History WMG / ASongOfIceAndFirePartII

[[WMG: Tommen Baratheon will die early on in TWoW, setting of a new War of (Insert Number Here) Kings.]]

* A BigBadDuumvirate, though this seems unlikely as Littlefinger has more to lose than gain from doing this- House Bolton's luck appears to be running short, with enemies on all sides. Alternatively, Roose will propose this and Littlefinger [[KickTheSonOfABitch will refuse, leaving him to die]].

Everyone seems to think that she's going to eventually be his downfall, but maybe she'll end up being his evil accomplice, either a DarkChick or an odd sort of [[TheDragon Dragon]] once her CorruptTheCutie process is complete. The characters always develop in surprising ways, and Sansa turning into a competent ManipulativeBitch--or even a [[MagnificentBitch magnificent]] one--would be at least as surprising as a sword-wielding "for the North!" moment, while still being more in character.

* One other thing: the Starks have essentially lost their FatalFlaw of HonorBeforeReason. They've shifted from LawfulGood to ChaoticGood.

[[WMG: Whoever wins the Iron Throne will be a Tyrell.]]
Or, failing that, the person who does take the Iron Throne - consensus seems to be that Jon or Dany are the most likely at the end - will marry a Tyrell. Why? Well, Stark = York and Lannister = Lancaster, and this troper thinks that Tyrell = Tudor. The Tyrells' rose sigil looks very much like the Tudor rose in design, and one of the actual Tudor colors was green (the other being white; red and white is a common misconception because of the rose; the red and white symbolized the joining of White Rose York and Red Rose Lancaster). The Tyrells' colors are green and gold. The head of the Tyrell family is also Lord of the Marches - the Tudors were Welsh, Welsh Marches, anyone? Lastly, Margaery Tyrell's story has quite a few parallels to Anne Boleyn's, and Anne Boleyn's rise and fall is one of the better-known events in the Tudor era. Which also makes the fact that Natalie Dormer plays Margaery, and was also Anne Boleyn on Series/TheTudors, a nice CastingGag.
* Going with the Margaery/Anne Boleyn parallel, and the fact that if Jon is a Targaryen he binds two royal houses together in his blood (which Henry VII did not do; he married the York heiress but it was his sons who carried both York and Lancaster blood) it's possible that Jon will marry Margaery.
* Henry Tudor was technically a Lancastrian, though; his mother, Margaret Beaufort, was the great-granddaughter of John of Gaunt. The seeds of the War of the Roses were first planted when John's son, Henry Bolingbroke, overthrew his cousin, Richard II, and became Henry IV. The Lancasters were eventually deposed, though, because Henry VI was crazy and his wife, Margaret of Anjou, could have given LadyMacbeth lessons in ruthlessness. I don't know if GRRM knows it, but when Henry Tudor went to war with Richard III, Henry fought under the banner of the dragon (the symbol of Wales) and Richard under the banner of the white boar.
* OP here. Yes, I know that Henry Tudor was technically a Lancastrian through his mother, but Margaret Beaufort was of a secondary line, the descendent of John of Gaunt's legitimized bastards. So he wasn't a member of the primary line, he was the only living claimant the Lancasters had left. Besides, it wouldn't be an entirely direct parallel - Cersei reads like an evil caricature of Elizabeth Woodville in some ways, and Robert like an extreme caricature of Edward IV in his later years. It's why I'm very concerned that Tommen will suffer a Prince in the Tower sort of fate.
** Oh, Robert is so strikingly like Edward IV it ''had'' to have been deliberate. Both were both very tall, muscular and handsome as young men; excellent military commanders, and didn't get along well with their brothers. They both got fat as they aged and were succeeded by twelve-year-olds. Cersei also has a bit of Margaret of Anjou and Lucrezia Borgia in her. Nevertheless, despite that York and Lancaster sound similar to Stark and Lannister, the Yorkists and Lancastrians have more direct textual parallels in the Baratheons and the Targaryens with the Blackfyres being legitimized bastards. If Martin plans to end the series like the War of the Roses did, then the logical end would be for a surviving Blackfyre male to marry a Baratheon female. But I don't think it's going to be that exact.
*** Tommen suffering a murderous fate is almost written in stone.
* Not to mention the TV parallels Margaery Tyrell is played by Natalie Dormer who also played Anne Boleyn.
* Would that make Stannis Baratheon the Richard the Third of Westeros?
** This comparison is common enough to have made wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_depictions_of_Richard_III_of_England

[[WMG: At the end of the series, the Stark in Winterfell will be... Jeyne Poole, pretending to be Arya.]]
What could be more appropriate, in a series that places so much emphasis on mutable identities and the utter silliness of the medieval obsession with noble heritage, than ending up with the Stark lineage carried on by someone who we, the readers, know isn't a Stark at all? (Warning: this is going to be a long one.)
In one of the preview chapters of ''Winds'', we see that [[spoiler: Jeyne has continued to lay claim to her 'Arya' identity even when released from the Boltons' captivity]]. The other candidates for the job, while by no means ruled out at this stage, all have a plausible reason why they might not lay claim to Winterfell. Arya herself is in the process of abandoning her own identity; Sansa may never feel it's safe to drop the 'Alayne Stone' persona; Bran's up in the far, far north, surrounded by hostile Others, and seems unlikely to return south of the Wall even if he survives ''Winds'' and ''Dream''; Rickon's likely to have gone half-feral after spending so long on an island of cannibals and sharing his mind with a wolf throughout his formative years; and [[spoiler: Jon is dead, a bastard at any rate, and likely to have more important prophecy-related business than sorting out the succession in Winterfell even if he comes back]].
Who else could identify Jeyne as a fake? Theon, but he has no reason to- in fact, he's been the number one supporter of Jeyne keeping up the pretense of being Arya, [[spoiler: a pattern he continues in the Winds preview chapter.]] Lady Stoneheart could, assuming she's still mentally capable of such, but she's down in the Riverlands and unlikely to ever meet the girl passing herself off as her daughter. Littlefinger, Varys and Tyrion could, but none would have any objection to a fake Stark assuming it figured into their plans somehow (and, seriously, does anyone believe Littlefinger in particular is going to make it to the end of ''Dream''?) Finally, there's Roose and Ramsay, both of whom are going to be ''incredibly'' dead by the end of the series. As cruel as GRRM is to his heroes, he does have a way of making sure his villains get their just desserts, too. Perhaps it's a bit of a stretch that none of these characters would spill the beans, but thematically it'd be perfect for the series, fitting in with the recurring message that it's not who you are that counts but who you can convince other people you are, or who other people say you are. Plus, hey, the girl could use ''some'' good luck after everything she's been through.
** More likely she'll die before meeting Jon and it will be thought Arya is dead. Then the real Arya may return.
** Somehow this doesn't feel right. Also, Sansa will eventually drop the pretense, that is Littlefinger's plan, and I doubt she will permanently stay as Alayne.

[[WMG: The series will end with three kingdoms.]]
The Lannisters are doomed. Sorry Tommen, but its true. The magic is coming back, and they're the only faction that has none of it on their side. They'll probably be wiped out by the end of book six to clear the board for the serious players. Dany will invade before Stannis can move South, securing King's Landing promptly. This will leave Stannis with a serious dilemma: he can legitimately say that Joffrey and Tommen had no claim to the throne, but Dany does have a valid claim. At the same time, though, I doubt he's going to lay down his armies, and as the magic comes back, Melisandre is going to gain access to increasingly kick-ass magic, and Dany will realize that, even with her dragons, she could potentially lose...around this time the Wall will come down, forcing the Night's Watch and the Wildlings into a hopeless battle against the forces of Darkness, but Stannis and Dany, determined to protect their people, abandon their own squabbling (something no other leader in the series was prepared to do) to protect the people. After the battle is over, Dany makes a propositions: technically, the North declared itself independent, but no longer has a legitimate King (all the Starks remain in hiding, or have taken the black, or just have no desire to rule)...so, she offers Stannis the North, and he promptly accepts. The Wildlings at this point have come to see the Nights Watch as their leaders, due to their valiance in battle, and Stannis proposes that the gift, and the lands that were once North of the wall be merged into a single, new kingdom, and that the position of Lord Commander and King Beyond the Wall be merged, and the Nights Watch take on the role of that kingdom's knights. Thus, Jon Snow becomes the first King of the Gift.
** While you're probably right, I'm not going to be 100% sure that the Lannisters aren't involved in anything magical until we finally see Casterly Rock. Yes, Jaime's dream about something ominous and terrible lurking under it are probably just dreams or metaphors, but still worth looking into.
** Due to Qyburn's love of Mary Shelley, the Lannister now have some magic to them. I'm sure that could in no way turn out wrong.

