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Proposed solution: Remove the "music genres only" restriction, rename to DiscreditedGenre and rework the page into the genre equivalent of DiscreditedTrope. Repurpose the "music genre hated by critics" analysis on the current page for Analysis.CriticProof.
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Proposed solution: solution:
# Remove the "music genres only" restriction, rename to DiscreditedGenre and rework the page into the genre equivalent of DiscreditedTrope. Repurpose the "music genre hated by critics" analysis on the current page for Analysis.CriticProof.
CriticProof. Disambiguate the old name.
# Cut and disambiguate. Allow DiscreditedTrope to list discredited genres.
# Remove the "music genres only" restriction, rename to DiscreditedGenre and rework the page into the genre equivalent of DiscreditedTrope. Repurpose the "music genre hated by critics" analysis on the current page for Analysis.
# Cut and disambiguate. Allow DiscreditedTrope to list discredited genres.
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Since the intended definition has quite a bit of overlap with CriticProof (a lot of the stuff critics hate at least sold well enough to get their attention), and it would be interesting to list genres that have fallen out of favour ''without'' falling victim to a specific GenreKiller or being outright CondemnedByHistory, I suggest reworking the page into the genre equivalent of DiscreditedTrope, removing the "music genres only" restriction.
to:
Since the intended definition has quite a bit of overlap with CriticProof (a lot of the stuff critics hate at least sold well enough to get their attention), and it would be interesting to list genres that have fallen out of favour ''without'' falling victim to a specific GenreKiller or being outright CondemnedByHistory, I suggest reworking the page into the genre equivalent of DiscreditedTrope, DiscreditedTrope and removing the "music genres only" restriction.
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None
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Since the intended definition has quite a bit of overlap with CriticProof (a lot of the stuff critics hate at least sold well enough to get their attention), and it would be interesting to list genres that have fallen out of favour ''without'' falling victim to a specific GenreKiller, I suggest reworking the page into the genre equivalent of DiscreditedTrope, removing the "music genres only" restriction.
to:
Since the intended definition has quite a bit of overlap with CriticProof (a lot of the stuff critics hate at least sold well enough to get their attention), and it would be interesting to list genres that have fallen out of favour ''without'' falling victim to a specific GenreKiller, GenreKiller or being outright CondemnedByHistory, I suggest reworking the page into the genre equivalent of DiscreditedTrope, removing the "music genres only" restriction.
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The trope DeadHorseGenre is defined as a genre music critics hate on principle, but a lot of the actual use is applied to genres that people in general dislike (often, but not always, one that used to be popular) -- likely due to the name's similarity to DeadHorseTrope.
Since the intended definition has quite a bit of overlap with CriticProof (a lot of the stuff critics hate at least sold well enough to get their attention), and it would be interesting to list genres that have fallen out of favour ''without'' falling victim to a specific GenreKiller, I suggest reworking the page into the genre equivalent of DiscreditedTrope, removing the "music genres only" restriction.
Proposed solution: Remove the "music genres only" restriction, rename to DiscreditedGenre and rework the page into the genre equivalent of DiscreditedTrope. Repurpose the "music genre hated by critics" analysis on the current page for Analysis.CriticProof.
Since the intended definition has quite a bit of overlap with CriticProof (a lot of the stuff critics hate at least sold well enough to get their attention), and it would be interesting to list genres that have fallen out of favour ''without'' falling victim to a specific GenreKiller, I suggest reworking the page into the genre equivalent of DiscreditedTrope, removing the "music genres only" restriction.
Proposed solution: Remove the "music genres only" restriction, rename to DiscreditedGenre and rework the page into the genre equivalent of DiscreditedTrope. Repurpose the "music genre hated by critics" analysis on the current page for Analysis.CriticProof.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
That's probably better off on the TRS queue.
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DeadHorseGenre is a problem AudienceReaction for several reasons: First, the description is about a music genre critics automatically hate, but the trope is also used for divisive genres, genres that have fallen out of favour and full-blown CondemnedByHistory genres (likely because the name suggests a genre that has been done to death, not a genre critics specifically don't like). Also, the fact that it revolves around genres and not works puts it in a weird spot when people try to wick it on YMMV pages -- while many GhettoIndex reactions gain examples about how the ghetto affected the development or reception of specific works, Dead Horse Genre examples generally fail to do so. Finally, it's not clear why it's restricted to music genres when other forms of media also have genres associated with dead trends that may or may not have received significant backlash.
'''Proposed solution:''' See how much of the page's contents can be salvaged for Analysis.CriticProof (for the intended "music genre critics dislike" meaning), then...
# Disambiguate between AudienceAlienatingEra, CondemnedByHistory and DeadHorseTrope. Yard the related concepts of "a song or album was poorly received because its genre is stigmatized" (which the page could be reworked into, but we'd have to start from scratch anyway) and "a creator switches genres -- such as an artist releasing a NewSoundAlbum -- to get away from a now-stigmatized genre" (would be Trivia, and there's little reason to make it specific to music).
# Make DeadHorseGenre definition-only.
# Rework DeadHorseGenre into "an unpopular music genre" and make it definition-only.
'''Proposed solution:''' See how much of the page's contents can be salvaged for Analysis.CriticProof (for the intended "music genre critics dislike" meaning), then...
# Disambiguate between AudienceAlienatingEra, CondemnedByHistory and DeadHorseTrope. Yard the related concepts of "a song or album was poorly received because its genre is stigmatized" (which the page could be reworked into, but we'd have to start from scratch anyway) and "a creator switches genres -- such as an artist releasing a NewSoundAlbum -- to get away from a now-stigmatized genre" (would be Trivia, and there's little reason to make it specific to music).
# Make DeadHorseGenre definition-only.
# Rework DeadHorseGenre into "an unpopular music genre" and make it definition-only.
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[[folder:A music genre disliked by critics specifically]]
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[[folder:A music genre disliked by critics specifically]]specifically (8/50, 16%)]]
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[[folder: A music genre that used to be popular, but has fallen out of favour]]
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[[folder: A music genre that used to be popular, but has fallen out of favour]]favour (12/50, 24%)]]
# SeriousBusiness.{{Music}}: Music genres. People will argue to death trying to define a genre or deciding whether or not a piece of music falls under this razor-thin subgenre or that one. Notable examples include: [''irrelevant examples removed'']
** "What is REAL rap music?" Almost anything made after 1999 is seen as popcorn trash. On the opposite side, anything before 1999 is played-out and passe. The turning point was the time when '''[[DeadHorseGenre "Gangsta rap", Alternative Rap, Political Rap, Hardcore Hip-Hop]]''' and associated genres lost popularity among casual rap listeners, causing a [[FandomRivalry rift]] in those that followed new genres and those that preferred the old.
** "What is REAL rap music?" Almost anything made after 1999 is seen as popcorn trash. On the opposite side, anything before 1999 is played-out and passe. The turning point was the time when '''[[DeadHorseGenre "Gangsta rap", Alternative Rap, Political Rap, Hardcore Hip-Hop]]''' and associated genres lost popularity among casual rap listeners, causing a [[FandomRivalry rift]] in those that followed new genres and those that preferred the old.
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# YMMV.WeAreTheWorld: As noted by internet reviewer WebVideo/ToddInTheShadows, the "[[CharityMotivationSong charity single]]" genre has been parodied to death, which makes the selection of celebrities for the updated version (particularly Josh Groban, who ''has'' appeared in parodies of the format) rather amusing.
# YMMV.ShelbyFlint: The popularity of disco music was already dwindling at a breakneck pace by the time Shelby recorded her late '70s disco/funk album with Ian Jack.
# YMMV.ShelbyFlint: The popularity of disco music was already dwindling at a breakneck pace by the time Shelby recorded her late '70s disco/funk album with Ian Jack.
to:
# YMMV.WeAreTheWorld: AtTheGates: VindicatedByHistory: As noted by internet reviewer WebVideo/ToddInTheShadows, with OnceOriginalNowCommon; the "[[CharityMotivationSong charity single]]" genre has been parodied to death, which makes the selection huge influence of celebrities for the updated version (particularly Josh Groban, who ''has'' appeared in parodies ''Slaughter of the format) rather amusing.
# YMMV.ShelbyFlint: The popularity of disco music was already dwindling at a breakneck pace bySoul'' towards the time Shelby recorded her late '70s disco/funk melodic metalcore subgenre, coupled with the fact that Main/{{Metalcore}} itself has become a '''DeadHorseGenre''' leads to ''Slaughter'' becoming a significant album in heavy metal history. It is now seen as one of the four highly-influential MelodicDeathMetal albums along with Ian Jack.''[[Music/{{Carcass}} Heartwork]]'', ''[[Music/DarkTranquillity The Gallery]]'', and ''[[Music/InFlames The Jester Race]]''.
# YMMV.ShelbyFlint: The popularity of disco music was already dwindling at a breakneck pace by
# YMMV.ShelbyFlint: The popularity of disco music was already dwindling at a breakneck pace by the time Shelby recorded her late '70s disco/funk album with Ian Jack.
# YMMV.WeAreTheWorld: As noted by internet reviewer WebVideo/ToddInTheShadows, the "[[CharityMotivationSong charity single]]" genre has been parodied to death, which makes the selection of celebrities for the updated version (particularly Josh Groban, who ''has'' appeared in parodies of the format) rather amusing.
# YMMV.WeAreTheWorld: As noted by internet reviewer WebVideo/ToddInTheShadows, the "[[CharityMotivationSong charity single]]" genre has been parodied to death, which makes the selection of celebrities for the updated version (particularly Josh Groban, who ''has'' appeared in parodies of the format) rather amusing.
