• 2 Aug 18th, 2017 at 10:10PM
    Lastest Reply: 18th Aug, 2017 11:35:28 PM
    Even after reading Playing With A Trope, Playing With Wiki, and [Trope Name], I still don't quite get what a Double Subverted trope is. The basic definition is that the trope is Subverted but then is Subverted again to make the trope occur after all; that's how I understand it. But, what confuses me is whenever there ISN'T a "Playing With" page on the main trope's page, thus there's no clearly defined way to know whether an example that I want to enter is Subverted or Double Subverted or Untwisted or Averted or the like.

    My main question is: is Double Subverted where a trope is Subverted and then Subverted again to make the trope Played Straight? Or is it more complicated than that? Reply

      I think you get it.

      Subversion is when a trope was set up in work, but then avoid the trope.

      Double Subversion is when it set up the the trope, then avoid it, but then use the trope straight afterward.

      Untwisted...what is it? If it's straight example then it's straight example, no need for some unnecessary double-negative no plus no equal yes or the like term.

      Aversion is when the trope doesn't set up at all. Usually this is only noteworthy if the trope is generally expected in that work.

      I think I didn't ask my question correctly, so here it is: Is Double Subverted when a trope is Subverted, but then that Subversion is Subverted to make the trope occur after all?

      Maybe I'm thinking too hard about this, but that is actually how I meant to ask my question before.
  • 0 Aug 18th, 2017 at 10:10PM
    Within the Untwist article, a vague reference is made to a "famous" book where a person leaves behind obvious clues that they are the murderer so that they may avoid double jeopardy within the courtroom, but not enough information is given to find the book through a google search. Can someone PLEASE tell me what this is referencing, and since the page states that "no examples are allowed" can someone decide whether to edit it to show what it is referencing or to not mention it at all? I just really can't stand finding a really good plot to a book that I can't read. Reply
  • 2 Aug 18th, 2017 at 9:09PM
    Lastest Reply: 18th Aug, 2017 10:58:27 PM
    RandomX has problems with long-winded entries, non-neutral wording, adding both false and unconfirmed information, shipping bias, grammar issues, spelling issues, and not ending their edits on a definitive concluding note. They keep making these mistakes, and it's leaving work for other tropers to fix.

    Their edit history. Reply
  • 0 Aug 18th, 2017 at 8:08PM
    Live Action TV
    Could someone confirm if the entries for Scrappies on Murder, She Wrote is true? The fandom for this show is very hard to find on the web. Reply
  • 0 Aug 18th, 2017 at 7:07PM
    Is it just me or are most of the Recap pages in the Literature section being misused.

    Looking through the pages they appear to consist of just lists of the books in the same series, the same lists but with a brief synopsis, or links to pages that contain that contain detailed synopsis of the entire plot but no tropes.

    Also if a work has enough tropes that they can be split across pages for individual books; then I have to wonder why they aren't in the literature namespace rather than the recap namespace (such as with the Harry Potter books), as this can create redundancies such as with the The Dresden Files which has both work pages and recap pages troping the individual books. Reply
  • 3 Aug 18th, 2017 at 5:05PM
    Lastest Reply: 18th Aug, 2017 09:55:28 PM
    SirPellucidar doesn't seem to understand how linking to other pages works. Reply

      Looking through their last trope page edits, I didn't really find a linking problem besides one instance of not putting curly braces around a single word title; they seem to know how to namespace and use CamelCase just fine?

      Not exactly. This was their last edit:

      Monsters in One Punch Man are often introduces with a caption giving their name and disaster level.

      How odd, earlier edits didn't have that problem. Could it be more than one person using the same account, or some edits being done on a mobile device and some not?

      Edit: Looking further back they seem to be all over place, sometimes they do it right, other times they don't, spotted one instance of unnecessary square brackets. If it's one person they're pretty sloppy with how they edit. Also seem to have problems with Conversation in the Main Page.
  • 3 Aug 18th, 2017 at 4:04PM
    Lastest Reply: 18th Aug, 2017 06:26:41 PM
    I've just realized that the term "White Savior" seems to have emerged as the more broadly accepted name for what we call Mighty Whitey. Does that sound right to anyone else? I'm not proposing a rename, just a redirect for search purposes. Reply
  • 3 Aug 18th, 2017 at 1:01PM
    Lastest Reply: 18th Aug, 2017 09:26:38 PM
    Immune opens with Raul suspended as Stephenson experiment. Where in Second Ship did this happen? Still not explained .in Immune. Reply

      ...what? What is this supposed to mean?