[[WMG: The series will end with the formation of new Seven Kingdoms]]
1. Dany will decide that the east is her home and won't return to Westeros. She will be The Queen in the East. However, wanting to prevent further war in Westeros, she will ask them to establish six other kingdoms. Tyrion will be the one bringing her message to Westeros.
2. Stannis will admit that Dany's claim is stronger than his and agree to rule Baratheon lands.
3. Bran will rebuild Winterfell and become The King in The North.
4. Bronn will be the fourth king because he seems to be good at gaining more power. He will make peace with Tyrion, who will be his Hand.
5. Littlefinger will be the fifth king because he can.
6. The sixth king will be The King beyond the Wall.
7. I'm not sure who number 7 will be, but Asha Greyjoy seems like a likely candidate.

[[WMG: The series will end with a DistantEpilogue, featuring life in a modern-day King's Landing.]]
1000 years after the epic tale, we'll see that [[ShaggyDogStory almost everything built up by our protagonists was either broken down or made moot]]. Dragons are fully domesticated, and have been bred into fat, stupid animals akin to turkeys. Magic is used so extensively, it more or less [[SufficientlyAnalyzedMagic replaces modern technology]]. The Others are now classified as an endangered species, and their ways are fully understood. The Old and New Gods have given way to Rh'llor, but a much more mellow and secular version of the worship we're seeing now. The Faceless Men, Nights' Watch, Brotherhood Without Banners, and other such groups have been demolished or faded away (save for the Brotherhood, which is now more or less a men's club). The wildlings have faded away (perhaps, save for small reservations?), and the great families have all lost their meaning. Winter and summer can be accurately predicted, or even controlled. [[ZeppelinsFromAnotherWorld Airships]] sail back and forth across the Wall, and the glorious Red Keep is a weathered ruin upon a hill, only kept as a small museum, in which an [[FutureImperfect extremly fractured version]] of the story is related to bored museum-goers.
* [[ComicallyMissingThePoint Why would the museum-goers be bored?]] The story would probably still be pretty interesting even in fractured form. Besides which, why would people who find the story boring go to the museum? Wouldn't the museum-goers self-select for those who find the story interesting?
** To them, the story is quite literally ancient history, and most likely eclipsed by "future" events. They'd be bored for the same reasons some visitors to modern-day museums get bored.
*** Not everyone thinks ancient history is as boring as you seem to. I prefer reading of the Mongol/Roman/Persian etc. Empires to last weeks news or 20th century history. I'm confident that your average visitor to an ancient history exhibition would agree.

* As the camera pans the parking lot on the approach we can see the license plates proclaim "REPUBLIC BICENTENNIAL" across the bottom. On the tour we see the Iron Throne gathering dust behind velvet ropes...

[[WMG: The whole series will end up being one massive ShootTheShaggyDog...]]
* Because even if the Others and their wights are turned back, even with Dany and her dragons' issue is finally settled, even if everyone plotting and scheming and murdering and burning and avenging and destroying ends up settled, done, backstabbed, frontstabbed, sidestabbed, and stabbed from every other angle, and there is someone or a few someones still left standing who 'win'...it doesn't matter, because WINTER IS STILL COMING, a long long winter due to how long the summer was, and all the crops and livestock and foodstores and items needed to survive have been destroyed due to all the people playing the game of thrones and their grudges out while all their men rampaged around the continent putting everything mindlessly to the sword, and the survivors will just end up starving and freezing to death, leaving a dead land with just the animals wandering around. Like the Music/BlueOysterCult sang, history shows again and again how nature points out the folly of man.
** If true, this would give a particularly bleak twist to the phrase "A Dream of Spring". It seems to be usually assumed it's either a HappilyEverAfter (or at least, as close to one as one could expect in the [=ASoIaFverse=]) or some kind of mildly optimistic AfterTheEnd à la Matrix Revolutions, that is, "yay, spring is here, no more Others, hallelujah", but it may simply turn out to be that everyone is dying because of the freak winter and can only ever ''dream'' of spring. Way to turn an already CrapsackWorld UpToEleven.

[[WMG:The whole thing ends in a peasant revolt]]
Seriously, how can it ''not''? The Westerosi are used to putting up with shit...but ''this'' much shit? War in the middle of a long winter, using up more food than strictly necessary (armies get hungrier than civilians, since active soldiers need more energy than holed-up farmers), and over what? Plus raising gigantic armies, potentially giving weapons and military training to commoners who would never have otherwise had either. And what are they fighting about? Who gets to be ''king''? That's probably enough to make anyone say "That does it! I'm sick of kings!" and revolt.
* I don't think it's very usual for civil wars to cause revolts (the other way around is of course a different matter). Wars are times when autocracies come into their own -- would introducing a young, fragile democracy in the middle of a war end it, or just make your side more likely to lose to the guy with an iron grip over his armies? And once the war ''ends'', the reigning monarch is the hero who saved us all from civil war, so he's got plenty of political capital to play with. Peasant revolts tend to come from long periods of misrule by a single regime on which all the blame can be easily piled (hence Cersei/Joffrey nearly causing one in KL).
** To some degree, I see the point, but that may just delay the inevitable to the new king's successor. This also assumes there'll be one new king, and not three or five or seven or more; there's no reason to assume that the winter won't force a stalemate. In that case, the civil war will be ongoing and you'll have cruelty and rot where the Lannisters and Boltons rule, at a minimum, plus other chaos elsewhere.

[[WMG: By the end of the series, Rickon will be the Stark in Winterfell.]]
If Stannis wins the castle back, things can work out quite easily, since Davos is Stannis's man and he's been sent to retrieve him. It's likely no other Starks will ever see Winterfell again.
* Ned is [[spoiler: dead.]]
* Catelyn is [[spoiler: somewhat dead.]]
* Robb is [[spoiler: super dead.]]
* Sansa is [[spoiler: set to take over the Vale.]]
* Bran is [[spoiler: a tree.]]
* Arya is [[spoiler: no longer a Stark.]]
* Jon is [[spoiler: on the wall, dead, and not a Stark anyway.]]

** Got to question a couple of those:
*** Arya refused to throw away Needle, and secretly revels in her wolf dreams. She's hiding it well enough for now, but she's still Arya Stark. No way is she going to stay the course, though she will probably learn a lot of tricks before she quits/gets kicked out.
*** I have trouble believing that about Jon. I don't know whether he'll [[spoiler:survive his injuries or be raised by Melisandre]], but that scene is ''way'' too reminiscent of Theon at the sack of Winterfell, Asha in the fight in the woods, Brienne in the fight with the 'Hound', Arya at the Twins. There's probably more. Quentyn Martell is the nearest thing to an exception, but even he [[spoiler:didn't actually die ''in that scene'']]. People have [[spoiler:died in their [=POV=], but there's a ton where they're implied to be dead and turn up later, and the way it faded out, dwelling on the last thing he saw/felt as he lost consciousness, is far more in line with the not-dead scenes]]. ''And'' he was legitimised by Robb, offered it again by Stannis, and there's kings all over the place who could potentially do it a third time.

[[WMG: The Seven Kingdoms will break up, at least temporarily]]
The High Septon will overthrow Cersei and Tommen, possibly by declaring that Tommen ''is'' a bastard. This will be a fatal mistake.
* '''The Iron Islands:''' The Iron Islands are still in open rebellion, and have no desire to bend the knee. The only one who could force them to do so is Daenerys Targaryen.
* '''The Westerlands:''' Without Tommen on the throne, Jaime will have no reason at all to be loyal to King's Landing. He will become the Lord of Casterly Rock, and will likely circle the wagons in hopes of survival. If Tommen and Cersei are dead, he may well declare himself King on the Rock.
* '''The North:''' The North is a powder keg already. Between Stannis, Melisandre, Lord Manderly, and the surviving Starks, the Boltons' hold on the North is doomed. And once the Boltons go, the Reeds will ensure that no one can send in reinforcements. The North probably won't get very involved in the southern war, due to a rather pressing need to fight the Others.
* '''The Vale:''' Petyr Baelish and Sansa Stark are poised to take control. And there really isn't an army left in Westeros that could take the Vale by force.
* '''The Riverlands:''' The Freys' control is so weak that the Riverlands will likely collapse into a series of independent lords. Especially if and when the Brotherhood takes out the Twins. The Tullys could eventually pull a comeback.
* '''The Reach:''' Euron will take Highgarden, and probably kill as many Tyrells as possible. If he manages to purge the house, the Reach will probably unite under the Hightowers (especially as we have Sam in Oldtown to serve as our [=POV=]).
* '''The Stormlands:''' Already falling to Aegon VI.
* '''Dorne:''' Will likely back Aegon.

