History WMG / UminekoWhenTheyCryOpenOne

* While I wouldn't be surprised if I got Natsuhi or Eva wrong, I'd be surprised if Krauss wasn't Sloth. It has been said (at Wiki/TheOtherWiki, so grain of salt and all that) that "He is an investor, but is unable to carry his plans out to the end, resulting in failures." That strikes me as Sloth. Of course, it could be a smokescreen anyway.

** Dine's 12th is not likely to apply -- R07 passed up the best opportunity to assert it in Red in Ep8, only moments after citing a different one in Red. Very few of Dine's rules have been cited, but this is the one and only one not to be validated in Red Truth ([[http://umineko.wikia.com/wiki/Van_Dine%27s_Commandments full list at the end of this page]].) Any rules that weren't cited at all could hardly be applicable; R07's support for Van Dine wasn't very strong, even his AnthropomorphicPersonification was a KnightInSourArmor toward the SSVD and never made any effort to defend the rules from the critique of other characters.
*** I'd also like to add that Dine's 13th pertained to organized crime, and it was revealed that Rudolf's livelihood was systematic scamming. This doesn't go to say that Rudolf was any kind of murderous criminal. Ep7 showed that he was opposed by nature to killing but not completely; when cornered with inescapable necessity, he could commit to it (whether successfully or not.) [[note]]Besides, Dine's 13th was a bullshit kludge to cover for his lack of insistence on motive; with a secret society or organized mob you have as great a wealth of motives for ''not'' killing as for killing. They're not fucking anarchists, after all.[[/note]]

[[spoiler: Krauss sent Natsuhi to her room to keep her from witnessing what he planned to do, and he managed to kill Rosa before he was disarmed. Krauss was wounded and survived long enough to smear his handprints on the Natsuhi's door while clawing for safety, his accomplice Gohda was killed instantly in the dining room. The bodies were taken to the shed, where Rudolf and Eva argued, with their respective spouses supporting them. Eva shot and killed Kyrie, shot Rudolf and only grazed him (as happened to Eva in Ep7.) When he came to, Eva and Hideyoshi had left and Rudolf saw Beatrice was 'killing' Shannon. Taking her example, he smeared his face with gore and faked his own death until the shed could be re-opened. When the bodies were discovered, Nanjo made an incomplete inspection of Rudolf because he was too occupied with concealing Shannon's condition, and simply assumed from the other corpses that he was also dead. After the shed was relocked, Beatrice and Genji took Rudolf to the study and revealed everything. Rudolf collected a rifle from Kinzo's collection and all remaining ammo, including those from the rifles he left behind. You can figure out how he committed the remaining twilights. Since the game was suspended before midnight, we can't know if Rudolf appeared to Battler to get him out before the bomb went off, we can't know if he succeeded or failed, or if Beatrice had set the bomb without his knowledge.]]

* The problem with a 'designated murderer' is that for Beatrice to pick a winner before they solve the epitaph is counter to her entire roulette gamble. If no one solves it, then she would do as she did in Ep4; throw out the apple of discord in the shape of Kinzo's corpse and watch the free-for-all. [[spoiler: That Krauss even survived that was just dumb luck, because you know he would've been the first one targeted by everyone. After Gohda and Kumasawa fled, Kyrie managed to take Krauss hostage, and perhaps Nanjo and Shannon/Kanon but they may have followed willingly. When they called the cousins to warn them to stay together for their own safety, and get rid of Gohda and Kumasawa for their own safety, Kyrie was the one with the gun. Kyrie was forced to kill Krauss, either because he attempted escape or resistance, and then deemed Nanjo too much a liability to leave alive. This demonstrated Kyrie's eligibility as the successor convincingly enough for Beatrice to reveal herself, and from there Beatrice coached her on how to proceed. When Shannon met with George, she warned him that Kyrie was trying to kill him, and helped fake his death -- he kept up the act when Battler came to look because he assumed he would be an accomplice for Kyrie. Kyrie met with Jessica, Jessica fought back and wounded Kyrie, but Kyrie managed to get the upper hand. Beatrice coached Jessica on what to say to Battler over the phone; when she added that her head would be split the next time he saw her, it was because Kyrie had a rifle pointed at her. The gunshot heard when Kyrie spoke to Battler was actually her gun killing Jessica. Kyrie wasn't killed until after Beatrice failed to get Battler's recognition of 'his sin', when Yasu completely resigned the game, killed everyone remaining and then herself.]]

** That's in EP6. Assuming we can trust anything in a scene that has Jessica as a demon-possessed killer, Kyrie flat-out admitted it to her.

...Is because Studio DEEN cut out almost every instance of Bernkastel appearing or being mentioned. The poems, the TIPs, her birth... nada. This counts as an Anti-Fantasy stance - or at least, an Anti-Witch stance, effectively 'warding' her off. She's currently struggling through the series, but that little detail, along with the AdaptationDecay and AdaptationExpansion, is subconsciously warding her off.

* Does Battler becoming the Endless Sorcerer at the end of EP5 count?

* Interesting. Would explain why she's a fucking psycho in EP1.