      You want the discussion page of The Rho Agenda there. Or possibly creating a headscratchers page for it.

      This is unsuitable for ATT, so locking.
  • 10 Aug 18th, 2017 at 12:12PM
    Lastest Reply: 18th Aug, 2017 06:08:41 PM
    Good evening. I had a couple of questions about creating tropes. Where can I suggest an idea for creating a new trope, and does it make sense if this "trope" is limited to Japanese pop culture?


      Good evening. The Trope Launch Pad is the place to make new tropes.

      Tropes limited to Japanese pop culture often aren't actually limited to Japanese culture. So I'd be careful.

      We have loads of tropes which are primarily Japanese, such as Four Is Death and Kotatsu.

      Thank you for your help. I just wanted to test my abilities in the context of such purely anime-related things like "Incest Bait" or "Best Girl" newer win, but I was confused that they hardly have any examples other than anime or visual novel.

      I dont think we want "Incest Girl Never Wins" ANYWHERE near our trope catalogue.

      And where I proposed to create such a trope, lol? The terms Incest Bait and Best Girl Never Win are not connected in any way. Moreover, the history of imouto-titles suggests that the "trope" you invented simply does not make sense.

      ^^ you mean the trope where the main characters younger sister (always Not Blood Siblings) likes him but he doesnt like her because he thinks of her like a sister? ive seen that one. its mostly in anime but make it anyway in the Trope Launch Pad and other people can find examples for you.

      In this case, I meant works where incest is fetishized and used as a bait for audience, but it seems to me that this is a too broad concept, which includes both pseudo-incest work and taboo plays directly. So I'm still wondering if this trope is possible at all.

      Well, the best way to find out is to make it on Trope Launch Pad and see what people think. Thats what TLP is for

      Well, okay, I'll try. While I already rejected 2-3 tropes, when it turned out that despite the description and examples, I just could not imagine how this trope will be added to the page: D

      Um, I don't want to be rude, but I can barely understand anything you've said here. I would recommend running any TLP proposals you have by the [[Get Help With English Here http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=b9tcd2k65789p1pglrd92nvr&page=122#3044]] thread first.
  • 3 Aug 18th, 2017 at 9:09AM
    Lastest Reply: 18th Aug, 2017 08:21:57 PM
    I fixed up this page that was created from for years ago, and it seems to be Not Thriving and missing some things, like how it is used in settings, and stuff. I merely fixed the namespaces, italicized, and categorized the examples. I have some things to do, so I'm just gotta leave the rest of the cleanup to you guys.

    EDIT: Also, I think the proper name of it is Romeo And Juliet Overture, since the overture is often played in love scenes. Reply


      What are you asking for? We have a YKTTW Crash Rescue topic specifically to handle such pages.

      For the record, the piece's full and proper name is "Romeo and Juliet Fantasy-Overture", although the Wikipedia article does call it simply "Romeo and Juliet". It's a stand-alone concert piece, as opposed to coming from any sort of stage work.
  • 2 Aug 18th, 2017 at 8:08AM
    Lastest Reply: 18th Aug, 2017 12:40:09 PM
    Hey guys. I've been absent for some time and I've just now come back and I can't figure out how and where to upload images for pages. Can you send me in the right direction for a tutorial? Thanks. Reply

      You need to go to a forum thread or a trope/work page and click the "Upload Image" button. Drag and drop, submit it, and copy the link it gives you. Paste that link wherever you want to show the image.

      What the above said. Note that it might be hidden under the "More" button at the top of the page.
  • 2 Aug 17th, 2017 at 11:11PM
    Lastest Reply: 18th Aug, 2017 12:54:32 AM
    Could anyone help me to rename this thread into "The Above Avatar Becomes a Moderator"? Reply

      Assuming you created the thread(or got permission from the owner of it), it's generally faster to send a holler.