If this happens, then it is unlikely that Aegon will be able to unite the Seven Kingdoms again. Dany could, with her dragons. But even if Aegon takes King's Landing, he'll only have the Crownlands, the Stormlands, and Dorne.

[[WMG: All or most of the great houses will be extinguished by the end of the series.]]
Remember, it doesn't need all heirs to be killed. For the house to continue it has to be someone bearing that name, so only trueborn male-line descent counts.

'''Stark:'''
Arya and Sansa are both in hiding, may never be found, and in any case their children will either be Snows or of their husbands' houses. Bran is dead to the world and certainly isn't going to have any kids, Jon's not a Stark, and even if Benjen's alive he's Night's Watch. So the whole house's future rests on little lost Rickon.

'''Lannister:'''
Cersei won't have any more kids and the two she has left are doomed (and aren't trueborn Lannisters anyway), per prophecy. I somehow doubt Jaime will, and if he does they'll be bastards since Kingsguard can't marry. Tyrion can't have any trueborn children since he's married to Sansa. Lancel's going to be a septon, young Tyrek is almost certainly dead, Genna's kids are Freys. Gerion ''might'' reappear, I suppose, but even if he's alive I doubt he's settled down to raise a family. Stafford had a son and so does Tywin's other male cousin, but it would be easy enough for something to happen to any or all of them.

'''Arryn:'''
There's only Sweetrobin left and he's being murdered.

'''Tully:'''
Lysa's and Cat's kids aren't Tullys even if any survive, and Brynden is hardly likely to marry or have children. There's Edmure and his unborn child, but I wouldn't bet too heavily on either surviving the series, and the kid could be a girl.

'''Baratheon:'''
Even if Shireen survives and marries her children won't be Baratheons. Stannis is unlikely to have more children, given his frosty relationship with his wife. Cersei's kids aren't really Baratheons and are doomed by prophecy in any case. The chances of any of Robert's bastards being legitimised seems pretty slim.
** I think Stannis wants sons, it's just his wife keeps giving him stillborns.
*** Really? I don't recall any mention of stillbirths or miscarriages in their particular case, just that they never had any other children. I guessed that they may have had trouble conceiving again, besides that the universally accepted version in-universe is that they haven't even tried in a long time. And Selyse's claim that the reason she hasn't given him any more children is because of Edric might even make some degree of sense if that's the case - if he feels (or she thinks he does) that their marriage was dishonoured by Robert's adultery on their wedding night then maybe she attributes his lack of interest to that.
** As I WMGed below, one of Robert's bastards, most likely Edric, may be legitimized by Stannis in case he doesn't have children. Or if Jon becomes King he may do so.

'''Martell:'''
Doran's estranged from his wife, Oberyn left only bastard daughters, and Quentyn got himself barbecued. Dornish law might make Arianne her father's heir, but she'll still don her husband's colours if she marries. That only leaves little Trystane, and he's too valuable a pawn to put much stock in his safety.
** Dornish law allows woman to keep their own sigils. There have already been ruling Princesses of Dorne.

'''Targaryen:'''
Dany's a girl, and it's very likely she can't have kids. Aegon still has a war to fight, and in any case there's a lot of popular doubt of his authenticity. Jon is almost certainly still a bastard even if he's Rhaegar's. I suppose if Dany married a Targaryen bastard it might be generally accepted that they're Targaryens, but that's still no good if they can't have children. This troper's pet theory is that Rhaegar's not really dead, but somehow I can't see him marrying again.

'''Greyjoy:'''
Aeron's a priest, I can't see Victarion marrying again, and Balon's only surviving son appears to have been castrated. Asha's children, if she ever has any, won't be Greyjoys. Admittedly Euron is a bit of a wildcard; there's no telling what he'll do.

The Tyrells are the only great house to really look like bucking the trend. Garlan's married - though childless as yet, and Willas might be a cripple but he's heir to Highgarden and so hardly unattractive. Garth is unmarried - perhaps too gross for most women to look at, but his brother Moryn has sons, grandsons, and a great grandson, and there's other male relatives too.

* Some parts of this WMG are based on an assumption that children can't inherit their mother's family name. However, there are examples of that in canon (e.g. all of Maege Mormont's daughters are Mormonts themselves).

* In Historic Patriarchal Societies like Westros, there's also a rule that allows the secondary heirs like second sons and daughters to be named to the wife's House if there are no other members.

* Dorne has followed cognatic primogeniture since Nymeria conquered it and since then House Nymeros Martell has ruled Dorne. Now, if it is the case that the children of a Princess of Dorne inherits its father's name, that means every single ruling Princess of Dorne since the Rhyonish conquest has married a male member of her own house. Since that seems highly unlikely, and since it completely flies in the face of the entire point of cognatic primogeniture, I am confident that any marriage that Arianne makes, excepting one, perhaps, with a Targaryen, will result in the children being of House Nymeros Martell. Also, as the person above points out, it is possible for a woman to pass on her name in certain situations in feudal societies, whether through matrilineal marriages or by passing on a name and title to a second born or lower son. There is also the possibility that any of the individuals of these dying houses could adopt a member of the lesser nobility or a second or third born son, granting him their name and titles (I believe this option was discusses when the issue of Lady Hornwood's inheritance was brought up). Also, House Lannister has at least one thriving cadet branch (the Lannisters of Lannisport) and thus it is unlikely that ALL of the Lannisters will go extinct.

[[WMG: Whoever wins the Iron Throne gets a BolivianArmyEnding.]]
Not from the Others, but from Daenerys. It's becomings pretty evident that there just isn't enough series left to resolve all the remaining plot threads, AND have another invasion. While its possible that Daenerys could simply give up on the invasion, and rule as a Queen across the Narrow Sea, this seems unlikely. More likely, during the last two books she finishes what she started by bringing about a general slave uprising throughout all the Free Cities, making her their Queen, and giving her one of the largest standing armies ever assembled, while the Seven Kingdoms lay in near-ruin. The final chapter of the final book will be the new King of the Seven Kingdoms getting a letter telling him just how thoroughly fucked he is once Dany arrives. If Martin ever picks up the series again, he will do so AFTER her victory, because her conquest will be a ForegoneConclusion, and there would be no drama in writing it down.

[[WMG: Money makes the world go round]]
Even the desparate LastStand against the Others will depend on who still has enough money to feed their troops. Just as the final payoff for GRRM bringing not only politics but also economy into a story with magic and dragons.

[[WMG:The series will end just how it started - with a succession crisis/civil war over the Iron Throne.]]

* After everyone seeking the Iron Throne obliterates themselves, [[spoiler:Walder Frey]], being the opportunist that he is, will move to claim it just because there's ''no one left'', then becoming [[spoiler: King Walder]], the First (at least the first king) of His Name, King of the Andals, [[TryToFitThatOnABusinessCard and so on and so forth.]] Two obvious problems, though: [[spoiler: he's close to a hundred, and mostly everyone hates him for that stunt he pulled at the twins. You know the one.]] He'll die of old age, illness, or a terminal case of knife-in-gut just after claiming the Iron Throne. Naturally, it'll be [[spoiler:Stevron]] that would have the strongest claim to take his place as he's the oldest son. But if he and his entire branch die, then all hell breaks loose because he's had so many sons and grandsons, and since half of them [[spoiler: are named Walder Frey]] and there's almost no way to ascertain birth order at this point, [[spoiler: House Frey]] enters into civil war and brothers and cousins start killing ''each other'' in the Red Keep. It would be something of a ShaggyDogStory (on a punny and parenthetical note [[spoiler:Rickon]] becomes King in the North [[spoiler: after his direwolf comes back to Winterfell and just goes apeshit in the castle, managing to kill the entire current usurping family.]] There must always be a Stark in Winterfell, after all.) yet it would also see justice done to [[spoiler: House Frey]], who is probably the one house in- and out-of-universe that nobody likes.