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[[folder: A combination of the above / Disliked music genres in general / Unclassifiable]]
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Note that some of these may simply have failed to bring up the "hated by critics specifically" or "used to be popular, but is now disliked" aspect.
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# {{Genres}}: '''ZCE. Or... zero-context index entry?'''
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# NewSoundAlbum: Music/TheByrds started out as a folk-rock group, but once it neared being a DeadHorseGenre they moved to psychedelic pop-rock with ''Fifth Dimension''. They later shifted to traditionalist country rock with ''Sweetheart of the Rodeo''.
# NuMetal: RescuedFromTheScrappyHeap:
** A select few bands, particularly outliers such as Music/{{Deftones}} and Music/SystemOfADown, among others, are well-respected by critics, some of which argue that they were never a part of the genre to begin with. In other countries, where the prejudice never existed, bands are proud to claim they were influenced by Korn, Limp Bizkit, Slipknot and other NuMetal bands. A few bands have been saved by '''[[DeadHorseGenre leaving the nu metal scene]]''' and [[GenreShift shifting]] to more technical music styles. The genre itself has received this somewhat in the '10s, where a more real and authentic style of nu metal emerged and has gained ground, avoiding the mistakes that killed it in the first place and becoming a recognized genre in it's own right (though still not without detractors).
** The fact that it became a '''DeadHorseGenre''' in the first place might be the reason why modern nu metal bands don't face nearly as much persecution from listeners as bands who played to the nu metal trend back during its peak. Bands like Issues, In This Moment, Emmure, Of Mice & Men, From Ashes to New, Bring Me the Horizon, Islander, Hacktivist, and the like are exploring genre by its own merits, rather than trying to cash in on a trend or being pressured by their labels to make them money off of a phenomenon. Since nu metal currently isn't an "in" trend, these bands are playing the genre (or at least integrating elements of it) [[DoingItForTheArt because they genuinely like it]], not just for a paycheck. They're aren't completely free from persecution, but people who dislike the bands have little to-do with the fact that it's nu metal.
# NuMetal: RescuedFromTheScrappyHeap:
** A select few bands, particularly outliers such as Music/{{Deftones}} and Music/SystemOfADown, among others, are well-respected by critics, some of which argue that they were never a part of the genre to begin with. In other countries, where the prejudice never existed, bands are proud to claim they were influenced by Korn, Limp Bizkit, Slipknot and other NuMetal bands. A few bands have been saved by '''[[DeadHorseGenre leaving the nu metal scene]]''' and [[GenreShift shifting]] to more technical music styles. The genre itself has received this somewhat in the '10s, where a more real and authentic style of nu metal emerged and has gained ground, avoiding the mistakes that killed it in the first place and becoming a recognized genre in it's own right (though still not without detractors).
** The fact that it became a '''DeadHorseGenre''' in the first place might be the reason why modern nu metal bands don't face nearly as much persecution from listeners as bands who played to the nu metal trend back during its peak. Bands like Issues, In This Moment, Emmure, Of Mice & Men, From Ashes to New, Bring Me the Horizon, Islander, Hacktivist, and the like are exploring genre by its own merits, rather than trying to cash in on a trend or being pressured by their labels to make them money off of a phenomenon. Since nu metal currently isn't an "in" trend, these bands are playing the genre (or at least integrating elements of it) [[DoingItForTheArt because they genuinely like it]], not just for a paycheck. They're aren't completely free from persecution, but people who dislike the bands have little to-do with the fact that it's nu metal.
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# PublicMediumIgnorance: '''ZCE. Or... zero-context index entry?'''
# {{Vaporwave}}: Some believe that vaporwave was ''very'' close to becoming this in 2013 before various albums released in the following years offered new takes on the genre and revitalized it. Others believe it already has.
** Vaporwave's influence eventually seeped into FutureFunk, a dance genre that's functionally identical to the filter house and nu-disco of TheAughts, but with the added aesthetics and sample sets of vaporwave.
# {{Vaporwave}}: Some believe that vaporwave was ''very'' close to becoming this in 2013 before various albums released in the following years offered new takes on the genre and revitalized it. Others believe it already has.
** Vaporwave's influence eventually seeped into FutureFunk, a dance genre that's functionally identical to the filter house and nu-disco of TheAughts, but with the added aesthetics and sample sets of vaporwave.
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# BrokenBase.{{Music}}: Speaking of gangster rap, there's a debate going on about whether or not the genre is '''[[DeadHorseGenre dead]]'''. Fans of the first wave of gangsta rappers (the anti-authoritarian, anti-establishment, and politically conscious era) felt that it died along time ago. Other, more cynical hip-hop fans (usually indie/alt-rap fans) feels that the current rap is no different from the earlier form, despite the fact that its more LighterAndSofter.
# CreatorKiller.Music: You can tell the creativity had dried up for the Music/DeadKennedys with their final album, 1986's ''Bedtime for Democracy''. The band had just survived a bitter obscenity trial for including a poster of Creator/HRGiger's ''Penis Landscape'' with their previous album, 1985's ''Frankenchrist'', one that left frontman Music/JelloBiafra's label Creator/AlternativeTentacles nearly bankrupt, and going into their next album ''Bedtime for Democracy'', they were drained. Even the band themselves seem to realize it, the song "Chickenshit Conformist" serving up a blistering damnation of a '''[[DeadHorseGenre dried-up punk scene]]''' and, in hindsight, almost a prediction that the Kennedys didn't have long left. Biafra would soon [[TheBandMinusTheFace split away from the band]] and start his own collaboration projects and spoken word albums.
# CreatorKiller.Music: You can tell the creativity had dried up for the Music/DeadKennedys with their final album, 1986's ''Bedtime for Democracy''. The band had just survived a bitter obscenity trial for including a poster of Creator/HRGiger's ''Penis Landscape'' with their previous album, 1985's ''Frankenchrist'', one that left frontman Music/JelloBiafra's label Creator/AlternativeTentacles nearly bankrupt, and going into their next album ''Bedtime for Democracy'', they were drained. Even the band themselves seem to realize it, the song "Chickenshit Conformist" serving up a blistering damnation of a '''[[DeadHorseGenre dried-up punk scene]]''' and, in hindsight, almost a prediction that the Kennedys didn't have long left. Biafra would soon [[TheBandMinusTheFace split away from the band]] and start his own collaboration projects and spoken word albums.
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# Music.DwightYoakam: He began his career in Nashville, Tennessee (what else would you expect?) in 1984, struggling at first since Honky Tonk was considered a DeadHorseGenre.
# Music.PrincesAssociates: Mazarati later moved away from Prince, signed with Motown Records and recorded another album, the '''[[DeadHorseGenre New Jack Swing-styled]]''' ''Mazarati 2'', before breaking up.
# PopularityPolynomial.{{Music}}: One ElectronicMusic genre that has benefited from the polynomial is {{Trance}}. The genre (one known for its more emotional and melodic compositions compared to other electronic genres) began in the early 90s, and grew to popularity within the European club and party scene through the decade, eventually splintering off to several different subgenres. Trance continued to maintain a very dedicated fandom that gradually grew more and more through the '00s all over the world, and while it did grow a fanbase stateside, it was harshly written off by house, DrumAndBass and {{techno}} fans as being [[{{Narm}} cheesy]] and [[{{Glurge}} sappy]], with numerous think-piece articles proclaiming trance had become a DeadHorseGenre. Not helping matters was the massive BrokenBase and countless arguments between fans over what was [[NoTrueScotsman "true" trance]]. Then TheNewTens came in and an EDM explosion took over America, and although trance wasn't ''quite'' as popular as ElectroHouse, TrapMusic, or {{dubstep}}, it still did benefit greatly from the boom, with several [=DJs=] experiencing a major surge of new fans. The immediate selling-out of tickets for Insomniac's Dreamstate festival (which primarily featured smaller-name producers in its lineup) became the topic of discussion as the genre making a major comeback.
# SeriousBusiness.{{Music}}: Music genres. People will argue to death trying to define a genre or deciding whether or not a piece of music falls under this razor-thin subgenre or that one. Notable examples include: [''irrelevant examples removed'']
** "What is REAL rap music?" Almost anything made after 1999 is seen as popcorn trash. On the opposite side, anything before 1999 is played-out and passe. The turning point was the time when '''[[DeadHorseGenre "Gangsta rap", Alternative Rap, Political Rap, Hardcore Hip-Hop]]''' and associated genres lost popularity among casual rap listeners, causing a [[FandomRivalry rift]] in those that followed new genres and those that preferred the old.
# YMMV.The77s: DeadHorseGenre: At Lost Dogs shows, Terry Taylor and Gene Eugene were fond of making fun of Roe for his other band's "boogie woogie music."
# YMMV.AtTheGates: VindicatedByHistory: As with OnceOriginalNowCommon; the huge influence of ''Slaughter of the Soul'' towards the melodic metalcore subgenre, coupled with the fact that Main/{{Metalcore}} itself has become a '''DeadHorseGenre''' leads to ''Slaughter'' becoming a significant album in heavy metal history. It is now seen as one of the four highly-influential MelodicDeathMetal albums along with ''[[Music/{{Carcass}} Heartwork]]'', ''[[Music/DarkTranquillity The Gallery]]'', and ''[[Music/InFlames The Jester Race]]''.
