Discussion Main / StupidEvil

Adam's entry for RWBY. I didn't realise when I removed it that I've removed it once before for being trope misuse and it was re-added.

• In Rwby, Adam is a powerful warrior, but he's an absolutely awful leader because he can't seem to figure out how to stop being evil for the cause. His insistence on putting the White Fang firmly on the 'Terrorist' side of Your Terrorists Are Our Freedom Fighters alienates both moderate Faunus and potential human allies, he's a Bad Boss, and he cannot resist using his power to settle petty grudges (like ordering a hit on Blake's parents because she broke up with him). He pretty much destroys the White Fang within a few months of pulling a coup to put himself in charge over the Well-Intentioned Extremist Sienna Khan.

Stupid Evil is for when villains do evil things just for the sake of being evil, even when it directly harms their interests.

Adam isn't evil for the sake of it. He's a broken soul with a Fatal Flaw of short-sightedness that has been lampshaded as such in-universe. He has a full-blown obsession with both Blake (for abandoning him) and vengeance (against humans because he was tortured in the past by them). As spiteful as he is, there are reasons for why he ended up so broken. He is not evil for the hell of it.

The entry is also incorrect: it mentions he can't figure out how to stop being evil for the cause, but his cause is different to the White Fang's goal. The White Fang are seeking equality with humans. Adam is trying to enslave humanity. He has a very specific evil goal to work towards. The White Fang also didn't turn on him because of his extremism. They turned on him when they found out he had his abandoned his men to be arrested just to save himself and escape.

Edited by Wyldchyld If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.

Would Pyrrhic Villainy count as an example trope for Stupid Evil?

Edited by Sphalerite58 Hide / Show Replies

• Florent L'Belle bankrupts himself by borrowing money to create expensive products he's too vain to actually sell, then commits a Complexity Addiction murder to (unsuccessfully) access a hidden treasure. Even the other characters lampshade this, and even the case's secondary Ineffectual Sympathetic Villain comes out better (for managing to enter said treasure's chamber via Mundane Solution instead).

It seems like a shoehorn. Stupid Evil is not just a villain who is dumb, but a villain whose villainy is itself counterproductive. The way Florent bankrupted himself is colossally idiotic, but not evil, just vain. His way back was evil but not really dumb, at least not to the point of being self-harmfull, had he succeeded, he'd be at least no worse than he as before. Therefore even though he's the biggest dumbass of the game's villains, he doesn't seem like an example of this specific trope.

• An odd variation of this pops up in Avatar; many viewers were asking why the RDA didn't use a myriad array of technologies available to completely exterminate the Na'vi. The movie itself made it quite clear that the RDA didn't want to exterminate the Na'vi people, suggesting Pragmatic Villainy on their part. But when push comes to shove, their battle plan seemed geared more toward playing up their Complete Monster-ness than actually being effective, which pushes them back toward Stupid Evil. In any case, Your Mileage May Vary.

Examples Are Not Arguable

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Is this is any way distinguishable from Dick Dastardly Stops to Cheat? They seem identical to me - bad guy sabotages themselves by doing something evil just for the sake of being evil, despite the action being counterproductive.

Edited by 24.68.65.233 Hide / Show Replies

Could cut lex luther a check fit in there somewhere?

The examples seriously need to be looked over. People are just putting dumb things characters do, instead of stupid evil things, where a character does something stupid just because it's the evilest thing available to them at the moment.

"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane." Hide / Show Replies

Moved this here:

• The Alien franchise has the Weyland-Yutani Corporation (and the military in the fourth film), which has placed a great deal of effort and resources in their attempt to acquire live xenomorphs. The details of how they hope to profit in weaponizing xenomorphs is unknown, especially if they can't even catch one alive or keep them from escaping. Regardless, they have wasted a lot of manpower, all for the sake of profit. A case of the sunk-costs fallacy in action, perhaps?
  • Despite Weyland-Yutani's reputation, their actions in the first three films are quite logical, safe, and cost-effective: Their plan in Alien is to risk the lives of a handful of low-level employees in order to acquire the xenomorph, in Aliens they intend to sacrifice a young colonist and a troublesome witness to get two xenomorphs, and in Alien 3 they send a small detachment of personnel with the intent of removing a queen xenomorph embryo from Ripley - a risk-free goal that, though it fails, costs Weyland-Yutani nothing more than the price of a trip to Fury 161. It's only in Alien Resurrection and the Extended Universe that the villains fall under this trope.
    • The Expanded Universe comics (which ignore Alien 3 and Alien Resurrection) actually give a legitimate explanation for why Weyland-Yutani keeps messing around with xenomorphs despite basic common sense showing that it's an awful idea. The xenomorph hive mind (already latently telepathic in order to control the xenomorphs) extends it's influence ever so slightly to tempt people into interacting with xenomorphs, thus spreading more xenomorphs. And they're not the only ones affected; just about everyone can get lured in by the temptation if their will isn't strong enough, including alien races presumably. The movies beyond Aliens ignore the comic however so there they have no excuse other than stupidity.

This is a Conversation In The Main Page that is likely not an example. As the second bullet states, the Company's We Have Reserves policies are remarkably cost-effective. Even Resurrection I'd question, given that the aliens would be remarkably effective as as bioweapon if it could be controlled. When the Aliens do escape, it has nothing to do with the Company doing something evil that bites them in the ass, but being Too Dumb to Live in general.

You've got roaming bands of armed, aggressive, tyrannical plumbers coming to your door, saying "Use our service, or else!"

Removed the following:

• In Avatar: The Last Airbender, Admiral Zhao of the Fire Nation invades the capital of the Water Tribe; while there, it's revealed to him that there are spirits present that represent elements in nature and that harming them will have dire consequences for the world — not just the Water Tribe, the whole world (Fire Nation included). So what does he do? He decides to kill the Moon Spirit for no other reason than spite and pride. Gee Zhao, you think having the Moon might be a little important? He, of course, dies a Karmic Death when he once again chooses spite over common sense.

First of all, he had a reason other than "spite and pride." (spite had nothing to do with anything, although pride was certainly a factor.) Destroying the Moon spirit would cripple the Water Tribe and take away their water bending, giving his men an immediate and decisive victory.

As for the damaging the whole world part, Zhao had no information on what negative impact this would have on the Fire Nation or the world as a whole. The only information he has is vague warnings from Iroh, whom he already mistrusts as a traitor. It wasn't exactly a smart or cautious move, but there was too much thought into it to fall here.

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Good / Evil trope. Real Life examples should be removed.

OMNIA RESOLVITUR DIALECTICE Hide / Show Replies