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Codafett
topic
05:00:27 PM Apr 8th 2014
This page is much more agreeable and generally better done than DMOS. At least these don't sound like people whining their hearts out.
MsCC93
topic
12:03:53 PM Mar 20th 2014
I know a lot of people are gonna disagree, but before this page becomes an Edit War, I do kind of agree with Some New Guy because some fans are taking some scenes far too seriously.
SeptimusHeap
moderator
12:51:21 PM Mar 20th 2014
Eh, I still don't see a reason to remove the items.
SomeNewGuy
01:15:37 PM Mar 20th 2014
edited by 50.177.255.121
At the very least, I think the second bullet point under "Read it and Weep" should go. The hospital chase at the episode's climax was clearly Played for Laughs, and yet so many people are claiming that RD committed a "horrible crime" and how its "offensive" that she wasn't "punished".

Also, the MMC thing I deleted is also pretty ridiculous, as it assumes that Twilight and Celestia knowingly switched the Mane Six's Cutie Marks, which is completely false. The notion that they "nearly ruined their friends lives" thing also comes off as overblown.
RK_Striker_JK_5
01:28:31 PM Mar 20th 2014
Knowingly or not, that was the results of their actions. Celestia sent it to her. Twilight cast a spell with zero prep, zero precautions and zero follow-up to her actions. And yes, it nearly did ruin their lives. Sweet Apple Acres nearly closed down, as well as Carousel Boutique.
Psyga315
09:00:44 PM Mar 20th 2014
That, and it caused chaos in Ponyville. Had Twilight not figured it out, Ponyville would have been a hotbed for fighting.
MsCC93
07:45:45 AM Mar 21st 2014
edited by 172.56.3.113
No offense to you guys disagreeing (no offense to you Psyga as well), but what Twilight did was a complete accident. She wasn't intending anything bad to happen. Had Twilight not shown remorse for her actions, then it would be a valid Wall Banger and I would agree with her not getting called out. Plus, to be fair, Twilight fixed her mistakes anyway.

I agree with Some New Guy. I mean, fans are talking this too seriously, and act like every bad thing that the Mane Cast do is like they committed an unforgivable sin.
SomeNewGuy
11:21:03 AM Mar 21st 2014
Okay, can we get Enhas and Gingerman in here? They seriously seem to have an anti-Rarity bias.
RK_Striker_JK_5
01:51:03 PM Mar 21st 2014
Accident or not, their actions were moronic and caused some pretty bad damage to the town and residents. And how she went about that spell is a certain wallbanger for me. This goes beyond simple mistake into "What were you thinking?!" And it's not the first or last time she's done magic without thinking of the consequences.
gingerman
11:37:27 PM Mar 21st 2014
edited by 121.219.58.22
Here I am, and it looks like I'm coming off the wrong way. I'm quite a fan of Rarity, in fact more so than any other members of the cast, but I sure do object to the way she's often used as a character; a sort of comic relief sociopath, if you will, who doesn't benefit from Twilight's peculiar ability to never be wrong for more than a passing moment. My apologies if I appeared to be overly committed to mud-slinging.
cake25
07:47:39 AM Mar 27th 2014
I pulled the Rarity pinpoints because it seemed like it was just harping on her atrocities rather than a wall-banger, really.
gingerman
03:42:38 AM Mar 28th 2014
edited by 101.160.168.28
Fair enough. In hindsight, it was a pretty broad gripe.

But still...a contestable retraction.
iansimsjam
topic
05:04:00 AM Jan 19th 2014
I think the Last Roundup example should be deleted because I think the part where Rainbow Dash is blamed for not turning back is supposed to be funny.
MsCC93
05:06:50 AM Jan 19th 2014
True, but fans also blame Rainbow Dash, ignoring the fact that the others left them too.
Psyga315
06:59:36 AM Jan 19th 2014
edited by 76.64.68.161
That and she's the Element of Loyalty. Then again, she's known to betray it. Like that one time she ditched a long term friend for someone she barely met. Although the former was being a bitch.
iansimsjam
topic
04:48:57 AM Jan 19th 2014
I just added an image to the page.
MsCC93
topic
08:18:16 AM Dec 24th 2013
edited by 72.66.11.101
Adding on to this pinpoint.

  • What's frustrating is that they believed they had become bullies even though they hadn't. What they did do is potentially endanger Babs but at no point did they acknowledge that as being a problem. It's kind of a messed up priorities this show seems to espouse, namely being a bully is the worst thing ever, and nothing you do can compare to being a bully. You could almost kill someone, and the show wouldn't hold it against you, but pick on someone? Harbingers of the apocalypse are more forgivable than you.