# Music.PrincesAssociates: Mazarati later moved away from Prince, signed with Motown Records and recorded another album, the '''[[DeadHorseGenre New Jack Swing-styled]]''' ''Mazarati 2'', before breaking up.
# PopularityPolynomial.{{Music}}: One ElectronicMusic genre that has benefited from the polynomial is {{Trance}}. The genre (one known for its more emotional and melodic compositions compared to other electronic genres) began in the early 90s, and grew to popularity within the European club and party scene through the decade, eventually splintering off to several different subgenres. Trance continued to maintain a very dedicated fandom that gradually grew more and more through the '00s all over the world, and while it did grow a fanbase stateside, it was harshly written off by house, DrumAndBass and {{techno}} fans as being [[{{Narm}} cheesy]] and [[{{Glurge}} sappy]], with numerous think-piece articles proclaiming trance had become a DeadHorseGenre. Not helping matters was the massive BrokenBase and countless arguments between fans over what was [[NoTrueScotsman "true" trance]]. Then TheNewTens came in and an EDM explosion took over America, and although trance wasn't ''quite'' as popular as ElectroHouse, TrapMusic, or {{dubstep}}, it still did benefit greatly from the boom, with several [=DJs=] experiencing a major surge of new fans. The immediate selling-out of tickets for Insomniac's Dreamstate festival (which primarily featured smaller-name producers in its lineup) became the topic of discussion as the genre making a major comeback.
# SeriousBusiness.{{Music}}: Music genres. People will argue to death trying to define a genre or deciding whether or not a piece of music falls under this razor-thin subgenre or that one. Notable examples include: [''irrelevant examples removed'']
** "What is REAL rap music?" Almost anything made after 1999 is seen as popcorn trash. On the opposite side, anything before 1999 is played-out and passe. The turning point was the time when '''[[DeadHorseGenre "Gangsta rap", Alternative Rap, Political Rap, Hardcore Hip-Hop]]''' and associated genres lost popularity among casual rap listeners, causing a [[FandomRivalry rift]] in those that followed new genres and those that preferred the old.
# YMMV.The77s: DeadHorseGenre: At Lost Dogs shows, Terry Taylor and Gene Eugene were fond of making fun of Roe for his other band's "boogie woogie music."
# YMMV.AtTheGates: VindicatedByHistory: As with OnceOriginalNowCommon; the huge influence of ''Slaughter of the Soul'' towards the melodic metalcore subgenre, coupled with the fact that Main/{{Metalcore}} itself has become a '''DeadHorseGenre''' leads to ''Slaughter'' becoming a significant album in heavy metal history. It is now seen as one of the four highly-influential MelodicDeathMetal albums along with ''[[Music/{{Carcass}} Heartwork]]'', ''[[Music/DarkTranquillity The Gallery]]'', and ''[[Music/InFlames The Jester Race]]''.
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# YMMV.JoshGroban: Has done a Christmas album. Ironically, it's his best-selling.
# YMMV.{{Magma}}: A potential criticism of the band. Then again, [[Music/SexPistols Johnny]] [[Music/PublicImageLtd Rotten]] is a fan...
# YMMV.{{Motown}}: The trope page suggests that Motown is the exception to this trope in the manufactured bands category, but there are probably more than a few listeners or critics who dislike the formulaic, factory-like Motown production process. This was certainly the case in TheSeventies, when many rock and funk musicians [[RockIsAuthenticPopIsShallow placed their music in opposition]] to what they often derided as "Toytown". '''Seems to be about general people disliking manufactured bands? Probably a better fit for CriticProof.'''
# YMMV.{{Magma}}: A potential criticism of the band. Then again, [[Music/SexPistols Johnny]] [[Music/PublicImageLtd Rotten]] is a fan...
# YMMV.{{Motown}}: The trope page suggests that Motown is the exception to this trope in the manufactured bands category, but there are probably more than a few listeners or critics who dislike the formulaic, factory-like Motown production process. This was certainly the case in TheSeventies, when many rock and funk musicians [[RockIsAuthenticPopIsShallow placed their music in opposition]] to what they often derided as "Toytown". '''Seems to be about general people disliking manufactured bands? Probably a better fit for CriticProof.'''
to:
# YMMV.JoshGroban: Has done a Christmas album. Ironically, it's his best-selling.
# YMMV.{{Magma}}: A potential criticism of the band. Then again, [[Music/SexPistols Johnny]] [[Music/PublicImageLtd Rotten]] is a fan...
# YMMV.{{Motown}}: The trope page suggestsbest-selling. '''Vaguely hints that Motown is the exception to this trope in the manufactured bands category, but there are probably more than a few listeners or critics who dislike the formulaic, factory-like Motown production process. This was certainly the case in TheSeventies, when many rock and funk musicians [[RockIsAuthenticPopIsShallow placed their Christmas music in opposition]] to what they often derided as "Toytown". '''Seems to be about general people disliking manufactured bands? Probably a better fit for CriticProof.'''is disliked'''
# YMMV.{{Magma}}: A potential criticism of the band. Then again, [[Music/SexPistols Johnny]] [[Music/PublicImageLtd Rotten]] is a fan...
# YMMV.{{Motown}}: The trope page suggests
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[[folder:Non-music examples]]
to:
[[folder: Zero-Context Examples and other undeterminable examples (8/50, 16%)]]
# {{Genres}}: '''ZCE. Or... zero-context index entry?'''
# NewSoundAlbum: Music/TheByrds started out as a folk-rock group, but once it neared being a DeadHorseGenre they moved to psychedelic pop-rock with ''Fifth Dimension''. They later shifted to traditionalist country rock with ''Sweetheart of the Rodeo''.
# NuMetal: RescuedFromTheScrappyHeap:
** A select few bands, particularly outliers such as Music/{{Deftones}} and Music/SystemOfADown, among others, are well-respected by critics, some of which argue that they were never a part of the genre to begin with. In other countries, where the prejudice never existed, bands are proud to claim they were influenced by Korn, Limp Bizkit, Slipknot and other NuMetal bands. A few bands have been saved by '''[[DeadHorseGenre leaving the nu metal scene]]''' and [[GenreShift shifting]] to more technical music styles. The genre itself has received this somewhat in the '10s, where a more real and authentic style of nu metal emerged and has gained ground, avoiding the mistakes that killed it in the first place and becoming a recognized genre in it's own right (though still not without detractors).
** The fact that it became a '''DeadHorseGenre''' in the first place might be the reason why modern nu metal bands don't face nearly as much persecution from listeners as bands who played to the nu metal trend back during its peak. Bands like Issues, In This Moment, Emmure, Of Mice & Men, From Ashes to New, Bring Me the Horizon, Islander, Hacktivist, and the like are exploring genre by its own merits, rather than trying to cash in on a trend or being pressured by their labels to make them money off of a phenomenon. Since nu metal currently isn't an "in" trend, these bands are playing the genre (or at least integrating elements of it) [[DoingItForTheArt because they genuinely like it]], not just for a paycheck. They're aren't completely free from persecution, but people who dislike the bands have little to-do with the fact that it's nu metal.
# PublicMediumIgnorance: '''ZCE. Or... zero-context index entry?'''
# {{Vaporwave}}: Some believe that vaporwave was ''very'' close to becoming this in 2013 before various albums released in the following years offered new takes on the genre and revitalized it. Others believe it already has.
** Vaporwave's influence eventually seeped into FutureFunk, a dance genre that's functionally identical to the filter house and nu-disco of TheAughts, but with the added aesthetics and sample sets of vaporwave.
# Music.PrincesAssociates: Mazarati later moved away from Prince, signed with Motown Records and recorded another album, the '''[[DeadHorseGenre New Jack Swing-styled]]''' ''Mazarati 2'', before breaking up. '''NewJackSwing is a former member of CondemnedByHistory.{{Music}} that was removed during a cleanup -- it was deemed to suffer from HypeBacklash. Regardless, I'll list this as unclassifiable because the mention itself has no additional context.'''
# YMMV.{{Magma}}: A potential criticism of the band. Then again, [[Music/SexPistols Johnny]] [[Music/PublicImageLtd Rotten]] is a fan...
# YMMV.{{Motown}}: The trope page suggests that Motown is the exception to this trope in the manufactured bands category, but there are probably more than a few listeners or critics who dislike the formulaic, factory-like Motown production process. This was certainly the case in TheSeventies, when many rock and funk musicians [[RockIsAuthenticPopIsShallow placed their music in opposition]] to what they often derided as "Toytown". '''Seems to be about general people disliking manufactured bands? Probably a better fit for CriticProof.'''
[[/folder]]
[[folder:Non-musicexamples]]examples (5/50, 10%)]]
# {{Genres}}: '''ZCE. Or... zero-context index entry?'''
# NewSoundAlbum: Music/TheByrds started out as a folk-rock group, but once it neared being a DeadHorseGenre they moved to psychedelic pop-rock with ''Fifth Dimension''. They later shifted to traditionalist country rock with ''Sweetheart of the Rodeo''.
# NuMetal: RescuedFromTheScrappyHeap:
** A select few bands, particularly outliers such as Music/{{Deftones}} and Music/SystemOfADown, among others, are well-respected by critics, some of which argue that they were never a part of the genre to begin with. In other countries, where the prejudice never existed, bands are proud to claim they were influenced by Korn, Limp Bizkit, Slipknot and other NuMetal bands. A few bands have been saved by '''[[DeadHorseGenre leaving the nu metal scene]]''' and [[GenreShift shifting]] to more technical music styles. The genre itself has received this somewhat in the '10s, where a more real and authentic style of nu metal emerged and has gained ground, avoiding the mistakes that killed it in the first place and becoming a recognized genre in it's own right (though still not without detractors).
