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Why So Much Hate?
I am a staunch believer that you have to read/watch/generally pay attention before you judge anything. It's why I love anime, why I love fanfiction reading and writing, and why I am a shameless brony.

So, while hearing all the hatred for the series in general, I decided to read the series.

And so, in response to all of the hate that the series has...

It's completely justified.

The "romance" is unbelievably unhealthy. Bella is a war-starting little punk, sacrificing so many lives just for her foolish teenage "romance," which isn't even characterized correctly!

Then comes the padding that is the "plot." First major problem: plot holes. Vampires can exist without a need for human blood, yet the vast majority of them drink normal blood. Why would you do that?! There's no real reason for it! Just for a bit of free food? By this time, more than a few exceptional vampire groups would be drinking animal blood!

For that matter, why is the vampire capital in Italy?! There's no reason for it! Granted, I shouldn't be picking out fridge logic, but this is too obvious to ignore!

Then you add the lack of biological research, the fact that sparkling in sunlight is retarded, Edward's needless, mindless angst, and then you get a mess of almost unreadable purple prose.

It's a disaster!

The fact that this thing is popular is only icing on the cake. It's not deserving of its popularity. And now excuse me while I go cry in a corner.
Join me, fellow anime fan...
comment #11557 CosmicPickle 26th Nov 11
I completely agree with you.
comment #11566 Archer250 27th Nov 11
People like you should be writers.
comment #11592 qtjinla15 28th Nov 11
Tvtropes, where writers come to whine about more successful writers.
comment #11594 eveil 28th Nov 11 (edited by: eveil)
You mean where writers come together and whine about more fortunate writers.
comment #11600 CosmicPickle 28th Nov 11
I actually believe that the vampire capital is in Italy to take a stab at the Catholic church. I got that from Mark Reads Twilight and I'm totally convinced.
comment #11601 CosmicPickle 28th Nov 11
Are you really so butthurt that you needed to edit it out and then respond anyways?
comment #11602 eveil 28th Nov 11
I was actually trying to delete the first comment. Forgive me if I don't know how to fully function this site.
comment #11605 CosmicPickle 28th Nov 11
So were you planning on deleting the comment and then responding to it anyways?

Whatever, feel free to edit out my comments again if you want so you can continue going "LA LA LA I can't hear you" towards anything you don't want to hear. I won't bother getting into an editing war.
comment #11610 eveil 28th Nov 11
And yet you still bother to provoke. ;)
comment #11611 kay4today 29th Nov 11
Tvtropes, where writers come to whine about more successful writers.

Welcome to the club. Who are you going to whine about?
comment #11613 lu127 29th Nov 11
So they're allowed to say "Boo this person's works don't deserve to be successful" but it's considered provoking if I defend it?

People tend to think they can do whatever they want and then cry about it whenever it's done to themselves. And it's starting to get annoying.

Welcome to the club. Who are you going to whine about?

I want to start with every single shonen author and end with every single MMORPG.
comment #11614 eveil 29th Nov 11 (edited by: eveil)
^The problem is the figures are not say "Boo this person's works don't deserve to be successful" but rather "this author's work does not deserve the sales for the work is not well done."

The problem is that the applyance that quanity or popalarity equals quality is not a well defined notion. No; I am not saying populaity means a work is not good but rather that sometimes the work attracts load of figures who do not judge it well. Commencing the attacks on Twilight as "its more popular than my work" is rather naive and rather jerkish. I would suggest that one does fall down the destructive path of populism for it and elitism is the way of apathy.
comment #11616 Ailedhoo 29th Nov 11
^The problem is the figures are not say "Boo this person's works don't deserve to be successful" but rather "this author's work does not deserve the sales for the work is not well done."

Not seeing the difference between those two.

The problem is that the applyance that quanity or popalarity equals quality is not a well defined notion. No; I am not saying populaity means a work is not good but rather that sometimes the work attracts load of figures who do not judge it well. Commencing the attacks on Twilight as "its more popular than my work" is rather naive and rather jerkish. I would suggest that one does fall down the destructive path of populism for it and elitism is the way of apathy.