[[WMG: Westeros will be split into two kingdoms, the North and the South]]

And the rulers will be Sansa (the North) and Daenerys.

Sansa and Daenerys seem to be opposites of each other. The physical reason being hair. Daenerys' hair is silver/white, the colour of snow, while Sansa's is red, the colour of fire. They are already representing each other's elements (if you take Sansa being Northern as a sign that her element would be ice). Additionally, G.R.R.Martin seems to be raising women up out of their usual story ruts. So it would make sense for the victors in the end to be two women. Who both also have fathers who were unjustly killed (Truth for Sansa; Daenerys doesn't seem to know much about her family in Westeros, so this is her own personal truth).

They are also the only two female P.O.V. who are in any condition to be victors in the Game of Thrones. Cersei is being taken down in King's Landing due to her own mistakes; Brienne may or may not be dead; Arya's interests lie only in revenge; Cat is down for the count; Mellesendrei is only working for the gains of her own gods; and Arianne has not done anything significant except have her actions result in the maiming of Myrcella Baratheon. As well, Sansa is the only Stark currently participating in the Game of Thrones (and this includes Jon; the Night's Watch takes no part). That takes away Bran and Rickon, who, despite having the same colouring, are not as involved in the war.

They also show both sides of the iron coin. All men must die (Dany; the phrase is mentioned multiple times in her storyline) and All Men Must Serve (Sansa; she was raised to believe that she has to do her duty).

They are also both naive in the ways of politics, though both are learning. Sansa is being taught by Littlefinger, and Dany in her plot line in Meereen. Dany also has her dragons, while Sansa is theoretically able to raise a strong army through name alone.

Aditionally, neither of them are welcome in Westeros by the crown. Dany because she is a threat, and Sansa because she is an assumed kingslayer.

Both come from old blood, and had families that were old by the time Westeros became seven kingdoms. The Starks in the North, and the Targaryeans in Old Valyria. Both families also have strong connections to their house sygils, the Direwolf and the Dragon respectively.

Dany is the unburnt. Who is to say that Sansa, the only living Stark without a (warging) connection to her house sygil, can't be the unfrozen?
* The Starks in ancient history bent the knee to House Targaryen without a fight. They were the Kings who Knelt. Sansa will be one of the first Westerosi that Dany meets, and she (Sansa) will swear fealty and all her knowledge of Westeros' current political situation, in exchange for protection and vengeance. They team up. TheyFightCrime. They rule.

[[WMG: The Starks and much of the North will end up reuniting with the wildlings by the time the series ends.]]
So much emphasis is placed on the First Men status of the Stark family(and their shared history with the wildlings) throughout the series, and with Rickon possibly on Skagos and Jon as the Night's Watch Commander working more with the wildlings, the wildlings returning to Westeros is not unlikely. The series could end with Rickon leading an independent North.

[[WMG: Arya Stark is "The Valonqar"]]

It's been noted before that the Valyrian language doesn't have that great a distinction between male and female, as far as words go. So "valonqar" basically means younger sibling, regardless of whether it's a boy or a girl. There's the first slice of evidence.

Second, that it would be Jaime or Tyrion who kills Cersei seems a little too obvious.

Now while this doesn't discount other younger siblings who might take her out, like Daenerys or Stannis or The Hound, I think Arya is way more likely given the nature of most "prophecies" or visions of the future that we've seen come true as well as GRRM's penchant for juicy surprises.

When Maggy the Frog tells Cersei that "When your tears have drowned you, the valonqar will wrap his hands about your pale white throat and choke the life from you." So Maggy apparently believed the "valonqar" to be a boy. Of course, Arya, for most of the series and her life, has been commonly mistaken for a boy. She may even disguise herself as a boy again one day, if she's going to be a Faceless Man.

On top of this, there's the fact that Arya being the one would be nice poetic justice for Cersei. She is one of the few people on Arya's death list who is still alive. She's also one of the first people to be on said death list. When you think about it, Arya and Cersei have wanted to kill each other since book one when Arya struck Joffrey. It's noted many times what a major blunder it was for Cersei that she couldn't capture or even find Arya after she betrayed Ned. And something that the HBO show has noted even more than the book's is the fact, that Arya is a bit similar to Cersei in temperament. Or rather, Arya is becoming everything Cersei wishes she were: a warrior woman and a respected leader.

It'd be nice if the moment Cersei thinks she's going to be killed by either Tyrion or Dany, it's Arya that comes out of the shadows and finishes her. Especially since it would mean she was finally able to avenge her father's death in some way.

[[WMG: Daenerys herself will be [[spoiler: one of the betrayers]]]]
The prophecy said, [[spoiler:"[[ExactWords Three betrayals shall you know]]]], not [[spoiler: "You will be betrayed three times"]] My original thought was that Daenerys would "betray" [[spoiler:Mereen]] by abandoning it to go to Westros, [[spoiler: "for blood"]], but the [[spoiler: "for blood" betrayal would seem to be what Mirri Maz Duur did]], so maybe she will betray someone (Probably [[spoiler: Hizdahr]]0 so she can be with [[spoiler:Daario - "for love"]].
* I agree. I think the three "for love" parts of that prophecy will refer to the same thing. She'll betray a lover, the first since Drogo she's genuinely loved, by killing him, like Azor Ahai killed Nissa Nissa, in order to activate whatever her equivalent of Lightbringer is (thus "lighting a fire").
* I was thinking the same thing. We also have the [[spoiler:betrayal for 'Gold']] with [[spoiler:Viserys' golden crown...]]

[[WMG: The prophecy from the very first chapter is still not fulfilled.]]
On their way back from the execution the Starks find a dead Direwolf (the mother of the direwolves the Stark children adopt), killed by an antler lodged in her throat. This is seen as a bad omen, because the stag is the animal of House Baratheon. It's some very blatant foreshadowing that when Robert Baratheon arrives shortly afterward, his bringing Ned to King's Landing leads to his death and the downfall of House Stark. However, I think that there may be more to that. Robert can't really be blamed for Ned's death, and neither can another Baratheon. So this omen may only be fulfilled in the future, when a Baratheon (possibly Stannis) is the one to actively kill a Stark, or (figuratively) ultimately "kills" House Stark. He is already up north, and may take Winterfell soon.
* The prophecy was fulfilled when Robert asked Ned to be the Hand of the King. That led to Ned's death and all the trouble from the first book. That's what Cat's so afraid of, when Ned tells her he's going to go south with Robert.
** Backwards: Cat was the one who wanted Ned to ''take'' the position, because she was afraid that him refusing might make Robert his enemy (this was reversed in the TV show), but in either a particularly vicious ProphecyTwist or a case of YouCantFightFate, Robert ended up getting Ned killed instead of killing him himself.

[[WMG: The valonqar from the prophecy isn't a younger sibling of Cersei's -- it's a younger sibling of the young and beautiful queen from the same prophecy.]]

Specifically, the younger and more beautiful queen is Sansa and the valonqar is Arya. The queen isn't the queen of Westeros -- she's the Queen in the North. Sansa has, after all, already been responsible for the death of one of Cersei's children. Cersei also tends to think of the two of them -- "The Stark girls" -- as a unit, made up of the older one and the younger one (i.e. the valonqar). We also know that Valyrian nouns are gender-neutral, which doesn't make it much of a stretch to guess that the pronouns are gender-neutral as well (and that "wrap his hands" could be translated as "wrap her hands"). We also know that of Arya's list of future kills, Queen Cersei is always the last one that she names -- the way that you'd name the final boss in a video game last. She's missed the chance to kill some of the people on that list, but Cersei was always the main one. And finally, oh, how incredibly sweet it would be. GRRM is good at making us miserable, but he's also good at dealing out the occasional moment of transcendent bliss (Jaime in the bear pit, the Tickler's death, what happened to Vargo Hoat, etc.), and that would definitely be one of them.