** The fact that it became a '''DeadHorseGenre''' in the first place might be the reason why modern nu metal bands don't face nearly as much persecution from listeners as bands who played to the nu metal trend back during its peak. Bands like Issues, In This Moment, Emmure, Of Mice & Men, From Ashes to New, Bring Me the Horizon, Islander, Hacktivist, and the like are exploring genre by its own merits, rather than trying to cash in on a trend or being pressured by their labels to make them money off of a phenomenon. Since nu metal currently isn't an "in" trend, these bands are playing the genre (or at least integrating elements of it) [[DoingItForTheArt because they genuinely like it]], not just for a paycheck. They're aren't completely free from persecution, but people who dislike the bands have little to-do with the fact that it's nu metal.
# PublicMediumIgnorance: '''ZCE. Or... zero-context index entry?'''
# {{Vaporwave}}: Some believe that vaporwave was ''very'' close to becoming this in 2013 before various albums released in the following years offered new takes on the genre and revitalized it. Others believe it already has.
** Vaporwave's influence eventually seeped into FutureFunk, a dance genre that's functionally identical to the filter house and nu-disco of TheAughts, but with the added aesthetics and sample sets of vaporwave.
# Music.PrincesAssociates: Mazarati later moved away from Prince, signed with Motown Records and recorded another album, the '''[[DeadHorseGenre New Jack Swing-styled]]''' ''Mazarati 2'', before breaking up. '''NewJackSwing is a former member of CondemnedByHistory.{{Music}} that was removed during a cleanup -- it was deemed to suffer from HypeBacklash. Regardless, I'll list this as unclassifiable because the mention itself has no additional context.'''
# YMMV.{{Magma}}: A potential criticism of the band. Then again, [[Music/SexPistols Johnny]] [[Music/PublicImageLtd Rotten]] is a fan...
# YMMV.{{Motown}}: The trope page suggests that Motown is the exception to this trope in the manufactured bands category, but there are probably more than a few listeners or critics who dislike the formulaic, factory-like Motown production process. This was certainly the case in TheSeventies, when many rock and funk musicians [[RockIsAuthenticPopIsShallow placed their music in opposition]] to what they often derided as "Toytown". '''Seems to be about general people disliking manufactured bands? Probably a better fit for CriticProof.'''
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# BrokenBase.{{Music}}: Speaking of gangster rap, there's a debate going on about whether or not the genre is '''[[DeadHorseGenre dead]]'''. Fans of the first wave of gangsta rappers (the anti-authoritarian, anti-establishment, and politically conscious era) felt that it died along time ago. Other, more cynical hip-hop fans (usually indie/alt-rap fans) feels that the current rap is no different from the earlier form, despite the fact that its more LighterAndSofter. '''Here, the question of "is the GangstaRap genre dead?" seems to be "is a substantial amount of new Gangsta Rap works still being produced, or are the modern ones so much LighterAndSofter that they don't count?"'''
# CreatorKiller.Music: You can tell the creativity had dried up for the Music/DeadKennedys with their final album, 1986's ''Bedtime for Democracy''. The band had just survived a bitter obscenity trial for including a poster of Creator/HRGiger's ''Penis Landscape'' with their previous album, 1985's ''Frankenchrist'', one that left frontman Music/JelloBiafra's label Creator/AlternativeTentacles nearly bankrupt, and going into their next album ''Bedtime for Democracy'', they were drained. Even the band themselves seem to realize it, the song "Chickenshit Conformist" serving up a blistering damnation of a '''[[DeadHorseGenre dried-up punk scene]]''' and, in hindsight, almost a prediction that the Kennedys didn't have long left. Biafra would soon [[TheBandMinusTheFace split away from the band]] and start his own collaboration projects and spoken word albums. '''Seems to think punk is dead because people largely stopped making it'''
# Music.DwightYoakam: He began his career in Nashville, Tennessee (what else would you expect?) in 1984, struggling at first since Honky Tonk was considered a DeadHorseGenre. '''Not sure if "Honky Tonk is disliked", "Honky Tonk used to be popular and faced backlash later" or "Honky Tonk is a dead genre with no new works being released, which led to this Honky Tonk artist struggling to find an audience"
# PopularityPolynomial.{{Music}}: One ElectronicMusic genre that has benefited from the polynomial is {{Trance}}. The genre (one known for its more emotional and melodic compositions compared to other electronic genres) began in the early 90s, and grew to popularity within the European club and party scene through the decade, eventually splintering off to several different subgenres. Trance continued to maintain a very dedicated fandom that gradually grew more and more through the '00s all over the world, and while it did grow a fanbase stateside, it was harshly written off by house, DrumAndBass and {{techno}} fans as being [[{{Narm}} cheesy]] and [[{{Glurge}} sappy]], with numerous think-piece articles proclaiming trance had become a '''DeadHorseGenre'''. Not helping matters was the massive BrokenBase and countless arguments between fans over what was [[NoTrueScotsman "true" trance]]. Then TheNewTens came in and an EDM explosion took over America, and although trance wasn't ''quite'' as popular as ElectroHouse, TrapMusic, or {{dubstep}}, it still did benefit greatly from the boom, with several [=DJs=] experiencing a major surge of new fans. The immediate selling-out of tickets for Insomniac's Dreamstate festival (which primarily featured smaller-name producers in its lineup) became the topic of discussion as the genre making a major comeback. '''A weird example that blames a PeripheryHatedom for the genre's temporary downfall'''
# YMMV.The77s: DeadHorseGenre: At Lost Dogs shows, Terry Taylor and Gene Eugene were fond of making fun of Roe for his other band's "boogie woogie music." '''Seems to be a misplaced In-Universe example, but regardless it's hard to tell what folder the "boogie woogie music" would belong to.'''
[[folder:Other (5/50, 10%)]]
# BrokenBase.{{Music}}: Speaking of gangster rap, there's a debate going on about whether or not the genre is '''[[DeadHorseGenre dead]]'''. Fans of the first wave of gangsta rappers (the anti-authoritarian, anti-establishment, and politically conscious era) felt that it died along time ago. Other, more cynical hip-hop fans (usually indie/alt-rap fans) feels that the current rap is no different from the earlier form, despite the fact that its more LighterAndSofter. '''Here, the question of "is the GangstaRap genre dead?" seems to be "is a substantial amount of new Gangsta Rap works still being produced, or are the modern ones so much LighterAndSofter that they don't count?"'''
# CreatorKiller.Music: You can tell the creativity had dried up for the Music/DeadKennedys with their final album, 1986's ''Bedtime for Democracy''. The band had just survived a bitter obscenity trial for including a poster of Creator/HRGiger's ''Penis Landscape'' with their previous album, 1985's ''Frankenchrist'', one that left frontman Music/JelloBiafra's label Creator/AlternativeTentacles nearly bankrupt, and going into their next album ''Bedtime for Democracy'', they were drained. Even the band themselves seem to realize it, the song "Chickenshit Conformist" serving up a blistering damnation of a '''[[DeadHorseGenre dried-up punk scene]]''' and, in hindsight, almost a prediction that the Kennedys didn't have long left. Biafra would soon [[TheBandMinusTheFace split away from the band]] and start his own collaboration projects and spoken word albums. '''Seems to think punk is dead because people largely stopped making it'''
# Music.DwightYoakam: He began his career in Nashville, Tennessee (what else would you expect?) in 1984, struggling at first since Honky Tonk was considered a DeadHorseGenre. '''Not sure if "Honky Tonk is disliked", "Honky Tonk used to be popular and faced backlash later" or "Honky Tonk is a dead genre with no new works being released, which led to this Honky Tonk artist struggling to find an audience"
# PopularityPolynomial.{{Music}}: One ElectronicMusic genre that has benefited from the polynomial is {{Trance}}. The genre (one known for its more emotional and melodic compositions compared to other electronic genres) began in the early 90s, and grew to popularity within the European club and party scene through the decade, eventually splintering off to several different subgenres. Trance continued to maintain a very dedicated fandom that gradually grew more and more through the '00s all over the world, and while it did grow a fanbase stateside, it was harshly written off by house, DrumAndBass and {{techno}} fans as being [[{{Narm}} cheesy]] and [[{{Glurge}} sappy]], with numerous think-piece articles proclaiming trance had become a '''DeadHorseGenre'''. Not helping matters was the massive BrokenBase and countless arguments between fans over what was [[NoTrueScotsman "true" trance]]. Then TheNewTens came in and an EDM explosion took over America, and although trance wasn't ''quite'' as popular as ElectroHouse, TrapMusic, or {{dubstep}}, it still did benefit greatly from the boom, with several [=DJs=] experiencing a major surge of new fans. The immediate selling-out of tickets for Insomniac's Dreamstate festival (which primarily featured smaller-name producers in its lineup) became the topic of discussion as the genre making a major comeback. '''A weird example that blames a PeripheryHatedom for the genre's temporary downfall'''
# YMMV.The77s: DeadHorseGenre: At Lost Dogs shows, Terry Taylor and Gene Eugene were fond of making fun of Roe for his other band's "boogie woogie music." '''Seems to be a misplaced In-Universe example, but regardless it's hard to tell what folder the "boogie woogie music" would belong to.'''