Even though I hate Diamond Tiara, Silver Spoon, and Babs with every fiber of my being because of their bullying towards the CMCs, saying that they are worse than child abusers and Harbingers is a little harsh. Even the fandom gets in on this by making Discord and Chrysalis look less evil than Gilda.

I think I can answer your question to this double standard. The writers may portray bullies a lot worse because maybe they haven't dealt with murderers and harbingers of the apocalypse, but they have dealt with a lot of bullies when they were younger, so they use this show as a way to vent out their frustrations towards how they feel about bullies, and make the look worse than they really are.
Peteman
08:56:40 AM Dec 24th 2013
I just can't be bothered to hate them. I honestly think that the CMCs are worse than the bullies, because the bullies haven't recklessly endangered anyone yet.
MsCC93
09:17:58 AM Dec 24th 2013
I still hate the bullies even more, because the CM Cs only wanted to humiliate Babs. They didn't mention anything about murdering her. It's just a kids show and I doubt they would allow such a moral to exist. Plus, Bully characters get more hate because they are lame, bland character who have no depth and only exist to make the protagonists miserable. They suck.
Peteman
09:24:44 AM Dec 24th 2013
edited by 70.24.219.104
The problem is that if something went wrong (and with those three, things almost inevitably do), that car would have overshot the mud bank and landed in the lake instead.

Plus, they almost got Fluttershy petrified.

I just can't be bothered to care. It's like a conflict between one-dimensional jerks, and the more likeable finalists of Canada's Worst Driver. I'm being given a choice between assholes and people who barely avoid committing vehicular homicide on a regular basis. My ideal resolution would be to have both parties called out for their behaviour.
Psyga315
10:53:45 AM Dec 24th 2013
Then again, they've forgiven bullies for worst shit before. Sunset Shimmer anyone?
Peteman
11:02:11 AM Dec 24th 2013
edited by 70.24.219.104
That was only after she tried to conquer Equestria with a bunch of brainwashed teenagers (granted, the invasion plan died in the opening minutes).

You know, the thing this show seems to treat as the lesser issue.

I am being a bit tongue-in-cheek here.
MsCC93
05:39:16 AM Dec 26th 2013
Sunset Shimmer is even worse than Diamond Tiara & Silver Spoon because she tried to murder the Mane 6 (and caused major property damage), I'll admit, and I dislike Diamond Tiara and Silver Spoon. Plus, Sunset Shimmer is fairly disliked by fans too.

While I do agree with Peteman when it comes to the way the show treats bullies, the only reasons the jerks/bully characters get more bile than major villain characters is because the bullies remind bronies (and possibly the writers) of some bullies they met in real life, whereas the villains like Discord and Nightmare Moon are not realistic and are only fantasy-type villains, and people in real life never had to experience with villains like them.

I think One Bad Apple should have ended with all six fillies getting punished anyway. Babs and DT & SS for their bullying and the Crusaders for trying to retaliate.
MsCC93
topic
12:11:32 PM Dec 11th 2013
edited by 131.118.228.9
I would like to contest an entry that was written for "A Canterlot Wedding."

  • If there's anything in this episode that makes my blood boil, it's that Celestia immediately jumps to "Cadence's" defense upon hearing Twilight's claim that "Cadence" is evil and abandons her! Celestia, this just in, she's your most faithful student who has saved Equestria TWICE when you couldn't! How can someone who trusts their student with their life and knows their achievements perfectly well not even bother to investigate the possibility that she might be correct!? And then after that, you simply tell her to trust in her instincts when all you've ever done to 'encourage' her was doing the exact opposite!

Okay first off, it doesn't look like there's any side-taking when Celestia got angry at Twilight for calling her evil. She was simply upset with Twilight because she bursted into the chapel and insulted her niece by calling her evil without gathering any evidence. I agree it was harsh for her to leave Twilight at the chapel, but she was simply scolding her for her actions.

People here are forgetting the fact that nobody except Twilight (possibly) knew that Chrysalis took Cadance's place and that by Twilight calling the former evil, it looked like she was insulting the real princess.

