Film TRON Legacy Discussion

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01:10:04 PM Jan 12th 2014
This is showing up as a red link.
01:12:58 PM Jan 12th 2014
Fixed. That can happen when a subpage is cut. All you need to do is edit the page briefly and the redlink-bluelink thing will remember that the page exists.
07:00:45 PM Apr 1st 2013
edited by Morgenthaler
A request to people who've seen this film: can someone update the entry for TRON: Legacy for Super Weight? It's a Just for Fun homegrown ranking at TV Tropes of measuring characters' relative power in a story, divided into nine broad categories. The entry according to the old criteria was this (and can be found on the medium subpage's discussion page):

  • TRON: Legacy
    • Type 0: Gladiators in the arena, rectified "soldier" programs
    • Type 1: The Black Guard, Sam, Quorra
    • Type 2: Rinzler
    • Type 3: Clu
    • Type 4: Kevin Flynn

There's also an entry for TRON that need to be updated.
10:32:51 AM May 3rd 2013
You could very well make a case that Kevin is Type 5, as he DID create The Grid, the "world" upon which TRON takes place.
12:15:40 PM Dec 11th 2012
I'm removing this entry as I don't see how the trope can be expected to apply in a virtual world that, presumably, lacks the equivalent to OSHA to begin with. The bit about Flynn rigging the portal to close in half a day is also something of a plot gimmick to justify him being stuck there. I doubt he would have consulted OSHA either.

  • No OSHA Compliance:
    • When Sam is taken to the games, one of the programs manages to get away from the guards. Since he'd rather die than compete, he dives into a convenient pit with a giant fan that's right out in the open.
    • Kevin Flynn designed the Portal between the real world and the Grid in such a way that it can only be opened from the outside, and only stays active on the inside for half a day or so. While it seemed to be a sensible security precaution at the time (as Kevin Flynn admits), it turns into a trap when he can't make it back in time.
    • The elevator leading to the End of Line Club has emergency brakes that have to be manually activated. Either that or Kevin Flynn had to install emergency brakes on the spot, which is equally bad.
    • Clu's personal ship attaches to the top spire of his enormous Rectifier, and the only way up to it is a small elevator platform. There's also no guard rails at the entrance, so people can get knocked off the edge with ease.

04:30:48 PM Dec 11th 2012
Looking over the trope page, the work doesn't actually NEED an OSHA to exist in its world, it's just about ludicrously unsafe work environments. In all of TRON, Programs (et al) can and have died (or derezzed) from falling from high places, as well as non-game-related environmental hazards. Similarly, the digitizing laser was designed with very unsafe practices. I'd say it applies.
03:33:40 AM Jun 21st 2012
edited by atypicaloracle
The events of Tron: Evolution are canon. The misadventures of the Monitor program "Anon" make up the connection between Tron: Betrayal and Tron: Legacy.

Something about this is kind of humorous in a plot-hole-discontinuity sort of way, and relates to the "Curb Stomp Battle" Flynn engaged in to rescue Quorra from the guards... in that it didn't happen that way. Quorra was rescued from the wasteland by Flynn, but it was Anon who protected her. There were no Black Guards present: they dove off an exploding ship and fell to the ground in a malfunctioning Rectifier. They tumble free of the Rectifier as it crashes, and Anon shoves Quorra away so it won't land on her, getting himself derezzed in the process.

The closest they come to acknowledging this in Legacy is Quorra's statement that "a sympathetic program" smuggled her out of the city. Until I played Evolution, I assumed this meant Zuse.
04:55:31 PM Jan 15th 2012
I'm not sure the reason behind the inclusion of Verbal Tic is appropriate: Rinzler does speak in English on exceedingly rare occasions, not just in ticking sounds (which I took to be more of a rattling, growly, small electric motor sound, representing that "he's more machine, now, than man"). Coincidentally, the only times he does speak are when his Tron programming tries to re-assert itself. But because it's not a Tron vs. Rinzler split-personality thing (more like a buried-past thing), I think it still counts as Rinzler speaking.
08:56:04 PM Feb 6th 2012
Don't forget he also spoke in the Arena, saying one word: "User". I definitely count that as Rinzler speaking.
04:24:56 PM Apr 24th 2012
I think it works. His primary method of communication is body language and the low growl (even if the latter only advertises his presence, most of the time).

