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zerothis
topic
05:02:10 PM Feb 18th 2014
edited by 75.111.92.243
"Artistic License - Biology: Komodo Dragons"... Komodo Dragons are not just smart for a lizards, they are nearer the top of of the smart animals list than average. Granted, not nearly primate, dolphin, or even bird smart. But they can count to six, plan a cooperative attack or heist, roll around in dung taken fresh from intestines of prey to make themselves less appetizing to bigger Komodos (documented as a _learned_ behavior), and captive ones are often trained to make interacting with them easier, safer, and less stressful for both parties (they are more trainable than a dog). In the wild, they have an instinct to vigorously bite and and make gaping wounds on prey then wait for it to bleed to death (or at least bleed to to weakness). However, they tend to learn that a vigorous attack isn't necessary. Their mouths are a cesspool where e. coli, staphylococcus, providencia, proteus, and other deadly bacteria live _simultaniously_ (this is a neat trick because bacteria tend to crowd out others until there's only one left, also neat because they are immune). A sneak attack or slow attack that breaks the skin is an attiquate and energy conserving option <http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x181lp6_komodo-hunt-a-buffalo_animals>. A sleeping person may not even realise if they've been bitten during the night, but their death is inevitable. And despite having a mouth full of infections, a Komodo can still smell an infected prey if it managed to get 8 miles away. The infection is actually a tracking method first, _disabling_ the prey with bacteria is simply a backup plan. It can smell uninfected blood nearby. They prey probably won't get 8 miles away, the Komodo's venom, though mild, interferes with blood clotting (Komodo bites don't stop bleeding), lowers blood pressure, inhibits muscle movement, induces hypothermia, causes shock, and eventually will even cause loss of consciousness (a couple of days maybe, but faster than an infection). All of this will interfere with planing and execution of escape. Captive Komodos don't have cesspool mouths as the necessary conditions and diet to introduce and maintain the bacteria are not provided. Rotten meat is occasionally fed to them but this is in suffcient amounts to create a cesspool. Captive born Komodos are not given the conditions to train themselves out of thinking vigorous bites are the way to get food. Even if they envenomate live prey (a hapless handler perhaps) they never get to track it down and see it get weaker and then experience the reward of eating it after these conditions. Tamed Komodos, again with clean mouths now, learned that a stealthy little bite just means the prey gets away or that the zoo keeper still comes back to annoy them again (thus only a vigorous attack is worth their time). Now, in the wild, its true that the Komodo usually waits hidden to spring an ambush. When the moment comes, ideally, it strikes like a snake when the prey is very close. But it may decide to attack when the prey is a bit farther away leading with a charge and ending with a bite or _tackle_ and bite, or use sweep the prey off its feet and bite (likely if it waits to for the prey walk past its head). A tail swipe after the prey has just walked past is the most likely knock down method/. All very much like an alligator or crocodile ambush. All that said, this has been documented, Komodos can charge a deer from a considerable distance, grab hold and rip out its throat or even break its neck. A an _extremely_ rare occurrence but documented.

Now to the scene: Of course the Komodos would be kept warm. This would keep them active and interesting to the patrons. These komodos are not trained; if they were, they'd simply wait for food from their keepers (they wouldn't know Bond and the villain were anything else), or their bath, or they'd keep away from the keepers for the annoyance of being cadged for transport. They are old, as can be discerned from their size (which is possibly the most unlikely Komodo aspect of the scene, see chart blogsDOTscientificamericanDOTcomSLASHtetrapod-zoologySLASHfilesSLASH2012SLASH05SLASHbig-monitor-lizards-compared-Conty-wikipedia-May-2012-tiny.jpg and compare if the bigger Komodo in the move is exceptionally larger than average). They are experienced through age. They actually assess the situation briefly and approach the person from behind, _slowly_. The attack is cooperative, same as wild Komodo do. It knocks its prey flat to the ground with a vigorous pull. Not a common way for a Komodo unfoot prey, but wild Komodo use various means to unfoot their prey if they are in an impatient mood and a reverse yank is a documented method (Komodos will do many thing backwards, they escape away from fights by backing up rather than turning around and running). The one who latches onto the human's leg first expects the other observing Komodo to latch on as soon also, and it does, they mean to tear their prey apart (and they easily can) into 2 to 6 pieces depending on how pressed for time they are. Also it drags the pray away from the other of its kind. It has learned from past experience humans are cooperative also. They use very little caution to protect themselves against the humans. The naturally do not fear humans and they have never been harmed beyond annoyance by their keepers either. The one goes about its business of joining the attack when used as a stepping stool. Yes, they _are_ that sturdy. Its much too concerned with the attack to care. It probably would not care too much anyhow, Bond's step is no more threatening, annoying or distracting to it than a fly in the face. This is like alligators who have been documented to occasionally not react to being stepped or sat on by people, or poked repeatedly with a stick. Komotos are much more thoughtful, more difficult to provoke, and concerned about humans (even wild ones) than a gator. So, the Komodos made a series of choices that while technically realistically possible are extremely unlikely behavior for them? I don't think so, I think this behavior closer to likely than that because, they know that humans don't spend a lot of time there. If they want to make a meal of one, the don't have time for patients. They've got to make the quick choices before the human escapes or is rescued. That leaves me to wonder why no one it coming to the rescue of the henchman. Perhaps they fear the Komodos. Perhaps they don't like the henchman. Perhaps they are all up for a promotion once he's completely disposed of. All of the above I think.