[[WMG: The valonqar isn't Cersei's younger brother; the valonqar is her younger sister.]]
Remember, at least some High Valyrian nouns are common or neuter, even ones one might expect to be masculine or feminine: we know that Maester Aemon concluded that the "Prince who was Promised" was actually a princ''ess'', Daenerys. It is therefore possible that valonqar could be a common noun, essentially "younger sibling." As such, it could refer to a younger sister as easily as a younger brother. Of course, Cersei has no sisters, only two brothers, both younger than she. But she does have three or four sisters-in-law: Selyse Florent, married to Stannis Baratheon, Margaery Tyrell (also her daughter-in-law), who was married to Renly, Sansa Stark, married to Tyrion, and Tysha, also married to Tyrion. Any one of these women could qualify as Cersei's younger sister (granted, I don't recall if we ever learn Selyse's age relative to Cersei, or Tysha's either), and any one of them would certainly have motive.
* Sansa is interesting. Unlike Margaery (that marriage was annulled), she's still legally Cersei's sister-in-law, and she would also be able to do double-duty as the "young queen" who's supposed to usurp her. Then there's the irony in Cersei having essentially played her EvilMentor in queenliness. Finally, just think how wonderfully ''[[TheDogBitesBack satisfying]]'' it would be.

[[WMG:Arya is really the younger and more beautiful queen/person who will cast Cersei down]]
Right now, the leading fan theories on this are for Dany, Sansa, and Margaery, but they're way too obvious. Dany and Marg are clearly redherrings- Marg for Cersei since she thinks it is her and Dany for the audience because she is being set up to be in the position to fill that role, especially if we interpret the prophecy to be referring to a queen instead of just a person who may or may not be royalty or even female. But in true Martin fashion, those expectations are going to come to nothing. With Sansa, that theory just seems more like fan hopes than anything substantial.
But if Arya is the younger and more beautiful one who will cast Cersei down it would be completely unexpected and almost out of no where since most don't see Arya in this way, least of all Cersei. She is obviously younger, and as far as beauty goes, Arya seems to be the ugly duckling type who is growing into her looks as the books go on. Having Cersei taken down by a younger, live version of Lyanna Stark (the woman Cersei spent the duration of her marriage living in the shadow of) would be perfect symmetry and it would explain the importance behind Arya's similarity to her aunt.
* Interesting, although a few characters note that Lyanna Stark, while pretty, was not half as beautiful as Cersei or Ashara Dayne.
** That's true. In this series, as in life, beauty is subjective. Some say Lyanna was incredibly beautiful. Some say she was just OK, but not even close to being as beautiful as others. But Arya goes through the same thing. Some call her ugly (Arya Horseface) while others say she is attractive. Her beauty is even referenced in [=ADWD=] by another character. Plus, Cersei has aged a decade and a half since she was in her prime. It will be much easier to surpass her in beauty now.
*** Cersei was attracted to Rhaegar when she was young and he, in turn, found Lyanna more beautiful. Since Arya looks like Lyanna...

[[WMG: Daenerys is the 'Mummer's Dragon'.]]
There are theories that Aegon is fake. But what if it's the other way around and it was Daenerys and Viserys that were fakes? Illyrio is said to have Valyrian looks - and conveniently, the guardian of last two Targaryens dies off screen, making swap extremely easy. Why not put his kids on the throne while he is at it?

Now, why I say it's Aegon that is real? Simly - Connington is real, and he spent most of his life with him. Aegon being fake is much less likely, simply because he was out of Illyrio's reach much of the time. Conninton was fanatically loyal to Rhaegar, making him playing part in any funny stuff or not noticing problems with Aegon had he was fake very unlikely. But he never meets Daenerys, does he?

Now, take a look at the prophecy. "Kraken and Dark flame, lion and griffin, the sun's son and the mummer's dragon". You might notice they come in pairs, tied to each other. Greyjoy and Red Priest, Tyrion and Connington, Prince of Dorne and... who exactly? Unless it means one of his companions, the only person tied to him was Daenerys herself, after all, he was after her hand.

Why Daenerys would be warned from herself? Because if you think about it, she is her own worst enemy. The peaceful, meek Daenerys that wants to rule slaves as "Mother" is the worst obstacle Deanerys, Queen of the Andals, the Rhoynar, and the First Men, Lady of the Seven Kingdoms, still has. She could have landed in Westeros together with Aegon, but as of ADwD, she is alone, half naked, starving, and unarmed right in front of big group of known rapist riders, purely due to her efforts to keep Mereen peaceful.

You can ask - what about dragons? Well, maybe all that was needed to wake them up was deaths of 3 people? Dany burned her son, her husband, and the priestess - 3 lives sacrificed to fire. If Melisandre is right burning royal blood makes magic more powerful, the people involved would massively boost the spell. After all, besides dragons, Daenerys and her brother did not show anything special so far. What if her problems with taming them would disappear in an instant for Aegon? Or Jon, for that matter?

[[WMG: Drogon will grow two additional heads]]
You guys are all being way too metaphorical about this prophecy.

[[WMG: Syrio Forel was a Faceless Man and is still at King's Landing...]]
...masquerading as Ser Meryn Trant, who he killed after Arya fled. ''With his wooden sword.''
* Introducing the Faceless Men was really OpeningACanOfClones, wasn't it...

[[WMG:The Faceless Men are more of a major player of the Game than even Varys and Littlefinger put together.]]

...And have been for decades beyond count.

OK... that's not so wild: it's pretty darned obvious they're a part of the whole mess, simply down to who they do and do not accept "prayers" from and how they choose to accept clients in the first place. That means an awful lot of room for an agenda beyond their open mission statement. The really wild stuff is in what comes next...

The possible link with the Iron Bank: face it... that iron coin and an Iron Bank is rather suggestive. There must surely be some connection? And, Arya's first assignment is to kill an insurance broker of some description. Telling me the rather nervous guy hasn't racked up a few debts in the wrong places insuring the wrong things (and knows it)? Won't wash. Whether the Faceless Men and the Iron Bank actually have something that is just a rather cozy relationship or what amounts to a full-blown connection meaning they are one and the same, their combined influence goes back ''decades'' for said bank to get such a ''fearsome'' reputation when it comes to debt collection. And, who, pray tell, has been funding all sides from even before the start of the series? And, can call in debts as and when it's useful for their purposes, whatever those may be?

If anybody tries to tell me that Jaqen H'gar was in the Black Cells when Arya first met him because he got careless, I'll start laughing. And, should they further go on to suggest that he had to go along with the Black Watch Recruitment Drive just to get out, again... I'll start turning into a hyena. I don't know what he was doing, but whatever it was, it was no accident. And, accepting Arya's little list of names, and going along with her scheme in Harrenhal? I'll be surprised if that was a total accident, as well. It certainly stirred the political pot.

Recruiting her may or may not have been on the shopping list, but he was in a wonderful position to affect the War in various other ways, depending on the requests he could trigger just by hanging around waiting for "I wish he'd just drop dead" kind of requests all the way to the more expensive kind: just think of the characters he came into contact with through that Black Cell... including, probably, Varys. He's not only touched the Black Watch, Arya, a bastard of the late king in Gendry, one of the centre pin Castles of the War of the Five Kings, but could collect a better suited face and is now in the Citadel... Please: simple religious assassination order simply serving a conglomerate ideal of Death, my left foot. You don't land that deeply in politics just for kicks and giggles. Or, just to kill. Think of all the information he's already had access to by sneaking around King's Landing... and is primed to get where he is, now.

He's also well placed to start collecting debts linked to the Iron Throne, should the need arise. Should Varys leave any left outstanding for him to collect, of course.

And, something else to nibble on that is totally out there: the Waif. She's very, very short. The size of a young child, in fact. Yet, she's waaaaaaay older than she looks and admits it with one hell of a backstory... and, she's in a place where looking human is made rather easy. What if she isn't actually human, but good at singing to all that weirwood that's hanging about the place, rather? Acorn... oak... oak table: we're still talking tree, here. And, as the Children up North use bowls with carved eyes, etc... I'm betting the "dead" wood hanging around e.g. the doors of the House can still see. The Faceless Men lie about their backgrounds all the time, when they need to... Are you telling me you didn't think of her as possibly being a Child of the Forest at some point? And, the Children do mention the fact that they could be all the "gods" men have had, any way.

