Main Buxom Is Better Discussion

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09:13:41 PM Dec 31st 2015
02:32:29 AM Jan 1st 2016
No, because Buxom Is Better is other people thinking large breasts as attractive.
12:57:31 PM Dec 18th 2013
edited by
Really? This page gets to stay while Baby Got Back got axed? Even though it's going through the exact same problems?
01:02:53 PM Dec 18th 2013
Please bring it up in the Trope Repair Shop and/or this project thread if you think it has problems (without complaining about another page being axed).
01:51:39 AM Aug 12th 2011
Is the 'porn' folder really necessary? There doesn't seem to be much in it besides "there are big boobs in porn" and a link to a website, which I thought weren't encouraged?
02:51:25 PM Jul 28th 2011
There are currently several pages that have red links to Buxom Babe, I would like to propose making that a redirect to Buxom Is Better.

I am the Tippy Toe Zombie I like to Limbo Often I fall on people's heads
06:09:37 PM Sep 23rd 2011
Buxom Babe was a redirect to this trope. We cutlisted it because to was a bad name and was being used to point out busty characters tropers had a Perverse Sexual Lust for. red links to Buxom Babe should be removed and replaced with Buxom Is Better when appropriate .
07:40:09 AM Jun 19th 2011
edited by captainpat
"Within various media there is a prevalent assumption among story writers, artists, etc., that large(r) breasts automatically make a woman more attractive; this often leads to "excessive" focus on said breasts (even if this assumption is not stated in the text), or the character with the largest breasts getting treated as the most attractive in-universe (regardless of who the fans think is really the most attractive)."

Ok, This needs to be re-worked. Saying that "large(r) breasts automatically make a woman more attractive" is not a assumption, that's an opinion. Now saying that the author thinks the audience of a work will find a large breasted character or the character with the largest breasts more attractive is an assumption. However, without Word of God as to why the author gave the character large breasts in the first then all this paragraph is doing is making an assumption of a potential assumption.

12:40:37 PM Nov 1st 2010
edited by
Buxom Is Better proper is fine but it would be best to keep anything related author appeal out of the trope. Buxom is better should derive strictly from things in the actual work.

Buxom sells, I'm leaning on no. Unless you know what went on in the through the character designer's head when making said character, it's anyone's guess whether or not the creator where trying to cash in on the appeal of big breasts and/or wanted to implemented his fetish in the character design. Either way it would require a lot insight.

World of Buxom, I'm iffy on. It sound vaguely reminiscent of Most Common Super Power, so it could a sub trope but I've never really liked Most Common Super Power. Trying to link it to Reality Is Unrealistic doesn't really work since that page deals with tropes that are mistaken for reality. Most people already know big breasts, in real life, are rare. Beside since it's fiction that pretty much gives the creator free reign to do what they want. Also busty characters tend to stick out more, I'm concerned that people might spot a few buxom character and assume this trope.

Personally I think we have enough breasts tropes and we're starting to get the point where there's way too much overlap between breast tropes. However if you're going to add one more I'd go with World of buxom, but World of buxom should only apply if the majority of the seen character super-power or not are busty. That way it doesn't overlap too much with Most Common Super Power. Also should also be required that the show have a lot of busty characters, on screen, preferable extras. That way there's at least some proof that's it really is a world of busty women.

Well those are my thoughts.
09:55:07 PM Nov 1st 2010
I don't think we really need more tropes for this, personally. Buxom Sells, for one thing, can fit under Sex Sells.

Admittedly, Buxom Is Better is being misused somewhat, but I suspect that's inevitable. The trope page makes it pretty clear what it's about (bigger breasts = hotter girl) but of course some people are going to ignore that.
07:08:41 AM Oct 30th 2010
edited by captainpat
I'm seeing this trope being used a lot. Unfortunately, I don't think being used properly. It's pretty much being used to tag any big breasted character often the quip only talks about how big said character's breasts are.

I'm not surprise since this is the same thing that happened with Most Common Superpower and Gag Boobs, but I think it's far more of an issue with this trope since, not saying I could do much better, the name nor the description are as clear as they could be.

IMO, I think the breast bias or big breast bias would be a better fit for the name, as one of the tropers mentioned but that might be too late. However, I think for the description it needs to be made more clear that this trope is not just about having big breasts.

05:38:06 AM Oct 31st 2010
edited by MarqFJA
You know, you raise a good point. I've been so distracted by many things in the past months that I've neglected addressing this issue.

