Main Rule Abiding Rebel Discussion

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01:12:13 PM Nov 27th 2017
What happened to the original concept for this page, of a work that presented itself as challenging but wound up reverting to conventional ideals? I don't have a problem with the current state of it but the original version was one of the more interesting tropes, is the content still there? Has it been preserved on another page? What was the reason for the change?
02:33:21 PM Nov 4th 2013
Regarding Serena Southerlyn's coming out on Law & Order, if Elisabeth Röhm had ad-libbed that line, why would it have made it to air? Either the director would have called "Cut!" and have the scene redone as written, or it would have been edited out in post-production and the next # would have had a line added to explain her absence.

That's why I think it was in the script from the get-go.
06:15:48 PM Nov 4th 2013
I agree, but it could've been a Throw It In!.
11:07:00 AM Apr 28th 2013
I cut these examples because they don't fit the rule of "a work that portrays itself as edgy but is too conventional or safe to truly justify that portrayal." These may be their own trope:

  • Although Reina and her flunkies in Yandere Kanojo speak rather coarsely and enjoy violence, they don't seem to drink, smoke or do anything else that would otherwise fit their 'delinquent' status. Even then, Reina has mellowed out somewhat over time due to her relationship with Manabu.
  • The protagonists of W Juliet are a softspoken, elegant guy (forced by circumstance to pose as a girl at school) and a butch straight girl who fall in love. At first the manga seems to be about an unconventional but very romantic relationship, but our hero and heroine change and behave in more and more "gender appropriate" ways, and by the time the series ends their relationship is quite conventional, although the implication at the end is that they get married in drag ..
  • The Grand Finale of the 101 Dalmatians cartoon had Cruella hitching a ride with a motorcycle gang who wouldn't exceed the speed limit.
  • The Simpsons:
    • The picture above is from the episode "The Bart Wants What It Wants". It depicts the filming of a scene from the fictional movie Canadian Graffiti.
    • In the episode "Take My Wife, Sleaze", Homer pulls his motorcycle up beside Chief Wiggum in his car, who expresses his desire to put Homer and his newly formed motorcycle gang behind bars. Homer derisively points out that Wiggum can't hassle them because they're going at the speed limit.
01:05:47 PM Jun 13th 2012
About Shrek, the first time I saw that movie (as a kid) I thought "Why isn't the pretty princess staying a pretty princess? I like pretty princesses!"

Since Ugly Guy with Hot Wife is common enough to be a trope, and Beauty Is Never Tarnished is a trope as well I think the way things turned out there was actually more rebellious than if Fiona had stayed pretty. Does anyone agree with me, and if so, should that example be removed or should we just add a sub-bullet thing explaining that there are different views on the subject?
07:05:36 PM Jun 4th 2012
How the hell is this YMMV?
12:34:53 AM Jun 5th 2012
The trope is about a work trying and failing to be controvertial/edgy. Whether it succeeds or fails is going to be decided individually by each reader/watcher of the work, since everyone has a different definition of what they consider edgy or conventional.
12:11:20 PM Apr 5th 2012
We have to get rid of examples that are less this trope and more "Fair for Its Day: the Butthurt Edition". If you have to add "Well, it was Fair for Its Day in the example, then I don't think it should be this trope. For instance, "Show X has had racial minorities featured on the show, just not any recurring characters." and then need to add "Well, to be fair...", does it really need to be in this page? I don't mean to sound rude, but it seems like the page is getting flooded with shoehorned examples that don't quite count.
06:35:01 PM Dec 7th 2011
As two of the four "real life" examples are either from nonfiction literature or from stand-up comedy, would it be all right if I copy-pasted them there?
04:58:14 PM Mar 21st 2010
I'm trying to figure out how Dragonriders of Pern belongs on this page. I don't recall anywhere that Anne McCaffrey claimed she was trying to write some kind of revolutionary moral about the value of a pastoral society.
05:07:18 PM Mar 21st 2010
I think it's because she wrote about gay men in an era where gay people were all but non-existent in media, but her portrayals weren't exactly flattering.
12:40:11 AM Oct 18th 2011
So, uh, for the torchwood one, its being criticized for not having all the characters sleep with multiple people of both sexes? am i reading that right?
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