Psyga315
02:25:48 PM Dec 11th 2013
While I have my own side to pick, I'll probably do my best to stay out of this and simply say: Broken Base.
MsCC93
06:43:22 PM Dec 11th 2013
Agreed.
Peteman
topic
09:50:59 PM Sep 27th 2013
Wasn't Sunset Shimmer's threat to destroy the portal just a bluff? She had no intention of following through with it.
Candi
topic
11:50:09 PM Jun 18th 2013
edited by 69.172.221.2
"Keep Calm and Flutter"

Isn't the way Discord treats Fluttershy part of the problems people have with that other Twilight? A guy can do whatever he wants to do to a female, and her friendship (love) will eventually reform him because it's just that powerful? (And isn't that the kind of 'I can change him' thinking DV groups have been trying to stop?) Not exactly a good story or message for a show that was originally intended for young girls.

"The trailer revealing Spike's counterpart is a dog."

Small child, monkey, or dolphin. Definitely not a dog. That's truly ridiculous.
WaxingName
topic
09:06:01 PM Mar 24th 2013
Not contesting, but...

  • The episode Games Ponies Play just suffers from a dull and predictable comedy of errors plot, as in "is a humorous play that involves mistaken identity and has a happy ending". It has already been done and this one adds nothing new, and the happy ending is way too forced, especially since Miss Harshwhinney's complaints are spot on, and the only difference between what happened with her in the Crystal Empire and elsewhere is that the welcoming intended for her happened to the random rube, and in fact she gets treated like crud by the random passers-by who splash her.
    • The characters as they were written are, for the most part, portrayed at their most brainless and grating.

This is a complaint about an entire plot. Isn't this a little big for this page and something for DMOS?
Candi
11:51:27 PM Jun 18th 2013
Might be, according to trope description -is there an entry on this already over there?
taylorkerekes
topic
04:16:45 PM Feb 12th 2013
NOTE: For this one, I will be as mature as possible, after what I've learned from my suspension.

Contesting entry:

  • A Friend In Need. Pinkie destroying Cranky's book was an accident, to be fair, but she's not upset because she hurt Cranky's feelings. She's upset because he vows never to be her friend, and her whole reason for pestering him is less "I'd earnestly like to help him around the new town" and more "he will be my friend because I always make friends". At least she seems to be getting a hint when Twilight and Rainbow explain to her why Cranky doesn't want her around, but then she throws that aside and insists on giving him an apology that doesn't look sincere at all, to the point of harassing him into boarding up his house. And just when the episode has them stuck in a stalemate - Pinkie won't leave him alone because he won't apologize, and he won't have anything to do with her because she ruined his diary - pop comes the Contrived Coincidence and the Deus ex Machina. And still Pinkie is most happy because Cranky said he'll be her friend, which is essentially Pinkie getting her ulterior motive fulfilled. With Friends Like These......

I do believe was Pinkie Pie was genuinely sorry for hurting Cranky's feelings, but only the way it was executed here sounded pretty unconvincing. Sure, Twilight and Applejack suggested leaving him alone, but that only proves further that they've failed to know more about the guy. Thus, I wouldn't go as far as labeling Pinkie's "pestering" him as just that, but I sense that Pinkie wanted to do more than just make Cranky her friend. I feel that she also wanted to cheer him up, which doesn't necessarily mean just make him her friend, when you think about it.
Fighteer
moderator
05:39:22 AM Feb 13th 2013
This is not a valid contest, taylorkerekes. You were told that you could only do this on the basis of facts, not your interpretation of the characters' motives.
taylorkerekes
05:56:11 AM Feb 13th 2013
Sorry about that. It won't happen again.
taylorkerekes
topic
07:14:40 PM Feb 11th 2013
edited by taylorkerekes
Contesting entries:

Just be thankful that they managed to carry out the Aesop that they intended to deliver WAS delivered, and considering how the CMC labels themselves as bullies, well, I guess it's just kids' minds kicking in. Plus, I really don't think being Easily Forgiven is really a bad thing.

  • Magic Duel. Fluttershy getting repeatedly ignored by her friends when she discovers the Alicorn Amulet reference in the book, and then "getting volunteered" into doing the dangerous mission. For crying out loud, this is rude - not funny - and they're supposed to be her friends, not strangers who don't care about her. It's not like she was inaudible or had her voice drowned out by any other noises. And why would Rainbow Dash, the biggest daredevil in Equestria, and Applejack and Rarity, who have proven before that they won't shirk when danger comes to call, endorse Fluttershy going out, especially when Rainbow is supposed to be her fillyhood friend and should know better?