For now, I now realize that at least part of the problem is that we're trying to shoehorn multiple tropes into one. Here's my current take on it:

  • Buxom Is Better proper: The belief that 1) a true woman has to be big-breasted, and 2) the bigger the breasts, the more feminine/womanly and/or sexually attractive you are; can take the form of a buxom girl ridiculing a lesser-endowed peer's lack of "assets", or guys favoring a shallow woman for her bustiness while ignoring the kind-hearted Shrinking Violet with an average-sized chest.
  • Buxom Sells: Owing in part to Sex Sells, the majority of character artists/designers/writers either believe that making a female/hermaphrodite character noticeably big-breasted and/or deliberating designing the character and/or her wardrobe to draw Male Gaze to her big breasts would result in increased popularity, and thereby increased profitability, or they don't believe so, but are still trying to cash in on the relatively prevalent appeal of already existing buxom female characters by designing their female characters accordingly.
    • The likes of Mai Shiranui, Ivy, Morrigan and Felicia would fall under this; one can't really deny that their character designers aren't purposefully emphasizing their bustiness.
  • World of Buxom: Where every single known/shown female/hermaphrodite character - excluding the occasional Token Loli or Pettanko - is unquestionably big-breasted, even the nameless extras, to a degree that is dissonant with reality.

Buxom Is Better (proper) and Buxom Sells can and do overlap in the case of some character designers.

I would appreciate any suggestions to improve the above proposed division.
12:51:28 PM Sep 9th 2010
edited by MarqFJA
I am thinking that we should add an example category for works where Buxom Is Better is taken so far that the only girls in the recurring cast (or even the entire cast) with breasts that are smaller than "large/very large" are the Pettanko and Loli characters. Cases in point: Godannar, Dragonaut, Divergence Eve, Angel Blade. And there are'' more, FYI.

Also, I'm considering an Author Appeal entry, where we list comic-book artists/manga authors/anime creators/character designers/etc. who are notorious for preferring to draw/animate big-breasted female characters. Cases in point: Kubo Tite (of Bleach), Masami Obari (of Gravion, Angel Blade, Marine a Go Go, etc.), Seiji Matsuyama (of Eiken and Zokusei manga).

01:27:38 PM Sep 9th 2010
edited by Iverum
The second one we have tropes for already.

Also, adding more "categories" expands the trope in awkward ways. The definition of the trope is hard to get already.
07:49:26 AM May 26th 2010
Not that I don't appreciate a good pun, I was wondering change the picture on the page to a more literal one. Perhaps of a girl being jealous of a another girls rack or of a girl getting attention for being busty. What do you guys think?
09:03:20 AM May 26th 2010
No, this one's fine.
11:51:21 PM May 26th 2010
edited by Iverum
Actually, a new image wouldn't be bad. This one doesn't explain the trope at all. Or really contribute to the page at all.

In fact, there is a discussion here
02:38:19 AM Apr 27th 2010
I'm trying to think of punny "Baby Got X" alt-names for this trope, but can't settle on one. Current choices (in no particular order):

Thoughts, anyone?
04:45:10 PM Dec 14th 2010
I like Baby Got Bust. It's catchy.
03:40:10 AM Dec 20th 2010
Why does there have to be a punny alt-name? Buxom is better is already a pun/snowclone of Bigger is Better and works fine. This website needs less puns, not more. Baby got Boobs is already a porn series.
06:05:54 PM Mar 31st 2010
This has been cutlisted, but I'm pretty sure it's a legitimate trope. Not entirely sure it should have examples, but they're better here than cluttering the Most Common Superpower page.
07:09:31 PM Mar 31st 2010
"Men think large breasts are sexy" ≠ trope

And here's an idea: why not just delete the MCSP examples instead of creating a non-trope article whose only purpose is for people to fill with PSL?
10:51:22 PM Mar 31st 2010
Pill hasn't had any success in the discussion thread in getting rid of this, so she gone to the cutlist. Don't cut.
11:34:06 PM Mar 31st 2010
It's definitely a trope. Though it may be ill defined based on the current article.
08:41:47 AM Apr 1st 2010
@Pill: How many times do I have to say it? Buxom Is Better is not "Men think large breasts are sexy", it's "Most men think the bigger the breasts, the sexier they are (which isn't always true)".

@Iverum: Please state your issues, then, so we may work to correct them. Civil, well-mannered debate is always welcome in my book.
12:16:51 PM Apr 2nd 2010
The article text just seems to meander a bit too much. It's a bit hard to pull exactly what this Trope is without rereading it. The article could be organized a bit better is the main point I want to make.
12:30:22 PM Apr 2nd 2010
Okay, that is a reasonable point. Can you specify which lines/paragraphs are problematic?
12:59:07 PM Apr 2nd 2010
Within the various forms of media, there is a prevalent assumption among story writers, artists, etc., that large(r) breasts automatically make a woman more attractive; this often leads to "excessive" focus on said breasts even if this assumption is not stated in the text, and/or the character with the largest breasts automatically being treated as the most attractive in-universe (regardless of who the fans think is really the most attractive).

This sentence makes the trope sound like Author Appeal. It's the first sentence in the article, and sets the trope up as something it is not. It's also a run-on, but we'll ignore that.

This trope is basically a female character that is at least reasonably attractive, and who is notable - and usually lampshaded in-universe - for having substantially larger than average breasts among other female contemporaries.

This sentence should probably come first. It gives a better idea of what the trope is. It still is a little unclear however. Are you saying that the trope is about female characters who are attractive with large breasts, or female characters who are attractive because they have large breasts.

