Follow TV Tropes

Following

History YMMV / Batman1989

Go To

OR

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** Jack Napier killing Bruce's parents as opposed to Joe Chill. Some like this change and think it adds [[ItsPersonal a more personal level to the Batman/Joker dynamic]] (Creator/BobKane not only loved the idea, but wished he'd come up with it himself). Others dislike it for effectively turning Batman's arc into a revenge story against one man, as opposed to crime as a whole as symbolized by a faceless mugger.

to:

** Jack Napier killing Bruce's parents as opposed to Joe Chill. Some like this change and think it adds [[ItsPersonal a more personal level to the Batman/Joker dynamic]] (Creator/BobKane not only loved the idea, but wished he'd come up with it himself). Others dislike it for effectively turning Batman's arc into a revenge story against one specific man, as opposed to a crusade against crime as a whole as symbolized by a faceless mugger.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Unnecessary reference to reviewer


** Jack Napier killing Bruce's parents as opposed to Joe Chill. Some like this change and think it adds [[ItsPersonal a more personal level to the Batman/Joker dynamic]] (Creator/BobKane not only loved the idea, but wished he'd come up with it himself). Others, like [[WebVideo/AtopTheFourthWall Linkara]], dislike it for effectively turning Batman's arc into a revenge story against one man, as opposed to crime as a whole as symbolized by a faceless mugger.

to:

** Jack Napier killing Bruce's parents as opposed to Joe Chill. Some like this change and think it adds [[ItsPersonal a more personal level to the Batman/Joker dynamic]] (Creator/BobKane not only loved the idea, but wished he'd come up with it himself). Others, like [[WebVideo/AtopTheFourthWall Linkara]], Others dislike it for effectively turning Batman's arc into a revenge story against one man, as opposed to crime as a whole as symbolized by a faceless mugger.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* AwardSnub: Anton Furst during his acceptance speech chided the [[UsefulNotes/AcademyAward Academy]] for not nominating Creator/JackNicholson's role as The Joker, though he did receive a MediaNotes/GoldenGlobe nomination. Became HilariousInHindsight 19 years later, when Creator/HeathLedger won a posthumous one for the same role in ''Film/TheDarkKnight''. Followed by Creator/JoaquinPhoenix winning Best Actor for ''Film/Joker2019'' 11 years later! For that matter, Music/DannyElfman's score wasn't nominated, nor were any of the songs by Music/{{Prince}}.

to:

* AwardSnub: Anton Furst during his acceptance speech chided the [[UsefulNotes/AcademyAward [[MediaNotes/AcademyAward Academy]] for not nominating Creator/JackNicholson's role as The Joker, though he did receive a MediaNotes/GoldenGlobe nomination. Became HilariousInHindsight 19 years later, when Creator/HeathLedger won a posthumous one for the same role in ''Film/TheDarkKnight''. Followed by Creator/JoaquinPhoenix winning Best Actor for ''Film/Joker2019'' 11 years later! For that matter, Music/DannyElfman's score wasn't nominated, nor were any of the songs by Music/{{Prince}}.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:

Added DiffLines:


!!The Music/{{Prince}} album
* CompleteMonster: "[[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zqaTU5bGx8 Partyman]]": The [[AntagonistTitle titular]] "[[Characters/BatmanFilmSeriesTheJoker Partyman]]" is the mysterious "guest of honor" who hosts a party where hundreds attend. [[BitchInSheepsClothing Pretending to be a comedic, fun-loving host]], it is then revealed he [[TamperingWithFoodAndDrink has been poisoning the drinks]], and watches with sadistic glee as his victims slowly die from the poison.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
all of this is in the text of the film, with jack planning to take over the crime syndicate plainly in his first scene with the mistress, jack clearly slips out of batman's grasp (with bats showing exertion during the grasp and shock when jack slips). i dont think these are valid "what ifs" if the text is as straightforward as this one is.