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* PeripheryHatedom
* ProgressiveRock
* PublicMediumIgnorance
* SoapOpera
* Archive.AdOfWinArchive2010
* AudienceAlienatingEra.{{Music}}
* BrokenBase.{{Music}}
* FanonDiscontinuity.{{Music}}
* Fridge.TVTropes
* Funny.ToddInTheShadows2016Episodes
* GenreKiller.{{Music}}
* GenreMotif.{{Showtunes}}
* JustForFun.TropeNameInjokes
* Music.ArminVanBuuren
* Music.DwightYoakam
* Music.PrincesAssociates
* NetworkDecay.NotableAversions
* PopularityPolynomial.{{Music}}
* ToddInTheShadows.TropesDToF
* Trivia.DaysGone
* WebVideo.CrashThompson
* YMMV.BrutalLegend
* YMMV.HomePage
* YMMV.JoshGroban
* YMMV.KingCrimson
* PeripheryHatedom
* ProgressiveRock
* PublicMediumIgnorance
* SoapOpera
* Archive.AdOfWinArchive2010
* AudienceAlienatingEra.{{Music}}
* BrokenBase.{{Music}}
* FanonDiscontinuity.{{Music}}
* Fridge.TVTropes
* Funny.ToddInTheShadows2016Episodes
* GenreKiller.{{Music}}
* GenreMotif.{{Showtunes}}
* JustForFun.TropeNameInjokes
* Music.ArminVanBuuren
* Music.DwightYoakam
* Music.PrincesAssociates
* NetworkDecay.NotableAversions
* PopularityPolynomial.{{Music}}
* ToddInTheShadows.TropesDToF
* Trivia.DaysGone
* WebVideo.CrashThompson
* YMMV.BrutalLegend
* YMMV.HomePage
* YMMV.JoshGroban
* YMMV.KingCrimson
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* PeripheryHatedom
* ProgressiveRock
* PublicMediumIgnorance
* SoapOpera
* Archive.AdOfWinArchive2010
* AudienceAlienatingEra.{{Music}}
* BrokenBase.{{Music}}
* FanonDiscontinuity.{{Music}}
* Fridge.TVTropes
* Funny.ToddInTheShadows2016Episodes
* GenreKiller.{{Music}}
* GenreMotif.{{Showtunes}}
* JustForFun.TropeNameInjokes
* Music.ArminVanBuuren
* Music.DwightYoakam
* Music.PrincesAssociates
* NetworkDecay.NotableAversions
* PopularityPolynomial.{{Music}}
* ToddInTheShadows.TropesDToF
* Trivia.DaysGone
* WebVideo.CrashThompson
* YMMV.BrutalLegend
* YMMV.HomePage
* YMMV.JoshGroban
* YMMV.KingCrimson
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# ProgressiveRock: Critics, who usually believe in ThreeChordsAndTheTruth, have tended to hate the genre, even during its heyday in the early '70s. Today, they still hold prog up as the ''[[DiscoSucks other]]'' reason '70s music sucked so much. This is probably influenced by Lester Bangs' and Robert Christgau's disdain for prog. The critical darlings of the first half of the '70s were {{Singer Songwriter}}s like Music/BobDylan and Music/JoniMitchell and ProtoPunk bands like the Music/NewYorkDolls and Music/TheStooges, while critics went for PunkRock, PostPunk and NewWaveMusic in the second half. A prominent exception is Allmusic, which has given several famous prog albums the maximum rating of five stars, as is the Italian writer Creator/PieroScaruffi, who ranks prog albums as two of his top three albums ever made (three of three if you count Beefheart as prog). Pitchfork has been known to give prog records good reviews on occasion as well [[note]]for example, it gave a 9/10 rating to Music/{{Yes}}' ''Close to the Edge'', a 9.4/10 rating to Music/PinkFloyd's ''Music/ThePiperAtTheGatesOfDawn'' - which might have been a 10/10 if they had perceived the reissue to be of higher quality - and a 10/10 rating to Music/PinkFloyd's ''Music/{{Animals|1977}}''[[/note]], but on the whole it much more frequently lambastes them. And, for that matter, even Christgau has given good reviews to prog records on occasion (Music/HenryCow, Music/PinkFloyd, Music/KingCrimson, etc.). Other than that, the only positive press coverage prog artists usually get is in magazines catering to musicians. Despite this, and no doubt precisely ''because'' of its appeal to musicians, the genre still has a number of {{Spiritual Successor}}s and other lasting influences on modern music; see below.
# Funny.ToddInTheShadows2016Episodes: In an otherwise vaguely positive review, Todd gets annoyed by the fact that the version that got famous is a remix, and wants to hear the original... which he immediately and passionately hates (due to it being a [[PetPeeveTrope White Guy With]] '''[[DeadHorseGenre Acoustic Guitar Song]]'''), to the point of pulling a knife on it. '''This is a pet peeve of music critic Todd in the Shadows, but there's no context on how critics in general feel about it'''
# GenreKiller.{{Music}} (2): {{Shoegazing}} is a rare example -- an album so ''good'' it killed its own genre for quite some time. Music/MyBloodyValentine's 1991 album ''Music/{{Loveless}}'' is widely believed to have turned shoegazing into a DeadHorseGenre nonetheless, with almost every other band in the scene receiving a hostile critical reaction for trying to sound like My Bloody Valentine. The fact that My Bloody Valentine's third album, ''MBV'', was [[DevelopmentHell 21 years in the making]] didn't help at all; the scene was soon supplanted by {{Britpop}}. This ended up derailing more than a few careers (Music/{{Slowdive}} was notably plagued by this; ''Souvlaki'' is [[VindicatedByHistory now often mentioned in the same breath]] as ''Loveless'' and sometimes even considered to be ''better''). Fortunately, it wasn't permanent -- [[GenreRelaunch interest in shoegazing came back in the 2000s and 2010s.]]
# Music.ArminVanBuuren: PrecisionFStrike: At [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQ25w4WxFys&feature=youtu.be&t=5m16s one interview]], he actually tells the journalists that called {{trance}} a DeadHorseGenre to "go fuck themselves".
# YMMV.BrutalLegend: Given that this is a game about Metal, there's sure to be plenty of ribbing of unpopular music styles - such as the Hair Metal-themed villain group ([[{{Hypocrite}} despite the fact there are multiple hair metal songs on the soundtrack]]). {{Subverted}} because this is a game set in a world without critics to badmouth any specific genre. Any Metal in this game, that is not said to be awful in game, [[WordOfGod is an affectionate nod to its genre]]. Rob Halford even said, "[Lionwhyte] is a cross-section of everything I know and love in Heavy Metal music.".
# YMMV.KingCrimson: Seems to be averted, since even some normally prog-averse critics such as Robert Christgau have praised some of their albums (e.g., ''Red''). Alongside Music/PinkFloyd, they seem to be one of the few prog bands that even prog-skeptic listeners will admit to liking.
# Funny.ToddInTheShadows2016Episodes: In an otherwise vaguely positive review, Todd gets annoyed by the fact that the version that got famous is a remix, and wants to hear the original... which he immediately and passionately hates (due to it being a [[PetPeeveTrope White Guy With]] '''[[DeadHorseGenre Acoustic Guitar Song]]'''), to the point of pulling a knife on it. '''This is a pet peeve of music critic Todd in the Shadows, but there's no context on how critics in general feel about it'''
# GenreKiller.{{Music}} (2): {{Shoegazing}} is a rare example -- an album so ''good'' it killed its own genre for quite some time. Music/MyBloodyValentine's 1991 album ''Music/{{Loveless}}'' is widely believed to have turned shoegazing into a DeadHorseGenre nonetheless, with almost every other band in the scene receiving a hostile critical reaction for trying to sound like My Bloody Valentine. The fact that My Bloody Valentine's third album, ''MBV'', was [[DevelopmentHell 21 years in the making]] didn't help at all; the scene was soon supplanted by {{Britpop}}. This ended up derailing more than a few careers (Music/{{Slowdive}} was notably plagued by this; ''Souvlaki'' is [[VindicatedByHistory now often mentioned in the same breath]] as ''Loveless'' and sometimes even considered to be ''better''). Fortunately, it wasn't permanent -- [[GenreRelaunch interest in shoegazing came back in the 2000s and 2010s.]]
# Music.ArminVanBuuren: PrecisionFStrike: At [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQ25w4WxFys&feature=youtu.be&t=5m16s one interview]], he actually tells the journalists that called {{trance}} a DeadHorseGenre to "go fuck themselves".
# YMMV.BrutalLegend: Given that this is a game about Metal, there's sure to be plenty of ribbing of unpopular music styles - such as the Hair Metal-themed villain group ([[{{Hypocrite}} despite the fact there are multiple hair metal songs on the soundtrack]]). {{Subverted}} because this is a game set in a world without critics to badmouth any specific genre. Any Metal in this game, that is not said to be awful in game, [[WordOfGod is an affectionate nod to its genre]]. Rob Halford even said, "[Lionwhyte] is a cross-section of everything I know and love in Heavy Metal music.".
# YMMV.KingCrimson: Seems to be averted, since even some normally prog-averse critics such as Robert Christgau have praised some of their albums (e.g., ''Red''). Alongside Music/PinkFloyd, they seem to be one of the few prog bands that even prog-skeptic listeners will admit to liking.
# AudienceAlienatingEra.{{Music}}: Who knew that Music/{{KISS}}, the hottest band in the world, could be so plagued by a long history of bad career decisions?
** It's often ignored that KISS was pretty obscure in their first year or so. '''[[DeadHorseGenre Glam rock was on its way out in the United States]]''' by 1974 (even Music/AliceCooper was moving away from it), and [[Music/KissAlbum KISS's debut album]] was [[GermansLoveDavidHasselhoff more popular in Japan than in the US.]] They only broke out with ''Music/DressedToKill'', the point where they refined the live theatrics they've become so famous for.