The trope should also define the difference between
This trope is "Bigger Breasts = Hotter Girl", not simply "Big Breasts = Hot Girl"
03:57:16 PM Apr 2nd 2010
edited by MarqFJA
<sigh> This is exactly why I wanted to continue tweaking the description in YKTTW stage; unfortunately, I kept getting a lot of "Just Launch It Already!!" reactions and eventually caved in. But I digress.

  • 1st Point: The paragraph was supposed to explain that the trope commonly arises from either Author Appeal, or assuming that "all men like big breasts, and the bigger the better", but in hindsight, I realize that it doesn't show that quite well. I don't get how it's a "run-on", though.
    • On a side-note, it was derived from the "Rename Booberiffic" thread in the Trope Repair Shop, which contributed a lot to Buxom Is Better's current form.
  • 2nd Point: It's a legacy of the earlier Booberiffic. I think it was supposed to exclude undeniably hideous females who somehow qualify for the "big breasts" criterion. In short, Generic Cuteness is required, even if in-universe the character is supposed to be homely (e.g. Chisame Hasegawa, who is supposed to have "bad skin", yet is drawn in the same "blemishless" way as practically everyone else  *)
  • 3rd Point: Okay, I thought I should go with brief and concise, given that I've been given some "description is too long" complaints in the YKTTW, but it seems that I was too brief. I'll have to expand that part.

Anything else?
04:21:26 PM Apr 2nd 2010
edited by Pill
Just because it's "observable" doesn't mean its a trope. It is NOT a repeated pattern or motif in works, but merely a societal conditioning. That's like me saying that "many people have cell phones" is a trope.

If you all really insist on keeping this article (and I refuse to call it a trope, as it seems the definition of the word has been skewered on this site), I suggest you rename it to "Breast Bias", make it very evident that the opinion of breasts this trope gives is, in fact, a biased opinion, and keep it absolutely example-less. Also, delete any outward links that use this page just to denote characters people want to gush over for their breasts. We don't need another MCSP problem.

And Mad, how did you come to the conclusion that I'm female?
04:44:00 PM Apr 2nd 2010
I direct you to "Rename Booberiffic?" for references on why and how it has been agreed that this is a valid trope, and "Misuse of breast tropes", and Tropability of Breast Tropes/Related Tropes to discuss your complaint of the Buxom Is Better trope's "untropability". I do not want to clutter the discussion page with a debate that be done in a more fitting place.

That aside, to expand on my previous rebuttal, your very own logic would dictate that Biggus Dickus, a trope that has a similar premise (in short, "bigger penis = better sex"), should also be treated the same. However, there have been no contention thus far about its validity as a trope.
04:46:22 AM Mar 9th 2010
edited by MarqFJA
From YKTTW Working Title: Mammaria Majores.

Spun off from this discussion, and ultimately from the Buxom YKTTW, which accidentally split off into Booberiffic (now Cut Listed), Huge Tracts Of Land, and If You've Got It, Flaunt It. See also the Misuse of breast tropes and the Tropability of Breast Tropes / Related Tropes forum dicussions.

The current previous prospective title, Mammaria Majores, can be taken as both an abbreviation of glandulae mammaria majores (sic; correct form majorum) ("Greater Mammary Glands"), and as pseudo-Latin for "major mammaries" (= "greater[-sized] breasts").

Proposed Alternate Titles (do not alter; additions are to be discussed first):
04:52:58 AM Mar 19th 2010
edited by Iverum
Why is there an Unknown Classification section? What does that even mean? Cut it.

Unknown classification (Pending proper reclassification; no additional examples please)
  • Notably lampshaded in one episode of Azumanga Daioh: resident Cloudcuckoolander Osaka describes the well-developed Sakaki as "American" and herself as "Japanese", with Yomi being somewhat between them as "Hawaiian" (as there's a very large Japanese minority in Hawaii). When Tomo asks about herself, the short reply is: "Japanese".
    • Hawaii also has a large portion of naturally large natives, and Yomi is always teased about being overweight.

The Real Life section should be cut too. Except perhaps for mentioning porn. Otherwise, most of them don't relate to the trope at all.
12:34:09 PM Mar 19th 2010
While I may agree with you on the "Unknown Classification" section, I think the Real Life section is fine as it is, except maybe moving the "Gigantomastia" bit to the tail end of the article description.

And Since the Buxom Is Better phenomenon applies in Real Life, it stands to reason that anyone who's interested in the trope and its Real Life occurences would also be interested in knowing the current world records.

The "no more examples" tag ensures that this section does not become overloaded with Perverse Sexual Lust.
03:15:18 AM Jun 4th 2010
edited by BigT
The whole point of the Unknown Classification section is to allow Wiki Magic to put it in the right section. The person who put it there didn't want it to stay, they just didn't know where to put it.

BTW, obviously that example would go under Anime/Manga.
08:55:41 PM Jun 4th 2010
It wasn't a question of what type of media it was, the classification was acting as a separate section from Subversions and such. It made no sense.
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