* AlternativeCharacterInterpretation:
** How much did Joker want to take over from Carl Grissom? While he did kill the man, he seems to have been motivated by {{revenge}}, with him filling his former boss's shoes as an afterthought. On the other hand, some of his comments as Napier seemed to imply that he wanted to be Grissom's successor, which should mean either he was planning a coup or simply expected the aging Grissom to die of natural causes.
** Was Jack Napier (being Mr. Vanity that he was) genuinely reluctant to take over the raid on Axis Chemicals, or was it a SecretTestOfCharacter on Grissom's part (as Napier was clearly suspicious of Grissom [[OOCIsSeriousBusiness asking him to take the job]], and was somehow aware that Grissom had set him up ''over a '''woman'''''), which the crime boss failed by ratting out his "number-one guy"?
** Did Batman drop Napier in to the chemicals because he recognized the man who killed his parents, or did he simply lose his grip? It should be noted that Napier had been holding his bloody face and his gloves were wet.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* AwardSnub: Anton Furst during his acceptance speech chided the [[UsefulNotes/AcademyAward Academy]] for not nominating Creator/JackNicholson's role as The Joker, though he did receive a MediaNotes/GoldenGlobes nomination. Became HilariousInHindsight 19 years later, when Creator/HeathLedger won a posthumous one for the same role in ''Film/TheDarkKnight''. Followed by Creator/JoaquinPhoenix winning Best Actor for ''Film/Joker2019'' 11 years later! For that matter, Music/DannyElfman's score wasn't nominated, nor were any of the songs by Music/{{Prince}}.

to:

* AwardSnub: Anton Furst during his acceptance speech chided the [[UsefulNotes/AcademyAward Academy]] for not nominating Creator/JackNicholson's role as The Joker, though he did receive a MediaNotes/GoldenGlobes MediaNotes/GoldenGlobe nomination. Became HilariousInHindsight 19 years later, when Creator/HeathLedger won a posthumous one for the same role in ''Film/TheDarkKnight''. Followed by Creator/JoaquinPhoenix winning Best Actor for ''Film/Joker2019'' 11 years later! For that matter, Music/DannyElfman's score wasn't nominated, nor were any of the songs by Music/{{Prince}}.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* AwardSnub: Anton Furst during his acceptance speech chided the [[UsefulNotes/AcademyAward Academy]] for not nominating Creator/JackNicholson's role as The Joker. Became HilariousInHindsight 19 years later, when Creator/HeathLedger won a posthumous one for the same role in ''Film/TheDarkKnight''. Followed by Creator/JoaquinPhoenix winning Best Actor for ''Film/Joker2019'' 11 years later! For that matter, Music/DannyElfman's score wasn't nominated, nor were any of the songs by Music/{{Prince}}.

to:

* AwardSnub: Anton Furst during his acceptance speech chided the [[UsefulNotes/AcademyAward Academy]] for not nominating Creator/JackNicholson's role as The Joker.Joker, though he did receive a MediaNotes/GoldenGlobes nomination. Became HilariousInHindsight 19 years later, when Creator/HeathLedger won a posthumous one for the same role in ''Film/TheDarkKnight''. Followed by Creator/JoaquinPhoenix winning Best Actor for ''Film/Joker2019'' 11 years later! For that matter, Music/DannyElfman's score wasn't nominated, nor were any of the songs by Music/{{Prince}}.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Crosswicking

Added DiffLines:

* CommonKnowledge: Despite what many people think, Alfred doesn't just reveal that Bruce Wayne is Batman to Vicki Vale. She managed to figure it out on her own after discovering the article about Bruce's parents being killed in front of him when he was a child. However, he ''does'' let her into the Bat Cave without Bruce's permission, something that Bruce ribs him about in the [[Film/BatmanReturns next movie]].
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** Music/DannyElfman's [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wgpmdqUEQRM legendary theme]], which became instantly influential (see the ''WesternAnimation/BatmanTheAnimatedSeries'' theme). The theme became so iconic that it was even used in the trailers for ''Film/BatmanForever'' and ''Film/BatmanAndRobin'' despite the fact that Elfman did not do the scores for those two films.