[[WMG: The Faceless Men and the Maesters will soon come into conflict with one another.]]
If the idea of a cabal of Maesters trying to eliminate magic is true, it stands to reason that the Faceless Men, whose entire MO is based around some sort of face switching magic, would want to prevent that. Expect high ranking men with many chain links to start dropping dead in the near future.

[[WMG: Griff is a Faceless Man]]

[[spoiler: Jon Connington really did die a long time ago]], and a Faceless man took his face to become Griff, the sellsword. He was hired by Varys and Illyrio, using Illyrio's vast fortune, to put [[spoiler: Aegon/Pisswater Prince/Illyrio's son/etc.]] on the Iron Throne. In ADWD, Griff's internal monologue uses the phrase "All Men Must Die."

His "greyscale" is just an excuse for him to abandon the Griff face when the charade is over and return to Braavos for a new mission.

[[WMG: Danearys herself will be [[spoiler: one of the betrayers]]]]

[[WMG: Dany really can't have kids]]
Mirri Maz Duur wasn't making a prophecy, she was giving the educated guess of an experienced midwife who saw firsthand the damage Rhaego's birth did to Dany. Exact wording is usually pretty important in the books, and Mirri's exact words were that Daenerys would never bear a living child. Being able to concieve and being able to carry the pregnancy to term are two different things- look at Lysa's track record.

[[WMG: Daenerys will march on Harrenhal with the dragons. Or even just one or two of the dragons.]]
Like Aegon the Conqueror.

[[WMG: Dany's return to westeros will be A Big SurprisinglyRealisticOutcome.]]
She missed the oppurtunity to conquer, Aegon has or will gain the support and thanks to Cersei noone wants a woman.

[[WMG: There'll be a diplomatic incident involving Daenerys and "The bear and the maiden fair"]]
Everybody in Westeros seems to be constantly singing it, but Dany didn't grow up there. So when she hears the lyrics for the first time, she'll take them to be about Ser Jorah and herself - cue interesting insights into a paranoid queen.

[[WMG: Daenerys will never return to Westeros.]]
Instead, she will conquer Essos and reestablish the Valyrian Freehold. She can hardly abandon Meereen now, and the only way the war in Slaver's Bay can end is with one side crushing the other; that's clear now. Once that's done, the obvious next target is Volantis; remember that woman in Volantis, the Widow of the Waterfront, who gave Ser Jorah a message for Dany, on behalf of the slaves of Volantis: "Tell her we are waiting. Tell her to come soon." Once Dany takes Volantis, the obvious next step is to do what the Volantenes wanted Aegon the Conqueror to do, long ago: conquer the other free cities and reestablish the Freehold of Valyria. This will end up being [=ASoIaF=]'s version of the Holy Roman Empire, as the Valyrian Freehold was its version of the Roman Empire.

[[WMG: Daenerys will become the ruler of a humongous, multi-cultural empire that goes all the way from Meereen to Westeros]]
* Because she was already our UsefulNotes/AlexanderTheGreat expy anyway. And it will be named Targarya.
** She will then die, and her empire will fragment almost immediately afterward.
** Just so long as she doesn't found hundreds of cities named Daeneria or whatever narcissistic name she comes up with.

[[WMG:Dany will accidentally obliterate King's Landing as soon as she makes it to Westeros]]
Martin's last trolling will be the biggest one. Daenerys and her dragons will finally make it to Westeros after nearly 3 decades and 7 books. However, as soon as she takes King's Landing she'll place one of her ill-behaved dragons in the wrong dungeon and it will unearth and fire one of the wildfire pots laid down decades ago by the Mad King. The ensuing chain reaction will destroy King's Landing, kill Daenerys and the three dragons before she even learns of the White Walker threat. This new Doom will turn the Westerosi realm into another myth of old like Valyria.

[[WMG:Daenerys will sacrifice herself and her dragons to save Westeros]]
By the end of the series, the Others will make it past the wall and lay waste to Westeros. And since magic is tied to the dragons, at the end she will have to sacrifice herself and her dragons to save Westeros, and remove all magic from the world in the process.

[[WMG:A Grand Unified Theory of Daenerys Targaryen's future exploits]]
Daenerys has now spent five books in Essos, slowly growing in power and learning how to be a queen. It's long due for her to make her expedition to Westeros reality, but she's been adamant that she won't leave Meereen until she can be reasonably certain that its people are going to be safe for the time being. I believe that many of the elements that allow her to leave are quickly coming together in ''A Dance With Dragons'':

First, she will defeat Khal Jhago and his bloodriders personally with Drogon's help, and suddenly the ''khalasar'' figures out that she might be worth following, after all. They set off back to Meereen, luring Drogon with lame horses and other easy prey. Meanwhile Victarion's fleet reaches the city and engages in naval battle with the forces of Volantis and Qarth. Victarion has one of his crew use the Horn of Valyria and commands the two dragons to attack enemy forces, decimating them. At the same time surprising news come from Volantis: the slaves have started their own uprising in the absence of the bulk of the city's army and have received unexpected help from the Sealord of Braavos who sees a perfect opportunity to both end the slave trade on the shores of the Narrow Sea once and for all and make his city the dominant power in the region. The remains of the Volantean army retreat as the hear the news and the Yunkai'i are driven back or destroyed with the help of the dragons. The Ironborn are reluctantly welcomed into the city, but Ser Barristan has the Unsullied secretly block the way back to their ships.

At this point Daenerys returns with her new ''khalasar''. Victarion tries to force her to marry him by blackmailing her with her dragons, but at this point Moqorro reveals that he had just been using him to get to Dany. He uses the magic in Victarion's hand that he healed to take control of him and force him to blow the Horn of Valyria, himself, in Dany's name and give her full control over all three dragons. The Ironborn revolt but are crushed between the Dothraki and the Unsullied and the survivors are chained to the oars for the oncoming journey. At this point the Mage arrives and reveals Dany the threat of the Others in the North and urges her to leave at once to save millions. A certain dwarf makes an appearance and pledges his sellsword company at her service, along with his expertise of the current political state of Westeros. Dany decides to leave Reznak mo Reznak as her viceroy for the time being, as his ruthless advice turned out to be wise in the hindsight, after all, but also leaves Jorah Mormont along with half of her Unsullied as his Kingsguard with orders to dispose of him should he prove treacherous.

With her new Iron Fleet and an army, Daenerys sails off towards the North, but first stopping at Braavos for winter supplies. There she hears of the plight of the Wildlings starving at the shores, and decides to take her fleet to them. They are the ships that Mother Mole prophecised in the last book.

[[WMG: Daenerys is already nuts and Quaite is a figment of her imagination]]

* Then how are Quaithe's predictions coming true?
** Because Daenerys is a MadOracle and makes the predictions herself.

[[WMG: Daenerys or some other Head of the Dragon will get into trouble in the Eyrie when they reach Westeros]]
Come on, when you read the description of the Moon Door and the Sky Cells, or see them in the series, don't you think this place is just asking for a SuicidalGotcha followed by a rescue by a SurpriseVehicle? And the only flying "vehicles" in Martin's world are dragons. Bonus points if that Head of the Dragon will be Tyrion, who already ran afoul of the Eyrie's penitentiary system in Book 1.
* This sounds awesome, but given the nature of [[SurprisinglyRealisticOutcome this series]], such a scene could easily end with the character breaking their bones upon the dragon's scales. There's also the possibility that they misjudge the timing and end up splattered across the rocks anyway, though dragons are pretty huge.

[[WMG: The Great Other will finally make an appearance near the end.]]
And he'll turn out to be [[IncrediblyLamePun a pretty cool guy.]] But in all seriousness he will be surprisingly friendly and non-malicious if disinterested in normal mortal affairs. Mostly he just cares about getting R'hllor to [[IncrediblyLamePun chill out a bit.]] Also his and R'hllor's dialogue is going to be [[HurricaneOfPuns loaded with Ice and Fire puns.]] Also FoeYay.

[[WMG: The other source of Valyrian steel swords]]
The Iron throne is made of the swords of Aegon the Conqueror's fallen foes. I bet were probably made of Valyrian steel, ergo, the Iron throne will be melted down so the swords can be reforged. Ultimately, Westeros will become a republic and someone (Davos? Jon? Littlefinger?) will be president.
* Semms unlikely, given how valuable Valyrian steel is. I'd be more inclined to think Aegon took whatever Valyrian steel was there and used/reforged those weapons before making the Iron Throne.
** Even if it the throne contains no Valyrian steel, [[ClapYourHandsIfYouBelieve the small folk think it might]], [[TheMagicComesBack and therefore it will]]. The throne, after all, is a lie that has been repeated so many times it has become real.