On the other hand, you can point to the verbal "tic" of his voice being heavily distorted when he speaks, potentially implying some kind of damage.
05:16:12 PM Dec 26th 2011
I noticed in the movie that there was Go Board in Flynn's hideout. The board game Go has a terminology for when a stone is about to be captured, similar to Chess players saying check, called atari. The game company Atari was named after this term. Is this a trope somehow?
08:12:15 PM Dec 26th 2011
Maybe a combination of Genius Bonus and Shout-Out?
07:14:41 PM Oct 10th 2011
I can't tell if anyone else has brought attention to this, but during the Coup:Flashback scene, Tron easily derezzes a number of guards, and then even though he could easily throw one of his two light-discs at CLU, he decides to run and tackle him instead, never utilizing the weapons. With Tron being such a skilled fighter, I can hardly believe this was unintentional. Can anyone shed some light on this? Why did he choose this bizarre way to subdue CLU? Why not use the weapons? Was there some other purpose in not harming CLU?
06:57:05 AM Oct 11th 2011
He perhaps had two reasons, one was to give Kevin as much time to run, knowing he was no match for the mirror of a user. The second reason was because Clue is part User, Tron's desire to protect them kept him from making a fatal blow until Clu had crossed a line.
06:57:27 AM Oct 11th 2011
That's more a headscratcher than anything else, because there's lots of possible reasons he might have done that.
03:23:17 AM Jun 21st 2012
Given his speed, agility and combat programming, he surely could have kept C.L.U. busy for a while without resorting to a suicide dive tackle.
07:02:35 PM May 24th 2011
I see from the page history someone is pretty adament about putting line breaks to seperate Flynn's opening narration in an attempt to mimic the delivery. I prefer it to be pushed into a solid paragraph because otherwise it pushes the page introduction quite a long ways down, almost past the page image. Effectively it is making the quote longer than it is and too long quotes are generally looked down upon.

Also, I know someone put a bunch of % % remarks at the beginning of the page as a list of "do's and don'ts" for the page. Even though it doesn't show up on the actual page, that kind of stuff is what the discussion page is for. If there is any sort of edit war going on (like with the page quote) it's far easier to have a discussion here than in the edit comments.
08:36:46 PM Aug 21st 2011
It doesn't push it down past the page image on my screen. Perhaps your resolution is too low or zoom is too high, because I'm not seeing any issues.
02:29:44 PM Apr 9th 2011
edited by SanyuMiyazaki
I'm debating whether or not we should lump any tropes concerning the Blu-ray bonus short film "Tron: The Next Day" on this page, or put all those tropes on its own page. We could also cover any tropes involving the Flynn Lives ARG, as "The Next Day" serves as a chronology of the game, as well as revealing that Ram's User, Roy Kleinberg, was ZackAttack, and Alan Bradley was ISOlated Thinker. What do you guys think?
05:07:23 PM Apr 9th 2011
Spin-Offs rarely deserve their own pages. More than a few works articles just separate the tropes in a specific section at the bottom of the page.
09:43:59 AM Apr 10th 2011
So it should be a separate section on this page?
04:04:08 PM Apr 8th 2011
Am I the only person trying to fit Tron 2.0 into the new continuity?
05:05:11 AM Apr 11th 2011
Maybe but it's clear that it really doesn't fit. Tron Legacy and 2.0 are completely separate sequels to the original and Legacy is canon.
08:24:53 PM Apr 23rd 2011
edited by Fulcon
Pffffft! That's the easy way out!

They may be seperate sequels, but there is little to nothing saying that they couldn't happen. 2.0 could've happened before Legacy, for example.

I wonder what the general opinion would be if Jet were included in the sequel? I forsee complications between him and Sam.
03:36:33 AM Apr 8th 2011
edited by JRPictures
Ignore this this was an accidental double post
03:35:42 AM Apr 8th 2011
◦Ah, but in the film, discs do not split into two.

