season 5, and Emma and Sean were later fleshed out in future episodes (in one case, conning their father).
* BrokenBase: The first three seasons are generally regarded as the best (both in terms of the quality of the writing and the overall team dynamic), but fans Fans are divided on whether the Season 4 lineup (Danny, Stacey, Ash, Albert, Billy) is better than the Season 5-8 lineup (Mickey, Ash, Albert, Emma, Sean) or vice versa. Arguments for the former cite Billy being a fairly unique character in his own right and the original crew dynamic remaining largely intact (minus Mickey) while allowing a closer look into how Danny fits as a leader after it having been teased a few times in the first 3 seasons. Arguments for the latter cite an overall return to the original dynamic of the first three seasons - with Emma and Sean filling the roles left by Stacey and Danny but with enough uniqueness to make them their own - that Danny's nature as a character meant he couldn't work as a leader of the team and Adrian Lester's return.



* ItsTheSameNowItSucks: One of the main criticisms of the series (especially in the later seasons) is that a lot of the episodes follow the same pattern: gang picks a mark, the con gets underway, some kind of complication arises, it looks like everything's gone wrong, turns out (via flashback) they were already prepared for the complication and everything turns out fine by the end. Plus there's often some disagreement within the gang that usually puts the con in danger. While some episodes do subvert this pattern, the fact that a lot of viewers reached a point of LikeYouWouldReallyDoIt with regards to any of the gang suffering serious long-term consequences for their actions meant that the series rapidly lost a lot of its main source of tension.

to:

* ItsTheSameNowItSucks: One of the main criticisms of the series (especially in the later seasons) is that a lot of the episodes follow the same pattern: gang picks a mark, the con gets underway, some kind of complication arises, it looks like everything's gone wrong, turns out (via flashback) they were already prepared for the complication (or they adapt to circumstances, or a disagreement within the gang puts the con in danger) and everything turns out fine by the end. Plus there's often some disagreement within the gang that usually puts the con in danger.end. While some episodes do subvert this pattern, the fact that a lot of viewers reached a point of LikeYouWouldReallyDoIt with regards to any of the gang suffering serious long-term consequences for their actions meant that the series rapidly lost a lot of its main source of tension.



* RescuedFromTheScrappyHeap: Some, although not all, of Emma and Sean's detractors feel that they got some decent CharacterDevelopment in the following seasons, as well as some powerful and emotional DayInTheLimelight's.
* TheyChangedItNowItSucks: A large section of the fans' regard to Season 4. The team dynamic was completely changed with the chaotic Danny now serving as the leader and the rest of the team seeming to merely indulge him rather than actively follow him as a leader like they did under Mickey. [[TheScrappy Plus there was Billy]]. Evidently, the writers seemed to agree as from the start of Season 5, things returned back to something much closer to the first 3 seasons. [[ItsTheSameNowItSucks Though that came with its own set of problems]].

to:

* RescuedFromTheScrappyHeap: Some, although though not all, of Emma and Sean's detractors feel that they got some decent CharacterDevelopment in the following seasons, as well as some powerful and emotional DayInTheLimelight's.
* TheyChangedItNowItSucks: A large section of the fans' regard to Season 4. 4 was very divisive among fans. The team dynamic was completely changed with the chaotic Danny now serving as the leader leader, and the rest of the team seeming to merely indulge him rather than actively follow him as a leader like they did under Mickey. [[TheScrappy Plus there was Billy]].Billy, who didn't stay for very long]]. Evidently, the writers seemed to agree as from the start of Season 5, things returned back to something much closer to the first 3 seasons. [[ItsTheSameNowItSucks Though that came with its own set of problems]].

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* BaseBreakingCharacter: Billy, Emma and Sean all qualify for various sections of the fandom. Billy was often regarded as a whiny brat prone to indulging in {{Wangst}} whom the writers tried to use as a foil to Danny in his new position as leader, but who wasn't nearly as funny or charming as Danny had been when he'd served as Mickey's foil. Emma and Sean were instantly regarded as the [[ReplacementScrappy Replacement Scrappies]] for Danny and Stacey, with people claiming they weren't given enough depth to make them unique or interesting (especially Sean), and especially that Emma and Mickey's relationship was a severe case of StrangledByTheRedString (and again an attempt to mirror the {{UST}} between Mickey and Stacey in the earlier seasons).



