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04:00:22 PM Aug 1st 2013
edited by
On another note, why do I see a lot of run-and-gun games (e.g. Contra, Gunstar Heroes, Metal Slug) classified as shmups? Yes the emphasis is on shooting and you have more firepower in those sort of games, but the core gameplay is still that of a platform game—you're not freely moving around the screen; you're still bound to gravity and moving around on platforms than in the air. If platform games where you have a gun constitute shmups, then I suppose like games like the 2D Metroid games count as shmups too.
06:42:43 AM Aug 2nd 2013
They're not platform games by any stretch of the imagination. You could argue that Run&Gun is a distinct genre, but the point of those games is overwhelming firepower and shooting everything that moves, screen filling boss fights, dodging waves of bullets from enemies, and screen clearing attacks. They're certainly closer to shmups than platformers, which are mostly about jumping puzzles and just getting from point a to point b.

Personally, I do see them as distinct, but I basically consider there to be three Shmup genres: Vertical strolling, side-scrolling, and Run & Guns.
08:58:17 AM Aug 2nd 2013
"They're not platform games by any stretch of the imagination."

What, so jumping around on platforms in Contra and such ISN'T like a platform game? Even if there's a lot of shooting going on, you still have to jump around platforms like in, say, Super Mario Bros.; shooting and blindly moving will get you running into a wall at best and touching an enemy or falling into a bottomless pit at worst.
10:13:19 AM Aug 2nd 2013
There's more to being a platformer than "having platforms." Would you call Half-Life a platformer then? And "blindly moving will get you running into a wall at best and touching an enemy" perfectly describes R-Type.

The question is this: Is the core part of the gameplay the shooting, or the platforming? In the case of Metal Slug and Contra, it's most definitely the shooting. Never played Gunstar Heroes, though.
05:16:03 PM Aug 2nd 2013
Maybe there's an emphasis on shooting, but in Contra there are several parts where you have to jump carefully—the waterfall stage comes to mind.
10:25:12 AM Jan 19th 2011
The "other rail shooter" section is complete nonsense. It includes games like Guwange, Axlelay which are scrolling shmups with genuine rail shooting games that don't belong on the page.

I'm deleting the section and moving the examples elsewhere on the page. And deleting examples which aren't actual shmups.
05:08:20 AM Jan 21st 2011
edited by TrevMUN
And I've restored them. I should have known that you would be attempting to do this after what you were saying on the Headscratchers page. You're just like the guy who stubbornly kept removing the Phantasy Star games from the Massively Multiplayer Online index because of his belief that they were Roguelikes.
05:31:23 AM Jan 21st 2011
Looking at the edits, if I may, I'd like to note the following: We are not That Other Wiki.

An argumentative Edit War about what genre a game is might belong there, but I'd like to think it doesn't belong here, or even need to. Rather, I'd prefer that an uncertain game be listed in as many categories as possible, with qualifications, links and even videos, so as to let the reader make up their own mind about where it belongs. With as many passive-aggressive flame wars - well, pilot light wars - going on about whether certain works are good or bad, I don't see the point in adding more fuel to the fire.

Isn't this wiki supposed to be centered around fun?
02:03:25 AM Jul 13th 2013
Old topic, but don't we have a Rail Shooter page anyway?
05:54:06 PM Sep 4th 2010
Eliminated the Cute 'em Up section. If Bullet Hell games don't get a separate category on this page, neither should cute-'em-ups.
06:15:00 PM Jul 11th 2010
Would Kingdom Hearts II fit as a shoot em up, during the rocket ship parts?
04:31:48 PM Aug 21st 2010
I think that's more Unexpected Shmup Level.
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