# FanonDiscontinuity.{{Music}}:
** Sometimes, it's easy to ignore music from the favourite artist of a fandom that they perceive end up sucking. If this happens to an entire genre of music, it becomes a '''DeadHorseGenre'''.
** A number of Music/{{KISS}} fans prefer to pretend there was never a time when the band performed without the makeup. Another group would like to throw '''[[DeadHorseGenre the disco album]]''' in there as well.
# GenreKiller.Music:
** In fact, the gradual "decline" of rock music in general from the mainstream consciousness between the mid-'90s and the early '10s can't really be attributed to a single factor or album, but rather, to a series of complex circumstances and societal changes, enough to potentially fill an entire book and far too complex in size and scope for this wiki alone to effectively cover. A good comparison might be the disappearance of {{jazz}} from the mainstream. It did not die overnight like [[DiscoSucks disco]], nor was it '''[[DeadHorseGenre the last stand of classical music]]''' in the mainstream. Rather, its decline [[https://www.cnn.com/2016/09/25/entertainment/cnnphotos-jim-marshall-jazz/index.html unfolded over several decades]] in the latter half of the 20th century that saw its image go from "hip dance music" to "elitist, old-fashioned museum piece". Ironically, rock played a key role in jazz's decline by seizing its mantle as the music of the young, with critics [[https://www.thecrimson.com/article/1965/5/19/the-decline-of-jazz-pif-there/ noting]] as early as TheSixties that jazz was no longer as cool as it used to be. The silver lining was that moving out of the mainstream allowed jazz to escape the creative stagnation that had resulted from being there, and some commentators are speculating that the same may happen to rock.
** What few will argue is that grunge gave a single unified image to the growing backlash, as while it didn't single-handedly kill the genre as most people believe, it was the last nail in the coffin for what was already becoming a DeadHorseGenre. As a result, since hair metal was the dominant genre of metal music in the mainstream rock scene, metal as a whole faded from the limelight for much of TheNineties. While some genres avoided this, the general rule was that as long as you paid due reverence to '80s Main/AlternativeRock (Music/TheSmiths, Music/{{REM}}) and Main/HardcorePunk (Music/MinorThreat, Music/BlackFlag) or played something abrasive and unquestionably anti-mainstream, it was okay to play metal in TheNineties.
# Fridge.TVTropes: When you read the trope DeadHorseGenre, you come to the realization that: a.) practically anything and everything that ever got a lick of success anywhere in the world gets to be a DHG eventually; b.) a lot of the styles mentioned as a DHG were competing against each other in the same pop culture space, and maybe were even ''conceived'' as an antidote or antithesis to another popular style; c.) if they were popular once, [[PopularityPolynomial they may well become popular again]] with at least ''somebody'', at least if given a new lease on life, and d.) because the styles did become [[HypeBacklash popular to the point of overkill]], HypeBacklash and a certain amount of Fan Dumb will always be a factor in the perception of those styles of music. The critics and tastemakers who declared them "dead" often ''were'' [[AscendedFan ascended fans]], after all, perhaps [[ItsPopularNowItSucks overreacting to a style's overexposure]], [[OpinionMyopia not necessarily fans of the style (or fans of a different style) to begin with]], and/or [[SturgeonsLaw whining about the amount of below-average examples that inevitably rears its head as more and more people adopt that genre]].
# ToddInTheShadows.TropesDToF:
** One of his biggest problems with the remake of "We Are The World" is that the "MegaCrossover for charity" genre has passed the point of parody. He also points out that many of the contributors had already spoofed the genre, with emphasis on Music/JoshGroban.
** He also considers club anthems to be heading in this direction. When LMFAO used a ZombieApocalypse theme in one of their videos, he claimed a zombie was a perfect analogy for the genre; technically dead, but still moving.
** It's often ignored that KISS was pretty obscure in their first year or so. '''[[DeadHorseGenre Glam rock was on its way out in the United States]]''' by 1974 (even Music/AliceCooper was moving away from it), and [[Music/KissAlbum KISS's debut album]] was [[GermansLoveDavidHasselhoff more popular in Japan than in the US.]] They only broke out with ''Music/DressedToKill'', the point where they refined the live theatrics they've become so famous for.
# FanonDiscontinuity.{{Music}}:
** Sometimes, it's easy to ignore music from the favourite artist of a fandom that they perceive end up sucking. If this happens to an entire genre of music, it becomes a '''DeadHorseGenre'''.
** A number of Music/{{KISS}} fans prefer to pretend there was never a time when the band performed without the makeup. Another group would like to throw '''[[DeadHorseGenre the disco album]]''' in there as well.
# GenreKiller.Music:
** In fact, the gradual "decline" of rock music in general from the mainstream consciousness between the mid-'90s and the early '10s can't really be attributed to a single factor or album, but rather, to a series of complex circumstances and societal changes, enough to potentially fill an entire book and far too complex in size and scope for this wiki alone to effectively cover. A good comparison might be the disappearance of {{jazz}} from the mainstream. It did not die overnight like [[DiscoSucks disco]], nor was it '''[[DeadHorseGenre the last stand of classical music]]''' in the mainstream. Rather, its decline [[https://www.cnn.com/2016/09/25/entertainment/cnnphotos-jim-marshall-jazz/index.html unfolded over several decades]] in the latter half of the 20th century that saw its image go from "hip dance music" to "elitist, old-fashioned museum piece". Ironically, rock played a key role in jazz's decline by seizing its mantle as the music of the young, with critics [[https://www.thecrimson.com/article/1965/5/19/the-decline-of-jazz-pif-there/ noting]] as early as TheSixties that jazz was no longer as cool as it used to be. The silver lining was that moving out of the mainstream allowed jazz to escape the creative stagnation that had resulted from being there, and some commentators are speculating that the same may happen to rock.
** What few will argue is that grunge gave a single unified image to the growing backlash, as while it didn't single-handedly kill the genre as most people believe, it was the last nail in the coffin for what was already becoming a DeadHorseGenre. As a result, since hair metal was the dominant genre of metal music in the mainstream rock scene, metal as a whole faded from the limelight for much of TheNineties. While some genres avoided this, the general rule was that as long as you paid due reverence to '80s Main/AlternativeRock (Music/TheSmiths, Music/{{REM}}) and Main/HardcorePunk (Music/MinorThreat, Music/BlackFlag) or played something abrasive and unquestionably anti-mainstream, it was okay to play metal in TheNineties.
# Fridge.TVTropes: When you read the trope DeadHorseGenre, you come to the realization that: a.) practically anything and everything that ever got a lick of success anywhere in the world gets to be a DHG eventually; b.) a lot of the styles mentioned as a DHG were competing against each other in the same pop culture space, and maybe were even ''conceived'' as an antidote or antithesis to another popular style; c.) if they were popular once, [[PopularityPolynomial they may well become popular again]] with at least ''somebody'', at least if given a new lease on life, and d.) because the styles did become [[HypeBacklash popular to the point of overkill]], HypeBacklash and a certain amount of Fan Dumb will always be a factor in the perception of those styles of music. The critics and tastemakers who declared them "dead" often ''were'' [[AscendedFan ascended fans]], after all, perhaps [[ItsPopularNowItSucks overreacting to a style's overexposure]], [[OpinionMyopia not necessarily fans of the style (or fans of a different style) to begin with]], and/or [[SturgeonsLaw whining about the amount of below-average examples that inevitably rears its head as more and more people adopt that genre]].
# ToddInTheShadows.TropesDToF:
** One of his biggest problems with the remake of "We Are The World" is that the "MegaCrossover for charity" genre has passed the point of parody. He also points out that many of the contributors had already spoofed the genre, with emphasis on Music/JoshGroban.
** He also considers club anthems to be heading in this direction. When LMFAO used a ZombieApocalypse theme in one of their videos, he claimed a zombie was a perfect analogy for the genre; technically dead, but still moving.
# PublicMediumIgnorance: '''ZCE. Or... zero-context index entry?'''
# Archive.AdOfWinArchive2010: @/{{TheAmazingIowan}}: DeadHorseGenre shows up with an ad for "Now That's What I Call Music 36", featuring Katy Perry, Usher, Taio Cruz, Neon Trees, Nelly, & More! I think we know what the Ad Server thinks of modern pop...
# BrokenBase.{{Music}}: Speaking of gangster rap, there's a debate going on about whether or not the genre is '''[[DeadHorseGenre dead]]'''. Fans of the first wave of gangsta rappers (the anti-authoritarian, anti-establishment, and politically conscious era) felt that it died along time ago. Other, more cynical hip-hop fans (usually indie/alt-rap fans) feels that the current rap is no different from the earlier form, despite the fact that its more LighterAndSofter.
# BrokenBase.{{Music}}: Speaking of gangster rap, there's a debate going on about whether or not the genre is '''[[DeadHorseGenre dead]]'''. Fans of the first wave of gangsta rappers (the anti-authoritarian, anti-establishment, and politically conscious era) felt that it died along time ago. Other, more cynical hip-hop fans (usually indie/alt-rap fans) feels that the current rap is no different from the earlier form, despite the fact that its more LighterAndSofter.