to:

** Music/DannyElfman's [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wgpmdqUEQRM legendary theme]], which became instantly influential (see the ''WesternAnimation/BatmanTheAnimatedSeries'' theme). The theme became so iconic that it was even used in the trailers for ''Film/BatmanForever'' and ''Film/BatmanAndRobin'' despite the fact that Elfman did not do the scores for those two films.films, nor was it used in the films themselves.



* CriticalDissonance: With a 72% rating on Rotten Tomatoes, critics have a more divided reaction towards the film. Compare that to audiences who not only made it the second highest grossing film of the year[[note]]behind only ''Film/IndianaJonesAndTheLastCrusade'', and while it lost to ''Last Crusade'' internationally, ''Batman'' actually beat it handily in the domestic North American box office[[/note]], but fondly regard it when it comes to superhero movies and film in general, some even regarding it as a favorite or the definitive Batman/Superhero film!

to:

* CriticalDissonance: With a 72% 76% rating on Rotten Tomatoes, critics have a more divided reaction towards the film. Compare that to audiences who not only made it the second highest grossing film of the year[[note]]behind only ''Film/IndianaJonesAndTheLastCrusade'', and while it lost to ''Last Crusade'' internationally, ''Batman'' actually beat it handily in the domestic North American box office[[/note]], but fondly regard it when it comes to superhero movies and film in general, some even regarding it as a favorite or the definitive Batman/Superhero film!
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** Did Batman drop Napier in to the chemicals because he recognized the man who killed his parents, or did he simply lose his grip? It should be noted that Napier had been holding his bloody face and hid gloves were wet.

to:

** Did Batman drop Napier in to the chemicals because he recognized the man who killed his parents, or did he simply lose his grip? It should be noted that Napier had been holding his bloody face and hid his gloves were wet.

Added: 1014

Removed: 1060

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* OnceOriginalNowCommon:
** The first film was unique and incredibly groundbreaking at the time. Comic book movies, and there weren't that many of them then, had never been so darkly elaborate before. It was also by far the darkest film take on Batman at the time. However, after both the Franchise/DCAnimatedUniverse take on the characters and the [[Film/TheDarkKnightTrilogy Christopher Nolan reboot]] proved to be exceptional adaptations in their own right, while being ''far'' DarkerAndEdgier - to say nothing about superhero movies taking a shift in that direction, too.
** Unlike ''Film/SupermanTheMovie'', this film forgoes showing a proper origin story [[BaitAndSwitch by opening with a family that looks like the Waynes being accosted by thugs before Batman enters and subdues the thugs]], and we get glimpses of the tragic evening that Bruce lost his parents through flashbacks, instead. Today, superhero backstories are more well-known to the point that many forgo featuring their origin stories entirely.



* SeinfeldIsUnfunny:
** The first film was unique and incredibly groundbreaking at the time. Comic book movies, and there weren't that many of them then, had never been so darkly elaborate before. It was also by far the darkest film take on Batman at the time. However, after both the Franchise/DCAnimatedUniverse take on the characters and the [[Film/TheDarkKnightTrilogy Christopher Nolan reboot]] proved to be exceptional adaptations in their own right, ''and'' the lingering bad aftertaste of Schumacher's sequels tainted the series' reputation, it can be harder to appreciate the Burton films for what they were/are.
** Unlike ''Film/SupermanTheMovie'', this film forgoes showing a proper origin story [[BaitAndSwitch by opening with a family that looks like the Waynes being accosted by thugs before Batman enters and subdues the thugs]], and we get glimpses of the tragic evening that Bruce lost his parents through flashbacks, instead. Today, superhero backstories are more well-known to the point that many forgo featuring their origin stories entirely.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

** Did Batman drop Napier in to the chemicals because he recognized the man who killed his parents, or did he simply lose his grip? It should be noted that Napier had been holding his bloody face and hid gloves were wet.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Cool Loser TRS cleanup, has been renamed to Unconvincingly Unpopular Character and is a YMMV audience reaction.