* BaseBreakingCharacter: Billy, Emma and Sean all qualify for various sections of the fandom. Billy was often regarded as a whiny brat prone to indulging in {{Wangst}} whom the writers tried to use as a foil to Danny in his new position as leader, but who wasn't nearly as funny or charming as Danny had been when he'd served as Mickey's foil. Emma and Sean were instantly regarded as the [[ReplacementScrappy Replacement Scrappies]] for Danny and Stacey, with people claiming they weren't given enough depth to make them unique or interesting (especially Sean), and especially that Emma and Mickey's relationship was a severe case of StrangledByTheRedString (and again an attempt to mirror the {{UST}} between Mickey and Stacey in the earlier seasons).
** RescuedFromTheScrappyHeap: Some, although not all, of Emma and Sean's detractors feel that they got some decent CharacterDevelopment in the following seasons, as well as some powerful and emotional DayInTheLimelight's.

to:

* BaseBreakingCharacter: Billy, Emma and Sean all qualify for various sections of the fandom. Billy was often regarded as a whiny brat prone to indulging in {{Wangst}} whom the writers tried to use as a foil to Danny in his new position as leader, but who wasn't nearly as funny or charming as Danny had been when he'd served as Mickey's foil. Emma and Sean were instantly regarded as the [[ReplacementScrappy Replacement Scrappies]] for Danny and Stacey, with people claiming they weren't given enough depth to make them unique or interesting (especially Sean), and especially that Emma and Mickey's relationship was a severe case of StrangledByTheRedString (and again an attempt to mirror the {{UST}} between Mickey and Stacey in the earlier seasons).
**
RescuedFromTheScrappyHeap: Some, although not all, of Emma and Sean's detractors feel that they got some decent CharacterDevelopment in the following seasons, as well as some powerful and emotional DayInTheLimelight's.



** HeroAntagonist Lucy Britford with her FoeYay with Mickey and decent amount of professionalism. While the reasons she couldn't come back in the season 6 finale (her performer getting pregnant) is a valid case of RealLifeWritesThePlot, that wouldn't have kept her from showing up again in seasons 7 or 8, but she never did.

to:

** HeroAntagonist Lucy Britford with her FoeYay with Mickey and decent amount of professionalism. While the reasons she couldn't come back in the season 6 finale (her performer (Creator/IndiraVarma getting pregnant) is a valid case of RealLifeWritesThePlot, that wouldn't have kept her from showing up again in seasons 7 or 8, but she never did.
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* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: Alfie's EstablishingCharacterMoment in the season 5 finale. Carlton was explicitly setting up Alfie to draw in Albert's interests for the team, so did he tell Alfie to pretend to be exaggeratedly classist and rude around Albert (notably Alfie doesn't seem quite as unpleasant for the rest fo the episode), or did he just assume that Alfie's personality and views would do that naturally?

to:

* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: Alfie's EstablishingCharacterMoment in the season 5 finale. Carlton was explicitly setting up Alfie to draw in Albert's interests for the team, so did he tell Alfie to pretend to be exaggeratedly classist and rude around Albert (notably Alfie doesn't seem quite as unpleasant for the rest fo of the episode), or did he just assume that Alfie's personality and views would do that naturally?
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: Alfie's EstablishingCharacterMoment in the season 5 finale. Calrton was explicitly setting up Alfie to draw in Albert's interests for the team, so did he tell Alfie to pretend to be exaggeratedly classist and rude around Albert (notably Alfie doesn't seem quite as unpleasant for the rest fo the episode), or did he just assume that Alfie's personality and views would do that naturally?

to:

* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: Alfie's EstablishingCharacterMoment in the season 5 finale. Calrton Carlton was explicitly setting up Alfie to draw in Albert's interests for the team, so did he tell Alfie to pretend to be exaggeratedly classist and rude around Albert (notably Alfie doesn't seem quite as unpleasant for the rest fo the episode), or did he just assume that Alfie's personality and views would do that naturally?
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: Alfie's EstablishingCharacterMoment in the season 5 finale. Calrton was explicitly setting up Alfie to draw in Albert's interests for the team, so did he tell Alfie to pretend to be exaggeratedly classist and rude around Albert (notably Alfie doesn't seem quite as unpleasant for the rest fo the episode), or did he just assume that Alfie's personality and views would do that naturally?

