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Quatic
topic
10:28:05 PM Jul 29th 2014
Weren't Gilgamesh and Enkidu the very first example of The Hero and The Lancer?
SeptimusHeap
moderator
01:58:16 AM Jul 30th 2014
First recorded, probably yes.
MithrandirOlorin
topic
03:32:39 PM Aug 20th 2013
People have mentioned allot of Leia isn't really an example of The Chick and so her being the page image isn't appropriate. But really I think she's closer to being a straight example of The Chick then Han Solo is of The Lancer. I think some nerds can't take that the Five-Man Band doesn't apply to Star Wars at all.

Han and Luke aren't even on screen together for most of the trilogy. It's Leia he has all the banter with.

The prequel tirlogy has better Lancer examples. Obi-Won in episodes I and III and Anakin in episode II.
wolviepris
topic
09:38:34 PM Jan 17th 2013
Can we get rid of the Knights of the Round Table Lancelot/Kay piece? It really varies according to the era, place of origin, and the individual story. If we can't agree on which character fulfills the role, it's not all that great of a Trope Codifier.
sidestep
12:30:10 AM Aug 6th 2014
edited by 62.68.146.141
I'm pretty sure that Kay is Arthur's Lancer no matter what era we're in. He's everything that the king ISN'T, but he's still his most loyal, although sour and snarky, follower.

Lancelot is more like Sixth Ranger, no matter how you look at him.
SeptimusHeap
moderator
01:43:42 AM Aug 6th 2014
Lancelot doesn't seem to fit Sixth Ranger - by all accounts he was part of the Arthurian circle from the get-go. Sixth Ranger is a trope about people joining late in a team.

Most data I can find support the assertion that Kay is in a sense The Lancer, by the way.
sidestep
06:14:42 AM Aug 6th 2014
edited by 62.68.146.141
He DID joined them later. Both in-story and out of it, actually.

Gang started with guys like Kay, Bedivere, Gawayne. Heck, even sir Balin was there before he appeared. Lancy joined much later - at the very least, after King married the Guinevere, and was presented with a Round Table.

Not saying of him being Canon Immigrant in later retellings of the legend, with no mention in earlier stories whatsoever.
SeptimusHeap
moderator
07:44:00 AM Aug 6th 2014
Ah, then I got bad information. I'll pass that on.
MithrandirOlorin
topic
09:33:31 PM Dec 6th 2012
No Wrestling examples. Perhaps it doesn't usually come to people's minds, but there are definitely Lancers in wrestling History.

Savage, Brutus the Barber Beefcake and the Warrior had all basically been The Lancer to Hulk Hogan.
MithrandirOlorin
topic
02:39:02 AM Nov 24th 2012
Can someone qualify as The Lancer only if it's a Five-Man Band? Or can it apply to other Heroic Partnerships? where it's just the 2 of them or perhaps within a Power Trio.
Telcontar
moderator
07:10:43 AM Nov 24th 2012
The Lancer can happen outside a Five-Man Band; a power trio or heroic partnership of some kind can have one too.
Whipporwill
topic
10:32:37 PM Sep 29th 2012
I've removed Applejack from the list. Friendship is Magic hasn't used the five-man band structure much since the pilot, but even then it was Rainbow Dash that was set up as the Lancer, while Applejack was a steady, reliable Big Guy.

The key here is that the Lancer's style *conflicts* with the hero. RD is aggressive, impulsive, mouthy, and physical, while Twilight Sparkle is cautious, responsible, intellectual, and meticulous. RD is also the one who wants to be a big shot. Applejack is traditional rather than intellectual, but is cautious, responsible, and hardworking. Her style more or less meshes with Twilight's, and while the two aren't super close, AJ's perfectly willing to defer to Twilight's judgement and Twilight knows she can rely on AJ.

Put another way, if TS is a blue oni, RD is a red oni, but AJ is another blue oni.

wootzits
topic
04:14:31 AM Oct 31st 2011
Should a female lancer be called "lancette"?
Stoogebie
topic
10:31:33 AM May 16th 2011
Okay, so I read through the "Playing With" section, and it said that if all the other members of the group foil The Hero, it counts as an aversion. So what if there are two lancers?
74.103.24.243
topic
12:26:24 AM Aug 18th 2010
Just a quick question; where does the name "Lancer" come from? Is it a character?
74.103.24.243
12:27:25 AM Aug 18th 2010
Never mind, just read the page:)
StClair
11:10:35 AM Jan 23rd 2012
edited by StClair
The funny thing is, my understanding was that the trope/character type was named for the character in Mospeda/Robotech - the "backup" hero, who's more worldly and cynical and reserved than the earnest, naive, hot-blooded young-male-viewer-surrogate capital-H Hero. Thus, Lancer vis Scott Bernard, Han Solo vis Luke Skywalker... the sort also known as the Cool Guy.
ArcVaranus
topic
05:42:12 PM Aug 12th 2010
edited by ArcVaranus
So, can villains have Lancers as well? As in, have a Dragon or a BigBadDuumvirate situation where the partner acts as the Big Bad's opposite number?
SomeGuy
11:57:24 AM Aug 13th 2010
I would guess no technically, since The Lancer is defined in relation to the hero.

Metaphorically? Maybe- I can't think of any examples, though. Usually the the Big Bad and The Dragon have a lot more in common than The Hero and The Lancer.
ArcVaranus
10:13:29 AM Aug 20th 2010
Yeah, but the Dragon is usually seen as a subordinate to the Big Bad. I'm thinking of a character who's at an equal level to the main villain, but isn't the one who takes the lead in their evil schemes.

I suppose the situation would be rare, since you don't see a lot of fictional examples of villains trusting each other like a hero would trust his lancer, least of all in the case of Big Bads.
DonaldthePotholer
topic
01:59:37 AM Apr 11th 2010
edited by DonaldthePotholer
Let Me Get This Straight: It doesn't matter how loyal he is to The Hero or his cause, the key thing is that The Lancer is directly on the team (as opposed to an aloof Sixth Ranger) and the opposite ogre to The Hero. Right?
FastEddie
moderator
02:01:32 AM Apr 11th 2010
Pretty much.
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