* MisaimedFandom: In an extremely rare case where a ''henchman'' received one, we have Bob the Goon, depicted here almost as Jack Napier's/The Joker's HeterosexualLifePartner and a sort of proto-Harley Quinn. Fans of the movie will often mention how much they love Bob, which is pretty strange as he doesn't do much that's noteworthy and in fact (except for Alicia) is the ''least'' dangerous member of the Joker's gang. It must be the look, as Bob ''does'' look like he could be [[CoolLoser the world's hippest slacker]]. Even portrayer Tracey Walter himself became enamored with the character, remarking in an interview that Bob's enthusiasm really shines through: "He admired what the Joker stood for." As if the Joker were ever anything more than a delusional psychopath, and [[spoiler:Bob is ''[[BadBoss executed]]'' because (or in spite of) his loyalty.]]

to:

* MisaimedFandom: In an extremely rare case where a ''henchman'' received one, we have Bob the Goon, depicted here almost as Jack Napier's/The Joker's HeterosexualLifePartner and a sort of proto-Harley Quinn. Fans of the movie will often mention how much they love Bob, which is pretty strange as he doesn't do much that's noteworthy and in fact (except for Alicia) is the ''least'' dangerous member of the Joker's gang. It must be the look, as Bob ''does'' look like he could be [[CoolLoser the world's hippest slacker]].slacker. Even portrayer Tracey Walter himself became enamored with the character, remarking in an interview that Bob's enthusiasm really shines through: "He admired what the Joker stood for." As if the Joker were ever anything more than a delusional psychopath, and [[spoiler:Bob is ''[[BadBoss executed]]'' because (or in spite of) his loyalty.]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** Creator/PierceBrosnan was also approached for the role of Batman but declined, saying he didn't want to be in a comic-book movie. More than 30 years later he would play the role of ComicBook/DoctorFate (Kent Nelson) in the 2022 film Film/BlackAdam.

to:

** Creator/PierceBrosnan was also approached for the role of Batman but declined, saying he didn't want to be in a comic-book movie. More than 30 years later later, he would play the role of ComicBook/DoctorFate (Kent Nelson) in the 2022 film Film/BlackAdam.''Film/BlackAdam2022''.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** Joker's parade and laughing gas attack, followed by Batman foiling it with the Batwing, which he then flies up above the clouds and rise up against the moon making it look like the Bat-Signal in an iconic MoneyMakingShot.

to:

** Joker's parade and laughing gas attack, followed by Batman foiling it with the Batwing, which he then flies up above the clouds and rise up against the full moon making it look like the Bat-Signal in an iconic MoneyMakingShot.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** Joker's parade and laughing gas attack, followed by Batman foiling it with the Batwing.

to:

** Joker's parade and laughing gas attack, followed by Batman foiling it with the Batwing.Batwing, which he then flies up above the clouds and rise up against the moon making it look like the Bat-Signal in an iconic MoneyMakingShot.

Added: 511

Changed: 8

Removed: 508

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Renamed one trope.


** Let's see, a famous ''Franchise/StarWars'' [[Creator/BillyDeeWilliams cast member]] is cast in a Batman project that so happens to feature ComicBook/TheJoker. Where would we see [[Creator/MarkHamill that]] [[WesternAnimation/BatmanTheAnimatedSeries later?]]

to:

** Let's see, a famous ''Franchise/StarWars'' [[Creator/BillyDeeWilliams cast member]] is cast in a Batman project that so happens to feature ComicBook/TheJoker. Where would we see [[Creator/MarkHamill that]] [[WesternAnimation/BatmanTheAnimatedSeries later?]]later]]?