# GenreMotif.{{Showtunes}}: As a DeadHorseGenre, it's almost never shown in a positive light outside of its own context.
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# SeriousBusiness.{{Music}}: * Music genres. People will argue to death trying to define a genre or deciding whether or not a piece of music falls under this razor-thin subgenre or that one. Notable examples include: [''irrelevant examples removed'']
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# Music.DwightYoakam: He began his career in Nashville, Tennessee (what else would you expect?) in 1984, struggling at first since Honky Tonk was considered a DeadHorseGenre.
# Music.PrincesAssociates: Mazarati later moved away from Prince, signed with Motown Records and recorded another album, the '''[[DeadHorseGenre New Jack Swing-styled]]''' ''Mazarati 2'', before breaking up.
# PopularityPolynomial.{{Music}}: One ElectronicMusic genre that has benefited from the polynomial is {{Trance}}. The genre (one known for its more emotional and melodic compositions compared to other electronic genres) began in the early 90s, and grew to popularity within the European club and party scene through the decade, eventually splintering off to several different subgenres. Trance continued to maintain a very dedicated fandom that gradually grew more and more through the '00s all over the world, and while it did grow a fanbase stateside, it was harshly written off by house, DrumAndBass and {{techno}} fans as being [[{{Narm}} cheesy]] and [[{{Glurge}} sappy]], with numerous think-piece articles proclaiming trance had become a DeadHorseGenre. Not helping matters was the massive BrokenBase and countless arguments between fans over what was [[NoTrueScotsman "true" trance]]. Then TheNewTens came in and an EDM explosion took over America, and although trance wasn't ''quite'' as popular as ElectroHouse, TrapMusic, or {{dubstep}}, it still did benefit greatly from the boom, with several [=DJs=] experiencing a major surge of new fans. The immediate selling-out of tickets for Insomniac's Dreamstate festival (which primarily featured smaller-name producers in its lineup) became the topic of discussion as the genre making a major comeback.
# SeriousBusiness.{{Music}}:* Music genres. People will argue to death trying to define a genre or deciding whether or not a piece of music falls under this razor-thin subgenre or that one. Notable examples include: [''irrelevant examples removed'']
# Music.PrincesAssociates: Mazarati later moved away from Prince, signed with Motown Records and recorded another album, the '''[[DeadHorseGenre New Jack Swing-styled]]''' ''Mazarati 2'', before breaking up.
# PopularityPolynomial.{{Music}}: One ElectronicMusic genre that has benefited from the polynomial is {{Trance}}. The genre (one known for its more emotional and melodic compositions compared to other electronic genres) began in the early 90s, and grew to popularity within the European club and party scene through the decade, eventually splintering off to several different subgenres. Trance continued to maintain a very dedicated fandom that gradually grew more and more through the '00s all over the world, and while it did grow a fanbase stateside, it was harshly written off by house, DrumAndBass and {{techno}} fans as being [[{{Narm}} cheesy]] and [[{{Glurge}} sappy]], with numerous think-piece articles proclaiming trance had become a DeadHorseGenre. Not helping matters was the massive BrokenBase and countless arguments between fans over what was [[NoTrueScotsman "true" trance]]. Then TheNewTens came in and an EDM explosion took over America, and although trance wasn't ''quite'' as popular as ElectroHouse, TrapMusic, or {{dubstep}}, it still did benefit greatly from the boom, with several [=DJs=] experiencing a major surge of new fans. The immediate selling-out of tickets for Insomniac's Dreamstate festival (which primarily featured smaller-name producers in its lineup) became the topic of discussion as the genre making a major comeback.
# SeriousBusiness.{{Music}}:
# YMMV.The77s: DeadHorseGenre: At Lost Dogs shows, Terry Taylor and Gene Eugene were fond of making fun of Roe for his other band's "boogie woogie music."
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# YMMV.The77s: DeadHorseGenre: At Lost Dogs shows, Terry Taylor and Gene Eugene were fond of making fun of Roe for his other band's "boogie woogie music."
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# YMMV.The77s: DeadHorseGenre: At Lost Dogs shows, Terry Taylor and Gene Eugene were fond of making fun of Roe for HomePage: A music genre that people mock/hate on. YMMV as there will be someone out there who likes it.
# YMMV.JoshGroban: Has done a Christmas album. Ironically, it's hisother band's "boogie woogie music." best-selling.
# YMMV.JoshGroban: Has done a Christmas album. Ironically, it's his
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# WebVideo.CrashThompson: Invoked by name at the start of Top 10 Best Nu-Metal Bands.
--> "And you know, there's no better way to get back to basics than to do... what pretty much every internet reviewer is known for doing."
--> *{{beat}}*
--> "BEATING A DEAD HORSE! HOLY ''FUCK'', DID NU-METAL SUCK ASS!"
--> "And you know, there's no better way to get back to basics than to do... what pretty much every internet reviewer is known for doing."
--> *{{beat}}*
--> "BEATING A DEAD HORSE! HOLY ''FUCK'', DID NU-METAL SUCK ASS!"
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# SoapOpera: Although soaps originated in the U.S., the genre there has undergone a severe decline to the point that media analysts have declared it '''[[DeadHorseGenre effectively dead]]'''.
# Trivia.DaysGone: SleeperHit: ''Days Gone'' was released to reception best described as SoOkayItsAverage, with many critics not enthused by yet ''[[DeadHorseGenre another]]'' open-world zombie survival game, and it saw itself releasing between big hitters from acclaimed developers or established [=IPs=] such as ''VideoGame/SekiroShadowsDieTwice'', on top of the aforementioned ''VideoGame/WorldWarZ2019'' and being a [=PS4=]-exclusive. In spite of all that, ''Days Gone'' sold extremely well and ended up as the console's sixth-best selling exclusive in the United States as of early 2020.
# Trivia.DaysGone: SleeperHit: ''Days Gone'' was released to reception best described as SoOkayItsAverage, with many critics not enthused by yet ''[[DeadHorseGenre another]]'' open-world zombie survival game, and it saw itself releasing between big hitters from acclaimed developers or established [=IPs=] such as ''VideoGame/SekiroShadowsDieTwice'', on top of the aforementioned ''VideoGame/WorldWarZ2019'' and being a [=PS4=]-exclusive. In spite of all that, ''Days Gone'' sold extremely well and ended up as the console's sixth-best selling exclusive in the United States as of early 2020.
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# NetworkDecay.NotableAversions: Technically cable music channels (the ones that just air audio and display the track and artist information) like DMX, Music Choice and MTV's Urge package aren't really television channels, but beyond throwing out the occasional fad or DeadHorseGenre format (what's Toni Basil's "Mickey" doing in the rotation of Music Choice's [[AlternativeRock Classic Alternative]] station? A throwback to when it was the New Wave channel), these channels are designed to purposefully not decay based on format division between each channel (you're never going to find Music/LadyGaga playing on the Oldies channel, for instance). '''Not about music ''genres'''''
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A wick check for DeadHorseGenre, which is probably redundant with CondemnedByHistory, particularly because multiple on-page examples used to be listed there until the cleanup thread rejected them. Could possibly be disambiguated between CondemnedByHistory and DeadHorseTrope, or made definition-only (possibly with a link to those two pages).
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* AudienceAlienatingEra
* CreativityLeash
* FanHater
* {{Genres}}
* GhettoIndex
* ItaloDisco
* NewSoundAlbum
* NoTrueScotsman
* NuMetal
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* CreativityLeash
* FanHater
* {{Genres}}
* GhettoIndex
* ItaloDisco
* NewSoundAlbum
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* NuMetal
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'''Proposed solution:''' See how much of the page's contents can be
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* {{Genres}}
* GhettoIndex
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# Make DeadHorseGenre definition-only.
# Rework DeadHorseGenre into "an unpopular music genre" and make it definition-only.
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* YMMV.ArethaFranklin
* YMMV.AtTheGates
* YMMV.AtTheGates
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* YMMV.{{Magma}}
* YMMV.MaydayParade
* YMMV.MotleyCrue
* YMMV.{{Motown}}
* YMMV.OverClockedRemix
* YMMV.{{Pinball}}
* YMMV.PinkFloyd
* YMMV.ShelbyFlint
* YMMV.The77s
* YMMV.VampireReviews
* YMMV.WeAreTheWorld
* YMMV.MaydayParade
* YMMV.MotleyCrue
* YMMV.{{Motown}}
* YMMV.OverClockedRemix
* YMMV.{{Pinball}}
* YMMV.PinkFloyd
* YMMV.ShelbyFlint
* YMMV.The77s
* YMMV.VampireReviews
* YMMV.WeAreTheWorld
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[[folder:A music genre disliked by critics specifically]]
# CreativityLeash: Music that critics automatically hate.
# YMMV.
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[[/folder]]
[[folder: A music genre that used to be popular, but has fallen out of favour]]
# YMMV.
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** In a 1989 (!) interview with MTV that would be later used in the special "It Came from the 80s II: Metal Goes Pop", Nikki Sixx [[LampshadeHanging hangs a lampshade]] on [[FollowTheLeader the glut of copycat glam rock bands]] at the moment, and infers that this was the same type of "dinosaur music mentality that punk rebelled against in the '70s". He goes on to say that somebody has to do something original. Guess who followed in the AnswerCut in said special? The band responsible for the genre's eventual demise, Music/{{Nirvana}}.