What's with this "I have more valid tastes than you" mentality going on around here?
comment #11617 eveil 29th Nov 11
^It is not the case of elitism but rather the case of observation. Also: there is a big difference between the two but I guess when one is not of sympathy... well here is how: success via little effort is a grant problem in society that must be delt with.
comment #11618 Ailedhoo 29th Nov 11
^It is not the case of elitism but rather the case of observation.

Sounds like elitism to me.

Also: there is a big difference between the two but I guess when one is not of sympathy... well here is how: success via little effort is a grant problem in society that must be delt with.

It's called basic economics and luck. Deal with it. You're still using the outdated Marxist philosophy that an object's value is dependent on the labor and effort put into it.
comment #11619 eveil 29th Nov 11
@eveil

Defending a work is okay of course, but you didn't do that. :P

What are you doing on Tv Tropes anyway? It's the whiniest place of whiners ever. ;)
comment #11625 kay4today 29th Nov 11
Defending a work is okay of course, but you didn't do that. :P

THAT counts as a defense. Not a very detailed one, but it's a knee-jerk response after hearing years of "Boo Twilight sucks why didn't authors like me become successful".

What are you doing on Tv Tropes anyway? It's the whiniest place of whiners ever. ;)

I know this is just a nice way of asking me to leave. So... guess I'll be going.
comment #11626 eveil 29th Nov 11 (edited by: eveil)
Deal with it, even if it's annoying. Which it is.

No, I don't want you to leave. Believe it or not, but I find your posts amusing. And not in the "Haha, your stupidness amuses me so keep embarassing yourself." way, but in the "Lol, that guy is hilarious and snarky." way. I've never seen anybody winning an argument against you.
comment #11628 kay4today 29th Nov 11
@eviel I wasn't trying to get into an editing war with you. You called me butthurt and I explained my actions. That's all.
comment #11635 CosmicPickle 29th Nov 11
I think the problem is simple: these posts are now personal wars as oppose to wars on the ideas.

O and eveil... I was not using Marxist ideas. If you say "dael with it" with little effort, it is a sign of more the flaws of greed. Such is apathy be the idea of "deal with it."
comment #11638 Ailedhoo 29th Nov 11
No, I don't want you to leave. Believe it or not, but I find your posts amusing. And not in the "Haha, your stupidness amuses me so keep embarassing yourself." way, but in the "Lol, that guy is hilarious and snarky." way. I've never seen anybody winning an argument against you.

Alright then, guess I'll stay a little longer.

@eviel I wasn't trying to get into an editing war with you. You called me butthurt and I explained my actions. That's all.

When you said "delete the first comment", did you mean my comment, or your own?

O and eveil... I was not using Marxist ideas. If you say "dael with it" with little effort, it is a sign of more the flaws of greed. Such is apathy be the idea of "deal with it."

People will like whatever they want. Successful businesses try to predict what people want, or would want, rather than whining about people not wanting their products. Or they complain to the government about large businesses taking away their customers and get a law passed or something. And some just stumble around and get lucky. There's nothing you can do about luck.

So unless you want to start banning people from liking and buying a product just because you think it sucks, you're going to have to deal with it.
comment #11649 eveil 1st Dec 11
@eveil My own comment. I'm a newbie so I haven't quite figured it out yet.
comment #11658 CosmicPickle 1st Dec 11
Oh, then I think I completely misinterpreted what happened.
comment #11659 eveil 1st Dec 11
Alright then, guess I'll stay a little longer.

Why do I have the impression that you're not serious? :P
comment #11668 kay4today 2nd Dec 11 (edited by: kay4today)
What's wrong with the vampire capital being in Italy? Why is that a less logical place than anywhere else in the world?
comment #12357 AnEnemySpy 16th Jan 12
Twilight is a piece of garbage that should have never seen the light of day. And, well Italy just seems kind of random.
comment #12365 qtjinla15 17th Jan 12
"Bella is a war-starting little punk"? ...best description of her I've read yet!
comment #14391 jewelia13 22nd May 12
I actually read the series twice (in the span of about 8 months) just to be sure, but I agree that it's terrible.