Can someone tell me what is meant by this and Chekhov's Gun

Cause I swear Rinzler's disc do split in two unless I'm missing something.
04:12:52 AM Apr 8th 2011
The fact that Rinzler has two identity discs is a hint that he has two identies: Rinzler and Tron.

Now, it sure looks like his disc split in two, but he's the only one ever doing this.
04:59:02 AM Apr 11th 2011
Well fair enough. I can see that.
09:28:25 PM Jun 22nd 2012
Sam tries to split his own disc, but it won't play along. "Is that even legal?!"
06:47:08 PM Mar 31st 2011
Regarding the first entry on What Happened to the Mouse?, I thought that Sam's first light cycle rod was broken during the games (which necessitated his rescue by Quorra), so he held onto the spare he managed to take just in case he needed it. Would it still count as an entry under that?
01:19:12 AM Feb 19th 2011
edited by
At one point of the movie there's a blatant case of "My name is inigo montoya" ( Could it be added ?

(sorry if I screw something up, I don't clearly know how things work in here)
02:48:38 AM Feb 19th 2011
Add it, then. :-)
05:42:54 PM Feb 6th 2011
edited by ragingzealot
This might be stretching it a little bit, but there seemed to be a subtle Sibling Rivalry between Clu and Sam, mostly from the point of view of Clu. Clu and Sam can be seen as half siblings with the same father (Kevin Flynn), and in the final showdown Clu subtly expresses that a large part of his motivation for doing everything was to impress his "father" ("I did everything, everything you ever asked... I took the system to its maximum potential, I created the perfect system!") and shows a bit of residual hurt over his perceived abandonment by Kevin ("You promised that we would change the world together, you broke your promise")and he also shows a measure of jealousy of Kevin's affection for Sam ("You knew I'd beat you, and still you did all this, for HIM?"). This is my first suggestion, so let me know what you think. Thanks.
06:17:01 PM Feb 6th 2011
It's way too flimsy to justify a trope entry, methinks.
07:28:07 PM Feb 6th 2011
I couldn't agree more, I just familiarized myself with the Well Done Son Guy and Calling the Old Man Out tropes an believe these fit the situation much better (and are already present on the page). Sorry for the premature post.
08:25:45 PM Feb 6th 2011
I don't think you need be sorry. You weren't sure, so you asked on the discussion page - that's the right thing to do, no matter what the answer ends up being. Better than adding the example on the page without asking first, then finding out you were wrong.
06:40:49 AM Feb 1st 2011
edited by shinfernape
They should have got Kurt Russell to play Clu as he looks a lot like Jeff Bridges and I think the digital de-aging process would work better than. It would be like how they de-ages Professor X in Xmen 3. But also Kurt Russell is awesome and though a double dose of Bridges is something I think it would have been more grand if it was Kurt Russell vs Jeff Bridges.
09:08:45 PM Feb 12th 2011
It would also make the Metal Gear Solid similarities even better...
11:43:46 PM Mar 18th 2011

What similarities? I know Kurt Russel played Snake Plissken but I never played the MGS series.
12:31:13 PM Jan 31st 2011
Should we add a Character Alignment to the YMMV section? If we do, what do we feel would be the proper alignments for all major characters?
12:37:44 PM Jan 31st 2011
No Just No. Character Alignment is hyper-subjective and Flame Bait incarnate. Don't do it ever.
03:20:05 PM Jan 31st 2011
I've been noticing that a lot lately, so I'm glad I checked first.
06:29:42 PM Jan 30th 2011
Should we add a Paranoia Fuel for this movie and on the original Tron film. I mean, this franchise does propose that every single computer program is a living, sentient "person". Every-time you do big project and delete some programs, that's like God sending down a plague upon the city...
07:17:32 AM Jan 31st 2011
First, that's YMMV. Second, it's only paranoia fuel if you are taking an awful lot of drugs.
07:40:34 AM Jan 31st 2011
Or if you are very young. :-)