Added: 861

Changed: 200

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* TheScrappy: Billy, Emma and Sean all qualify for various sections of the fandom. Billy was often regarded as a whiny brat prone to indulging in {{Wangst}} whom the writers tried to use as a foil to Danny in his new position as leader, but who wasn't nearly as funny or charming as Danny had been when he'd served as Mickey's foil. Emma and Sean were instantly regarded as the [[ReplacementScrappy Replacement Scrappies]] for Danny and Stacey, with people claiming they weren't given enough depth to make them unique or interesting (especially Sean), and especially that Emma and Mickey's relationship was a severe case of StrangledByTheRedString (and again an attempt to mirror the {{UST}} between Mickey and Stacey in the earlier seasons).

to:

* TheScrappy: BaseBreakingCharacter: Billy, Emma and Sean all qualify for various sections of the fandom. Billy was often regarded as a whiny brat prone to indulging in {{Wangst}} whom the writers tried to use as a foil to Danny in his new position as leader, but who wasn't nearly as funny or charming as Danny had been when he'd served as Mickey's foil. Emma and Sean were instantly regarded as the [[ReplacementScrappy Replacement Scrappies]] for Danny and Stacey, with people claiming they weren't given enough depth to make them unique or interesting (especially Sean), and especially that Emma and Mickey's relationship was a severe case of StrangledByTheRedString (and again an attempt to mirror the {{UST}} between Mickey and Stacey in the earlier seasons).



* TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodCharacter: Lucy Britford. While the reasons she couldn't come back in season 6 are covered under WhatCouldHaveBeen she had interesting, unused, potential to be in the following seasons.

to:

* TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodCharacter: TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodCharacter:
** HeroAntagonist
Lucy Britford. Britford with her FoeYay with Mickey and decent amount of professionalism. While the reasons she couldn't come back in the season 6 are covered under WhatCouldHaveBeen finale (her performer getting pregnant) is a valid case of RealLifeWritesThePlot, that wouldn't have kept her from showing up again in seasons 7 or 8, but she had interesting, unused, potential to be in never did.
** Frank Doyle,
the following seasons.NobleTopEnforcer from the season 4 finale gets a lot of development before being unceremoniously beaten up and tossed on the side of the road as just another KickTheDog moment for his KarmaHoudini boss, when it could have been much more rewarding (and certainly felt like it was being set up) for him to betray his boss to either the team or the cops. Frank being Albert's former partner form his Vegas days and only pretending to beat up and run off the various cheaters over the years could have been a great twist.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* TheScrappy: Billy, Emma and Sean all qualify for various sections of the fandom. Billy was often regarded as a whiny brat prone to indulging in {{Wangst}} whom the writers tried to use as a foil to Danny in his new position as leader, but who wasn't nearly as funny or charming as Danny had been when he'd served as Mickey's foil. Emma and Sean were instantly regarded as the [[ReplacementScrappy Replacement Scrappies]] for Danny and Stacey, with people claiming they weren't given enough depth to make them unique or interesting (especially Shaun), and especially that Emma and Mickey's relationship was a severe case of StrangledByTheRedString (and again an attempt to mirror the {{UST}} between Mickey and Stacey in the earlier seasons).

to:

* TheScrappy: Billy, Emma and Sean all qualify for various sections of the fandom. Billy was often regarded as a whiny brat prone to indulging in {{Wangst}} whom the writers tried to use as a foil to Danny in his new position as leader, but who wasn't nearly as funny or charming as Danny had been when he'd served as Mickey's foil. Emma and Sean were instantly regarded as the [[ReplacementScrappy Replacement Scrappies]] for Danny and Stacey, with people claiming they weren't given enough depth to make them unique or interesting (especially Shaun), Sean), and especially that Emma and Mickey's relationship was a severe case of StrangledByTheRedString (and again an attempt to mirror the {{UST}} between Mickey and Stacey in the earlier seasons).

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