While this is in fact mean-spirited, bear in mind, though, that Fluttershy is the quietest of the ponies, thus making her the least likely to get struck by Trixie's magic.

  • Peewee's absence in Just for Sidekicks. Spike adopting him at the end of Dragon Quest was a beautiful moment, and a key turning point in his growth as a character, and now all of a sudden we're given a yarn about Spike giving him away? The phoenixes flew off and left no trace of where they could be, so unless Spike somehow located them, there's no way Spike was able to find the parents and return Peewee.

It's quite safe to assume that he got help locating them offscreen. Ever consider that, genius?

  • The episode Games Ponies Play just suffers from a dull and predictable comedy of errors plot, as in "is a humorous play that involves mistaken identity and has a happy ending". It has already been done and this one adds nothing new, and the happy ending is way too forced, especially since Miss Harshwhinney's complaints are spot on, and the only difference between what happened with her in the Crystal Empire and elsewhere is that the welcoming intended for her happened to the random rube, and in fact she gets treated like crud by the random passers-by who splash her.

I don't know about you, but I find the way it's all executed in this episode to be quite exceptionally well done. Plus, when you think about it, the ending isn't really "forced" at all, and there is a possibility that not every passerby really treated her badly. Think "offscreen".
Peteman
07:32:42 PM Feb 11th 2013
Show, Don't Tell is one of the biggest rules of any media. Telling viewers to assume stuff happens offscreen is one of the biggest violations of that rule, especially if what happens onscreen is the exact opposite of what we're supposed to assume. While you can't show every little detail, indeed that would be boring, but anything you do show should be assumed to be the highlights, the activities that influence how the characters are going to act, Gilligan Cut, Unspoken Plan Guarantee, and other such tropes notwithstanding.
taylorkerekes
07:38:00 PM Feb 11th 2013
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ARWofY0OIU

I really don't care what you say. We're all free to assume what happens offscreen. You're not Emperor Ming controlling our minds.
rodneyAnonymous
09:14:31 PM Feb 11th 2013
Stop being rude, please. There is no situation where that is appropriate.
MsCC93
09:41:31 PM Feb 11th 2013
No offense, but if you don't like this page, don't look. Is it that hard. That's the purpose of the Wall Bangers page, for people to voice their own opinions. Don't like, don't read.
Peteman
topic
04:21:38 PM Feb 11th 2013
Seriously? After all that crap we put up with DMOS, someone's trying to have this page cutlisted for being whiny? Guess what? Every other wallbanger page is like this.

This show is not above criticism. It's not above breaking their own aesops, confusing their own timeline, having their characters act like complete idiots, introducing ideas in a ham-fisted manner, using cliched plots, using Deus ex Machina for a forced happy ending, and making other major mistakes.

taylorkerekes, if this page bothers you so much, why do you even come here? I've stopped going to the Awesome, Heartwarming, Tear Jerker, and Funny pages for the series save to drop off the stuff people put on the episode version because people would put every little thing onto them. I look at the Fridge Brilliance section with a fair degree of nausea because people would project their fanon with absolute conviction or proudly declare what is flat out stated in the episode. I don't bother them, so why do you bother us?
taylorkerekes
04:31:19 PM Feb 11th 2013
edited by taylorkerekes
I guess the best solution would be to check out the Fridge Brilliance page, since I do find it quite helpful in either proving or disproving some instances where some fans claim the show isn't above "breaking their own aesops, confusing their own timeline, having their characters act like complete idiots, introducing ideas in a ham-fisted manner, using cliched plots, using Deus ex Machina for a forced happy ending, and making other major mistakes". So you're out of luck.
Peteman
04:34:58 PM Feb 11th 2013
I find most of the time they're just grasping at straws, deepening my conviction.
taylorkerekes
04:47:36 PM Feb 11th 2013
Actually, you're 100% wrong. I have found that most of their claims are quite accurate, so there's no further argument here.
PDL
04:57:03 PM Feb 11th 2013
Please don't play the "Holier the Thou" card, it just makes you look like a jackass.

It's perfectly normal to find criticism in your favorite show. It's also possible to overthink something, especially a show about colorful ponies for children.
taylorkerekes
05:27:16 PM Feb 11th 2013
But isn't there ANYBODY who looks to the Fridge Brilliance page for good theories?
FastEddie
moderator
05:34:29 PM Feb 11th 2013
edited by FastEddie
Wouldn't make any difference if there were. All of it would be subjective and there would be at least 9 definitions of 'good theory' for every 8 people.