[[/folder]]
[[folder: A combination of the above / Disliked music genres in general / Unclassifiable]]
# AudienceAlienatingEra: See also FanonDiscontinuity, CanonDiscontinuity, RunningTheAsylum, EarlyInstallmentWeirdness, '''DeadHorseGenre (for the musical era equivalent)'''
# FanHater: '''DeadHorseGenre''', in which they hate on people for liking what they deem inferior brands of music.
# {{Genres}}: '''ZCE. Or... zero-context index entry?'''
# GhettoIndex: Music genres that are hated in and of themselves.
# ItaloDisco: Its popularity had waned by the start of TheNineties due to Italo house, Eurobeat, and Italo-dance taking its place. As Italo-disco is considered by fans to be highly associated with the preceding decade, there are less than a handful songs in The Nineties that are widely known as examples of Italo-disco, notably the 1990 Susanne Meals song "Forever" (a cover of another Italo song by Bryan Rich). From the turn of the millenium onward the genre amassed a gradually expanding fanbase aside from established sizable ones in eastern Europe, Spain and Latin America.
# NewSoundAlbum: Music/TheByrds started out as a folk-rock group, but once it neared being a DeadHorseGenre they moved to psychedelic pop-rock with ''Fifth Dimension''. They later shifted to traditionalist country rock with ''Sweetheart of the Rodeo''.
# NuMetal: RescuedFromTheScrappyHeap:
** A select few bands, particularly outliers such as Music/{{Deftones}} and Music/SystemOfADown, among others, are well-respected by critics, some of which argue that they were never a part of the genre to begin with. In other countries, where the prejudice never existed, bands are proud to claim they were influenced by Korn, Limp Bizkit, Slipknot and other NuMetal bands. A few bands have been saved by '''[[DeadHorseGenre leaving the nu metal scene]]''' and [[GenreShift shifting]] to more technical music styles. The genre itself has received this somewhat in the '10s, where a more real and authentic style of nu metal emerged and has gained ground, avoiding the mistakes that killed it in the first place and becoming a recognized genre in it's own right (though still not without detractors).
** The fact that it became a '''DeadHorseGenre''' in the first place might be the reason why modern nu metal bands don't face nearly as much persecution from listeners as bands who played to the nu metal trend back during its peak. Bands like Issues, In This Moment, Emmure, Of Mice & Men, From Ashes to New, Bring Me the Horizon, Islander, Hacktivist, and the like are exploring genre by its own merits, rather than trying to cash in on a trend or being pressured by their labels to make them money off of a phenomenon. Since nu metal currently isn't an "in" trend, these bands are playing the genre (or at least integrating elements of it) [[DoingItForTheArt because they genuinely like it]], not just for a paycheck. They're aren't completely free from persecution, but people who dislike the bands have little to-do with the fact that it's nu metal.
# PeripheryHatedom: Many music examples overlap with '''DeadHorseGenre'''.
# {{Vaporwave}}: Some believe that vaporwave was ''very'' close to becoming this in 2013 before various albums released in the following years offered new takes on the genre and revitalized it. Others believe it already has.
** Vaporwave's influence eventually seeped into FutureFunk, a dance genre that's functionally identical to the filter house and nu-disco of TheAughts, but with the added aesthetics and sample sets of vaporwave.
# CreatorKiller.Music: You can tell the creativity had dried up for the Music/DeadKennedys with their final album, 1986's ''Bedtime for Democracy''. The band had just survived a bitter obscenity trial for including a poster of Creator/HRGiger's ''Penis Landscape'' with their previous album, 1985's ''Frankenchrist'', one that left frontman Music/JelloBiafra's label Creator/AlternativeTentacles nearly bankrupt, and going into their next album ''Bedtime for Democracy'', they were drained. Even the band themselves seem to realize it, the song "Chickenshit Conformist" serving up a blistering damnation of a '''[[DeadHorseGenre dried-up punk scene]]''' and, in hindsight, almost a prediction that the Kennedys didn't have long left. Biafra would soon [[TheBandMinusTheFace split away from the band]] and start his own collaboration projects and spoken word albums.
# JustForFun.TropeNameInjokes: Example from a DeadHorseGenre, complete with random Administrivia/{{complaining|AboutShowsYouDontLike}}.
# SeriousBusiness.{{Music}}: * Music genres. People will argue to death trying to define a genre or deciding whether or not a piece of music falls under this razor-thin subgenre or that one. Notable examples include: [''irrelevant examples removed'']
** "What is REAL rap music?" Almost anything made after 1999 is seen as popcorn trash. On the opposite side, anything before 1999 is played-out and passe. The turning point was the time when '''[[DeadHorseGenre "Gangsta rap", Alternative Rap, Political Rap, Hardcore Hip-Hop]]''' and associated genres lost popularity among casual rap listeners, causing a [[FandomRivalry rift]] in those that followed new genres and those that preferred the old.
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[[/folder]]
[[folder:Non-music examples]]
# YMMV.VampireReviews: AndYouThoughtItWouldFail: Elisa mentioned it was a pretty risky move to do nothing but vampire fiction with the '''DeadHorseGenre''' feeling about them following ''Twilight'' and its fandom backlash.
# YMMV.{{Pinball}}: First, it was because video games were cheaper to maintain and took up less space at arcades. Later, as arcades died out, pinball machines all but disappeared. Of all the major pinball machine manufacturers such as Gottlieb, Bally, Williams, etc., only Stern Pinball remains today.
** It could be argued that pinball has more of a PopularityPolynomial, as it is staging what appears to be somewhat of a revival in the last few years. Second-hand machine prices have surged. As an example, the value of ''Pinball/MedievalMadness'' has gone from about $4,000-$5,000 in 2007 to over $7,000 in 2012. And as of 2013, a new pinball manufacturer, Creator/JerseyJackPinball, has sprouted up and released their first pinball, based on ''Pinball/TheWizardOfOz''. '''Argues against itself. Is also a weird example because it claims that pinball simply fell out of favor because video games were easier to handle and arcades died -- not because people soured on pinball'''
[[/folder]]
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* ToddInTheShadows.DToF
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* ToddInTheShadows.DToFTropesDToF
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* GenreKiller/Music
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* GenreKiller/MusicGenreKiller.{{Music}}
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* Vaporwave
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* Vaporwave{{Vaporwave}}
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Added DiffLines:
A wick check for DeadHorseGenre, which is probably redundant with CondemnedByHistory, particularly because multiple on-page examples used to be listed there until the cleanup thread rejected them. Could possibly be disambiguated between CondemnedByHistory and DeadHorseTrope, or made definition-only (possibly with a link to those two pages).
Checked: 0/50
* AudienceAlienatingEra
* CreativityLeash
* FanHater
* {{Genres}}
* GhettoIndex
* ItaloDisco
* NewSoundAlbum
* NoTrueScotsman
* NuMetal
* PeripheryHatedom
* ProgressiveRock
* PublicMediumIgnorance
* SoapOpera
* Vaporwave
* Archive.AdOfWinArchive2010
* AudienceAlienatingEra.{{Music}}
* BrokenBase.{{Music}}
* CreatorKiller.{{Music}}
* FanonDiscontinuity.{{Music}}
* Fridge.TVTropes
* Funny.ToddInTheShadows2016Episodes
* GenreKiller/Music
* GenreMotif.{{Showtunes}}
* JustForFun.TropeNameInjokes
* Music.ArminVanBuuren
* Music.DwightYoakam
* Music.PrincesAssociates
* NetworkDecay.NotableAversions
* PopularityPolynomial.{{Music}}
* SeriousBusiness.{{Music}}
* ToddInTheShadows.DToF
* Trivia.DaysGone
* WebVideo.CrashThompson
* YMMV.ArethaFranklin
* YMMV.AtTheGates
* YMMV.BrutalLegend
* YMMV.HomePage
* YMMV.JoshGroban
* YMMV.KingCrimson
* YMMV.{{Magma}}
* YMMV.MaydayParade
* YMMV.MotleyCrue
* YMMV.{{Motown}}
* YMMV.OverClockedRemix
* YMMV.{{Pinball}}
* YMMV.PinkFloyd
* YMMV.ShelbyFlint
* YMMV.The77s
* YMMV.VampireReviews
* YMMV.WeAreTheWorld
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* AudienceAlienatingEra
* CreativityLeash
* FanHater
* {{Genres}}
* GhettoIndex
* ItaloDisco
* NewSoundAlbum
* NoTrueScotsman
* NuMetal
* PeripheryHatedom
* ProgressiveRock
* PublicMediumIgnorance
* SoapOpera
* Vaporwave
* Archive.AdOfWinArchive2010
* AudienceAlienatingEra.{{Music}}
* BrokenBase.{{Music}}
* CreatorKiller.{{Music}}
* FanonDiscontinuity.{{Music}}
* Fridge.TVTropes
* Funny.ToddInTheShadows2016Episodes
* GenreKiller/Music
* GenreMotif.{{Showtunes}}
* JustForFun.TropeNameInjokes
* Music.ArminVanBuuren
* Music.DwightYoakam
* Music.PrincesAssociates
* NetworkDecay.NotableAversions
* PopularityPolynomial.{{Music}}
* SeriousBusiness.{{Music}}
* ToddInTheShadows.DToF
* Trivia.DaysGone
* WebVideo.CrashThompson
* YMMV.ArethaFranklin
* YMMV.AtTheGates
* YMMV.BrutalLegend
* YMMV.HomePage
* YMMV.JoshGroban
* YMMV.KingCrimson
* YMMV.{{Magma}}
* YMMV.MaydayParade
* YMMV.MotleyCrue
* YMMV.{{Motown}}
* YMMV.OverClockedRemix
* YMMV.{{Pinball}}
* YMMV.PinkFloyd
* YMMV.ShelbyFlint
* YMMV.The77s
* YMMV.VampireReviews
* YMMV.WeAreTheWorld