In grade-school, I had a classmate who hated computers because he had learned the truth from the Terminator movie. Yes, he believed in Skynet. For real. Surely he could have believed in Tron as well.
08:00:06 AM Jan 31st 2011
Paranoia Fuel should be limited to (notionally) mature audiences or it becomes "literally everything ever".
12:26:42 PM Jan 31st 2011
Yeah, I guess you're right...
07:13:37 PM Dec 27th 2010
Missed Moment of Awesome: If Flynn had kicked the program instead of bumping it on the head...
02:09:09 AM Dec 29th 2010 wouldn't be a Missed Moment of Awesome, because that's not what a Missed Moment of Awesome is. A MMOA is when something awesome happens but we don't get to see it because it happens offscreen. Seriously, that trope has undergone the fastest instance of Trope Decay I have ever seen on this wiki.
12:27:30 AM Dec 30th 2010
If that's the case then the real MMOA is Sam's apparently super badass slaughter of the guard programs in the anteroom of Clu's carrier's bridge. He marches in, evidently now confident and driven, takes his disc out, then the doors lock and you hear discs slamming off walls followed by terrified screams. Then Sam marches straight out of the now barren room and grabs Jarvis by the throat.
06:31:32 PM Dec 27th 2010
I'd like to argue for a YMMV in the case of Zuse & Gem being Clu's agents. Zuse mentions 'playing all the angles' and that 'he believed in the Users once'; shortly after Sam uses the phrase as well right before Zuse very ineffectively 'attacks' him. When the hubbub dies down, Zuse guns down CLU's last enforcer to take Kevin's disc, presumably as a bargaining chip. He's also quite hesitant to hand it over when the time comes, almost as though he knows that's his only chance. I feel perhaps the two aren't the villains they're made out to be, or could at least be interpreted otherwise.
02:38:25 AM Dec 28th 2010
Still doesn't mean they weren't Clu's agents, though. 1) "Believed in the Users once," with a bitter inflection that combines with his words to imply 'but not any more, so screw it.' 2) Zuse doesn't seemed like he's programmed for combat, ex-ISO or not. It's entirely possible, probable even, that his ineffectual attack is the best he could do. Like when the Joker is forced into physical combat, more often than not he'll get his ass kicked (and should) because his forte is so not melee. 3) Given that Clu blows up the club, and possibly/probably Zuse and Jem with it, immediately after the disk gets handed over, it's not unlikely that Zuse realized he was only getting away with his existence so long as Clu thought he might be useful. Not likely moral/ethical/ect hesitation so much as practical concern for his continued well-being.

So yes, it's possible you could interpret them as something other than The Moles, but given what we see it'd be necessary to do so. Until we get official information otherwise, the facts are there.
09:47:37 AM Dec 27th 2010
maybe there should be a Crowning Music of awesome trope? i didnt see one in the trope list, however, its mentions in the little snippet of quotes in the opening sections of the page, and well the music was AWESOME too, considering Derezzed( the music from the club fight scene) and the Light cycle battle too.
02:07:09 AM Dec 29th 2010
There already exists a Crowning Music of Awesome page. Put any entries regarding the movie's soundtrack on the movie's page.
09:45:55 AM Dec 26th 2010
I have to disagree with the Interspecies Romance entry with Sam and Quorra. While there very well could be something between them in the future, there just wasn't really anything that could be clearly labeled as a romance within the movie that couldn't also be explained as a platonic friendship. And this is from someone who went into the movie expecting something to occur between them.
11:19:04 AM Dec 26th 2010
I for one think the ending had very clear romantic undertones, but you are right that it's not explicit.

05:43:58 PM Dec 26th 2010
Squint your eyes one way and Sam is the son of Quorra's god. Squint another way and she is his sister. Yep, paint me doubtful....
03:08:33 AM Dec 27th 2010
First of all, Kevin Flynn was the creator of The Grid, not the father of The Grid. Second, the special thing about Quorra is that he didn't create her. Her kind evolved.

Yep: In this setting, the world was created by Intelligent Design, but then the forces of evolution takes over... and the creator loves it. One of his archangels is appalled, however, and this disagreement is what make him fall and become the devil of this world. Awesome story.
09:00:23 PM Jan 10th 2011
I don't know about you, but I thought that it was rather clear that Quorra and Sam had feelings for each other. Did they have sex or even kiss (as in most blockbusters)? No.