[[WMG: "The Shadow" is a volcano that puts Valyria to shame]]
Old Valyria seems to have been a volcanic region devastated by an enormous eruption, and is also strongly tied to dragons. It doesn't take a great leap of imagination to assume a connection, especially considering "dragonglass", whose real-world counterpart obsidian is a volcanic material. The other place associated with dragons is Asshai "by-the-Shadow", near a mysterious area called the Shadow Lands, which are said to be "under the shadow". So what if they're either metaphorically "in the shadow" of a great mountain, or literally shadowed by plumes of smoke belching from it? What if beyond Asshai the atmosphere becomes so caustic and poisonous (or even dragon-infested) that it's generally considered uninhabitable, a sort of naturally-occurring uber-{{Mordor}}?
* Kinda confirmed by the World of Ice and Fire. The Shadow is a volcanic valley with very steep slopes, which is only illuminated by the sun at noon. It really is permeated with caustic vapors and covered with ash, and indeed is dragon-infested. It is also indeed uninhabitable; even the city of Asshai isn't a vacation spot, and only barely sustains its population because all kinds of sorcerers and cultists flock to the place (and possibly some of them are undead and immortal).

[[WMG:The old gods, children of the forest, First Men and the Starks are less benevolent than they seem..]]
In A Dance with Dragons, we learn that the ancient Starks used to sacrifice people to their weirwoods via Bran's vision of the white-haired woman cutting a captive's throat in front of a heart tree. We know that "blood magic" is a powerful and ancient form of magic GRRM's world through the examples of Melisandre and Mirri Maz Duur. Since A Game of Thrones we have been told that weirwoods have blood-colored sap and leaves and often appear to "weep blood" from their faces. The weirwood in White Harbor, which was the site of much bloody sacrifice as mentioned by Davos, is humungous and fat. Weirwoods cannot take root at the Eyrie and we know that that castle is unique in that it executes its major criminals by throwing them off the mountain as opposed to beheading (apparently the preferred execution method in the rest of the Seven Kingdoms). From this we can deduce that weirwoods thrive on the blood of human sacrifices and in fact that their "sap" is most likely, to some degree, literal blood!

This throws the First Men and the children of the forest and the old gods into a whole new light. When we first learn of the Andals invading Westeros and driving the First Men and the children back and hacking down all the weirwoods we are sympathetic to the First Men and the children (or, at least, I was). But, if the Andals knew of the origin of the weirwoods, they could hardly be blamed for finding the First Men and children barbaric and horrifying.

On a related note, we have the Starks. They are the only major house that is still (mostly) of the blood of the First Men. They describe their ancestors as the "Kings of Winter". They are the only major house that still worships the old gods (though they appear to be unaware of their religion's bloody origin). At one point in the story, I forget where exactly, it is noted that the Stark words are the only words of a major house that are not a boast of some kind. In contrast to things like "Growing strong", "We do not sow", "Ours is the fury", etc., the Stark words are "Winter is coming". "Winter is coming" is used as a warning throughout the books akin to something like "Knock on wood". However, what if originally, the Stark words were meant as a boast, as well? As in, look out southerners/Andals/enemies of the old gods, because when Winter gets here, we are gonna kick some serious butt. In other words, Winter coming was a good thing for the Starks of old and their gods.....

* That's a pretty good theory actually. One problem; the Children of the Forest and the Others were enemies, and the First Men sided with the children.
* Interesting, but it depends on your interpretation of Bran's vision, which came without any context. It could have been an execution of a criminal. That might have been the origin of the Northern custom of the local lord performing executions personally, and then going to pray before the heart tree afterward. Also, the lack of a heart tree at the Eyrie proves nothing: heart trees in the South are not weirwoods in the first place. There is no heart tree at the Eyrie because no tree can grow at that elevation.
** Well... whether or not Bran's vision entailed an execution, a Mayan-style blood sacrifice or some kind of Extreme Bar Mitzvah doesn't really enter into it. The point is that someone's blood was being spilled at the base of a weirwood. And Abraham Stark's descendants -- such as Ned -- have been unwittingly feeding their tree every time they cleanse their blades in the waters of the godswood ever since. Also, no, the lack of a heart tree at the Eyrie by itself doesn't prove anything, and yes, weirwoods are not as customary in the godwoods of the southron castles. However, in Chapter 80 of Storm of Swords (Sansa's seventh of that book), a point is made that in the Eyrie they specifically tried to get a weirwood to take root and it could not. The book also notes that your explanation is of course the most likely; a tree just can't take root at that altitude... On the other hand, all this circumstantial evidence has got to add up to something at some point, and taken as a contrast to the bloated, ginormous tree at White Harbour (where bloody executions are noted to have been quite common), well...
** Just thought of something else: the weirwood at the wildling village of Whitetree is also huge. Not only that, but it is described as having a mouth carved into it large enough to fit a sheep into and Jon Snow even finds charred human remains in there. The wildlings still worship the old gods by and large and seem to be much more in tune with their religion and history... This all but confirms that they are making blood sacrifices to the weirwoods.
*** Cremating and then interring your dead in or around a still living Weirwood carved with a face which suggests it's nicely plugged into the Greenseer network looks like it would be a really great way prevent wights happening.

[[WMG: The Drowned God and the Storm God were the original deities of he First Men]]
Ironborn religious doctrine teaches that the Drowned God led their ancestors to find the Sea Stone Chair. Implying that they had been worshiping him or a being like him proceeding their settling on the Iron Islands. Thus, it may be possible that the First Men who came from Essos did in fact worship him before they discarded him in favour of the Children of the Forest. But the First Men are said to come from Essos, and within the series the similarities between the Drowned God and R'hilor are remarked upon as uncanny. Therefore, it can be further extrapolated that the Drowned God and the Storm God are merely mutations of the R'hilor and the Great Other respectively, changed as Ironborn's culture began to emphasize sea-born raiding.
* There are hints at all sorts of gods the First Men may have had before converting to "the old gods" of the children of the forest (the ancient story of the first Storm King says he took a daughter of "the gods" as a wife, and went to war with them, which implies numerous, anthropomorphic gods, at least some of whom have powers over the weather). Either they had multiple religions, or it was a polytheistic/henotheistic religion with a whole pantheon of gods.
* A seafaring pantheon doesn't make all that much sense considering that the First Men had to _walk_ to get to Westeros, and that destroying their bridge is seen as the ideal way to stop them.

[[WMG: The weird seasons were put in place as a way to keep the world in technological stasis.]]
Some powerful magic entity doesn't want mankind to become too powerful with their technology. Giving them long, harsh winters and seasons of unpredictable length is a good way to hold back progress.
* In the real world, a lot of technology came about in Northern Europe during the Little Ice Age (~1350-1850); in fact, it's kind of the figurative summer of European civilization. The long winters would probably spur technological progress to survive and expand, not retard it.
** The issue is that, even during the Little Ice Age, winter still only lasted a few months. Winters in the world of ''A Song of Ice and Fire'' are short if they last ''three years''. For a decent chunk of the population, a long winter would be entirely unsurvivable. Since they're most likely global, they also include a long time period when trade is likely to be mostly if not entirely shut down by severe weather and localized famine. The unpredictability would make long-term planning and investments difficult to justify, further impeding progress.

[[WMG: The Ice Dragon mentioned in [=ADWD=] is real]]
It is the power behind and probably the god of the Others and Dany's three dragons will fight it in the final book.