Just going to have to get your arms around the notion that people's opinions differ.
Peteman
05:35:16 PM Feb 11th 2013
Given how Fridge Brilliance is abused in most cases, MLP or otherwise, definitely not me.
taylorkerekes
05:41:28 PM Feb 11th 2013
Well, in MLP: FIM's case, Fridge Brilliance is certainly NOT abused.
taylorkerekes
05:41:35 PM Feb 11th 2013
Well, in MLP: FIM's case, Fridge Brilliance is certainly NOT abused.
PDL
06:42:53 PM Feb 11th 2013
I don't know... Most pages don't need several folders for every single episode, each of them jam-filled with entries.

Actually the Fridge Horror page is ridiculous as well. I wonder if it needs trimming again.
MsCC93
09:44:52 PM Feb 11th 2013
edited by MsCC93
I agree with Fast Eddie and Peteman. To me, if you dislike a page, is it that hard not to read it? That's why the Wall Banger page is highly subjective, meaning not everyone is going to agree. I mean as long as the page doesn't have excess natter, justifying edits, flame wars, and serious attempts at complaining rather than explaining why it's a wall banger, then it shouldn't be a problem. You're overreacting taylorkereles.
JapaneseTeeth
08:14:37 AM Feb 12th 2013
Both the Fridge Brilliance and the DMOS / Wallbanger pages are highly subjective. If you don't like one, just ignore it and stick to the parts that interest you. Stuff like DMOS and Wallbanger entries can only be removed if they are factually inaccurate. There may very well be fridge brilliance or whatever that explains them, but unless it's objectively shown in the show itself, that's not grounds for deleting it.
Komodin
topic
04:20:54 PM Feb 11th 2013
RE: Cutlist

The Cut List reason is a bit too vague. What do you mean by "whiny and biased?" I ask this because "having the gall to dislike something about a show that I like" doesn't strike me as a good reason to axe the page.
Peteman
04:23:55 PM Feb 11th 2013
It isn't. Unless we want to cut every wallbanger page for being whiny and biased, that isn't a good reason.
RA2
topic
07:29:12 PM Feb 6th 2013
edited by RA2
I'd like to contest the "Babs Seed" thing.

  • The episode "One Bad Apple." Basically the aesop that was intended to be delivered was for you not to become a bully yourself and tell an adult when dealing with bullies. The real wall banger was how Babs Seed got off scot-free for her bullying towards the CM Cs (well at least Diamond Tiara and Silver Spoon got a minor one) all because she was revealed to have a Freudian Excuse which leads to a warped aesop: "Bullying is acceptable if you have a Freudian Excuse and the victims are insensitive for not understanding how you feel." The accidental aesop delivered was the real wallbanger for me.

I feel like this is missing the point; true Babs didn't get hurt or punished, but she did realize her mistake and was genuinely sorry for it. In a show about friendship, it should be obvious which of those things is more important. And I'll grant that the CMC were way too harsh on themselves when they labelled themselves as "bullies," but it's not the fist time they've gotten stuck on a slippery slope. Nothing about the episode said to me that bullying was "acceptable."
MsCC93
06:09:26 AM Feb 9th 2013
edited by MsCC93
edit
Peteman
topic
10:21:23 AM Jan 28th 2013
edited by Peteman
  • The episode "Dragon Quest" has a major wall-banger at the end. Long story short, Spike refused to smash a phoenix egg after a group of rowdy teenage dragons dare him to do so. He then takes the egg home and decides to raise the baby phoenix (Named "Peewee") as his own. This is supposed to parallel how Spike was adopted and raised by ponies. The problem? Unlike Spike, whom it is explicitly stated that they never knew who his parents were (implying they died or they (accidentally) abandoned him as an egg), it's established that Spike knows who Peewee's parents are and knows where they live. In other words, he could've just as easily tried to find Peewee's parents and return him to them. Hey, Spike? We have a term for taking a child from their parents. It's called "kidnapping".