* HypeBacklash: While the film is not considered to be bad and is still highly respected for its impact on the superhero genre and Franchise/{{Batman}} as a whole, it has received more criticism in recent years from fans over elements such as the RomanticPlotTumor between Bruce and Vicki, the decision to have Batman seemingly kill people (deviating from the ThouShallNotKill rule he had in all comics after his first year of publication) and much of the screen time being dedicated to [[SpotlightStealingSquad The Joker]] instead of Batman, amongst other things. It doesn't help that several decades later, ''Film/TheDarkKnightTrilogy'' and ''Film/{{The Batman|2022}}'' would be released, which have gone on to contest this film's long-standing status as the best live-action Batman film(s), due to being TruerToTheText to the comics (despite their AdaptationalMundanity).

to:

* HypeBacklash: While the film is not considered to be bad and is still highly respected for its impact on the superhero genre and Franchise/{{Batman}} as a whole, it has received more criticism in recent years from fans over elements such as the RomanticPlotTumor between Bruce and Vicki, the decision to have Batman seemingly kill people (deviating from the ThouShallNotKill ThouShaltNotKill rule he had in all comics after his first year of publication) and much of the screen time being dedicated to [[SpotlightStealingSquad The Joker]] instead of Batman, amongst other things. It doesn't help that several decades later, ''Film/TheDarkKnightTrilogy'' and ''Film/{{The Batman|2022}}'' would be released, which have gone on to contest this film's long-standing status as the best live-action Batman film(s), due to being TruerToTheText to the comics (despite their AdaptationalMundanity).



** [[spoiler:Young Jack Napier]], in a flashback. [[spoiler:He even looks like the Joker [[http://i.imgur.com/3ZcbXV6.jpg without any makeup or prosthetics.]]]]

to:

** [[spoiler:Young Jack Napier]], in a flashback. [[spoiler:He even looks like the Joker [[http://i.imgur.com/3ZcbXV6.jpg without any makeup or prosthetics.]]]] prosthetics]].]]



* QuestionableCasting: Creator/MichaelKeaton so thoroughly proved the naysayers wrong that, in hindsight, it's hard to remember just how bizarre it seemed at the time to cast a famously mild, unimposing comedic actor as a grim, Frank Miller-inspired version of Batman. Thousands of fans wrote letters to Creator/WarnerBrothers protesting the choice before the movie's release, and Keaton himself initially thought that his being cast for the part meant that the film would be taking its cues from the TV series.



* WTHCastingAgency: Creator/MichaelKeaton so thoroughly proved the naysayers wrong that, in hindsight, it's hard to remember just how bizarre it seemed at the time to cast a famously mild, unimposing comedic actor as a grim, Frank Miller-inspired version of Batman. Thousands of fans wrote letters to Creator/WarnerBrothers protesting the choice before the movie's release, and Keaton himself initially thought that his being cast for the part meant that the film would be taking its cues from the TV series.

Added: 132

Changed: 150

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:


* MisaimedFandom: In an extremely rare case where a ''henchman'' received one, we have Bob the Goon, depicted here almost as Jack Napier's/The Joker's HeterosexualLifePartner and a sort of proto-Harley Quinn. Fans of the movie will often mention how much they love Bob, which is pretty strange as he doesn't do much that's noteworthy and in fact (except for Alicia) is the ''least'' dangerous member of the Joker's gang. It must be the look, as Bob ''does'' look like he could be [[CoolLoser the world's hippest slacker]]. Even portrayer Tracey Walter himself became enamored with the character, remarking in an interview that Bob's enthusiasm really shines through: "He admired what the Joker stood for." As if the Joker were ever anything more than a delusional psychopath, not to mention that [[spoiler:Bob is ''[[BadBoss executed]]'' because (or in spite of) his loyalty.]]

to:

* MisaimedFandom: In an extremely rare case where a ''henchman'' received one, we have Bob the Goon, depicted here almost as Jack Napier's/The Joker's HeterosexualLifePartner and a sort of proto-Harley Quinn. Fans of the movie will often mention how much they love Bob, which is pretty strange as he doesn't do much that's noteworthy and in fact (except for Alicia) is the ''least'' dangerous member of the Joker's gang. It must be the look, as Bob ''does'' look like he could be [[CoolLoser the world's hippest slacker]]. Even portrayer Tracey Walter himself became enamored with the character, remarking in an interview that Bob's enthusiasm really shines through: "He admired what the Joker stood for." As if the Joker were ever anything more than a delusional psychopath, not to mention that and [[spoiler:Bob is ''[[BadBoss executed]]'' because (or in spite of) his loyalty.]]



* WTHCostumingDepartment: Lawrence, the large, bald individual of the Joker goon squad, wears [[ChristianityIsCatholic a Roman collar]] beneath his jacket.

to:

* WTHCostumingDepartment: WTHCostumingDepartment:
**
Lawrence, the large, bald individual of the Joker goon squad, wears [[ChristianityIsCatholic a Roman collar]] beneath his jacket.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

** There are people who believe "Jack Napier" is the real name of every version of The Joker, due to this movie giving him that name. While some versions [[MythologyGag occasionally use it as an alias]], most continuities prefer to keep [[MysteriousPast his name and history a secret]].
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


*** Later, Creator/LiamNeeson, who played Qui-Gon Jinn in Film/ThePhantomMenace (first movie (1999) of Star Wars Prequel Trilogy), later played Creator/ChristianBale!Bruce Wayne/Batman's mentor and main enemy Ra's Al Ghul in "Batman Begins" (2006), directed by Creator/ChristopherEdwardNolan.

to:

*** Later, Creator/LiamNeeson, who played Qui-Gon Jinn in Film/ThePhantomMenace (first movie (1999) of Star Wars Prequel Trilogy), later played Creator/ChristianBale!Bruce Wayne/Batman's mentor and main enemy Ra's Al Ghul in "Batman Begins" (2006), directed by Creator/ChristopherEdwardNolan.Creator/ChristopherNolan.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

*** Going further, the Batwing seems to use the same targeting system as an X-Wing to hit a target that's only two meters in size. And just like the X-Wing, it doesn't work here either.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* HypeBacklash: While the film is not considered to be bad and is still highly respected for its impact on the superhero genre and Franchise/{{Batman}} as a whole, it has received more criticism in recent years from fans over elements such as the RomanticPlotTumor between Bruce and Vicki, the decision to have Batman seemingly kill people (deviating from the ThouShallNotKill rule he had in all comics after his first year of publication) and much of the screen time being dedicated to [[SpotlightStealingSquad The Joker]] instead of Batman, amongst other things. It doesn't help that several decades later, ''Film/TheDarkKnightTrilogy'' and ''Film/{{The Batman|2022}} would be released, which have gone on to contest this film's long-standing status as the best live-action Batman film(s), due to being TruerToTheText to the comics (despite their AdaptationalMundanity).

to:

* HypeBacklash: While the film is not considered to be bad and is still highly respected for its impact on the superhero genre and Franchise/{{Batman}} as a whole, it has received more criticism in recent years from fans over elements such as the RomanticPlotTumor between Bruce and Vicki, the decision to have Batman seemingly kill people (deviating from the ThouShallNotKill rule he had in all comics after his first year of publication) and much of the screen time being dedicated to [[SpotlightStealingSquad The Joker]] instead of Batman, amongst other things. It doesn't help that several decades later, ''Film/TheDarkKnightTrilogy'' and ''Film/{{The Batman|2022}} Batman|2022}}'' would be released, which have gone on to contest this film's long-standing status as the best live-action Batman film(s), due to being TruerToTheText to the comics (despite their AdaptationalMundanity).

Top