There's the weird little predestination theme going on with Edward's inevitable, eternal love for Bella and the werewolves' imprinting (especially Jacob). I know fictional romance is a lot more glamorous than real life, but that's just going too far. The idea that Jacob could never be with Bella because the universe said so is just baffling. Even classic star-crossed love tales usually involve a tragic flaw. And boy, did Bella and Edward both have tragic flaws. There's almost no discernible reason for their story to have a happy ending. Relationships end over much less than angsty, theatrical suicide attempts.

And that's just one of my many complaints.
comment #14408 JobanGrayskull 24th May 12
Lets see...

Stephanie Meyer - Wrote a best-selling novel that rakes in millions.

Most/all of the people here - Didn't make millions from writing novels.

Hmm, whose opinion is more important? The one coming from someone who was able to make millions, or the one coming from unsuccessful writers jealous of other peoples' success?
comment #15293 Aeae 9th Jul 12
Aeae, Given that logic no one's opinion matters if they don't make millions with their day-job. People buy books and watch movies because they want a good story, and if they're let-down they should be free to criticize. Sales are a measure of consumer interest not quality. Meyer made millions not because she's a good writer but because she hit a certain niche at the right time. Vampire Romance was big with Anne Rice years ago and it's big(sort-of) now. Criticism is really another term for feedback which every author needs.
comment #15294 morninglight 9th Jul 12
morninglight, if you think you know how the market works so well, then why don't you write a best-selling novel and make millions? Just choose whatever sells and write about it.

Just because the genre is popular doesn't mean you can just write something crappy and make millions.
comment #15296 Aeae 9th Jul 12
Ignoring how invalid of a criticism "Let's see YOU do better" is, given that it doesn't actually address anyone's issues with the book...

If only the opinions of those who write best sellers matter, what do you say about someone such as Stephen King, who denounced Twilight and basically said it only sold well because it was wish fulfillment?
comment #15297 MFM 9th Jul 12
Regardless of the reason, Twilight sold well.

Telling someone that their successful idea was a bad idea is a self-defeating argument.

comment #15298 Aeae 9th Jul 12
Doesn't mean it still isn't terrible in quality.
comment #15305 qtjinla15 10th Jul 12
Right... and that's how it became a best-seller. By being terrible.

Just because something doesn't appeal to your niche doesn't make it terrible.
comment #15309 Aeae 10th Jul 12
You're ignoring Stephen King's argument, not refuting it. If you say "Even if you say Twilight only sold well because it was wish fulfillment, that doesn't matter because it still sold well", then a cheating racer could easily say "Even if you say I only won because I cheated, it doesn't matter because I still won. "
comment #15310 Tuckerscreator 10th Jul 12
Stephen King is free to have his opinion, as is everyone else. But at the end of the day, the only thing that really matters to Stephanie Meyers is that her book raked in millions of dollars. If wish fulfillment sells well, then she did a good job of exploiting that. Perhaps you should spend less time complaining about what other people like.

And really, you're comparing Stephanie Meyers to a cheater? A cheater will get disqualified if he gets caught. No one is going to take away Meyer's millions of dollars just because she didn't do it the way you wanted her to.
comment #15311 Aeae 11th Jul 12
There's no real "race" in publishing, but there are indeed ways to cut corners. That's why people object to, say, perceived nepotism, where an author got published just because they were well-connected. But whoever got in by nepotism is not going to be "disqualified" by some referee. But that doesn't mean they still didn't have an unfair advantage. It's the same with publishing wish fulfillment.
comment #15313 Tuckerscreator 11th Jul 12
Unbelievable how many people seem to accept the notion that success equals quality as truth.
comment #15995 gfrequency 3rd Sep 12
This is a hilariously exaggerated review. Shrugs off into the sunset.
comment #17171 Starburstia 10th Dec 12
gfrequency, it shows a lack of critical intelligence and the ability to judge things in an unbiased matter.
comment #17178 qtjinla15 10th Dec 12
It sucks for A Bad Driver that he's so even-handed in his criticism. It requires him to wade through a ton of junk, just for him to feel justified that it is indeed junk.. and Aeae, that has to be the most anti-intellectual argument I've ever heard. Good job.
comment #17752 soundofimpact 18th Jan 13
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