I'd like to contest this entry. Spike had to travel something like several days by foot following a large migration of dragons which likely would have been over by then, meaning the most obvious landmark would have been lost. Combined with the fact that he would have had to backtrack to where the original nest would be (because Twilight teleported them home while the egg was in tow), then find where they relocated to, and adding the fact with the flying birds most likely scattering to a safer location, this means tracking Peewee's original parents would be like trying to find a needle in a haystack... in another city... that you only have a vague idea the directions to.
RA2
07:15:23 PM Feb 6th 2013
Oops, didn't see this, I went ahead and deleted it because those pics of Spike returning Peewee in "Just for Sidekicks" invalidated the argument. Won't contest the un-deletion if someone has a better argument for keeping it
Peteman
topic
12:05:19 PM Jan 26th 2013
It's possible that Spike didn't find Peewee's parents. He found him a foster family.
taylorkerekes
topic
05:20:08 PM Dec 29th 2012
I'm not gonna create any deviations for these entries, but I will do my best to prove them either right or wrong.

  • Several fans have taken issue with Griffon the Brushoff, specifically how Gilda is written as a flat, one-note bully. While its true that such people exist in real life and in the media, having a characters who's a jerk simply for the sake of being a jerk seems out of place in an idealistic Sugar Bowl like this show. It doesn't help that all the other "bully" characters that appeared on the show were far more fleshed out than her or had an excuse. (Diamond Tiara and Silver Spoon are just spoiled rich kids, Trixie gets redeemed in season 3, and Babs gets a believable Freudian Excuse and eventually becomes friendly)

While I can understand that some shows do carry out this ignorant scenario a lot, we just can hope that sometime in the future the writers will provide some good explanations. If they don't though, well, we're certainly no worse off.

  • The Mysterious Mare Do Well. Basically, Rainbow Dash has been getting full of herself and her friends decide she needs to learn a lesson in humility. Ok, nothing wrong there. The problem is what was done to achieve that - her friends are annoyed by her bragging and decide to pose as the superhero to each her a lesson. This makes Dash progressively become more frustrated and desperate as the new hero steals her thunder, and starts doing stuff like breaking the dam and bothering other ponies over trivial matters. After all of this is revealed, the others claim they were showing Dash how to be a real hero and that she shouldn't brag. WHAT?! SERIOUSLY?! What's the moral here? If one of your friends is getting on your nerves, don't talk to them about it; lie to them and attempt to manipulate them into changing their behavior? If the others had tried talking to Rainbow Dash about her behavior and she had ignored them, I would've understood their actions, but they didn't!

Oh, now THAT one I really find questionable. Plus, it really doesn't surprise me, since other shows have in fact pulled what I like to call "Dirty Psychology 101".

  • The episode "Secret Of My Excess" has one. Ok, so first Spike gets greedy from people giving him so many gifts (something he's not used to...despite that you'd think that Celestia, Twilight Sparkle's parents, and other people who knew Spike before the series began would give him gifts as well). Odd, but fine. Then, Spike starts growing larger and more powerful as he hoards more things. That's stretching the Willing Suspension of Disbelief a bit...But, it's a cartoon, so we'll let that pass. It's then explained that Spike's growth is a result of his greed and that the more he wants/obtains, the bigger he gets and they must stop him from being greedy to return him to normal. An interesting metaphor, if a bit overused. But, fine. But, then...then it's explained that this is a normal aspect of a dragon's growth. (beat) WHAT!?! Not only has this never been established before with the other dragon characters shown in the series (Yes, they did hoard treasure, but they didn't mindlessly grab at any random object they could reach. And they certainly weren't reduced to Hulk Speak like Spike was), but it doesn't make sense at all regarding the lesson that the episode is trying to convey. Spike's greed is normal, but it's bad so we have to remind him to be generous with others by having him remember how good he felt when he gave Rarity that gem? Wouldn't a better lesson be "It's ok to want things, but you should learn to be patient and not expect to get everything you want right away"?

I think the moral delivered in this episode is good enough, and while I can accept greedy behavior coming from a dragon, I just assume that whatever "greedy" behavior Spike displayed in the past is a bit more innocent in comparison, but I guess that's just me. Still, I pretty much enjoy this episode.

  • If you thought Pinkie got off easy for destroying Cranky's book, that's nothing compared to what her "friends" got away with in "Mmmystery on the Friendship Express." The former can at least be written off as an accident, the latter was completely selfish and slimy. Does it mean nothing to them that the Cakes poured their blood sweat and tears into the Mmm, while simultaneously taking care of two newborns? It doesn't matter how tasty it looked, it wasn't theirs to eat! The deus ex machina that took the heat off of them was such an Ass Pull. What really burns me up, is that we had episodes like Suited for Success where both sides of the conflict learn a lesson. Here however we see one of the most incredible Houdinis of the karma and lesson variety. Rather than "Dear Princess Celestia, today we learned that that we need to have better self-restraint, and that we should confess to our mistakes," the lesson is just some yarn about how Pinkie was in the wrong.

