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MasamiPhoenix
topic
03:46:02 PM Oct 25th 2010
I was reading through this and I noticed the Final Fantasy VII while definitely interesting, doesn't mention any actual hate being levied at Tifa for getting in the way. It reads more like an Anti Goggles article. I'm not saying it doesn't belong here, but could somebody more familiar with the fandom please clarify if/how Tifa is attacked?
BattleMage
topic
11:15:07 PM Aug 5th 2010
edited by BattleMage
oops
Rebochan
07:15:22 PM Aug 6th 2010
YOU BLEW IT UP!
Rebochan
topic
10:36:48 PM Aug 5th 2010
Figured I'd take this into discussion since there's something of an edit war going on with images.

Right now, the duel is between an MS Paint doodle of Marth, having stabbed Caeda and hanging out with a fangirl instead, and an official image of Cloud and Tifa in close, intimate proximity.

Here's my logic for the Cloud/Tifa pic: 1. Cloud and Tifa is a pairing that inspires such vicious ship wars that several wikis will actually try to deny they are a couple just to prevent fighting. 2. This is explained clearly on the page. 3. The main page shows Ichigo and Aoyama in close intimate proximity, with a caption jokingly referencing this type of shipper's reaction to it.

The justification for the Marth pic appears to be: 1. Someone is actually dead. 2. That someone is Marth's canon love interest.

I put a similar image of a very hotly contested couple on the Western Animation page, which also has a caption noting the explosive nature of the fandom after the scene depicted.

If the issue here is the caption not being good enough, I say fix the caption. Otherwise, I'm not against adding good fanart depicting violent shippers...but it should be of higher quality and should actually depict the characters in question. I checked the deviant art page for the Marth pic and the person he's snuggling up to isn't even a game character.
BattleMage
11:15:29 PM Aug 5th 2010
The MS Paint abomination illustrates the trope a lot better, but I agree that it's way too awful to consider using as an image.

As for the current image:

1. It's not that the caption isn't good enough, it's that you need it to explain the image to people unfamiliar with FF VII. Are you saying that this instance is famous enough to override JAFAAC?

A page image falls under Just A Face And A Caption if the picture requires an explanation for anyone not familiar with the work or the character to know why it is an example of the trope.

2. That logic could be used to justify every instance of Just a Face and a Caption ever.

3. All of the issues that apply to the Cloud/Tifa pic apply to that one as well. Or are you saying that every Official Couple ever automatically sparks this trope?

I'd recommended taking it to this thread in order to get more opinions.
Monsund
01:20:50 PM Aug 6th 2010
As Battle Mage, the old picture was Just a Face and a Caption. The current picture summarizes this trope on its own, obsessive fans of Marth(but probablly not Fire Emblem) want his Love Interest(who eventually becomes his wife) to die so he can be shipped with a Mary Sue.

Besides the MS Paint makes it clear its a trope unique to the fandom, most Die for Our Ship artists aren't great artists.
Monsund
01:37:06 PM Aug 6th 2010
Caeda is also a character that gets this alot due to Marth Debuted in Smash Bros. and Fandumb. Alot of times fangirls from the Smash bros fandom will bash and ignore her to pair Marth up with Roy(who does no' even exist in the same universe with Marth) or a made up Mary Sue like the current picture.

I'll accept a Final Fantasy 7 picture if it shows something similar to the current FireEmblem picture, such as Tifa getting the Ron the Death Eater treatment or killed(its called Die for Our Ship after all) while Cloud embraces with Aerith/Barret/Red 13. We don't need any more plain game screenshots with a caption.
BattleMage
05:02:25 PM Aug 6th 2010
Being fan art doesn't excuse it from its poor quality, even if it does demonstrate the trope. It doesn't even properly acknowledge the original source.

Let's leave the page image-less until we've come to a consensus on the image.
Monsund
05:17:46 PM Aug 6th 2010
Fine with me, lets just keep the Just a Face and a Caption images out.
Rebochan
07:14:58 PM Aug 6th 2010
I'm sorry, I don't see anything about why that image is any worse than the one on the main Die for Our Ship page then. If the caption explains that this canon couple is controversial, it should be fine because that's exactly what that Tokyo Mew Mew picture that's been on that page for years does.

If the Marth picture was of higher quality, I'd be fine with it as a replacement. But considering that I'm fairly certain more people have heard of Final Fantasy VII than know about Tokyo Mew Mew in minute enough detail, either my image should be fine or that image is a problem

Just a Face and a Caption should only be a problem if it doesn't accurately justify the image's inclusion. If the old caption was bad, fine, I redid it with more context. If the image requires everyone in the world to know about the property, we're never going to have an image here.

Finally, as a potential non-controversial image, what about this one?
Monsund
11:05:29 PM Aug 6th 2010
Naw, infact I think we'll be fine without an image. Not every trope page needs a picture.
MasamiPhoenix
03:47:27 PM Oct 25th 2010
Given how strong Kingdom Hearts factors suffers from this trope, how about a picture of Axel fighting Sora to try to bring out Roxas?
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