However, there were little hints throughout the entire movie that made this romantic attraction quite explicit. As Olivia Wilde stated in an interview: "Meeting Sam for the first time is when [Quorra]'s suddenly awakened to that kind of sensation of, 'Oh, I like him!' She’s never really had any romantic relations before and I think she develops this enormous crush on Sam throughout the movie... she's slowly falling in love with him." Maybe it is not the most explicit example of the trope, but I for one think that it definitely qualify.

As for the averted Token Romance trope, I think that a romance between the two, subtle or explicit, would be more than relevant to the plot. Quorra's the last ISO out there, so romantic feelings would reinforce Sam's concern for her when she turns herself in to Clu, hence why he stayed close to his father in order to save her. Thus, I for one believe that a Token Romance trope, straight, subverted or averted, is simply not relevant in TRON: Legacy and its sequels.
06:22:08 PM Dec 23rd 2010
Clu letting Sam think he was Kevin for the first couple minutes: Okay, it's arguably not a subversion of Luke, I Am Your Father (where the son thought the father was someone else before the reveal - Sam had no idea who he was before he unmasked), but it's not a subversion of Actually, I Am Him either (which would involve the father pretending to be someone else who knew the father). Do We Have This One?, or are lookalike impostors too common?

07:01:31 PM Dec 22nd 2010
edited by what0080
Codified Likeness Utility... Fun with Acronyms or no?
09:12:34 AM Dec 21st 2010
There has been some confusion regarding the nature of Kevin Flynn. What people miss is that the story (except for a few intro scenes in the beginning and one epilogue scene in the end) doesn't take place on Earth, where Kevin Flynn was a human. No, the story takes place in the world called The Grid.

The relevant classification of Kevin and Sam is User, not human. The title User is with a capital U, and it stands for being the true meaning of life. The lives of Programs, that is - again, Program with a capital P. These Prograns are no mere simulations, they are real people with real emotions and real spiritual love for their real creators.

Kevin is not just any user, he's the thousands of years old supreme User who created the world - a world where people are longing for his second coming.

Yes, form a HUMAN viewpoint, Kevin is a human. But the religion tropes are not played as YMMV audience reaction tropes. They are played very straight. In The Grid, Kevin is de facto the God who created the world, and Clu is de facto the fallen one who usurped him.

In other words - deleting religion tropes with the handwave that Kevin is human is NOT the way to go.
04:58:20 PM Dec 21st 2010
edited by PaulA
For what it's worth, I wasn't being arrogant or dismissive, I really just didn't understand where you were coming from with this. To me "God Is Flawed" is only a trope because we have a baseline assumption that God is infallible, and Flynn's a fallible human being, so that baseline assumption isn't there.

It wasn't until you started emphasizing the distinction between "human" and "User" that I got the idea you were coming at it from the perspective of the Programs — and then I remembered the scene in the original film where Tron asks Flynn for reassurance that there's a divine Plan, and Flynn has to break it to him that Users are just people too and are usually making it up as they go along — and I got it: the Programs do have that baseline assumption that Users are infallible, so to them it is a Discovery that the User is flawed.
01:23:02 AM Dec 22nd 2010
Don't worry. :-) My comments here aren't aimed at you, we had alredy cleared up the misunderstanding. They are aimed at all the potential tropers who will react the same way in the future: Your initial reaction is the most natural one, considering that Most Viewers Are Human.

01:30:02 AM Dec 22nd 2010
Hmm, we ought to make that a redirect for something!

Anyway, Speaking of perspektive, I think I have judged the Flynn of the first movie too harshly. Sure he was a bit immature, but never a jerk. It's just that he didn't fit so well on the pedestal.
08:30:37 PM Dec 16th 2010
Should the trope "Black Mesa Commute" be added to Tron: Legacy?
09:42:00 PM Dec 16th 2010
Black Mesa Commute is a trope applying to interactivity in video games. TRON: Legacy is not a video game.

Is the answer really that simple, or am I missing something?
07:49:41 PM Dec 17th 2010
Yeah, it's just that simple. I believe the appropriate non-game trope would probably have to be something near the lines of Scenery Porn.
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