Okay, that analysis just sounds biased and contradicting.

  • The episode "Dragon Quest" has a major wall-banger at the end. Long story short, Spike refused to smash a phoenix egg after a group of rowdy teenage dragons dare him to do so. He then takes the egg home and decides to raise the baby phoenix (Named "Peewee") as his own. This is supposed to parallel how Spike was adopted and raised by ponies. The problem? Unlike Spike, whom it is explicitly stated that they never knew who his parents were (implying they died or they (accidentally) abandoned him as an egg), it's established that Spike knows who Peewee's parents are and knows where they live. In other words, he could've just as easily tried to find Peewee's parents and return him to them. Hey, Spike? We have a term for taking a child from their parents. It's called "kidnapping". Not something you want to teach the children watching the show.

Ever consider the possibility that Phoenix birds might be extremely dangerous? So perhaps it's possible that Spike will raise it as a kinder, gentler bird.

  • In the finale, The Bad Guy Wins. During her victory, Queen Chrysalis gloats on how only Twilight was the only one to have noticed her through the disguise, while the others were ignorant of all this. Applejack apologizes and Twilight only tells her that "she fooled everyone." Except... She didn't. Chrysalis, for the duration of her disguise, had Bitch Alert and Obviously Evil signs flaring over her with her jerkass behavior, sinister glares, and even doing a Villain Song complete with Evil Laugh in the middle of a freaking wedding. The other Mane Five may get leeway due to not really knowing Cadance, the disguise, but it doesn't explain Celestia, who is related to Cadance, and how fooled she was. It seemed that the only people who got "fooled" are the ones holding an Idiot Ball.
    • Speaking of Chrysalis, her statement about Shining Armor's love being so great that it let her, an Emotion Eater overpower Celestia. It wouldn't be so bad if one could infer they were roughly equal power level and it gave her a boost, but the way she said it came across as though she was completely out of her league without it. Implying a character whom we never met before despite his crucial position in a main character's life and never seen interact with his beloved except via flashback and abusive doppleganger has this nigh-unstoppable love for another character who we never met before and yet has a crucial position in a main character's life and has a massive criteria for Mary Sue-dom in FIM circles comes across as Character Shilling of the highest order.

Though I do share sorta the same feelings, this analysis does sound rather exaggerated, if you ask me.

  • Also from the finale, the reveal of Shining Armor's existence. He is revealed to have had a very crucial role in Twilight's Backstory, being her closest friend as a filly, and somehow, they only grow apart when Twilight left for Ponyville (which is in naked-eye viewing distance from Canterlot, mind). What makes this really wall-bangy is that, Twilight doesn't forget about her teacher, Princess Celestia, whom she can visit at any time on a quick train ride to Canterlot, but she somehow forgets that she misses her brother, her own family and closest friend, whom she can also visit at any time on a quick train ride to Canterlot.

Why does that matter exactly? 'Cause personally, I don't really see it as a big deal.

  • In the Cider episode, Applejack proudly proclaims that she didn't learn a thing. It was meant to reinforce the concept of not compromising one's quality for the sake of quantity and about how you need to learn to be patient, but the whole reason things happened the way they did was because the Apples are terrible businessponies. That episode proved that with a few extra hooves, they could supply the entire town in under an hour. And yet, year after year, they refuse to so much as hire a couple of salesponies (and they'd have access to them, since they're friends with the owner of Ponyville's equivalent of Wallmart) to run the stand while they put on a constant output. They don't even consider raising prices even though there's sufficient demand that they could probably get rich if they increased the price. And they create a lot of dissatisfied customers by not issuing rain checks to those who didn't get any, nor do they ration it when they see they've got such a huge lineup, instead allowing Pinkie to hoard it (there was a fancomic in which Pinkie deliberately did this to ensure that the cider runs out at the exact time Rainbow Dash would be served as payback for abandoning her and Rarity back in The Last Roundup).

Alright, that's just plain biased and negative. I just don't view the Apples as lousy business people like you do. Ever try to put a positive spin on this?

  • The mission briefing in "The Crystal Empire". Both Luna and Twilight have a point: "What if Twilight fails?" If King Sombra taking over the Crystal Empire would have dire consequences for the rest of Equestria, wouldn't Celestia try to do something like she did previously with Discord and Chrysalis? No, she stays behind in Canterlot Castle and treats this as a test for Twilight to allow her to advance in her mage studies, and she sends her and her friends risking their lives for the sake of Equestria once again, without the Elements of Harmony. I'm sorry, but the stakes are way too high for you to be fooling around like this, Princess.