* There's a WMG below that says Nanjo was involved in EP3's murders. This would go so well with it.

Think about it. Way back in the first arc, Battler mentioned reading a book called VisualNovel/HigurashiWhenTheyCry right after the first twilight, I believe. And when Beatrice stared him in the face, he had to stop the idea that magic exists, but at the same time, he still had the hope that there was good magic out there, and Rika could apparently use magic. So what's stopping Battler from thinking those two up to help him? However, after he was betrayed by Beatrice, his perception of witches was forever tainted, and those two became flat-out nastier as a result of that. The only reason Ange didn't also become evil was because she had rejected magic, and so didn't really count as a witch.

** You all forgot that there's Meta-Kanon and Meta-Shanon in EP2. And it's also suggested that they remember previous games. Go figure. I think they mirror "each other". And remember that the Siestas didn't have a [[spoiler:known]] vessel when they first appeared; Gaap might be the same.

* Technically speaking, Siestas are furniture of Mariage Sorceriee, so they already are on Battler's side, he just has to summon them. As for the theory itself, it's interesting, and possible, but it goes against the 07th Knox Rule, and it's overdone in general - just doesn't sound like Ryukishi to me. Than again, nobody said that Goldsmith is the killer... If we are to view it from anti-fantasy side, all he did so far was just firing magic lasers and pretending he killed everybody with magic in EP4. Might as well be the same as Beato. But then again Battler being Goldsmith wouldn't change much in that case.

* Then, it would mean there is no culprit in EP5. Or rather, "culprit" in this theory only refers to the killer after the first twilight. But it's actually possible there is a separate culprit for the first twilight, so it's not a problem.

* Well, if we take Battler out of the running, it suddenly makes a whole lot of sense. Going by the stakes' personalities and not by what they're supposed to represent, Gluttony fits Jessica for the most part. Plus, Gaap said in EP5 that she was Jessica's mother - or at least Natsuhi imagined it - explaining the drill hair.

*** Evidence supports he does see everything we see in EP3. After the magical Beato vs. Virgilia fight he becomes distraught again because he doesn't know how to counter it, which is when Virgilia steps in and provides him (and us) with the Schrodinger's Box perspective. He has to ask for specifics on certain incidents because it's all still being seen exactly how we see it...tinted by Beato's magic-colored glasses.

*** Yes, they do. Look at the cover of EP5. It says "When They Cry 4" after "Welcome to Rokkenjima" under the title (in kanji). [[http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20091213081053/umineko/images/d/d1/Uminekoep5l.jpg Here's a pic of EP5's cover.]]

In EP5 Battler states in red that there are always two sides of one truth. While in Ange's point of view Kasumi was killed with magic despite circumstances - which should make this even for a witch impossible in a human's point of view - she and her men were sniped by Amakusa, whose TIPs even state that he was trained as a counter sniper! Too bad, he failed to save Ange from getting shot.

** EP6's Tea Party has Amakusa talking on the phone with Okonogi, and a rather strong implication that Amakusa has got a sniper rifle, and has been ordered to finish off Kasumi and her goons at Rokkenjima...AND kill Ange as her attitude makes her a liability. (Puzzlingly, Okonogi says it's "For world peace".)

* No. It's the other way around. Lambdadelta looks more like the young Takano from the epilogue scene. There's an extra TIPS passage that is Lambdadelta's diary. She existed long before the events of Hinamizawa, being very fickle about her magic. She would only let mortals use her Magic of Certainty if they possessed enough of a drive to accomplish their goals. It functioned so that as long as you were determined, you could never fail. She ran across Takano as a little girl, and Takano wished to become like a God. Lambda granted this wish, and went on her merry way. When Takano grew up, she was able to fulfill her goals with the help of the Magic of Certainty. Hanyuu used her powers to transfer Rika across the Sea of Kakera every time she died in order to try and stop the destruction of her town from occurring. The remnants of Rika that didn't make it (anger, cynicism, and hate) found each other among the Sea and formed Bernkastel. Lambda discovered Bern and [[LoveMakesYouEvil decided to imprison her]] because [[LesYay she apparently fell in love with her the minute they met]].

* You're forgetting, the Red Truth is subjective, only true FromACertainPointOfView. [[color:red:The Red Truths you're referring to regard the physical means of opening the door. Therefore, the idea of using magic to open the door has not been denied by the Red Truth!]]

** Actually, in the first arc, Genji and Kanon also say the extension phone line (the one that can call the other phones on the island) is broken as well. This is why Genji goes directly to Natsuhi first thing in the morning rather than calling, which due to Genji's personality he would most certainly also do. However it's possible that this was also a lie and that the extension phones were working all along, and only the outside lines were cut for real - both in EP1 and EP4, an attempt to call the police IS made (in EP1 it's after Natsuhi gets the creepy call from Maria and knows the inside line is working, but she still can't get through to the outside; in EP4, before he calls Jessica, Krauss also attempts to call the police, to no avail).