      I'd give it a try, thanks.
  • 3 Aug 17th, 2017 at 8:08PM
    Lastest Reply: 18th Aug, 2017 09:32:09 PM
    Is there supposed to be a "web show" after Game Theory in WebVideo.Game Theory Web Show? It feels redundant. Reply
  • 7 Aug 17th, 2017 at 6:06PM
    Lastest Reply: 18th Aug, 2017 07:39:03 AM
    mariofan1000 unilaterally changed the page quote on List Song with the edit reason "I think this is a better quote, given that it's in english." (Note: the original quote was in English.) They also have some less-than-savory edits on TropesThatWillNeverHappen.TooDangerous; I know that that's a Darth Wiki page, but are those really kosher here? Reply

      Wasn't there another troper who had "mariofan" in their name at one point?

      There's been a couple reported here before. http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/query.php?sparam=mariofan&qtype=att&sort=activity&status=all

      I found one of the edits he made. Without mentioning it, it does not look kosher to me at all.

      Might want to double-check to see if it's Jmariofan 77 (one of the other "mariofans"; that one was a ban evader).

      There's a General Quote thread in Projects Long Term Perpetual where existing page quotes being changed is handled.

      Care to share with the class, Jamey?

      Mario is a well-known character, so unless there's an IP check it could just be a coincidence.

      There's no evidence of ban evasion and that account is very old. Please engage the user via PM if you have concerns.

  • 5 Aug 17th, 2017 at 4:04PM
    Lastest Reply: 18th Aug, 2017 12:07:25 PM
    I'm... not even sure what to say about this. So Batman (Rebirth) had an entry under Internet Backlash mentioning writer Tom King getting some crap for a tweet he made a while back. It was an actual thing in some circles, so it was fine... then troper Gregzilla added this:

    "Worth noting is that this list was released during a time of extreme polarization of political opinions, so it could easily come across as a Genghis Gambit and a Zero-Approval Gambit to get people to stop fighting one another."

    Just... what? Literally nothing makes it seem like King was doing that. And he hasn't made those kinds of tweets before or since the one in question. In fact, he tweets anti-Trump stuff all the time. It just comes off as a weird fanwank with zero justification. Reply

      I personally think it at least bumps into Natter issues.

      Yep, that's what I thought too.

      So... should I remove it?

      If it's natter, then yes, definitely.

      Probably throw a natter notifier Gregzilla's way for good measure

      Internet Backlash (which is really a redirect to Internet Counterattack) is listed as in-universe only.
  • 1 Aug 17th, 2017 at 3:03PM
    Lastest Reply: 17th Aug, 2017 03:59:29 PM
    I was trying to add a simple line of text to my Troper page, I click the preview button, and the page preview doesn't load at all. I thought it was just my PC and decided to restart and try it again, but the same problem is still persisting. I can see the tab for the preview page starting to load on my tab bar, but it'll close instantly. Any reason why this is happening? Reply

      Quick update for this: I was trying this first on Firefox, where all the problems were persisting. I then decided to try it on Chrome, and everything works just fine on there.
  • 4 Aug 17th, 2017 at 3:03PM
    Web Original
    Lastest Reply: 17th Aug, 2017 06:40:28 PM
    A user added pictures to the body of several of the Rwby pages (funny, heartwarming, nightmare fuel, awesome) and reverted them on one page when another user deleted them, they've left a note saying to leave the pictures alone until it's resolved on the discussion page, but they haven't started a conversation on any of them and hasn't joined a discussion I was having with the user that deleted the pictures to argue for including them on the page. Is there a procedure for dealing with the issue since deleting them will probably result in an edit war? Reply
  • 8 Aug 17th, 2017 at 3:03PM
    Lastest Reply: 18th Aug, 2017 04:59:52 PM
    I received this PM out of nowhere:

    We've now moved to Obscurity Pages 1 and Obscurity Pages 2

    What does this mean? Is it spam? Reply

      Do you have the name of the user that sent you this message?

      Old School Gamer 1203

      There is no Obscurity Pages page. There IS, however, an Obscurity Pages 1 and an Obscurity Pages 2 in the Sandbox space, both of which were created yesterday and neither of which are indexed.