I really fail to see how this is a bad thing.

I await your responses.
Peteman
12:02:47 PM Jan 26th 2013
edited by Peteman
This is wallbangers. The whole point is to talk about what we see as major issues with the show.

Mmmystery on the Friendship Express: So, it's not a big deal that Pinkie's friends screwed over both her and her employers, and the only one who learns a lesson is Pinkie Pie? Learning about self-restraint is important and yet, no one ever seems to take it seriously.

Dragon Quest: "Ever consider the possibility that Phoenix birds might be extremely dangerous? So perhaps it's possible that Spike will raise it as a kinder, gentler bird." There's nothing that proves that phoenixes are that way. What's problematic about that entry is that Spike wouldn't know where they are. Flying creatures can go very far, especially in that time it would take Spike to travel back to their old nest, and the phoenixes would probably have abandoned the nest they were at because it was attacked.

The Super Speedy Cider Squeezy 6000: The Apples are lousy businessponies. In The Best Night Ever, despite something like nine months and access to Princess Celestia multiple times, Applejack did zero research, meaning she tried to sell food at a catered buffet that didn't even appeal to the clientele. In the Cider episode, she leaves most of her customers high and dry, makes no effort to try and help them leaving ponies like Rainbow Dash suffering for years, hires no additional help despite the fact that a few extra hooves proved they could easily supply the entire town as with five extra hooves, they made enough in less than an hour, and they let themselves be continually baited by the Flim Flam brothers, going so far as to surrender an entire field, which they demolished, as part of the deal they had no advantage in taking in the first place. Not to mention with demand far exceeding supply, they don't try to take advantage of the situation in any way, despite them having fairly constant financial problems. The cider business is how they make it through the winter, and they nearly shot themselves in the foot with all the bad decisions they made that episode.

A Canterlot Wedding: The problems listed are the flaws in storytelling. Princess Celestia not noticing her niece acting in strange and unusual manners, despite what should be centuries of experience, is breaking the willing suspension of disbelief. Meanwhile, as for the reveal of Shining Armor, Twilight has been in Canterlot, in the palace, several times, including on her birthday. That would have been a great time to introduce the character. Instead, they wait for this episode, even though Twilight had been in Canterlot several times to see Princess Celestia, whom, one would expect, would have the captain of her guard nearby at most times, at least when she was in the palace.

The Crystal Empire: How is unnecessarily risking the entire population of the Crystal Empire and subsequently the whole of Equestria not a bad thing? If they could have used the Orbital Friendship Cannon to smite King Sombra within five minutes of their arrival, then there is no reason not to do so. If they couldn't, we'd be more accepting, but they should have spared a minute or two explaining why.

taylorkerekes, you keep accusing other people of being biased, but you seem to be biased in the opposite direction. A lot of the more obnoxious/stupid behavior of the heroes is brushed aside by you. There are legitimate complaints, even if the way this is expressed on the Darth Wiki page is more done in the style of the Caustic Critic.
taylorkerekes
06:04:56 PM Feb 11th 2013
edited by taylorkerekes
Sorry, but I disagree 100% with your analysis on the Cider episode. I know for a FACT that the Apples are NOT lousy business ponies at all.
Psyga315
06:45:28 PM Feb 11th 2013
Might side with Tay on this one. They may be a business, but they're a family business. Granny even states that while the cider the Flim Flams make might be better than theirs, it doesn't amount to the care and effort that the Apples made...

If that makes any sense.
Peteman
06:50:09 PM Feb 11th 2013
edited by Peteman
Their repeated inability to adapt to the situation despite years of facing the same problems is what does them in, as well as their repeated suckerings by the Flim Flam brothers.

At most, I'm willing to alter it to mediocre businessponies with occasional dips into the truly idiotic.
taylorkerekes
07:00:10 PM Feb 11th 2013
You're still wrong, Peteman. The Apple Family are very good businessponies just with some flaws. You just don't wanna accentuate the positive.
Peteman
07:09:40 PM Feb 11th 2013
And yet they have constant financial problems, make a lot of mistakes, and keep having to rebuild that damn barn all the time.
taylorkerekes
07:15:45 PM Feb 11th 2013
It still doesn't make them bad businessponies. Plus, your views are still very inaccurate.
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