** Possibly supported in [[http://img-a.onemanga.com/mangas/00004542/000260202/21.jpg this line from EP3's manga.]]

* Yup, that's what I thought too. I believed that she took Kanon's body so that it could be posed as her own during the 4th twilight, while she escapes unscathed to kill the rest. Just like how in EP4, Kanon's body wasn't found yet he was confirmed dead - I think Shannon took it and disguised it as herself.

* Chapel was indeed never locked as confirmed by Will in Funeral of the Witch in EP7 - "Illusions to illusions. .....The gold truth locks the lock of illusions."

* That explain why the Red truth is, you know... red.

There's no proof for it, and yet, there's none against it. Why are they so interested in Beatrice's game? In EP5, it's shown that they actually care very little for Beatrice. They're interested in the game because they want to see how the new generation of the family, that apparently rose to higher riches, handles the game!

When he recited the KonamiCode all the way back in EP1, he inadvertently gave everyone infinite lives.
* Which version of EP1 does he say it in: Anime, Manga, or VN?

[[WMG:In EP3, Beatrice didn't epically troll Battler; Battler trolled HER!]]

*** Name Yoshiya is later revealed to be false. Also: EP6 Red - 'It has already been said in red that all people can only use their own names. Therefore, the names Erika, Battler, and Kanon can only be used by those people.' And EP8 manga - 'The name Kanon can only be carried by the person himself!'

*** She didn't "find" the solution; it's not so much intuition as it is basically picking the solution designed to hurt Ange the most and having a one in five (four immediate families, plus Yasu and servants) chance of it being right. I'm just saying that since she's going into it blind, the fact that she chose that particular scenario doesn't help or hurt the chances of it being right.

*** You could account for Jessica loving Kanon while being 100% aware of his true nature if she was already in love with Shannon, but even more smitten with her [[{{Bishonen}} pretty-boy role]]. Assume that she knew that was Shannon the first time she looked at Kanon, and she saw someone she was already attracted to that she could now show off to her friends, hold hands with in public, looks dashing in a BadassLongcoat, and his {{Kuudere}} charm sparks some RedOniBlueOni chemistry.

** I think the above troper means not imaginable [[PoisonOakEpilepticTrees in a different way than you understood it.]]

In order to survive [[PlayingWithSyringes Takano]], the cast had to know what was going on. They had to be told, and this was through the [[WaifProphet Rika]] / [[Doppelganger Bernkastel]] connection. There was no "rational" way for them to have that information. If Bernkastel loses, then the one "Good End" dimension of Higurashi will not have happened. And it would be through the [[ScrewDestiny will of man]], which surpasses gods.

# "Magic" and "science" are difficult to distinguish after magic has been explained. One might think of magnetism as magic if you aren't introduced to the principles behind it early enough. Say a wizard explained everything about how to make fireball, right up to what physical law allows for it; you'd probably still think of it as magic, simply because it's too out there for your brain to place into the "science" file folder. In fiction, this becomes a problem. As a result, "fantasy" and "science fiction" are separate by this maxim: "Fantasy is where the impossible is possible and science fiction is where the improbable is probable." Put that in red if you want, I'm to lazy to. The vast majority of things in Umineko are quite impossible. It's fantasy, straight up, but that's not always a bad thing. Science fiction isn't "intelligent" fantasy and fantasy isn't "ignorant" or "unexplained" science fiction. They're two separate genres, not [[{{Pokemon}} evolutionary forms]] of the same thing. Just because the Witches here are well versed in quantum mechanics doesn't mean that their magic doesn't violate the laws of nature. Lots of scientific laws are true in fantasy works, but it's the ones that are clearly violated that make it a fantasy proper. Science fiction (well, good science fiction) rarely violates real world laws, otherwise they may as well be casting a spell to teleport their spaceship.

* While I wouldn't be surprised if I got Natsuhi or Eva wrong, I'd be surprised if Krauss wasn't Sloth. It has been said (at TheOtherWiki, so grain of salt and all that) that "He is an investor, but is unable to carry his plans out to the end, resulting in failures." That strikes me as Sloth. Of course, it could be a smokescreen anyway.

You know, usually, when you hear about someone having died, especially when they're as key to a main character's backstory as Asumu is to Battler's, you usually hear more detail about how it happened. What exactly do we know about Asumu's death except that she died six years ago, prompting Battler to leave? Was she sick? Did she topple off a bridge? [[WomenInRefrigerators Get locked in her own fridge?]] The narrator's holding out on us. I think perhaps the wording "died" instead of "was killed" is supposed to imply that none of the main characters thinks it was murder, but that doesn't mean it wasn't. There are plenty of ways to kill people that make it look like an accident. We already know that Kyrie harbored a lot of resentment against Asumu - she certainly had long-term motive, even if we don't know what would actually trigger her to suddenly do it twelve years after Battler was born. Perhaps instead of cursing Asumu, as Kyrie suggests in the third arc, instead, she gave fate a little...push.

* [[spoiler:Genji wasn't lying. He only said that lock to the chapel is special and master key doesn't work on it and that key to the chapel is missing from key box. Which is true. Also, remember that: 1.Rosa is an accomplice and Genji is one of culprits in this episode so Genji might be telling her how to act. 2.Scenes not seen by Battler are not to be believed.]]