tsstevens
topic
01:40:07 PM Feb 4th 2013
The site owner himself has discussed The One With and said they should stay. Please leave them alone.
johnnye
08:46:40 PM Feb 4th 2013
edited by johnnye
What should it be, though? The single most notable element of this film, the one it'll almost certainly be described as "The One Where..." in years to come, is a massive spoiler.

I suppose by the time the next one comes out it'll be a Late-Arrival Spoiler anyway...
TompaDompa
10:16:15 AM Feb 5th 2013
edited by TompaDompa
"The one where Bond meets Q for the first time... again"?
"The one with the mommy issues"?
"The one where age is the main theme"?

But yes, johnnye is obviously correct.
dakinebrah
12:18:33 AM Feb 6th 2013
Yeah, we ought to find something better... I like "the one with Mommy issues".
Westrim
01:16:18 AM Feb 6th 2013
edited by Westrim
A massive spoiler? It happens before the opening theme. It's less of a spoiler than "the one with Mommy issues", which tells us that it's about Bond and M. Besides, it makes it clear that it's a temporary condition with the linked trope. We'd have to nix the page quote and part of the intro too to try to hide it, never mind the examples and subpages.
dakinebrah
01:34:43 AM Feb 6th 2013
I think what johnneye was speaking of was probably M's death.
johnnye
03:49:12 PM Feb 7th 2013
edited by johnnye
Yeah, that.
Craver357
topic
05:25:54 AM Dec 29th 2012
Can the Cain and Abel trope be used to describe Raoul Silva and James Bond's relationship with each other? I assume that both of them were apprentices of M, their mentor.
ashlay
11:06:23 AM Jan 14th 2013
No, they're not siblings and have no actual shared history.

The two of them having a similar but separate parental relationship with M are a different set of tropes.
dakinebrah
06:19:28 PM Jan 14th 2013
And what would those tropes be?
ashlay
10:58:01 AM Jan 26th 2013
johnnye
topic
04:11:39 AM Nov 30th 2012
edited by johnnye
  • Ancestral Weapon: James uses the hunting rifle of his father Andrew Bond to fight off Silva's mooks in the climax. However, as soon as he can get his hands on the better modern weapons the mooks bring with them, he trades up.

I don't know what Ashlay has against this second sentence (emphasis added). It's a subversion of the usual use of the trope. He doesn't fight the battle with his father's rifle; he uses it when it's all he's got, but drops it as soon as something better comes along.
ashlay
09:34:46 AM Dec 10th 2012
Trope has nothing to do with usage of the weapon, only it's history. You're probably thinking of Older Is Better.
CommunistBeans
topic
11:38:36 PM Nov 23rd 2012
Weird little thought, but remember Silva's weird virus animation thingies? Was I the only one in the theater who immediately thought "huh, the villain is also To The Ark from Marble Hornets"? The font he used, the use of repeated visual motifs, photo-manipulation, ominous white text on black...
Ytala
06:48:10 AM Dec 1st 2012
Um, those are pretty common elements in stuff like this.
Ehel
topic
12:14:15 AM Nov 19th 2012
Regarding "All There in the Manual", isn't Silvers full name stated by M towards Bond after she visits him in his cell? I'm not sure, else I'd take it out myself.
ashlay
08:36:33 AM Nov 19th 2012
She only calls him "Mr. Silva" in that scene.
TheBaronFlambo
topic
10:01:00 AM Nov 17th 2012
I don't know exactly what this fits under (maybe Doing It For The Art? It's subtly funny and an arcing thing too, though): http://imgur.com/a/V8Ihe