      Old School Gamer 1203 has edited those, as has another troper by the name of Tropes Forever. Hmmmm.....

      Another ban evader, perhaps? We seem to be getting a lot of those recently.

      No active bans, so no evasion. Also, IP does not match up.

      If you are still not sure, feel free to reply to them. Seems like a genuine user.

      For what it's worth, I got that message too.

      My guess at what it meant was that an "Obscurity" page was being split, and they'd decided to message everybody in the page's edit history to let them know, in case they wanted to make additional contributions. (I don't remember having ever edited a page called "Obscurity", but I've done a lot of drive-by editing on pages I no longer remember.)


      ^^Yeah. That's what we did. We were drafting them, and when we moved them to a new page, we decided to PM everyone who worked them to let them know. Maybe not the best plan, in hindsight, but It Seemed Like a Good Idea at the Time.
  • 5 Aug 17th, 2017 at 3:03PM
    Lastest Reply: 17th Aug, 2017 04:29:41 PM
    Game-Breaker's description seems really long-winded for a trope as simple as "a thing that breaks the game in the players favor" Reply

      It's fairly long, but it is necessary since it defines pretty clearly what does and doesn't constitute a Game Breaker, which should prevent false examples being added as a way to complain about a aspect of a game.

      That does raise an important question: How to shorten it while still describing the do's and don't's when adding Game Breakers.

      Take this to the Trope Description Improvement Drive?

      If your trope definition REQUIRES that much explanation, maybe it's a sign of it violating Tropes Are Not Narrow. Especially since it's a YMMV trope to acknowledge it's often high-subjective what's OP enough to count as breaking the game.

      Never mind.
  • 2 Aug 17th, 2017 at 2:02PM
    Lastest Reply: 18th Aug, 2017 01:12:47 PM
    1 august, Joe Merl added a Steven Universe example in Like Reality Unless Noted. I questioned in the "Is this an example" thread and, after the answer, removed the example in 2 august. 13 august, Goblin Cipher included the example again. I sent a pm explaining the situation but they not answered by far.

    Permission to remove the example again? Reply

      it's been reworded trying to make it have more context, but that's possible Edit War.

      Will they need a tap on the shoulder?

  • 1 Aug 17th, 2017 at 5:05AM
    Lastest Reply: 17th Aug, 2017 06:30:52 AM
    Troper Damaged Hen seems to have trouble with spelling and grammar. Nothing too major, but it's leaving some work for others to fix. Reply

      I see that they have received both grammar and context notifiers and have replied to them. So hopefully they'll improve.
  • 2 Aug 17th, 2017 at 3:03AM
    Lastest Reply: 17th Aug, 2017 03:42:09 AM
    I've seen it on three different shows

    I've seen on shows where a main character has an idea for a book or movie, only to find out later that someone else has already come up with a similar work (ironically, this submission may follow that category).

    Examples: -Family Guy (Brian Griffin and his Iron Eagle book) -Simpsons (Seymour Skinner and his Jurassic Park book) -GLOW (Sam Slyvia and his Back to the Future movie)

    Has this trope already been created and what is the name for it? Thanks in advance for your help. Reply
  • 2 Aug 17th, 2017 at 2:02AM
    Western Animation
    Lastest Reply: 17th Aug, 2017 11:51:23 AM
    From my post on the Natter Alert forum thread: ( http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=zybsujciv8eflkwsxjrf908h&page=58#1439 )

    "Analysis/RickAndMorty. After S03E04 was released, someone attempted to write a summation of what the writers did wrong, and, well, These Tropers got involved, and the whole thing seems to be closer to a bitter forum thread than to an essay."

    In retrospect, I'd remove everything on that page, as even the original post is written in first person. Do you think that page has something worth preserving? Reply

      Seems they would do better in a forum topic. That stuff's not what Analysis is for. I'll cut it with an appropriate message.

      That's what I thought, too. Looks like a blog post and complaining.
  • 1 Aug 16th, 2017 at 9:09PM
    Lastest Reply: 17th Aug, 2017 04:16:16 PM
    I looked at the Closed Captioning trope very carefully, and it looks pretty much like a Useful Note.

    Mind if anyone starts a TRS thread on this? Reply