Characters The Dark Knight Saga Discussion

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04:42:14 PM Sep 2nd 2012
What category would be appropriate for Dr. Pavel, Barsad, Natascha, and the prisoners Bruce meets in the Pit? Do we need another category?

Also, apart from those, Judge Surrillo, Finch, a few of the ferry characters and Thomas Schiff, I think we've covered pretty much every important character in the series. Not bad; not bad at all. Soon, thanks to Wiki Magic, we may have every non-extra in the series on this page.
02:35:08 PM Aug 3rd 2012
Should Selina Kyle be moved to "The City" instead of Major Antagonists? She's really not an antagonist when it comes down to it, I'd think.
04:16:34 PM Aug 2nd 2012
Does Bane's speech in front of Blackgate Prison count as a New Era Speech or is it a Subverted Trope, since he was going to kill them all anyway?
07:05:02 AM Jul 30th 2012
Can we please make up our minds as to whether Bane is Affably Evil or Faux Affably Evil?
02:35:44 PM Aug 3rd 2012
I think Faux, considering that basically everything he was doing revolved around a lie and a limited time.
03:29:28 PM Aug 3rd 2012
Faux, as his polite manners just hide murderous intent. Affably Evil villains are genuinly nice, Faux Affably Evil just pretend to be, and that false niceness serves to make them scarier. Like how Bane was being pretty polite to Dagget and Pavel seconds before murdering them.
04:49:14 AM Sep 3rd 2012
Ehh... I'm going with genuine. The man's a royal, murderous ass, yes, but that's not the measure of Faux vs. Genuine Affably Evil. The former's very, very specifically an *act*, like Joker's or Crane's. The latter's a genuine part of the personality; nothing more and nothing less. It doesn't make Bane any less monstrous or evil, if anything I think we can say it makes him even more disturbing and unnatural. However, I think we can safely say that we get more than enough information throughout the film that this is *genuinely* how he looks at the world.

It's quite arguable that he was legitimately putting on a front for Dagget given how the latter pushed his buttons, but the rest of the times it doesn't patch up. The very best example I can give is to how he (usually) interacts with his mooks like he does to the sacrifice after the successful plane operation, and especially to Talia.

Yes, I agree the polite manners hide murderous intent, but that's not the definition of Faux Affably Evil. That is (to quote the Laconic): A villain with a fake veneer of niceness. I'm pretty sure that no matter how you look at it, that's not what the evidence says about Bane; if it did we wouldn't still have the "sincere" bit..
02:12:14 PM Jul 20th 2012
Should Selina Kyle really be listed as an Anti-Hero Type III - she seems more like an Anti-Villain who has a Heel–Face Turn. I mean luring Batman into a trap is pretty seriously villainous, even if she makes up for it later.
06:17:19 PM Jul 11th 2012
edited by darkclaw
Should Harvey Dent be in The City or Major Antagonists, or both (Harvey in The City and Two-Face in Major Antagonists)?

For now I put a note under Major Antagonists saying to see The City folder.
01:31:27 PM Aug 18th 2012
He should be in T He City folder, however, someone should change the image. The fact that he becomes Two Face, though not really a spoiler to anyone familiar with the series, would be a spoiler to people who aren't. Someone should put an image of him before the burn
05:20:31 AM Oct 24th 2010
Just to mention, anyone who is willing to threaten the life of people who have never done anything to them just because they are related to someone who they blame for their girlfriend's death (even though Gordon had nothing to do with Rachel's death in the first place, it was the Joker's fault), not to mention doesn't even care about the fact he could cause psychological trauma to said innocents is evil.
09:33:35 AM Oct 24th 2010
Yeah, I kinda have some problems with that definition. Using it that way, then Ghost Rider, a protagonist, and basically the hero of Ghost Rider, would have been Chaotic Evil as well.
01:10:37 PM Oct 24th 2010
Seriously?!!? Kidnapping and threatening an innocent person and her child with the very real danger of getting shot isn't evil enough for you!??!
01:18:05 PM Oct 24th 2010
Ok, that is evil. I'll agree with that.
01:52:44 PM Aug 18th 2010
edited by cclospina
06:38:14 AM Aug 19th 2010
He does work with Commisioner Gordon in the second movie so I'd say NG
06:53:29 PM Sep 25th 2010
Uh, no, that implies that it's GORDON who is Neutral Good. Batman is DEFINITELY Chaotic Good. For one thing, he's a VIGILANTE, and for that matter, a vigilante who ends up being pursued by the police, and causes a LOT of property damage in trying to evade them. Even Crane ends up calling the police on him. He has "one rule" and this rule obviously has more to do with morality than lawfulness; aside from that, he's barely more lawful than the Joker.
09:01:24 AM Nov 12th 2010
Just to check: What are the criteria for Lawful Good, if none of these characters rank any more orderly than "Neutral"? (For reference, Superman is usually the first person cited as the epitome of Lawful Good, and he generally chooses to aid Batman and keep his identity a secret.)
05:35:26 AM Aug 9th 2010
"Harvey thought chance was fair, never went after anyone who wasn't connected to Rachel's death, and adhered to the coin toss absolutely."

Ahem, to you remember the kid he tried to kill at the end of the movie, an innocent.

Also, he never really seemed particularily orderly nor whim-driven like Joker. I'd say he was Neutral Evil above alll else, but YMMV
11:03:19 PM Aug 17th 2010
Chance is complete chaos. He's not motivate by whims like The Joker, but Harvey's belief in lady luck above all else is completely erratic. Chaotic Evil is the alignment for him.
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