The scene where Q and Bond are talking in the art gallery involves them looking at a painting of the ship being towed away, in which Q's voices his melancholy towards the painting's story of an old glourious ship that fought so hard being simply hauled off because of it's age, reflecting how "young and sharp" he looks compared to Bond who is portrayed as aging. At the end of the film, after Bond has been just as badass as always for a few hours, there's a painting in the background of the new M's office of a big, fierce ship in it's prime. The pictures in the link describe it better than I ever could.
johnnye
10:41:00 AM Nov 17th 2012
ashlay
02:46:49 PM Nov 18th 2012
johnnye
06:55:02 AM Nov 19th 2012
Listed it under Rule of Symbolism.
GovernorExplosion
topic
12:05:42 PM Nov 11th 2012
edited by GovernorExplosion
Is it possible the opening scene was an Actor Allusion to Daniel Craig in Tintin? Specifically, The Oner and the ending fight with Mr. Sahkrine.
ashlay
03:52:50 PM Nov 11th 2012
wasn't a sword fight on a dock, so no. Also The Oner is fairly widespread, there's nothing to suggest it was taking from that particular movie.
lrrose
02:48:19 PM Nov 18th 2012
Actor Allusions are required to be "blatant, specific, or Word of God."
Nikedeimos
topic
01:19:16 AM Nov 6th 2012
What about the screw-up of Eve in the beginning? Why is M taking the blame when Eve wasted an opportunity for perfectly good second shot? She does not get chastised enough for failing a critical mission and killing a fellow agent whereas M gets the blame for story convenience. Should Eve be listed as Karma Houdini for that? Or do we have something along the line of "We could have avoided this plot" if Eve took the second shot as one would expect from a trained field agent?
johnnye
08:24:20 AM Nov 6th 2012
Well, she's relieved of field duty and ends up as a secretary, so hardly a karma houdini. As for WCHATP, perhaps. I'd say it would go best under Fridge Logic though.
Ytala
02:27:24 PM Nov 6th 2012
You seem to be overlooking how the list alone wasn't what M was being blamed for. A terrorist attack on central London also occurred on her watch, including a breach of her personal computer files - neither are small things that can be ignored. Secondly, there wasn't chance for "a perfectly good second shot"; by the time of the first shot her target had already begun to move parallel to her own position, and therefore a disadvantageous one. Marksmanship really isn't something as simple as it seems from a computer chair.
Ytala
topic
04:11:50 PM Nov 5th 2012
So is M's name actually Emma, or are people just taking Kincade's misheard use of her codename as canon? It's getting thrown around as fact but nobody's sourcing it.
johnnye
06:49:21 PM Nov 5th 2012
Don't see any reason to suggest it is. Kincade's the only person to ever call her that, and it seems pretty obvious that it's because he doesn't know she's a spy, and it's the natural assumption that if someone's introduced as "Em", that's their name.
vacillating
08:05:59 AM Nov 11th 2012
Especially as, if IMDB's quotes are to be believed, Mallory calls her 'Eleanor'.
Thecommander236
11:50:48 PM Nov 29th 2012
May be a nickname. This may go under "I Have Many Names."
johnnye
03:46:14 AM Nov 30th 2012
edited by johnnye
She has one codename, which we know, and one real name, which we don't. Presumably either her first or second name begins with M though;

Bond: I always thought M was just a randomly assigned initial, I had no idea it stood for-
M: Utter one more syllable and I'll have you killed.

The fact that Gareth Mallory is also called 'M' shows the title is either a legacy codename, or based on the office-holder's surname.
johnnye
topic
10:21:24 PM Oct 31st 2012
What's the best trope to describe the way that this film resets a lot of the Bond formula that the last two films left out in order to Shoo Out the Clowns? It's like a reverse Re Tool.
ashlay
09:17:24 AM Nov 1st 2012
edited by ashlay
Casino Royale still followed a lot of the Bond elements despite how Darker and Edgier people remember it as being. And as Craig has stated, poor Quantum of Solace only lacked the classic bond elements because it was made during the '08 writers strike, and thus barely had a script.

Skyfall probably qualifies as a continuation of the Continuity Reboot / Origins Episode Craig's era has been as a whole, this time retelling how Bond met Q, Moneypenny, etc.
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