[[WMG: There's a Kraken out there somewhere]]
And I don't mean more Greyjoys. During ASoS there's a point where the King's Council is meeting, and Varys mentions all this talk of dragons in the east, which we all know to be true. Oddly, he also mentions a Kraken has been seen attacking ships and dragging them underwater. As yet, nothing has come of this, but given it was mentioned in the same breath as something true, there could be more to it than just idle rumour.
* If Euron's tale of throwing his dragon egg into the water is true, it may have hatched underwater for some reason. A sea-dragon might easily be mistaken for a kraken, especially as few people alive have seen a real dragon. However, it's far more likely that he used it to pay the Faceless Men for Balon's murder.
** I doubt it. Sea-dragons are a thing, though whether an ordinary dragon egg could hatch into one is a different question, and they're not krakens: sea-dragons prey on krakens. And most people know both dragons and krakens from pictures; krakens wrap their squid arms around ships and pull them under (at least in every other story that involves them) so it's unlikely that a sea-dragon would be mistaken for one. Although I believe Euron about throwing the egg away. No-one else would have done it, but '... Euron's maddest of all' and what we've seen of him seems to bear that out. If anyone would throw away a king's ransom in a fit of pique, it would be him. (On a side note, I have a theory for why all the iron-born are crazy. They're brain-damaged from the ritual drownings.)
* Going with the analogy between sea-dragons and Dany's dragons, what if sea dragons are born in blood and salt, just as Dany's are born in fire and blood (or alternately, the krakens as Elemental Counterparts to the dragons? It ties in with the symbolism around the Ironmen. The problem with this line of thought is how exactly would that work technically speaking? Kill/sacrifice some mook, toss them overboard with the egg? Wouldn't that be a bit of a gamble?
** Or, what about the stone dragons of Dragonstone? Although all of Melisandre's burnings in the earlier books surely would have done something towards waking them by now. Maybe there's some kind of specific sacrifice thing to wake ''them'' in a way analogous to how Dany's eggs were hatched.
** ''Or'', what if the ''ice dragon(s)'' isn't a literal dragon but some other mythical beast or EldritchAbomination that is only referred to as a dragon because 1. no one's actually seen it and/or 2. it's known to unleash hellish destruction, so they called it a dragon by analogy, or for lack of a more appropriate word -- kind of how Renaissance zoologists referred to giraffes as "cameleopards" because they [[YouFailZoologyForever Failed Zoology Forever]], or the theory that different dragon myths cropped up in the first place because of people finding dinosaur bones and being unable to explain them appropriately.

[[WMG:During long summers, the '''Black''' Walkers lay waste to Sothoryos, just like the White Walkers do to Westeros during long winters]]
Jalabhar Xho wasn't merely a deposed prince. He escaped the entire genocide of his people at the hands of the Black Walkers, with dark skin hot as molten rock and eyes red like fire. Unfortunately, when he first arrived he didn't speak the Common Tongue well enough to accurately explain his situation to Robert.
* Except that Jalabhar Xho isn't from Sothoryos; he's from the Summer Isles, which lie directly south of Dorne, and are still populated.
** The Summer Isles are part of Sothoryos in the same sense that Cape Verde is part of Africa.
* Alternatively, the Black Walkers aren't actually black- they're called that because some people have seen the blackened, burned wastes they leave behind, but almost no one has actually seen one in person and lived. They're actually white, because their bodies are so hot they're glowing.

[[WMG:The Lord of Light and the Great Other are [[EldritchAbomination Eldritch Abominations.]]]]
They are so great that humans can't possibly perceive them directly, but their eternal struggle with each other manifests as the uneven seasons of Westeros. Humans and normal life in general can only survive in their impasse, and victory of either one would spell immediate doom for everyone; the first Long Winter was a time when the Great Other almost won and the Doom of Valyria resulted from the Lord of Light gaining the upper hand. Humans tend to see one or the other as good and evil simply because they happened to be saved from one's wrath by the other, by coincidence. They are only vaguely aware of humans, themselves and don't really comprehend them as individuals, but seek to use them as pawns by sending power in their way that only a few with the affinity can actually exploit. And those few can mix a little bit of humanity in the essence of these entities to create the {{Humanoid Abomination}}s known as the Others and Melisandre's shadow children, respectively. Ofcourse no-one has the idea of how to make more Others, any more, since they were all too succesful, but Craster had the right idea.

[[WMG:Ideas on Valyria.]]
Valyria was built ontop of a super-caldera like YellowStone park, except on a much bigger scale, on the day of the doom, this massive volcano erupted, and the destruction of basicley everything was cause by the massive techtonic shift and natural disasters that were caused by the eruption.

The dragons have been dying out every since the doom because they draw their life force from the energies volcano, when it erupted it used up all this energy and cut them off from the life force, so each generation of dragons had to rely on whatever little was left, thus dying out. When Dany brought the 3 dragons to life, enough time had passed that energy had built up again, allowing them to live, thus ushering a new age of dragons.

The Doom of Valyria was actualy caused by all the sorcery and power being used at once causing a resonance cascade like even that set of the volcano, which would not have erupted by itself untill the red comet came 500 years later.

The Doom was the fire that brought forth the LightBringer, prematurely, all the magic and Valyrian steel in the area were combined in the event to form the sword, and the incarnation of Azor Ahai will have to travel to the center of the doom, in the ruins of the capital, where s/he will find the lightbringer waiting to be drawn from the fires of the very earth itself, and as an added bonus, it will be infused with the souls of the entire nation making it like the original.

[[WMG:R'hllor is the Storm God, and the Drowned God is the Great Other. (spoilers for ''A Storm of Swords'' onwards). ]]

There are quite a lot of parellels between the faith of the Red Priests and that of the Ironborn.

Both are duotheistic religions with one good and one evil god.

Their good gods are associated with opposite elements and colours - R'hllor with fire and red, the Drowned God with water and pale green and blue.

The gods communicate with particularly faithful priests through their respective elements - Melisandre and Moqorro see visions in their flames, and Aeron hears the voice of the Drowned God in the waves.

Death and resurrection are a part of both faiths. The priests of R'hllor are known to be capable of reviving the dead, and the initiation ritual for damphairs involves being drowned and revived by CPR.
* It goes further than that. The description from Thoros about how he first resurrected Beric Dondarrion involve him giving Dondarrion a ritualistic kiss of life. What else involves a kiss of life? CPR.

Both faiths also involve human sacrifice via their gods' repective elements - burning for R'hllor, drowning for the Drowned God.

When particularly close to their respective god's element, Melisandre and Aeron are both capable of going without food.

Slavery also figures in both cultures - the Ironborn have thralls while the Red Priests are all slaves to the faith, though the Ironborn think this kind of slavery is just wrong.

Now, consider when Stannis and Melisandre did the leech ritual to kill Balon Greyjoy, Joffrey Baratheon, and Robb Stark. Joffrey and Robb were both betrayed by their allies, while Balon was blown off a ledge by a gust of wind. Aeron, naturally enough, blames the Storm God. It's interesting to note that Balon ''was'' killed by a storm, and if this theory is true, Balon would have worshipped R'hllor's enemy, so R'hllor decided to take a more direct hand here.

Also, Davos Seaworth. He was always associated with water, but after the Battle of King's Landing, he was swept into the sea, nearly drowned, but ultimately thrown back - one could look at this as the Drowned God sending Stannis a gift to counter R'hllor's influence on him via Melisandre, who Davos does not trust.

Finally, there's the matter of Patchface. Patchface was drowned but revived; now he's completely insane and rants about life under the sea, which occasionally resembles the Drowned God's watery halls. Also, he freaks Melisandre right the fuck out. Since Patchface was evidently given life by the Drowned God, it's natural Melisandre would react in disgust at one who has the favour of (what she considers to be) the devil.

[[WMG: The Others and the long seasonal cycles are GaiasVengeance.]]

The humans of this world are so numerous and so vile, that every so often the damn ''planet'' has its fill of them. First it sends the Others to spread fear and death. And then Winter Comes to take the rest. The few humans that survive start the cycle all over again.

[[WMG: The ravens are so reliable because they are ALL controlled by Bloodraven]]
It is said that "Bloodraven has one thousand eyes and one" ("Sworn Sword", and probably elsewhere)--he controls tons of creatures. Maybe the reason that all the ravens are so reliable as messengers is that they are ALL STILL CONTROLLED by Bloodraven, and people have just forgotten/never knew.

They never talk about actually TRAINING the ravens; it's just taken as a given that they are reliable messengers, and they know somehow where to go. The Maesters/Varys/someone know that he is still alive and controlling them, but have some kind of deal for him to stay away up beyond the Wall in return for keeping their communications going.

(This level of trust on behalf of, well, ANYONE in this universe--among other things--obviously speaks out against this theory as a likely possibility, but it still seems interesting.)